Just picked up a 700 BDL 300 win mag. Purchased in 1971. Along with a Winchester 3030. They were both taken up to Alaska where the man fell in love with the scenery and never even loaded either of them. These rifles still had the paper tags and string on them brand new. She wanted $400 for both. I told her No Way. I paused for a second didn't speak fast enough and she had a very sad look on her face I feel bad about. But already had in mind a price that I was going to give her. That was $500. But after seeing and handling the rifles the boxes were trashed held together by tape. The guns are mint condition. I gave her $600. She is super happy. Local dealer offered her $100 each. Today I'm going over there to look at a 1976 super beetle convertible factory condition that has been sitting since 1979 when her mother burnt the clutch out on it.
I got this for my .243 after watching the video. Thanks for making it crystal clear that you can use the Mag well with the ADL. I've read forums on top of forums about it, but I couldn't find a clear answer. I got it put on today and it's great I was able to get green. ! Groups at 50 were great. Next couple days I'll see what it does at 100yds. I didn't pay attention and actually bought a magazine because I didn't think it came with one.
Thats awesome. A good video series to check out would be tibosaurous rex's "sniper 101". I learned stuff that I never learned being around operational Marine Corps snipers. He will teach you to take that setup out to 1000 yards and maybe even further. I eas already reaching 700-800, but after applying what he teaches I was able to get my setup out further.
Alaskan Ballistics have you been to the range since confirming torque settings? I can shoot groups less than 1/2". But since I have the lightweight barrel I notice as I continue to shoot the groups open up. I tried several factory loads and found that Winchester Deer Season XP shoots the best.
The rifle I shoot in competitive matches started life as a 700 adl , on sale at dicks! My budget build involved the mag pull hunter stock. Chambered in 308, the stock made a huge difference! A smithy suggested I tork the action screws to 65 in the rear, and the front screw slightly less...I settled on 63...kept the Remington barrel, stuffing the receiver with a 1 peace 20 moa rail..and topping it off with a swfa as fixed 10 power..the rifle performance is surprising at under 1/2 moa with 175 grain Sierra match kings with 41.7 gr of imr 4064.......big fan of magpul stock! Barrel is factory 26 in. 1/12 twist, varmint contour!
Nice. I just nailed a caribou at 459 yards with this rifle. All steel tps one piece base, burris xtreme tactical rings and a Nikon black force 1000 scope
@@AlaskanBallistics ...it's quite tame as you pointed out! Thinking about building another, this with 1/10 twist....but got to wait just bought at thermo weapon sight! Can't wait for it to arrive!!!!
I like how its the same cut of you shooting with safety glasses on each time, even though you sight in without several times and the video splits to the same cut.... Either way, solid video showing the stock install, and the shots. Good job.
Positioning of your non shooting hand will help your groups. You are changing your entire position each time when you dont have your hand in the exact same position. It also looked like you were jerking the trigger just a tad, and I couldnt tell if you were pulling the trigger at the top or the bottom of your breathing pattern. I was in the Marine Corps Infantry, shooting fundamentals is most important. I have a 700sps tac and I get quarter inch groups at 100 yards with a magpul stock and a Vortex optic. Proper torque on those screws will help, and sticking with 1 type of ammo helps. Also, another thing people overlook is copper fouling inside the barrel. DO NOT CLEAN THE BARREL unless you absolutely have to. Only vlean yhe bolt and action. After 100-200 rounds you will build up a good level of copper fouling in the barrel and it will actually improve your accuracy. Most people dont know that about remington bolt action rifles, but the barrel design was not meant to be cleaned. Once the optimum level is built up each round will push out any excess and will keep tge proper amouny of fouling in the barrel. Try it and you will learn to appreciate the stock a lot more, although if you have the money I recommend a Mcmillan stock, doesnt matter which one, although we used the A3 STOCK in the marine corps. They are super heavy and creatr rigidity where it is needed. One more thing, remington 700 rifles chambered in 308 work best with an 18"-20" barrel. The twist rates were notvdesigned for a longer barrel which confuses me on why remington makes any longer barrel for a 308. If you are in love with what you have thats great because its still very capable, but id recommend trading out for an sps tactical if you get the chance. The heavy barrel is amazing, plus you can pay tge $200 for the tax stamp for a supressor and run that. The supressor actually will imcrease your accuracy, make the weapon quieter so your less likely to scare away the game, and actually tames some of the recoil a little bit. All in all its a nice rifle man.
Glad I could help. Now let’s hope Biden doesn’t get elected because he wants to take ALL guns off the shelf except shotguns and black powder rifles. Handguns will not be allowed by anybody outside of law enforcement and military, and any and all battle rifles will be banned.
Before final torque it’s good to have rifle barrel to the sky and give it a couple of light taps on the ground buttstock to seat the recoil lug all the way to the rear…. Good glass bed would make it perfect 👍🏾
Try shooting off bags if on a bench or put something heavy in front of the bipod to get a forward preload. I was having a lot of issues with my 700 7mmRM grouping poorly but once I got that bipod hop under control they tightened up. Great vid!!
Without removing barreled action, you only have to remove the check riser if the bolt is obstructed. Check risers of various heights are available, also. My personal experience with Magpul Hunter 700 stocks are that the torque specs are dependent on the rifle. Not all rifle actions react the same to the suggested Magpul torque values. Some experimentation may yield a differing outcome.
Great video, nice looking rifle and setup. Just wanted to mention, you can fit the Magpul magwell on other stocks, it just might take a little smithing. I installed one in my 700 long action with a Bell and Carlson stock. It took a lot less work than some I have seen and it feeds like a champ.
This is the first video I've seen where the gun shot actually SOUNDs likea gun shot. In most other videos like garandthumb etc, there's so much attentuation of the transient that it sounds fake. This one's got that Crrrrrrack.
I have to admit that’s a very nice stock. I’ve seen you said before that it is a bit heavy but I don’t mind weight so much I might get a similar set up for my Remington 700 270. Either that or upgrade to a slightly bigger caliber/cartridge along with a better rifle. But with how you turned you adl into something so much more sounds interesting I own a sps model which I don’t care for because of the stock itself
If your shooting Barnes bullets that are solid copper apposed to the other three bullets you're shooting that are a gliding copper you will continue open your groups. It's best to shoot one or the other and not mix the two types of copper. Clean tour rifle until the re are no more signs of copper with something like Wipe Out that shows blue on the patches if there is any copper left in the barrel. We had trouble with a good friend of mines rifle. He was shooting Barnes and Berger bullets, he couldn't keep a constant broupp untill he started shooting Berger's only. I prefer the Barnes bullets in most of my rifles btu the ones that don't shoot then I stick to one or the other.
