I think that the speed of attachment while working underwater contributes to diver safety and deployment efficiency. A few kilograms of extra plastic in the ocean doesn't concern me much. The increased survival rate of coral is a bonus. Plastic should be minimized, but there's a point of diminishing returns past which it's silly to put in too much effort. I do like the stainless steel tie idea. It's unfortunate that it doesn't work as quickly or secure them as well, but that was a great idea using them to secure the cages!
Thanks for the concern over our team's safety! It's really important we find ways that take this into consideration and how it affects the efficiency of the work as you mention. We'll try our best to test different methods but it's great to have our community chip in with all these ideas. Thanks for your input! Cheers, Tim
Several people have mentioned using a thin metal wire, and I have another reason for why that might work and actually save you time. Unlike the zip ties you can tie the metal wire around the frames before you send them down, then wrap the ends around the coral when you get down there. That way you don't have to collect the cuttings or bring the ties down with you.
I wonder if having the wire pre-attched wouldn't allow them to stack as well during transport out to sea or cause them to more easily get tangled together
@@matthewhilliard8410 that’s something to consider too, for sure! Maybe they could attach the wires on the shore or in the boat as a final step? This might require more trips back and forth from the shore to the site though, but they could time it and figure out which solution is faster/more effective. It’s pretty hard to know if these things will pose a big problem or not if you’re not there to trial it in person, or that’s what I inagine
But wouldn't handling the metal wires be a potential hazard to the divers? Not just in terms of direct injury, but I can imagine that if even only 10 of these wires poking into and through the diving suits per day, it would wear the suit down rather quickly.
@@Diluculi1 That's possible, to help avoid direct injury they could be spun with pliers. And it would depend on the kind of wire used, thin copper or aluminum wires would be more likely to bend than poke through a wetsuit.
Love to see you exploring alternatives, but also it seems like the plastic gets surrounded and sequestered by the body of the coral pretty quickly, so I don’t see what the major issue is. Also, the idea of tying knots in twine under water, with a current, in gloves, around irregular structures has me like 😵💫. I imagine that the ease of use of zip ties increases productivity considerably, even before the organic materials degrade (which is significant on its own). Cool innovation for the stainless connecting strips though! And that wouldn’t have come if you had dismissed the comments quickly like I would have 🤣 Awesome job keeping an open mind and taking community suggestions into consideration, with super transparent reporting and video evidence. You rock, Yudi!
Thank you for your thoughtful perspective! Studies have shown that while plastic zip ties can become encased in the coral’s skeleton within 3-6 months, there’s limited evidence on their long-term effects on coral growth. The zip ties would be encased in calcium carbonate, which is a secretion product of the coral as it grows. Cheers, Yudi
I used to freedive a ton in the coasts of Croatia and over the years of growing up, I've seen how fast these things can regrow even in areas that ended up being a bit more destroyed over the years, a helpful nudge like this speeds it up so heccin much and I love to see it. Back then I didn't really know the significance of these things beyond "diving relaxing, underwater beautiful" and basic school stuff. Seeing videos like these is genuinely amazing.
It's great to hear your experiences in Croatia. It breeds more hope in me that we can make a difference 'nudging' these important ecosystems back to health as you say! Thanks for the feedback, cheers Tim
Glad to see you looking into alternatives. Looking forward to results in 3 months. I really hope one of these twines will be up for the job. The metal structures I'm far less concerned about. It's not like you're pumping tons and tons of finely ground iron dust into the ocean. - That would be an issue for sure. But these cohesive structures will only corrode as fast as their surface area allows, and with the protective coatings that might take a very long time, and at least based on what I know right now, I don't think that slow source of extra iron is gonna be that dangerous.
Plus there are quite a few artificial reefs already colonized out there that were formed from deliberately sunken ships. Most are doing well and don't pose harm to the environment if the ship was cleaned properly.
Hey guys, nice to see fellow coral planters being busy! I have been trying to plant corals on and off since the bleaching of 2016. Working as a dive instructor in the Maldives, i realised that speed and convenience are key. While it was so rewarding seeing my first 5-10 pieces of coral growing over the years, and eventually attract schools of small fish. But more and more i regretted not putting another 100 pieces down years ago. But the problem for me, and i guess for everybody, is always time and resources. I did not have the option to go to the store to buy anything, as i was working on a resort island with no shops. So i had to import all my equipment in my luggage the 1 time a year i flew home. So after trying some things out, i figured out that a rope system was for me by far the best. I ended up finding or making some anchor points, either some big rocks, bags filled with sand or old umbrella stands. Then put those in a circle and connect a big rope , 1cm diameter or so, between them as the base of a spider web, to replace the frames you are using. If needed put some rocks or anything in the middle to elevate the whole. Just make sure this is sturdy, as long as these ropes are stretched tight, no turtle will be able to get stuck in it. Frames will still be the better choice, but they were not available for me. Then use thin 2 strand braided cotton rope to lay over the big ropes. I used rope that i could break by pulling hard enough by bare hands, in the hopes that a turtle that might get trapped will be able to do as well. And now for the best part: to attach a piece of coral, all you need to do is to unwind a short part of the braid, pull the 2 strains of the wire apart and slide the coral piece in. As the corals are quite sharp, they will stick in between the wire very good. Like this it took me around 5 seconds or so to attach a piece of coral. And it has a great benefit for later, as the ropes are really easy to transport from a central nursery to the reef. The downside of this method is the maintenance of repairing the broken ropes. Fish and turtles will come through and break ropes. If you want you could solve this by using thicker ropes, but that does create the potential for something to get stuck in it if the ropes are to close to eachother. But in my case i made the coral nursery in the place where i did my training sessions. And i got real nice response from the guests who saw me fixing or adding corals during their scuba dive training
Hey there, fellow coral planter! 🌊 It’s fantastic to hear about your dedication to coral restoration since 2016. Your rope system sounds innovative and efficient, especially considering the logistical constraints you faced on the resort island. I love how you’ve thought about the safety of marine life with breakable ropes for turtles-such a thoughtful touch! Some other organization here in Bali use rope to hang Acropora branching, and same as you, it's for the coral nursery. Thanks for sharing your experience and the ingenious solutions you’ve come up with. It’s all about adapting to what works best in your specific environment. Best of luck with your ongoing efforts, and to make even more progress in the future! 🌍💚 Cheers, Yudi
It is nice to see that you are proceeding with a lot of testing! About corrosion, if you have in contact normal steel with stainless one, you can have galvanic corrosion... leading to a faster corrosion of the scheleton.
Fantastic job. Keep going! It’s better to start and get things moving along with restoration than wait for the perfect solution. I’m sure you guys can work out an alternative in time… but until then I’m excited to see you also consider recycling to mitigate the additional waste.
Yudi, thank you so much for the updates. These are great to make us feel part of a movement and let use contribute with ideas. Your passion makes me feel hopeful for the future of the earth!!
Thank you for following our progress and for your kind words! One of our goals is to raise awareness of the importance of coral reefs and the urgent need for conservation efforts. And hearing that our message is received by many is truly encouraging. Cheers, Yudi
rebar tie wire cost almost same as zip tie, but for experienced user it's faster than zip tie to use.. You just need rebar wire tie twister tool and little practice... there is also power tool version, but won't be cheap to get one that can be used underwater..
This was als my first thought: (ungalvanised) steel wire, possibly with a wire gun. I have no experience with them, but If it can be used for rebar tightening it should be fast and secure enough for tying choral
This is the answer, they could even use stainless steel wire if it needs to last a long time, but I assume raw steel wire last long enough for the coral to attach by itself
I'm not sure about the underwater power tool (that would be awesome thoug). I think the wire is worth to try on coral, I think with some preparation it would be more or less the same time as zip ties, to pre cut it for example. Thank you for the ideas! Cheers, Yudi
You and your whole team are heroes. Your passion and dedication show!! We as humans do the best we can when we have good intentions. The fact that the team can say "we are open to ideas and are willing to try them out" show real leadership because true leaders listen. Thank you on behalf of everyone and every living thing that loves our planet, we love you ❤❤❤❤
Great to see the science being done to evaluate alternative options. Regarding the stainless steel zip ties, have you considered crimping them in a zigzag pattern, like an accordion, before using them? This gives some elasticity to the steel, allowing a more variable shaped object to be attached. Another option might be Polylactic acid (PLA) or polycaprolactone (PCL) zipties. PLA zipties can be mass produced easily and cheaply by 3D printer (and there are organizations which do printing work for charities). PCL zipties are available premade online. They are slightly more expensive but in underwater environments they will become weak in a year, and dissolve almost completely in 4 years. If you would like more information on this topic, please reply and we can organize a conversation. I am not a retailer.
Very cool! from what i could find from a quick search the iron isn't really bad for the environment at least there is no mentioning of it in this article: Iron in the environment (Kamble et al., 2013)
I cannot wait to see how this projects evolves. 🙌🏻 Some other coral restoration projects use rope. This is one of my favourite projects as a proud Mossy Earth member.💙
Thank you for your support on this project! There are some project that used rope around our site, usually for hanging nursery for Acropora branching type of coral. Cheers, Yudi
Nice work everyone!!! Did you consider also the possibility of building different layers of height in the structures? Corals grow on rocks and different height, so it could be interesting to create maybe some points with a double layer of structures forming also different slopes and sizes for future development of coral and fish safe spots. I know nothing about reef ecology, but seeing the structures being all on a single layer made me think that maybe a bit of variety could be useful and more natural
Great suggestion! Building structures with varying heights could indeed mimic natural reef environments more closely and provide diverse habitats for marine life. However, for our project, uniformity in structure design ensures efficiency, especially considering the volume we produce. Additionally, we are afraid that the strong currents in our working area pose a risk for taller structures. Thanks again for your input and support! 🌊💙 Cheers, Yudi
1. Zip ties will be grown over by the coral, keeping it from breaking off and impacting the oceans, so it’s likely not an issue. However other methods aren’t a bad idea. 2. Metal structures will eventually rust away, however by that time the corals will have grown large enough to support themselves and each other. I think that is a benefit as they will eventually grow onto one another like they should. I think of the rebar like a manure plant pot, it gives structure for the initial growth and then slowly degrades allowing the corals to expand and grow even larger
The only issue is that rust is toxic to some corals But otherwise yeah, however the loss of the metal structure will also make it more susceptible to damage for a few years
@@ConstantChaos1 ahhh I didn’t know that, yeah I guess no one really like breathing in iron oxide 😂 I wonder how long it would take to break down, because if it took 5 years it might be an issue, but if it takes 50 the coral may have grown large enough for it to not matter 🤷♂️
@@ConstantChaos1 after reading a bit more it looks like the rusting varies based on several factors including temperature (which I assume is fairly high in a shallow coral reef), current and metal absorption rates. The articles still allude to about a 10-40 year lifespan. Likely to be on the lower side because of temp and current, but generously 20 years because of the epoxy and because I’m hopeful 😂
@NoahHagen yeah, and to be clear the rust is actually only a problem for some corals, others do actually benifit from being generally nearby as the iron oxide can be fertalizer for algae making the waters more nutrient dense, but hopefully the resin and crushed coral coating will slow it down enough for it to just work as fertalizer and not cause issues. It's an imperfect system but logistically a much better solution than things like bio-blocks at least for now, especially since if we see certian ones rusting out too fast, we can always intervene, it's a much larger issue with things like sunken ships or lost shipping containers. Which generate much more rust.
