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🤣🤣 I really should have stopped. I'm a sucker for moral dilemmas. I kept telling myself somehow the writing quality would improve and the payoff would be fascinating.

Very well said. I agree. Baker's other movies were special because any random screenwriter in Hollywood couldn't write them. He seemed to really understand his characters. If you told me that some random Hollywood screenwriter wrote Anora I wouldn't be surprised. I noticed that Baker does have an affinity for loud arguments. That's what happens with artists. Eventually they indulge their worst impulses. I remember feeling like the end of Red Rocket was too noisy and the comedic value of those arguments was wearing thin.

Lol it's gotta be an alien then

@@BraveNewSlop on manatees with balls

The script is bad TV quality. I know you watch a lot of films, more well watched than me I'm sure. Do you think there's been a progressive slackening of critical standards and writing quality? Or do you try to avoid a lot of these Hollywood movies altogether.

​@@BraveNewSlop No, I don't think there has been a significant decline in traditional, informed film criticism ....but it is hard to find amidst the endless sensationalist race for content and clicks, unthinkingly parroting the same phrases. There's no audience for a middling review. It has to be either the best or the worst. Interestingly Emilia Perez seems to have gone from being the best film ever to the worst film ever in the space of a month 🤔😂

@@steve4films 😂Haven't seen that one. Do you have a critic you trust and like? I have read so many different critic reviews in my life, and yet never found anyone who is remotely as insightful as Ebert. I understand that there are once-in-a-generation voices, but surely there's someone who at least offers a fraction of his consistent wisdom.

@ I think you just have to find people with similar tastes that you trust, ideally who also talk about some films you might not have heard of. 🤔 …and try to ignore/mute the reviewers who talk rubbish 😆.

Appreciate the thoughts here. The movie isn't a satire, neither Drinker nor his fans (who have an incentive to say so) have mentioned it. There was no text about making a satire in the Kickstarter either. However, I agree with a lot of what you're saying. We sometimes see what we want to see when we judge the world (movies, people, ideas). It's dangerous to live in an echo chamber. Where I think we disagree is that I think the greatest critics do make cases for why something is "objectively" bad, while being open to disagreement and consideration. Ebert is an example. He sometimes phrases things as his subjective take, and sometimes as an objective quality of the movie. However, he is also open to reflection and has even written pieces about later in life re-appraising a movie. Hope you stick around and check out future channel videos. Would love to have you!

Lol, thank you. I am extremely curious what has gone on behind the scenes with Drinker after his movie bombed. Has he expressed any responsibility, or merit to the criticism, in conversations with friends or co-producers? What did he think when seeing the backlash? As far as creators go, any highly active influencer with millions of followers seems to have a case of narcissism. They were somewhere on that spectrum before the fame, and pushed further along by the constant worship. However, I don't think Drinker seems really all that narcissistic in comparison. Like, let's say you sprung a surprise question about his failed movie during an interview. I don't think he'd react in an aggressive, confrontational way. I feel like he'd just kind of shut down or try to crack a joke and move on. This is just speculation from my research on him for the video. I honestly think he's a sort of insecure guy who is in way over his head. That doesn't absolve him at all. I just think that out of a lot of these creators who "behave badly" either by being hypocrites, fomenting hatred, etc, he seems most like a guy capable of reformation. Again, just speculation.

Really interesting thoughts here. I agree with a lot of this. It makes you wonder, which is worse: extreme graphic violence and gore caused to innocents that you see as horrific (as you might find in a horror movie) or milder violence and gore caused to innocents that you see as awesome (as you might find in Deadpool). I'm curious, how do you feel about comics meant for kids featuring Deadpool and Wolverine?

Wow, thank you. It's really meaningful to hear this. One of the most inspiring, if not the most inspiring, comments I've gotten. This is bigger than a RUclips channel, and few see that.

:0

Truth over conformity! :)

Yeah, it's disappointing to see so many people leave hateful comments and then they disappear when I try to have a real conversation with them about it. I need to get better at getting them to listen without scaring them off

@@BraveNewSlop Ignore them, they are his followers, don't mind them they just want to protect their master like it's a religion you know truth hurts.