@@AlaskanBallistics well I just did the magpul stock and magazine upgrade Fixed the feeding issues, it was an easy job your video really helped me Thank you
I just picked up a brand new one of these stocks at a Georgia Flea Market for 30 bucks Deciding if I shouldn't throw it up for sale and put the funds towards something else,or keep it ?
Great looking stock. Having to remove the cheek weld to pull the bolt is a pain but like you said at least they thought of it. Also sending it to you shows good for them. Having a mag is very kewl! Well done vid! I think the FDE should make for a good base for a camo job.
Regarding this issue, of having to remove the cheek rest every time, in order to pull out the bolt, I am proposing a cosmetic solution. Going to smoothly grind off enough material at that point where the bolt bumps the cheek rest, then fine shape the edges in design as if it came that way with epoxy and then paint that edge.
Not sure if you noticed but your triger guard is broken on the rear screw. Most likely due to over tightening. Leads to inaccuracy due to unbalanced tightness. Can put the lug in a bind. Happened to me and to replace with a new metal one.
This is a good video on this system. I was wonder if you could go from ADL to DBM with it. I heard that the accuracy goes down this stock in general, but i have also been taught that ADLs have better accuracy because there is no buckle were the well is at. Anyway I've been checking out this stock and I think your video has convinced me to make a move on this thing. The od green is hard to find but the FDE is nice. Maybe I'll stick with straight black. Thanks for the video demonstration and insight.
Alaskan Ballistics that is awsome that's all I wanted it for hunting. I also wanted to the ease of taking a mag out for safety when I jump in and out of the vehicles.
You mentioned the 700 adl not letting some rounds eject. And after your mod I noticed you didn’t have that problem. My ADL in 300wm doesn’t like to eject sometime and I really have to tug on it. Did you in fact fix that problem? Remington factory is closed so I can’t send it back like they want me too so exploring other options
Alaskan Ballistics oh ok. I have that problem too but I’m also having an issue with the bolt not coming back out of some cartridges after I fire. Some shots it comes out first go but most shots it’s like wicked stuck in there
Get a timney hunter trigger and find the exact torque spec of your triger guard or bottom metal/mag well!!!!! Or you will have problems no matter what ammunition or stock you use your torque specs are the foundation of your rifle!!!!!
Alaskan Ballistics what's the weight now with that stock? Since the Remmy is cylindrical I bet a bedding job will cut it in half as well. Not needed, but doesn't hurt.
If you want to cut those groups easily in half have the action Glass Bedded and free float the barrel, adjusting the trigger helps to, you never mentioned what caliber your shooting but looks like 300 Win Mag, handloading will both save you money and if you do your part you can cut the same hole with it. My 300 Win Mag load is 180 gr Nossler accubond in a Nossler case behind 75.5 gr of Reloader 22, Winchester large magnum rifle primer. Seat the bullets out to function threw the magazine or .10 off the rifling. Which ever is shorter. I shoot regular sub 1/2 inch groups with mine, I just put his 3rd barrel on him
Alaskan Ballistics I just bought a Remington 700 7mm Mag, thinking of getting one of those stocks. I’ll glass bedding the wood stock to get the best groups. Shooting Nossler 175 LR accubonds. Will let you know how I do
How tall are you? I notice your trigger finger is in a good position to the trigger? Also, if you don't mind, what do you currently have the LOP set at?
Question how stiff is the fore end?? I understand that the barrel is free floated but are you able to flex the fore end up to touch the barrel?? I'm concerned that could effect accuracy
The malfunction you were experiencing was a result of user error. Loading the rounds closer to the chamber, instead of almost touching the bolt face (while open) would have fixed this problem
Alaskan Ballistics yeah I wasn't sure I was looking for some nasty 308 rounds to screw some porcupines up big time. But I'm trading that rifle in for a Remington 700 aac sd in 308 and I will get this same stock but in od green. 16.5 inch barrel should be nice and loud. 308 doesn't kick like yours tho hahahahahha.
My 2012 rem 700 has the same feeding issue. Always hunt with 2 rounds in the mag and 1 in the chamber. Cant load it with more than 2, just get me Issues
2 questions... I tried scanning your comments and couldn’t find answers my questions. 1. How do you like the look of the sporter barrel in the stock? Do you have any pics? I’ve only seen these stocks with heavy barrels and not the factory barrel. 2. I have a .270 and a .300WM. Can I buy one stock and swap out if I wanted too since both are long action? Or is there a LA and a Magnum mag kit? Thanks!
I don't have any picks but recommend you check out my caribou scouting packraft video there's so good shots in there... i like the looks. 2) there is a long action magwell and long action magwell But the stock is the same
MaxairEngineering a .270 and .300 WM are both Long Actions. One is a standard long action and one is a magnum. I understand the fact that a SA and a LA are not interchangeable. I was referring to the OP saying it was a magnum LA kit.
@@TheMOXFilms sorry I meant to say there is a long action mag well, and a long action Magnum mag well, somehow my phone didn't put that into the comment section. My speak to text is awful. The stock is the same for the long action and a long action Magnum but the mag Wells are different
How does it feel? Does it feel solid or cheap and hollow? Is it light or heavy solid.... It sounds like cheap hollow plastic... I really want to purchase one, but without feeling it, holding it... I'm hesitant....
Wow... Thanks for the fast reply.... I have a hard time ordering things on line.. Tactile quality in a stock is so important... Without being able to put my hands on it I was worried about the feel.... The polymer stock the 700 came w. sucks.... feels like a pop bottle...
Leaving Communitst NY couldn't agree with you more on the regular stock.... This stock is offered on a factory version, is go to a store (maybe not in NY) and pick one up and feel it.
What ammo you cycling. My model 700 cycles fine. 30-06 by the way. I use remington core-lokt in it by the way. Just for hunting anyways and thats all ive ever used the 700 for. Just a thought. P.s i think a detachable mag would be great though. Didnt watch whole vid before commenting
Hmm well either way some of em just come out of the factory bad. I will say the stock looked awesome. Just needs a bipod. Also if youve never checked out the old 760 gamemaster bdl. Pretty sweet little gun. Just a white tail slayer really.discontinued in 93 i believe.