@NoahHagen yeah there is high temp and radiation levels working against us, but the epoxy should buy us a fair bit of time. I think 20-30 years is a fair assessment (for a half life at least), assuming near perfect coatings of epoxy, if they are more slapdash with holes in the coating, I give it 10-17 or so, but the coatings look good so yeah Sry I really liked my materials sciences classes lol
Thin aluminium wire would likely work just as well, and wouldn't easily corrode either. And can be cut underwater with similar effort as cable ties with a good pair of wire cutters. That would solve the plastics issue.
That's a fantastic suggestion! Aluminium wire does sound like a practical solution. I wonder if it would be the same result as metal wire (which has high detachment rate). I think it's worth testing it. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I don't think aluminum will work great, it's lower on the galvanic series than steel, so the aluminum would be eaten away at. If the stainless steel works then a bronze or brass could work as alternatives. Still would take some testing to confirm.
Great work guys! I wonder if there are any biodegradable zip ties that would work for fixing the coral on? I'd assume they're not needed once the coral has grown enough to attach itself but you'd need to find something that lasts long enough for that to happen, and can biodegrade in salt water cotton/hemp ties are a nice idea, but can only imagine how annoying they are to tie underwater 😂
Thanks so much for your support and great question! 🌊 You're absolutely right about the need for biodegradable options. We've actually been exploring biodegradable zip ties but so far we couldn't find plastic-free biodegradable one. It's definitely a challenge, but we're hopeful that we'll find a sustainable solution soon. As for cotton and hemp ties, you're spot on-they are more eco-friendly but can be tricky to work with underwater! We're always on the lookout for better alternatives. Do you have any ideas or suggestions for biodegradable materials that might work well? Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I'm not all that sure how various things do in seawater but PCL is biodegradable and maybe natural rubber? Also, just thinking but it might be easier to use a different method to attach the coral with the string? If you used a binding knot (something like a bag knot, which is a variation on a clove hitch. Clove hitches and it's variations would be good here I'd imagine because you can create it loosely then just pull on each end to tighten it) to hold the coral onto the reef (rather than just wrapping the string) then tied whichever knot you're using on top that might be easier because the coral would be held in place while you're tying the knot? Waxed strings might last better underwater too if the string degrading too fast is part of the problem? Good luck with it all! (and sorry explaining knots with words is not a good plan)
@@hannesbolmstedt care must be taken in selecting "biodegradable" products because what is biodegradable in soil is not necessarily biodegradable in salt water, or may in fact deteriorate too fast to be useful. I think steel/iron wire strikes a good balance - lasts long enough to be useful, corrodes into iron which is a natural nutrient in the water. If wires aren't being successful to attach corals then I think it's worth doing some investigation as to why; maybe it matters if the twist is placed next to the coral or next to the frame. Maybe the coral doesn't like rusty steel touching it (add a protective sleeve over the wire?). Maybe the gauge of wire matters. Maybe a special tool needs to be used to consistently tighten the wires. I also wonder if it is not impractical to get the coral to grow/attach to the frames in a tank on land before deploying them into the environment, therefore allowing the attachment materials to be removed before deployment. Either way forge ahead with the zipties in the meantime - great work!
@@tmmtmm At least with live rock, very little time out of water kills the organisms. Its probably not feasible to create coral farms on land and transport them out to sea. Not economically.
Instead of metal zipties, you could use thin metal wires. Wrap the wire around the corals and the steel bars, and then twist the two ends of the wire around each other for fixing. My dad used this method in his hobby vineyard to guide the growth of the plants. Which exact material of wire I'll leave to your expertise.
@@CitizenAyellowblue have you even watched the video? 8:26 The wire is faster and easier to secure corals with and they won't need the pliers (if they choose the right gauge). Also its easier to judge how tightly it holds, so that whey hopefully wont crush the corals. Also it would be cheaper too.
@@IamCrusaderRUS I think you'd get the same problem with the steel zip ties. Metal isn't soft and a tight enough hold would probably break the brittle coral.
That's what we are afraid of, so we need more time to test and hopefully come up with a way to use it on coral. Meanwhile, after some days now, the steel zip ties hold pretty good on structures. Cheers, Yudi
I recommend watching a video here on YT from the channel Nature on PBS. They did a video covering how marine biologists are restoring coral in Oahu Hawaii. The video is titled Coral Reefs That Can Finally Beat the Heat. They use a drill to make tiny holes for their heat tolerant coral to go in and an apoxy type glue to make sure it sticks. The video explains in more detail. Regardless yall are doing an amazing job. Nothing is ever perfect but trying to do our best is the only thing we can do. Great job. Fellow Mossy Earth member here!!!!
I watched that video! Cery interesting indeed. It's so encouraging to hear from fellow Mossy Earth members and knowing we're all in this together. 🌊💚Cheers, Yudi
Since I got a heart I'm not editing my old comment but *sowing which I just realized my phone has been auto"correcting" for a while now... I'm a horticulture student so that word comes up a lot and I hadn't noticed lol tbf I'm dyslexic
Do you have an average number of days or span of days that it takes for corral to attach fully? Could look to find a material to corrodes just over that limit and see if there is a product made of it that can be tied. Or something under it that you can do a second tie on at the midway point to re secure before it corrodes
The average time for corals to fully attach can vary, but it generally takes around 30 to 60 days for coral fragments to securely attach to a substrate. I have high hope in the hemp rope, but we should decide once we have the final result of the experiment. The idea is that the attachment will be covered in coral completely when it's successful. Cheers, Yudi
Thank you for the encouragement! We’re glad to hear you’re enjoying our updates. We’ll continue to share every step of the journey so many people feel included in our coral project! Cheers, Yudi
Thanks for the follow up! Using plastic is always a concern, however, it seems like it’s industry standard. I’m sure everyone around the world in this field knows what works best although I appreciate the experiments. Plastic zip ties are quick, cheap, and easy to use which matters when you’re scuba diving. Hopefully a more environmentally friendly alternative will be found. In the meantime you gotta use what you gotta use. Excellent work 🙌
I have a new question: how do you select what coral fragments you put on the structures? Did you guys analyze which species, mixtures and ratios occur in the old reef and mimic that? Or do you focus on particular species to get a quick coverage so the other species can more easily return in a natural way? Or do you just grab whatever you can find? I heard that you dont want to break of coral yourself and try to only use naturally fragmented parts, but I can imagine that limits your options.
Thanks for your question! Since we aim to replicate the surrounding coral ecosystem, we collect naturally fragmented coral around our restoration site. So our limitation would be the species found in surrounding area. Cheers, Yudi
My (totally untested) suggestion -- cotton/hemp/sisal string that has been waterproofed with linseed oil. It should stay flexible, but last longer in sea water. Preparing it in advance takes time, though. You'll need to coat the string and hang it up to dry. The product is basically the same as traditional linoleum flooring, and is fully biodegradable. Some notes on linseed oil: There are three common types to buy. Raw linseed oil is totally natural, but takes a very long time (weeks or months) to dry. Boiled linseed oil dries much more quickly, but includes heavy metal additives like cobalt. DOUBLE boiled linseed oil dries quickly and has no additives, but can be hard to find. The drying process generates heat, and the oil/fibre mixture is flammable. There's little risk if the string is hung up with plenty of ventilation -- the main risk is from piles of rags coated in the oil. I'm happy to talk about this more in this comment thread, or by email.
Concrete rebar is tied together with "tie wire" a steel wire is wrapped around and twisted tightly to Bund the crossing rebar together. If you used tie wire it would be more metal and less plastic, some care/practice using the tie wire will mean you have alot if control with it too. There are multiple types of tools for tie wire you could try too. It could be used just like the metal cable ties too, and it will likely be cheaper. Honestly can't think of a better option myself.
Thank you for your suggestion, I think tie wire is a good replacement. We are going to further test this if we can use it in our coral restoration project. Thank you again for the support! Cheers, Yudi
Interesting work keep up improving it and also see if others are doing things differently elsewhere in the world. My direct comment is that a rope of 95% cotton last a lot longer than 100% cotton so could work and still be a lot less plastic than zip ties
Thank you for the support! We studied similar efforts around Bali at the early stages of our project, and it has been insightful. Anx thanks for the input, we'll definitely consider this and research the potential benefits. Cheers, Yudi
Later when i had more corals to work with, i started to skip the frames all together. I put bigger pieces of staghorn all over a place that i wanted to put corals on, about half a meter apart from eachother. Then i used the thin 2 strand cotton ropes and connected them all with eachother. This had the effect that the individual pieces of coral where not able to roll over anymore. So the triggerfish grabbing a piece and rolling it over so that it died was not happening anymore. Then i would put smaller pieces of coral in between the bigger pieces. So that they remained completely out of the sand. Like this i could take a rope of 1 year old corals, cary them trough the water to another place. Cut the rope, put the corals on a small hill so that they will not get covered by sand. And attach a new rope to them and fill that with new fragments. And as the bigger corals were resting on the ground now, the thin ropes hardly broke anymore. Unless a stingray decides to dig a hole right in the middle of your chosen spot or so.. 😂 Ah, and it was funny to see that our resident green turtle quickly learned that the thick ropes were really good for cleaning her shell. So we could watch her rubbing her back on the points where the thick ropes were leading into the sand. If you want some pictures to see what i did, i can email them to you. Take care!
