Probably just fine. The agitator might ware down a little bit but that can easily be replaced for a couple hundred. There isn't much that can go wrong with stationary welded/solderd sheet metal
I'm totally new to Stilling... got my wife a still for her birthday ( yes, really for her! lol )... we didn't have a clue about any of this and so I got a cheap $260 Chinese still from Amazon because hey, I don't know if we'll even enjoy it!, purchased some turbo yeast, made a sugar wash and a few days later made our first Spirits. While not an ideal setup, it was fun and a fantastic way to become a beginner and get results that are drinkable. Love starting to go through your videos, educational and entertaining.
I built my 1st still recently after 5 months of watching Jamie and a couple others. I decided on a 35L Digiboil, a generic copper alembic dome, SS 2" column with reflux cond. and main cond. with a sight glass and digital thermometer all in tri-clamp. I added a gin basket at the top and a SS basket inside the boiler for on-fruit/grain distilling. I picked up a Brewzilla heat wrap as well. I sourced the parts from whoever had the part I wanted cheapest. Most of the 2" column parts are all from China. The SS basket is for an 8qt. Instapot. I set up the main cond. cooling to run off a hand made garden hose adapter with shut off valve for flow control. The reflux cooling is a separate 1/4" system with a pond pump in a big bucket. All together about $800. I can use it to make almost anything. I hope this helps other with build ideas.
Great video, would definitely be cool to do a series on still building experiences from different price points and perhaps some number 8 wire approaches as well. Good job Jesse keep em coming!👌👌
For that pump, as long as you control it on the discharge side and have fittings that will hold 20-30 psi, you can completely stop flow and not hurt anything. Gotta be on the discharge side though, control flow on the suck side and you'll cavitate. Centrifugal pumps will just sit there and spin with the fluid, not positive displacement like and piston pump that makes a solid seal on discharge and needs relief valve like you're average garage air compressor. But bypassing the extra probably helps with cooling though. Thanks for all the videos!
Lucky man indeed , let’s face it people spend many times more on jet skis , boats , motorcycles, ect it’s his hobby , very keen to see your follow up vid in the future , cheers jesse tip top work as usual 🥃👌🏼
We have these at the stills at work. It’s gotta be a safety manifold, usually with a pressure gauge, pressure release valve, and not sure what the third opening would be for...
@@iceman77706 The ones I saw running the third was always blocked off. In a still that has a control system youd have another gauge to the computer controller in the third one.
I've been running a 30L china special for the last 6 years. It's stood up to aaaalot of use. I've averaged a run per week for those 6 years and the only failure has been a brass retaining nut that secures the pot-mounted thermometer. It simply disintegrated at about 3 years. Replaced for 50 cents. Guys, don't buy the cheapest of the Chinese products but their mid->upper range stills are a heckuva value. You can spend more on "made in XXXXX" if you need the support but don't kid yourselves. Most of the components in that gear are from the far east regardless.
"Most of the components in that gear are from the far east regardless." That is the reality. You see a lot of fear based on racial stereotypes in these threads about stuff being built in China so people buy "Made in America" or "Made in XXXX" and those are just companies selling you stuff made in China anyway. I went down a Coffee rabbit hole and spent quite a lot on espresso makers and grinders and at this point my entire setup is made in China. China has because a technological and manufacturing powerhouse, not just a country making cheap knock-offs. It will take a while for people's perceptions to catch up.
I also operate a Chinese still. Not quite as spanky as that one but what I like most about it is using the boiler for mashing, fermenting and distilling. All OK for a hobby based op. No complaints about quality.
I love it! What a beautiful still. Here in the U.S.A. we can't play like you folks. If the thing works as well is it looks...I'm really glad for the man. I just run a 30L copper pot still. I have no real drinking buddies around here so I don't require a nice still like that. Great video! Cheers!
I hope so cause I already did. bought the same column but I'm not ready for the jacketed pot yet. bought the same control box but they also offer with a PID. No customs fees in the US so no hidden fees there. Don't know if it did at the time this was shot but it clearly states on their website that the control box doesn't include any wiring from mains or to the elements so no surprises for me there. I already have a 60 amp welder circuit and am familiar with wiring the elements so I'll be good to go. Unfortunately I am not in the US at the moment so I won't be able to report on quality until May. I am encouraged by the findings of your friend Dana. Thanks this was a great video. I had seen a few reviews on other channels but none really looking in depth at the quality workmanship like yours.
PID's are inherrently flawed for distilling, please do a few searches maybe on homedistiller or another reputable source. They are only promoted by people lacking a basic understanding of how distillation works. Simple power or voltage regulation works perfectly, but trying to control that process based on a thermoprobe is a massive fail.
@@MrJhchrist I have done some research on the use of PIDs. I intend to also use my controller for mashing and boiling on a separate vessel which is why I chose a PID. It is my understanding I can use it in manual mode which is basically like looking at a digital thermometer and making power adjustments with that readout as a reference. I'm not a beginner and I have mashed boiled and distilled with manual control as well as direct fire propane before. I decided I would like to try PID and if it doesn't work out as expected the price difference is minimal in the grand scheme of things and will be very easy/cheap to retrofit.
@@bookie60 Right on. I think it's important to make the distinction though as "manual mode" literally has nothing to do with Proportional-Integral-Derivative control. While some PID controllers do allow for a manual power control, that is a completely different thing and any random newb reading our comments should hear that. Especially since a few very inexperienced distillers have fairly large platform on YT and also happen to sell PID controllers. Actual PID control is great for mashing, terrible for controlling a still boiler where the boiling point inherently varies from batch to batch as well as throughout every run. But by all means if a PID controller also offers power control then it can be used for boilers as well as mashing (or fermenting, or sous vide etc). Cheers
I don't really give a shit how some random noob interprets my random youtube comment. I don't really think I have a burden of responsibility here. Especially when George over at barley and hops (who by the way seems to have a fairly good understanding of the basic principles of distillation) is making whole videos about how great pids are. My original comment only barely mentioned the fact that Oak Stills controller is also offered with a pid. And I only mentioned it because some people might want one and they don't list it on their website. Should have known I would get scolded by some forum dad. You know on second thought I'm gonna run in full PID mode and leave my still unattended and see if the garage blows up or if it makes pure methanol and I go blind.
@@StillIt Thanks for the show. I'm just like so many others here on your channel drooling over that setup. I'm trying to start a small destillery here in Sweden. So, is there any chance of you letting us know the manufacturer of the setup?