Chuck, it’s been some time since you’ve installed this stock, has this rifle seen any field use? Notice any wear? Is it too heavy to pack on a moose hunt? Great video, I’m sure lots of time goes into it, showing the shot, then the impact in succession like that. Thanks!
+fishfulthinking1514 Thank you for watching! It killed one caribou on August 11 (has video), was recently on a winter caribou hunt. It is heavy but not too heavy for my taste. Groups tightened up after i torqued it properly.
Alaskan Ballistics depends where you go. There’s a 1000 yd range here now, but I haven’t been there since the addition. I generally shoot off the back porch at my sisters house.
I'm putting together a 7mm-300, also referred to as a 7mm Practical (necked down .300 Win Mag) . I read max cartridge OAL for the magazine is 3.5". Are they correct on that? I'd love it if they were actually closer to 3.7" I want to use this setup. I have one of these in a 700 SA in .243 and love it.
You're quite welcome. I don't know if you could file the inside of the magazine that much. I doubt it. Best of luck... Are you loading that long to fit the round to your chamber?
Yes. If I shoot 195gr-197gr ELD or VLD bullets, I will have to load them that long to avoid jumping them too far. I don't want more than .010 jump. I think I am just going to shoot 140-168gr bullets in this rifle. This is going to be a hunting/varmint rifle.
Honestly, its not a bad stock. But i am kinda disapointed with it, and that mainly goes against weight. Its not terrible, but i was hoping it would be lighter than my old wooden stock. Shortening the forend wouldnt hurt my feelings either. May end up lighting the block via flutes and holes
Alaskan Ballistics syncrinized holes along the side, im thinking 3/8 - 1/4 imch holes, but im still measuring, and planning. Ill update you on how it goes
Does this stock lift the barrel to make it free floating or is it still making contact with the forward end of the stock? Was considering one of these for my 700ADL 7 Rem Mag.
Yeah I figured out both Problems by now. Groups are getting better I just haven't made a video of it yet. I really appreciate the suggestions! Thank you very much!
YA... I edited my original comment because I hadn't watch the video till the end. Just didn't want to forget what I was going to say. But glad you got it figured out.
Nice stock and good information video. I've a question: Does this Magpul stock have a good weight to it? I have the Rem 700 ADL 06, with the original wooden stock. I bought a synthetic stock from an army Ranger who removed it from his newly purchased 700. I thought it'd be nicer to have a black synthetic stock, but what I didn't like ehen I mounted it, was the new weight. It's too light. That rifle already kicks like a mule having supportive weight from the wood stock, but I think it'll be worse with a lite stock. I have been thinking of buying this Magpul for a while.. What say ye?
It's a pretty hefty stock yes. High shot it side-by-side with another 7 mmeter Remington magnum Remington 700 the other day and the one with the magpul stock feels a lot better than the wood stock
@@AlaskanBallistics So you don't know the weight of stock before you mounted it? I'd have to check with manufacturer. Do you know weight Now? Could you say?
Did you ever tighten up both stock screws? They should be torqued to 65 in.-lbs. I also see that you are a local guy in Alaska, the Anchorage, Wasilla or the Palmer area. I'm Wasilla!
Rudolph Ferdinand yes sir I did, but I did not get any footage of it yet. It did shoot much better with groups tightening to about half an inch with the Hornady Precision Hunter 162 grain ELD X
Alaskan Ballistics I need to replace a stock on a Browning XBolt but Magpul doesn't have a stock for my Browning, so have to buy one from McMillan and they will cost me about $500, and that's with a military/veterans discount 20% off. I'm a EPM member at Birchwood Park and I normally do my shooting Monday, Tuesday, or Wednesday never the other days. I hope to see you one day at Birchwood Park; white Dodge truck 2003 military stickers rear window.
The cheek piece is easily removable if the bolt doesn't clear during removal. Give me a 270 over a 7mm Rem mag. I don't like how recoil affects accuracy. For the additional recoil there is not really any significant gain in ballistics over the 270. But, hey, for each his own! Shoot what you like! I enjoyed your video.
If you have a set of calipers could you measure the longest round that will fit in their magazine? I load longer than factory and they fit in the factory box mag.
Actually, you're shooting 4 different bullets from 4 different makers. Thus your bullets' copper is different recipes. This may impede the accuracy you're getting. You may also find a variance of groupings between a CLEAN barrel and a copper fouled barrel. Cold/warm barrel variance too. Remove copper fouling between brand of bullets. Clean your barrel, shoot a couple of fouling shots, then shoot with a cold barrel for zero. Do that for every new make of bullet. Cleaning your barrel after every firing is no longer needed with today's modern powders. This was needed back in the day of using black powder, which is highly corrosive and became strict tradition passed down from father/son over the centuries. Modern powders are not corrosive. Clean your barrel when you find accuracy dropping off, then a few fouling shots to re-establish your carbon fouling. Measure how far back your bolt goes with the cheek riser piece in place. Remove the cheek riser piece and measure how far back the bolt moves. You MAY be able to use a round file and remove some of the plastic from the nose of the cheek riser piece, buff it smooth with sandpaper (also softening the edges) and be able to remove your bolt. If you must remove enough material to end up with a "hole" in the cheek riser piece, remove a bit more and create a form using masking tape on the outside and fill the void with epoxy. Fine tune it with sandpaper when cured and a touch of FDE paint. If you use black epoxy and like the contrast, just tune it up with some sandpaper to dress it smooth.
Thanks for the advice. Getting a torque wrench and making sure I screwed them into spec made everything very accurate. Look at my 7mm Rem Mag 120gr ttsx video. Thanks. Godspeed
You're quite welcome... The bright side is that if you get it and it doesn't work for you, you can probably get your money back... Or you could probably sell it for 75-80% of new value later
![Remington Core-Lokt Tipped 7MM Magnum [Incredible Groups] 100 YD Groups, Long Range, and Drop Chart](/img/1.gif)
Just picked up a 700 BDL 300 win mag. Purchased in 1971. Along with a Winchester 3030. They were both taken up to Alaska where the man fell in love with the scenery and never even loaded either of them. These rifles still had the paper tags and string on them brand new. She wanted $400 for both. I told her No Way. I paused for a second didn't speak fast enough and she had a very sad look on her face I feel bad about. But already had in mind a price that I was going to give her. That was $500. But after seeing and handling the rifles the boxes were trashed held together by tape. The guns are mint condition. I gave her $600. She is super happy. Local dealer offered her $100 each.
