Although the Emergent Woodwurm has a lot of text. Given how big you can get creatures in this deck. It could attack and easily look at the top 30 or so cards & put the best permanent among them straight to the battlefield.
In a game I played the other day, using the Emergent Woodwurm, I got to just pick up my deck and put the best permanent straight on the battlefield (Mayael's Aria)
I think that taurean mauler would be a great add u get a counter every time someone casts a spell I know it’s not super fast but over time especially paired with the other cards that give additional plus one counters when u add a plus one counter it could add up fast and deal a ton of damage fast
@@yaboizborg Taurean Mauler is not a rare sight during Command Zone episodes either (especially around JLK), so I don't think they'd disagree! But since we're in green as well, Managorger Hydra is practically strictly better, right? Sure, The Hydra is a little smaller from the get-go, but it also counts your spells, it has trample, and I think you're always going to want the +1/+1 counter, so the "may" clause is not very relevant here. If you're in a tribal deck that's not about hydras, I can see why you'd prefer the changeling, however ;) That does not mean Mauler is not a good suggestion; I'd say to pick up both! They're just so efficient!
It seems a bit counterintuitive to complain about the lack of card draw in the deck, then only net add one card draw effect in the budget upgrade. I was like, well they've got to spend at least 6 of the 10 slots on card draw right? Nope. Add 3, drop 2. Seems legit 😂😂
I prefer it as they are upgrades anyone can use, regardless of budget. And if you put expensive upgrades at the end for those who want it, then that solves that issue of people wanting more expensive upgrades.
I don't think 10-dollar upgrades are necessarily wrong. If you're thinking of Tinker Time, there's a lot that a lot of people have to say about that deck. I've heard it's one of the stronger ones competitively, but I don't think it plays interestingly, and the doesn't really do a good job of supporting either of its main commanders. There are several structural problems with it, but I've ranted about it a lot already XD As for the upgrades, they proposed Brudiclad as a hidden commander and mostly added things that could fetch him. While I agree Brudiclad would make a stellar addition to a Gimbal deck (or Rashmi and Ragavan if the deck has tokens), I'm not a fan of (a lot of) tutors. I think a few people felt the added cards didn't really do anything for the rest of the 99; only that it included Brudiclad. Of course less expensive upgrades are always preferable!
While I do appreciate that Shalai and Hallar are a simpler strategy, I was hoping to see you dive into the nuances of backup with Bright-Palm. While the deck is still aggro, you get to get a little crazy with trigger doublers, Panharmonicon effects, and my favourite secret deck tech, Harmonic Prodigy. Backup triggers stack, don't be afraid to go a little crazy with it!
Seriously, I've played a few games with this deck already, and while S&H can deal some pretty decent damage fairly consistently, I've had much more fun with bright palm. I had one game end with a 65/66 krenko tin street kingpin with a turn of trample, unblockable by creatures with power 2 or less, and around 130 goblin tokens fairly early. And if you manage to get both commanders on the field at the same time, the damage output can get ridiculous very fast. Shalai and Hallar are good for constant damage, but an unchecked bright palm very quickly snowballs into something unmanageable
Quite compelling, burn you for 20 and swing for game? Jokes aside I fear backup might never show up again or once in a blue moon, while more flexible I fear Brightpalm might have a Ranar moment.
I loved to see Ladee Danger again, but I'm kinda dissapointed you went with Shalai and Halar as a commander. Not that they arent good (because obviously they are), but that turned the upgrades into generic +1/+1 counter stuff, instead of highlighting cool synergies for the backup mechanic. And I cant speak for everybody, but I bought the deck because I loved the backup idea, not because I wanted to play the 100th +1/+1 counter deck.
I personally left Enduring Scalelord in. 1, with effects that place a +1/+1 on each creature it sets Shalai And Hallar off big time. 2, it is part of an infinite combo that is built in to the box (Mirror Style Master + Shalai and Hallar. Have all three out and MSM and ES available to attack. Attack with them, MSM triggers making a copy of itself and ES, backup puts a counter on a creature causing the og ES and the copy ES to feed off each other infinitely putting counters on themselves while Ahalai and Hallar kill your opponents).
I could be wrong but I think this is the first ever precon to have a complete infinite combo in it, also works with flameshadow conjuring or flamerush rider. Closest I can think of to another precon doing this is the wilhelt precon being one card away from it
If you're going for a budget infinite upgrade, add wildwood scourge. Together with enduring scalelord you get infinite counters which means infinite damage for shalai and hallar.
OG Shalai, Voice of Plenty would have been a great honorable mention; $7 but gives hexproof to yourself and all your other creatures, and ALSO has an activated ability to put counters on your entire field.
This one brought me joy! Love the addition of Grumgully, it surprised me you didn't also mention Renata, Called to the Hunt. And I would consider Animation Module when running those. To inexpensively create a 2/2 or 3/3 artifact creature goes a long way into stabilizing (or overwhelming) the board.
@@LadeeDanger IF you're struggling to find what else to cut, Ion Storm is clunkier than it reads, and Restoration Angel can't save your commander (Shalai and Hallar) from targeted removal, as it specifies a non-Angel target. A fine card that could double ETBs and Backups, but considering your direction, I think it could step down for better synergies. I love Kami of Whispered Hopes in MOM, could be a fine inclusion.
Unlike some of the other folks, I appreciate the super-budget option-realistically, I'm going to play most precons a couple times and then cannibalize them for other decks, which means I don't really want to sink a bunch of money into cards I may not use-but if it's not too much work it'd be great if it were an option. As in, "For each slot, here's the card we're suggesting to swap in on a $10 budget, and here's the card we'd suggest instead if you're on a $30 or $50 budget-though possibly it's the same card in some instances."
There's a ton of cards from the main set that are cheap and synergize well. I'm using Fertilid's Favor and Kami of Whispered Hopes for ramp, Dusk Legion Duelist for card draw, and Ancient Imperiosaur as a finisher.
