Galen is a fantastic interviewer. He always seems to know in advance which nuances the interviewee would most like to tease out, and is never lost in those nuances.
As a census enumerator in 2020, there were some issues. Especially at apartment complexes built after 2010. A lot of them received two census addresses for the same apartment. Long stay hotels and college dorms were also an issue. Homeless and nomadic people might not have been counted exactly right either. People with second vacation homes, in jail temporarily, or timeshares they were staying at might have been an issue in the count as well.
I was a census enumerator in Seattle in 2000, a mostly good experience, and in Brooklyn in 2010, which was a massive shitshow. My thoughts on NY are... there was a widespread belief in management that NYC was being badly undercounted, and lots of pressure to achieve max contact, but a lot of people just don't want to be counted. And if you have enough trouble reaching someone, it is sometimes possible to count based on guesses using third party info, etc. And of course sometimes people under pressure just make things up. So this sounds like an institutional overcorrection of a previously perceived error that may or may not have existed. Having done this work at the ground level, and later acquired more of a high-level perspective on it, I truly appreciate experts like you putting in the time to share your insights. Thank you!!
Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo ending the Mexican-American War is the origin of the White-Hispanic category. Part of the treaty requires the US to give all the Mexican citizens in the ceded territories the same rights as whites in the US, and not enslavable, as Mexico was a "free" country. Having a separate category of Mexican would push them towards the status of slave, or less than a full citizen.
@Benjamin Majeski that treaty has quite a bit of influence on US law. The categorization of those of Mexican decent and women getting half in a divorce were two that are well known. Though, the Californios still got shafted once the gold rush began and their land claims got challenged in US courts.
Guest must not live in a state were the state legislature continually modifies the district boundaries. While living in Austin, we didn’t know who would be on our ballots because the width of the lines on the maps in the newspapers and initially on the web were too thick. Thus we often lost our representative and things seldom changed
If we had never abandoned the original strategy of allowing the House to grow with the population, there we would be over 11,000 representatives in the House. This would be utterly unmanageable and impractical.
It's insulting that every form you fill out asks for your ethnic origin. If America is not a racist country, then the only question should be are you natural born citizen, legal or illegal alien. Clearly, we are still a race focused country.
I was a supervisor in 2010 in San Mateo, CA and Springfield, MA in 2020. Challenges, no doubt. But their methods didn't suffer re double counting, for instance, folks with multiple homes: that is flagged all the way up and down the system. Surprised he speculated about that. He doesn't actually know. I was trained in grad school in social science psychometric design. Error is much more at the 'interpretive' level. Lots of checks and balances. There is an 'internal affairs' making sure no hijinx. Issue/no issue. :(
Fantastic interview. Thank you so much, both to Galen and Dan. One nitpick if I may (and please don’t attack me everyone). I’d just like to encourage Dan not to assume that all non-straight households / people identify as queer. Queer is a **chosen** (is non intrinsic) identity that many people in the LGBTQ+ community don’t use to self-identify. Plus in 2023, even cis straight people have started claiming a queer identity, so the term is fairly ill defined and ambiguous at best, and hurtful and offensive at worst. Saying non-straight families (or non heteronormative) is safer and more inclusive. Thank you so much for an otherwise insightful discussion.
Censuses are common in countries and empires throughout history. The Thai monarch and government did them for centuries; they were done throughout the medieval times in Europe; etc.
They covered that, spoke about the Romans etc. the nuance is that those censuses were not aimed at establishing democratic representation (obviously feudal lords had no interest in doing so).
331.9M people /435 districts is 763k people/district which is almost tied with North Dakota at 779k, and above Alaska, DC, Vermont, and Wyoming. So, three.
@Szurke Taltos we'll never have exactly proportional because of the guaranteed 3 votes each state gets from the Constitution. However, an expanded House brings us closer to actual proportionality, and it changes the math in the presidential election in favor of the more Opelousas states, reducing the influence of small state, while not eliminating it. Originally it was around 20k people per Representative. And the best thing is it doesn't take an amendment to do it. We just need an act of Congress.
@@szurketaltos2693 We already have proportional representation. But since we have a limited number of representatives, it gets less proportional as the population grows.
US census is a wonderfully antiquated way of keeping track of the population. In more modern countries the authorities generally have databases of who lives where.
Galen felt a little too dismissive of his argument to uncap the House. Of the 7 states that lost a seat between 2010 to 2020, 5 of them grew in population. The issue is with 435 as a set number, you get penalized for not growing "enough". If the House had been set to grow like 10 seats, then this would have been avoided.
Galen is a fantastic interviewer. He always seems to know in advance which nuances the interviewee would most like to tease out, and is never lost in those nuances.
As a census enumerator in 2020, there were some issues. Especially at apartment complexes built after 2010. A lot of them received two census addresses for the same apartment. Long stay hotels and college dorms were also an issue. Homeless and nomadic people might not have been counted exactly right either. People with second vacation homes, in jail temporarily, or timeshares they were staying at might have been an issue in the count as well.
This was a stellar interview, subject and podcast! And I don't say that lightly. Absolutely fascinating.
