Elon Musk & Self-Driving Cars ARE A NIGHTMARE
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- Опубликовано: 29 апр 2024
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#elonmusk #tesla #twitter
All together now:
Just Make Public Transport
Like the hyperloop? 🫠
@@pikapownsyou mean that thing that's like a train, but worse in every way?
Yeah, here in Hamburg we already have almost fully autonomous transportation all around the clock.
It's the tram lines 😂
They are actually almost self-driving. The only thing the driver has to do is operate a few controls and be there in case of emergency.
@@pikapowns Next time you drive put a pipe from your exhaust tank and root all the way to the front drives window, Then go inside start your engine and throw away the key.
Then weld the doors and windows shut.
Preferably do that in a secluded area.
@@lolusuck386 No the thing that completely reimagined public transportation as a private road for private taxis.
"I want to play Tears of the Kingdom on my way to the Anime-Con"
I can already do this - it's called T-R-A-I-N-S.
This comment was sponsored by the European gang.
Or even a BUS 🚌... Brought to you by even moderately competent US cities.
Subways are great for the work commute.-Enlightened American City, with Light rail, subways, and busses.
We don't even need to go as far as Europe for this. Montreal right above me has some of the best public railway transportation in the entire world. We NEED THAT, especially the proposed Montreal to Boston train system.
Trains and nuclear power are both technologies that solve huge problems in society yet have never seen widespread adoption for political reasons.
German trains are worse than walking.
We wanted light rail in our city. It’s a rapidly growing city! A politician said “no need, we’ll have self driving cars to handle our public transit needs in 2 or 3 years.”
That was 8 years ago
We could have had the rail by now. I hate it here so much.
Gotta love the technocrat maxime:
_"Why use the solutions we have readily available in the present day when we can wait and hope for science fiction to become reality some time in the future?"_ 🙄
@@LRM12o8ain't that basically Christian rapture belief wrapped into a shiny techy skin?
Why take action to stop systemic racism, or inequality or climate change?
None of that will matter very soon when (GOD RIPS OPEN THE HEAVENS TO TAKE THE CHOSEN) new technology magically arrive to save the world
100 years ago my city had electric trolley servicing the entire metro area, been running for decades at that point and was very functional. It was paved over 80 years ago and our light rail services maybe 10% of the area and 50% of the passenger load. If only we had the public electric transport we had 100 years ago :(
streetcars >>>>>>> selfdriving cars
When I first became a truck driver my instructor said that our jobs would be taken over by self driving trucks in 10 years. 18 years later and I’m still waiting.
In the next 15-20 years long distance trucking might have some autonomous drivers because fair weather freeway driving is by far the easiest to automate. Then more of the jobs would just be the last 10-20 miles from the outer depots to the customer.
@@hugegamer5988So what happens when one of those trucks crashes? You think the company will be willing to take that liability risk?
@@thunderspark1536 the airplane industry has to some degree done that, afaik
@@lorenzopisetta305 And you want to know what happened when the lawsuits started piling up? They blamed the pilots of course. But here, there are no humans.
@@thunderspark1536 this is America, you think we have a functional justice system? Blame will be put on the human driver(s) because computers can’t make mistakes (and the judges RV was gifted to them)
Here’s a crazy idea. Invest in a ton of public transit it’s way safer than cars
I've learned that the people in control will always make the decision that makes the least amount of sense...
Why would a private company invest in public transit? That's the governemts job, not Waymo or Cruise or whatever they are called.
Exactly. It should be made by the government and controlled by the government. Cut out out the middle man
@@zagreus5773 no body was saying that, learn how to read better.
Elon musk admitted that he pushed the hyperloop scam because he wanted to boycott the high speed rail that California was planning. I heard that it’s been funded by the Biden infrastructures plan but still 15 years have been lost.
PUBLIC TRANSIT AND WALKABLE STREETS. Jesus. This problem was solved 150 years ago. The only car innovation we really need is fewer cars. Period.
Heretic! The oiliarchy requires consumption!
You mean having 150 story high interlinked apartment buildings so that people don't have to live 2 hours away from your wonderful public transport?
Good luck removing all the city regulations to make that happen, and good luck convincing people that being stuffed In a concrete box is better than having their own home.
@@OfficialUSKRprogram🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡💩💩
@@OfficialUSKRprogram Look up streetcar suburbs real quick. You can have both
I like the idea of fever cars but I also know how car rental services will squeeze you as soon as half of city people start relying on their services. A lot of people live in the city but work outside where getting there by public transport is almost impossible. If you want to deviate slightly from the popular routes you get slapped with hour+ wait times or even stuck if you miss the last connection. The only things that gave me worse experiences than normal cars are rental/service cars.
I operate one for a living. They're never gonna work. We need public transit and walkable cities, not stupider cars.
And also universal healthcare and education. None of that is ever going to happen in the US
Or how about less cities.
@@cristianproust We need more Christian schools then.
@@andrewericjamesclark6808 hey, look someone who wants to be a 12th century European Peasant!
Legal liability will stop full self-driving. Now an accident victim doesn't just sue the broke driver with zero assets, the victim can sue the automaker, the software creator, the sensor vendors, the navigation map vendor, etc. It wrecked general aviation too.
