AOM Retold: Replay Analysis (Magic vs Matreius, Thor vs Hades)

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  • Опубликовано: 4 ноя 2024

Комментарии • 80

  • @banana_hammock11
    @banana_hammock11 21 день назад +34

    This is exactly the type of content I want to see! Thanks Magic

  • @potatoflys
    @potatoflys 21 день назад +9

    This full game analysis is so good, I struggle with knowing when to sit back versus press my advantage and seeing your decision making throughout the whole game helps a lot.

  • @xCH0SEN1x
    @xCH0SEN1x 21 день назад +12

    You've been the best content creator on Retold point blank period. Thanks for sharing all of your years of experience and knowledge 😊😊

  • @kaname110
    @kaname110 21 день назад +5

    Also please do more of these analysis as this is super cool for us to learn and understand the decision making. It would be great to have one of these videos for every civ!

  • @markvanderwerf8592
    @markvanderwerf8592 21 день назад +14

    Thor build:
    Make armory then scout. Armory researches in order copper armor, copper shields, thor's hammer, copper weapons after going up.
    3 dwarves to gold
    1 vil to wood, make ox cart.
    2 more dwarves to gold
    2 more dwarves to wood.
    Rest of dwarves to chickens, kill 5 initially.
    Last 2 dwarves to wood, click up at 3:30.
    If you're gonna kill the chicken just gather them, they are only a little slower than hunt and you still get a 4.30 advance. Just get your hunt after.
    Build is good, biggest weakness i find is just other gods that go up at 3.45 or 4.00 and instantly which i think pretty much anyone should do. You can't really punish the Thor anyway (except kronos a bit).
    Other gods get up expansion earlier and equalize that way for which reason i like going up to freyja to get that scouting going. If they expand you can expand as well but things even out more.

    • @IamMagicAOM
      @IamMagicAOM  21 день назад +4

      really nice, thanks!

    • @Donar_AoM
      @Donar_AoM 21 день назад +1

      Yes against Kronos rush its hard, almost impossible to use the greedy bo, also Loki can gold starve or Heimdall rush, that's what my experience was

  • @Vaios7G
    @Vaios7G 21 день назад +3

    I love how mindful you are with your building placement. That wall especially on the right side *chef's kiss*.

  • @thralldoomhammer7250
    @thralldoomhammer7250 21 день назад +19

    Thor The Chicken Slayer!

  • @ConstantijnII
    @ConstantijnII 20 дней назад +1

    This is it. Exactly what I like to see. Very nice video, Magic.
    I think your video plan of sometimes full commentary, sometimes only an intro is pretty solid.
    Looking forward to the next.

  • @obligatoire4063
    @obligatoire4063 20 дней назад +1

    Hi Magic, I am a TRUE NEW PLAYER in RTS and AOM is my first (I have 30h played lol) and I love it, I started like : « i like thor so I will play it » and so I play this god. A week ago, I didnt know what a build order was.
    Anyway, your content is really helping me to understand the game and how it works.
    I love the way you manage several unit groups I wish I could do it.
    I hope you will do more content about Thor ! And I will watch the other gods too to understand their weaknesses !
    Great video !

  • @ProdigyDDK
    @ProdigyDDK 21 день назад

    another banger video thanks!

  • @jaygoogles
    @jaygoogles 21 день назад +2

    Love the intro!!!

  • @sebastianheselaars4315
    @sebastianheselaars4315 19 дней назад

    This, exactly this is the content I have been looking for. MVP video!!! Thanks

  • @kaname110
    @kaname110 21 день назад +1

    Awesome content, Magic! Great to see this legendary game come back with a new shape and hype!

  • @ManchmalGaming
    @ManchmalGaming 20 дней назад

    My favorite video from you so far! Very clear! 👋

  • @timbuysman3454
    @timbuysman3454 21 день назад +1

    Great video. I hope the devs are listening to your balancing recommendations.

  • @logicftw7700
    @logicftw7700 21 день назад

    Great video. Everything I wanted. Will be great to see more matchups with different god combinations to get ideas for my own play.

  • @kostatimo6021
    @kostatimo6021 21 день назад +1

    Thanks for the content, you are magic guy indeed ❤❤

  • @adhafang9882
    @adhafang9882 21 день назад +1

    Nice one! would be also nice to see other top players games with ur commentary, thank u

  • @antonioiborra8
    @antonioiborra8 21 день назад +1

    awesome video as always!

  • @SirQuinnsly
    @SirQuinnsly 21 день назад +1

    Super informative, thanks for sharing!