Thank you! :) Glad you enjoyed

Very much appreciate the respectful constructive criticism. We may have to agree to disagree. I left tons of poor writing on the cutting room floor, so to speak. 1. Maybe my point about the Happy Halloween was poorly phrased. The chorus of dreary monotone Happy Halloweens feels very unnatural to me. I've only ever heard Happy Halloween said in a playful, teasing, or ironic manner. Never in a rote emotionless way. Because it's not a serious holiday. I may be wrong. 2. I'm not sure how they're not one-liners? They're forced, poorly written one-liners inserted unnaturally. No one responds to any of these one-liners. 3. I may not be understanding this point. You said, "how can we continue [to move toward a verdict via discussion] if we can’t reach a verdict." Is that not an inherently illogical statement? 4. There has to be a difference in writing expectations between a RUclips video and a movie script, no? If you want to compare stories I've written to the story the guy wrote, that's perfectly fair. I'm not criticizing his Tweets, I'm criticizing a movie. Are you curious to see my screenwriting? I can send you an example video from a previous channel. 5. This isn't rage bait, I genuinely think this movie is bad. I think the script is bad, most of the acting is terrible, it's filmed lazily too. There are certainly strong negative reviews of this movie too, from both critic and audience. Are those also rage bait? I mean, yes, this video is comedic in nature and I'm having fun by hyperbolizing, and I'm being provocative. But that doesn't mean I don't believe these are examples of bad writing, and that the movie is bad. This video is basically the type of conversation I'd have with a friend about the movie. Again, I appreciate your respectful comment and I would love to hear more from you on a future video if you're willing to stick around and see where the channel goes!

Lol it's just so thoughtlessly written. Are both of her lines are meant to be sarcastic? Both the, "What's that?" And the "Nice" after he tells her? If so, that's a much snarkier and borderline mean way to act. It's one thing to playfully snark at someone for a poor design. But to double down after they tell you and sarcastically add, "Nice," makes it clear you're still disapproving. Just over-analyzing for fun here lol. Also, to add another layer here, the pitchfork is the centerpiece of their costumes. Without it, no one would know who they were. It's so goofy that a husband and wife who make homemade costumes together for Halloween would make them completely separately and with no shared idea on the defining prop. It would be like if a couple were going as Harry Potter and Hermione with homemade costumes and the wife never saw the homemade wands until the last second. But yes, such a dull movie.

@@BraveNewSlop So true, lol. This movie gave me "real people don't talk that way" vibes stronger than almost any mainstream non-Shyamalan movie I can remember, especially in the jury scenes.

@ Lmao, it's so funny that we're in the minority of people who felt that way

Yeah I agree. Too many references

That's interesting, you see Fairy Godmother as immortal as having had the factory for generations? I think they could have easily had a line about "expanding the business" and so she'd hired some newer workers.

I'd agree that Hoult carries the movie. I don't quite agree he's as good as you say. I think he plays his character a bit too moral. Like, for example, when he discussed being an alcoholic or in the flashback scene to considering a drink at Rowdy's Hideaway. I couldn't sense any of this "alcoholic bad man" that he described being in the past. Hoult just exudes "good person" energy generally (like making his Max Mad Fury Road antihero so lovable and sympathetic). I thought he turned it up too much in the dramatic scenes. But, hey, considering that I probably wouldn't have managed to finish the movie without Hoult in it, that says a lot for him.

Lol, and they'd be making hilarious things in the factory too

Lol I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not 🙃

@ I’m being serious 😭

@ Aww thank you 😇

I've just never heard anything close to a monotone chorus of Happy Halloween. I've only ever heard Happy Halloween wished with playfulness or irony, considering it's not a serious holiday at all. You might say, "Have a great memorial day weekend," or something in a dry monotone, but in my experience, not "Happy Halloween." It would be as strange to me as a room full of people intoning "Happy Birthday" As far as gas, I thought acid reflux, heartburn, etc would cause higher chest symptoms. But I never knew "just gas" could mimic heart attack symptoms. These aren't the reasons the movie is bad, the movie is bad because it's all like this. But if I'm objectively wrong in my comments about the gas I may be able to cut out the part where I correct it.

