The reload rates are all pretty bogus anyway. 11" to 12" doesn't make such a huge difference. Beyond a certain weight, it doesn't really matter how big or heavy it is.
A year late but finally a reply as to why! the Germans used brass casings for their guns, the British used bags like you commonly see. While the shells would be loaded in a similar manner to each other, slamming a brass casing into a breech is decidedly quicker and easier than gently pushing some bags in. The brass casing helped seal the breech of the gun, but is mostly what contributed to the excellent German rate of fire.
I mean what should they do? As he said, the SMS von der Tann was built to counter the HMS Invincible, so obviously it is better. And I don't think they should artificially make them equal. But naval is broken anyways
What wehranoobs not know is optimal climb speed, not angle🥴. Check AdamTheEnginerd for climb speed and comparison griffin spit VS 109. Griffin has a maasive power drop at around 4600-5200 meter. Supercharger changes. 109s dont have that
He may have connection issues or crashed. Several time I crashed in the middle of the fight and could came back with little damage when I would expect my ship to be dead.
For me.. The SMS Von Der Tann for me have better protection than the North Dakota and IJN Settsu even the IJN Hyuga. I have the Von Der Tann and i tried to 1 vs 1 them and i always win. I can only lose 30-50% of my crew and they just die against me and they make some surprised picachu on fighting me lol. And yes ofcourse i can lose against the Mariya and Poltava. But i killed like 50% to 70% of their crew. It seems like this Von Der Tann have a trolly armor layout.
Instead of implementing nuanced balence differences that are historical, Gaijin just took the stats at face value. Von Der Tann, like all german ships, was tested with higher quality coal, with a specially designated crew, running far lighter than it would in combat. Of course, it would never reach that top speed after it had been comissioned, so it should be fixed. Also, British realoding procedures were much more efficient, so Invincible's reload needs a few seconds shaved off
Im already curios about the later german BC classes like the Derfflinger and the Seydlitz, considering that they had much better survivability, including 300mm belt armor and just ALL of the internal compartments divided by heavy bulkheads.
While not completely incorrect I would say your description of the designed role of battlecruisers is lacking or insufficient and a bit too reductionist. I believe the propagation of this mantra is the reason the classification is attributed more widely than it should be, like for example the people who argue incorrectly that the Alaska is a battlecruiser instead of a large cruiser. Wikipedia gives a decent outline of the designed roles of battlecruisers.
Was in a game with you the other day stug, was a good laugh. It’s ridiculous how much Britain gets given poor stats and overall predated ships compared to other nations. This is evident with other ships such as the dreadnought which was literally the first of its kind, laid down in 1906. Its international counterparts that have been added were built at least 5 years later in an era which naval technology was advancing at an alarming rate. It’s ridiculous that the nation that historically has had the most powerful navy in the world, should suffer so much like this. Take with these two ships, the invincible in real life had a much better reload rate and would put reload the Vdt due to time saving measures and turret design. Not only that but the British 12 inch was much more powerful than the German shell due to its use of richer explosive filler and the regular occurrence overcharging on each salvo. Gaijin needs to buff British naval units across top tier blue water.
Sure the British got the first Dreadnought, but the Japanese initially go the choice between a Pre-Dreadnought and a Semi-Dreadnought. Granted they got a pretty fine looking Dread now, but right at the start... As for the reload rate: That was bought at the cost of removing most or in some cases all of the flash protection and stacking ammo in the turrets, which was exactly the something that was wrong with the "our bloody ships" as Admiral Beaty - the guy who ordered this insanity - put it, being the direct cause of hits to the turrets being able to propagate into the main magazines and destroying several of the British battlecruisers.
The 1st German bb and battlecruiser seemed underwhelming in test range. But I know ill have to get past them for the inevitable Bizmark. I think ill just put it off til then, maybe these ships will be better.
Westfalen and VdT do better against their current competition than Bismarck will do against it's own. Iowa/SoDak, Yamato, KGV/Nelson, and Littorio will be much better than it, while currently Westfalen is the fifth best Dread and VdT is the best Battlecruiser- Or, put into comparison with the Dreads, sixth best.
If Warthunder naval is historically accurate: HMS Invincible has a lead in speed and firepower.. British design emphasize speed over armor . HMS Invincible was fast enough to catch anything smaller and escape anything more powerful. So saying Von Der Tan has a slight lead in speed against its British counterpart is somewhat wrong
HMS Invincible was designed to be faster than Battleships, not Battlecruisers, since at that time it was the only one in existence. Von der Tann was designed specifically to counter Invincible, and it was built a year later and wasn't the first ship of an entire hull class. VdT itself did historically reach figures of 51km/h, so it was actually slightly faster while maintaining high armor; It paid for that in primary firepower, as in real life the Germans didn't have a reload advantage over the British, just the opposite in fact. They had a different armor/firepower mix, but a similar amount of speed, with VdT winning barely.