Yes, I am jealous too, in the nicest of ways! But that's a big bucket of money, albeit for a very large professional bit of kit, which tends to make me think, as a few have mentioned already, that James might have some difficulty in showing that it is solely for his personal use/hobby. Finally, the "journey" that many of us take in getting to a useable, and personal, still is one that James seemed to have bypassed. Many of us prefer the "Jesse" method, i.e. buy stuff, get stuff made, discover better ways to do stuff by failing at some etc. etc. Overall, more power to you James and good luck with it all 👍 The only downside, which I must mention, is that it's a crying shame you couldn't get NZ made product(s) to fulfil your needs 🙁
@@charlesschmidtke8427 Are the commercial controllers worth having for a hobbyiest? SCR or even PID with a soldering iron seem like enough for a tended still. Ground Fault circuit is the only part you need to buy that is expensive.
I am new to the craft but I can't shake the feeling that I will always love my setup because I built it mid lockdown with what I had. I converted an urn into a still and have been tweaking it ever since for the love of it. No agitator built in but it cost around 2000 ZAR (South African Rand). But one day I might buy a beast like this.
I can totally agree with this. I still love my ccvm / pot / plate still. It really comes down to the boiler with this thing. I think beat solution is build everything else and buy a potnin a lot of ways
@@StillIt Nothing to really respond with brov, Ii just wanted to say that you're a legend and You're channel was a huge motivator for me getting into this craft. Ii knew I could make ethanol, but you gave me the confidence to produce adequate booze lol. Genuine thanks (even though ya from the wrong side of rugby hahaha #SA) you awesome dude!!!!!
My keyboard just fucked out. I trust you'll decipher my message. It's difficult to pretend that I screwed up "I" at least twice and somehow squeezed a "you're" in there where a "your" shoulda gone hahahaha. But then put "you" where I should've put "you're".... I give up hahaha
You need a globe valve if you want to throttle flow, to keep the valve from washing out. I can't imagine it would be a real-world problem with low-pressure water though more of a high-pressure thing. That's what we use in oil and gas applications.
I did "cleaning" for start ups or rework on FDA food and Pharm stills and posses piping, run Tri Sodium Phosphate(TSP) at steam temps, low% to water (1tbs per gal) PH about 10 or 11. Gets rid of any oils and others used in manufacturing or shipping. Neutralize with Citric/Ascorbic or vinegar over board. Then run with your acid of choice, overboard, rinse, and ready to go! Works good on ammo cleaning too. Thanks for the info guys!
I also bought a 4 inch coloumn and a dephlegmator from Oak stills. All looked good but the dephlegmator sensor was put to measure the water temperature instead of measuring the steam temperature which makes it a lot harder to run properly so I had to rebuild that a bit. And also the sensor didn't have any gasket or option to add it so it was leaking quite a lot. But the craftmanship sure looks nice.
You guys are competent cobbers. If you pick up an older dehumidifier you can easily convert it to a circulating ice water source by gently bending the condenser down into the collection tub. Add some insulation, a pump, and hoses and you have a device with one third to one half of the footprint of a freezer. It is not as pretty as your still, but, usually cheap at yard sales and thrift shops. Most folks ran the appliance around the clock, then barked at the power bill. Converted, the collector is a block of ice after 20 minutes and lasts for hours so add a timer or thermal controlled on off switch and the cost of a run is minimal. I chose the thermal method.
I’ve just done the same exercise - 50L 4 plate, 4 inch still, big whiskey head/onion, gin basket, and and and. Sitting in the box at hone waiting for me to get back and unpack it. Price was about half of what I could get for exactly the same item locally.
mmm, chinesium. I have about 100 more Chinese shipments to go before I have all my piece parts. Love Ali but you have to be very patient. Being able to order a pallet with all the bits would be so nice. 30 gallon pot, 4" column. Those are big batches for a home brewer. Getting that jacketed pot is a big win and he might have saved money buying bits and pieces but he could have easily ended up spending more buying things twice and adding all the different shipping costs. Seems too big for a hobbyist to me but I certainly wouldn't turn it down if you sent it to me.
If its Jacketed, the more economical route is to use water in the jacket, fill above the heat elemetns, to where the lowest check valve is at. The high density steam is is more efficient than a liquid bath bain marie. Additionally its also more responsive to changes in heat adjustments.
That will create very low density steam. High density steam is what you have in powerplants where the vapor is so dense it's damn near 1kg/L You need a very high pressure vessel if you want to hold the high density steam and the fact that the still is robbing the jacket of so much heat and there is only a few kW of power to produce that steam there will never be anything other than just a very very low density steam in this setup.
I run a 150liter jacketed boiler similar to this one, trust me the jacket with enough water to keep the 2 5500 watt elements submerged with steam in the jacket is more than adequate to boil the mash in this guy's boiler. There is no need for oil or glycol, that just adds unnecessary costs to running you still. Maybe its not high pressure, but the steam itself is very dense and will boil the mash to 212F very easily.
@@hypnopooper6252 Indeed! However what you have is not high density steam. High density steam is wet steam above 10 bar of pressure. I doubt your jacket can hold even 2 bar. It most probably is vented to atmosphere.
Seconded on this - my jacketed boiler works way better when not full of water. I’ve not thought about using Glycol before - I would be interested to see sone stats on how that higher boiling point impact on overall times.
Plum brandy - sieve the seeds out first before charging the boiler, using a 6 mm sieve. Otherwise mill the fruit and make a puree for fermenting. Even with a spherical bottom kettle, the plum pits clog up a 2 inch TC port and ball valve. Nice work.
Breaking up all the seeds in your plums before mashing or even distillation will definitely put you far over any threshold for cyanamide which any country considers "safe" or you'll have to end your run a LOT earlier, and even then you're kind of pushing it. There are drum based sieve machines which will remove the seeds from stone fruits without damaging them, but they are often either very big or very expensive bits of kit, sometimes both. The most compact one I could find is the robot coupe c80, but if you can't find one second-hand, it really is too expensive to buy new. A better solution is to allow for backpurging on the outlet so you can dislodge stones if they do get stuck. That way, a 2" TC port will be able to handle almost anything besides the more stubborn grappa mashes, though it does use more water and creates more backset. Depending on your strategy of elimination that might be a bigger issue than clogging though.
