How Good Could Mickey Mantle Have Been?
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- Опубликовано: 26 сен 2024
- Mickey Mantle is without a doubt one of the greatest baseball players of all time. But as is the case with many greats, injuries, and off-field issues kept him from being even better. In this video, we discuss the career of Mickey Mantle from his early life in Oklahoma to his World Series records to his 500th home run. We also discuss how much better he could have been without the health problems he faced
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Mantle played basically his entire career with a Torn ACL. Something to think about.
I'm 73 years old; Mickey Mantle is, without a doubt, the best ballplayer EVER to put on the uniform. B
Well, I'm 74 years old and, in my opinion, even healthy, he would not have been the player that Willie Mays was.
I agree. He would be my number one pick.
TY Cobb
I know Mickey Mantle never reached his full potential because of injuries and lifestyle. But in my book he will always be the greatest ballplayer I ever saw. In their prime, Mays may have been better defensively but nobody was as exciting as Mickey when it came to offense.
it was rickey henderson for me
@@jaysantos11 I guess it depends on when you were born and who you followed. Rickey was very exciting and was a potent offensive force. He was known for his base stealing and offense. His outfield arm wasn't his strong point. I think if you were around when Mantle was in his prime you'd notice a big difference. When Mantle played, base stealing wasn't a big deal in those days, It started being a big deal when Maury Wills of the Dodgers stole 104 bases in 1962, Mantle was timed at 3.1 seconds from home to first batting lefthanded. That might still be the record. Regardless , you're entitled to your opinion and it was a good choice.
you dont know what you are talking about..
And yet, as a young guy he was an outstanding defender also.
No one was better than Mickey at his best. “He’s got more speed than any slugger and more slug than any speedster” - Casey Stengel
I still remember the first time I heard the Name Mickey Mantle. I was a young boy in the early 60's growing up in rocket city (Cocoa Beach, Fl.). I played sandlot football 365 days a year and had not yet become interested in baseball. I was heading out the front door to go play football and my Dad was watching a baseball game. As I walked past the TV set I watched a center fielder streak into the frame and make a sliding/diving catch. I asked my Dad, Wow who is that? My Dad answered, That's Mickey Mantle and you should have seen him run when he had two good legs! After that I was an instant #7 fan. I truly believe had he not tripped on that sprinkler head he would be viewed as and have the numbers to be called the greatest ball player ever. I would go further and postulate had he not been playing in excruciating pain for so many years that his drinking would not have become so damaging to him either. Yet he never complained or made excuses
I was a massive Mickey Mantle fan growing up, even though I was born over a decade after he last played. I initially thought it was funny that a baseball player had the same name as Mickey Mouse, but the more I read about his life and his career the more I came to respect his life and appreciate his career. I also used him as a reverse role model of sorts and stayed away from alcohol because I saw the way alcohol affected his body. He always said his greatest regret in the game was swinging for the fences so much that he ended up with a career average of .298. Of course it was his luck that his last year came in the Year of the Pitcher of 1968, when his .237/.385/.398 was still good for a 143 OPS+. It helped that he had more walks than hits that year.
There was a Mantle lithograph hanging on my bedroom wall for basically most of my childhood. I was born in the mid 70’s.
His 145 wRC+ in 1968 was good for the 13th best in the league (Tied with Roberto Clemente). Had more efficient evaluation concepts existed then, he could have kept playing. Instead, he unfortunately thought he wasn't good anymore.
The Mick is probably my favorite Yankee of all time. Wish I could have seen him play. Awesome video man keep up the dope work.
Mick had the skills to have been baseball greatest player..
9:30 those World Series records he has will never be broken
@breadandcircuses8127 my bad
My mom knew Mickey, his dad and my grandfather worked together in mines, in Commerce. My aunt was, um, deflowered by Mickey, as were many girls. What is amazing, to me, is he was able to develop into such an amazing athlete in such a small town.
My dad was from NYC and my mom would visit with Mickey and she finally went to a Yankees game. She read magazines while fans got mad this woman wasn't paying attention. My dad said Mom never realized how big a player Mickey was, she just tried get him to stop drinking, Mickeys dad was a drinker. As kids we knew him but that was well as after he retired. My grandpa was proud because he knew him as a little kid.