I bet you anything musk will find a way to loophole the liability towards the car owners
It will be in the fine print or something, a clause exempting tesla for any bs the self-driving does while the driver is inside the vehicle, meaning they're supposed to "supervised the full self driving, at all times"
This is why Tesla auto pilot shut itself off less than one second before impact. Such practice would become the standard in all auto pilot systems if TRUE self driving cars were a reality.
Tesla ditched all the sensors but a crappy camera for their driving. It’s a major reason why their FSD is so far behind other systems.
This is a dumb argument. If you want to use it, you make a choice it's your fault
@@BenSmith-cm8ocBullshit. You don't excuse liability because you CHOSE to use a vehicle. When a car's brake is faulty, do you blame the driver?
Overpromise and under-deliver is the American way!
Then musk just might be the most American man currently alive
Same logic applies to video games, too lol
America first!
@@matheussanthiago9685 Musk knows more about over promising than anyone currently alive on earth.
Ubisoft does the same.
As someone who writes robotic software, I would never let software drive my car. I maybe would use it for cruise control and keeping distance from the car in front of me on the highway. But the steering wheel can too quickly be used to put the car into an unrecoverable state, so I'm not letting anything a software engineer designed touch it.
what about railway systems like trolleys? i mean, their only programming would be to stop, wait, and go, with the failsafe of stopping if it perceives an obstruction in the way (prolly still need a human for that).
@@Echo81Rumple83 Automatic street trolleys can be designed much safer, especially if a combination of lidar systems and cameras are used to detect railway obstructions. Giving trolleys right of way and their own lane of road would also help simplify the amount of decisions an autonomous system would have to make.
If you ever see conspiracies/fear mongering about "15 minute cities" just consider that those naratives only benefit car manufacturers
Also the fact that car manufacturers have a history of lobbying and manipulating the narrative to benefit their bottom line.
How would it be fear mongering if its true? Not my theory but the theory is youre restricted to your 15 minutes unless you get permission to leave.
@@Garycarlyle can I get citation for that?
I have zero desire to deal with self-driving anything. If I want something to "self-drive" I will take the bus or an Uber.
Literally every problem the self driving cars are claimed to solve can be managed 100x better by public transit. Give the people TRAINS
Two things:
1. We already have autonomous trains, many subways around the world operate in fully unattended mode, and if you ride high-speed rail anywhere the train is mostly autonomous because humans cannot physically react properly at those speeds.
2. The fundamental issue with FSD is that it's probably almost exactly equivalent to solving AGI (artificial general intelligence), because the public road is, well, a public environment where everything happens with the expectation of human intelligence. This also explains why the only real FSD is, as I mentioned, with trains, since a railway track can be a perfectly signaled and isolated.
There's an option for 2 that doesn't involve AGI, which we will never do of course. Building infrastructure specifically for autonomous vehicles. No humans, no randomness, turns the challenge from AGI to essentially an engineering task. But even that option has nothing to do with tesla...
@@jaazz90 yes and then when we build that infrastructure , we can make it more efficient by adding more space to the vehicles so they can carry more people at once, then we can make that even more efficient by linking all these vehicles to a single engine... wait...
The claim that FSD is basically the same as AGI comes from Elon who tries to a) hide his failure to develop FSD and b) claim that he is close to reaching AGI so that people keep pumping the stock. Don't believe the nonsense he says, it is utterly stupid to believe FSD and AGI are even similar. People have said that about all kinds of tasks that AI then solved without becoming anything like AGI, like playing Chess, Go, DOTA, creating language etc.
@@flavorlessquark8614 I mean London had metro and bikes before cars yet there's been natural demand for cars or carriages. They are similar but not interchangeable
@@flavorlessquark8614 Have you considered the efficiency gains we could get by cutting down friction almost entirely by using steel wheels on some kind of dedicated hard surface, such as a long rail of steel embedded securely into the ground? Could be revolutionary.
Manufacturers who sell a "Fully Self-Driving" Car / "Autopilot" should ABSOLUTELY be liable 100% the car causes while the feature is engaged. That's not insane, that's the ONLY REASONABLE CONCLUSION of the manufacturer saying it's fulls self-driving!
But thinking we live in a reasonable, sane world where that's going to happen, well THAT would indeed be insane! 😮💨
Just remember, Tesla auto pilot turns itself off less than one second before impact. Technically, it was off when the impact occurred, so the driver is at fault
why do people think that human operated vehicles are somehow better than computer-operated vehicles? do you people not realize how much better computers are at reacting to shit compared to humans? obviously the technology isn't there yet, but eventually it will be and when full self-driving actually gets up to snuff it could potentially fully eliminate car accidents
🎯
@@clown134 "Self-driving cars will maybe have value in the future as long as we sacrifice enough human lives right now."
@BlitzkriegOmega that's just a lie. go look it up.
That reporter riding around talking about how great the trip is is the definition of antecdotal evidence. All the investigative skills of a toddler
The video footage playing while he said that also had no one else on the road.