The gaskets in column must fitet properly and it must have a puzz for a bublle plate. Thats to avoid leaking. My one is only 50l boiler but it's works right out of a box. Good luck guys! Congratulations for a nice buy!
Awesome to see! I've just bought myself a column from the exact same company. Very impressed with their customer service. Quality isn't the best but should work well. Ended up with a 4 inch, 6 plate borosilicate glass column. Has a 20 inch packed section before the dephlegmator. Running 2x2200w elements in a cut an shut double keg boiler. Maiden voyage in less than two weeks with good old tpw. Should step my shed game up!
I have the 8 gallon from Mile High, excellent quality gear, good service, still way more expensive that I could have brought from China. Slight pang of buyers remorse.
@@jasonpowell8582 don't have buyers remorse. From what I have read about milehigh, they are in the business of providing the best quality they can. It probably far exceeds what is needed, but you have the best. Enjoy what you have and slumber in the comfort of having something special! There are more expensive options I'm sure.
I have been inspired by the still it posts, and those of Barley and Hops, Bearded and Bored too. So much so I have enrolled on a course to look at setting up a legitimate business in the UK to progress my interest to a business. Being in the same job for 15 years with all the uncertainty the last year has brought has made me think about a new avenue. Bless Jesse, George and the Bearded champ for giving me the option to progress to the next step. I may not proceed, but I'll find out what I decide soon.
Hey Jesse and James, I'm hoping you guys could do a video on how to run something like this. I've had thoughts on getting something like this as my mate from lazy dayz brewing has a bubble plate setup from oakstills also and it's a real good quality setup. Thanks for the video guys
You are now entering the Zone of distillers and mad scientist all. So you make beer that's good because you must make a "wort, mash, beer"; all the same thing just different names before you can distill it. This in a great hobby and I wish you well. A jar of good shine will open doors that a dollar bill cant. Bio-Clinical engineer here. I love this stuff.
You could go with 3 gallon barrel or even a bain marie then 40 gallon brute bucket and a beer keg still will fill 3 gallons. 200l stills are always expensive and jacketed is double that.
WOW from a 25L pot still to a monster, definitely invested in it now. Still looks great! Any recommendations to upgrade from a T500 without breaking the bank?
Great video makes me feel a little more confident I have a still coming from China 55 gallon they customized it for me it has a 6-in column a 6-in whiskey helmet and a 6 inch pot still so I can go between two different units it's not jacketed it does have an agitator I'm not using electric elements I'm doing propane because this will be used in West Africa. Love watching you and your adventures I've built most all of my stills myself pot still reflux still and I just completed my first vacuum still which was a real eye opener
Love your set up so much I built almost the same keg. First run at expected 15% bout 2 gallon. Ran perfect but at 2 gallon it was still at 60%... Thanks and be safe
To get that kind of still for that price, wow. If it performs as well as it looks, that'll make his distillations so much easier, more precise, and faster. He's going to absolutely love having that little pot at the drain for his specific gravity readings, since it's just another means of confirming that your distillate is coming over at the rate you want it with the separation from the parent solution that you're looking for, so you can adjust your reflux on the fly until it behaves how you like. Such a cool piece of kit for the money.
Looks like they shipped him silicone gaskets and not PTFE ones. Ignoring any potential safety issues they will pick up and hold the Gin aromas and flavours so will be OK until he wants to run a neutral and then they will leach flavour back out. PTFE gaskets don't cost much more and work just as well, it just seems strange that companies still ship silicone gaskets that degrade when exposed to quite a few chemicals in the distillate. Acetone, which is in foreshots, swells silicone just at room temperature and can effect the seal, under reflux all gaskets are exposed for quite some time so something to watch out for even if you aren't concerned about using unsuitable plastics in distilling.
Yeah, even if you forget the potential for chemical leaching, you really can't forget about the fact that those gaskets will degrade over time, and if you wait to replace them until they fail, they'll fail in the middle of a run which is a whole mess, not to mention a fire hazard. Much better to use PTFE foam gaskets, they last forever, don't get pinched, and unless you're boiling fluorine, you don't have to worry about any chemical leaching.
I worked at a distillery company for a few years, and we ordered ALL the stills from China to resell them. Several distillery brands get their tanks from China. Then, we modified them a little to make them work correctly. Most of them have held good through the years, and the ones that didn't were usually ruined over the operator. I no longer work there and have nothing to gain from it. If you're curious about running a Chinese still, they work just fine. Some tanks may require modifications to function if you buy straight from China.
A tiktok creator had a really good video about ethical purchasing from places like China that have bad reputations and there is a fair amount to be said but basically if your willing to do a ton of research (if your planning on being commercial that should be your standard imo) you can find manufactures everywhere that produce cheap products but pays their employees fair wages after you adjust them for purchasing power.
My still is Chinese, the cheapest I found (70$). It was crap, but after adding some inox tubing to make the column large enough for packing (20$), it's quite usable! Like with most cheap Chinese inox, the welds aren't too good and tend to get some surface rust. The rust always washes out with the foreshots. Not great if you're serious about the craft, but for a low-budget hobbyist it's OK
I bought a still from Oak a few years ago, although a lot cheaper version. 100ltr boiler 4” x 4 plates. Also got the control box. Cheap as $1,600 USD delivered. A few issues, the controls box was way over sized, the plates leak a bit, just need tap and tighten as u go. Seeing the jacketed boiler makes me think it’s time for an upgrade! Made heaps of booze, gin, whiskey, rum. I’m the most popular bloke in my street.
It looks nice, our company also produce it!! This is Christine, a sales from DYE company which is a professional manufacturer in China, mainly producing distilling, brewing equipment, freeze dryer, stainless steel tanks etc.
Let me start by saying I know nothing about stills but I find your content educational. An old shiner told me if I ever get into making shine never buy copper made in China as its not pure copper but is alloyed with other metals {which makes the copper much cheaper to produce} and can have an adverse effect on your product. I also had a HVAC tech tell me the same thing, Chinese copper is not real copper.
Even thow im from the us and 100% believe in buying 🇺🇸. That thing is a beauty and the set up is ingenious! If distillation alcohol was legal for a home hobby in the USA and I had the funds i would totally invest in 1 from that company. Absolutely awesome
Hi there. Greetings from Latvia. Been watching your videos and since then upgraded my still from 15 L to 45 L and a 2" DIY cooper collumn with reflux. My question is what is the max ABV of this still? Because i can get 87 % only with reflux and some cooper wire balls stufed into the column. Thanx fore the videos. Lots of intersting info from YOU.
