This is awsome information for the pc compatible user... I only have a raspberry pi running raspian and retropi I thought I could get away with using dosbox however I am presented with "this program cannot be run in DOS mode" It would really be nice if I knew of a solution I could just apt-get install and have what I need
why does the nib format exist in the fist place if it contains the same info as g64? Why is the nib file still much larger than g64? is some data lost, or is this because g64 is somehow compressed like zip compression?
That's a great question! I can give a partial answer. According to old documentation, NIBTOOLS came along in 2004, and is based on routines from Markus Brenner's MNIB (2000-04), which did nibble disks directly to G64 or D64. I don't know *exactly* what the NIB format was meant to address: whether it was a shortcoming in G64, another convenient level of abstraction for the programmer, or somehow feeds into the C64 Preservation Project's mission of analysing the disk images in addition to archiving them. Neither NIB nor G64 are compressed -- but the NBZ variant is, and is typically smaller than the G64 (sometimes even the D64), making it an ideal format for archiving many disk images online. I don't know if NIB stores data that G64 doesn't, or if the difference in size just comes from how the file is internally structured. For example, converting a G64 to its TXT representation using G64CONV yields an 800KB+ file, and it's the same image. -- JC
Thanks for this excellent video, it helped me to understand a lot. I still have an issue which I can't figure out, maybe you can help. I try to burn the G64 file on a real floppy. I use XUM1541 or also tried in prompt commad. I have my parallel cable connected from the 1541 to the C64. But, I obviously miss something in the picture.Everytime I try to burn a g64, he keep saying connection failed with the P.C. I use the P.C. to run my professional dos in the 64 but I am now wondering, if the C64 is off while I try to burn the G64 file, what is the key here? Thanks a milion if you read my answer
Thank you for the kind comment! I've never used a XUM1541, but my understanding is that it's similar to a ZoomFloppy. I do have a video called "Installing a ZOOMFLOPPY in 2022", which you may or may not find helpful. :) -- JC
@@BasicBitesCA hey bud, I found my answer since then. I got confuzed with the fact the parallel cable I use is only working when my C64 is on. Actually I need to purchase a xum 1541 including a parallel port as well. Damn, for months I overlooked this, thinking I am too ignorant to understand.....
Awesome this helped me figure out what to do with these NIB files! Here is a batch file that will process all files in a folder: @echo convert NIB to G64 for /f "delims=" %%i in ('Dir /b *.nib') Do (nibconv.exe -v "%%~fi" "%%~ni.g64") Just put the nibconv.exe into the same folder as the NIB I thought I could just select all the NIB and drag onto the nibconv.exe but that did not work. So I came up with the above batch file.
So is it possible to actually write a .nib file to a real C64 5/14 inch floppy and it will think it is the original disk with the copy protection intact. like if some one would try to copy it with a normal disk to disk copier. it would fail to copy because of the protection of the original nib image even though its coming off a standard blank floppy. ??
NIBTOOLS includes the nibwrite utility for writing NIB/G64 images back to physical floppy disks. In full disclosure, I have not yet personally done that. However, NIB and G64 are *true* disk images, meaning that they contain the actual GCR data as it was read off the magnetic surface of the original. My understanding is that if you have a fully working NIB (or G64) file, writing it out to a diskette will result in an equally functional physical copy. -- JC
D64 images are fine for emulation. I 100% agree with using G64 for copy-protected games though. But using D64 images isn't as bad as you make it out to be.
Unfortunately, I do not know what those are. Hopefully another tech channel will have you covered on that. In the meantime, thanks for watching Basic Bites! -- JC
There is no "best format" for games. If you've nibbled an original retail floppy disk with any sort of copy protection, then G64 is the way to go, because most protection schemes rely on preserving the GCR encoding. I always convert NIBs to G64s for use on my Pi1541, because I know it will simply work. On the other hand, D64 is the default format with the widest compatibility for regular non-protected disks, as well as any new software releases that have never been on a physical disk. -- JC
If it is of any interest to anyone, I've been working on a program that makes nibs of V-Max protected disks writable back to disk with no hang-ups or loading issues and without modifying the loader routine. (including Defender of the Crown)
@lordaragorn6072 yes, still a work-in-progress. It will now do all versions of v-max and Vorpal (epyx) protected disks. I may consider adding RapidLok to the list, but that one is fairly easy to reproduce already
@@wadz668 Great news. I have collected a lot of games in the nib / g64 format, which does not work properly due to protection, such as vmax or rapid lock. I'd be happy to test the program if you'd like to share it.
I am very frustrated at the moment. I have downloaded several nib/g64 collections and many games are not working properly, neither in Vice nor in Mister. I've tried Conan, Green Beret, Contra USA, and others. This is one of the collections I have tried and converted to G64 with nibconv "Commodore - 64 (PP) (20131204-081826)" and I love the way the folders are arranged, I just wish it would work.