Thunderfoot had a good segment on these self driving Tesla's as the equivalent of babysitting a little kid while he takes the wheel of the car. You are gonna have to have your hands on the wheel the whole time to correct it when it runs stop signs and tries to veer into traffic
Their rebranding for "supervised full self-driving"
Or whatever they called it
It just just pathetic
@@matheussanthiago9685and the muskrats just eat it up as if that makes sense. Words don't mean anything anymore
Sounds like a combination of Russian roulette and an ADD test.
Sounds even more mentally taxing than just driving.
we love daddy Thunderf00t here
The VIRGIN *"self-driving"* car fan VS the CHAD *"beep-beep!"* moped enjoyer
Vaush hates mopeds tho
@@fluffynator6222I don't need Vowsh to validate all of my opinions
@@afterhourscinema782
Fair enough
GEDDAFUKOUTTAMYWAY IM DRIVIN HEREEEE pilled
@@fluffynator6222 Who cares? Also, Vaush hates motorcycles, not mopeds afaik.
It's wild that private companies are allowed to beta test their products on public roads.
Someone donates $500
Vaush: One sec I gotta make fun of this chatter
Well to be fair, the person donating knows what they sign up for. And Vaush is doing alright money-wise too, he doesn't need to pander and please his viewers for donos. He has the liberty to rip on them a little if he wants.
"Sheen this is the 6th time you've brought trains but worse to show and tell"
WTF, this is Enron and Theranos all over again. Why TF is anyone believing anything Musk says!? This is madness.
Enron Muskrat
Silliest time-line
Because every homo sapiens is a schizo and the only difference is to what degree. This is how our neurons are formed. You can't objectively process all the incoming information, so you make patterns to compartmentize it and operate with some abstracts of an actual thing which inherently can't contain all the information of the original.
More stock for me. Thank you.
@@jwetzel3141When you're left holding the bag, you won't have that attitude.
"Why won't anyone buy my sinking stock?!" -You, soon.
If they want to do do robot taxis make the CEO legally responsible. Ever time a car gets a ticket the CEO must pay it, if a person is killed the CEO stands trial as the driver.
Only two fell off hard jokes in the first two minutes? Fell off hard fell off hard!
This community is so cooked man
You know what is the best self-driving-car? A streetcar!
You know what is the second-best self-driving-car? A taxi (okay, needs a human as driver, but if you replace around fifty "normal" cars with one taxi it will feel as if it were Musk's self-driving utopia, only better because less crowded!)
We're so close to it that Elon himself has starting referring to it as "supervised full self driving" FIVE YEARS after claiming it was already 100% capable of solo cross country navigation.
We will have self driving cars one day. Probably not in the next 20 years, but it will happen. But heres the thing....
YOU WILL STILL NEED GOOD PUBLIC TRANSPORT. Thats what drives me crazy. Having a car drive itself fundamentally does not change the problem of cars. Its not an efficient way of moving people.
It makes it alot more efficient tho because the self driving cars could communicate with each other basically acting like a swarm which would make traffic alot more fluent
@@Landgraf43 Problem is that it will still be inferior to same system with public transport since public transport just uses road space significantly more efficiently
They can't ticket a car, but they'll send fines for missed tolls to the person associated with the license plate...
The thing some people even in Vaush's audience don't seem to understand is that using AI or similar tech to eliminate workers isn't particularly helpful. It will *NOT* make things cheaper for the consumer. Companies will just charge the same amount for the service and pocket the excess that would have otherwise gone to the worker. Also, removing human workers while we still live in a capitalist system that requires work and payment to obtain basic necessities like food, water, shelter, and medical care is a bad thing. That's fewer available jobs, meaning fewer people are able to earn the money necessary to afford being alive. None of these "innovations" or any that have come previously have been used to alleviate the workload expected from an average person, it's just made that work more niche, more inaccessible without specialized education/training, and more likely to be outsourced. I've yet to hear a single good justification for full self driving to even be a thing aside from "it can drive you home safely if you're plastered and you won't have to leave your car at the bar/party." To that, my reply is to get some help with your alcoholism rather than find work-arounds to enable it.
Or it could be solved with reliable public transport. You plan on getting plastered, you leave your car at home. Simple
Who are those imaginary people? Vaush's audience is 99% on your side. The thing you don't seem to understand is that AI is literally a technology. The only reason we're living better today than we did in 1910 is technology, not societal change or democratic institutions or morality or anything else. Yes millions will get screwed over, so advocate for education and new job creation, or for UBI and taxation, not for banning technology.
@@jaazz90 you're conflating all technology with reliable technology. yeah the world was built on technology, that doesn't mean every tech bro in SV is saving our skins another decade down the line. FSD clearly isn't working and we have better, actually functional, reliable tech that does work.
So vaush's audience are puritanical freaks that think anyone that likes to go to a bar is an alcoholic.... Can't really say I'm surprised...