I'm really considering making one from scratch using stainless pipe, stainless ~55 gallon drums, etc.. I've also considered substituting the reflux for is very cheap lab grade counterparts and just introducing copper elsewhere. idk. lol
I found your videos about 3 weeks ago after a knee surgery 😳 and fell in love with the idea of home brewing. My best friend loves vodka so I will be using that video. I like Irish whiskey how do you get that flavor profile? Yes I know for it to be true Irish it must come from Ireland. My father like bourbon is there a recipe and process for that flavor. Thank you.
Cool man, you definitely found a cool hobby. Irish your going to want to mix malted barley and unmalted barley. To get started something like 30% unmalted. Bourbon is all about corn. Corn gets tricky hough as you have to deal with a super thick poridge like mash. You could check out ujssm to get started.
@@jaredschwiner6844 I don't know about the gin basket. But a lot of people make smaller pieces of oak (the size of a finger roughly) and toast them up, you can speed up the flavouring that way.
Guessing that "water manifold" is a RIMS tube for heating the jacket potentially? Heating element in the long and and water in/out on the side with a temp gauge in the 1/2" NPT port.
@@StillIt Ahh ok. I couldn't really see the boiler and on second thought guessing the element already goes straight into the jacket and already has the in/out port on the jacket. Guess the mystery will continue lol...
Agreed! I have a 5 gal. Chinese no jacket. Enough to get the bug. In the process of building a dirty love child between Still it and bearded . Love the craft ! Love the hobby! Happy “distilling “!!!
I really need you help. I am a huge fan. Here in the Caribbean, St Lucia, I am considering purchasing a 600L non jacketed still from Oakstills. For the production of whiskey, corn based. What do you think. Jacketed or non jacketed and why? Also, their 800mm high condenser seems to be on the small side for that still capacity of 4*7k watts boiler and 8* plate 8" column. What are your thoughts?
Great Video. Very well made and i really like that you people from the trades to review!! The video came at the right time... i was thinking of buying one, seems like there is some more planning and banking to do.. ;) cheers thx
I’m new to distilling, I’m about to find out if my Chinese still is worth it. Either way, I think it’s a good place to start. If it turns out well I think my next move will be a copper still 10 gallon or so.
I just met with the people who made these last mouth. Copper workers are paid extremely well in China ( compared to others ) Some of the factory are starting produce high quality still. Most of their order came from the EU / Taiwan (Whisky distilling just isn't a thing in mainland China and Baijiu still don't use copper) So shit products will get them no where.
A follow-up video would be really nice.
I am curious how the thing does after 2 years.
Probably just fine. The agitator might ware down a little bit but that can easily be replaced for a couple hundred. There isn't much that can go wrong with stationary welded/solderd sheet metal
It's ALWAYS good to have a sparky as a really good friend, no matter what country you live in!
You mean a welder?
No you mean an electrician
@@crakkbone either way you would have been correct, tbh.
I'm totally new to Stilling... got my wife a still for her birthday ( yes, really for her! lol )... we didn't have a clue about any of this and so I got a cheap $260 Chinese still from Amazon because hey, I don't know if we'll even enjoy it!, purchased some turbo yeast, made a sugar wash and a few days later made our first Spirits. While not an ideal setup, it was fun and a fantastic way to become a beginner and get results that are drinkable. Love starting to go through your videos, educational and entertaining.
I built my 1st still recently after 5 months of watching Jamie and a couple others. I decided on a 35L Digiboil, a generic copper alembic dome, SS 2" column with reflux cond. and main cond. with a sight glass and digital thermometer all in tri-clamp. I added a gin basket at the top and a SS basket inside the boiler for on-fruit/grain distilling. I picked up a Brewzilla heat wrap as well. I sourced the parts from whoever had the part I wanted cheapest. Most of the 2" column parts are all from China. The SS basket is for an 8qt. Instapot. I set up the main cond. cooling to run off a hand made garden hose adapter with shut off valve for flow control. The reflux cooling is a separate 1/4" system with a pond pump in a big bucket. All together about $800. I can use it to make almost anything. I hope this helps other with build ideas.
His room mate is having trouble with their Subaru.
Hahahah can't work out why it's over heating!
@@StillIt It's a subie, probably just a head gasket
Definitely a head gasket 😂😂
Great video. Love his coolant setup.
Not surprised its a subaru
Great video, would definitely be cool to do a series on still building experiences from different price points and perhaps some number 8 wire approaches as well.
Good job Jesse keep em coming!👌👌
For that pump, as long as you control it on the discharge side and have fittings that will hold 20-30 psi, you can completely stop flow and not hurt anything. Gotta be on the discharge side though, control flow on the suck side and you'll cavitate. Centrifugal pumps will just sit there and spin with the fluid, not positive displacement like and piston pump that makes a solid seal on discharge and needs relief valve like you're average garage air compressor. But bypassing the extra probably helps with cooling though.
Thanks for all the videos!
All I can say is " I Love It " and now he has a still that every time he uses it he will get better . All so many years of enjoying it .
Manifold is for a pressure release valve and pressure gauge. Can be found on there EBay page
Interesting, internet detective ftw!!
Cheers! I will research it.
Lucky man indeed , let’s face it people spend many times more on jet skis , boats , motorcycles, ect it’s his hobby , very keen to see your follow up vid in the future , cheers jesse tip top work as usual 🥃👌🏼
I like the longer, more in depth video. Great job!
I love the look of the home built stills that people make, but I tell you what that is one sweet setup.
The "Extra" 3 to 1 manifold is for a pressure gauge and a Over Pressure valve, OPV. You mount it on a 2in on the boil pot.
We have these at the stills at work. It’s gotta be a safety manifold, usually with a pressure gauge, pressure release valve, and not sure what the third opening would be for...
@@iceman77706
The ones I saw running the third was always blocked off. In a still that has a control system youd have another gauge to the computer controller in the third one.
I've been running a 30L china special for the last 6 years. It's stood up to aaaalot of use. I've averaged a run per week for those 6 years and the only failure has been a brass retaining nut that secures the pot-mounted thermometer. It simply disintegrated at about 3 years. Replaced for 50 cents. Guys, don't buy the cheapest of the Chinese products but their mid->upper range stills are a heckuva value. You can spend more on "made in XXXXX" if you need the support but don't kid yourselves. Most of the components in that gear are from the far east regardless.