A lot of comparisons with Tadeas to Toski and frostfang. Wanted to highlight they are draw whenever A creature deals damage where as he is ONE OR MORE deal damage you draw
Lovely video and great suggestions. I think I'll be using Kami of Whispered Hopes rather than Grumgully, but these were all super great adds - budget or no budget. More Lady & Rachel videos, please! ❤
I played this deck straight out the box and I think ppl are cutting the Emergent woodwurm prematurely. By turn 3 I had hydra and end of turn it had 6 +1/+1 because of , conclave mentor and Mikaeus put a +1/+1 counters on hydra. By turn 5 I could have cast the wurm targeting hydra and ripped 50 card off the top of my deck and cast any of them. The table conceded when I went to cast it. So ppl are sleeping on it I think especially in green with ramp.
Yup. And the wurm trigger is "any permanent". Best thing I did with it was swinging at 2 players with the face commander and two other creatures, and the wurm backup trigger allowed me to put Uncivil Unrest and kill the two players I attacked on the spot. The wurm is great, and just need a little more ramp in the deck.
Yeah it does need more ramp. But one card I don't see alot of even in +1/+1 decks is Fight Rigging from new capenna. It's got hideaway 5 and put a plus a +1/+1 counter on target creature every beginning of combat, and when you have a total of 8 power on your battlefield cast the exile spell. It's a sleeper spell. The wurm deserves one more chance. Love the content ohana!
Stonecoil serpent would be a good add as well! Easy mana bomb and if you're doubling counters this way, there's already a good amount put on there to begin with!
I really don't get the upgrade guides this time. It was more with Tinker Time that I have issues with though. This series is framed as a way of upgrading the precons to the point they can be played against "real decks", but then with that deck, what happened wasn't really an upgrade. It was a pivot into a secret commander deck. While an interesting idea, it didn't feel as though it actually made the deck any stronger or ready to play against other decks. It took what the deck was actually trying to do and said, "That's nice, but I'd rather do this." I walked away from that video thinking, "that was interesting, but it didn't actually help." With Call for Backup, it didn't have as many issues. Choosing Shalai and Hallar isn't bad or anything, but the reason given for the choice was incredibly strange. Saying that the backup mechanic was too much stuff to remember when the deck has a number of cards with backup doesn't really make sense. Backup aside, what Bright-Palm actually does is lets you double the number of counters on one of your creatures whenever you attack with it and make it so it can't be chump blocked. That's actually a really strong effect. But more importantly, Bright-Palm isn't a removal magnet the way Shalai and Hallar are. Also Invigorating Hot Spring doesn't work the way you think it does. You read that you can only "Activate only as a sorcery and once per turn" and then said that you could use it on your opponents' turns. In ends up not being a great card in my opinion. Ideally, you want to ramp on turn 1 or 2. If you don't have a creature on turn 3 and you play it instead of your commander, it'll sit a full turn without having a counter removed. At the earliest, it would take five of your turns to remove all the counters from it. At that point, it's only slightly better than Fires of Yavimaya. I'm also very confused with Master Chef not being one of the additions to the deck. It's a better Grumgully. It actually puts counters on your humans and it's an enchantment, so it's harder to remove. I do think Rachel's made a good addition to the Command Zone and like the energy she brings to the podcast, but I can't say I'm a fan of the upgrade guides with this set, even setting the really low budget aside.
I feel the same. And people are really, really underestimating Bright-Palm's ability. When a card says "Double", it tends to do som really silly things. And Backup isn't that hard to figure out. Shalai and Hallar are great, sure, but they will very quickly become a lightning rod for removal because of their ability. And because they are an infinite combo piece in the command zone with several other cards, a lot of people will target them even if you don't run said combo just to not take the risk. Invigorating Hot Springs is great if you keep Bright-palm as the commander, because most of the backup triggers want you to attack. It's a 100% worth adding imo. Master chef is a cool addition but I think that both Bright-Palm and S&H want a good density creatures to put counters on, especially on 2/3 manas so you can backup them and use the ability right away.
@@IronTigrex Haste is definitely way better if you're running Bright-Palms. For the budget guide, I'd definitely want Grumgully and Master Chef both, even if I think the latter is the better card. But yeah, Shalai and Hallar being part of several known infinite combos is going to make it hard for them not to eat removal every turn cycle.
They are still great but I really like how they can be the sneaky option for killing someone out of nowhere with Bright-palm. I had a couple of games this weekend and several times all I had to do is cast them with Bright-palm on the board and just swing, with Bright-palm killing one player just by becoming huge thanks to the doubling ability and evasion, and the duo fireballing another player for like 16 damage. Backup is really sweet as an ability.
I misread Backup making it a LOT better in my mind than it actually is; did not read the “until end of turn” clause 😬 oh well… That being said, I still wish y’all would’ve done B-P over S&H. It’s just too straight forward a card.
How about the cards in MOM? Uncommons: Kami of Whispered Hopes = Hardened Scales on a stick, Botanical Brawler = Scalelord for 2 mana, Invasion of Moag // Bloomwielder Dryads Rares: Invasion of Gobakhan // Lightshield Array Protects the team and distributes counters on attackers; Ozolith, the Shattered Spire = Another hardened scale; Boon-Bringer Valkyrie for Life (link); Doomskar Warrior to dig for cards. Maybe not budget any more but worth it: Vivien, Arkbow Ranger
If you like what Snake Umbra does you should check out Keen sense! Same effect without totem armor but for just a single green mana! Great upgrade, love to see the Naya love.
Damn I got bright palm and the gremlin commander in packs, I wish they'd use the face commander every once in a while. For a +1/+1 counter deck, I already have a good idea of what kind of cards to put in, but with something new like backup, there are probably plenty of cards from before this set that aren't straight up "put +1/+1 counters on a thing" cards that I wouldn't even think of to use. Those would have been nice to hear more about.
May I suggest some of the banger new hardened scales effects from MOM? Ozolith the Shattered Spire is so so good and gives you a consistent supply of counters when you need it. It is also so broken with the Kami of Lost Hope, stack the counters on that and have a ton of counters. Last but not least, invasion of Moag. You don't even need to flip it. Just read it as 4 mana give all your creatures a +1/+1 counter.