@@jaazz90 I know reading is hard, but maybe learn how at some point? You see, the word "some" is meant to denote a portion or percentage, not all, so even if 99% of Vaush's audience is "on my side," then *some* of them still aren't. The "imaginary" people are like, I don't know, the ones he's constantly arguing with in his chat in every single video on this topic for example. Now that that's out of the way, another faux pas when learning to read is inserting things that aren't there. Where/when did I say anything at all about "banning technology?" Like technology in general? I was saying that I see no reason for one specific technology to exist, not advocating for it to be banned. I know paying attention and following along is *really* hard, but do try to keep up with the adults.
Called full self driving but it isn't actually full self driving. How does Muskrat get away with lying like he does?
It’s really simple. He’s rich. That’s it 💀
@@giannaleng1897 Shit, I forgot. Rich people can do whatever they want. My bad.
@@Zero_Ninety we’re joking around but it’s actually just sad lmao 😭
@@Zero_Ninetyask Shinzo Abe, if he can still do whatever he wants
Said I, again implying absolutely nothing your honor
@@matheussanthiago9685 Be real, there are a large number of social privileges a person receives for being rich, especially ones that protect them from being punished for open face lies. There’s only so much money can do to protect you from being shot.
My GPS still tries to trick me into driving into a lake every now and again, and that technology has been widely available for a while, now. For self-driving cars to truly be safe for wide-scale use, you'd probably need straight-up AI.
The thing is, even the most sophisticated fully self-driving system we have available, the human brain, can't always reliably navigate a city. Which indeed causes me not to have too high hopes for computerized FDSs
How is it that they realized that you can't fine a car with no driver and didn't immediately tell them to F off the road until there's a legal framework in place?
Tesla's FSD still hasnt gotten past level 2, and it will never work with "vision-only".
I don't get why it shouldn't be possible to solve self driving with just vision, because last time I checked we humans also rely on vision and don't have some kind of lidar sensor in our head.
@@Landgraf43 Because LIDAR gives a more direct and less computationally intensive solution to distance perception, than image parallax that matches human vision.
@@carultch I get that lidar has some advantages I'm just saying that there is no reason why self driving with vision only shouldn't be possible when the fact that we humans do it proves that it is in fact possible.
We also rely on our ears (sound and motion), touch, and sometimes, smell. Our vision also works differently than the fixed-focus, deep depth of focus cameras these systems use. Our eyes are higher resolutions have very shallow depth of field and work more like scanners that quickly focus on small areas of interest. The latter is where driver-assist features can help bring attention to potential hazards outside our field of view.
Computers are much faster at processing the same small set of commands repeatedly. However, our brains are still faster at persistent memory and recalling random pieces of information, so humans are still quicker at recognizing novel, unexpected situations and responding to them. We are also still much better at negotiating with other people, drivers, pedestrians or cyclists when in a traffic conflict situation than these driver assist systems are.
Could they get there eventually? Probably, but not anytime soon, and they shouldn’t be allowed to be tested on public streets until they are much better than they currently are, certainly not without a human to correct them when they make the wrong decision.
It’s more stressful to worry about having to take over the car if there is a problem then actually just driving it.
Remember, these are the same people who'd add a sensor on the front of an SUV and wait for you to go "OH MAI GAAD, _WAW_ " rather than admit that SUV designs are awful to begin with and go back to making a normal car.
No way in hell am I getting into the back seat of a taxi with no driver
I barely get into the passenger seat of the people I know best, let alone some software
15:16 "Is it really that difficult to get a human to read stuff out loud?" -Vaush, watching a video from the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, fails the newest version of the Turing test: a French Canadian speaking English.
The reason they exist. Is they want to automate things to make more money.... that's it. The problem is when you automate too much, there IS no money.
If no one has jobs? who pays for the automated taxi.
Driving, employees millions of people.
Automating... just driving, will cause at least a 1% increase in unemployment in america. (minimum)
The strangest thing. We as employees must "fulfill our social contract" by remaining employed, but corporations seem to face no such equivalent pressure to preserve employment.
You understand money is a standin for real things right? If no one has a job, you have a bunch of people who don't need to work *and* all the food, resources and housing needed to sustain them (the robots certainly don't need any of that). You have to deliberately contrive reasons why a human society with automation would somehow not distribute these resources accordingly. Who cares about money anymore when you can sit back and produce food for the whole population?
@@Valhan177 Because corporations are short sighted and parasitic, they care about what raises their stock price in the short term, without any actual concern for if its long-term effects. A lot of corporations are run as stock schemes and not as businesses. In a lot of cases, what's good for the stock price is terrible for both the company's long-term health and the economy as a while.
Musk cant even get his Vegas Tunnel cars working without a driver, wich would be a billion time easier than FSD in open space.
God I hate that stupid Vegas tunnel. We could have just had a subway. 😔
From me a tech worker (desperately hoping to escape):
You can teach a robot to toast bread. Easy right? How hard do you press the butter against the bread?
Toasting bread is easy. Buttering toast is hard.
In order to butter bread, you'd need info on the hardness of the bread, the shape/hardness of your knife, the type of butter and its hardness. Soft butter on hot toast requires a lot less force than cold butter on soft bread.
It would be easier to have the toasting and buttering process together so the robot knows already how toasted the bread will be and how warm to expect it. It can also warm the butter to allow it to spread easier to make the required force necessary a smaller variable range. But also you'd have a lot of trouble with people complaining they can't have an unexpected bread type or toasting process because the robot isn't able to handle everything.