"Most of the components in that gear are from the far east regardless." That is the reality. You see a lot of fear based on racial stereotypes in these threads about stuff being built in China so people buy "Made in America" or "Made in XXXX" and those are just companies selling you stuff made in China anyway. I went down a Coffee rabbit hole and spent quite a lot on espresso makers and grinders and at this point my entire setup is made in China. China has because a technological and manufacturing powerhouse, not just a country making cheap knock-offs. It will take a while for people's perceptions to catch up.
I also operate a Chinese still. Not quite as spanky as that one but what I like most about it is using the boiler for mashing, fermenting and distilling. All OK for a hobby based op. No complaints about quality.
I love it! What a beautiful still. Here in the U.S.A. we can't play like you folks. If the thing works as well is it looks...I'm really glad for the man. I just run a 30L copper pot still. I have no real drinking buddies around here so I don't require a nice still like that. Great video! Cheers!
I hope so cause I already did. bought the same column but I'm not ready for the jacketed pot yet. bought the same control box but they also offer with a PID. No customs fees in the US so no hidden fees there. Don't know if it did at the time this was shot but it clearly states on their website that the control box doesn't include any wiring from mains or to the elements so no surprises for me there. I already have a 60 amp welder circuit and am familiar with wiring the elements so I'll be good to go. Unfortunately I am not in the US at the moment so I won't be able to report on quality until May. I am encouraged by the findings of your friend Dana. Thanks this was a great video. I had seen a few reviews on other channels but none really looking in depth at the quality workmanship like yours.
PID's are inherrently flawed for distilling, please do a few searches maybe on homedistiller or another reputable source. They are only promoted by people lacking a basic understanding of how distillation works. Simple power or voltage regulation works perfectly, but trying to control that process based on a thermoprobe is a massive fail.
@@MrJhchrist I have done some research on the use of PIDs. I intend to also use my controller for mashing and boiling on a separate vessel which is why I chose a PID. It is my understanding I can use it in manual mode which is basically like looking at a digital thermometer and making power adjustments with that readout as a reference. I'm not a beginner and I have mashed boiled and distilled with manual control as well as direct fire propane before. I decided I would like to try PID and if it doesn't work out as expected the price difference is minimal in the grand scheme of things and will be very easy/cheap to retrofit.
@@bookie60 Right on. I think it's important to make the distinction though as "manual mode" literally has nothing to do with Proportional-Integral-Derivative control. While some PID controllers do allow for a manual power control, that is a completely different thing and any random newb reading our comments should hear that. Especially since a few very inexperienced distillers have fairly large platform on YT and also happen to sell PID controllers. Actual PID control is great for mashing, terrible for controlling a still boiler where the boiling point inherently varies from batch to batch as well as throughout every run.
But by all means if a PID controller also offers power control then it can be used for boilers as well as mashing (or fermenting, or sous vide etc).
Cheers
I don't really give a shit how some random noob interprets my random youtube comment. I don't really think I have a burden of responsibility here. Especially when George over at barley and hops (who by the way seems to have a fairly good understanding of the basic principles of distillation) is making whole videos about how great pids are. My original comment only barely mentioned the fact that Oak Stills controller is also offered with a pid. And I only mentioned it because some people might want one and they don't list it on their website. Should have known I would get scolded by some forum dad. You know on second thought I'm gonna run in full PID mode and leave my still unattended and see if the garage blows up or if it makes pure methanol and I go blind.
the more local shops who "make similar product" want 4x the money... I can't blame anyone who is trying to save while still getting quality....
Love the USA got same still with 28g boiler no oil Jacket and no electric controller for low 2k
I'm sitting over here damn near drooling, hahaha! My jealousy is embarrassing! Very cool video. Great to see the whole process:-)
It's a sweet set-up man
@@StillIt Definitely worthy of my envy:-)
Hahaha, Bearded..... was thinking the same thing
So the big question is: Is Jesse getting one of these and if not why?
@@StillIt Thanks for the show. I'm just like so many others here on your channel drooling over that setup. I'm trying to start a small destillery here in Sweden. So, is there any chance of you letting us know the manufacturer of the setup?
Yes I would love to see some lower end stills and how to save money we all try to save if we can. And when we can.
Yes, I am jealous too, in the nicest of ways!
But that's a big bucket of money, albeit for a very large professional bit of kit, which tends to make me think, as a few have mentioned already, that James might have some difficulty in showing that it is solely for his personal use/hobby.
Finally, the "journey" that many of us take in getting to a useable, and personal, still is one that James seemed to have bypassed.
Many of us prefer the "Jesse" method, i.e. buy stuff, get stuff made, discover better ways to do stuff by failing at some etc. etc.
Overall, more power to you James and good luck with it all 👍
The only downside, which I must mention, is that it's a crying shame you couldn't get NZ made product(s) to fulfil your needs 🙁
Got a 53 gallon w/6” column from mile high distilling it’s amazing
Nice
How much was it?
Tots with controller and pumps ect I’m 8500 in. But we are starting a micro distillery.
@@charlesschmidtke8427 Are the commercial controllers worth having for a hobbyiest? SCR or even PID with a soldering iron seem like enough for a tended still. Ground Fault circuit is the only part you need to buy that is expensive.
@@robertfontaine3650 what do you mean by “ground fault circuit”? You mean getting an electrician to install GFCI protection?
I am new to the craft but I can't shake the feeling that I will always love my setup because I built it mid lockdown with what I had. I converted an urn into a still and have been tweaking it ever since for the love of it. No agitator built in but it cost around 2000 ZAR (South African Rand). But one day I might buy a beast like this.
I can totally agree with this. I still love my ccvm / pot / plate still. It really comes down to the boiler with this thing. I think beat solution is build everything else and buy a potnin a lot of ways
@@StillIt Nothing to really respond with brov, Ii just wanted to say that you're a legend and You're channel was a huge motivator for me getting into this craft. Ii knew I could make ethanol, but you gave me the confidence to produce adequate booze lol. Genuine thanks (even though ya from the wrong side of rugby hahaha #SA) you awesome dude!!!!!
My keyboard just fucked out. I trust you'll decipher my message. It's difficult to pretend that I screwed up "I" at least twice and somehow squeezed a "you're" in there where a "your" shoulda gone hahahaha. But then put "you" where I should've put "you're".... I give up hahaha
That odd bit of "manifold" that you found @7:13 is part of the pressure relief valve system.