In my view, Mantle is a top-10 player all-time. His peak is second only to Bonds in the post-integration era. He had 110 fWAR and bWAR in fewer than 10k PAs. Three seasons he had a waaWL% above .555, which is an all-time great season, each time eclipsing 10 WAR. He’s at worst a top-10 hitter, and I have him as the sixth-best. He was so, so, so good already, and had he not torn his ACL and been more mature, I think he could have been the GOAT.
No doubt. He would of been the HR king by a mile.
Post integration, like when blacks started playing?
@@chrislewis5069yes that’s what post integration means
Where do you have plujos... bc here me out first 10 year stats plujos is by far and away the greatest hitter of all time
@@hoppy23
Agreed.
I knew Mantle had issues with his knees. I didn't know it was a torn ACL which I know couldn't be repaired back then. It couldn't be repaired in 1977 either since that is when I tore my ACL and had to live with it. The vicissitudes of life and their downstream effects. I first saw him in Yankee Stadium in 1959 at the age of 5 and was so excited to see him play.
Mantle is GOAT if he did not get hurt early in his career AND did not drink himself to death. If he played 23 healthy years, his numbers are off the chart.
Bone disease from HS football incident and knee/leg thing from incident where DiMaggio didn't yield to Mickey (it was Mantle's ball to catch). Joe was good but, IMO, an A-hole. I agree Mantle plays healthy and his numbers would have been significantly more impressive.
Easily the best baseball player I've ever seen, but I'm only 73.
@breadandcircuses8127 How old are you? Who's the best baseball player you've ever seen?
Well I’m 40 and have watched a decent amount of baseball over the years. Played a bit myself too. And Prime Mantle is the best talent the game has seen. Whether some admit to it or not. 3.1 seconds from home to first base and 500 plus foot home runs while not ever touching weights or SUPPLEMENTS.
Imagine Mickey coming up today with a diet, strength training program, film study and hitting the tightly stitched baseballs of today with the high quality maple bats… Lol! He’d dwarf Shohei’s best shots.
😂😂
Mantle hit more tape measure HRs than anybody that ever played. Forget about the one he hit in Washinton griffith park, their were longer HRs than that one that he hit. Read the book explosion by Mark Gallager about all of Mantles HRs.
The Babe had the most tape measure homeruns. Mickey, along with Jimmy Foxx and Frank Howard were the next three on that list.
That shot Mick hit off Bill Fischer in 1963 off the facade is like something out of The Natural. Game winner and it leaves a lot to the imagination too considering it was still going upward when it struck. I’ve heard other players say the ball almost bounced back to the infield it hit the facade so hard. Lol! Let that sink in.
They didn't start measuring Home Runs until the 1950s. I am sure Ruth hit long ones but they basically guessed.
I remember when he and Roger Maris were challenging each other for home run leader not only on TV but I would listen it on radio During the World Series my junior high school was played on TV in the auditorium in 1961
Love Mantle my favorite player by far .
He was so great but if he had not injured and stayed away from the booze he would have been the greatest that ever played. I seen him play in person at a spring training game back in 1963. I was a big Yankee fan.
My pet theory is that if Lou Gehrig had lived, Mantle would have broken Ruth's home run record. Reasoning: Gehrig, the original Yankee captain, was liked and respected by management and fellow players. He probably plays into the mid forties, then becomes a coach being groomed to be Joe McCarthy's successor. This makes him manager instead of Casey Stengel when Mantle comes up. Which has two major positive effects on Mantle's career. One, Gehrig is much more respected by Joe DiMaggio than Stengel was, Gehrig could have convinced Joe D that there was no shame in playing first base (after all, Gehrig was the best who ever did it). Which means the 1951 World Series injury doesn't happen. Second, much of Mantle's drinking problems stemmed from the fact that Stengel rode him hard. Gehrig is an entirely different personality, I picture his response to Mantle's partying more along the lines of "I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed." which may have been more effective. Your projection of 721 home runs in 1973 sounds about right. Hank Aaron still would have ultimately ended up with the record, and since he wouldn't have gotten there first, the experience probably would have been a lot more pleasant for him. Also, if Mantle breaks Ruth's single season record instead of Roger Maris, Maris probably ends up with a better career, the stress of 1961 took a lot out of him.
This scenario does come at a price for Yankee fans, though. I'm not sure anyone but Casey Stengel sees the potential of a certain awkward-looking young catcher in the late forties.
A LOT of what ifs, but still interesting. I think, though, it unjustly slights eccentric Stengel's contribution.