@@flippedstug9517 Great video by the way, One thing I just want to point out is that Von Der Tann's speed fully fitted is about 46 km/h to 48 km/h. Historically that 51 km/h top speed was only achieve on trials with better coal, was light, the trial grounds where shallow and have specialized crews and propellers. I know that VDT is the response to the Invincible class, a better and well armored ship to it's counter part but I'll say the edge in speed goes to the Invincible.
![HMS Malborough - Expensive But Hard Hitting [War Thunder]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/6DQbm6SPuHw/mqdefault.jpg)
![HMS Malborough - Expensive But Hard Hitting [War Thunder]](/img/tr.png)
![Marat - Russian Bias Much? [War Thunder]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/99xc4eYwjMw/mqdefault.jpg)
![HMS Glorious - 381 mm Guns VS Destroyers and Cruisers [War Thunder]](/img/1.gif)
It's interesting to notice that HMS Hood was the first British Battlecruiser to have thicker armor than Von der Tann.
This is a comparison I've been waiting to see since the update even though it was fairly obvious witch one was better.
i find it so aesthetically pleasing how you show the turrets, that alone earned my sub, and the reviews are great too, love it man
The reload rates are all pretty bogus anyway. 11" to 12" doesn't make such a huge difference. Beyond a certain weight, it doesn't really matter how big or heavy it is.
A year late but finally a reply as to why!
the Germans used brass casings for their guns, the British used bags like you commonly see. While the shells would be loaded in a similar manner to each other, slamming a brass casing into a breech is decidedly quicker and easier than gently pushing some bags in. The brass casing helped seal the breech of the gun, but is mostly what contributed to the excellent German rate of fire.
Ah yes. Perfectly balanced as all things should be
I mean what should they do? As he said, the SMS von der Tann was built to counter the HMS Invincible, so obviously it is better. And I don't think they should artificially make them equal. But naval is broken anyways
_Clears throat:_ *gErMaNy sUfFeRs*
Of course. The weakest faction in the game, especially in naval forces! Gaijin, plz nerf all others!
"some spitfires even outclimb out 109s! unacceptable!"
Tiger 1.0 when?
What wehranoobs not know is optimal climb speed, not angle🥴. Check AdamTheEnginerd for climb speed and comparison griffin spit VS 109. Griffin has a maasive power drop at around 4600-5200 meter. Supercharger changes. 109s dont have that
Italy is really suffering... No Dreadnought or even pre dreadnought still...
Entertaining Video 👌
Yo where da porter go
left da game after i dumped torps cuz fuck dat
He went to hogwarts
He may have connection issues or crashed. Several time I crashed in the middle of the fight and could came back with little damage when I would expect my ship to be dead.
Do you think the Mogador-class destroyer would be introduced in the French naval TT when it comes out?
Probably; The Le Fantasque-class would certainly come at 4.3, likely with Le Terrible as a premium variant, with the Mogador-class being a 4.7.
So they're bringing the French fleet in to warthunder now??
When will that be??
No idea, but I'd guess this year.
@@flippedstug9517 I’d say it has to be, it was one of the countries to have a consistently large navy that doesn’t have one in game
As per always britain lags behind because gaijin hates them...
Nice work!
Damn did I really forget?
point that "counter" in other videos :)
Big brain gaijin balancing
For me.. The SMS Von Der Tann for me have better protection than the North Dakota and IJN Settsu even the IJN Hyuga. I have the Von Der Tann and i tried to 1 vs 1 them and i always win. I can only lose 30-50% of my crew and they just die against me and they make some surprised picachu on fighting me lol.
And yes ofcourse i can lose against the Mariya and Poltava. But i killed like 50% to 70% of their crew. It seems like this Von Der Tann have a trolly armor layout.
Nice comparison, could you make a review on the HMS Dreadnought?
I hope they add the Iron Duke, Queen Elizabeth, Konig and Bayern at some point
SMS Kaiser was added just a day or two ago
Instead of implementing nuanced balence differences that are historical, Gaijin just took the stats at face value. Von Der Tann, like all german ships, was tested with higher quality coal, with a specially designated crew, running far lighter than it would in combat. Of course, it would never reach that top speed after it had been comissioned, so it should be fixed. Also, British realoding procedures were much more efficient, so Invincible's reload needs a few seconds shaved off
British reloading procedures were so efficient the ships blew up
So which is better???