That's a fantastic approach to coral restoration! Using rope nurseries is a proven method for cultivating healthy coral. I'm really impressed with your dedication and the progress you've made. Your efforts are making a significant difference in protecting our marine ecosystems. And it's always encouraging to see the marine life starts to come and settle in at our coral restoration area. Thank you for sharing your story, and for following our progress. Keep up the great work! Cheers, Yudi
Also they make a kind of tie wire with two loops on the end you use a tool to spin together and twist to tie down stuff. Could be perfect for what you need to do.
I wonder if small metal clips may help? Such as Screw-on clamp holder for pipes. They may be more expensive than wire alone, but way easier to use, as they hold the coral using pressure alone, as there is no need to spend time to tie it, and no need to cut them. The time you spend under water is a cost too, as you will have more free time to expand the project. The clips may be big, but that may create surface for coral to grow on, so it is not a loss. Check for "Spire clips" too.
Thank you for sharing your idea! The spire clips seem really interesting. I've never seen them before (I'm a bit of a tinkerer myself 😆). It's true that spending time underwater is costly, and we have limited time per dive, and since the source of the coral are from surounding area undwrwater, bringing coral fragments to the boat is extra effort, and we can only transport a few at a time. Also, exposing the corals to the air for too long risks stressing them. For the spire clips in coral restoration, it looks like marine glue or resin would be necessary to secure the coral fragments to the screw points. I can see how that would be very useful for an indoor nursery. Cheers, Yudi
if you plan on using wire, you can get safety wire pliers for fast installation of coral frags. there is a type of aquarium glue that hobbyists use to attach coral frags to a disk but i'm assuming it might be too expensive or have unknown ecological consequences like water pollution.
We are planning to use metal wire, as many are suggesting. As for the glue, I saw some project use the method you are saying, but for indoor nursery, usually for research in a lab. Chees, Yudi
Maybe try attaching the coral with thin metal wire, wrapped several times around the coral piece, and then twist the two ends together to secure it in place? 😊
Maybe you could fashion a specific shape of pliers and use a c-shaped piece of metal to attach the coral to the frame. It would only need to be a thicker wire you bend in to a spring and cut open so you could manufacture the clips fast and easy.
Interesting, thank your for the idea! It needs to be strong though, I use long pliers and while it can go to dificult corner, to get a good grip is quite an effort. Cheers, Yudi
You could try metal wire that is used to tie rebar. There are handheld devices that can tie rebar with metal wire. So it will be very quick to tie. Adapting those devices for underwater use might be a challenge. But rebar is tied under water as well so perhaps they already exist
Thank you for the idea and for your support! Somehow along the way we are forgetting this option, we are going to test it on our next trial. Cheers, Yudi
Stainless steel bailing wire! It comes in different thicknesses. So you can use thinner for the more delicate corals and thicker for holding the structures together
Interesting idea! Thin wire has a bad record for tying coral fragments, but I think it's worth to try to see the result first hand . Thank you for the suggestion! Cheers, Yudi
Incredible work. I do miss diving in Indonesia. I just wondered why you are creating a single height of structures and not stacking a couple to change the topography, and water velocity to promote diversity. Obviously you can't go too high with the currents as they are. Not sure if this has been noted at this site, but I've found the smaller the fragments the quicker the growth rate. Keep up the great work, sure many don't appreciate how much harder working underwater is.
Thank you for the kind words and your thoughtful suggestion. I think with the smaller structures you can fit more coral fragment into an area, but we also need to take into consideration the space for the coral to grow as well. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes thanks for replying. Sorry i didn't mean smaller structures, i meant smaller fragments. So dependent on the species, a 5mm fragment will grow faster to 500mm than a 50mm fragment will. Micro colony fusion. The paper Forsman et al 2015 highlights this.
Please you can use cotton ties such as small cotton rope. It's natural and don't need to use plastic. Last research show us plastic contaminate living tissue of coral. Plastic in the ocean is already a huge problem. People use this technic because it's easy to attach quickly and beginners, tourist everyone can do it. But the goal is not everyone can do it but it's so it good even if it's take more time. If you need any advice please let me know.
I'm afraid so, and I think the wax will crack when it dries. And epoxy also bot an option to aplly underwater, would too difficult. Thank you for suggestion and for following our project. Cheers, Yudi
I read that phytoplankton blooms can absorb iron from the ocean and convert it into a carbon store, also the blooms produce food for organisms. I guess steel is lighter and easier to produce and handle than iron, but steel rusts quicker - so many there is some use in looking into other materials than steel. Additionally, would there be a way to alter the design of the cages to have easier mounting points? For example have some loop holes of varying sizes that the coral could easily slot into? I know it needs to be secure but I feel like currently you are having to force the zip ties to create enough surface friction. If you could give the coral more contact surface area you wouldn't need to use as much force on the zip ties (And avoid breaking the corals). If the design were to be altered to have loops the cages could also interlink, making them more secure.
Thank you for sharing your perspectives! That is true, the corals also need iron for it biomechanism to create calsium carbonate. We are currectly testing the metal zip ties on limited selection of coral species, to find what is best to use it for. Cheers, Yudi
Hello, great work. Good luck with your trials. -- suggestion about a brace approach below. Because some of these materials can be quite tricky under water to tie, I was wondering to accelerate the installation and solve the zip ties problem an approach could on land to install a brace on the stricture. What i mean is somethin that has a u shape coral side or v shape on which a piece of tie - let s call it the strap - (not plastic) is attached to one side of the brace. The brace itself is secured with metal tie to the structure. Once under water with the coral the idea would be to have only one side of the strap to attach to secure the coral against the brace. Maybe this would not work for all for of coral if there is no tubular shape to strap against the brace. But hopefully it does not make the work under water more complicated and the strap can be soft enough to not hurt the coral Best of luck anyway
That’s a thoughtful suggestion! Thank you for the encouragement and for sharing your innovative idea. For simplicity, it is better to tie the coral directly to the stucture, and If the brace would be like an extention of the structure, I'm afraid it would create additional attachment to worried about. But securing the wire for coral on land before deploying it underwater could indeed simplify the process and address the plastic issue. Cheers, Yudi
Bamboo cord ( string) is waterproof... that may work. There is also stainless steel thread/ string also called stainless yarn. May be easier than the zipties
Thank you for the idea. We’ve been considering that and wondered if it’s 100% natural bamboo fiber or if it’s mixed with any synthetic materials. It's worth to look it up, we'll definitely do more research of the potential. Cheers, Yudi
We Haven't look into that, thank you for the suggestion! But I imagine that kind of preparation is something that would work in nusrery, as for our project, we take coral fragments from surrounding area and transplant it directly to the structure, so we need the instant tying menthod. Cheers, Yudi
Choosing which "coral" to plant is necessarily a type of selection pressure. What criteria is used to choose which coral to propagate within a species?
It's great to see some experimentation around the zip ties! Correct me if I'm wrong but would the epoxy resin to hold the sand on not be more harmful and be worth thinking about as well?
It’s a lot of extra work using these alternative methods. Does the plastic ties eventually fall off or just get enveloped by the coral? Or even just using the metal ties to hold the structures together and using the plastic ones for the corals. 🤷🏻♂️
Have you thought about using stainless steel or copper wire to atach the corals? I would think it gets you the reduction in plastic while also allowing for better ease of installation than the twine.
I love the staneless steel for the structural adhesion, but yeah i think it is a bad idea for the coral attachmemt as it wont be covered by the coral very easily as it isnt great for them to grow on.
you could instead of plastic zip ties use thicker steel wires, like a paperclip type of material. This will eventually rust but probably not before the coral adheres. Something to try anyway
At first I tought that the type of wire you use for stitching wounds in the hospital would be great since there are versions that disintegrate in a certain time frame, but that's probably too quick for the coral to grow. Pre-fixing metal wire to the frame that makes coral quick to attach later sounds good, but also creates a spiky field divers have to work in with their hands and the twisted up wire is still spiky. Going all natural (no metal that can corrode) sounds like the way to go, what about waxed hemp cord? Like mooring lines but in miniature version. It's been used for centuries on the oceans and depending on the thickness of the cord, you can test which one you need for the duration until the coral attaches and the cord eventually looses itself or disintegrates since it's not needed forever.
Thank your sharing your thoughts! I think the wire would work with the right tool, and it's worth to try it out. Probably will take more time to attach it. Thank you for the idea with the cord, we'll look it up. Cheers, Yudi
Some other project in Indonesia use cement to attach baby coral to concrete block type of structure, And usualy they do it on land near the beach before deploy them to the ocean. To addapt their approach as we transplant coral fragments directly underwater would be dificult. Cheers, Yudi
Can you not do everything above water with fast drying concrete? My father did it with oesters on a robe with fast drying concrete them sink it in the water..
We don't want to expose the coral above water for too long, and because we collect the coral fragments directly underwater (not from other source), bringing them up to the boat seems impractical since we can only bring up a little at the time. Some other project with concrete structure does this, typically done on the shore. Since our project site is only accessible by boat, we cannot use this method. Thank you for your support and for your input to our project! Cheers, Yudi
I’d be really curious if bioplastic zip ties made using PLA could be possible. I can find one manufacturer of them. And even if not, they can be easily manufactured with PLA, a 3D printer, and downloadable designs , also supporting local Indonesian technological innovation.
You could consider loosely attaching the zip ties prior to placing under water, so that the coral only needs to be placed and the tie tightened, this may speed things up underwater. Have you thought about pre-tying some of the rebar structures together on land and deploying in units of two or three? It would speed up deployment under water and make the operation more efficient. However I am not sure how that would affect stacking on the boat and how many you could take to site on a trip. I love the great work you are doing. It is great to see you try to minimise the plastic, but I think the huge benefits of re-growing a reef will outlay the small impact the amount of plastic will have, especially as it is covered by algae and corals.