@@nicholasschroeder3678 Well, no, I just said that Mantle would have been better off. The Yankees as a team may not have been. One, as I said, Yogi Berra might not have gotten an opportunity. Also, Gehrig's managerial style would most likely have resembled McCarthy, which means a set lineup every night, whereas Stengel mastered the art of platooning when he had bad teams, and was better suited to the '50s Yankees personnel. The Yankees had too much talent and resources for Gehrig to not win some World Series, but would he have won seven, especially if he didn't have Berra? That's questionable at best. So if it seems like I've slighted Stengel, that wasn't the intention. Thanks for the feedback.
@@big8dog887 I guess it's hard to really picture Stengel, with his wizened face and warped grammar, as something of a wizard, but I think he was one as a manager. Yeah, his teams were stacked with talent, but you just don't win that many Series without a strong man at the helm. You're right around Berra, and perhaps right about his handling of Mantle. But Gehrig as manager is a total what if: he seems to have all the right qualities, but--ironically in this case--the only HOF quality player who became a great manager that I can think of is Berra. I guess John McGraw was both. Am I missing any? Joe Torre was a very solid player...One last point, and I'm sorry if it seems I'm nitpicking (you make great points and interesting arguments), Ruth would undoubtedly have exceeded 800 home runs had his first 5 years not been spent as a dead ball pitcher. And had he taken better care of himself, 900 isn't unrealistic. On the other hand, he got very lucky in really never suffering injuries. But GOAT athletes are all lucky that way, and in many other ways. Being fat and out of shape didn't hurt his eye/hand or bat speed.
@@nicholasschroeder3678 I found three HOF players who won the World Series as bench (non-playing) managers: Red Schoendienst, Gil Hodges, and Bob Lemon.
As for Ruth, the counter to the "if he hadn't been a pitcher" argument is that, as a hitter he struck out a lot by the standards of the time. Since he was a pitcher early on, this was no big deal, it was to be expected. But if he had come up as an outfielder, this would have been deemed unacceptable, the big swings would have been coached out of him. Which means fewer, not more home runs. With his God-given hand-eye coordination, though, he might have challenged Cobb's hit record.
@@big8dog887 You're a gentleman and a scholar. Merry Christmas⛄️
Mantle was a MAJOR figure in that Golden Era of Baseball. I hated the Yankees but I loved Mantle. NO one hit the ball harder.
In my opinion still a top 10 player of all time even with the injuries
I read Jane Levy's book. I blame DiMaggio for his early knee injury. He was jelous of the kid from Oklahoma, my home state. My grandpa lives in Spavinaw where he was born. Got to see thehouse before the tore it down.
DiMaggio was known to be a private person and relatively uncommunicative. He was cordial to Mantle but not close. While DiMaggio respected Mantle's playing ability, he did not respect how Mantle failed to take care of himself and squandered some of his talents.
Mantle, like Foxx, Joe D and Gehrig didn't play long enough to pile up the career totals like Mays, Aaron, Pujols. But when you measure how effective he was in the Plate Apperances he had he was among the top 5 of all time. This effective measure of how much a player contributed to wins and runs is a far better way to compare players. All time, Mantle took far fewer Plate Apperances (PA) in his career to generate wins, runs and total bases than either Mays or Aaron. So while injuries kepts his career short (retired at age 36) and his career totals low, he was among the top 5 players of all time in terms of his offensive effectiveness at the Plate. Meaning, it took him far fewer plate appearances than say Mays or Aaron to contribute to a teams runs, wins, or generate total bases (the basics of baseball). These are his career rankings (among retired players), fewest PA per Situational Wins (4th), fewest PA per Adjusted Batting Runs (6th), fewest PA per Bases Out Runs Added (5th), fewest PA per Runs Created (7th), fewest PA per Total Bases+Walks (7th), fewest PA to generate 1 Offensive WAR (5th), and fewest PA per Wins Probability (4). Mantle's rankings in these categories is the real measure of his greatness and how much he contributed when he cam to bat. He was one of the greatest 5-7 hitters of all time. Only Ruth, Williams, Gehrig, Bonds, Hornsby, and Foxx where his equal or better in some of these categories.
I remember watching Monday night baseball with Tony Kubek and Howard Cosell. The game was in Detroit . Kubeck told Cosell that if Mantle played his home games here instead of Yankee Stadium he would have hit one thousand home runs. Cosell said you have to be kidding and Kubeck replied I am dead serious.