Hey guys! Loved the video and loved the chemistry between the two hosts. Awesome suggested adds for beginners to this deck for sure. I also would go with Conclave Mentor from M21. cheap card, good synergy and adds a bit of life gain to the deck. Leinore, Autumn Sovereign from midnight hunt commander, as well as beast whisperer and keeper of fables from throne to help with draw. Add together forever, Citadel Siege, and Primeval Bounty enchantments just to be a bully :) lol
Is keeping track of all the effects that put +1/+1 counters on your stuff really that much more simple than swinging with Bright-Palm once per turn? Maybe twice if you blink it or add extra combat steps? Some solid points all around and gives me a good idea where to take the deck with Bright-Palm, but not quite what I wanted to see. Oh well, there is more than enough other relevant content on the internet by now.
Putting together a Shalia and Hallar build with lifelink synergies for +1/+1 counters. There are a bunch of cards that give counters for each life gained and giving lifelink to Shalai and Hallar with those cards form some awesome synergies while still not being super high power since there are more than two cards in the combos.
I was hoping to merge my Chissiro deck with this one and make a small hidden Ninja village deck... but Bright-Palm cares more about the "haste" of its ability rather than the modified creatures. Excellent video as always, and a cool upgrade. Rachel and Ladee, you are the real Team Up Commander!!
While I do agree that shalai and halar is the stronger commander, I think I still would’ve liked to have seen the face commander upgrade. Counter decks have been done already, and backup gives it a kind of unique feel
I’ve been playing this deck for the past couple days and have won by turn 7. Absolutely busted out the box. Very consistent and versatile. You only need 5-10 cards to upgrade like retreat of kazundi, fight rigging and felidar retreat. Have absolutely loved it
Personally love the inclusion of invigorating hot springs, however it does say you can only activate it at sorcery speed, so unfortunately wouldn’t be able to activate it every turn. Hydras growth is always fun! Not sure if it’s in the deck, but super cheap!
Pretty sure this is the first ever precon that has an infinite combo in it, and funnily enough both cards were cut. If flameshadow conjuring is used on enduring scalelord and one of them gets a counter, they'll bounce between each other infinitely since when one of them gets a counter, the other will. Also wins the game with shalai though there's obviously easier ways to go infinite with it
After the Pinkerton nonsense, I'm not supporting WotC directly again. I thought they almost destroyed themselves with the DnD rules nonsense last time...
Enduring scalelord is actually part of an jnfinite. Copy it and then give it a counter, then the copy gets a counter than the original gets a counter and shalai just oings everyone to death
Great guide, but not entirely for me, since I'm more interested in building around the backup mechanic here instead of making the +1 counter yarok deck i had in mind. Still some great adds I'd overlooked. Loving the budget guide cause budget cards are great its a nice place to start on a deck im interested in keeping around.
You mean The Great Henge isn’t on budget? 😂 even cards like Beast Whisperer get dicey at almost three bucks for a ten dollar upgrade. Great content. You two rock! Enjoy the Ren Faire.
Rachel is a such smooth seller during the pre-show pitches... Ladee provides the ULTIMATE backup (har har) I didn't even fast forward! love the gurls thank u CZ
Backup with haste is pretty insane, because you can give the backup creature its own counter, and then it gets its ability again, which is super relevant with cards like Emergent Woodworm. Play him, give him three counters, he attacks and you do the trigger twice, X is 7.
I don’t know how well chishiro the shattered blade would fit in the deck. His first ability is meh to irrelevant but the second where all modified creatures get a +1/+1 counter means you can ping more things in your end step.
Chishiro is an awesome add imo & he puts in work. He just keeps adding +1+1 counters to your already modified creatures without having to do anything. Triggering S&H while growing your creatures at the same time.
Shalai and Hallar is a dream come true for me as a commander. It's the perfect deck for a ton of cards that I've just naturally collected over the past few years that I've wanted to play but never had the right deck for. I have foil Laezel, the beautiful alternate art for Halana and Alena, and All Will Be One was the highlight of my prerelease
For less than $1.00, you could throw in Sunscorch Regent. He’s a big boy dragon that gets bigger when your opponents play spells. Plus he gives you life! A bit harder to play with the double white pip, but I think would be a fun include.
I personally enjoy Drumhunter, Exuberant Firestoker, and Sunseed Nurturer from Shards of Alara. Mana ramp and extra bonus if you got a 5 power creature, which is easy. Drumhunter especially since it's a free draw each turn
Dear The Command Zone group, I know you’re sponsored by WotC themselves so you’re on their paychecks. But under the light of recent events of them sending The Pinkertons to harass a RUclipsr , something that is really splitting Corporation with fanbase , and so I and we hope that you would send a message condoning this choice of action and support the community, fanbase and RUclipsrs. Alas, I know you’ll never talk about that BECAUSE you’re on their paychecks so you prefer standing with evil corporation rather than with the community.
I genuinely surprised marath will of the wild wasn't in the add or honorable mention, she comes in with 3, 1/1 counters and you can move them around, create creatures, or deal pew pew damage, especially since there's so much 1/1 payoffs it's easy to put more on her and spread them back out
42:12 WOULD THAT KINDA BE AN SEMI-INFINITE COMBO ??? like you have ways to put counters on OTHER creatures, then you have ways to put EXTRA counters on them and that trigger other creaturs getting extra counters and then you have your commander than will do dmg So you have many creatures, you got the SCALELORD... you put counters on other, then you trigger more counters, then you put counters on Scalelord, then that triggers more counters, thus trigering the Commander ability... then you use an instant later, that does the counter thingy, and that repeats ... getting more and more counters and more dmg ... then FALKENRATH ... you pay, do damage to player, get counters on him, trigger putting MORE counters on OTHER creatures... TRIGGER AGAIN SCALELORD ... trigger commander ability... trigger FALKENRATH AGAIN.... REPEAT with a proper preparation. the cards at play. and enough mana.... those 2 cards that you taking OUT... could WIN THE GAME in 1 or 2 rotations.
I feel that these upgrade videos nowadays make not a lot of sense if they do not talk about the new cards. Especially if the decks have a new mechanic which is featured in the main set.
It’s funny how WOTC doesn’t acknowledge the secondary market, but “arbitrarily” sets values to stuff that’s basically spot on for the “non-existent” secondary market. They also removed the MSRP. We gotta remember all the horrible stuff they’ve done to the game and stop letting them slide along because they can afford sponsors like these people and their animators.
