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For the Greater Good. 🤨

The difference between Heinlein's and Verhoven's versions of Starship Troopers is that Heinlein wasn't writing a parody. That and the powered armor suits, and the bugs had actual technology. Bug warriors in the book were actually fearsome, they had firearms and used squad tactics instead of just zerg rushing, it was indirectly implied their their wargear was implanted into them surgicly. They were said to be superior to the federation in terms of battlefield coordination and logistics owing to their being eusocial creatures. Warrior bugs were smart but their intelligence was highly specialized. Unlike in the movie the bugs were a peer opponent of the federation not just an infestation that was only a threat due to numbers. In the book peace was never an option not because the bugs were very very alien such that humanity and the bugs had nothing in common in spite of both being advanced spacefaring highly technological civilizations. Basically they were ants with starships and computers and mechanized warfare which was so much more interesting then how the movie portrayed them. Other alien species existed in the background which the federation had peaceful relations with, humanity was at war with the bugs because the bugs had no concept of compromise and it was either us or them.

Wow this video is actually extremely deep

Thank you again sir!

Gene Roddenberry's wife said that he identified himself as a communist. Lots of socialist propaganda written into the script.

All science fiction is about the contemporary world in which it was written, not whatever era in which it is set. Science fiction is a mirror of how society views reality in the time in which it is written. That's why "Star Trek" has all the issues of the 20th and 21st Centuries. In reality, no biological life exists beyond Earth. You may think it does, and I won't trivialize your opinion if you do, but I will say that we definitely have no evidence that we need weapons against anyone in space but other humans. We certainly have no evidence that we need a space navy, unless against other humans. So, any science fiction portraying such weapons or militarization isn't talking about what's out in deep space, but is talking about humans in our contemporary era. I decided when I was in high school that I owed a debt to my country to defend the freedoms that I enjoyed. So, I joined the military. I looked at various branches of the military before joining the Navy, a decision that I made based on the once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to study nuclear propulsion. My decision to join the military was based on patriotism and duty but I chose the particular circumstances for my best benefit that I could find. I could have done much better if I had waited a year or two, but I don't know what would have happened to me in that time if I had, and I had no way of knowing about those changes that took place in that year or two.

Firefly is the best sci-fi tv show ever. And technically The Verse is a star system made of 4 stars orbiting one bigger star, that is why there are so many habitable planets. Super unique. Great video.

If you're interested in more Space Western animes, Outlaw Star is an interesting twist on it. It came out concurrent to Bebop and the original Trigun, so it tends to get passed over for bigger classics but I think it's worth looking at.

Have you read the Patchwork writings by Mencius Moldbug? He talks about the patchwork concept in statecraft and how you'll prolly see a significant political decentralization in the future.

Exaltation, Eternal Progression, pre-existence of humanity, agency, all of these things are very integral to my culture and beliefs

At this point "MAN" is very much a different species than humans at this point. Unless the zoo planets are strictly controlled, then I very much see a civil war in the future. If they are controlled then I see constant periodic revolts.

You give the writers of Discovery too much credit ;)

Okay to translate FH's UBIC plan into federal currency: abolish most all of the federal government's welfare programs, but in turn 50% (adjust percentage) of tax revenue is evenly distributed amongst the population. Probably should lower the taxes though. Not sure I agree that the plan is a good thing, but definitely better than what we have now.

I have one problem. Who drew the short straw to work in the dilithium mine? Are there actual people who's passion is risking death and dismemberment to have a job ... mining rocks? Don't get me wrong, one of my friends works on an oil rig. He's okay with his job but he's doing it for the money. I'm doing my job for the money. Assuming you can replicate replicators, one of the only jobs that would need to be done is mine dilithium (fuel for the replicators). So, why would anyone do it? They're not bettering themselves as a diplomat or artist. There's not some grand monumental goal like terraforming. And, there's no personal benefit. Anyway, we're no where near this point in reality. My job 100% requires a human being, no chance of automation until we have life-like androids, and doesn't pay rent. I have to live with my sisters so we can pool money. Affording food is a worry in so much as I can't afford much more than the cheapest food. We are no where near the point where a car is as cheap as a paperclip, so we should still be focused on maximizing production so we can get those prices down before we think about the Yang plan as that will drive prices up.

Were there any significant persons in Trek who spoke out against the visible part of the federation? Like, in public? I know the villains of the week and the occational deginatedly wrong strawman occationally do. And there's plenty of secret cabals who need to hide their shady doings from the public in Trek. But I can't think of any disenters in the Federation who go "Federation bad!" at any point. Unlike in Troopers.