Kubek is wrong. Mantle hit 266 at home and 277 away. About even. Yankee Stadium didn’t hurt his totals because he usually batted left handed and Yankee Stadium is friendly to power hitters who hit lefty.
Mickey Mantle not only was the greatest switch hitter but I'd put him ahead of Willie Mays in terms of the greatest player ever. Mays was an overall better fielder but Mantle wasn't bad either. His speed is unequaled. Mickey's arm was better than Mays, too so, other than the power angle, yeah, Mickey Mantle was an overall better player than Willie Mays.
@@syourke3 Mantle hit so many HRs to left and right center at the stadium, not too many pulled down the lines..I saw him clear the batters eye in CF at the 461 FT sign, 502 FT measured.
@@johnsrous1616 I'm sorry, I absolutely disagree. Here are numbers that support my opinion. For beginners,compare the peak seasons of Mantle and Mays. Frankly, there's no comparison. Mays led the NL in homers 4 times and led the NL in stolen bases 4 times. Mays had a WAR over 10, 6 times. From 1954-1966, his WAR was the best in MLB, at 124.1, followed by Aaron at 96.4, and Mantle at 90.0. Mantle and Gehrig combined had 5. He had 6 seasons of 40 or more homers, throughout his career, he led the league in Hits, Runs, Homers, Triples, Stolen Bases, Average, On Base Pct, Slugging, Total Bases, and Walks. He also won 12 Gold Gloves (in the first 7 years of his career there was no Gold Glove award). In 1957, he became the first player to have 20 or more in each of these categories, when he racked up 26 doubles, 20 triples, 35 homers, and 38 stolen bases. His .407 on-base percentage and .626 slugging percentage that season. His career numbers are unmatchable, and because of being drafted into the Army, he played in only 34 games in '52 and missed the entire '53 season. I was lucky enough to watch Mays in over 200 games at Seals Stadium and Candlestick Park while growing up. Nobody enjoyed baseball as much as him, and in my mind, nobody played the game as well as he did. Much has been said about Mantle homering while having a hangover. When Mays hit 4-homers against the Braves in one game, he was sick from food poisoning from the night before.
The thing is Mickey never was 100 percent in his prime, he blew out his knee in his rookie year, and what rookie is fully formed? He played the rest of his career probably 60-80 percent of what he could've been. Still great.
The Dodgers won the World Series in 1955. The Yankees won in 1956
i grew up in the 60's and as far as i was concerned, and with the kids on my block, Mickey Mantle was the greatest. i was a devout fan during his last years, and pinned my hopes of a continued Yankee dynasty on Bobby Murcer. but it didnt materialize - it must have been tough on Bobby that people expected him to be the "new Mantle", just as it was for Mantle to be the "new Dimaggio". it was an amazing time to watch Boog Powell, Harmon Killebrew, Frank Howard, Al Kaline - and, Mantle topped them all. my yankee and baseball fandom ended with Thurman Munson's passing. somehow, the game to me was never the same.
He was an amazing player despite all the injuries he suffered throughout his career. IMHO - his ACL injury in 1951 permanently altered his career and greatly hindered his production - which makes his career after even more remarkable. He was unfairly treated by the media during his career and he never seemed to understand why he was a god to so many, as he just viewed himself as just another guy. Super heartbreaking to see him at the end of his life, telling everyone he wasn’t a role model.
Also his shoulder injury in 1959. He couldn't hit left handed anymore but refused to quit switch hitting
I TOTALLY agree!!! 👍
That ACL injury was the fault of Joe D. He should have called for the ball early and Mickey would have pulled up. And Joe was a 1st class jerk as well.
@@davidroman1654 AGREE! 👍
Good morning ....saw the Mick play many times at the old yankee stadium....he was brilliant but he did not take care of himself and he knew it....strong unbelievably strong........where did he get the nick name "THE MICK"From??? After the 1952 world series it came from Jackie ROBINSON...Mickey was one of the greatest of the greatest....number 7 Mickey Mantle
Man I wish I could go back in time and watch that shot Mick hit in 1963 off Bill Fischer off the right field facade. Had to have been one of the most majestic shots in history. Game winner too. A lot of legendary power hitters hit in that old Yankee stadium but none matched that shot. Mickey did that kind of stuff without a strength training regiment or *supplements* of any kind. The REAL life Natural.