Putting together my still from Oak Stills. 26 gallon. Great quality!!! I’ve probably never been happier with a product for the money.
You need a globe valve if you want to throttle flow, to keep the valve from washing out. I can't imagine it would be a real-world problem with low-pressure water though more of a high-pressure thing. That's what we use in oil and gas applications.
I did "cleaning" for start ups or rework on FDA food and Pharm stills and posses piping, run Tri Sodium Phosphate(TSP) at steam temps, low% to water (1tbs per gal) PH about 10 or 11. Gets rid of any oils and others used in manufacturing or shipping. Neutralize with Citric/Ascorbic or vinegar over board. Then run with your acid of choice, overboard, rinse, and ready to go!
Works good on ammo cleaning too.
Thanks for the info guys!
I also bought a 4 inch coloumn and a dephlegmator from Oak stills. All looked good but the dephlegmator sensor was put to measure the water temperature instead of measuring the steam temperature which makes it a lot harder to run properly so I had to rebuild that a bit. And also the sensor didn't have any gasket or option to add it so it was leaking quite a lot. But the craftmanship sure looks nice.
You guys are competent cobbers. If you pick up an older dehumidifier you can easily convert it to a circulating ice water source by gently bending the condenser down into the collection tub. Add some insulation, a pump, and hoses and you have a device with one third to one half of the footprint of a freezer.
It is not as pretty as your still, but, usually cheap at yard sales and thrift shops. Most folks ran the appliance around the clock, then barked at the power bill. Converted, the collector is a block of ice after 20 minutes and lasts for hours so add a timer or thermal controlled on off switch and the cost of a run is minimal. I chose the thermal method.
Y'all have the most legit shirts. Respect from an old school moonshiner in the states.
I’ve just done the same exercise - 50L 4 plate, 4 inch still, big whiskey head/onion, gin basket, and and and.
Sitting in the box at hone waiting for me to get back and unpack it.
Price was about half of what I could get for exactly the same item locally.
New toys. . . . Exciting!
Who doesn’t love new toys!?
This is what I’m thinking 50L not a 100L . Do you have a link you’d care to share where I can look at your still?
@@silveraven1 Dunno how to do that here, but if you message me in FB I’ll be able show you some pics.
@@silveraven1 50 litre is a beer keg 1/2 barrel. You can buy them used for cheap. look up keggle.
I also have a still from aliexpress and it's the best one i have, distillex has the best stills and parts!
The only problem with distillex is DHL for us small buyers. 40$ parts with 90$ shipping charges.
mmm, chinesium. I have about 100 more Chinese shipments to go before I have all my piece parts. Love Ali but you have to be very patient. Being able to order a pallet with all the bits would be so nice. 30 gallon pot, 4" column. Those are big batches for a home brewer. Getting that jacketed pot is a big win and he might have saved money buying bits and pieces but he could have easily ended up spending more buying things twice and adding all the different shipping costs. Seems too big for a hobbyist to me but I certainly wouldn't turn it down if you sent it to me.
If its Jacketed, the more economical route is to use water in the jacket, fill above the heat elemetns, to where the lowest check valve is at. The high density steam is is more efficient than a liquid bath bain marie. Additionally its also more responsive to changes in heat adjustments.
That will create very low density steam. High density steam is what you have in powerplants where the vapor is so dense it's damn near 1kg/L You need a very high pressure vessel if you want to hold the high density steam and the fact that the still is robbing the jacket of so much heat and there is only a few kW of power to produce that steam there will never be anything other than just a very very low density steam in this setup.
I run a 150liter jacketed boiler similar to this one, trust me the jacket with enough water to keep the 2 5500 watt elements submerged with steam in the jacket is more than adequate to boil the mash in this guy's boiler. There is no need for oil or glycol, that just adds unnecessary costs to running you still. Maybe its not high pressure, but the steam itself is very dense and will boil the mash to 212F very easily.
@@hypnopooper6252 Indeed! However what you have is not high density steam. High density steam is wet steam above 10 bar of pressure. I doubt your jacket can hold even 2 bar. It most probably is vented to atmosphere.
Seconded on this - my jacketed boiler works way better when not full of water. I’ve not thought about using Glycol before - I would be interested to see sone stats on how that higher boiling point impact on overall times.
Plum brandy - sieve the seeds out first before charging the boiler, using a 6 mm sieve. Otherwise mill the fruit and make a puree for fermenting. Even with a spherical bottom kettle, the plum pits clog up a 2 inch TC port and ball valve. Nice work.
Breaking up all the seeds in your plums before mashing or even distillation will definitely put you far over any threshold for cyanamide which any country considers "safe" or you'll have to end your run a LOT earlier, and even then you're kind of pushing it.
There are drum based sieve machines which will remove the seeds from stone fruits without damaging them, but they are often either very big or very expensive bits of kit, sometimes both.
The most compact one I could find is the robot coupe c80, but if you can't find one second-hand, it really is too expensive to buy new.
A better solution is to allow for backpurging on the outlet so you can dislodge stones if they do get stuck. That way, a 2" TC port will be able to handle almost anything besides the more stubborn grappa mashes, though it does use more water and creates more backset.
Depending on your strategy of elimination that might be a bigger issue than clogging though.
@@horrorhotel1999 We used an apricot mill to separate out the pits. The mill works better with the varieties that have smaller pits.
Awesome Jesse, Happened on this video and was so surprised to see my friend James showing off his new Still. He never does anything by halves. Cheers
The gaskets in column must fitet properly and it must have a puzz for a bublle plate. Thats to avoid leaking. My one is only 50l boiler but it's works right out of a box. Good luck guys! Congratulations for a nice buy!
Oak still the best just got my new 100l boiler from them,... have a great fun guys 😁
Just ordered a 4inch flute and an 8 gallon boiler off them. Can't wait for it to arrive.
It looks like that Tee is to add PRV and other things, something similar is under Distillation Equipment's on their website.
Awesome to see! I've just bought myself a column from the exact same company. Very impressed with their customer service. Quality isn't the best but should work well. Ended up with a 4 inch, 6 plate borosilicate glass column. Has a 20 inch packed section before the dephlegmator. Running 2x2200w elements in a cut an shut double keg boiler. Maiden voyage in less than two weeks with good old tpw. Should step my shed game up!
Oh man. That sounds epic!
You got a way to share pics? Would gladly keep you updated on it brother!
