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It's the ability to rebuild with tokens that often poses the problem. I was happily casting my high mana value stuff and all these small parts are building or rebuilding in this tsunami of value.

We found Bello was hampered by the lack of evasion. In one match, he could not get anything through because of the sea of tokens that formed from the offspring and squirrels etc. I play quite often against Chatterfang and it's less about dealing with tokens but having to deal with how quickly the tokens can be rebuilt. But definetly agree, certain commanders and game plans draw mediate attention from players with good threat assessment or knowledge of the deck.

@@mtgspecs a good removal spell will certainly help you out with Bello. Also, continuously hating him to the point that he is so expensive you can't bring amount helps as well.

Awesome! The feeling when you find the one. How is it working against removal?

@@mtgspecs were the deck that has so much in the way of removal and aura recursion? I don't really worry about removal so much. Because, usually nobody has enough removal in casual.

Many thanks! That's an important detail and I'm glad you mentioned it because it reminds me to include those rule nuggets in my videos. Love the support!

Saheeli is a good shout and has reminded me that Shaun, Father of Synths exists. Glad this helped, trying out a new, quicker way of delivering deck techs to go with the more edited ones I produce.

⁠@@mtgspecsI forgot Shaun too, that’s a good one. I pulled a mockingbird as well but I’m still not sure how good it actually is

@@ryanwood4263 I took it out because of the X in the cost so it's not blinkable/recurrable and scales wierdly with the game - other clones can copy high mana value stuff for usually 4 mana and this requires an investment of X and then with offspring on top of that, well, I put it back in the binder.

Satya makes tokens as well but you may need to swing multiple times to get enough energy to keep something

@@ryanwood4263 an energy based Zinnia would be amazing - a guy I play Spell table with uses Guide of Souls in his list and I have a spare copy so may find room for it because if goes nuts in that deck.

Thank you! The cards I removed are in the sideboard of the deck list, although that only shows 14 - the original deck had 38 lands and my list has 37 so it'll be one of those! Good spot!

@@mtgspecs Thanks again :) excited to try out the deck!!

I hear you! 😂. I think he gets a pass because of how I've built it; it's in a different class to Edgar, the win rate is so-so. I'm just doing dumb stuff with changelings and lords. I watched someone play it with dragons the other day - jeez, it certainly can be a busted build, I'm too busy trying to get a win with Ramses, Assassin Lord 🙏.

@@mtgspecs That makes sense! You really have to drag down those Eminence commanders to keep them from being oppressive. Such a broken mechanic! Look how fast they banned/altered rules for companions. And Eminence is in some ways stronger. If you couldn't tell, I think Eminence and cards like Yuriko are fundamentally at odds with the format. They break the rules at the most core level.

Absolutely right, love a suboptimal build as it is (not sure anyone has forgiven me for my suboptimal build for Nadu..... Cursed video ha). I've put my time in with high power and I still have three I'd call HP on retainer for when everyone is bringing the spice. Recently a returning guest on Erinus TV's twitch and that comes with building to a budget which mean ejecting the overpriced staples for creative solutions. And Yuriko, well, I had that deck for a second but soon tired of how it made others feel and now it's Marvo 8 mana value with top deck shenanigans and it's way better received.

Thank you, I appreciate the kind words. Changes to where I live and my working pattern means I'm now the guy in the video who can't get to game knight as often as he would like and we recently had an evening where my wacky, experimental decks got stomped by high power and it was pretty disheartning. But I realise it wasn't about power level, it was about not communicating beforehand or bringing, as you say, a range of different power level decks.

I had no idea it had gone up in price so much. It's £85 as apposed to the £35 for the others. Quite shocked by that.

@@mtgspecs I never found it that low even at release. It was already close to 80€. Such a shame...

Many thanks! It's such an interesting archetype to pilot but so tricky to do well, which I think is a plus - it's a very unique experience and quite fulfilling! Happy to have helped.

I like how you are using other precons to create the deck, I had a video about doing this with Ashad. So many gather dust, with so much potential. Let me know how it plays.