Rest In Heaven #7
@@jimclaus1576 saw that shot off of Bill Fischer on WPIX CHANNEL 11..THE announcer was the scooter....he said "HOLY COW!!".Peace my brorher Jim
In a way, mantle is as Butkus in the nfl. They rarely played without nagging or worse injuries. However, game after game they gave everything they had and that everything they had was well above everybody else for the most part.
Mickey Mantle was special. I am thankful that I was able to see him play.
If Mantle ran to first base at 3.1 seconds he's a whole second faster than the fastest MLB player today Elly De La Cruz clocked at 4.1 seconds.
The fact that the fastest man in the game today is 4.1 should be a red flag. There is more to that story than you have been told.
He was quit the drinker,had lots of injuries,but he could knock the cover off the ball! My favorite!
succeeding in nyc is tough but the mick did it
Mantle may not be the greatest baseball player of all time, but he may well be the most beloved baseball player of all time.
He was both!!! 😮
Very nice work on the video
If Mickey hadn't been convinced he'd die young, took better care of himself and hadn't drank so much, he might have topped Babe Ruth in home runs.
Mantle led 'both leagues' in every category when he won the triple crown.
Take away the knee issues and booze, we will never know but is still the best what if argument in baseball history
Mantle was extremely popular and well known in NYC even before his Triple Crown year of 1956. In 1953, at age 21, after only two years in the majors, he was a mystery guest on What's My Line, "mystery" meaning the panel had to wear masks while attempting to guess his profession, otherwise they would easily recognize him.
Mickey Mantle should have won that 1958 MVP, beat him in every statistical category except for rbis, due to Mantle being walked more than anybody. Oh by the way, the Yankees won the WS that year while the Red Sox finished 3rd. If he would have stayed healthy, and stayed away from the alcohol and the fast life in NYC, then you're looking at a 700 hr/ 500 sb guy with those 7 rings, so yea, GOAT easily. I would compare Mantle with Mays because they both entered the league in 1951 and they were both centerfielders. But if you cut off Mays last 4 or 5 seasons and end his career after the 1968 season which is when Mantle ended his career, Mays still has better numbers. So even if Mays's career was over after the 1968 season, Mays still has more home runs, rbi. hits, runs, sb, and average than Mantle (including missing 2 seasons due to military service). Mantle should have had at least 4 more years or playing, but the injuries really hurt his longevity. Mantle had the greatest raw talent to ever enter the league, (faster and stronger than anyone) and achieved more team success. He definitely got walked more, due to the lack of protection. On a side note, doesn't Christian McCaffrey look a little like a young Mantle. While growing up on the farm when he was a kid, Mantle's father threw right handed to him while he hit left handed, and Mantle's uncle threw to him left handed while he hit right handed.
I am 81 yrs old, played little league several years, and American Legion ball for 2 years, batted against some who were pros a year or two later. Naturally, I saw the great Mick play many games. Without any doubt at all, he WAS the best SWITCH HITTER EVER, to date. He could have been even better, especially in running bases and working in the outfield, IF he hadn't injured his leg, which he suffered with for so long. Too, he could have been better, had he not become so much a friend with Billy Martin. I read that Mickey's dad taught him to be a switch hitter, by pitching to him right handed, while Mick batted right, and his grandfather pitching to him left handed, while Mick batted left hand. Resulting in the best switch hitter to date. Mick said he thought he was born to play baseball. With a father like he had, training him since being a little boy, I can understand why he would have said something like that. Late in life, Mick said that had he known everything he now knew, that he would not have done all the drinking, partying, etc., with his best friend, Billy Martin. I think that Mickey was so excited and happy to play baseball, which he truly loved, for money, and so young, that he was just vulnerable to somebody like Billy Martin, being such a good friend with him. With some of us, things look differently as we age, and review in our minds our life choices.
He's the greatest all around athlete to ever play the game. Basically Bo Jackson but with a lot more baseball skills. In the 50s. I really don't think you need a what if scenario to appreciate him. It's just too bad he couldn't see that himself and kept battling all those demons.
Now that you bring him up, how great could Bo have been if he wasn't injured?
His alcoholism negated a lot of that. But he could have benefited from better knee surgery nowadays too.
Correction: The Yankees did not win the 1955 World Series. That was the Brooklyn Dodgers, their first and only World Series that they would win while based in Brooklyn. I think you had confused 1951-1953 (Since he was involved in the 1951 World Series before his injury) with 1952-2953, 1955.
best short doc on THE MICK! on the You tubey
I say the same thing about
Bobby Orr as well.