FLAMESHADOW .... 44:43 you could copy your commander RIGHT ??? then TRIGGER YOUR COMMANDER ABILITY... SEVERAL TIMES !!! right ??? isnt that the idea here?
Wow, you literally removed two of the best cards in the deck? It's an accidental infinite kill combo, right in the precon! Activate flameshadow on scalelord, put a counter on ANYTHING, and it goes infinite... and with shalai out, everyone's dead... and best of all, it's a controlled infinite!
this deck is crazy fun to upgrade it with the tight budget. you could for example, add in the boom bringer Valkyrie. that thing will do lots of work for you. I know from my own experiences.
Hi Guys! My friends have looked into the rules and apparently Dhalai and Hallar's damage from +1+1's is not commander damage. I thought via this video that it was? Could someone clarify it for me please? I was pretty bummed when I found out :(
I put Drizzt, Bruenor, Catti-Brie and Wulfgar in this deck and had to throw in a dozen equipments. Plus a bear and a squirrel and human ranger partners and some dragons/angels..... its an R.A. Salvatore inspired deck
Why did y’all decide to have $10 budget for this deck. All the others are $50 budget. I assume it’s because it’d be too overpowered. Still wanna know tho lol😅
You can tell she has never!!!!! played Street Fighter you pronounced his name wrong it's Dhalsim ( Daal · seem) , Dhālasima धालसिम Marathi language . just saying
Every player has there own play style and that's fine, but I feel like this upgrade did a disservice to the deck by making it very generic instead of playing heavily with the new back up ability. Also switching to the secondary commander will generate a level of hate the deck can't handle even with all the upgrades. Still some good adds but not to sure about the cuts.
I love this format. I small suggestion, give us a list of the 10 cards to add, or provide us a link to card kingdom, with all the cards loaded up for us to buy. Either way, thank you for these videos, I feel like they are helping me get into the format.
Tades draws a maximum of one card per attack phase - the other more expensive cards you compared it with draw a card for EACH creature that deals damage... not saying it isn't a good card, just not in the same category as those others at all, drawing one card per turn (most of the time) for 4 mana on a creature is a common enough effect.
I threw Marath, Will of the wild in mine to go infinite with shalai and Hallar 😅. Remove 2 counters from Marath, add 2 counters to Marath, Shay shay and hallelujah ping for 2 on repeat.
Still watching, but I'm surprised no one's pointed out Bright Palm is a girl. On the front and back of the box Bright Palm has female pronouns, so it feels a little weird ^^;
I could still run this deck and these upgrades using Bright Palm as the commander, yeah? I just recently got this deck and wanna keep the lil shaman as the commander but still use these upgrades
Why are Mowu and Evolution Sage not in this deck normally? Proliferating and getting extra counters seem like they would generate a lot of extra value doing things the deck is going to do anyway.
It would be nice to have the list to add,remove and honorable mentions pinned to top of comments. For copy and paste purposes. Or a link to arkidek with said added cards.
The more I look at this deck, the more I wish the commander was just WG instead of WGR. The red cards are really easy to remove and not all that great.
What do you think of the “Call for Backup” precon? Any cards we missed? Any cards we suggested to take out or add that you disagree with?
Although the Emergent Woodwurm has a lot of text. Given how big you can get creatures in this deck. It could attack and easily look at the top 30 or so cards & put the best permanent among them straight to the battlefield.
In a game I played the other day, using the Emergent Woodwurm, I got to just pick up my deck and put the best permanent straight on the battlefield (Mayael's Aria)
I think that taurean mauler would be a great add u get a counter every time someone casts a spell I know it’s not super fast but over time especially paired with the other cards that give additional plus one counters when u add a plus one counter it could add up fast and deal a ton of damage fast
@@yaboizborg Taurean Mauler is not a rare sight during Command Zone episodes either (especially around JLK), so I don't think they'd disagree!
But since we're in green as well, Managorger Hydra is practically strictly better, right? Sure, The Hydra is a little smaller from the get-go, but it also counts your spells, it has trample, and I think you're always going to want the +1/+1 counter, so the "may" clause is not very relevant here. If you're in a tribal deck that's not about hydras, I can see why you'd prefer the changeling, however ;)
That does not mean Mauler is not a good suggestion; I'd say to pick up both! They're just so efficient!
It seems a bit counterintuitive to complain about the lack of card draw in the deck, then only net add one card draw effect in the budget upgrade.
I was like, well they've got to spend at least 6 of the 10 slots on card draw right? Nope. Add 3, drop 2. Seems legit 😂😂
Shalai and Halar comes off as a kill on site kind of commander.
All Will Be One card away from winning with them.
It's definitely a spicy option!
@@lunarlight3131 ok
As a new player, I love the $10 upgrades. I know it's not popular among existing viewers, but it is really helpful for me.
So glad that it was helpful to you!
$10 may not seem like much but there’s a TON of cards in that price range that are bangers than can spice up a deck real well.
I think it's better. Less expensive stables that go into every deck.
I prefer it as they are upgrades anyone can use, regardless of budget. And if you put expensive upgrades at the end for those who want it, then that solves that issue of people wanting more expensive upgrades.
I don't think 10-dollar upgrades are necessarily wrong. If you're thinking of Tinker Time, there's a lot that a lot of people have to say about that deck. I've heard it's one of the stronger ones competitively, but I don't think it plays interestingly, and the doesn't really do a good job of supporting either of its main commanders. There are several structural problems with it, but I've ranted about it a lot already XD
As for the upgrades, they proposed Brudiclad as a hidden commander and mostly added things that could fetch him. While I agree Brudiclad would make a stellar addition to a Gimbal deck (or Rashmi and Ragavan if the deck has tokens), I'm not a fan of (a lot of) tutors. I think a few people felt the added cards didn't really do anything for the rest of the 99; only that it included Brudiclad.
Of course less expensive upgrades are always preferable!
Should be noted that invigorating hotsprings cannot be activated on your opponent's turns since you can only activate as a sorcery
Paused just to say this
Call the pinkertons!