@@catelynh1020 exactly right. The way we do AI now is feed it lots of normalized data on how lots of people (ideally) butter bread.
The thumbnail goes hard
If *I* a Person, does a Crime, I could be arrested and Jail.
If *I* as a Corporation do a Crime, I get Another Fine/Fee.
so, how long until we find out that all these "self-driving" taxis are being remote-controlled by a call center in India?
They actually are, sort of. Human opetators take over control whenever there is an issue, very similar to that Amazon story. That is why you see multiple cars getting stuck for a while, there are human operators who are supposed to solve such a situation but that is hard to solve if you need to drive the right one away manually one by one.
RIP Elongated Muskrat
No more elonratted muskgate
thought of grimes and died
Rest in piss apartheid trump
You won't be missed
So if a robot robs a bank you can't arrest the owner?
If you buy a furby because it's cute and it sprouts legs and goes to rob a bank, then it was not your fault for buying it. If you buy a "bank robbing furby" and act surprised it robs a bank, you are reaponsible for it.
You just reminded me of a character in Futurama.
hasn't there already a "self-driving" car that has its own path, can carry lots of either passengers or cargos, and can be powered as long as there isn't an outage?
THEY KEEP REINVENTING THE TRAIN
As someone who has written computer vision software, camera only FSD will never work. I would never trust it.
Same, I only wrote computer vision code as part of college coursework and it’s obvious to me we are many many years from being even as safe as a distracted drunk teenager.
Tbh the more I consider the ideal environment for an AI to drive a vehicle, the more and more I just start describing a train.
Never say never. If we humans can do it from vision only there is no reason why a true AGI system shouldn't be able to do it.
@@Landgraf43 Ya, wake me up when a car has a human brain in it.
@@csadler pretty much every car has a human brain in it isn't it the point to create one that doesn't need a human brain to drive?
No cars. Only trains.
Yeah, like commercial fusion power has been 30 years away since the 1950s and it still is.
Vancouver literally has had autonomous trains since the 80's.
London since 1967.
@@bk2721 No, the train could not stop, autonomous or not. What is your point?
Everything "self-driving" EV cars is claimed to solve has already been possible for near decades:
With public transportation such as Electric Trams, Trains, Busses, Subways, Trolleys - and others.
Public transportation:
- Reduces traffic very greatly and effectively, deletes traffic jams, reduces emission and energy usage a fkload more, gives passenger the time to do whatever during the trip.
- Sure as hell is cheaper than building and maintaining extensive highroad everywhere - along with costs related to it such as health issues and environmental damage caused by the pollution.
- "Self-driving" i.e no need to drive or pay attention to anything except when you're stop is up due to 1 driver driving a whole bunch of passangers that would have taken 1 car each instead, havin to pay attention, be alert the whole time. It's like 40 cars driving themselves, but only one of them has a person driving.
- It's also a lot easier to make something that runs on rail self-driving, that has no traffic to compete with from any direction. Which already exists.
A buss on a road with fully or partly separate buss lanes and the same route, with stops planned at certain times - sure as hell is easier than a self-driving car on public roads.
- No need to have a "summon" function when the public transportation comes at the same scheduled time as always.
- No time needed to be spent for car-related stuff like charging, washing, service/repairs, finding & walking to/from parking lots and more.
- Many types of public transportation travels faster, and some much more so, even before adding stuff like being stuck in a traffic jam, finding a parking lot, charging and so on.
- No need for a drivers licence or health, vision good enough to drive.
You can travel drunk if you want, which "self-driving" cars wont solve.
- The city doesnt have to look like sh*t hellscape of parking lots and roads.
- Produces much, much less noise pollution.
Bleeeh the list is sooo long and i don't have energy or time to write more.
Also, i wrote this while on a tram.
The point of autonomous cars is that you significantly reduce cost, since the vehicles are always driving around, working (rather than sitting in a garage 90% of the day), and it's cheaper for people to subscribe to a ride share than own their own cars. The reality though is that it's a pipe-dream, yet investing a fraction of what's needed to make autonomy work toward excellent public transport would be far more superior. There's a reasonable economic argument for autonomous EVs if it existed, but at what cost of investment? At what cost of even cheaper public transport / walkability / bikeability not getting done?
wanted to get somewhere without driving yourself? we had a tool for that: its called a BUS
TAKE
TRANSIT
And if transit doesnt have enough coverage, frequency, reliability, or end-to-end performance, go outside, argue for more transit funding in your area. Go to council meetings, vote, and join the local riders union.
Transit doesnt have to be bad
The only way this works is in a closed system, with every vehicle networked with each other, roads designed for them, and no normal cars with drivers in them at all. Which means it can't work. There would need to be two separate road systems, which would double the costs to the public for maintaining them. Just build the public transport infrastructure, get more buses, whichever works best for any given area.
💯 the absolute MOST i could see a "self driving environment" would be like some kind of campus. Like little golf carts at Universal Lot or a really large college
I work in tech - even if the software/tech were even close to ready - the ETHICAL questions that have to be hammered out would never get through the courts. The ethical questio is - in a high impact crash, who dies? by which I mean, which part of the car will take the greatest impact based on last second split decisions the algorithum makes? You'd literally build "who dies" into the algorithm. The liability would be insane.