Image if Mantle and Orr where
100% healthy. Out of both career's
Orr had one season of full health
And mantle got hurt at 19.
It's amazing you can still make
A case that they are still the Greatest players of all time
In there respected sport.
Mickey was the most exciting power hitter of his era. Even in his declining years, he was still capable of slugging a monster shot, and that anticipation was always present every time he stepped up to the plate. How good might he have been? As it was, in my book, he was good enough.
Mantle was more than good enough.
I think a video of the same kind about Sandy Koufax could be very interesting, if he didn't have his injuries, he could well have exceeded 400 strikeouts in a season or have more no hitters or even more than one perfect game !
he was the G.O.A.T. no doubt. my lifetime hero
Met him twice besides being a great great player he was so humble incredible humble person.
mickey mantle is the best alot of people fail to recognize this
I grew up watching 80s and 90s baseball and Griffey was always my favorite player and although I never got to see Mantle play he was the only player in my opinion as talented as Jr. Both careers cut short and both would have hit 800 homers easy!
Mick was and still is my idol. I managed to buy a 1961 Topps baseball card of him, as well as a 1958 Roger Maris Rookie card and a few other momentos of those two that I will keep until I die. Baseball will never be like it was in those days....I hate the Yankees, but man those Murderers Row guys, and the M&M boys, with Mr. Ford the Chairman, Boyer and all those guys, what a team back then.
I've always thought he was only slightly lesser a player than Mays, not quite as good a CF. May's power was less spectacular but 660 is 660. And Mays was a little smarter. A writer for the SF Chronicle the length of his time in San Francisco said he never saw Mays make an incorrect play. Only player I definitely put ahead of Mays is Ruth, pretty much because of Ruth's pitching.
It's really hard to do these ratings. Where do you rank a Williams, maybe "the Greatest hitter who ever lived" but except for playing the Monster a suck fielder? Pitchers vs. position players. Guys who missed time due to WWII. Short careers (thinking of the guy at the beginning of this clip). The only thing I know for sure is that Joe DiMaggio was never "the greatest living baseball player" (he insisted on being introduced as that).
And Mays basically missed two seasons due to the Korean Conflict, and we know that Ted Williams missed around five years because of military duty. So 660 probably would have been 720ish if not for war. And yes, the guy you would compare Mantle with is Mays because they both entered the league in 1951 and they were both centerfielders. But if you cut off Mays last 4 or 5 seasons and end his career after the 1968 season which is when Mantle ended his career, Mays still has better numbers. So even if Mays's career was over after the 1968 season, Mays still has more home runs, rbi. hits, runs, sb, and average than Mantle (including missing 2 seasons due to military service). Mantle should have had at least 4 more years or playing, but the injuries really hurt his longevity. Mantle had the greatest raw talent to ever enter the league, and achieved more team success. He definitely got walked more, due to the lack of protection.
I think Joe DiMaggio was was a better all around player than Williams, but Williams obviously being a better hitter. But we know DiMaggio missed three season due to military service as well. DiMaggio also was on the better team playing with Gehrig three seasons and Mantle one season. The Yankees won a world series in 1943 without DiMaggio.
Exactly. How good could have been? He could have been the greatest on a team with less boozers.
Best switch hitter ever but the 1968 season brought down his lifetime batting average below 0.300
Not to mention , at 5'11" and 180 lbs he hit longer home runs than all the modern giants .
In my view, he is my all time favorite player!!!!
The statement, _'..he is my all time favorite player!!!!'_ suffices i.e., it stands on its own as it renders the preface, _'In my view'_ superfluously evident
Read the chapter on Mantle in Joe Pepitone's
"Joe You Could a made us Proud"
I watched Mickey Mantle once, at the 1967 All-Star game at Anaheim Stadium, in the twilight of his career. A year later I had a MM Little League bat, which I still have. MM had an aura as he strode to the plate at the Bog-A. That was the longest All-Star game ever, 15 innings, 2-1 NL. Factoid: There's a 5.8 rated rock climb named Mickey Mantle at Tahquitz Rock/Suicide Rock near Idyllwild, CA which has 3 mantle moves on the first pitch.
Without the 1951 injury, he may have served time in the military, so his homerun total may not have made him the second member of the 700 club. However, it would lead to the possibility that both he and Maris would have 61 or more homeruns in 1961 (he was injured that year and still would up with 54), and he still could have reached the 650 homerun mark. It is amazing to think of what someone that great could have done if healthy for his entire career.