I was a census enumerator in Seattle in 2000, a mostly good experience, and in Brooklyn in 2010, which was a massive shitshow. My thoughts on NY are... there was a widespread belief in management that NYC was being badly undercounted, and lots of pressure to achieve max contact, but a lot of people just don't want to be counted. And if you have enough trouble reaching someone, it is sometimes possible to count based on guesses using third party info, etc. And of course sometimes people under pressure just make things up. So this sounds like an institutional overcorrection of a previously perceived error that may or may not have existed.
Having done this work at the ground level, and later acquired more of a high-level perspective on it, I truly appreciate experts like you putting in the time to share your insights. Thank you!!
I learned a lot from this.
Thanks, Galen and Dan!
Quite an interview team.
I usually don't finish the episodes without the rest of the crew but this one was really great! Would love to hear from Dan more.
Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo ending the Mexican-American War is the origin of the White-Hispanic category. Part of the treaty requires the US to give all the Mexican citizens in the ceded territories the same rights as whites in the US, and not enslavable, as Mexico was a "free" country. Having a separate category of Mexican would push them towards the status of slave, or less than a full citizen.
thats actually very interesting, and historically, thats fascinating
@Benjamin Majeski that treaty has quite a bit of influence on US law. The categorization of those of Mexican decent and women getting half in a divorce were two that are well known. Though, the Californios still got shafted once the gold rush began and their land claims got challenged in US courts.
As someone who worked on the 2020 census as an Office Operations Supervisor, I don't know how to feel about this.
Guest must not live in a state were the state legislature continually modifies the district boundaries. While living in Austin, we didn’t know who would be on our ballots because the width of the lines on the maps in the newspapers and initially on the web were too thick. Thus we often lost our representative and things seldom changed
If we had never abandoned the original strategy of allowing the House to grow with the population, there we would be over 11,000 representatives in the House. This would be utterly unmanageable and impractical.
Great interview. Love that stuff at the end too.
It's insulting that every form you fill out asks for your ethnic origin. If America is not a racist country, then the only question should be are you natural born citizen, legal or illegal alien.
Clearly, we are still a race focused country.
I was a supervisor in 2010 in San Mateo, CA and Springfield, MA in 2020. Challenges, no doubt. But their methods didn't suffer re double counting, for instance, folks with multiple homes: that is flagged all the way up and down the system. Surprised he speculated about that. He doesn't actually know. I was trained in grad school in social science psychometric design. Error is much more at the 'interpretive' level. Lots of checks and balances. There is an 'internal affairs' making sure no hijinx. Issue/no issue. :(
Would be interesting to hear you talk about how/if the new privatization for 2020 matters
Fantastic interview. Thank you so much, both to Galen and Dan. One nitpick if I may (and please don’t attack me everyone). I’d just like to encourage Dan not to assume that all non-straight households / people identify as queer. Queer is a **chosen** (is non intrinsic) identity that many people in the LGBTQ+ community don’t use to self-identify. Plus in 2023, even cis straight people have started claiming a queer identity, so the term is fairly ill defined and ambiguous at best, and hurtful and offensive at worst. Saying non-straight families (or non heteronormative) is safer and more inclusive. Thank you so much for an otherwise insightful discussion.
Is that CGP Grey ?
Censuses are common in countries and empires throughout history. The Thai monarch and government did them for centuries; they were done throughout the medieval times in Europe; etc.
They covered that, spoke about the Romans etc. the nuance is that those censuses were not aimed at establishing democratic representation (obviously feudal lords had no interest in doing so).
Love Dan’s book, loved the podcast and Go Gate! Colgate class of 1980
Galen, how many states have fewer citizens than necessary to have one representative?
331.9M people /435 districts is 763k people/district which is almost tied with North Dakota at 779k, and above Alaska, DC, Vermont, and Wyoming. So, three.
we desperately need to increase the size of the House.
@@silasrobertshaw8122 I'd rather have proportional representation than an expanded house, which while nice would just be a band aid.
@Szurke Taltos we'll never have exactly proportional because of the guaranteed 3 votes each state gets from the Constitution. However, an expanded House brings us closer to actual proportionality, and it changes the math in the presidential election in favor of the more Opelousas states, reducing the influence of small state, while not eliminating it. Originally it was around 20k people per Representative. And the best thing is it doesn't take an amendment to do it. We just need an act of Congress.
@@szurketaltos2693
We already have proportional representation. But since we have a limited number of representatives, it gets less proportional as the population grows.
US census is a wonderfully antiquated way of keeping track of the population. In more modern countries the authorities generally have databases of who lives where.
I know little about life insurance, but a lot about actuarial science.
I’m always down for a good session of GUOP/BUOP
Galen felt a little too dismissive of his argument to uncap the House. Of the 7 states that lost a seat between 2010 to 2020, 5 of them grew in population. The issue is with 435 as a set number, you get penalized for not growing "enough". If the House had been set to grow like 10 seats, then this would have been avoided.
Mr. Bouk's voice has a similar cadence to Ezra Klein's :)
Galen Druke letting a little bit of a fascist flag fly here. Interesting
Just started watching, but how so?
do you think we’re ok? hmmm??