BASED
Lmao
😂
This is a great comment with current context
Solid. Rock solid.
While I do appreciate that Shalai and Hallar are a simpler strategy, I was hoping to see you dive into the nuances of backup with Bright-Palm. While the deck is still aggro, you get to get a little crazy with trigger doublers, Panharmonicon effects, and my favourite secret deck tech, Harmonic Prodigy. Backup triggers stack, don't be afraid to go a little crazy with it!
I had no idea that Bright-Palm was a shaman and Harmonic Prodigy is almost always the best card in the deck it's in!
Seriously, I've played a few games with this deck already, and while S&H can deal some pretty decent damage fairly consistently, I've had much more fun with bright palm.
I had one game end with a 65/66 krenko tin street kingpin with a turn of trample, unblockable by creatures with power 2 or less, and around 130 goblin tokens fairly early.
And if you manage to get both commanders on the field at the same time, the damage output can get ridiculous very fast.
Shalai and Hallar are good for constant damage, but an unchecked bright palm very quickly snowballs into something unmanageable
Quite compelling, burn you for 20 and swing for game?
Jokes aside I fear backup might never show up again or once in a blue moon, while more flexible I fear Brightpalm might have a Ranar moment.
this check is one of my favorite project decks ever. pure joy watching all the creatures grow.
I loved to see Ladee Danger again, but I'm kinda dissapointed you went with Shalai and Halar as a commander.
Not that they arent good (because obviously they are), but that turned the upgrades into generic +1/+1 counter stuff, instead of highlighting cool synergies for the backup mechanic. And I cant speak for everybody, but I bought the deck because I loved the backup idea, not because I wanted to play the 100th +1/+1 counter deck.
You're not alone.
Didn't realize how much I've missed Ladee on the channel until now
That means a lot to me!
@@LadeeDanger you rock!
I agree! Both of these women are great!!!
I personally left Enduring Scalelord in. 1, with effects that place a +1/+1 on each creature it sets Shalai And Hallar off big time. 2, it is part of an infinite combo that is built in to the box (Mirror Style Master + Shalai and Hallar. Have all three out and MSM and ES available to attack. Attack with them, MSM triggers making a copy of itself and ES, backup puts a counter on a creature causing the og ES and the copy ES to feed off each other infinitely putting counters on themselves while Ahalai and Hallar kill your opponents).
I could be wrong but I think this is the first ever precon to have a complete infinite combo in it, also works with flameshadow conjuring or flamerush rider. Closest I can think of to another precon doing this is the wilhelt precon being one card away from it
@@DracoX-hz3tu the mind flayyers precon has a infinite mana combo built in. Hulbreaker horror + sol ring + eveflowing chalice = infinite mana
If you're going for a budget infinite upgrade, add wildwood scourge. Together with enduring scalelord you get infinite counters which means infinite damage for shalai and hallar.
OG Shalai, Voice of Plenty would have been a great honorable mention; $7 but gives hexproof to yourself and all your other creatures, and ALSO has an activated ability to put counters on your entire field.
This one brought me joy! Love the addition of Grumgully, it surprised me you didn't also mention Renata, Called to the Hunt. And I would consider Animation Module when running those. To inexpensively create a 2/2 or 3/3 artifact creature goes a long way into stabilizing (or overwhelming) the board.
Those are also great options! With only 10 cards I couldn't get everything in there but I love hearing all the ideas in the comments.
@@LadeeDanger IF you're struggling to find what else to cut, Ion Storm is clunkier than it reads, and Restoration Angel can't save your commander (Shalai and Hallar) from targeted removal, as it specifies a non-Angel target. A fine card that could double ETBs and Backups, but considering your direction, I think it could step down for better synergies. I love Kami of Whispered Hopes in MOM, could be a fine inclusion.
Unlike some of the other folks, I appreciate the super-budget option-realistically, I'm going to play most precons a couple times and then cannibalize them for other decks, which means I don't really want to sink a bunch of money into cards I may not use-but if it's not too much work it'd be great if it were an option. As in, "For each slot, here's the card we're suggesting to swap in on a $10 budget, and here's the card we'd suggest instead if you're on a $30 or $50 budget-though possibly it's the same card in some instances."
There's a ton of cards from the main set that are cheap and synergize well. I'm using Fertilid's Favor and Kami of Whispered Hopes for ramp, Dusk Legion Duelist for card draw, and Ancient Imperiosaur as a finisher.
A lot of comparisons with Tadeas to Toski and frostfang. Wanted to highlight they are draw whenever A creature deals damage where as he is ONE OR MORE deal damage you draw
Lovely video and great suggestions. I think I'll be using Kami of Whispered Hopes rather than Grumgully, but these were all super great adds - budget or no budget. More Lady & Rachel videos, please! ❤
28.13: You cannot activate invigorating springs during an opponent's turn since it sais "only as a sorcery". Great add though!🤩
Tadeus is not toski cause it only draws one card per player dealt dmg. Toski draws for every creature dealing dmg
I played this deck straight out the box and I think ppl are cutting the Emergent woodwurm prematurely. By turn 3 I had hydra and end of turn it had 6 +1/+1 because of , conclave mentor and Mikaeus put a +1/+1 counters on hydra. By turn 5 I could have cast the wurm targeting hydra and ripped 50 card off the top of my deck and cast any of them. The table conceded when I went to cast it. So ppl are sleeping on it I think especially in green with ramp.
I'll have to give it another try!
Yup. And the wurm trigger is "any permanent". Best thing I did with it was swinging at 2 players with the face commander and two other creatures, and the wurm backup trigger allowed me to put Uncivil Unrest and kill the two players I attacked on the spot. The wurm is great, and just need a little more ramp in the deck.
Yeah it does need more ramp. But one card I don't see alot of even in +1/+1 decks is Fight Rigging from new capenna. It's got hideaway 5 and put a plus a +1/+1 counter on target creature every beginning of combat, and when you have a total of 8 power on your battlefield cast the exile spell. It's a sleeper spell. The wurm deserves one more chance. Love the content ohana!
Stonecoil serpent would be a good add as well! Easy mana bomb and if you're doubling counters this way, there's already a good amount put on there to begin with!