Thumbs down from Milton Friedman

Hello, Mr FeralHistorian. Enjoyed this vid and also have *some* disagreement about the content and rebuttals in the comments. But, I'll stick to two things. Firstly, this "fear of a Haitian style revolt amongst Southern States" [my summation of the lines you use], is a new one to me as an explanation/contribution to reasons for the American Civil war. I highly doubt that after so long (70 or 80 years by the time of the United States Civil War?) that that would be so strongly an influence especially with everything that happened in around the US sphere of influence. Haiti would have been (still is?) an example of a successfully repressed "successful revolution". By the US Civil War, Britain had banned slavery and acquiring new slaves for about 30 years. Spanish and Portuguese (and no doubt others) were still engaged in the slave trade. France was doing what France does in these situations (ie being hypocritical on ethics and maintaining financial debts on Haiti). As well as all manifestations of the anglosphere still being highly repressive (or genocidal as we now say) to the people under its dominion, such as against First Nations Americans and the people of Ireland. Not to mention the actions taken and the wars fought by the Russian Empire on native populations and foreign nations (... like Britain). So, while Toussaint may have been a well known story, I doubt that it would still have been the main thing that Southern States North Americans immediately thought about when deciding to secede from the Union. Secondly, (I'm being sci-fi nerd now instead of critical), there is a Judge Dredd story, I think published late 80's early 90's in 2000AD magazine, about an accident causing the deaths of citizens. My memory being hazy, I think a "news droid" uncovered that a leak of a chemical used to treat drinking water was released in high concentration becoming an aerosolised gas. (This is not from the Block Wars storyline but years after it.) The chemical was called "Rodentine". In lower dosage, it was used for pre-emptive pacification of citi-block dwellers. The news droid was reprogrammed and the story suppressed! Of the longtime Judge Dredd writers, John Wagner was a great one fo references to US American history and Alan Grant had expertise in sociology & psychology. In interviews, Alan Grant often made reference to studies on rats and mice put into laboratory equivalents of Twentieth Century cities (crammed together, lack of food, noise). Methods of social control and urban pacification are two of the essential elements of stories set in Mega City One. Writers like JGBallard and Anthony Burgess also influenced them. I remember stories, "urban myths", about pacifying populations going back to the 70's with claims that fluroridation can be used for that purpose and the CIA flooding the inner cities with drugs. I usually don't disagree with the main thrusts of your essays, it is often when there is an analogy or a reference meant to emphasise/clarify/exemplify a point that makes me frown.

The 90's movie look like a much more rational take on the scenario, I'll be at grounded in some classic movie tropes, whereas the 2024 movie looks like an overloaded Netflix miniseries, with all the usual maladies of multiple layers of invisible embedded nihilism and a complete blindness to the fact that it is trying to be smarter than it really is. There is something - although only a little something perhaps redeemable and trying to present a generic conflict without really putting in the stakes as to what it is in order to try to examine some of the universal themes. Ironically, to my mind, the variant that does take some more explicit sides, even partisan positions, is actually better able to more authentically examine some of those universal themes precisely because once it has accepted it has staked out a position, even performatively, it no longer has to carry around all that extra baggage in every scene and every line of dialogue trying to maintain the facade. If anything the more modern renditions suffers from one of the most debilitating issues in contemporary cinema, which is the perception and reality - self-reinforcing - of audience stupidity. The idea that contemporary audiences simply cannot understand anything beyond what is literally presented, if you present anything explicitly it must be an endorsement, and the people are not capable of rotating a scenario or a concept in their heads unless you walk them through it has ruined a lot of good things.

Star trek exists in a post scarcity world, Starship Troopers exists in a world where they realize scarcity is the basis of everything.

That was very well done. New subscriber now!

This is the first video I've seen from this channel that I really disagree with the Feral Historians take. This was the story of a real god always giving humanity another chance even though their hubris brings them low every few thousand years or so. They try and become God's themselves and fail miserably. Even the Earth Cylons repeated the cycle and tried to create life. They even try and create God's that they can interact with, at least create the mythology of the lords of kobol. Its like the Jews that created the golden calf idol in the old testament even though God had set them free from Egypt. The Battle Star series of the early 2000s has a God, the Judeo Christian god, more or less. This was a story about rejecting false God's, about a God wanting us to accept the role he created humanity for. When people try to become God's we lose the best parts of ourselves that make us human. We're not wise enough or noble enough to create an intelligent "lifeform" and do the right thing by it. The mental versions of 6 and Baltar were really angels the whole time and had probably seen the same cycle repeat itself over and over for an untold number of years. The Universe of Battlestar Galactica isn't one that's partially created with a god who wants humanity as partners in creation...its a universe where god is the parent that is constantly struggling to teach his children to keep the home he provided for them nice and the kid keeps on drawing on the walls with sharpies and crayons trying to make it their own.