We did the pre-tighten zip ties at the beginning, but we encountered some challenges. The coral fragments varied in size and shape, and often had bulges or branches on both ends, which made it difficult to fit them through the pre-tightened zip ties. While there wasn't a significant difference in time consumption, it is also the case for the structures. And we found it easier to transport the coral fragments on the boat when they were loose. Thank you for sharing your thoughts about our project and for your support! It means a lot to us. Cheers, Yudi.
Is it possible to attach the coral onto the frame while on the boat? If coral needs to remain wet, place the frame in a large bucket of saltwater and do the attaching while you're in the air. I suggest using stainless steel wire as it will last longer in the salt water. I don't know if a cable tie gun($140) would work, but it would would also make it much easier. Keep up the good work!
Thank you for sharing your prespectives! It is possible, but since we collect coral fragments and transplant it directly underwater, bringing them up to the boat will add extra efforts. And to reduce stress to the coral for being exposed out of the water we only have little window.
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I understand. If you used wire, you could attach the wire to your frame while in the air and reduce the time to attach the coral. I look to seeing more of your work.
Thank you for your suggection. We haven't had the chance to try it out. We found this brand 'Seatak' that looks like it's been used for coral restoration, but with the scale of our project, it would cost a lot of money. Cheers, Yudi
I imagine the string is less successful because as the natural fibers soak with water, they will stretch. If the coral bits are more loose because the string stretches, the water currents would probably cause them to move making it harder to attach. I use florist wire for hobby stuff, and it is roughly 1mm thick and easy to bend/twist/cut. I do think it would rust, but if the coral attaches first then it won't matter if it rusts away.
The cotton twine has the most detachment rate so far, although also has some succesful cases. We figure the state of the coral fragment also a factor. If the coral fragment is healthy ang usually big enough, it could attach faster to the structure. We'll definitely look into the florist wire, thanks for the idea! Cheers, Yudi
I was wondering if the metal zipties wont also be a big problem if they end up in the ocean as they seem pretty sharp and durable and might hurt a lot of sea creatures if eaten by accident
That's one of my concern at the begining, but when we finally got the material, it truns out their edges are not sharp at all. And we curl the remaining part using pliers as we tighten it. It's been almost a week now, and they are still attached well. Cheers, Yudi
has there been any consideration of wire/twist ties? I know most of them are made with plastic but I have seen some plastic free options that are coated with waxed paper instead, and you could potentially just use wire alone to act as a twist tie?
Thank you for your support and for the idea. From research that we found, wire ties has just slightly lower succesful rate from plastic zip ties. We will add this material on our next test. Cheers, Yudi
Even if plastic ends up being the most efficacious - this use of plastic far outweighs the ecological burden. There’s going to be micro plastics in the project area, might as well have been used to promote the restoration
In my head, wire twist ties (like the kind that come with cheap trash bags) should work just as well as zip ties, but I'm not the expert here and maybe they would corrode too quickly before the coral can fully attach itself to the frame. But twist ties, or just thin stainless steel wire, are really cheap and easy to use. Bailing wire is super cheap and easy to work with too, and it's fairly robust and corrosion resistant, and there are some neat tools designed specifically for bailing wire. I also like the idea of cement, since coral structure is basically the same stuff as lime cement. But getting cement to set when fully submerged is not easy. Maybe a combination of wire for short term, and a hydraulic cement for long-term?
Thank you for your suggestion! I like the idea of stainless thin wire, we'll see if we could get those materials in Indonesia. For cement as the glue to attach coral, I'm afraid it'll take more steps on preparing, and it wpuld be gard to mix it on the boat. I think tge thin wire would be the best option. Cheers, Yudi
I would say another alternative is using hemp rope if you can find it. It should naturally degrade after some time. probably by that time the coral has attached it's self to the structure.
Thank you for your support! We are testing the hemp rope on this experiment, and there are some succesful cases, but still far compare to zip ties. And that's why we are going to do more testing with hemp rope, with more selective coral fragments. Cheers, Yudi
For an alternative, would natural rubber(latex) zip ties keep the coral in place long enough? 1-5 years seems to be the timespan for the rubber to biodegrade, but I'm not sure how tight it would remain in the intial attaching timeframe. Apparently bamboo alternatives also exist, but i can't seem to find them myself .
I think rubber would be dificult to apply underwater with the strecthing and tightening. I read some other comment also suggesting bamboo cord, but we need to male sure if they are 100% organic first. Thank you for the support! Cheers, Yudi
Thank you for following our coral restoration project. To tie the coral, the ties need to stay with the coral until it gets fully enveloped by coral skeleton. For the fast growing coral, within a month we can see that the coral starts to encrust on top of the zip ties, making it impossible to take out without breaking the coral. Cheers, Yudi
Thank you for sharing you thoughts, we haven't try using tape, but I think the more difficult one is to find the tape made from organic material. Cheers, Yudi
Would it be possible to build and transport a larger rebar mat? Instead of 30-40 individual pieces, to assemble a larger section? That way, you can spend the time to make sure its sturdy while youre in the shop, which would also facilitate the use of steel ties. I understand that the size of the boat is a limiting factor. I imagine another benefit if using smaller pieces is that you can fit the sturcture to the uneven shape of the sea floor. But I'm a civil engineer and I've seen lots of rebar cages for shallow foundations of buildings. That's what came to my mind. Keep up the good work! I'm sure the coral and the fish would thank you if they could talk. I'm looking forward to seeing how this looks in 3 years.
Thank you for sharing your perspective! We try to avoid having welded joints on the top part to make the structure stronger. With rebar mat, it would end up shaped like a table because we also need the height. What would be cool is to come up with uniform modular structures with an interlocking system on each of the arms that can be arranged together. Any thoughts? Cheers, Yudi
I suggested this on the post on the main channel, but have you tried superglue? I use it in my aquariums and it hasnt shown harmful affects on the environment. Its not exactly plastic free but it can be argued as better if it works
Thank you for following our updates and for sharing your idea! I'd be curious if the glue can be used underwater since we do the attaching directly underwater 🤔 We saw some project using epoxy underwater and thinking about the extra tools and bringing the mixture underwater would be too much for us at this point. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes epoxy clay is definitely used quite often in aqua-scaping setups, especially saltwater, and has not currently been shown to cause problems. I do believe certain brands are able to cure underwater because they need pressure to be activated (similarly to superglue) though the added pressure of the waves and water might affect that and make it cure before it is ready.
It's a more challenging task, because we still need to create a strong and rigid structure like metal rebar while also mimicking the natural coral substrate. To achieve this, we coat the rebar with coral sand, which made from skeletal remain of corals. This creates a layer of natural material that provides a more suitable environment for coral growth. Thank you sharing your thoughts! Cheers, Yudi
I think that the speed of attachment while working underwater contributes to diver safety and deployment efficiency. A few kilograms of extra plastic in the ocean doesn't concern me much. The increased survival rate of coral is a bonus. Plastic should be minimized, but there's a point of diminishing returns past which it's silly to put in too much effort.
I do like the stainless steel tie idea. It's unfortunate that it doesn't work as quickly or secure them as well, but that was a great idea using them to secure the cages!
Thanks for the concern over our team's safety! It's really important we find ways that take this into consideration and how it affects the efficiency of the work as you mention. We'll try our best to test different methods but it's great to have our community chip in with all these ideas. Thanks for your input! Cheers, Tim
The coral should be growing over the plastic encasing it in effectively limestone
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I am glad to see the plastic recycled
Nothing is perfect from the very start, keep on keeping on. 👍
Thanks for the support! Cheers, Yudi
Also like the coral will quickly encase it in what is effectively limestone
Several people have mentioned using a thin metal wire, and I have another reason for why that might work and actually save you time. Unlike the zip ties you can tie the metal wire around the frames before you send them down, then wrap the ends around the coral when you get down there.
That way you don't have to collect the cuttings or bring the ties down with you.
Ooh yes, that’s smart!
I wonder if having the wire pre-attched wouldn't allow them to stack as well during transport out to sea or cause them to more easily get tangled together
@@matthewhilliard8410 that’s something to consider too, for sure! Maybe they could attach the wires on the shore or in the boat as a final step? This might require more trips back and forth from the shore to the site though, but they could time it and figure out which solution is faster/more effective. It’s pretty hard to know if these things will pose a big problem or not if you’re not there to trial it in person, or that’s what I inagine
But wouldn't handling the metal wires be a potential hazard to the divers? Not just in terms of direct injury, but I can imagine that if even only 10 of these wires poking into and through the diving suits per day, it would wear the suit down rather quickly.
@@Diluculi1 That's possible, to help avoid direct injury they could be spun with pliers.
And it would depend on the kind of wire used, thin copper or aluminum wires would be more likely to bend than poke through a wetsuit.
Love to see you exploring alternatives, but also it seems like the plastic gets surrounded and sequestered by the body of the coral pretty quickly, so I don’t see what the major issue is. Also, the idea of tying knots in twine under water, with a current, in gloves, around irregular structures has me like 😵💫. I imagine that the ease of use of zip ties increases productivity considerably, even before the organic materials degrade (which is significant on its own).
Cool innovation for the stainless connecting strips though! And that wouldn’t have come if you had dismissed the comments quickly like I would have 🤣 Awesome job keeping an open mind and taking community suggestions into consideration, with super transparent reporting and video evidence. You rock, Yudi!
Thank you so much for your support! I feel heard! 🤟 Cheers, Yudi
As long as the plastic zip ties won't cause LONG TERM health issues to the corals or the environment, I won't be against their use.
Thank you for your thoughtful perspective! Studies have shown that while plastic zip ties can become encased in the coral’s skeleton within 3-6 months, there’s limited evidence on their long-term effects on coral growth. The zip ties would be encased in calcium carbonate, which is a secretion product of the coral as it grows. Cheers, Yudi
I used to freedive a ton in the coasts of Croatia and over the years of growing up, I've seen how fast these things can regrow even in areas that ended up being a bit more destroyed over the years, a helpful nudge like this speeds it up so heccin much and I love to see it.