His biggest problem by far was the bottle. Just look at the history of known alcoholics. Their skills are eroded between age 32 - 33 they are not productive it their late 30's. Had he not left the bottle alone, 650 homeruns were in reach for him.
Not to rain on the Mick parade, but Ruth very likely would have had 800+ homers had he not spent his early 20s as a pitcher in the dead ball era. That said, the guy did not take good care of himself either, but he got lucky in not having any serious injuries, and was just one of those fat guys you see from time to time with fantastic natural strength and hand/eye. Unique...The choice of Mozart's 40th is kinda bizarre.
There are 5 guys who could have had 800 hrs if not for the what ifs.
1. Ruth had he not been a pitcher and just being an outfielder.
2. Pujos if he just stayed a Cardinal in St. Louis and not been a .255 hitter with the Angels
3. Griffey Jr. had he not gotten hurt with injuries and stayed in Seattle.
4. Alex Rodriguez had he not been suspended 211 games and then not being picked up.
5. Bonds if he didn't get injured in 2005 and missing time due to 94/95 strike stoppages.
Mays would have been the 2nd home run king had he not miss almost two seasons due to military duty.
@@flame-sky7148 Ted Williams missed 2 yrs in WW2 and another in the Korean War.
@@ricardocortese3838 yea I knew that long time ago, probably two decades ago. He would have had over 600 plus homers and 3000 plus hits.
The Dodgers won the World Series in 1955
If Mantle had played during this era with advanced, less invasive knee surgery, he might have ended up with 700 home runs
I saw him play live. He was the Greatest ever!
Had Mickey not of had the injuries, took better care of himself, and stopped whorin around, he could of easily hit 100 more home runs
More like 200
2:41 -- Imagine if his dad didn't go all tough love on him and Mantle did decide to quit and never look back? Never mind baseball, how much different would the baseball CARD hobby be without Mantle? I mean Mickey has always been the top dog of the hobby pretty much since the beginning, especially his iconic 1952 Topps (which contrary to popular belief is NOT his rookie card; that in fact is his 1951 Bowman)?
After losing Mutt in 1953 Casey Stengel became a father figure for him but Casey could drink even more than The Mick. When Stengel published his personal All Star Team he omitted Mantle, from whom he had great expectations but ended up being his biggest disappointment.
Thank you for acknowledging sports existed before 1970. Most people don't.
I ask the same question in regards to Darryl Strawberry about how good he would have been if it had not been for his substance abuse issues.
That 20-time All Star stuff needs context. From 1959 through 1963, the All-Star Game was a double-header. For some weird reason, baseball insists on counting them separately. Reduce his totals accordingly.
I still think Babe Ruth is the greatest ever and probably will always be the G.O.A.T. but strong cases can be made for Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle. Throw in the " What If " factor and all these guys are even better.
I love Mantle, and when I was a kid, I was one of my heroes, even though I hated the Yankees. But to speculate on what might have been is pointless. What might Mays have accomplished or Ted Williams had they not lost their prime years through military service? Also, I think it's pretty clear that Mays was a better defensive player than either Mantle or Williams. Still, Mantle was, in spite of his injuries and lifestyle, one of the greatest players of all time, but maybe not the greatest.
I remember watching him when he first came up In 1951. Saw him many times growing up. They talk about these 400 plus hrs. Nothing compared to what he did.
Imagine the numbers he could have put up if he played on two healthy legs.
I heard Mantle had hit a baseball out the Yankee stadium during practice.
Wonderful video. I love the Mick. One error: the New York Yankees did not win the 1955 World Series. The Brooklyn Dodgers did.
Mickey Mantle does take over for Joe DiMaggio
If Mantle had two good legs and took care of himself, he would have been the greatest player ever. Inspite of all his physical problems, he’s still one of the greatest ever to play the game.
Alcohol ruins more than it helps
Remember, he hit the ball out of Old Yankee Stadium. Ball parks today would fit inside that outfield.
5:07 The Yankees did not win the World Series in 1955
In todays game he’s the best baseball athlete to ever play the game
What if Bonds were the injured alcoholic and Mantle was using steroids?
The Mick was a superstar. With a little more care of himself he would have put numbers better than no one else. But the same goes with Babe Ruth, I guess.