Why not use a taxi if you want to ride around without driving? want to help with congestion? try a bus. want to do it constantly on a closed road? why not a train or subway? hell, you don't even need to tip or interact with the drivers on a bus or subway and you help everything so much more. Imagine how much High-speed rail could be built if we invested in what we use for AI driving.
the only exception I make for this is AI driving assistance, where a car might help auto-correct an accident, or bad habits, or assist disabled citizens drive better. that's still not autonomous though.
Not having a human present in these cars seems like it would make them way more likely to get defaced, smashed with a baseball bat, or stolen from.
I hate how isolated Americans have been. It's like saying hello is now too much interaction. I also hate ppl who say small talks are pointless.
I struggle with greetings and small talk, but avoiding human contact entirely is fucking psychotic. Can those people not even do the nod of acknowledgement?
Also "i hate talking to people" the woman said in an interview. Was the interviewer an ai too?
@@echiko4932 I think its fine to at least try to talk as like with everything, you get better at it the more you do it. But to just avoid humans, like why even go outside at that point?
$100 bucks to the first person to let the air out of all tyres on one of those driverless taxis
If you are at the point of embedding sensors on the road just build a fucking train.
Hear, hear everyone! Our new super high technologic driver less car has the benefit of causing an increase in unemployment and has no others reason to exist.
There are lots of reasons for actual reliable self driving to exists for example safety.
Is self-driving car just a dream for gen-Xers? Saying "we feel like the Jetsons" seems like a pretty superficial reason for wanting such a thing.
Though, real solutions like "creating cities where you don't need to drive" can't be done when politicians say "it should be an individual choice because such a city is not for everyone".
Self-driving cars were not a particular fixation for us Gen-Xers.. But there was a prime time '80s TV show called 'Knight Rider', which featured a black Trans-Am run by an AI.
I have long hypothesized. that 'Knight Rider' and the '60s cartoon 'The Jetsons' may have warped his mind..
How long can he keep getting away with this? Apparently forever 😔
I knew money was a powerful tool, but now I see the gravity of it. That's the ONLY way someone could possibly fail upward so much.
Enough money makes you impervious to the laws of man
But not impervious to the laws to physics that took Shinzo Abe out of the census
Said I, implying nothing your honor
I tend to say "until they have the climactic emperor's new clothes moment." The problem is that in our reality with cultists and bootlickers, it's as if they also have that same "magnificent gown" that the emperor is wearing. In order for such people to laugh at the naked emperor, the cultists would have to first admit that they're naked as well.
If current me went back in time to the 2000s and told past me about all this bullshit, the past me would've scoffed and called current me a frightened luddite who didn't understand the value of technology.
It's very sobering to think back to how "technology", as a concept, used to function almost as an unacknowledged religious belief on my part. I assumed that the reasons things weren't as good as they could be because of tech limitations. So naturally I also assumed that in a couple decades the tech would advance and that was just part of the inevitable march of progress. What I failed to grasp was that both these assumptions are demonstrably false. My lack of historical knowledge and lack of experience with the twisted logic of big business made it possible for the advertising narratives of tech billionaires to appeal to me because they made sense according to the false intuition I had about what makes the world work.
It seems like a political and historical education is crucial for understanding damn near everything. Even making an automobile purchase!
Remember a couple of years ago when they were testing self-driving taxis in Arizona and customers had to consent? Well.... Nobody asked me if it was okay to share the road with these cars.
Its very simple no matter how much you train an AI or develop a system to simulate driving you will NEVER replace humans behind the wheel because no machine can REACT and INTERPRET new information the way a human can
Right, they can do it faster?
FSD has already proven to be FAR better at preventing rear end collisions than human drivers. Do you actually think your reaction time is FASTER than a computer's? Seriously??
An estimated 94% of car accidents are from driver (human) error, not from our road layouts and laws. If you make a machine that is programmed to follow these layouts, rules, and laws to the letters it will be far safer of a driver.
Like ffs dude - we ALREADY, FOR YEARS, have added computer assisted driving because our human senses fail constantly: lane-following, proximity alerts and adjustments, auto-breaking. WE HAVE ALL THIS STUFF ALREADY AND ITS ALREADY PROVEN ITS USEFULNESS.
Just such a weak argument....
@@duckheadbob No. There are unforseen situations where you just need human level intelligence. And current AI just cant do it yet.
Also dont trust Teslas statistic. They only count situations where it is easy for fsd, like on highways.
@@niederrheiner8468 exactly you need human level intelligence, AGI which will likely happen within this decade. But the comment said you will never be able to do it which doesn't make sense.
i will tell you what will happen when we have fully autonomous vehicles, the car will drive it self, you're just a passenger. it finds a shortcut "where the road close because of a festival" it dives though the festival no waking up everyone along the way, tesla gets sues billions, all car company's drop the idea of self driving cars, the end
I think this was the payoff for SpaceX killing the Artemis 3 lunar landing.
