They're only more noticeable in Melee, since you get the sound effect and damage, but no knockback. Starting in Brawl, a phantom has a much less flashy spark, and a very muted unique sound, so you're less likely to see when you get one.
Yeah agreed, it was probably added for casual flavor. If you’re in the kind of situation that allows for it to happen and you’re a casual player who hasn’t been practicing a game from 2001 for however many decades you’ll probably try to dodge out of it, and this way getting it just a little too late still gives you *something*
I always interpreted phantom hits as brushing a punch against someone’s cheek, like the impact of the punch didn’t occur but you did scratch their cheek with it But at the same time, should this be in a fast pace fighting game about spacing? No!
@@Hugo_Prolovski I think it's more hype when an attack is barely dodged. It carries the same weight as a phantom hit for me, but I respect your opinion.
I think that the worst thing about phantom hits it not the minute distance not being equal to zero, I mean it is so close it almost doesn't matter, but that, at least according to mew2king, if the first frame of your attack animation that connects with the oponent is a phantom hit, then the rest of the frames would not count as a normal hit, even if they are completely inside the oponent. So Marth's sword can technically cut you from side to side and still be a phantom hit. And since generally attacks move frame by frame towards the opponent, it ends up happening somewhat often that the first frame that connects is a phantom hit and the rest gets nullified. Although phantom rests in my opinion are still a mistake on the part of the player, the hitbox stays up for just one frame (so the previously stated doesn't apply), if you hit a phantom rest that would mean that your were almost completely out of your mark, essentially just means that everyones hurtbox is a little smaller by a tiny amount than usual and you should strive to hit that, and the game is simply notifying you that you almost got it, but still almost 100% out of where you needed to be.
I'm on the side of removing phantom hits from melee, just like removing tripping from brawl. Both are incredibly annoying (or devastating) when they happen to you. Also worth noting glancing blows in brawl and beyond don't do damage so its unlikely you'd notice them unless you were looking for it.
I just realised that the spark effect in Ultimate is not the game telling you "oh, you were SO close !" but "yeah the hitboxes connected, but not enough to my taste, so no hit.". Now, I hate it. It's not our fault if the hitboxes in smash games were always questionnable.
it's in ultimate and I think Nintendo did the right thing by getting rid of the damage and just have both players attack again as its fair its the first person to hit a button first to hit the other a lot like sudden death which as been in the game since the beginning.. so stop complaining also tripping in brawl was fine it just happened to much to often. They should of reduced it and kept it as a slight advantage if one person is moving about to much to keep the action on the fighting not running away like some people... hungry box (running away from a banjo) 🤣😅
@@mecurseyoumimikyu4701 First of all, please learn to use proper punctuation so that your comments are readable. Second, it's clear you don't know what you're talking about, since this is about phantom hits but you're arguing about clanking for some reason. Finally, tripping for no reason other than bad RNG is ridiculous and shouldn't be in any game ever.
AsumSaus is the channel he makes video essays about melee and the mechanics of melee finding explanations for bugs and things like that. 10 out of 10 editing he is hands down one of the best editors on this entire platform.
I acctually have an idea for why V cancelling is in the game. The devs thought that if you are just about to just about to jump to give just the SLIGHTEST benefit for doing it on such strict timing and gave 5% less knockback
Imagine a tournament where the only way to win is to have the least amount of damage. If someone caps at 999%, they automatically lose. No wobbling, though.
I read somewhere online that using Master Hand in a competitive tournament is legal, and since he can't die, the only way to beat him is to not lose any stocks, and do more damage to him than he does to you. Sounds like a pain in the ass to do, until you remember how PAINFULLY slow he is. I played an offline match against a CPU Master Hand using the glitch, using the tournament rules, and beat him EASILY. Pretty interesting stuff.
11:08 Phantom hits aren't even in the game to mock you for being SO close but not quite, since without the phantom hit mechanic, any hit that would qualify as a phantom hit would qualify as a full hit. A phantom hit is a hit that is perfectly spaced to be as far away from your opponent as physically possible, but the game rewards you for your effort with a "fuck you, phantom hit" even though it was, for all intents and purposes, a full hit. So every time you get a phantom hit? Just know that the game is fucking you over by stealing away a hit that should have absolutely been a full hit.
HOLD ON. HOOOOOLD ON A MINUTE. REACTION. TO ASUMSAUS???!?!?!?! *WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO* literally best day of the week for me this is a glorious moment 0:57 oh you fuckin know it
I'm pretty sure Ultimate has Glancing Blows too actually. They play a unique animation where sparks fly off the opponent you hit and no knockback is taken
I feel like phantoms specifically fuck over puff more than any other character in the game, pretty much no other character can have a guaranteed kill move result in a death, outside of maybe Roy and Marths counter.