He retired at 36 years old, losing at least 4 or 5 seasons at the end of his career. The injuries and his drinking cost his lifetime totals dearly. Would he have hit 700 homeruns and challenged Ruth's mark? Probably not but we will never know.
Had he left the bottle alone , 650 homerun 's was well with in reach, inspired of the injury. Had he stayed healthy, he could have lost two years to the draft. The history of alcoholic is that they don't age well, 32 -33 they are usually done, or just hanging on because of their name.
At his best, there aren't five people who were better than Mickey Mantle. On top of that, Willie Mays wasn't even better than Mantle. For starters, Mays was horrible in the playoffs. Mantle is probably the greatest centerfielder in postseason history. Second, would you rather have 10 years of a A player, or seven years of an A+ player? I'll take the high peak.
Mays's 156.2 Wins Above Replacement rank fifth all time. He had six 10-WAR seasons, tied for second all time. Mantle had three 10-War seasons. By the way, Mays missed two years of his prime due to military duty, his numbers would have been even better.
@flame-sky7148 Maybe, we don't know. And you still haven't addressed the point that Mays was terrible in the playoffs, while Mantle was anything but. In fact, the only reason they named the World Series MVP after him is because he is the right color. And no matter how you slice it, at his best Mays was NEVER as good as Mantle. Mantle has three of the greatest seasons in history, and they are better than anyone not named Wagner, Ruth or PED Bonds.
Lol your funny. He did make that famous catch in the World Series. By the way Mays did have 12 Gold Gloves and over 300 stolen bases. It’s harder to get to the post season when you regularly have to face Spahn, Gibson, Koufax, Drysdale and later in your career, Seaver, Jenkins and Carlton. Mantle didn’t even have to face that or even the best pitcher in his league because he was on his team, Ford. Perhaps Mantle was the right skin tone, too bad for Mays.
@@flame-sky7148 Yeah, again that one catch doesn't discount he was a .230 playoff hitter with (I think one home run). And the 12 Gold Gloves are effectively meaningless for the time. You went by WAR, now you're changing it to accolades.
@@Mr.MikeBarksdale well after you have your at bats, one must play defense, as it’s part of the game. It’s not just offense, offense offense. I will take 660 hrs over 536. Mantle should have taken better care of himself then you would be talking about many more A+ seasons than the ones he had. You try and just limit the argument to postseason. That’s like saying what did Mike Trout do or Ted Williams do in the postseason. It takes a team to win it all. It takes chemistry, pitching and timely hitting. I will only agree that the WS MVP trophy should be named after Mantle. Although the All Star MVP should be named after Mays, because he had 24 appearances, many more A+ seasons.
The M&M boys: Mantle & Mozart.
the greatest EVER
In july 17 th 1961 against baltmore maris and mantle both hit homers after the 5fh inning it rained that plus mantle hit the foul pool now that is called the fair pool.in short maris should be crited with 62 homers and mantle with 56 homers maris and mantles july stats should be corrected.
Referencing the 5:00 mark of your video. The Yankees absolutely did not win the 1955 World Series. That was the Brooklyn Dodgers.
Greatest switch hitter ever not the GOAT that goes to Willie Mays but I got the Mick 2nd
Mickey was great. HIs injuries and drinking were awful. But Willie Mays remains the most talented baseball player ever. Babe Ruth was the most dominant. Ted Williams was the best hitter. Tony Gwynn was the other best hitter. Mickey was a very old 36 when he retired. If he'd kept healthy and had a post-35 run like Aaron, he would be on baseball's Mount Rushmore.
It's not possible for Mantle to have been better, but he definitely could have had a longer prime.
Kubek said he hit 20 balls every year 450 feet that were just caught, not even reaching the warning track
Mantle wll always be the greatest what if? If he hadneverbeen injured if he had not wound up in new york where his manager never saw a bar stool he didnt like if he had landed in say st louis where he would have had a normal ball park to hit in and of course the main if had he realized what talent he had and taken care of himself like the superstars of his era did mays aaron kaline musial
Could have been? He was still one of the top ten players all time in the major leagues, and the greatest switchitter as well. He overcame numerous serious injuries and a bone disease of the legs, a severe hip absess to hit 536 home runs, a Triple Crown in 1956, and a .297 lifetime BA. You can have been any better than what Mickey was, he didn't need to improve on anything.
My dads fav player
Imagine if he some surgeries and a lil juice…
He has crazy numbers without.