I have a theory that in the time-line where spaceX was never founded
NASA was forced to pick up its slack on its own, and became just as, if not more powerful and respectful as it was in the 60s and 70s
Meaning Elon took away form us The Martian time-line
NASA getting to operate on its own again would be ideal 👌
Martian timeline - hopefully you're not talking about colonization or even human exploration (vs robot exploration). It's a complete fantasy propelled by Musk. Not pessimism, realism. Common Sense Skeptic illustrates this very well.
Vaush: Doesn't like self-checkout because of automation
Me: Doesn't like self-checkout because I suck at bagging my own groceries
We got some new self checkout machines installed here in a local shop just a month ago.
Dear lord they are a buggy mess. I managed to "brick" one by trying to scan a vegetable that was in a bag, and it scanned the BAG's barcode instead of the sticker that was on the bag. And that caught it in a weird loop where it refused to proceed with the product because it kept saying "Put the product in the bag" and there was no way to cancel it except calling one of the cashiers and having them reset it.
They have to give a traffic ticket to an individual but isn't a corporation considered an individual? Why couldn't they ticket the company? Or is a company only a person when it benefits them and not when it could cost them money?
I think u know the answer to that.
In regards to the self checkout talk at the end, I have not seen a reduction in staff at the registers post Covid. I don't think I have ever, in my life, seen more than 3 man'd registers at any grocery store.
The only difference I've noticed post Covid is that the self checkouts are now half closed now and none of them accept cash anymore.
I have. in fact, several stores opened up more self-checkouts because it costs less than hiring twice their current team sizes to "do the same thing". automation is gonna screw us over if we keep this up.
The problem with saying that China is bad, is that you have to provide a valid argument, and emotionally thinking people are incapable of logic.
As someone who can’t drive I welcome any advancement in driverless tech. That being said we should just make more public transit options for people, being car dependent in a semi rural area fucking sucks. I love my family and don’t want to ask them for rides, and I some of my Uber drivers are MAGA and want to tell you about how Trump is the best. It fucking SUCKS.
The only achievements Musk has made in terms of FSD or robots are the high quality CGI videos.
This year marks the 10th year musk has promised actual full self driving is only months away. There are several Supercuts of the lies being told over and over.
@@hugegamer5988 That was called fraud in the past. What would Elisabeth Holmes say?
Funny thing is, I like driving. Driving is fun! I don’t want a self driving vehicle. I want to keep doing the thing that I find fun.🤷🏼♂️
Controlling the big metal box is a necessary chore for most people.
that's a good point, however that doesn't actually exclude FSD from existing as there will be plenty of people who either don't enjoy driving or aren't great at it (assuming everyone who finds it fun is good at it lol). as much I want you to enjoy yourself, it'd also be nice to not have to worry about not having fun because you've been rear ended by a thousands-pound robot with the intelligence of a toddler.
@@echiko4932 I totally understand that, friend. If you’ve got a long commute and you’re constantly stuck in traffic, that’s not fun at all. Or if you have an uncomfortable, unreliable car.
Fortunately neither of these situations apply to me, hence why I still enjoy driving. Also, I’m 47 and have only had my drivers license for a little over a year, so driving my little sports car is still lots of fun to me🤣
@@summerlovinxx Thank you. I was just expressing my opinion on driving. I get that millions of other people do not share it.
Have a nice day!✨
As a person with bad social anxiety, I never use these things that stop me from pushing myself to do the normal things. I hate the idea of everything allowing me to go completely contactless because even though I hate being anxious, I really hate the idea of what giving in to that anxiety would do.
I do think full self driving is possible in principle. I do not think what we have currently is anything remotely like it. I also don't think it is the solution to any of the actual problems we have with transportation.
All cars will be electric. All cars will not be self driving.
Nah they're developing other options
@@Fang1241Yeah, most cars will be electric, some like a subset of Porsches will use e-fuel, some trucks will use e-fuel or hydrogen (TBD).
@@endintiers porsche is also developing ways to reclaim carbon from the atmosphere and making fuel
i'm really shocked that there's any self driving stuff on public roads...when it was just an idea i figured it would be limited to people moving on private land because there's no way something that isn't super safe would be allowed to control cars and potentially destroy other people and property and since that meant it couldn't evolve over time then the tech gap would be too big to jump. but then...it just...appears here and there? wow...does someone have special friends in the safety regulatory agencies (or are the agencies not really serious...) it seems like a tech company theme though to just break into a "new" space which is just an old space but where the laws weren't written for it. make taxis but don't call them taxis, make hotels but don't call them hotels because it's all personal property outsourced. i guess if we could write really elegant simply laws that captured the essence of what we want (or don't want) loopholes could be minimized...so don't write a law that forbids certain things being done on telegraphs specifically
[i'm kinda shocked that vaping was released and then now there's health concerns. shouldn't it have been the reverse order of events? 😕]
Apple even said that FSD technology does not exist, which is one of the reasons they cancelled their own car program... but for some reason, this is being largely ignored. Considering that the iPhone is probably the most advance commercial technology we have, and it still glitches... why would I want my car to glitch in the same way?