Back then I didn't really know the significance of these things beyond "diving relaxing, underwater beautiful" and basic school stuff. Seeing videos like these is genuinely amazing.
It's great to hear your experiences in Croatia. It breeds more hope in me that we can make a difference 'nudging' these important ecosystems back to health as you say! Thanks for the feedback, cheers Tim
Glad to see you looking into alternatives. Looking forward to results in 3 months. I really hope one of these twines will be up for the job.
The metal structures I'm far less concerned about. It's not like you're pumping tons and tons of finely ground iron dust into the ocean. - That would be an issue for sure. But these cohesive structures will only corrode as fast as their surface area allows, and with the protective coatings that might take a very long time, and at least based on what I know right now, I don't think that slow source of extra iron is gonna be that dangerous.
Thank you for the support! And on top of that, the coralline algae will eventually covered the structure adding more layer naturally. Cheers, Yudi
Plus there are quite a few artificial reefs already colonized out there that were formed from deliberately sunken ships. Most are doing well and don't pose harm to the environment if the ship was cleaned properly.
Hey guys, nice to see fellow coral planters being busy!
I have been trying to plant corals on and off since the bleaching of 2016. Working as a dive instructor in the Maldives, i realised that speed and convenience are key. While it was so rewarding seeing my first 5-10 pieces of coral growing over the years, and eventually attract schools of small fish. But more and more i regretted not putting another 100 pieces down years ago.
But the problem for me, and i guess for everybody, is always time and resources. I did not have the option to go to the store to buy anything, as i was working on a resort island with no shops. So i had to import all my equipment in my luggage the 1 time a year i flew home.
So after trying some things out, i figured out that a rope system was for me by far the best. I ended up finding or making some anchor points, either some big rocks, bags filled with sand or old umbrella stands. Then put those in a circle and connect a big rope , 1cm diameter or so, between them as the base of a spider web, to replace the frames you are using. If needed put some rocks or anything in the middle to elevate the whole. Just make sure this is sturdy, as long as these ropes are stretched tight, no turtle will be able to get stuck in it. Frames will still be the better choice, but they were not available for me.
Then use thin 2 strand braided cotton rope to lay over the big ropes. I used rope that i could break by pulling hard enough by bare hands, in the hopes that a turtle that might get trapped will be able to do as well.
And now for the best part: to attach a piece of coral, all you need to do is to unwind a short part of the braid, pull the 2 strains of the wire apart and slide the coral piece in. As the corals are quite sharp, they will stick in between the wire very good. Like this it took me around 5 seconds or so to attach a piece of coral.
And it has a great benefit for later, as the ropes are really easy to transport from a central nursery to the reef.
The downside of this method is the maintenance of repairing the broken ropes. Fish and turtles will come through and break ropes. If you want you could solve this by using thicker ropes, but that does create the potential for something to get stuck in it if the ropes are to close to eachother.
But in my case i made the coral nursery in the place where i did my training sessions. And i got real nice response from the guests who saw me fixing or adding corals during their scuba dive training
Hey there, fellow coral planter! 🌊 It’s fantastic to hear about your dedication to coral restoration since 2016.
Your rope system sounds innovative and efficient, especially considering the logistical constraints you faced on the resort island. I love how you’ve thought about the safety of marine life with breakable ropes for turtles-such a thoughtful touch!
Some other organization here in Bali use rope to hang Acropora branching, and same as you, it's for the coral nursery.
Thanks for sharing your experience and the ingenious solutions you’ve come up with. It’s all about adapting to what works best in your specific environment. Best of luck with your ongoing efforts, and to make even more progress in the future! 🌍💚 Cheers, Yudi
This is all very positive news, thank you Yudi and Mossy Earth.
Thank you for following our progress! Cheers, Yudi
It is nice to see that you are proceeding with a lot of testing! About corrosion, if you have in contact normal steel with stainless one, you can have galvanic corrosion... leading to a faster corrosion of the scheleton.
Thank you for the insight! Luckily so far the coating seems to covered the structure very well. Cheers, Yudi
Fantastic job. Keep going! It’s better to start and get things moving along with restoration than wait for the perfect solution. I’m sure you guys can work out an alternative in time… but until then I’m excited to see you also consider recycling to mitigate the additional waste.
Thank you so much for the encouragement and support! 🌊 It's all about making progress and refining our approach as we learn and grow. Cheers, Yudi
Yudi, thank you so much for the updates. These are great to make us feel part of a movement and let use contribute with ideas. Your passion makes me feel hopeful for the future of the earth!!
Thank you for following our progress and for your kind words! One of our goals is to raise awareness of the importance of coral reefs and the urgent need for conservation efforts. And hearing that our message is received by many is truly encouraging. Cheers, Yudi
You are doing such an impressive work and I love to follow it. You have a really cool job!
Thank you for your support and for following our project! Stay tuned for our next update. Cheers, Yudi
rebar tie wire cost almost same as zip tie, but for experienced user it's faster than zip tie to use.. You just need rebar wire tie twister tool and little practice... there is also power tool version, but won't be cheap to get one that can be used underwater..
This was als my first thought: (ungalvanised) steel wire, possibly with a wire gun.
I have no experience with them, but
If it can be used for rebar tightening it should be fast and secure enough for tying choral
This is the answer, they could even use stainless steel wire if it needs to last a long time, but I assume raw steel wire last long enough for the coral to attach by itself
I'm not sure about the underwater power tool (that would be awesome thoug). I think the wire is worth to try on coral, I think with some preparation it would be more or less the same time as zip ties, to pre cut it for example. Thank you for the ideas! Cheers, Yudi
Keep going!! You guys are doing such important work!
Thank you for your suppirt and the encouragement! Cheers, Yudi
yesss this was my one and only concern, so excited to see what comes from this
It's also ours! Cheers, Yudi
If it helps the coral should quickly encase the ziptie in the skeleton, which isn't part of their living tissue and is effectively just limestone.
You and your whole team are heroes. Your passion and dedication show!! We as humans do the best we can when we have good intentions. The fact that the team can say "we are open to ideas and are willing to try them out" show real leadership because true leaders listen. Thank you on behalf of everyone and every living thing that loves our planet, we love you ❤❤❤❤
Thank you for your passion and kind words! ❤️ Cheers, Yudi
Thanks for the follow up Yudi. I love this field notes format where you're having an open conversation with all of us supporters. Go team!
Thank you for your support! Cheers, Yudi
Amazing adaptations, I have so much love and respect for you guys
Thank you for your support! ❤️ Cheers, Yudi
Great work guys! Love your enthusiasm, research and methodical approach, setting up best practice for this and future coral restorations.
Thank you for your kind words and for your support! Cheers, Yudi
Great to see the science being done to evaluate alternative options.
Regarding the stainless steel zip ties, have you considered crimping them in a zigzag pattern, like an accordion, before using them? This gives some elasticity to the steel, allowing a more variable shaped object to be attached.
Another option might be Polylactic acid (PLA) or polycaprolactone (PCL) zipties. PLA zipties can be mass produced easily and cheaply by 3D printer (and there are organizations which do printing work for charities). PCL zipties are available premade online. They are slightly more expensive but in underwater environments they will become weak in a year, and dissolve almost completely in 4 years.
If you would like more information on this topic, please reply and we can organize a conversation. I am not a retailer.
You are doing awesome work, keep it up!
Thank you! Cheers, Yudi
Interesting project
You are doing a fantastic job!
💚🙏🌱👏🐠
Thank you for your support! Cheers, Yudi
Very cool! from what i could find from a quick search the iron isn't really bad for the environment at least there is no mentioning of it in this article: Iron in the environment (Kamble et al., 2013)
Very resourceful! Thank you for the support! Cheers, Yudi
thanks for keeping us updated! Amazing work :))
Thank you for the support and for following our progress! Cheers, Yudi
I cannot wait to see how this projects evolves. 🙌🏻 Some other coral restoration projects use rope.
This is one of my favourite projects as a proud Mossy Earth member.💙
Thank you for your support on this project! There are some project that used rope around our site, usually for hanging nursery for Acropora branching type of coral. Cheers, Yudi
Best of luck with the trial Yudi and team!
Nice work everyone!!!
Did you consider also the possibility of building different layers of height in the structures? Corals grow on rocks and different height, so it could be interesting to create maybe some points with a double layer of structures forming also different slopes and sizes for future development of coral and fish safe spots.
I know nothing about reef ecology, but seeing the structures being all on a single layer made me think that maybe a bit of variety could be useful and more natural
Great suggestion! Building structures with varying heights could indeed mimic natural reef environments more closely and provide diverse habitats for marine life. However, for our project, uniformity in structure design ensures efficiency, especially considering the volume we produce. Additionally, we are afraid that the strong currents in our working area pose a risk for taller structures.
Thanks again for your input and support! 🌊💙 Cheers, Yudi
1. Zip ties will be grown over by the coral, keeping it from breaking off and impacting the oceans, so it’s likely not an issue. However other methods aren’t a bad idea.
2. Metal structures will eventually rust away, however by that time the corals will have grown large enough to support themselves and each other. I think that is a benefit as they will eventually grow onto one another like they should.
I think of the rebar like a manure plant pot, it gives structure for the initial growth and then slowly degrades allowing the corals to expand and grow even larger
The only issue is that rust is toxic to some corals
But otherwise yeah, however the loss of the metal structure will also make it more susceptible to damage for a few years
@@ConstantChaos1 ahhh I didn’t know that, yeah I guess no one really like breathing in iron oxide 😂 I wonder how long it would take to break down, because if it took 5 years it might be an issue, but if it takes 50 the coral may have grown large enough for it to not matter 🤷♂️
@@ConstantChaos1 after reading a bit more it looks like the rusting varies based on several factors including temperature (which I assume is fairly high in a shallow coral reef), current and metal absorption rates. The articles still allude to about a 10-40 year lifespan. Likely to be on the lower side because of temp and current, but generously 20 years because of the epoxy and because I’m hopeful 😂
@NoahHagen yeah, and to be clear the rust is actually only a problem for some corals, others do actually benifit from being generally nearby as the iron oxide can be fertalizer for algae making the waters more nutrient dense, but hopefully the resin and crushed coral coating will slow it down enough for it to just work as fertalizer and not cause issues. It's an imperfect system but logistically a much better solution than things like bio-blocks at least for now, especially since if we see certian ones rusting out too fast, we can always intervene, it's a much larger issue with things like sunken ships or lost shipping containers. Which generate much more rust.