Stonecoil Serpent has Protection from muticolored, meaning you can’t target it with Bright-Palm ability
I really don't get the upgrade guides this time. It was more with Tinker Time that I have issues with though. This series is framed as a way of upgrading the precons to the point they can be played against "real decks", but then with that deck, what happened wasn't really an upgrade. It was a pivot into a secret commander deck. While an interesting idea, it didn't feel as though it actually made the deck any stronger or ready to play against other decks. It took what the deck was actually trying to do and said, "That's nice, but I'd rather do this." I walked away from that video thinking, "that was interesting, but it didn't actually help."
With Call for Backup, it didn't have as many issues. Choosing Shalai and Hallar isn't bad or anything, but the reason given for the choice was incredibly strange. Saying that the backup mechanic was too much stuff to remember when the deck has a number of cards with backup doesn't really make sense. Backup aside, what Bright-Palm actually does is lets you double the number of counters on one of your creatures whenever you attack with it and make it so it can't be chump blocked. That's actually a really strong effect. But more importantly, Bright-Palm isn't a removal magnet the way Shalai and Hallar are.
Also Invigorating Hot Spring doesn't work the way you think it does. You read that you can only "Activate only as a sorcery and once per turn" and then said that you could use it on your opponents' turns. In ends up not being a great card in my opinion. Ideally, you want to ramp on turn 1 or 2. If you don't have a creature on turn 3 and you play it instead of your commander, it'll sit a full turn without having a counter removed. At the earliest, it would take five of your turns to remove all the counters from it. At that point, it's only slightly better than Fires of Yavimaya.
I'm also very confused with Master Chef not being one of the additions to the deck. It's a better Grumgully. It actually puts counters on your humans and it's an enchantment, so it's harder to remove.
I do think Rachel's made a good addition to the Command Zone and like the energy she brings to the podcast, but I can't say I'm a fan of the upgrade guides with this set, even setting the really low budget aside.
I feel the same. And people are really, really underestimating Bright-Palm's ability. When a card says "Double", it tends to do som really silly things. And Backup isn't that hard to figure out. Shalai and Hallar are great, sure, but they will very quickly become a lightning rod for removal because of their ability. And because they are an infinite combo piece in the command zone with several other cards, a lot of people will target them even if you don't run said combo just to not take the risk.
Invigorating Hot Springs is great if you keep Bright-palm as the commander, because most of the backup triggers want you to attack. It's a 100% worth adding imo. Master chef is a cool addition but I think that both Bright-Palm and S&H want a good density creatures to put counters on, especially on 2/3 manas so you can backup them and use the ability right away.
@@IronTigrex Haste is definitely way better if you're running Bright-Palms. For the budget guide, I'd definitely want Grumgully and Master Chef both, even if I think the latter is the better card.
But yeah, Shalai and Hallar being part of several known infinite combos is going to make it hard for them not to eat removal every turn cycle.
They are still great but I really like how they can be the sneaky option for killing someone out of nowhere with Bright-palm. I had a couple of games this weekend and several times all I had to do is cast them with Bright-palm on the board and just swing, with Bright-palm killing one player just by becoming huge thanks to the doubling ability and evasion, and the duo fireballing another player for like 16 damage. Backup is really sweet as an ability.
The master chef background seems pretty good for Shalai and hallar, and it’s only ~10 cents. Does a similar thing to grumgully.
When the first 10 dollar upgrade video came out I was just disappointed...now I'm just outright irritated. I just turned it off after deck breakdown.
I misread Backup making it a LOT better in my mind than it actually is; did not read the “until end of turn” clause 😬 oh well…
That being said, I still wish y’all would’ve done B-P over S&H. It’s just too straight forward a card.
I like the $10 budget but the fact that you didn't do it for the face card of the deck bugs me.
How about the cards in MOM? Uncommons: Kami of Whispered Hopes = Hardened Scales on a stick, Botanical Brawler = Scalelord for 2 mana, Invasion of Moag // Bloomwielder Dryads
Rares: Invasion of Gobakhan // Lightshield Array Protects the team and distributes counters on attackers; Ozolith, the Shattered Spire = Another hardened scale; Boon-Bringer Valkyrie for Life (link); Doomskar Warrior to dig for cards.
Maybe not budget any more but worth it: Vivien, Arkbow Ranger
If you like what Snake Umbra does you should check out Keen sense! Same effect without totem armor but for just a single green mana! Great upgrade, love to see the Naya love.
Damn I got bright palm and the gremlin commander in packs, I wish they'd use the face commander every once in a while. For a +1/+1 counter deck, I already have a good idea of what kind of cards to put in, but with something new like backup, there are probably plenty of cards from before this set that aren't straight up "put +1/+1 counters on a thing" cards that I wouldn't even think of to use. Those would have been nice to hear more about.
May I suggest some of the banger new hardened scales effects from MOM? Ozolith the Shattered Spire is so so good and gives you a consistent supply of counters when you need it. It is also so broken with the Kami of Lost Hope, stack the counters on that and have a ton of counters. Last but not least, invasion of Moag. You don't even need to flip it. Just read it as 4 mana give all your creatures a +1/+1 counter.
Great call!
Hey guys! Loved the video and loved the chemistry between the two hosts. Awesome suggested adds for beginners to this deck for sure. I also would go with Conclave Mentor from M21. cheap card, good synergy and adds a bit of life gain to the deck. Leinore, Autumn Sovereign from midnight hunt commander, as well as beast whisperer and keeper of fables from throne to help with draw. Add together forever, Citadel Siege, and Primeval Bounty enchantments just to be a bully :) lol
Is keeping track of all the effects that put +1/+1 counters on your stuff really that much more simple than swinging with Bright-Palm once per turn? Maybe twice if you blink it or add extra combat steps?
Some solid points all around and gives me a good idea where to take the deck with Bright-Palm, but not quite what I wanted to see. Oh well, there is more than enough other relevant content on the internet by now.
Ladees shirt really makes me want a Rust in Peace one where hes holding a Black Lotus
Putting together a Shalia and Hallar build with lifelink synergies for +1/+1 counters. There are a bunch of cards that give counters for each life gained and giving lifelink to Shalai and Hallar with those cards form some awesome synergies while still not being super high power since there are more than two cards in the combos.