@Hungrybox v-cancelling does apply to puff they literally showed it in the video where puff survives. so yes it does apply. any character in melee can do v cancels.
I didn't even know phantom hits existed even in ultimate. Now i know what those stupid little sparks are when i land a hit barely in the opponent but it counts as a miss. And i do way too much of those and i get punished almost every time for this. Great
Yeah... Of course, an a half a year old video, on a comment that didn't even get a single like, and with a weird name. What an amazing feat of you "hungrybox" for even finding this comment, assuming a bot didn't find it for you
Fun fact you can do all of this in smash ultimate you know when your hits collide that's a phantom hit.. you can z cancel up to 3 times in ultimate or that's my record... I'm surprised everyone's just learning all this I knew pixels wasn't a thing since like 2004 in smash as it always changes and you can do stuff on your own TV to change pixels its all about spacing and "z canceling" you do as you get hit it reduces your knock back iv survived death on 350% before as you can z cancel as you hit the floor or a wall you just get up or drop back to normal stance...
If a phantom happens because you barely hit them, then I think that's completely fine. Keep them. If you don't want phantoms, then just hit people better. If phantoms just randomly happened, then they would be objectively bad.
Why do people mind phantoms? Technically you missed your attack and still did damage. You’d rather just miss and not get damage? That makes no sense lol
There's a great video going into detail of smadh as a spectator sport with a brilliant look at one of my favourite sets. It's a bit old now, but I'd highly recommend! ruclips.net/video/8qxVDOc-oV8/видео.html
Funnily enough, phantom hits are worse in every game after Melee as Melee's phantom hits at least deal damage.
But it's still really fun to see
I feel like they happen more in melee though? Wish I could test it somehow.
They're only more noticeable in Melee, since you get the sound effect and damage, but no knockback. Starting in Brawl, a phantom has a much less flashy spark, and a very muted unique sound, so you're less likely to see when you get one.
Technically you're right, but phantom hits are actually a bit off from an actual hit, meaning they actual make more sense in the newer games.
@@adamspeiser6449 This is just false, it's the same mechanic except an overlap of .1 units instead of .01
V-Canceling is probably the airdodge version of “you were so close”
Yeah agreed, it was probably added for casual flavor. If you’re in the kind of situation that allows for it to happen and you’re a casual player who hasn’t been practicing a game from 2001 for however many decades you’ll probably try to dodge out of it, and this way getting it just a little too late still gives you *something*
Its kinda funny when mario is hitting peach and peach is just like “Sweet!”
Ayo Peach? 😳🤨
TwT
She's invincible and she thinks it's sweat
"There are no mistakes."
-Master Oogway
"Pizza Time"
- Master Oogway
Hole goal
There are no accidents
-master oogway
I always interpreted phantom hits as brushing a punch against someone’s cheek, like the impact of the punch didn’t occur but you did scratch their cheek with it
But at the same time, should this be in a fast pace fighting game about spacing? No!
i think it makes for hype moments so im a fan of it.
@@Hugo_Prolovski I think it's more hype when an attack is barely dodged. It carries the same weight as a phantom hit for me, but I respect your opinion.
true
ㅤ
Yeah you shouldn't be punished for perfectly spacing your attack
I think that the worst thing about phantom hits it not the minute distance not being equal to zero, I mean it is so close it almost doesn't matter, but that, at least according to mew2king, if the first frame of your attack animation that connects with the oponent is a phantom hit, then the rest of the frames would not count as a normal hit, even if they are completely inside the oponent. So Marth's sword can technically cut you from side to side and still be a phantom hit.
And since generally attacks move frame by frame towards the opponent, it ends up happening somewhat often that the first frame that connects is a phantom hit and the rest gets nullified.
Although phantom rests in my opinion are still a mistake on the part of the player, the hitbox stays up for just one frame (so the previously stated doesn't apply), if you hit a phantom rest that would mean that your were almost completely out of your mark, essentially just means that everyones hurtbox is a little smaller by a tiny amount than usual and you should strive to hit that, and the game is simply notifying you that you almost got it, but still almost 100% out of where you needed to be.
Honestly phantom rest is the worst thing you could possibly get next to a pk flash or knee.
yessir asumsaus, by far one of the best smash content creators out there!
Hey I’m in this
swag
gaws
Players: This game is unfinished
Sakurai, hyperventilating copium: It's a hidden mechanic
I'm on the side of removing phantom hits from melee, just like removing tripping from brawl. Both are incredibly annoying (or devastating) when they happen to you. Also worth noting glancing blows in brawl and beyond don't do damage so its unlikely you'd notice them unless you were looking for it.