@NoahHagen yeah there is high temp and radiation levels working against us, but the epoxy should buy us a fair bit of time. I think 20-30 years is a fair assessment (for a half life at least), assuming near perfect coatings of epoxy, if they are more slapdash with holes in the coating, I give it 10-17 or so, but the coatings look good so yeah
Sry I really liked my materials sciences classes lol
Thin aluminium wire would likely work just as well, and wouldn't easily corrode either. And can be cut underwater with similar effort as cable ties with a good pair of wire cutters. That would solve the plastics issue.
That's a fantastic suggestion! Aluminium wire does sound like a practical solution. I wonder if it would be the same result as metal wire (which has high detachment rate). I think it's worth testing it. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I don't think aluminum will work great, it's lower on the galvanic series than steel, so the aluminum would be eaten away at. If the stainless steel works then a bronze or brass could work as alternatives. Still would take some testing to confirm.
Great work guys!
I wonder if there are any biodegradable zip ties that would work for fixing the coral on? I'd assume they're not needed once the coral has grown enough to attach itself but you'd need to find something that lasts long enough for that to happen, and can biodegrade in salt water
cotton/hemp ties are a nice idea, but can only imagine how annoying they are to tie underwater 😂
Thanks so much for your support and great question! 🌊 You're absolutely right about the need for biodegradable options. We've actually been exploring biodegradable zip ties but so far we couldn't find plastic-free biodegradable one. It's definitely a challenge, but we're hopeful that we'll find a sustainable solution soon.
As for cotton and hemp ties, you're spot on-they are more eco-friendly but can be tricky to work with underwater! We're always on the lookout for better alternatives. Do you have any ideas or suggestions for biodegradable materials that might work well? Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I'm not all that sure how various things do in seawater but PCL is biodegradable and maybe natural rubber?
Also, just thinking but it might be easier to use a different method to attach the coral with the string?
If you used a binding knot (something like a bag knot, which is a variation on a clove hitch. Clove hitches and it's variations would be good here I'd imagine because you can create it loosely then just pull on each end to tighten it) to hold the coral onto the reef (rather than just wrapping the string) then tied whichever knot you're using on top that might be easier because the coral would be held in place while you're tying the knot?
Waxed strings might last better underwater too if the string degrading too fast is part of the problem?
Good luck with it all!
(and sorry explaining knots with words is not a good plan)
biodegradable zip-ties made from 100% PCL seem pretty widely available
@@hannesbolmstedt care must be taken in selecting "biodegradable" products because what is biodegradable in soil is not necessarily biodegradable in salt water, or may in fact deteriorate too fast to be useful. I think steel/iron wire strikes a good balance - lasts long enough to be useful, corrodes into iron which is a natural nutrient in the water. If wires aren't being successful to attach corals then I think it's worth doing some investigation as to why; maybe it matters if the twist is placed next to the coral or next to the frame. Maybe the coral doesn't like rusty steel touching it (add a protective sleeve over the wire?). Maybe the gauge of wire matters. Maybe a special tool needs to be used to consistently tighten the wires.
I also wonder if it is not impractical to get the coral to grow/attach to the frames in a tank on land before deploying them into the environment, therefore allowing the attachment materials to be removed before deployment. Either way forge ahead with the zipties in the meantime - great work!
@@tmmtmm At least with live rock, very little time out of water kills the organisms. Its probably not feasible to create coral farms on land and transport them out to sea. Not economically.
Instead of metal zipties, you could use thin metal wires. Wrap the wire around the corals and the steel bars, and then twist the two ends of the wire around each other for fixing. My dad used this method in his hobby vineyard to guide the growth of the plants. Which exact material of wire I'll leave to your expertise.
In what way is steel wire "safer" than metal zip ties? They're both metal. They both corrode...duh.
@@CitizenAyellowblue have you even watched the video? 8:26
The wire is faster and easier to secure corals with and they won't need the pliers (if they choose the right gauge). Also its easier to judge how tightly it holds, so that whey hopefully wont crush the corals. Also it would be cheaper too.
@@IamCrusaderRUS I think you'd get the same problem with the steel zip ties. Metal isn't soft and a tight enough hold would probably break the brittle coral.
That's what we are afraid of, so we need more time to test and hopefully come up with a way to use it on coral. Meanwhile, after some days now, the steel zip ties hold pretty good on structures. Cheers, Yudi
I recommend watching a video here on YT from the channel Nature on PBS. They did a video covering how marine biologists are restoring coral in Oahu Hawaii. The video is titled Coral Reefs That Can Finally Beat the Heat. They use a drill to make tiny holes for their heat tolerant coral to go in and an apoxy type glue to make sure it sticks. The video explains in more detail. Regardless yall are doing an amazing job. Nothing is ever perfect but trying to do our best is the only thing we can do. Great job. Fellow Mossy Earth member here!!!!
I watched that video! Cery interesting indeed. It's so encouraging to hear from fellow Mossy Earth members and knowing we're all in this together. 🌊💚Cheers, Yudi
This method is much more resource intensive and only works for direct sewing on stone or dead corrals tho.
That is for colonizing bleached and dead coral
Not for expanding the coral on the frames
Since I got a heart I'm not editing my old comment but *sowing which I just realized my phone has been auto"correcting" for a while now... I'm a horticulture student so that word comes up a lot and I hadn't noticed lol tbf I'm dyslexic
Very well considered and thought out responses to the comments received. I’m impressed with your work and proud to be a member!!
Thank you for your passion and your support to this project! Cheers, Yudi
Thank you for the good work Yudi.
Thank you for the support! Cheers, Yudi
I think you are doing an amazing work!
Please keep sending updates.
Will do! Thank you for the encouragement. Cheers, Yudi
Do you have an average number of days or span of days that it takes for corral to attach fully?
Could look to find a material to corrodes just over that limit and see if there is a product made of it that can be tied. Or something under it that you can do a second tie on at the midway point to re secure before it corrodes
The average time for corals to fully attach can vary, but it generally takes around 30 to 60 days for coral fragments to securely attach to a substrate. I have high hope in the hemp rope, but we should decide once we have the final result of the experiment. The idea is that the attachment will be covered in coral completely when it's successful. Cheers, Yudi
Idk if yudi has been training or not but your speech is so much clearer then the last video, great job ❤
Appreciate the feedback ❤️ thank you for following pur progress and for your kind words! Cheers, Yudi
I am really enjoying these updates, keep up the good work!
Thank you for the encouragement! We’re glad to hear you’re enjoying our updates. We’ll continue to share every step of the journey so many people feel included in our coral project! Cheers, Yudi
Thanks for the follow up! Using plastic is always a concern, however, it seems like it’s industry standard. I’m sure everyone around the world in this field knows what works best although I appreciate the experiments. Plastic zip ties are quick, cheap, and easy to use which matters when you’re scuba diving. Hopefully a more environmentally friendly alternative will be found. In the meantime you gotta use what you gotta use. Excellent work 🙌
Zero training for zip ties - they're getting help from volunteers.
Thank you for the kind words and understanding! Cheers, Yudi
Keep up the good work team! ❤
Thank you! Cheers, Yudi
I have a new question: how do you select what coral fragments you put on the structures? Did you guys analyze which species, mixtures and ratios occur in the old reef and mimic that? Or do you focus on particular species to get a quick coverage so the other species can more easily return in a natural way? Or do you just grab whatever you can find? I heard that you dont want to break of coral yourself and try to only use naturally fragmented parts, but I can imagine that limits your options.
Thanks for your question! Since we aim to replicate the surrounding coral ecosystem, we collect naturally fragmented coral around our restoration site. So our limitation would be the species found in surrounding area. Cheers, Yudi
Thank you for all of your efforts! ❤
Thank you for your encouragement! Cheers, Yudi
My (totally untested) suggestion -- cotton/hemp/sisal string that has been waterproofed with linseed oil. It should stay flexible, but last longer in sea water. Preparing it in advance takes time, though. You'll need to coat the string and hang it up to dry. The product is basically the same as traditional linoleum flooring, and is fully biodegradable.
Some notes on linseed oil:
There are three common types to buy. Raw linseed oil is totally natural, but takes a very long time (weeks or months) to dry. Boiled linseed oil dries much more quickly, but includes heavy metal additives like cobalt. DOUBLE boiled linseed oil dries quickly and has no additives, but can be hard to find.
The drying process generates heat, and the oil/fibre mixture is flammable. There's little risk if the string is hung up with plenty of ventilation -- the main risk is from piles of rags coated in the oil.
I'm happy to talk about this more in this comment thread, or by email.
Concrete rebar is tied together with "tie wire" a steel wire is wrapped around and twisted tightly to Bund the crossing rebar together. If you used tie wire it would be more metal and less plastic, some care/practice using the tie wire will mean you have alot if control with it too. There are multiple types of tools for tie wire you could try too. It could be used just like the metal cable ties too, and it will likely be cheaper. Honestly can't think of a better option myself.
Thank you for your suggestion, I think tie wire is a good replacement. We are going to further test this if we can use it in our coral restoration project. Thank you again for the support! Cheers, Yudi
Interesting work keep up improving it and also see if others are doing things differently elsewhere in the world. My direct comment is that a rope of 95% cotton last a lot longer than 100% cotton so could work and still be a lot less plastic than zip ties
Thank you for the support! We studied similar efforts around Bali at the early stages of our project, and it has been insightful. Anx thanks for the input, we'll definitely consider this and research the potential benefits. Cheers, Yudi
Later when i had more corals to work with, i started to skip the frames all together. I put bigger pieces of staghorn all over a place that i wanted to put corals on, about half a meter apart from eachother. Then i used the thin 2 strand cotton ropes and connected them all with eachother.
This had the effect that the individual pieces of coral where not able to roll over anymore. So the triggerfish grabbing a piece and rolling it over so that it died was not happening anymore.