Today I'm going over there to look at a 1976 super beetle convertible factory condition that has been sitting since 1979 when her mother burnt the clutch out on it.
Cool!
Good for you not ripping her off!
Good luck on the car... that's cool
I got this for my .243 after watching the video. Thanks for making it crystal clear that you can use the Mag well with the ADL. I've read forums on top of forums about it, but I couldn't find a clear answer. I got it put on today and it's great I was able to get green. ! Groups at 50 were great. Next couple days I'll see what it does at 100yds. I didn't pay attention and actually bought a magazine because I didn't think it came with one.
Cool now you have two mags! Thanks for watching. Since the video I've gotten better accuracy since torquing the screws down to 64 inch pounds
Thats awesome. A good video series to check out would be tibosaurous rex's "sniper 101". I learned stuff that I never learned being around operational Marine Corps snipers. He will teach you to take that setup out to 1000 yards and maybe even further. I eas already reaching 700-800, but after applying what he teaches I was able to get my setup out further.
Cool. I've read his book I think.
Minute of Angle out of stock ammo with a mule kicker like the 7mm ! Outstanding.
Thank you I've tightened it up since then can't wait to hand load
Been thinking about doing this for my 30-06. Now I'm sold on it. Thanks for making this video!
You're quite welcome! Thank you for watching! Killed a caribou at 459 yards with this rifle last year.
@@AlaskanBallistics Awesome 👍
@@AlaskanBallistics subbed to your channel also.
@@caseyosborn875 thank you! I've tried to up my video quality since this video and I have a video coming out every weds. Godspeed Sir!
I bought the Magpul stock for my 7mm-08. It was a great purchase. Some guys at the range today were checking it out.
shumardi1. great.. i just re torqued and put the limbsaver on it..
Alaskan Ballistics have you been to the range since confirming torque settings? I can shoot groups less than 1/2". But since I have the lightweight barrel I notice as I continue to shoot the groups open up. I tried several factory loads and found that Winchester Deer Season XP shoots the best.
shumardi1 going today
Alaskan Ballistics So how did it go?
shumardi1 i had a bad day shooting, was me. but i managed a sub 1/2 moa group with the Hornady precision Hunter eldx
The magazine attachment will work on a BDL as it comes factory with the bullet drop floor plate.
Yep. Works on either
The rifle I shoot in competitive matches started life as a 700 adl , on sale at dicks! My budget build involved the mag pull hunter stock. Chambered in 308, the stock made a huge difference! A smithy suggested I tork the action screws to 65 in the rear, and the front screw slightly less...I settled on 63...kept the Remington barrel, stuffing the receiver with a 1 peace 20 moa rail..and topping it off with a swfa as fixed 10 power..the rifle performance is surprising at under 1/2 moa with 175 grain Sierra match kings with 41.7 gr of imr 4064.......big fan of magpul stock! Barrel is factory 26 in. 1/12 twist, varmint contour!
Nice. I just nailed a caribou at 459 yards with this rifle.
All steel tps one piece base, burris xtreme tactical rings and a Nikon black force 1000 scope
I bet with a heavy varmint barrel, that thing doesn't kick at all
@@AlaskanBallistics ...it's quite tame as you pointed out! Thinking about building another, this with 1/10 twist....but got to wait just bought at thermo weapon sight! Can't wait for it to arrive!!!!
I got my 700 06 for Christmas 40 years ago this year. I have been looking at this stock so I can go to the box mag. Thanks for the video.
You're welcome. It is heavier though!
I like how its the same cut of you shooting with safety glasses on each time, even though you sight in without several times and the video splits to the same cut.... Either way, solid video showing the stock install, and the shots. Good job.
John Kennelly yeah i flipped them up and down a lot, and cut the fact that i dropped them twice out. Lol good eye
I’ve had my rem 700 243 in the magpull hunter 700 stock for a couple of years now and I don’t like the but pad myself glad i ain’t the only one
Buttpads are easy to swap out, and Magpul makes beefier Buttpads.
@LynnJynh9315 I got the adaptor for the limbsaver
@@AlaskanBallistics What is it about the buttpad that's wrong? I'm guessing it ain't recoil, not with 243......
Was referring to my 7mm Rem mag
@@AlaskanBallistics try it with shoulder surgery then let me know how little 243 is lol
Positioning of your non shooting hand will help your groups. You are changing your entire position each time when you dont have your hand in the exact same position. It also looked like you were jerking the trigger just a tad, and I couldnt tell if you were pulling the trigger at the top or the bottom of your breathing pattern. I was in the Marine Corps Infantry, shooting fundamentals is most important. I have a 700sps tac and I get quarter inch groups at 100 yards with a magpul stock and a Vortex optic. Proper torque on those screws will help, and sticking with 1 type of ammo helps. Also, another thing people overlook is copper fouling inside the barrel. DO NOT CLEAN THE BARREL unless you absolutely have to. Only vlean yhe bolt and action. After 100-200 rounds you will build up a good level of copper fouling in the barrel and it will actually improve your accuracy. Most people dont know that about remington bolt action rifles, but the barrel design was not meant to be cleaned. Once the optimum level is built up each round will push out any excess and will keep tge proper amouny of fouling in the barrel. Try it and you will learn to appreciate the stock a lot more, although if you have the money I recommend a Mcmillan stock, doesnt matter which one, although we used the A3 STOCK in the marine corps. They are super heavy and creatr rigidity where it is needed. One more thing, remington 700 rifles chambered in 308 work best with an 18"-20" barrel. The twist rates were notvdesigned for a longer barrel which confuses me on why remington makes any longer barrel for a 308. If you are in love with what you have thats great because its still very capable, but id recommend trading out for an sps tactical if you get the chance. The heavy barrel is amazing, plus you can pay tge $200 for the tax stamp for a supressor and run that. The supressor actually will imcrease your accuracy, make the weapon quieter so your less likely to scare away the game, and actually tames some of the recoil a little bit. All in all its a nice rifle man.
Thank you for all the advice, I've been shooting in a lot better lately after properly torquing screws.Took a Caribou at 459 yards.
I'll take note as well...
I have this in .223 and just swapped out my rubber Houge for the Magpul....