"What is capitalism" "Well, basically: stonks" Yeah, no, that's called technology. Capitalism is all that growth happening while the people who make it happen get less than they had before.

For managed democracy! Long Live Super Earth!

"It's not fascist" Good for you. It's nice to finally see a RUclips video that understands the difference between what Heinlein described and what Dougie Houser in von Rundstedt's overcoat suggests. The movie is enjoyable for what it is but totally distorts Filipino Juan Rico's journey.

I love you Mitchell and Webb reference 8:52.

What I find most interesting with Starship Troopers is the difference between the film and the book. They are so different it's hard to understand how they took the film the direction it went. Then again if memory serves the director said he had never even read the book... Which would make a lot of sense when seeing the final product.

The biggest difference between the two settings is that Star Trek is post-scarcity where there is literally nothing material you cannot have. The sole limitation to material objects is the energy to replicate them. In a post scarcity world, almost all work would be voluntary since there is almost nothing to spend money on. Starship Troopers, on the other hand, is not post-scarcity. There are still limited material resources and work is not optional if you want access to those less abundant resources. Money still matters and is a motivator.

There's a big difference. The Star Trek Federation can't fight a war, while the Starship Troopers Federation would fall apart in peacetime. The fact UFP struggles in war is obvious with the Dominion and Borg. But, I'll point out how the UCF would fail in peacetime - the critical flaw is "service" is subjective. As long as a war is happening, lots of genuine, selfless, action is necessary. But in peacetime, "service" is decided by the powers that be. An entrenched class of "citizens" could then decide their children are providing "service" by performing an easy comfortable desk job, while at the same time demand nigh-impossible forms of "service" from social outsiders. The system would collapse into aristocracy. In fact, the way the old nobility started out was when war happened everybody who was knight or higher had to get on his horse and do the lion's work of the fighting. So the caste with political power was doing the sacrificing in war. That changed when occasional peace started breaking out in Europe, and the nobles gradually changed from professional soldiers to a useless parasite class.

"Somehow the slenderness of that thread makes it feel that much stronger." Though it has in no way been made greater, a candle shines brightest in complete darkness. Edit: If you want to just have fun, play against an Ork player. The Orks are the essence of "Random bullshit GO!" and there's no such thing as a salty Ork player.

What is laughable he is using the movie that was only loosely based on the book and the movie maker admited that he did not read the book just assumed it was a nasi style society The STroopers world is better then STrek world

One amendment... you say Star Fleet is selective & how rigorous the ACADEMY entrance exam is. That's true, but the academy is for officers. Not enlisted. Carmen (from the movie, it's been forever since I read the book), had extremely high scores & Carl had psychic abilities (and I assume really high grades/scores as well.) Great video though. I love the comparison.

This is how the world ends, not with a bang but with a whimper. Pretty much sums up the movie. The movie world feels very depopulated, as if a plague had been suffered wiping out most of the humans but none of the infrastructure. So nobody's starving or suffering from lack of services health fuel electricity or phone. There's no martial law like you might see if there was some kind of National Emergency. There just aren't enough people to deal with a handful of outlaw Biker Boys. Of course in the later Hollywood sequels it's pretty clear the apocalypse caused by fuel shortages leading to nuclear exchanges but the first movie doesn't indicate that at all there's even a bar scene with all the people acting pretty much normal.

Starship troopers shows something realistic and workable, while Star Trek shows something elitist and utopian (like that other ideology that has already repeatedly failed spectacularly).

Woooooo Nationalistic Authoritarianism!

Even if you get the equivalent to $10 million. You still couldn't go out and buy a starship. The systems, expertise, materials, engineering, logictics, etc. would not be available to the average citizen. You couldn't hire a crew, a captain, nor rent a dry dock. Most people would just not be interested. You would need an organization to lure people to your cause.

6:50 the little squeaks almost made me panic, i thought a creature was let loose within my home

I still have most of my GI Joes from my childhood. Still think they are so cool. It started a long obsession with action figures that I can’t shake into my forties. Mostly, they get bought and hung on the wall. But every so often, I dig out the trunk with all of my old toys and let the kids pick a couple out. I end up spending the better part of an afternoon digging through it all and reminiscing. Oh, to be young again. Late eighties into the early nineties. Carefree. Sunday morning cartoons. Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles on the TV and, for a time, in my cereal bowl. For a time there, the OJ Simpson trial was destroying my ability to watch cartoons after school. It seemed like it would never end

in capitalism it is not about owning sources of capital like mines you mention. Rather the name "capitalism" comes form latin "capita"-"head". Capitalism is system where "capital" is EVERYTHING that is productive. And most productive thing is your head, origin point of any idea and thus action. There is reason why we have term "human capital". its kinda reundant, but gets around misconception that "capitalism" focues on "means of prorudction". Thats not true. It is also not factually correct since capitalists do not merely own title to something. They work, They risk. They are entreprenours-they use ther heads to implement their ideas. Hence-they use capita. What you refer to in video is rent seeking and rentierism. The reverse of capitalism and state very clsoe to feudalism.