@@mtgspecs I'll tell you right now my opinion about virtual valor. The commander really wasn't any good, neither was the backup. In the end... It was too unreliable. After a few wipes, your creatures were sent back into the Stone age. That is why I think Voltron is probably much better. Because, even if your auras are no longer available, you have artifacts still

@@mtgspecs people always talk about combining science and creative energy? The problem with that idea is that they utilize energy for different strategies. Science uses it for various means, like card draw. Meanwhile, creative energy is all about creating copies of creatures and using energy for payoffs specifically. Actually, what I did with those two, I took all the energy artifacts from creative energy and put them in science. Which, I think works really well. Now this deck, the thing people got to realize is that Scrappy survivors is all about Preston. It is all about Preston giving settlements to all those lands. This will in turn feed all that glitters. Basically, the same strategy utilized by virtue and valor. To that end, I brought virtue and valor's face commander over as one of the 99. The win condition for this remastered deck as I call it is colossification. Once certain pieces are on the field, it'll protect my creature and let me Commander damage everyone out of the game.

@@unanon_user totally a rule 0 conversation you can have with players - I think the first time someone does something overly busted with it, you'll be told no and thank you though 😂. I initially made a Colonel Autumn and Alistair the Brigadier deck and it was so ridiculous I retired it before even playing it.

@@unanon_user to be fair, I have had my butt handed to me by this deck a few times. My issue is a tale as old as time; it's very voltron but not optimised for that style of play. They do great stuff to mitigate the card disadvantage that auras bring and the mana investment of equipment but overall, I never returned to the precon with the same sort of enthusiasm I have for Mothman or my boy, Liberty Prime.

@@mtgspecs if I didn't know any better, I could swear the people who designed this deck or thinking about virtue and valor. Because those settlement tokens are considered auras. You are right though. But I think that's because not enough of the creatures focus on both oras and equipment or either one. Me personally? If I were going to upgrade it. I would probably do myself a favor and get rid of six creatures, counting Preston. I don't like dealing with these token aura headaches that acts like virtue and valor usually give me. My solution? Throwing in a lovely little mana dork called sanctum Weaver and chromatic lantern. Not keeping track of so much will make things so much more fun. The next thing to go are those vault and bobblehead cards. The lantern would take the place of one and I would probably add the fellwar stone for the other one. I'm replacing the blood Forged Battle axe and brass knuckles with sword of vengeance and kaldra compleat. Any auras I remove will be replaced by the ones from virtue and valor for sure. There's some really good ones there that are worth considering. The face Commander stays where he is. For one, I like him and other, he does a lot of work. Always creating junk tokens. Especially if my opponents keep going after my card draw. That is my upgrade path for Scrappy survivors. Of course, I do plan on tackling the mana base. Talking about needing a lot of work..., but I would think that's quite obvious. Among the lands that would end up on the chopping block is junktown. I really have no need whatsoever for sacrifice lands at all. Especially since it only produces colorless mana. I would add guild lands and as many of the snarl lands as possible. I would also add in more filter lands. That is if I wanted to bother with this deck ever again. But more than likely, I wouldn't. Because it would require far too much work. I want my next deck purchase to be something that requires as little work as possible

I feel that the deck gives you ample time to get Archetype onto the board, control is the great equaliser. I'm a fan of one card effecting more than one thing. Thanks for the updates. The deck is on the part of my shelf where I put decks that need attention so. It's helping me out.

@@mtgspecs I hate artifacts and enchantments that give hex proof. Because, ordinarily you really can't do anything about them being removed. That's it. But the archetype of endurance affects every single creature. Throwing something like shalai who gives you and planeswalkers hexproof and you have something really awesome. Additionally, I added a chromatic lantern and ashaya, soul of the wild. Turning every creature I have into Amana rock. I am a huge fan of this strategy. Also got mana reflection in there. I am going to be producing asinine levels of mana. Believe me, if I had the room? I would have added everflowing chalice. 🤣

@@mtgspecs but honestly? If you are going to use artifacts I give you hex proof? Just use the mirror shield instead, it is far superior to the swift foot boots. It gives you protection against death touch. The problem with giving everything hexproof is that a board wipe will take care of it. But the way I figured, if your stuff isn't too threatening? You probably will be fine.