Love that!
I was hoping to merge my Chissiro deck with this one and make a small hidden Ninja village deck... but Bright-Palm cares more about the "haste" of its ability rather than the modified creatures.
Excellent video as always, and a cool upgrade. Rachel and Ladee, you are the real Team Up Commander!!
The alternative commander is good with chishiro if you have a few modified creatures
I’ve added Goblin bombardment, Grumgully and flash speed One with the Kami to my Shalai and Hallar deck. Bit convoluted but fun
While I do agree that shalai and halar is the stronger commander, I think I still would’ve liked to have seen the face commander upgrade. Counter decks have been done already, and backup gives it a kind of unique feel
Ladee and Rachel are a really cool combo. This Video was great!
I’ve been playing this deck for the past couple days and have won by turn 7. Absolutely busted out the box. Very consistent and versatile. You only need 5-10 cards to upgrade like retreat of kazundi, fight rigging and felidar retreat. Have absolutely loved it
Nice considering alot of ppl say it's one of the weaker ones. Which commander did you use?
Ladee!!!!! It's been too long. 😃❤🧡💛💚💙💜
Personally love the inclusion of invigorating hot springs, however it does say you can only activate it at sorcery speed, so unfortunately wouldn’t be able to activate it every turn.
Hydras growth is always fun! Not sure if it’s in the deck, but super cheap!
Spicy tech from my own collection: Bard Class. For under $1, you get a source of +1/+1 counters, colored cost reduction, and impulse draw.
Great add!
Ladee 🥰 you both convinced me to give it a try! Glad to see you both in this upgrade :)
Pretty sure this is the first ever precon that has an infinite combo in it, and funnily enough both cards were cut. If flameshadow conjuring is used on enduring scalelord and one of them gets a counter, they'll bounce between each other infinitely since when one of them gets a counter, the other will. Also wins the game with shalai though there's obviously easier ways to go infinite with it
After the Pinkerton nonsense, I'm not supporting WotC directly again. I thought they almost destroyed themselves with the DnD rules nonsense last time...
I had the displeasure of going up against a Shalai & Hallar deck with my Rashmi & Ragavan deck, and it was rough to say the least lol 😅
Enduring scalelord is actually part of an jnfinite. Copy it and then give it a counter, then the copy gets a counter than the original gets a counter and shalai just oings everyone to death
Great guide, but not entirely for me, since I'm more interested in building around the backup mechanic here instead of making the +1 counter yarok deck i had in mind. Still some great adds I'd overlooked.
Loving the budget guide cause budget cards are great its a nice place to start on a deck im interested in keeping around.
Deaths presence, 5G enchantment when a creature you control dies put +1/+1 counters equal to the creatures power on a creature. 20 cents
You mean The Great Henge isn’t on budget? 😂 even cards like Beast Whisperer get dicey at almost three bucks for a ten dollar upgrade. Great content. You two rock! Enjoy the Ren Faire.
Enduring scalelord is a win con with shalai and Hallar: easy to get infinite counters on him = infinite damage.
It can even be done just with the precon, I think it's the first time a precon has the ability to go infinite even tho it's quite a bit of mana to do
@@DracoX-hz3tu I think you're right!
Tadeas isn't quite as strong as Toski. It only draws you 1 card when you hit with multiple creatures.
Really enjoyed my first few games with this deck. Hardened Scales is my number one auto include
It's such a great add into this deck
I replaced Enduring Scales with Botanical Brawler. They achieve the same thing but one is cheaper and comes in with counters.
Animation Module. I’m not asking for a reprint, please. Just calling attention to the card.
I would also put forward Wildwood Scourge. Its 16 cents and goes infinite with the Scalelord!
Or it goes infinite on its own with flameshadow...
@@DraygaFlight Scourge needs counters on non hydra creatures, and Scalelord needs a third piece to put counters on itself or the copy
Should have stayed with bright palms, his much more of a beast. also, Iridescent Hornbeetle is much more useful he the deck your building.
Rachel is a such smooth seller during the pre-show pitches... Ladee provides the ULTIMATE backup (har har) I didn't even fast forward! love the gurls thank u CZ
Backup with haste is pretty insane, because you can give the backup creature its own counter, and then it gets its ability again, which is super relevant with cards like Emergent Woodworm. Play him, give him three counters, he attacks and you do the trigger twice, X is 7.
Call for back up?
WOTC should change it to "Call for Pinkertons".
First! I want more backup cards! The mechanic seems really fun!!
Vorinclex mysterious raider will be awesome with shali and haller
Watch out, WotC might send Blackwater PMC after you, maybe you even get nuked.
I don’t know how well chishiro the shattered blade would fit in the deck. His first ability is meh to irrelevant but the second where all modified creatures get a +1/+1 counter means you can ping more things in your end step.
Sometimes just one part of a card can totally be worth throwing into the 99 and see how it plays!
Chishiro is an awesome add imo & he puts in work. He just keeps adding +1+1 counters to your already modified creatures without having to do anything. Triggering S&H while growing your creatures at the same time.
Shalai and Hallar is a dream come true for me as a commander. It's the perfect deck for a ton of cards that I've just naturally collected over the past few years that I've wanted to play but never had the right deck for. I have foil Laezel, the beautiful alternate art for Halana and Alena, and All Will Be One was the highlight of my prerelease
Ladee AND Rachel! More of this when possible, please!
You guys do really great work, but I have a hard time caring about such a limited budget.
For less than $1.00, you could throw in Sunscorch Regent. He’s a big boy dragon that gets bigger when your opponents play spells. Plus he gives you life! A bit harder to play with the double white pip, but I think would be a fun include.
That's a fun idea!
He is in the preconstructed list already.
@@IronTigrex Oh I didn’t know! Just watched the video and commented lol thanks for letting me know!
it's in the deck already!
@@ana-alyciajuarez5958 No worries! And he does do some work in the deck. He gets HUGE pretty fast.
I think Surrak and Goreclaw, would be a great addition to the deck gives creatures haste and counters on etb plus trample for everything.