My problem with Heinlein's solution is that of corruption. I see people in the Federation hiring others to go to the military and vote for them, or political factions getting supporters easy posts so they can vote. I don't think it would solve the problem that Heinlein intends it to solve. We have it anyway and I don't think it would make it any worse but I'm not sure it would make it better either. Thing is, rules and paper can always be worked around or ignored if they don't have people to support them. Take a look at the US. Probably 99% of US federal government actions are explicitly banned by the Constitution. They do them anyway because the people impose no consequences for that. Same would probably happen for SST Federation. My solution has always been the perpetual one, maintain a culture that opposes corruption and supports free speech and spread knowledge of corruption and how to identify it whenever you can. Oh, and one last thing. FASCIST!!!!!! -> (to get ahead of "them")

One point to add: Both federations have a secret police-type force operating out of the shadows.

Your telling me a 3d printer isn't a replicator. I'm 2 hrs into a 18 hr print and if anything goes wrong i have to start all over again and things go wrong more then not.

Star Trek is pretty tiresome as the characters basically Sh!t Marble Balls as they are so much better and wiser than us backward Plebs. The Aliens always are the true mirrors of normal humans with their violence, greed, jealousy and other vices, forming a contrast to our future (unobtainable) selves. Star Trek appears to be a totalitarian society as there is zero talk of politics/elections, etc. Star Ship Troopers (the book, not the Melrose Space movie) provides a fine blueprint for the future where only Veterans can serve in positions of power and have a say in governance. The only fault I have with the system is that voting needs to go away and representatives need to be selected from a lottery, with no one able to serve more than twice in a lifetime. They can elect a council from the best veterans we have available to act as an executive. While not specifically banned, woman wouldn't be able to pass the training regime and wouldn't be able to have a say, which is a good thing, because giving woman the vote has lead to emotional, rather than rational policies, getting us to where we are now." Democracy is all it's forms is a failure, as the majority always seems to vote to give themselves more stuff at the expense of either their fellow citizens and/or future generations, with interest groups, government agencies and businesses buying influence or using blackmail to enrich/protect themselves from the masses. We must do better.

I wrote a fan animation that showed a greedy federation secretly monetarily profiting off of labor done by federation citizens to live out lavish life styles but I cancelled the project to make my own sci fi series instead. Now I'm working on my second series.

fucker just pulls out an AK-12 mag randomly. Now I need a feral historian firearms/gear collection video.

Mr DuBois was the science teacher growing up.

A good example are cities like Rome and Athens. They became ruins but not because everyone died over night. It was slow, less money to hire janitors, maintence men, and masons to repair buildings. Eventually they became ghost towns because food is not grown in cities and fled to the lords who owned land where they lived on property and paid rent with a share of crops. This was the start of feudalism.

I think a lot of this misunderstanding comes from a blanket misunderstanding of military service, especially in the contemporary of when the book was written. A lot of people, especially those that have never served, tend to forget that the military has always had a large role in exploration, civil works, and social programs. It's not unreasonable that in The Federation that things like advanced scientific research projects like CERN, or civil sustainment programs like the postal service and space peace corps, are all part of the military complex. That was how I had read the book. Employment by the federal government and military service are one and the same. This is especially foreign to us when you consider that in the modern U.S. military as many non-combat works as possible are being handed over to civilian contracts to accommodate our shrinking enlisted forces. I can't remember ever actually seeing a DFAC that was run by servicemembers, save for field kitchens in smaller FOBs.

I think it might also be coming from a lot of people (including me) don't hate the idea of restricted voting based on self-sacrifice in the shape of helping (or protecting) society but just thought that the bit about finding work for everyone meant the federation didn't really care about putting you boots on the ground it just wanted you to shovel shit to the extend that any grifters would run away

Star fleets federation is arguably fascist. Fascist in its ideas is a united whole of the group working towards the survival and thriving of the group. There is no class war there is the top and bottom united into a organic whole for the betterment of all. This sounds a lot like the United federation of planets. The entire point is to survive against the test of time. It would change under different conditions externally and internally so how it would rule would vary over time. So facing the dominion it becomes more militaristic without those kind of external threats it can scale it back. And since it is about surviving the test of time using bio weapons to make your enemies be willing to listen to reason as they did to the founders is consistent with survival being the primary mode. They had also moved to an almost post scarcity civilization so their society would be able to allow more freedom. This is why people think the federation is socialist because of it being united and with replicators and other advanced technologies life became different.

the uf pro multicam black. not bad not bad.