Yeah, agreed. I remember playing it during the game and thinking, how does this help me at all? Definetly a misplay, should have waited for a different board state.

Woah, your opponents have respect for the power of Hazel clearly. Is this your playgroup or random players? It becomes a meta call then; I played Hazel on stream the other day against the other precons and she only got taken out once. There is some consideration of when to cast a commander; I've talked about commanders being a one off sorcery in the zone, where you have to carefully time it's casting - hope you get Hazel to stick!

@@mtgspecs It's just a friend playgroup. They are terrified of her ramp so Swiftfoot Boots are probably in order to give her haste and hexproof. Mainly they've been trying to make sure I can't use the tap. It's two blue decks and a red with a lot of removal so figuring a safe cast time has been a challenge.

@@Raven1024 that's a tough pod. Any thoughts on switching to lots of refundancy for the deck? Cryptolith Rite, Elven Chorus, Jaheira, Inspiring Statuary, Krark Clan Ironworks - all can produce insane mana with the right tokens. Then Hazel has back up. Or you go Saryth the Vipers Fang, spells like Malakir Rebirth, Veil of Summer and go in on protection. I prefer the former as taking up slots with protection can dilute the rest of the deck. The first part supports your goals.

Good shout.

I would hazard a guess that it's a Universes Beyond issue; maybe a step to far for some people to include them. However, we have a Tetzin in our playgroup that uses Transformers and it's amazing.

That's AWESOME. This is new information. Just another reason why the upgrade guide ended 30 seconds after it started 😉 Cheers for the info.

Chatterfang, Slimefoot, Ghave what is it with GBx token commanders going infinite with no effort?

@@MF_Dicedealer ha yeah! It's not my preferred way of winning. We have someone in our play group who was rocking an infinite and we made sure to say, 'that's fine but don't expect us to be impressed' haha

I think overall he's a meh, it's entry level stuff really, and you are spot on, without him, you are left with a bunch of artifacts and enchantments, which is why I talk about token making cards which give you a board when he's not in play or it's an opponents turn. However, I play as much of the decks as I can before I post about them; the turns you get with him in play and with the right artifacts/enchantments are insane - definetly casual, definitely low power but brain off smash and bash stuff.

@@mtgspecs Thanks! I have another question about old precon. Grand Larceny. Is he worth upgrade? Like he's really good after upgrade compare to other high tier deck or he's just fun to play deck.

You will definitely be doing a lot of work to keep him alive. Me personally? I would suggest adding something like archetype of endurance for absolute hexproofing. By the time you put the commander out on the field, you'll have enough mana to bring out archetype of endurance anyway. You also have to be very cheesy about what you add to his deck. Remember that Bello resets the power and toughness of any creature or vehicle within its requirements to four. So, it could do a lot of leg work? But, you're going to be doing quite a lot of it yourself as far as imagining your deck, building it right. With a few fine adjustments, the mana base for animated army will be worth using.

Yeah, I'd never go into a game where I would be exclusively want to help others, gotta have some winning strategy. Even my weaker builds (I have one built around skeleton and skull art) have a plan. Same with group hug. It's the deal making for me - I'll scratch your back sorta stuff. Bang on about the doubling stuff. A card that's getting a lot of attention because of this is 'On the trail' from Deep Clue Sea and ramps you as you draw a second card. Thanks for your thoughts, I'm piloting this with my upgrades tomorrow at my LGS.

@@mtgspecs same. I can't wait to bring out hugs Bunny. I made sure to eliminate all board wipes, because nothing makes you more of a threat than a board wipe. I did add in tithe taker the period and it works so well with baird

@@unanon_user hugs bunny is amazing! I found my copy of Psychic Possession early. Can't wait to draw when they draw. I should put Wedding Ring in also.

@@mtgspecs I threw in Nadir kraken too.,. And manor reflection. 🤣

@@unanon_user Nadir! I love that card. I have that card. Swaps to be made again!