I just realised that the spark effect in Ultimate is not the game telling you "oh, you were SO close !" but "yeah the hitboxes connected, but not enough to my taste, so no hit.".
Now, I hate it. It's not our fault if the hitboxes in smash games were always questionnable.
it's in ultimate and I think Nintendo did the right thing by getting rid of the damage and just have both players attack again as its fair its the first person to hit a button first to hit the other a lot like sudden death which as been in the game since the beginning.. so stop complaining also tripping in brawl was fine it just happened to much to often. They should of reduced it and kept it as a slight advantage if one person is moving about to much to keep the action on the fighting not running away like some people... hungry box (running away from a banjo) 🤣😅
@@mecurseyoumimikyu4701 First of all, please learn to use proper punctuation so that your comments are readable. Second, it's clear you don't know what you're talking about, since this is about phantom hits but you're arguing about clanking for some reason. Finally, tripping for no reason other than bad RNG is ridiculous and shouldn't be in any game ever.
But here's the thing it's a skill issue my guy not complete RNG like tripping is in Brawl
Except phantom hits don't just randomly happen unlike tripping.
I wouldnt mind watching hungrybox reacting to all of asumsaus' vids lol his reactions are great
5:49 aMSa: “hehe I’m gonna use that to beat mang0 at Big House someday”
I was waiting for an AsumSaus reaction lol, great vid
AsumSaus is an amazing content creator. I'd love to see more of your reactions and opinions on his stuff
I wish there was someone who would make this quality of content and editing for ultimate tech videos😭
he use a lot of basicly hacks into the god to show the data
and then do insane tier edit
so it would be even harder to do on ultimate
AsumSaus is the channel he makes video essays about melee and the mechanics of melee finding explanations for bugs and things like that. 10 out of 10 editing he is hands down one of the best editors on this entire platform.
Asum's videos are such high quality it's insane
Changing phantoms to 5 MDUs seems good. Let’s do that.
Melee looks like its made of titanium. But if we look deep in-depth, it’s being held together by fucking scotch tape
I acctually have an idea for why V cancelling is in the game.
The devs thought that if you are just about to just about to jump to give just the SLIGHTEST benefit for doing it on such strict timing and gave 5% less knockback
AsumSaus is the GOAT and I’m happy to see you giving him the respect.
Glancing Blows are a sick mechanic, and the mockery is precisely why I love it
Yooooo Asum Sauce’s videos are definitely reaction worthy, definitely think abt reacting all of them
Perfectly balanced as all things should be
10:54 that's big coming from the guy that got saved at Evo because of them
Imagine a tournament where the only way to win is to have the least amount of damage. If someone caps at 999%, they automatically lose.
No wobbling, though.
I read somewhere online that using Master Hand in a competitive tournament is legal, and since he can't die, the only way to beat him is to not lose any stocks, and do more damage to him than he does to you. Sounds like a pain in the ass to do, until you remember how PAINFULLY slow he is. I played an offline match against a CPU Master Hand using the glitch, using the tournament rules, and beat him EASILY. Pretty interesting stuff.
AsumSaus is the goat of meelee... no... AsumSaus is the goat of Smash content
I like how the part that blew hbox's mind the hardest was just, basic 3d game design and how pixels mean very little in that context lmao
Asumsaus is sick
11:08
Phantom hits aren't even in the game to mock you for being SO close but not quite, since without the phantom hit mechanic, any hit that would qualify as a phantom hit would qualify as a full hit. A phantom hit is a hit that is perfectly spaced to be as far away from your opponent as physically possible, but the game rewards you for your effort with a "fuck you, phantom hit" even though it was, for all intents and purposes, a full hit. So every time you get a phantom hit? Just know that the game is fucking you over by stealing away a hit that should have absolutely been a full hit.
I love how fox spot-dodging makes him dab. 4:51
Id love to see you react to more stuff from Asum his videos are incredible
HOLD ON. HOOOOOLD ON A MINUTE. REACTION. TO ASUMSAUS???!?!?!?! *WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO* literally best day of the week for me this is a glorious moment
0:57 oh you fuckin know it
Would really love to see hbox watch more asumsaus videos, his videos are so insanely high quality
I'm pretty sure Ultimate has Glancing Blows too actually.
They play a unique animation where sparks fly off the opponent you hit and no knockback is taken
Phantoms are cool, it helps you learn the limit of your hitboxes by giving some form of feedback.
I get excited every time you post cause every video is 🔥🔥
I know hungry doesn't make games,but that unit thing is basically how any game works, like there's no other way.
6:19 LOL
Nice video, would love to see more more reaction videos from asum saus his vids are so great!