Then i would put smaller pieces of coral in between the bigger pieces. So that they remained completely out of the sand.
Like this i could take a rope of 1 year old corals, cary them trough the water to another place. Cut the rope, put the corals on a small hill so that they will not get covered by sand. And attach a new rope to them and fill that with new fragments. And as the bigger corals were resting on the ground now, the thin ropes hardly broke anymore. Unless a stingray decides to dig a hole right in the middle of your chosen spot or so.. 😂
Ah, and it was funny to see that our resident green turtle quickly learned that the thick ropes were really good for cleaning her shell. So we could watch her rubbing her back on the points where the thick ropes were leading into the sand.
If you want some pictures to see what i did, i can email them to you.
Take care!
That's a fantastic approach to coral restoration! Using rope nurseries is a proven method for cultivating healthy coral. I'm really impressed with your dedication and the progress you've made. Your efforts are making a significant difference in protecting our marine ecosystems. And it's always encouraging to see the marine life starts to come and settle in at our coral restoration area. Thank you for sharing your story, and for following our progress. Keep up the great work! Cheers, Yudi
Also they make a kind of tie wire with two loops on the end you use a tool to spin together and twist to tie down stuff. Could be perfect for what you need to do.
Thank you for your suggestion! Interesting, we'll see if we could get one of those in Indonesia. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I put some more information about them in my other comment (sorry for the mess). Wishing you the best of luck!
Very interesting, thanks for the answers.
Thank you for following our progress! Cheers, Yudi
I wonder if small metal clips may help? Such as Screw-on clamp holder for pipes. They may be more expensive than wire alone, but way easier to use, as they hold the coral using pressure alone, as there is no need to spend time to tie it, and no need to cut them. The time you spend under water is a cost too, as you will have more free time to expand the project. The clips may be big, but that may create surface for coral to grow on, so it is not a loss. Check for "Spire clips" too.
Thank you for sharing your idea! The spire clips seem really interesting. I've never seen them before (I'm a bit of a tinkerer myself 😆).
It's true that spending time underwater is costly, and we have limited time per dive, and since the source of the coral are from surounding area undwrwater, bringing coral fragments to the boat is extra effort, and we can only transport a few at a time. Also, exposing the corals to the air for too long risks stressing them.
For the spire clips in coral restoration, it looks like marine glue or resin would be necessary to secure the coral fragments to the screw points. I can see how that would be very useful for an indoor nursery. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I wish you the best! This is very important and you are doing a great thing.
I think that it is fine to have slight set backs for the greater good! Keep going!
Thank you for your support to our project! Cheers, Yudi
if you plan on using wire, you can get safety wire pliers for fast installation of coral frags. there is a type of aquarium glue that hobbyists use to attach coral frags to a disk but i'm assuming it might be too expensive or have unknown ecological consequences like water pollution.
We are planning to use metal wire, as many are suggesting. As for the glue, I saw some project use the method you are saying, but for indoor nursery, usually for research in a lab. Chees, Yudi
Great job with the vlog, really interesting
Could there be a way to bond the rubble together into some kind of structure for the new corals to grow on?
Maybe try attaching the coral with thin metal wire, wrapped several times around the coral piece, and then twist the two ends together to secure it in place? 😊
That sounds like a good idea, and I think that could work. Thank's for the idea, we'll definitely do experiment with it. Cheers, Yudi
Maybe you could fashion a specific shape of pliers and use a c-shaped piece of metal to attach the coral to the frame. It would only need to be a thicker wire you bend in to a spring and cut open so you could manufacture the clips fast and easy.
Interesting, thank your for the idea! It needs to be strong though, I use long pliers and while it can go to dificult corner, to get a good grip is quite an effort. Cheers, Yudi
You could try metal wire that is used to tie rebar. There are handheld devices that can tie rebar with metal wire. So it will be very quick to tie. Adapting those devices for underwater use might be a challenge. But rebar is tied under water as well so perhaps they already exist
Thank you for the idea and for your support! Somehow along the way we are forgetting this option, we are going to test it on our next trial. Cheers, Yudi
Stainless steel bailing wire! It comes in different thicknesses. So you can use thinner for the more delicate corals and thicker for holding the structures together
Interesting idea! Thin wire has a bad record for tying coral fragments, but I think it's worth to try to see the result first hand . Thank you for the suggestion! Cheers, Yudi
Incredible work. I do miss diving in Indonesia. I just wondered why you are creating a single height of structures and not stacking a couple to change the topography, and water velocity to promote diversity. Obviously you can't go too high with the currents as they are. Not sure if this has been noted at this site, but I've found the smaller the fragments the quicker the growth rate. Keep up the great work, sure many don't appreciate how much harder working underwater is.
Thank you for the kind words and your thoughtful suggestion. I think with the smaller structures you can fit more coral fragment into an area, but we also need to take into consideration the space for the coral to grow as well. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes thanks for replying. Sorry i didn't mean smaller structures, i meant smaller fragments. So dependent on the species, a 5mm fragment will grow faster to 500mm than a 50mm fragment will. Micro colony fusion. The paper Forsman et al 2015 highlights this.
Super work!❤
Thank you for the support! Cheers, Yudi
Please you can use cotton ties such as small cotton rope. It's natural and don't need to use plastic. Last research show us plastic contaminate living tissue of coral. Plastic in the ocean is already a huge problem. People use this technic because it's easy to attach quickly and beginners, tourist everyone can do it. But the goal is not everyone can do it but it's so it good even if it's take more time. If you need any advice please let me know.
Maybe try coating the hemp strings in wax or epoxy? To increase longevity. That would be a lot of work i guess?
I'm afraid so, and I think the wax will crack when it dries. And epoxy also bot an option to aplly underwater, would too difficult. Thank you for suggestion and for following our project. Cheers, Yudi
I read that phytoplankton blooms can absorb iron from the ocean and convert it into a carbon store, also the blooms produce food for organisms. I guess steel is lighter and easier to produce and handle than iron, but steel rusts quicker - so many there is some use in looking into other materials than steel. Additionally, would there be a way to alter the design of the cages to have easier mounting points? For example have some loop holes of varying sizes that the coral could easily slot into? I know it needs to be secure but I feel like currently you are having to force the zip ties to create enough surface friction. If you could give the coral more contact surface area you wouldn't need to use as much force on the zip ties (And avoid breaking the corals). If the design were to be altered to have loops the cages could also interlink, making them more secure.
Thank you for sharing your perspectives! That is true, the corals also need iron for it biomechanism to create calsium carbonate.
We are currectly testing the metal zip ties on limited selection of coral species, to find what is best to use it for.
Cheers, Yudi
Hello, great work. Good luck with your trials. -- suggestion about a brace approach below.
Because some of these materials can be quite tricky under water to tie,
I was wondering to accelerate the installation and solve the zip ties problem an approach could on land to install a brace on the stricture.
What i mean is somethin that has a u shape coral side or v shape on which a piece of tie - let s call it the strap - (not plastic) is attached to one side of the brace. The brace itself is secured with metal tie to the structure.
Once under water with the coral the idea would be to have only one side of the strap to attach to secure the coral against the brace.
Maybe this would not work for all for of coral if there is no tubular shape to strap against the brace. But hopefully it does not make the work under water more complicated and the strap can be soft enough to not hurt the coral
Best of luck anyway
That’s a thoughtful suggestion! Thank you for the encouragement and for sharing your innovative idea. For simplicity, it is better to tie the coral directly to the stucture, and If the brace would be like an extention of the structure, I'm afraid it would create additional attachment to worried about. But securing the wire for coral on land before deploying it underwater could indeed simplify the process and address the plastic issue. Cheers, Yudi
Bamboo cord ( string) is waterproof... that may work. There is also stainless steel thread/ string also called stainless yarn. May be easier than the zipties
Thank you for the idea. We’ve been considering that and wondered if it’s 100% natural bamboo fiber or if it’s mixed with any synthetic materials. It's worth to look it up, we'll definitely do more research of the potential. Cheers, Yudi
Have you looked into adding a "pin" that would allow you to hook up the structures just using friction instead of ties?
We Haven't look into that, thank you for the suggestion! But I imagine that kind of preparation is something that would work in nusrery, as for our project, we take coral fragments from surrounding area and transplant it directly to the structure, so we need the instant tying menthod. Cheers, Yudi
Choosing which "coral" to plant is necessarily a type of selection pressure. What criteria is used to choose which coral to propagate within a species?
Could possibly use wire to tie in the coral, just wrap around and twist the ends to tighten.
Thank you for the suggestion, we will try using the wire in the next test. Cheers, Yudi
It's great to see some experimentation around the zip ties! Correct me if I'm wrong but would the epoxy resin to hold the sand on not be more harmful and be worth thinking about as well?
It’s a lot of extra work using these alternative methods. Does the plastic ties eventually fall off or just get enveloped by the coral?
Or even just using the metal ties to hold the structures together and using the plastic ones for the corals. 🤷🏻♂️
Thank you for sharing your thoughts. The zip ties will eventually get enveloped by coral between 3 - 6 months. Cheers, Yudi
Have you thought about using stainless steel or copper wire to atach the corals? I would think it gets you the reduction in plastic while also allowing for better ease of installation than the twine.
That sounds like a good idea, thank you for your suggestion. Cheers, Yudi
I love the staneless steel for the structural adhesion, but yeah i think it is a bad idea for the coral attachmemt as it wont be covered by the coral very easily as it isnt great for them to grow on.
Thank you for your support! I'm also curious to see how fast the coralline algae would encrust the stainless steel zip ties. Cheers, Yudi
How long do you need the zipties to last? Does the coral eventually attach to the metal?
Great improvement! Also nice to hear some Indonesian!
Thank you for your support! Cheers, Yudi
Would you say zip tie like products are the best way to attach coral or are there adhesives that would be better or be more efficient to use?
what about stainless steel twist ties?
you could instead of plastic zip ties use thicker steel wires, like a paperclip type of material. This will eventually rust but probably not before the coral adheres. Something to try anyway
Or a fencing wire and associated fencing wire tool
Thanks for the suggestion! I think it doesn't harm to include steel wires with different sizes on our next experiment. Cheers, Yudi
At first I tought that the type of wire you use for stitching wounds in the hospital would be great since there are versions that disintegrate in a certain time frame, but that's probably too quick for the coral to grow.