I don't believe I'm familiar with that collection. Does PP stand for "Preservation Project" by any chance? Many of my NIBs come from the C64 Preservation Project 10th Anniversary Collection (2015), which you can find under that name on the Internet Archive (although in that particular case, they've already done the conversion work for you, in that you can also download the entire collection as G64 if you want). If NIBCONV is successfully spitting out a G64 file, and that file isn't working on multiple emulators, I would suspect a bad NIB. That said, most of what I use is non-gaming software. For gaming, you might be better off with the cracked, fixed, and trained versions on D64s from CSDb, rather than images of the original disks. -- JC
@@BasicBitesCA In fact, I also tried that collection. For now I'm going to forgo the use of the Nibs, and stay with the Good GB64v3.00 collection. Thanks for the info anyway. Regards.
"....That was recorded off the surface of that disk." "Recorded _off,"_ eh? Interesting that it would copy from it and then _erase_ it at the same time. "Recorded OFF"? Not sure that makes sense.
"recorded off... " is a euphemism I've heard and used for a long time. It's not to suggest it was removed from the source. Back in the day sometimes I'd "record a tape off the radio", or I "copied a disk off a friend". You're right that it doesn't technically make sense. Maybe it's a Canadian thing?
@@infindebula: I don't know if it's a Canadian thing , but it's not a euphemism; it's simply a flat-out wrong word used. What would be so hard about just saying "FROM" instead?
@@HelloKittyFanMan. You're right, euphemism was the wrong word. It is a colloquialism I suppose. Another example: "I bought this watch off some random guy." Of course it's the wrong word. I'm not defending it, and I would never write it. In fact I didn't even realize it's something I say until I read your comment above!
Invaluable video! This is my first time using a C64 and this was the only source I could find that would explain this subject. A++
Thank you! Welcome to the world of the Commodore 64. -- JC
Brilliant, clear and easy to follow. Best video I've seen on nib conversion. A*****
This is awsome information for the pc compatible user...
I only have a raspberry pi running raspian and retropi
I thought I could get away with using dosbox however I am presented with "this program cannot be run in DOS mode"
It would really be nice if I knew of a solution I could just apt-get install and have what I need
Do you have a website where I could ask further questions?
why does the nib format exist in the fist place if it contains the same info as g64?
Why is the nib file still much larger than g64? is some data lost, or is this because g64 is somehow compressed like zip compression?
That's a great question! I can give a partial answer. According to old documentation, NIBTOOLS came along in 2004, and is based on routines from Markus Brenner's MNIB (2000-04), which did nibble disks directly to G64 or D64. I don't know *exactly* what the NIB format was meant to address: whether it was a shortcoming in G64, another convenient level of abstraction for the programmer, or somehow feeds into the C64 Preservation Project's mission of analysing the disk images in addition to archiving them. Neither NIB nor G64 are compressed -- but the NBZ variant is, and is typically smaller than the G64 (sometimes even the D64), making it an ideal format for archiving many disk images online. I don't know if NIB stores data that G64 doesn't, or if the difference in size just comes from how the file is internally structured. For example, converting a G64 to its TXT representation using G64CONV yields an 800KB+ file, and it's the same image. -- JC
Thanks for this excellent video, it helped me to understand a lot. I still have an issue which I can't figure out, maybe you can help. I try to burn the G64 file on a real floppy. I use XUM1541 or also tried in prompt commad. I have my parallel cable connected from the 1541 to the C64. But, I obviously miss something in the picture.Everytime I try to burn a g64, he keep saying connection failed with the P.C. I use the P.C. to run my professional dos in the 64 but I am now wondering, if the C64 is off while I try to burn the G64 file, what is the key here? Thanks a milion if you read my answer
Thank you for the kind comment! I've never used a XUM1541, but my understanding is that it's similar to a ZoomFloppy. I do have a video called "Installing a ZOOMFLOPPY in 2022", which you may or may not find helpful. :) -- JC
@@BasicBitesCA hey bud, I found my answer since then. I got confuzed with the fact the parallel cable I use is only working when my C64 is on. Actually I need to purchase a xum 1541 including a parallel port as well. Damn, for months I overlooked this, thinking I am too ignorant to understand.....
Awesome this helped me figure out what to do with these NIB files! Here is a batch file that will process all files in a folder:
@echo convert NIB to G64
for /f "delims=" %%i in ('Dir /b *.nib') Do (nibconv.exe -v "%%~fi" "%%~ni.g64")
Just put the nibconv.exe into the same folder as the NIB
I thought I could just select all the NIB and drag onto the nibconv.exe but that did not work. So I came up with the above batch file.
So is it possible to actually write a .nib file to a real C64 5/14 inch floppy and it will think it is the original disk with the copy protection intact. like if some one would try to copy it with a normal disk to disk copier. it would fail to copy because of the protection of the original nib image even though its coming off a standard blank floppy. ??