I feel like phantoms specifically fuck over puff more than any other character in the game, pretty much no other character can have a guaranteed kill move result in a death, outside of maybe Roy and Marths counter.
Hidden Tech that Sakurai puts in these games is one of the reasons I love them tho haha.
MDU or IGU (in game units) are a staple in coding, as the only thing that defines distance is distance itself; they are axiomatic units
@hungrybox I assume this is a Bot
@Hungrybox v-cancelling does apply to puff they literally showed it in the video where puff survives. so yes it does apply. any character in melee can do v cancels.
It’s crazy that that phantom rest basically happened against Zain and hbox again, also at smash con
That vid was more scientific then anything on tv in the last few years.
I didn't even know phantom hits existed even in ultimate. Now i know what those stupid little sparks are when i land a hit barely in the opponent but it counts as a miss. And i do way too much of those and i get punished almost every time for this. Great
Yeah... Of course, an a half a year old video, on a comment that didn't even get a single like, and with a weird name. What an amazing feat of you "hungrybox" for even finding this comment, assuming a bot didn't find it for you
Game: You're not 1 pixel away. You're 1/100 pixel away from Landing the hit, but here some damage but no knock back.
Oh boy
Melee has to be the least finished Smash game ever made
Finally Hbox watched a Asumsaus videos
asumsaus is best smash related youtuber :D
Video games sure are complicated
ty for introducing me to comp smash
good ol wombo combo never hurt nobody riiiiiight?
"fun fact I learned to l cancel groom playing 64"
De Ja Vu have I seen this video before???
can't wait for the asumbox reacts to continue
Melee nerfed kirby into ablivian and I hate them for it with a burning passion
You should really react to more of AsumSaus' videos, you have really great reactions to them
holy shit was that plok music in the intro
Id love to see hbox react to more asumsaus videos really cool video
v canceling will be meta relevant some day
ASUM SAUS VIDDDD
Hbox be salty after that loss
6:19 That’s what she said
Does anyone know the songs playing at the beginning and end of the video?
I got an ad that was Team Liquid x Honda
What a very balanced game with no issues
hold on.... IS THAT THE FUCKING PLOK BOXING GLOVE MUSIC AT THE START OF THE VIDEO????
Please react to more asumsaus video melee is the only smash game I haven’t played but I love his videos
2 seconds...
Yes the Editing is amazing...
L-Cancel...
Falco...
Yeah...
What a hard video...
...
Fun fact you can do all of this in smash ultimate you know when your hits collide that's a phantom hit.. you can z cancel up to 3 times in ultimate or that's my record... I'm surprised everyone's just learning all this I knew pixels wasn't a thing since like 2004 in smash as it always changes and you can do stuff on your own TV to change pixels its all about spacing and "z canceling" you do as you get hit it reduces your knock back iv survived death on 350% before as you can z cancel as you hit the floor or a wall you just get up or drop back to normal stance...
If a phantom happens because you barely hit them, then I think that's completely fine. Keep them. If you don't want phantoms, then just hit people better. If phantoms just randomly happened, then they would be objectively bad.
intentional! Why!?
"It removes phantom hits entirely. And shit I'm down for that"
Why do people mind phantoms? Technically you missed your attack and still did damage. You’d rather just miss and not get damage? That makes no sense lol
Siuuuuuuuu for French and Belgian community
Brawl had phantom hits but they dealt no damage.
7:52
Heyo what's the outro song name here pls? :D
Persona 4 Dancing All Night - Specialist
I just notice that the house at the start says drug store XD
?
@@Hugo_Prolovski at the start of the video the earthbound stage
I love how those videos are better than the actual game
Debatable.
I do this since 2004...
Bro this game is sooooo buggued
Outro song?
Specialist from persona
What I know about melee as non melee player: fox shine spam, dash dancing, spam everything you have
spam isnt really that good in melee and i think Ultimate for example is much more spamy
Congrats you just proved to us that you know nothing about melee!
There's a great video going into detail of smadh as a spectator sport with a brilliant look at one of my favourite sets. It's a bit old now, but I'd highly recommend! ruclips.net/video/8qxVDOc-oV8/видео.html
What if that infamous 0.9 melee match was just a v-cancel?
Does anyone else hear the echo?
@hungrybox1.. PagMan REAL
also it doesnt even show the name anymore because of the new @ system lol
Soy fan de este wey UwU
We don't make mistakes
We have happy accidentally
This really shouldn't be uploaded to RUclips. You don't want to be a reaction tuber, do you?
🦀
the thumbnails piss me off lately
How bout watching his video on stupid advantages.
Remove phantoms
😮
Saying "on accident" is so cringe
Lmao
Am I the only one that jump on the notifications