Pre-fixing metal wire to the frame that makes coral quick to attach later sounds good, but also creates a spiky field divers have to work in with their hands and the twisted up wire is still spiky.
Going all natural (no metal that can corrode) sounds like the way to go, what about waxed hemp cord? Like mooring lines but in miniature version. It's been used for centuries on the oceans and depending on the thickness of the cord, you can test which one you need for the duration until the coral attaches and the cord eventually looses itself or disintegrates since it's not needed forever.
Thank your sharing your thoughts! I think the wire would work with the right tool, and it's worth to try it out. Probably will take more time to attach it.
Thank you for the idea with the cord, we'll look it up. Cheers, Yudi
Can you use a putty or a type cement?
Some other project in Indonesia use cement to attach baby coral to concrete block type of structure, And usualy they do it on land near the beach before deploy them to the ocean. To addapt their approach as we transplant coral fragments directly underwater would be dificult. Cheers, Yudi
Can you not do everything above water with fast drying concrete? My father did it with oesters on a robe with fast drying concrete them sink it in the water..
We don't want to expose the coral above water for too long, and because we collect the coral fragments directly underwater (not from other source), bringing them up to the boat seems impractical since we can only bring up a little at the time.
Some other project with concrete structure does this, typically done on the shore. Since our project site is only accessible by boat, we cannot use this method.
Thank you for your support and for your input to our project! Cheers, Yudi
I’d be really curious if bioplastic zip ties made using PLA could be possible. I can find one manufacturer of them. And even if not, they can be easily manufactured with PLA, a 3D printer, and downloadable designs , also supporting local Indonesian technological innovation.
You could consider loosely attaching the zip ties prior to placing under water, so that the coral only needs to be placed and the tie tightened, this may speed things up underwater.
Have you thought about pre-tying some of the rebar structures together on land and deploying in units of two or three? It would speed up deployment under water and make the operation more efficient. However I am not sure how that would affect stacking on the boat and how many you could take to site on a trip.
I love the great work you are doing. It is great to see you try to minimise the plastic, but I think the huge benefits of re-growing a reef will outlay the small impact the amount of plastic will have, especially as it is covered by algae and corals.
We did the pre-tighten zip ties at the beginning, but we encountered some challenges. The coral fragments varied in size and shape, and often had bulges or branches on both ends, which made it difficult to fit them through the pre-tightened zip ties. While there wasn't a significant difference in time consumption, it is also the case for the structures. And we found it easier to transport the coral fragments on the boat when they were loose.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts about our project and for your support! It means a lot to us. Cheers, Yudi.
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes Hey thanks for the response and best wishes for the project :)
Is it possible to attach the coral onto the frame while on the boat? If coral needs to remain wet, place the frame in a large bucket of saltwater and do the attaching while you're in the air. I suggest using stainless steel wire as it will last longer in the salt water. I don't know if a cable tie gun($140) would work, but it would would also make it much easier. Keep up the good work!
Thank you for sharing your prespectives! It is possible, but since we collect coral fragments and transplant it directly underwater, bringing them up to the boat will add extra efforts. And to reduce stress to the coral for being exposed out of the water we only have little window.
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes I understand. If you used wire, you could attach the wire to your frame while in the air and reduce the time to attach the coral. I look to seeing more of your work.
Try twist ties. Like what goes on bread in the US. The one with paper on the outside of a thin piece of wire.
Interesting idea, I think it's worth the try. Thank you for the suggestion! Cheers, Yudi
How you don't use superglue as all reefers do ?
Thank you for your suggection. We haven't had the chance to try it out. We found this brand 'Seatak' that looks like it's been used for coral restoration, but with the scale of our project, it would cost a lot of money. Cheers, Yudi
Would you be able to do a livestream of the area?
That would be cool, but we can't at the moment. Cheers, Yudi
I imagine the string is less successful because as the natural fibers soak with water, they will stretch. If the coral bits are more loose because the string stretches, the water currents would probably cause them to move making it harder to attach.
I use florist wire for hobby stuff, and it is roughly 1mm thick and easy to bend/twist/cut. I do think it would rust, but if the coral attaches first then it won't matter if it rusts away.
The cotton twine has the most detachment rate so far, although also has some succesful cases. We figure the state of the coral fragment also a factor. If the coral fragment is healthy ang usually big enough, it could attach faster to the structure.
We'll definitely look into the florist wire, thanks for the idea!
Cheers, Yudi
I was wondering if the metal zipties wont also be a big problem if they end up in the ocean as they seem pretty sharp and durable and might hurt a lot of sea creatures if eaten by accident
That's one of my concern at the begining, but when we finally got the material, it truns out their edges are not sharp at all. And we curl the remaining part using pliers as we tighten it. It's been almost a week now, and they are still attached well. Cheers, Yudi
has there been any consideration of wire/twist ties? I know most of them are made with plastic but I have seen some plastic free options that are coated with waxed paper instead, and you could potentially just use wire alone to act as a twist tie?
Thank you for your support and for the idea. From research that we found, wire ties has just slightly lower succesful rate from plastic zip ties. We will add this material on our next test. Cheers, Yudi
Even if plastic ends up being the most efficacious - this use of plastic far outweighs the ecological burden. There’s going to be micro plastics in the project area, might as well have been used to promote the restoration
Thank you for your thought and support! Cheers, Yudi
In my head, wire twist ties (like the kind that come with cheap trash bags) should work just as well as zip ties, but I'm not the expert here and maybe they would corrode too quickly before the coral can fully attach itself to the frame. But twist ties, or just thin stainless steel wire, are really cheap and easy to use. Bailing wire is super cheap and easy to work with too, and it's fairly robust and corrosion resistant, and there are some neat tools designed specifically for bailing wire.
I also like the idea of cement, since coral structure is basically the same stuff as lime cement. But getting cement to set when fully submerged is not easy.
Maybe a combination of wire for short term, and a hydraulic cement for long-term?
Thank you for your suggestion! I like the idea of stainless thin wire, we'll see if we could get those materials in Indonesia. For cement as the glue to attach coral, I'm afraid it'll take more steps on preparing, and it wpuld be gard to mix it on the boat. I think tge thin wire would be the best option. Cheers, Yudi
I would say another alternative is using hemp rope if you can find it. It should naturally degrade after some time. probably by that time the coral has attached it's self to the structure.
Thank you for your support! We are testing the hemp rope on this experiment, and there are some succesful cases, but still far compare to zip ties. And that's why we are going to do more testing with hemp rope, with more selective coral fragments. Cheers, Yudi
For an alternative, would natural rubber(latex) zip ties keep the coral in place long enough? 1-5 years seems to be the timespan for the rubber to biodegrade, but I'm not sure how tight it would remain in the intial attaching timeframe.
Apparently bamboo alternatives also exist, but i can't seem to find them myself .
I think rubber would be dificult to apply underwater with the strecthing and tightening. I read some other comment also suggesting bamboo cord, but we need to male sure if they are 100% organic first. Thank you for the support! Cheers, Yudi
Bread wire ties do not work?
Bread wire ties would be to thin unfortunately. Thank your for the suggestion. Cheers, Yudi
I'd be curious how well velcro Cable Ties work under water. Also there is a thing as reusable zipties.
Thank you for following our coral restoration project.
To tie the coral, the ties need to stay with the coral until it gets fully enveloped by coral skeleton. For the fast growing coral, within a month we can see that the coral starts to encrust on top of the zip ties, making it impossible to take out without breaking the coral. Cheers, Yudi
did you try to use tape? i search it about it some tape can be used in sea but i don't know if its good for this project
Thank you for sharing you thoughts, we haven't try using tape, but I think the more difficult one is to find the tape made from organic material. Cheers, Yudi
Would it be possible to build and transport a larger rebar mat? Instead of 30-40 individual pieces, to assemble a larger section? That way, you can spend the time to make sure its sturdy while youre in the shop, which would also facilitate the use of steel ties.
I understand that the size of the boat is a limiting factor. I imagine another benefit if using smaller pieces is that you can fit the sturcture to the uneven shape of the sea floor.
But I'm a civil engineer and I've seen lots of rebar cages for shallow foundations of buildings. That's what came to my mind.
Keep up the good work! I'm sure the coral and the fish would thank you if they could talk. I'm looking forward to seeing how this looks in 3 years.
Thank you for sharing your perspective!
We try to avoid having welded joints on the top part to make the structure stronger. With rebar mat, it would end up shaped like a table because we also need the height.
What would be cool is to come up with uniform modular structures with an interlocking system on each of the arms that can be arranged together. Any thoughts? Cheers, Yudi
I suggested this on the post on the main channel, but have you tried superglue? I use it in my aquariums and it hasnt shown harmful affects on the environment. Its not exactly plastic free but it can be argued as better if it works
Thank you for following our updates and for sharing your idea! I'd be curious if the glue can be used underwater since we do the attaching directly underwater 🤔
We saw some project using epoxy underwater and thinking about the extra tools and bringing the mixture underwater would be too much for us at this point. Cheers, Yudi
@@MossyEarth-FieldNotes epoxy clay is definitely used quite often in aqua-scaping setups, especially saltwater, and has not currently been shown to cause problems. I do believe certain brands are able to cure underwater because they need pressure to be activated (similarly to superglue) though the added pressure of the waves and water might affect that and make it cure before it is ready.
what about the structural frames? could they be made of biodegradable material? metal structure is not naturally found in coral reefs
It's a more challenging task, because we still need to create a strong and rigid structure like metal rebar while also mimicking the natural coral substrate.
To achieve this, we coat the rebar with coral sand, which made from skeletal remain of corals. This creates a layer of natural material that provides a more suitable environment for coral growth.
Thank you sharing your thoughts! Cheers, Yudi
people have probably mentioned it but do biodegradable cable ties exist?
Yes they do, but finding the plastic-free biodegradable one is not easy here in Indonesia. Cheers, Yudi
What about Rebar wires?
In one of the research experiments we found, there was a high detachment rate due to rusting. Cheers, Yudi