Hope you enjoy
Glad I could help. Now let’s hope Biden doesn’t get elected because he wants to take ALL guns off the shelf except shotguns and black powder rifles. Handguns will not be allowed by anybody outside of law enforcement and military, and any and all battle rifles will be banned.
Before final torque it’s good to have rifle barrel to the sky and give it a couple of light taps on the ground buttstock to seat the recoil lug all the way to the rear…. Good glass bed would make it perfect 👍🏾
Thank you! Good advice
LOL, Ok I finished it. I like it too. The bottom mag is great. Thanks!
Yes sir it is!!! Send me some pictures!
Try shooting off bags if on a bench or put something heavy in front of the bipod to get a forward preload. I was having a lot of issues with my 700 7mmRM grouping poorly but once I got that bipod hop under control they tightened up. Great vid!!
Christopher Mullenix good advice, i re-torqued the stock and got some good groups
Without removing barreled action, you only have to remove the check riser if the bolt is obstructed. Check risers of various heights are available, also. My personal experience with Magpul Hunter 700 stocks are that the torque specs are dependent on the rifle. Not all rifle actions react the same to the suggested Magpul torque values. Some experimentation may yield a differing outcome.
Yes that has been done. Watch to the end gift the cheek riser
Great video, nice looking rifle and setup. Just wanted to mention, you can fit the Magpul magwell on other stocks, it just might take a little smithing. I installed one in my 700 long action with a Bell and Carlson stock. It took a lot less work than some I have seen and it feeds like a champ.
Nice!!!
also always make sure lug is all the way rearward whether bedded or not
Thanks that's good advice
This is the first video I've seen where the gun shot actually SOUNDs likea gun shot. In most other videos like garandthumb etc, there's so much attentuation of the transient that it sounds fake. This one's got that Crrrrrrack.
That's because I'm not rich enough to afford their microphone s and sound editing devices.
you can take the cheek riser off and get the bolt out. It has different size spacers for the cheek adjustments.
You didn’t watch to the end lol
@@AlaskanBallistics True there were a few seconds left on the video. Sorry
No problem Rooster
I have to admit that’s a very nice stock. I’ve seen you said before that it is a bit heavy but I don’t mind weight so much I might get a similar set up for my Remington 700 270. Either that or upgrade to a slightly bigger caliber/cartridge along with a better rifle. But with how you turned you adl into something so much more sounds interesting I own a sps model which I don’t care for because of the stock itself
You'll love the stock.
i then added kahntrol clamp on break and calvin elite trigger set to 1.5lb damn near same hole @100yd
I know someone that did a similar set up. 700 SPS ACC. He did a full glass bed on it and is getting a sub-MOA at 300 yds with match rounds.
+Gomer Pyle nice.. I've retorqued it and am getting just under moa
+Gomer Pyle that's awesome... May go that route though properly torquing the sick helped. A lot
If your shooting Barnes bullets that are solid copper apposed to the other three bullets you're shooting that are a gliding copper you will continue open your groups. It's best to shoot one or the other and not mix the two types of copper. Clean tour rifle until the re are no more signs of copper with something like Wipe Out that shows blue on the patches if there is any copper left in the barrel.
We had trouble with a good friend of mines rifle. He was shooting Barnes and Berger bullets, he couldn't keep a constant broupp untill he started shooting Berger's only. I prefer the Barnes bullets in most of my rifles btu the ones that don't shoot then I stick to one or the other.
That's great advice.. thank you. I've been sticking to the barnes led 139gr in the 7mm Mag
I am thinking seriously about getting one of these.
shumardi1 i love it... still a bit of tweaking to do
I have a 700 ADL .270 I have the same feeding issues, thanks for the video
No problem Bob
@@AlaskanBallistics well I just did the magpul stock and magazine upgrade
Fixed the feeding issues, it was an easy job your video really helped me
Thank you
Thank you for watching, and thank you for the feedback. I hope you enjoy many good treats of hunting with the stock.
i then bedded scope base and lapped rings was then shooting 1/4 min groups @ 100yards
I wonder if those groups will shrink if the barrel was cool between shot groups.
I cut out a lot of time between shots on the video. Properly torqued the groups are better now. Killed a caribou at 459 yards last year
i bedded my so called remington sps longrange 300winmag and cut groups in half now 1/2 min groups
Great vedio,, what caliber is your rifle?
7mm Remington Magnum. Thank You!
I just picked up a brand new one of these stocks at a Georgia Flea Market for 30 bucks
Deciding if I shouldn't throw it up for sale and put the funds towards something else,or keep it ?
Nice
That’s a pretty good rifle. A factory Remington that shoots consistently with all types of ammo is hard to come by.
Yeah it does better now that i tightened the stock down to torque specs
Great looking stock. Having to remove the cheek weld to pull the bolt is a pain but like you said at least they thought of it. Also sending it to you shows good for them. Having a mag is very kewl! Well done vid! I think the FDE should make for a good base for a camo job.
Regarding this issue, of having to remove the cheek rest every time, in order to pull out the bolt, I am proposing a cosmetic solution. Going to smoothly grind off enough material at that point where the bolt bumps the cheek rest, then fine shape the edges in design as if it came that way with epoxy and then paint that edge.
That would work. But I'm okay with it. Learned to love with it
Not sure if you noticed but your triger guard is broken on the rear screw. Most likely due to over tightening. Leads to inaccuracy due to unbalanced tightness. Can put the lug in a bind. Happened to me and to replace with a new metal one.
Thanks for letting me know
So it's been some time since posting. How do you like it? Were you able to replace the butt pad? Have you had any issues with the mag?
Good video by the way.
No issues with the magazines. I was able to get an adapter to buy for the butt pad. Made a 459 yd shot on a caribou
This is a good video on this system. I was wonder if you could go from ADL to DBM with it. I heard that the accuracy goes down this stock in general, but i have also been taught that ADLs have better accuracy because there is no buckle were the well is at. Anyway I've been checking out this stock and I think your video has convinced me to make a move on this thing. The od green is hard to find but the FDE is nice. Maybe I'll stick with straight black. Thanks for the video demonstration and insight.
JAC. I've actually gotten some nice groups since.... Just killed a caribou at 200 yards
Alaskan Ballistics that is awsome that's all I wanted it for hunting. I also wanted to the ease of taking a mag out for safety when I jump in and out of the vehicles.
Good vid, nice shooting, thanks!!
Thank you.
I'm wondering if you ever had the stock screws torqued to 40lbs. Before you shot it?