I'm all in on artifacts. I think. The token producing effects keeps you safe during other people's turns. Definitely have to pick a one or the other though. The synergy with vehicles finally made me enjoy vehicles, they tend to have more enters and attack triggers and thematically, the trash theme feels more mechanical. But I do like the idea of Bello artifacts vs Bello enchantments as a video. And of course, Bello enchantments is a really fun deck building premise.

@@mtgspecs doing further research has me realizing the true power of this commander. Another scenario, add something like microsynth lattice, which is six mana artifact. It turns your creatures into artifacts. Now imagine the fascinating results of all those creatures with infect and a CMC of four gaining indestructible on your turn? The trick is to find them with a low enough power and toughness to make it viable. Not really possible with creatures that have annihilator, unfortunately. They are simply too high and power and toughness. You were basically be nerfing yourself by utilizing the strategy on them.

Finally, a use for the five Karumonix cards I pulled - I like this direction, pure evil. Squirrels not so cuddly now, eh?

@@mtgspecs which is why I suggested adding archetype of endurance. Because you want better hex proofing. Maybe go step further and add in dark steel foundry and mycroid laytice to make everything indestructible. You're welcome

There was definitely more jeskai/artifact cards across all the precons. Haven't attempted a Caeser upgrade with just the fallout cards, mainly as Liberty Prime got all my attention and is a beloved deck in my roster and Queen Marchesa is my Mardu build. You have inspired me though; maybe a future live stream build. Keen to do it with Dogmeat also - plenty of equipment and auras to explore.

Did you flavour upgrade from across the precons or from the wider pool of magic cards?

@@mtgspecs I flavor upgraded my Liberty prime Deck with fallout cards exclusively. Utilizing all the cards that belonged within the same game AK fallout 4. So, my Liberty prime Deck is more or less my fallout 4 deck. I chose Liberty prime, because it reminds me a lot of the backup commander for buckle up.

@@mtgspecs it is practically impossible to flavor upgrade any other fallout deck. With mutant menace, not only does the theme get in the way... But the mana base does as well. Absolutely atrocious for what you were trying to accomplish. Scrappy survivors is too much of a Voltron deck to flavor upgrade for fallout. You could throw in some artifacts and honestly? That's about it. Science was so shockingly easy to flavor upgrade. All you really needed to do was research. I did forget one card in the long run, which will be rectified. The leader of the railroad herself. More than likely, she will replace James, awful father. She synergizes really well with The artifact creatures in that deck. James doesn't really accomplish anything, just like in fallout 3. 🤣 Hail Caesar isn't Voltron or artifact tribal. It is really more like family matters. In fact, I honestly consider squad superior version of offspring. Thus, it'll need lots of Mana. That man a base for what you want to accomplish is absolutely dreadful. There are no cards in any other fallout deck that facilitate and the need to replicate. Not the way hail Caesar requires. That's if you can actually accomplish flavor operating hail Caesar, it'll be a mess. For me? I see upgrading hail Caesar more in the lines of fixing up its mana base. Making a few creature cuts and removing some magics here and there. Throw in more powerful mana rocks. Throwing some lands that generate more mana. Pretty much it

Yes! So many squirrel options now, especially as they have had lots of joke cards in the Un sets. We went from 9 legal Golgari squirrels to 28. My favourite kindred team is frogs at the moment - we get good ones every set.

@@patricklukcy13 I love that attitude! I have a few decks that aren't designed to win for various reasons. I dont often tell other players as I would want to rob them of their victory? Group hug would work well in the assassin variant of commander where two players have to guard another from other players. Keeping giving out those cards, good commenter!

@@lootship5 really like that you've gone in on expend. Bello went against the grain of the raccoon mechanic in the main set so I'm intrigued by your idea.

Solid work. Thanks! I can refer to this if I do any other three colour builds.