I strangely had never heard of it or seen it on lists before. Has modern culture forgotten it? Or have I just not seen much about it.

@BraveNewSlop believe it or not, it's actually considered politically incorrect, for lack of a better term. Many people resent Solzhenitsyn for exposing the Soviet police state. Back when he wrote it, many Westerners still had an idealised view of how the USSR worked. Academics, in particular, still hold a grudge, which is why it never seems to be on any college curriculum.

@@alextrivunovic644 Interesting, is there a source for this?

@BraveNewSlop probably, but I'm speaking more from personal experience. In my high school in Sweden, Solzhenitsyn was covered. Once i went to college in the States and asked professors about him, i often got hostile reactions. Over the years since then, the few times I've seen him mentioned in media, it was almost always negative. I assume this has to do with his personal social and political views. He was both anti-communist and anti-capitalist, which means he had few, if any, admirers in the West. Catholic distributists might be an exception.

​@ Gotcha, that's interesting. One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich is a journalistic account. There's not really any philosophizing. Just cold hard truth. For people to ignore something as powerful as this work because they dislike the author seems crazy. That's not normally how we treat classic works of art. I did in fact get a commenter saying this was "right-wing propaganda" which is absurd. It's sad when people apply political labels to everything...

Lmao. It's such a poorly written movie.

Appreciate the thoughts here. Maybe we can agree to disagree. In a lot of ways, I think the longer scenes are worse than the short odd moments. I'm curious, just to get an idea, what might you rate the movie out of 10? Also, feel free to check out my video on 12 Angry Men if you're curious how I might view a similar movie, but one I loved.

Hmm, I don't find it exhausting. I find it invigorating. Movies make me feel all sorts of things, from revulsion to boredom to aggravation to joy and inspiration and reflection. Feel free to check out my analyses of Captain Fantastic or 12 Angry Men if you're interested in a celebration of a great work and its effects on us. Appreciate the perspective, let me see if I can clarify my thoughts. First, I may have been unclear in criticizing the movie's tone on Happy Halloween. People also say Happy Birthday, but it'd be weird for a chorus of adults to intone "Happy Birthday" in a gloomy monotone. It's just unnatural. It's possible the original script was intending her to poke fun at how it's made, but the acting doesn't have a hint of irony in her initial line. Or her follow up, "Nice!" Each line is perfectly literal and explanatory. What's that? It's my pitchfork. Nice! Even the lines on paper make it sound as if it's sincere. And the delivery even more so. Sure, bars have dumb names. And sure, I'm being hyperbolic throughout the video because I'm having fun making fun of a movie I thought was terrible. But it did absolutely feel ridiculous to me to have such a silly name for such a serious place. You don't want your actor saying, "Did you stop at Rowdy's Hideaway?" as the inflection point in your emotional climax. It sounds like a Chuck E Cheese or Dave and Buster's type arcade. It sounds like a theme park attraction. Like a mini golf course. Again, I'll accept that in the video I'm exaggerating a bit for humor. But I've got tons of other clips I left on the cutting room floor just because I didn't have time. It's filled to the brim with stuff like this, in my opinion.

Maybe my point was poorly made. I meant to describe the tone of it. Halloween is a silly, fun thing. So people don't really wish it in a serious, dry way. I've never heard anything like a chorus of monotoned, obligatory "Happy Halloweens" in real life. It just feels off, and it's obvious the screenwriter just shoehorned it in as a segue to the next scene in their costumes.

@BraveNewSlop because our main characters are disguising themselves. His wife doesn't even recognize the instrument her husband is associated with using. I'm not saying it is a great film, but it was good. 3.5 to 4 stats.

@ This is so interesting to me. I just can't understand why people liked it so much. I understand being intrigued by the plot at the beginning. But it starts to feel more and more like bad TV, and there's never any real payoff. For example, in 12 Angry Men we get to see the process of convincing the jury. In this movie, we see part of a process and then we cut to the verdict.

Right, but we don't need to pretend people are making good things just because they're old. Whether this is terrible or great doesn't change Clint Eastwood's legacy. Though it would have been cool for him to go out a really awesome movie, can't deny.