I did after this video. Makes all the difference. Duh to me🤦♂️
Thats an awesome rifle
It really has been... 459 yards on a caribou this past year... Barnes 139gr LRX. Thanks for watching and commenting!!!
Thanks for the demo.
Tom Olofsson you're welcome... I got better groups when i properly torqued the stock
Is your cheek piece removable? if so then remove it instead of taking action out of stock, no need to rezero that way
It's at the end of the video...
You mentioned the 700 adl not letting some rounds eject. And after your mod I noticed you didn’t have that problem. My ADL in 300wm doesn’t like to eject sometime and I really have to tug on it. Did you in fact fix that problem? Remington factory is closed so I can’t send it back like they want me too so exploring other options
It's not ejection but feeding into the chamber
Alaskan Ballistics oh ok. I have that problem too but I’m also having an issue with the bolt not coming back out of some cartridges after I fire. Some shots it comes out first go but most shots it’s like wicked stuck in there
Trigger job will tighten up those groups along with correct torque on screws.
Tom Panek probably. Got a recommendation?
Get a timney hunter trigger and find the exact torque spec of your triger guard or bottom metal/mag well!!!!! Or you will have problems no matter what ammunition or stock you use your torque specs are the foundation of your rifle!!!!!
I've torqued it properly... working on the timney trigger
Great Vid, Birchwood looked super busy that day.
Get an Inch Lb torque wrench. That'll tighten those patterns into groups.
Maxim Dolchok i did. Thanks... It tightened it up
Alaskan Ballistics what's the weight now with that stock?
Since the Remmy is cylindrical I bet a bedding job will cut it in half as well. Not needed, but doesn't hurt.
Maxim Dolchok wasn't too bad at Birchwood... I was the only one in that range that day
It was just a little bit more I'll have to put it on the scale when I get home and I'll respond to you then
Maxim Dolchok
Great idea on bedding job
To remove the bolt - take out screw in butt to adjust the length and the cheek riser pops off. Kind of a pain but only one screw
I show that at the end of the video. But thank you!
If you want to cut those groups easily in half have the action Glass Bedded and free float the barrel, adjusting the trigger helps to, you never mentioned what caliber your shooting but looks like 300 Win Mag, handloading will both save you money and if you do your part you can cut the same hole with it. My 300 Win Mag load is 180 gr Nossler accubond in a Nossler case behind 75.5 gr of Reloader 22, Winchester large magnum rifle primer. Seat the bullets out to function threw the magazine or .10 off the rifling. Which ever is shorter. I shoot regular sub 1/2 inch groups with mine, I just put his 3rd barrel on him
Kodeeni 7mm mag
Alaskan Ballistics
I just bought a Remington 700 7mm Mag, thinking of getting one of those stocks. I’ll glass bedding the wood stock to get the best groups. Shooting Nossler 175 LR accubonds. Will let you know how I do
Sweet... yes let me know...
The Magpul stock free floats the barrel
Did you have to get longer action screws or did the ADL screws work
The ADL screws worked just fine...
How tall are you? I notice your trigger finger is in a good position to the trigger? Also, if you don't mind, what do you currently have the LOP set at?
shumardi1. I'm 5'8"... standard length right now.. love the way my head fits the stock
I'm having the same problem. I'm going to do magpull stock
bradley michels i highly recommend it. I properly torqued it last night and it shot a good bit tighter today with Hornady ammunition
How did it work out?
i have not got it yet money been holding me back
bradley michels understand, I'm still eating rice from buying this thing!!!
Question how stiff is the fore end?? I understand that the barrel is free floated but are you able to flex the fore end up to touch the barrel?? I'm concerned that could effect accuracy
No that thing is solid
Thank you for watching!
Live the intro. The channel and videos
Andrew Bodnarchuk thank you sir!
The malfunction you were experiencing was a result of user error. Loading the rounds closer to the chamber, instead of almost touching the bolt face (while open) would have fixed this problem
I tried that a bunch off camera. Made it worse. Didn't matter how I loaded them.
@@AlaskanBallistics I ran into that same problem with a savage 300sm rifle. Didn't matter what I did it just didn't feed right.
300wsm.
I've got one going back to savage for that now
good review
Thank you
Bolder partition bullets are real destructive right? Might need to get some for porcupines. Awesome video.
Vaneater nosler partition... Yes... But they penetrate deeply too... A lot like the barnes
Alaskan Ballistics yeah I wasn't sure I was looking for some nasty 308 rounds to screw some porcupines up big time. But I'm trading that rifle in for a Remington 700 aac sd in 308 and I will get this same stock but in od green. 16.5 inch barrel should be nice and loud. 308 doesn't kick like yours tho hahahahahha.
My 2012 rem 700 has the same feeding issue. Always hunt with 2 rounds in the mag and 1 in the chamber. Cant load it with more than 2, just get me Issues
New stock with magazines makes a huge difference.
I like it 👍👍
Thanks!
2 questions... I tried scanning your comments and couldn’t find answers my questions.
1. How do you like the look of the sporter barrel in the stock? Do you have any pics? I’ve only seen these stocks with heavy barrels and not the factory barrel.
2. I have a .270 and a .300WM. Can I buy one stock and swap out if I wanted too since both are long action? Or is there a LA and a Magnum mag kit?
Thanks!
I don't have any picks but recommend you check out my caribou scouting packraft video there's so good shots in there... i like the looks.
2) there is a long action magwell and long action magwell
But the stock is the same
MaxairEngineering a .270 and .300 WM are both Long Actions. One is a standard long action and one is a magnum.
I understand the fact that a SA and a LA are not interchangeable. I was referring to the OP saying it was a magnum LA kit.
@@TheMOXFilms sorry I meant to say there is a long action mag well, and a long action Magnum mag well, somehow my phone didn't put that into the comment section. My speak to text is awful. The stock is the same for the long action and a long action Magnum but the mag Wells are different
This may sound dumb, but how can you tell what type of action it is
Thanks very much for this review! Does the bipod attach via some type of mlok adapter?
Yes a fixed sling swivel stud. I may have a gunsmith flute the stock a little to save weight
Yes you have the option to throw on a sling mounted bipod or use the mlok keyholes on the bottom of the stock
How does it feel? Does it feel solid or cheap and hollow? Is it light or heavy solid.... It sounds like cheap hollow plastic... I really want to purchase one, but without feeling it, holding it... I'm hesitant....