Hit and miss games. Last two, one was a win due to junk jet, the other match at MagicCon Amsterdam - complete dud. Basically, it suffers from the usual voltron woes - all eggs in one basket blowouts. Ive not experienced anything but low lows or high highs with it. What I am doing now is taking the energy precon from MH3 and creating a sideboard of cards to swap in from it so it can go from pure Fallout to higher powered. I'm putting small stickers into the cards that come out and go in to make that easier. I LOVE Liberty Prime and sometimes I want him to be able to achieve more and sometimes I just want this cool Fallout only pile of cards to play.

Not currently. Would be an interesting project to make this 1v1.

It's solid, spirals out of control quickly, you see a lot of cards which is always a joy in commander. The theme of artifact and enchantment creatures keeps it interesting as well.

As do you, good commenter 😊

Yeah, I missed that fourth counter. Such a powerful card.

Additionally if for some reason an enchantment on the board gives you an additional card draw- that adds an additional counter for a potential of 7 ingredient counters on it

I'm a Bello stan 😊 - he sweet talks heavy objects into ambushing my enemies. He's a keeper!

I'm looking at rebuilding it with Muerra (keeping Bello in), with raccoon tribal shenanigans. Got the precon for my gf who loves her some good trash pandas, but still figuring out how best to capture that vibe. Was thinking about something food & treasure token based (ie trash to treasures dumpster diving), but I also saw an article about building it storm which sounded very interesting since Muerra can give you lots of mana for big turns if you can keep your cards rolling in.

@@jody-hehim5007 have you considered using the junk cards from Fallout? Actual trash to impulse draw. Depends if you want to keep it all Bloomburrow. Love the storm idea.

What's your top enchantment picks for an enchantment focused build?

And you can use wildsear too

@@ryanwood4263 Ya, the precon seems to lean a lot more into Enchantments as well.

As someone who has piloted enchantress decks before, I agree with you. Making it into an enchantress deck makes more sense. Also, with green and red enchantments... We are definitely going to see some really interesting stuff. Even better if you could populate it with enchantress creatures exclusively... With the exception of the commander.

Just say you’re broke

Hey, welcome to the game! Short answer - yes, more is more is fun and both of those cards can lead to a story of how you won with a 40 power creature! Longer answer - maybe. Out of the box, the counter theme is fairly unsupported and 'eggs in one basket' so taking a turn to cast either of those spells is putting you behind in an archetype that already puts you behind. With my upgrade suggestions, I can see a place for them and would take out the two advocate cards I suggested to fit them in. Doubling Season is super expensive - Primal Vigor (the Enchanting Tales version) is way cheaper and has fringe benefits in this deck - it effects everyone so you'd give someone two octopi with the Octomancer, an extra treasure with the Bloodroot Apothecary that they shouldn't crack etc. You made a good choice with this deck - steep learning curve but will grow with you over time. Enjoy!

As someone who has used those kind of cards before and added them into this deck? If you are going to only deal with counters that make your creature stompy, go with primal vigor instead of doubling season. Then, slot in innkeepers talent. Doubling season is usually very expensive.

I will indeed. Played that deck today actually in preparation.

It does indeed; another commenter brought me up to speed. Insane card becomes more insane (if you read it correctly!). Cheers for the correction.

@@blandine7859 thank you, that's so great to hear.

Jeez, you are so right. That card is insane. Good spot!

Doing better and just add innkeepers talent instead combined with primal vigor. Primal vigor is cheaper

Yeah, that's a great shout actually. I think I was steering away from it because I put it in so many decks 😅. I also like Silent Arbiter and Crawlspace.

In my opinion, I would rather put in propaganda. But the reason I don't really like to use stuff like this is that people will save up the man if they want to get rid of your stuff bad enough. So, I'd rather make the investment in better hex proofing.

Many thanks!

I have an urge to build her from scratch using the crime mechanic. Bunny mob boss vibes. Tidal Barracuda is an excellent shout. Glad you liked the Galadriel suggestion, she is pricey but just the 'uumpth' the game plan needed.

DO IT ha ha

It was on private - should work now 😊

@@ThirdPersonCenturion thanks ill check it out. We are bringing this series back and just working out the details. Never heard of Centurion commander before - exciting.

Excellent! I always know when I've struck gold, when the day after posting, my other half tells me they want to build the deck 😁.