Hey Nathaniel, I just go the same one. Shoot me an email on markeltom@gmail.com - keen to know how you got on!
I was looking at a similar un-jacketed still from milehigh in the US. Perfect timing for the video.
I have the 8 gallon from Mile High, excellent quality gear, good service, still way more expensive that I could have brought from China. Slight pang of buyers remorse.
@@jasonpowell8582 don't have buyers remorse. From what I have read about milehigh, they are in the business of providing the best quality they can. It probably far exceeds what is needed, but you have the best. Enjoy what you have and slumber in the comfort of having something special! There are more expensive options I'm sure.
I have been inspired by the still it posts, and those of Barley and Hops, Bearded and Bored too. So much so I have enrolled on a course to look at setting up a legitimate business in the UK to progress my interest to a business. Being in the same job for 15 years with all the uncertainty the last year has brought has made me think about a new avenue. Bless Jesse, George and the Bearded champ for giving me the option to progress to the next step. I may not proceed, but I'll find out what I decide soon.
Hey Jesse and James, I'm hoping you guys could do a video on how to run something like this. I've had thoughts on getting something like this as my mate from lazy dayz brewing has a bubble plate setup from oakstills also and it's a real good quality setup. Thanks for the video guys
Please review different distillation companies to see quality, selection, cost, customer service, etc...
I'm a beer brewer so I have no idea whats going on in this video but its definitely interesting. I can tell this is a very nice setup tho
Careful mate. Keep associating with us and you may be pulled over to the dark side 🤣
You are now entering the Zone of distillers and mad scientist all. So you make beer that's good because you must make a "wort, mash, beer"; all the same thing just different names before you can distill it. This in a great hobby and I wish you well. A jar of good shine will open doors that a dollar bill cant. Bio-Clinical engineer here. I love this stuff.
@@russellmcgahee942written like a true distiller 😉
A really good look at an area that I hope to get to in a year or so. Thanks mate.
Damn!!! Sweet. DIY Guys are DIY guys anywhere in the world. I want a 200L still to do a big barrel in 1 run.
You could go with 3 gallon barrel or even a bain marie then 40 gallon brute bucket and a beer keg still will fill 3 gallons. 200l stills are always expensive and jacketed is double that.
This gives me a new respect for a pot still and propane stove. His setup is so much more complicated. As far as price goes, he did get a good value.
WOW from a 25L pot still to a monster, definitely invested in it now. Still looks great! Any recommendations to upgrade from a T500 without breaking the bank?
Great video makes me feel a little more confident I have a still coming from China 55 gallon they customized it for me it has a 6-in column a 6-in whiskey helmet and a 6 inch pot still so I can go between two different units it's not jacketed it does have an agitator I'm not using electric elements I'm doing propane because this will be used in West Africa. Love watching you and your adventures I've built most all of my stills myself pot still reflux still and I just completed my first vacuum still which was a real eye opener
Love your set up so much I built almost the same keg. First run at expected 15% bout 2 gallon. Ran perfect but at 2 gallon it was still at 60%... Thanks and be safe
Please do more reviews of similar built stills
Are there links to the still purchased available? Curious....
Oakstills.com brother. Just bought a 4 inch, 6 bubble plate borosilicate glass column. Less than perfect but should work.
You can find anything on Alibaba.com. I've bought all kinds of stuff there. Buyers protection is pretty decent.
Me and a mate are going through this exact process ATM. This is bloody great!
To get that kind of still for that price, wow. If it performs as well as it looks, that'll make his distillations so much easier, more precise, and faster. He's going to absolutely love having that little pot at the drain for his specific gravity readings, since it's just another means of confirming that your distillate is coming over at the rate you want it with the separation from the parent solution that you're looking for, so you can adjust your reflux on the fly until it behaves how you like. Such a cool piece of kit for the money.
enjoy watching three guys play with a great new toy
It would make a kick-ass Lamp or Bong! Best use of Chinesium that I've seen!
Hi I’m new to your group. I’m happy to say I purchased the same unit 3 days before this video was published . 😀
Hey! I'm a bit curious how this has held up
Looks like they shipped him silicone gaskets and not PTFE ones. Ignoring any potential safety issues they will pick up and hold the Gin aromas and flavours so will be OK until he wants to run a neutral and then they will leach flavour back out. PTFE gaskets don't cost much more and work just as well, it just seems strange that companies still ship silicone gaskets that degrade when exposed to quite a few chemicals in the distillate. Acetone, which is in foreshots, swells silicone just at room temperature and can effect the seal, under reflux all gaskets are exposed for quite some time so something to watch out for even if you aren't concerned about using unsuitable plastics in distilling.
Yeah, even if you forget the potential for chemical leaching, you really can't forget about the fact that those gaskets will degrade over time, and if you wait to replace them until they fail, they'll fail in the middle of a run which is a whole mess, not to mention a fire hazard.
Much better to use PTFE foam gaskets, they last forever, don't get pinched, and unless you're boiling fluorine, you don't have to worry about any chemical leaching.
all my boilers and copper work are Chinese made. The workmanship is excellent, and they are good to make business with.
would love one of those, haha. when are you gonna get round to an update on your Dunder pit and making some Rum with it? lol
For those interested, it's not listed on their website but they also sell their temperature control box with a PID.
Hey Jesse have you got a link to the manufacturer of the boiler?
I worked at a distillery company for a few years, and we ordered ALL the stills from China to resell them. Several distillery brands get their tanks from China. Then, we modified them a little to make them work correctly. Most of them have held good through the years, and the ones that didn't were usually ruined over the operator. I no longer work there and have nothing to gain from it. If you're curious about running a Chinese still, they work just fine. Some tanks may require modifications to function if you buy straight from China.
A tiktok creator had a really good video about ethical purchasing from places like China that have bad reputations and there is a fair amount to be said but basically if your willing to do a ton of research (if your planning on being commercial that should be your standard imo) you can find manufactures everywhere that produce cheap products but pays their employees fair wages after you adjust them for purchasing power.
My still is Chinese, the cheapest I found (70$). It was crap, but after adding some inox tubing to make the column large enough for packing (20$), it's quite usable! Like with most cheap Chinese inox, the welds aren't too good and tend to get some surface rust. The rust always washes out with the foreshots. Not great if you're serious about the craft, but for a low-budget hobbyist it's OK
Thanks Jesse, another great vid. James..Congratulations! A beauty. Have you named her yet? What will be your youtube channel? Still-It-Larger?