+Leaving Communitst NY it's heavy duty polymer... It feels great, very durable and a reason it's not cheap!
Wow... Thanks for the fast reply.... I have a hard time ordering things on line.. Tactile quality in a stock is so important... Without being able to put my hands on it I was worried about the feel.... The polymer stock the 700 came w. sucks.... feels like a pop bottle...
Leaving Communitst NY couldn't agree with you more on the regular stock.... This stock is offered on a factory version, is go to a store (maybe not in NY) and pick one up and feel it.
I bought that same rifle up here in Anchorage at the ammo can think about swapping out the stock for something more tacticool
Don't blame you there. This one is heavy. I'd look for a minimalist chassis system now that i know better
Look up mdttac.com/us_en/lss-chassis-system.html this is my idea for ak hunting set up for long hikes
Sweet video. I want to do the same to my adl. What bottom metal did you get. The 700L magnum or 700L long action
Adam Harger 700L Magnum!
Thanks for watching man... You'll love it.
Look at the adl spring on the follower has moved back
Thanks. This gun is staying in this stock...
@@AlaskanBallistics that's what happened to mine
What ammo you cycling. My model 700 cycles fine. 30-06 by the way. I use remington core-lokt in it by the way. Just for hunting anyways and thats all ive ever used the 700 for. Just a thought.
P.s i think a detachable mag would be great though. Didnt watch whole vid before commenting
I guess i do expierience the head of the bullet not wanting to slide up in sometimes
Federal nosler partitions... barnes tsx, winchester powerpoint, hornady sst, did it with a lot of ammo
Hmm well either way some of em just come out of the factory bad. I will say the stock looked awesome. Just needs a bipod. Also if youve never checked out the old 760 gamemaster bdl. Pretty sweet little gun. Just a white tail slayer really.discontinued in 93 i believe.
Yeah i've got a haris bipod on it now...
Chuck, it’s been some time since you’ve installed this stock, has this rifle seen any field use? Notice any wear? Is it too heavy to pack on a moose hunt? Great video, I’m sure lots of time goes into it, showing the shot, then the impact in succession like that. Thanks!
+fishfulthinking1514 Thank you for watching! It killed one caribou on August 11 (has video), was recently on a winter caribou hunt. It is heavy but not too heavy for my taste. Groups tightened up after i torqued it properly.
Alaskan Ballistics excellent. Thanks for the reply. Maybe I’ll bump into you one day. I’m on the peninsula.
fishfulthinking1514 Nice is there anywhere to shoot down there? I went to hope once
Alaskan Ballistics depends where you go. There’s a 1000 yd range here now, but I haven’t been there since the addition. I generally shoot off the back porch at my sisters house.
fishfulthinking1514 yeah we were looking for a place to shoot some videos this weekend lol thanks
I'm putting together a 7mm-300, also referred to as a 7mm Practical (necked down .300 Win Mag) . I read max cartridge OAL for the magazine is 3.5". Are they correct on that? I'd love it if they were actually closer to 3.7" I want to use this setup. I have one of these in a 700 SA in .243 and love it.
Robert W i just measured my magazine. looks like anything loaded past about 3.52" Would probably rub the bullet on the front of the magazine.
Thanks for checking for me. You just saved a big headache.
You're quite welcome. I don't know if you could file the inside of the magazine that much. I doubt it. Best of luck...
Are you loading that long to fit the round to your chamber?
Yes. If I shoot 195gr-197gr ELD or VLD bullets, I will have to load them that long to avoid jumping them too far. I don't want more than .010 jump. I think I am just going to shoot 140-168gr bullets in this rifle. This is going to be a hunting/varmint rifle.
Robert W , I had a Browning A-Bolt that was that way, too longof a throat
Do they make that stock to fit a heavy fluted barrel
Yes same stock
Just some suggestions you need to bed the recoil lug,action,and bottom metal
Thank you for all of the suggestions
Nope it has a machined aluminum bedding block no need for epoxy bedding
Honestly, its not a bad stock. But i am kinda disapointed with it, and that mainly goes against weight. Its not terrible, but i was hoping it would be lighter than my old wooden stock. Shortening the forend wouldnt hurt my feelings either. May end up lighting the block via flutes and holes
Mathew Christian good idea...
+The Bogeyman it is heavier
Alaskan Ballistics syncrinized holes along the side, im thinking 3/8 - 1/4 imch holes, but im still measuring, and planning. Ill update you on how it goes
Does this stock lift the barrel to make it free floating or is it still making contact with the forward end of the stock? Was considering one of these for my 700ADL 7 Rem Mag.
It doesn't lift the barrel, it is free floating
Will the bolt come off ??or do you have to take apart to get bolt off
It's at the end but yeah you have to take the buttpad off to get the cheekriser off.
As far as your groups opening up goes. I wonder if you seated your recoil lug before tightening your action screw.
Yeah I figured out both Problems by now. Groups are getting better I just haven't made a video of it yet. I really appreciate the suggestions! Thank you very much!
YA... I edited my original comment because I hadn't watch the video till the end. Just didn't want to forget what I was going to say. But glad you got it figured out.
Mardy26 no problem sir. I've done that before too
Nice stock and good information video. I've a question: Does this Magpul stock have a good weight to it? I have the Rem 700 ADL 06, with the original wooden stock. I bought a synthetic stock from an army Ranger who removed it from his newly purchased 700. I thought it'd be nicer to have a black synthetic stock, but what I didn't like ehen I mounted it, was the new weight. It's too light. That rifle already kicks like a mule having supportive weight from the wood stock, but I think it'll be worse with a lite stock. I have been thinking of buying this Magpul for a while.. What say ye?
It's a pretty hefty stock yes. High shot it side-by-side with another 7 mmeter Remington magnum Remington 700 the other day and the one with the magpul stock feels a lot better than the wood stock
@@AlaskanBallistics So you don't know the weight of stock before you mounted it? I'd have to check with manufacturer. Do you know weight Now? Could you say?
My gun scope and everything is over 9 lbs
@@AlaskanBallistics so how's the recoil?
Very mild my wife shoots it. I do have a limbsaver on it
I have the short action and I can take my bolt out without removing the check riser.
Yep only on the short actions
Looks nice.
Thanks Rich! Just uploaded a Ballistics video today on it
Your barrel must of got hot almost looks as if the groups opens up do to heat could be a possibility?