At Jutland, Von Der Tann scored 5 hits on Indefatigable out of 52 shells fired before the Indy blew up.
Thats NOT bad shooting at all.
Im already curios about the later german BC classes like the Derfflinger and the Seydlitz, considering that they had much better survivability, including 300mm belt armor and just ALL of the internal compartments divided by heavy bulkheads.
Von der Tann glad I grinded for it
While not completely incorrect I would say your description of the designed role of battlecruisers is lacking or insufficient and a bit too reductionist. I believe the propagation of this mantra is the reason the classification is attributed more widely than it should be, like for example the people who argue incorrectly that the Alaska is a battlecruiser instead of a large cruiser. Wikipedia gives a decent outline of the designed roles of battlecruisers.
Was in a game with you the other day stug, was a good laugh. It’s ridiculous how much Britain gets given poor stats and overall predated ships compared to other nations. This is evident with other ships such as the dreadnought which was literally the first of its kind, laid down in 1906. Its international counterparts that have been added were built at least 5 years later in an era which naval technology was advancing at an alarming rate. It’s ridiculous that the nation that historically has had the most powerful navy in the world, should suffer so much like this. Take with these two ships, the invincible in real life had a much better reload rate and would put reload the Vdt due to time saving measures and turret design. Not only that but the British 12 inch was much more powerful than the German shell due to its use of richer explosive filler and the regular occurrence overcharging on each salvo. Gaijin needs to buff British naval units across top tier blue water.
Sure the British got the first Dreadnought, but the Japanese initially go the choice between a Pre-Dreadnought and a Semi-Dreadnought.
Granted they got a pretty fine looking Dread now, but right at the start...
As for the reload rate: That was bought at the cost of removing most or in some cases all of the flash protection and stacking ammo in the turrets, which was exactly the something that was wrong with the "our bloody ships" as Admiral Beaty - the guy who ordered this insanity - put it, being the direct cause of hits to the turrets being able to propagate into the main magazines and destroying several of the British battlecruisers.
Review on type 1936A mob with 15cm guns plz. Its very good. One shoted a uss pensecola🥳
there is one category the Invincible beats von ter tan in though
it looks a hell of a lot better
Is there any real reason to play Brittain in naval? i just started and feel like im wasting my time when seeing everything they have be outclassed
To be honest if your good doesn't matter what nation you play the brit dreadnaughts seem to do pretty well in my experience
But you forget; the Invincible is invincible.
The 1st German bb and battlecruiser seemed underwhelming in test range. But I know ill have to get past them for the inevitable Bizmark. I think ill just put it off til then, maybe these ships will be better.
Westfalen and VdT do better against their current competition than Bismarck will do against it's own. Iowa/SoDak, Yamato, KGV/Nelson, and Littorio will be much better than it, while currently Westfalen is the fifth best Dread and VdT is the best Battlecruiser- Or, put into comparison with the Dreads, sixth best.
@@flippedstug9517 How well do you think would the Scharnhorst Klasse do?
Beautiful ship. Can't wait for the other German WW1 BCs.
and there is a 2-3 km pit, where english cant pen german ships and german can...the main belt...greets
If Warthunder naval is historically accurate: HMS Invincible has a lead in speed and firepower.. British design emphasize speed over armor . HMS Invincible was fast enough to catch anything smaller and escape anything more powerful.
So saying Von Der Tan has a slight lead in speed against its British counterpart is somewhat wrong
HMS Invincible was designed to be faster than Battleships, not Battlecruisers, since at that time it was the only one in existence. Von der Tann was designed specifically to counter Invincible, and it was built a year later and wasn't the first ship of an entire hull class. VdT itself did historically reach figures of 51km/h, so it was actually slightly faster while maintaining high armor; It paid for that in primary firepower, as in real life the Germans didn't have a reload advantage over the British, just the opposite in fact. They had a different armor/firepower mix, but a similar amount of speed, with VdT winning barely.
@@flippedstug9517 Great video by the way, One thing I just want to point out is that Von Der Tann's speed fully fitted is about 46 km/h to 48 km/h. Historically that 51 km/h top speed was only achieve on trials with better coal, was light, the trial grounds where shallow and have specialized crews and propellers. I know that VDT is the response to the Invincible class, a better and well armored ship to it's counter part but I'll say the edge in speed goes to the Invincible.
id asume the Invincible goes down to 5.7 next BR changes, and the VdT stays as 6.0
The German v is pronounced as an English f…
Once again, the German ship is *_BETTER_* ... Typical.
"Idk man, seems like Russian bias to me" - Wehraboo
Tbf, VdT was basically intended to counter the Invincible, which was designed to kill cruisers.
I think japan more op than german, but required hands