Capitalism allowing tech-bros to use human beings as their crash test dummies.
Your comment makes no sense. Communists didnt use people against their will??
I think FSD can exist, but it needs enough data to be more efficient than humans.
Most car companies are working on it, but Tesla is the only one dumb enough to try without the proper tech.
Cars are just not an efficient solution in densly populated urban areas, regardless whether self-driving or not. I live in Berlin and owning a car is just not necessary here.
If you really, really need one you can have one - but there had been years I haven't even sat in a car because it just wasn't necessary and it wasn't even a conscious choice but something I realized afterwards.
And I don't just refer to the actual metropolitan area but include the outskirts or what we call "the belt of fat" here because "suburbs" would be misleading because it's more of a cluster of interconnected towns and small cities in their own right which are growing more and more together from "organical settlement cores".
Autonomous trains already exist. I could see autonomous boats and planes coming before autonomous cars tbh.
Autonomous planes are pretty much a thing. Autopilot can basically fly and land the plane. It just can't take off by itself.
i will now be carrying a traffic cone with me if i ever walk around sf
16:30 ...As someone who has anxiety and struggled with social skills (But took steps to address it and see a therapist in order to help with it.) it makes me seethe how 'trendy' isolationism is becoming. It's fucking up our ability to communicate and survive as a species and is deteriorating our social skills. My ex wife was a toxic isolationist who disregarded those around her and treated everyone like a nuisance and capitalizing on my issues, made me that way for a long time. She was emotionally abusive and didn't allow me to make friends outside of our relationship or interact with my own family. She'd always brag about whenever she never had to socialize with people and that it was 'the greatest thing ever' and here I am, decades older in my life with autism still struggling to make a real, meaningful friendship. Even offices I'd visit will condescendingly remind me that I can just use their 'online self-help service' when I feel like human communication is just fading away. Fuck this isolationist shit.
Liability should be 50% passenger and 50% the company to deter this demonic trend.
robotaxis by 2023 guys. LOL
This will be flying cars in 2017
They cut the fleet in half? For traffic violations? Is it to warn the other half of self-driving cars to behave?
"Go to your garage, you're grounded"
Bingo! The liability issue is the key! However, don’t underestimate the ability of Elon Musk to pressure and corrupt lawmakers into passing laws that pass liability on to others.
There should be a law that these vehicles should have a driver inside them .. even when they are not actually driving.. just to monitor the situation. I dont understand how there could be this law grey zone at all.
Who wants to drive in a taxi that smells of piss ?
Piss? You think thats the worst kind of smell thats gonna be in there?
Well . . . how I heard someone sell self-driving cars is that, when someone is drunk, it can take the person home, hopefully, without incident. Vaush bringing up answering emails on the way to work gave me such dread. Ugh. Because of American exploitation in the workplace, how much do you guys want to bet that bosses will expect you to be 'productive' on the way to work and also on the way home, if this ever becomes the reality? Bet you, also, they will word it to where you shouldn't be paid for the work en route either. 'We don't have to pay you for work, you weren't physically here. And you have to answer. You want to keep this job, right?' EDIT: wow, injuries/death and violations averted! Police and fire department unable to even tow the damn car if it's in the way. The company picks it up. Private enterprise screwing the rest of us, once again.
If your boss wants you to be productive on the way to work, it means you should be working remotely in the first place. The only chance the US has for getting cars off the road is to fully dive into remote work as the norm.
@@taragnor you do know that remote working is being squashed by employers as we speak, right? Nevermind self driving cars and all, your employer is over reaching when they want you to work more hours than you are compensated for and that won't end until both employees and policy tell them to stop doing that. That's why some European countries, on the books, say that employers CANNOT even phone or email an employee when they are off the clock. They are only to contact those who are on shift in the first place. Something that SHOULD be happening here but doesn't because employers know that they can strongarm people that work for them.
Hypothetically : Someone could rig a car to be an RC car and just jump in the backseat and if pulled over you just say "it's a self driving car" and on you go your merry way with your big RC car
Muppet movies have already been using full sized RC cars, since the 80's. The movie makers rig a full sized car with a remote control, and have the muppet performer hiding in the footwell, while it drives on a closed course.
how are they not getting tickets tho? if my car is wrongly parked without me in it the cop isnt just like 'huh well guess its fine then'
Apparently self driving is the crypto of transportation. A complicated and more expensive solution looking for a problem
While creating a whole new category of problems that needn't exist
I disagree that FSD will never be a thing, it might be another 10 years of development though, wow it sure sucks now.🤣
Imo we're likely crack fusion sooner than self driving cars. And fusion is still "just 30 years away!"
Self-driving taxis have ONE benefit, actually. Drunk chicks won't be sexually harassed/assaulted by drivers.
There are MANY stories of women leaving a bar/party alone in a Uber and, once they're home, they're harassed by the driver, or the driver uses the knowledge of where they live to harass them.
This could be pretty much fixed with women driving the cars, but still.
Not that self-driving cars is a good idea right now, or ever will be. Mapping the roads is too expensive and complicated. There's the question of liability, the trolley problems, and the fact the tech is not ready for actual autonomous driving.