Interesting!
I personally enjoy Drumhunter, Exuberant Firestoker, and Sunseed Nurturer from Shards of Alara. Mana ramp and extra bonus if you got a 5 power creature, which is easy. Drumhunter especially since it's a free draw each turn
i idnt check new cards until now. The enchantment red that give riot makes many combos with marchesa the black rose
It's Ladee! its been 3000 years
The ladee is back in town
Dear The Command Zone group, I know you’re sponsored by WotC themselves so you’re on their paychecks. But under the light of recent events of them sending The Pinkertons to harass a RUclipsr , something that is really splitting Corporation with fanbase , and so I and we hope that you would send a message condoning this choice of action and support the community, fanbase and RUclipsrs. Alas, I know you’ll never talk about that BECAUSE you’re on their paychecks so you prefer standing with evil corporation rather than with the community.
Chishiro would be a cheap and fun upgrade.
Took out Emergent Woodwurm :( one of the few cards that gave a little bit of card advantage
I genuinely surprised marath will of the wild wasn't in the add or honorable mention, she comes in with 3, 1/1 counters and you can move them around, create creatures, or deal pew pew damage, especially since there's so much 1/1 payoffs it's easy to put more on her and spread them back out
Great video, I liked the noticeable mentions section.
Craig probably wants to strap up Shalai and Hallar with grafted exoskeleton.😂
42:12
WOULD THAT KINDA BE AN SEMI-INFINITE COMBO ???
like you have ways to put counters on OTHER creatures, then you have ways to put EXTRA counters on them and that trigger other creaturs getting extra counters
and then you have your commander than will do dmg
So you have many creatures, you got the SCALELORD... you put counters on other, then you trigger more counters, then you put counters on Scalelord, then that triggers more counters, thus trigering the Commander ability... then you use an instant later, that does the counter thingy, and that repeats ... getting more and more counters and more dmg ...
then FALKENRATH ... you pay, do damage to player, get counters on him, trigger putting MORE counters on OTHER creatures... TRIGGER AGAIN SCALELORD ... trigger commander ability...
trigger FALKENRATH AGAIN.... REPEAT
with a proper preparation. the cards at play. and enough mana.... those 2 cards that you taking OUT... could WIN THE GAME in 1 or 2 rotations.
Tadeas aint no toski, only 3 draws per turn once per opponent provided there are no blocks, its good draw but it is not toski/frostfang
I feel that these upgrade videos nowadays make not a lot of sense if they do not talk about the new cards. Especially if the decks have a new mechanic which is featured in the main set.
It’s funny how WOTC doesn’t acknowledge the secondary market, but “arbitrarily” sets values to stuff that’s basically spot on for the “non-existent” secondary market. They also removed the MSRP.
We gotta remember all the horrible stuff they’ve done to the game and stop letting them slide along because they can afford sponsors like these people and their animators.
FLAMESHADOW .... 44:43
you could copy your commander RIGHT ???
then TRIGGER YOUR COMMANDER ABILITY... SEVERAL TIMES !!!
right ???
isnt that the idea here?
Wow, you literally removed two of the best cards in the deck? It's an accidental infinite kill combo, right in the precon!
Activate flameshadow on scalelord, put a counter on ANYTHING, and it goes infinite... and with shalai out, everyone's dead... and best of all, it's a controlled infinite!
this deck is crazy fun to upgrade it with the tight budget. you could for example, add in the boom bringer Valkyrie. that thing will do lots of work for you. I know from my own experiences.
Hi Guys! My friends have looked into the rules and apparently Dhalai and Hallar's damage from +1+1's is not commander damage. I thought via this video that it was? Could someone clarify it for me please? I was pretty bummed when I found out :(
I put Drizzt, Bruenor, Catti-Brie and Wulfgar in this deck and had to throw in a dozen equipments.
Plus a bear and a squirrel and human ranger partners and some dragons/angels..... its an R.A. Salvatore inspired deck
Why did y’all decide to have $10 budget for this deck. All the others are $50 budget. I assume it’s because it’d be too overpowered. Still wanna know tho lol😅
You can tell she has never!!!!! played Street Fighter you pronounced his name wrong it's Dhalsim ( Daal · seem) , Dhālasima धालसिम
Marathi language . just saying
Every player has there own play style and that's fine, but I feel like this upgrade did a disservice to the deck by making it very generic instead of playing heavily with the new back up ability. Also switching to the secondary commander will generate a level of hate the deck can't handle even with all the upgrades. Still some good adds but not to sure about the cuts.
I love this format. I small suggestion, give us a list of the 10 cards to add, or provide us a link to card kingdom, with all the cards loaded up for us to buy. Either way, thank you for these videos, I feel like they are helping me get into the format.
Tades draws a maximum of one card per attack phase - the other more expensive cards you compared it with draw a card for EACH creature that deals damage... not saying it isn't a good card, just not in the same category as those others at all, drawing one card per turn (most of the time) for 4 mana on a creature is a common enough effect.
I threw Marath, Will of the wild in mine to go infinite with shalai and Hallar 😅. Remove 2 counters from Marath, add 2 counters to Marath, Shay shay and hallelujah ping for 2 on repeat.
Still watching, but I'm surprised no one's pointed out Bright Palm is a girl. On the front and back of the box Bright Palm has female pronouns, so it feels a little weird ^^;
I could still run this deck and these upgrades using Bright Palm as the commander, yeah? I just recently got this deck and wanna keep the lil shaman as the commander but still use these upgrades
Why are Mowu and Evolution Sage not in this deck normally?
Proliferating and getting extra counters seem like they would generate a lot of extra value doing things the deck is going to do anyway.
It would be nice to have the list to add,remove and honorable mentions pinned to top of comments. For copy and paste purposes. Or a link to arkidek with said added cards.
This is my first deck I was given by my brother an I enjoy its play style a lot tbh 😂 I really don’t know a lot yet but it’s hella fun 😂😂
Any news from the sleeves project? its april and i have yet to receive them. Sent emails and have not heard from you guys since february. This is sad.
The more I look at this deck, the more I wish the commander was just WG instead of WGR.
The red cards are really easy to remove and not all that great.