🤣 That's exactly how it felt

I wanted to have some fun pointing out absurdities of the kind I rarely see in prestigious, critically acclaimed dramas. You're right, it's nowhere near a conventional review. I'm experimenting right now with what sorts of content I want to make. I could definitely make straightforward reviews--would be quicker, especially with the editing obligations. We'll see where the channel ultimately goes. Check out my Anora review if you're looking for a more conventional breakdown of a movie as a whole. Agree with your points. Especially the one about the prosecutor/politician. She's a side character, we know almost nothing about her. Yet the movie makes it about her moral journey rather than the main character, who at least has a little more depth. We don't care if she wins her campaign, if she loses it, if she forfeits it, if she quits her job, if she moves to Timbuktu. Again, it really feels like a ChatGPT story, because things happen that are vaguely logical (it's possible a prosecutor could have a change of heart) but are not persuasively realistic. A prosecutor changing from politician to detective and then willing to end her political aspirations to do the right thing is something that might occur over the course of an 8-episode TV show. Not in a handful of laughably literal scenes as the B-plot of an episode of Law and Order (like this movie).

Yeah that's fair. I blame myself for watching it all the way thru

It's alright if we disagree, though I'm curious, what would it take to change your mind?

🤣 It sounds more like a strip club

Why do you think it's clickbait?

The time loop? Lol. I guess it could work for a bad movie night

That's my favorite part too 🤣

same!! 😂

Agreed, would have been nice to see something quiet and personal as the last project. This was basically an obnoxious episode of TV.

Wait, no way. I didn't realize that. Might check it out. It's funny, the premise is the one thing I gave credit to the writer for. Even that wasn't original!

Lmaooo agreed. Exercising the right to quit watching or reading something bad is crucial life skill. Sometimes slop is so bad it almost becomes the equivalent of mindless scrolling. You're not enjoying it but you're trapped in a semi-conscious passive state.

Me too. I miss hand drawn animation

Well said. I hold out hope that criticism can sway the profit machine a bit. But I don't know how to improve critic talent, integrity, and honesty. Like, this movie should have been panned. Even if regular audience still liked it, even if it didn't lose a dime, the people involved in making it would feel some shame and reputational damage. That might affect their future opportunities. As it should be! It's as if critics have forgotten that art is supposed to be a highly competitive field. The lower the standards, the worse movies get. The lower the standards, the more the quality stuff is kept out. It feels like criticism now operates with the assumption that the vast majority of movies will be good, and just a small fraction will be bad.

Drive Away Dolls. I have not seen Madame Web nor Kraven.

@@kasaibouF29 Haven't seen any of those actually. Noticed Drive Away Dolls was a Coen movie. Do you normally like Coen Brothers? I unpopularly think they're super overrated.

@BraveNewSlop I'm no homophobe, but the excessive lesbianity was too much for me.

I'm glad he does that for you, there's nothing better than having something like that. For me it's Key and Peele to cheer me up. Drinker writing a bad movie doesn't take that away, any more than Jordan Peele writing a bad movie makes Key and Peele unfunny.

@BraveNewSlop i see what youre doing, reactions is money. Where not all dense here. I wish you luck with this. RUclips is changing but not for the better

@ Serious question here: Why is it more substantive for Drinker to make his 1000th movie review, than for me to make a review of Drinker's movie and Drinker's hypocrisy?

@@BraveNewSlop i cant do what you did thats Making content. And giving a opinion is not the issue. Thats good food for thought. But most people know exactly what youre saying. Look money and a lot of following gives power and power makes you a target and can make u blind. For your own assumptions. So youre right in a way. Butt what i am saying make a original of yourself not leaning on other tubers. Make a different sound and you will attract the crowd.

@ For sure, I agree that if I was just making videos on other RUclipsrs that would be pathetic. I am definitely making my own style of content as well! :)

Thank you, I wanted to go deeper. This is someone who's preaching all the time about masculine virtues, what it means to be a man, why male heroism is so important. There's an irony beyond just the hypocrisy about lazy writing. The irony of someone assailing fiction for depicting weak men while in fact he is acting like one in real life. Which is worse?