NIBTOOLS includes the nibwrite utility for writing NIB/G64 images back to physical floppy disks. In full disclosure, I have not yet personally done that. However, NIB and G64 are *true* disk images, meaning that they contain the actual GCR data as it was read off the magnetic surface of the original. My understanding is that if you have a fully working NIB (or G64) file, writing it out to a diskette will result in an equally functional physical copy. -- JC
@@BasicBitesCA That is good news . Thank you
@@BasicBitesCA Do you need a special cable though to write it back like the one that's needed to create the nib in the first place ?
Is there a similar thing for Linux? Fedora, specifically...
nibtools works perfectly well in Linux. I've used it for years.
D64 images are fine for emulation. I 100% agree with using G64 for copy-protected games though. But using D64 images isn't as bad as you make it out to be.
Can you convert multiple files at once?
@echo convert NIB to G64
for /f "delims=" %%i in ('Dir /b *.nib') Do (nibconv.exe -v "%%~fi" "%%~ni.g64")
how to use with retroarch and launchbox pls
Unfortunately, I do not know what those are. Hopefully another tech channel will have you covered on that. In the meantime, thanks for watching Basic Bites! -- JC
whats the best format for playing games
also is c64 emulation easy to setup
There is no "best format" for games. If you've nibbled an original retail floppy disk with any sort of copy protection, then G64 is the way to go, because most protection schemes rely on preserving the GCR encoding. I always convert NIBs to G64s for use on my Pi1541, because I know it will simply work. On the other hand, D64 is the default format with the widest compatibility for regular non-protected disks, as well as any new software releases that have never been on a physical disk. -- JC
very basic information supplied
Thank you for watching BASIC Bites! 😉 -- JC
@@BasicBitesCA exactly! 😉
If it is of any interest to anyone, I've been working on a program that makes nibs of V-Max protected disks writable back to disk with no hang-ups or loading issues and without modifying the loader routine. (including Defender of the Crown)
I am interested. Have you managed to create such a program?
@lordaragorn6072 yes, still a work-in-progress. It will now do all versions of v-max and Vorpal (epyx) protected disks. I may consider adding RapidLok to the list, but that one is fairly easy to reproduce already
@@wadz668 Great news. I have collected a lot of games in the nib / g64 format, which does not work properly due to protection, such as vmax or rapid lock. I'd be happy to test the program if you'd like to share it.
@@lordaragorn6072 I'd be happy to share but RUclips doesn't allow links in comments. Any ideas?
@@wadz668 It won't be easy, RUclips deletes everything I type
I am very frustrated at the moment. I have downloaded several nib/g64 collections and many games are not working properly, neither in Vice nor in Mister. I've tried Conan, Green Beret, Contra USA, and others. This is one of the collections I have tried and converted to G64 with nibconv "Commodore - 64 (PP) (20131204-081826)" and I love the way the folders are arranged, I just wish it would work.
I don't believe I'm familiar with that collection. Does PP stand for "Preservation Project" by any chance? Many of my NIBs come from the C64 Preservation Project 10th Anniversary Collection (2015), which you can find under that name on the Internet Archive (although in that particular case, they've already done the conversion work for you, in that you can also download the entire collection as G64 if you want). If NIBCONV is successfully spitting out a G64 file, and that file isn't working on multiple emulators, I would suspect a bad NIB. That said, most of what I use is non-gaming software. For gaming, you might be better off with the cracked, fixed, and trained versions on D64s from CSDb, rather than images of the original disks. -- JC
@@BasicBitesCA In fact, I also tried that collection. For now I'm going to forgo the use of the Nibs, and stay with the Good GB64v3.00 collection. Thanks for the info anyway. Regards.
" 'Optional' options"? Haha, as opposed to... "mandatory options"?
"....That was recorded off the surface of that disk." "Recorded _off,"_ eh? Interesting that it would copy from it and then _erase_ it at the same time. "Recorded OFF"? Not sure that makes sense.
"recorded off... " is a euphemism I've heard and used for a long time. It's not to suggest it was removed from the source. Back in the day sometimes I'd "record a tape off the radio", or I "copied a disk off a friend". You're right that it doesn't technically make sense. Maybe it's a Canadian thing?
@@infindebula: I don't know if it's a Canadian thing , but it's not a euphemism; it's simply a flat-out wrong word used. What would be so hard about just saying "FROM" instead?
@@HelloKittyFanMan. You're right, euphemism was the wrong word. It is a colloquialism I suppose. Another example: "I bought this watch off some random guy."
Of course it's the wrong word. I'm not defending it, and I would never write it. In fact I didn't even realize it's something I say until I read your comment above!
@@infindebula: Thanks. Yeah, it's kind of stupid-sounding, huh? Why not just use the _correct_ preposition?
@@HelloKittyFanMan. As I said I don't know if it's a Canadian thing. But ... I'll try harder.
Not In But