Hahahaha too true!
Always enjoy watching your channel!! I have learned heaps !!!
How is still working after 4 months of use ?is it holding up? I am thinking of buying one😁
I bought a still from Oak a few years ago, although a lot cheaper version. 100ltr boiler 4” x 4 plates. Also got the control box. Cheap as $1,600 USD delivered. A few issues, the controls box was way over sized, the plates leak a bit, just need tap and tighten as u go. Seeing the jacketed boiler makes me think it’s time for an upgrade! Made heaps of booze, gin, whiskey, rum. I’m the most popular bloke in my street.
My 1,000 phone was made in China. It’s pretty nice. Better than any phones made in America
Please make more videos with his still, james was great would be good to see more vids with him
It looks nice, our company also produce it!! This is Christine, a sales from DYE company which is a professional manufacturer in China, mainly producing distilling, brewing equipment, freeze dryer, stainless steel tanks etc.
Do you have a link to your company or where your products are available?
Man, those kids in China are getting pretty good with a TIG welder haha. Just playing. Great Video
I could see you probably had a issue with the parrot. Did it had a vent hole? Else she will build up pressure.
Yup it does.
Very creative, condenser water, cooling device. Maybe over kill with the pump but awesome set up.
I got one and it's very nice, just want to update with fals bottom and build up a couple of sections.
i built my own pid and heating grounded heating element with site glass column and reflux chamber works great .my ideas came from Mr.Duncan
I got a column from distillex yet to use as I welded the rest of my still myself I was very impressed for what I paid
I'm still waiting for customs to release some qi coils I ordered in January. Now at least in America is a bad time to order from China.
True that! Man I hope you get your stuff soon.
Let me start by saying I know nothing about stills but I find your content educational. An old shiner told me if I ever get into making shine never buy copper made in China as its not pure copper but is alloyed with other metals {which makes the copper much cheaper to produce} and can have an adverse effect on your product. I also had a HVAC tech tell me the same thing, Chinese copper is not real copper.
Even thow im from the us and 100% believe in buying 🇺🇸. That thing is a beauty and the set up is ingenious! If distillation alcohol was legal for a home hobby in the USA and I had the funds i would totally invest in 1 from that company. Absolutely awesome
iv just brought us tripod "deathgrip" had to add parts and fix it from min1 this by us is over rated
Hi there. Greetings from Latvia. Been watching your videos and since then upgraded my still from 15 L to 45 L and a 2" DIY cooper collumn with reflux. My question is what is the max ABV of this still? Because i can get 87 % only with reflux and some cooper wire balls stufed into the column. Thanx fore the videos. Lots of intersting info from YOU.
I'm really considering making one from scratch using stainless pipe, stainless ~55 gallon drums, etc.. I've also considered substituting the reflux for is very cheap lab grade counterparts and just introducing copper elsewhere. idk. lol
Thanks again gentlemen for the video. So my question is can I or should I us a 50L boiler with this setup or not?
My still ship next week. My total cost was $ 3,153.00 to my front door . No gin basket but I did get whiskey helmet.
This is a cool video. Not sure I'm brave enough to send $6k on the seas of the internet to China, but glad to see it worked out for old mate.
I hear you dude.
I found your videos about 3 weeks ago after a knee surgery 😳 and fell in love with the idea of home brewing.
My best friend loves vodka so I will be using that video.
I like Irish whiskey how do you get that flavor profile? Yes I know for it to be true Irish it must come from Ireland.
My father like bourbon is there a recipe and process for that flavor.
Thank you.
Cool man, you definitely found a cool hobby.
Irish your going to want to mix malted barley and unmalted barley. To get started something like 30% unmalted.
Bourbon is all about corn. Corn gets tricky hough as you have to deal with a super thick poridge like mash. You could check out ujssm to get started.
Can I add charcoal to a gin basket to infuse smoke flavor so as not to barrel it for yrs to get the flavor?
@@jaredschwiner6844 I don't know about the gin basket.
But a lot of people make smaller pieces of oak (the size of a finger roughly) and toast them up, you can speed up the flavouring that way.
wow...crazy...nuts!...you boys down under know how to do this! It's a mini pro distillery! Cheers!
New still day is always a great day!
Guessing that "water manifold" is a RIMS tube for heating the jacket potentially? Heating element in the long and and water in/out on the side with a temp gauge in the 1/2" NPT port.
True could be. James double checked the list later, he didn't pay for it so it could have been put in by accident
@@StillIt Ahh ok. I couldn't really see the boiler and on second thought guessing the element already goes straight into the jacket and already has the in/out port on the jacket. Guess the mystery will continue lol...
Build one! You gain more knowledge, more intimate and a fraction of the cost
Yup like I said in vid totally agree with you! But. . . . If you want to have a jacketed still. That makes things a bit trickier!
I did consider making. But time and equipment are the issue.
So instead I'm looking to use my computer skills and build a control system for it.
Agreed! I have a 5 gal. Chinese no jacket. Enough to get the bug. In the process of building a dirty love child between Still it and bearded . Love the craft ! Love the hobby! Happy “distilling “!!!
I really need you help. I am a huge fan.
Here in the Caribbean, St Lucia, I am considering purchasing a 600L non jacketed still from Oakstills. For the production of whiskey, corn based.
What do you think. Jacketed or non jacketed and why?
Also, their 800mm high condenser seems to be on the small side for that still capacity of 4*7k watts boiler and 8* plate 8" column.
What are your thoughts?
That thing is gorgeous.
Sexy all right ;)
3 days is bonkers... for NZ. You can order from Amazon in other countries and it turn up later the same day. Now THAT blows my mind.
Great Video. Very well made and i really like that you people from the trades to review!! The video came at the right time... i was thinking of buying one, seems like there is some more planning and banking to do.. ;) cheers thx
Nice video, that still is a bit beyond my requirements haha. For the money I'm thinking a Portuguese alembic is the way to go
I’m new to distilling, I’m about to find out if my Chinese still is worth it. Either way, I think it’s a good place to start. If it turns out well I think my next move will be a copper still 10 gallon or so.
I just met with the people who made these last mouth.
Copper workers are paid extremely well in China ( compared to others )
Some of the factory are starting produce high quality still.
Most of their order came from the EU / Taiwan
(Whisky distilling just isn't a thing in mainland China and Baijiu still don't use copper)
So shit products will get them no where.
Nice video, Nice still. Looking forward to a follow up on this still.