Stock not properly torqued
@@AlaskanBallistics I did that with my scope last summer I was on than all of a sudden my scope was way off after moving an inch I bought better rings
Did you need longer screws to mount your top action?
No sir
I saw on magpul's website that they sell 10 round mags also.
John McClane for the magnum? sweet I'll have to check that out... might come in handy in bear country...
John McClane just looked and there's no ten round for the magnum
My mistake....I didn't realize yours isn't a .308
Did you ever tighten up both stock screws? They should be torqued to 65 in.-lbs. I also see that you are a local guy in Alaska, the Anchorage, Wasilla or the Palmer area. I'm Wasilla!
Rudolph Ferdinand yes sir I did, but I did not get any footage of it yet. It did shoot much better with groups tightening to about half an inch with the Hornady Precision Hunter 162 grain ELD X
anchorage
Alaskan Ballistics I need to replace a stock on a Browning XBolt but Magpul doesn't have a stock for my Browning, so have to buy one from McMillan and they will cost me about $500, and that's with a military/veterans discount 20% off. I'm a EPM member at Birchwood Park and I normally do my shooting Monday, Tuesday, or Wednesday never the other days. I hope to see you one day at Birchwood Park; white Dodge truck 2003 military stickers rear window.
Okay. I'm not a member yet. But when i do join I'll see you there
The cheek piece is easily removable if the bolt doesn't clear during removal. Give me a 270 over a 7mm Rem mag. I don't like how recoil affects accuracy. For the additional recoil there is not really any significant gain in ballistics over the 270. But, hey, for each his own! Shoot what you like! I enjoyed your video.
I removed the cheek piece at the end of the video.
Funny, my bolt comes out without hitting the stock.
You must have a short action?
Alaskan Ballistics i have a short action, and my bolt clears as well.
you remove the cheek riser to remove the bolt. I do it all the time
Exactly, pain in the butt
Did you get the action screws torqued properly before this accuracy test? That would make a difference.
shumardi1 agreed... yes but my friend's wrench broke during the process... so I've got to get one
Let us know how the accuracy improves after you torque it correctly. I think it will improve a lot.
A Wheeler Fat Wrench is a good economical way to go.
shumardi1. economical... they're still $70
Alaskan Ballistics Well, it is an expensive sport. But imagine how expensive it would be if it was tactical. The Wheeler Tactical Fat Wrench.
If you have a set of calipers could you measure the longest round that will fit in their magazine? I load longer than factory and they fit in the factory box mag.
OSUNickTheGreek yes sir... It'll take a me a few hours to get hone and get it done. But I'll try
Thank you for watching
+OSUNickTheGreek can't find my calipers utrrggghhh! Will borrow some
No problem. I appreciate the help.
OSUNickTheGreek yeah i was caribou hunting off the Denali hwy heading home now... Be at least tomorrow jan 3
What did you retorque to get better groups?
64 in pounds
What bipod are you using?
Light weight Harris 6-9"
What brand is your T-handle screwdriver and where can we purchase one?
Got it at lowes. Don't remember the brand
Take the spacers out and the cheek piece should come out
Jonathan Murray thank you sir... I think i did that at the very end.... Thanks for watching
of course ive worked up a load using r22 powder,208gr eldx match bullets .007 off lands
I’d love to have seen before vs after
Yeah i should have thought about it
Actually, you're shooting 4 different bullets from 4 different makers. Thus your bullets' copper is different recipes. This may impede the accuracy you're getting. You may also find a variance of groupings between a CLEAN barrel and a copper fouled barrel. Cold/warm barrel variance too. Remove copper fouling between brand of bullets.
Clean your barrel, shoot a couple of fouling shots, then shoot with a cold barrel for zero. Do that for every new make of bullet.
Cleaning your barrel after every firing is no longer needed with today's modern powders. This was needed back in the day of using black powder, which is highly corrosive and became strict tradition passed down from father/son over the centuries. Modern powders are not corrosive. Clean your barrel when you find accuracy dropping off, then a few fouling shots to re-establish your carbon fouling.
Measure how far back your bolt goes with the cheek riser piece in place. Remove the cheek riser piece and measure how far back the bolt moves. You MAY be able to use a round file and remove some of the plastic from the nose of the cheek riser piece, buff it smooth with sandpaper (also softening the edges) and be able to remove your bolt. If you must remove enough material to end up with a "hole" in the cheek riser piece, remove a bit more and create a form using masking tape on the outside and fill the void with epoxy. Fine tune it with sandpaper when cured and a touch of FDE paint. If you use black epoxy and like the contrast, just tune it up with some sandpaper to dress it smooth.
Thanks for the advice. Getting a torque wrench and making sure I screwed them into spec made everything very accurate. Look at my 7mm Rem Mag 120gr ttsx video. Thanks. Godspeed
anyway good job keep shooting
Thank you
Not suprized you didn't seat the damn action before torque
You're right after doing that my group's improved. Didn't take a video of that. Thanks for the comment. Godspeed
Sand the end of the cheek riser down. Shape it a little
Easy fix
Or just remove it like shown at the end of the video
So I can take my remington 700 adl and just by that magpul stock and it will accept a magazine?
Stock and magazine well, but it works just fine. Thanks for watching
You have to buy the magpul magwell separately.
Yep kinda sad
Are the Magpul mag stocks compatible with other calibers like 22-250?
I believe the short action stock may be compatible. Not 100% Sure... If it's not longer than a .308 it should work
Thank you!
You're quite welcome... The bright side is that if you get it and it doesn't work for you, you can probably get your money back... Or you could probably sell it for 75-80% of new value later
asanmartinjr07 - Just fitted on of these stocks on my 22-250. The .308 P mags work fine with the 22-250 rounds.
Maris Pip3r thank you for responding, that’s good information
What size did you use to take out the trigger guard off?
I don't remember. I don't touch it now
does the short action version mag accept .223
Not sure... I'd assume there's a solution for that but I'd find a stock and bottom metal that took ar mags
So after a bit of research looks like you can get it to take AICS mags for either the 5.56x45 pattern or the 7.62 x 51 nato pattern
Works with a remington 700 ,300 win mag?
Should. Should be the exact same thing
Thanks, these videos really help 👍
@@rubenmoreno782 you're quite welcome sir!!! Thank you for watching!
How long is your barrel?
ltr450NoS 24"
Can I use this stock for a savage axis 6.5 creedmoor?
Only if magpul makes a stock for that specific model. I don't think they do