  • @skylarkuper471
    @skylarkuper471 21 день назад +1

    Great vid! Loving the game, I’m a full Odin main now because of you. The only thing I wish they had was an input lock and input filtering. I’m more than happy with cross play but I play controller and I’d love an option to play both casual and ranked against other controller players as well!

  • @illusion2438
    @illusion2438 21 день назад

    Your sim city has leveled up. I can tell you think so deeply about the strategy of this game. So impressive.

  • @brunopereiracabral2392
    @brunopereiracabral2392 21 день назад

    Analysis! The vids eeeeveryone is looking for from the best players🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

  • @AlexCoopa
    @AlexCoopa 19 дней назад

    Commentating games are 100x better! Love the content

  • @kalorathekau
    @kalorathekau 20 дней назад

    I always wondered how strong the build was, when it often looked like other civs would take a 2nd TC and even pull ahead in villager count. But you pointed out the military difference even when your opponent catches up economically, and that was really eye-opening, in the power it affords you to dictate the game

  • @Fenrys-5555
    @Fenrys-5555 20 дней назад

    thx for the video :) as other comment i will love to have each civ explained like this with green arrow along the strategy :)

  • @djnefrozhardstylepromotion3527
    @djnefrozhardstylepromotion3527 21 день назад +2

    We need to acknowledge that Hades is probably the easiest matchup for Thor tho.
    I think that everybody agrees that Thor needs a nerf, I just hope they don't massacre it like Zeus/Haders on first patch.
    Maybe 10 more seconds and 20 more golds on the special hammer tech, -10 hp on dwarfs, reduced burning pitch bonus for hack dmg ranged units 4x->2.5x should be enough.
    Btw your build can be really improved and there are even greedier builds with it.
    F.e. against non rushing civs you can get armor->hammer->shield->weapons in age 1 and build an ox cart before killing the 5 chickens for decay time with 4 dwarfs on wood and 6 on gold initially. (Doesn't work if there is only 5 chickens since you wont have enough food to age up with them alone)
    This makes you age 30 seconds later but you have 1 more cart, 4 dwarfs+upgrades, can tech up axe + pickaxe during transition while getting 2 hersirs + 2 houses, and on age up you can directly make 2 barracks and one forum while pumping units.

  • @DanielDorva
    @DanielDorva 12 дней назад

    very nice mate!

  • @lorenzovrolijk
    @lorenzovrolijk 21 день назад +3

    Multiple points so a bit of a longer comment, but I guess the yt algorithm will like that anyway.
    I think the intro is a good way to go about balance in general, it's tiresome to hear people whine about 'x is OP' but then never ever play x themselves because 'I am an n player not x'. I don't know if you know 'heromarine' from starcraft 2, but I used to watch his streams all the time where he would whine about protoss (he plays terran himself), but then often destroy like 3 protosses in a row on ladder, and when confronted with this the go-to response would be 'but he did not play that correctly'. So often someone's experience does not match reality, and I think Ra in old aot was a good example of this. It was never very good because 3rd age gp at 2nd gold goes brrr (ironically the problem Ra is also having in retold, although he's slowly climbing on winrate), but because losing vs. Ra feels much more frustrating than losing vs. Odin (still talking old aot here), it is somehow perceived as worse or more overpowered. Add to that Ra overperforming in team games (because of old aot's insane trade bonus and tg trade route length as well as guaranteed safe gold), which then somehow gets converted in one's mind to 1v1 performance, and you have a god which is seen as OP but is actually quite underwhelming. As retold appears to follow a drafting system similar to aoe2 there's really no reason to not play multiple gods, so there's no excuse to not just play the OP thing to reverse-engineer a counter to it.
    2:54 I don't think it is particularly good advice to recommend this to climb the ladder with (unless you are addressing players who already are really good, like 1600-1700+). If I look at the build, you are not scouting at all (aside from no info this also means no herdables and no relics) and sacrificing your chickens, it just doesn't seem like good base advice. Instead, if you'd recommend Poseidon, you get 1) the fastest sensible advance time in the game, 2) kataskopos scouting, 3) no walking time to second hunt because of lure (and +100w from 2 granaries saved), 4) a somewhat stable god (patch-wise) and 5) a god that is still very strong, both in actual proven win% and in subjective opinion of most people. It will probably help you go further in the long run if you pick Poseidon
    As for not grabbing the 4th TC, I think it's interesting because if you grab the TC and the enemy builds a fortress and then a petrobolos, you are actually ahead in resources even if you produced 0 units out of the 4th TC or used its population space. Of course this is assuming the fortress and created petrobolos don't significantly contribute value in the near future - which they might - but it's still interesting to think about.
    As for Thor being OP, I was looking at the winrates and saw that apparently, Thor cannot seem to beat Isis (no matter how I adjust the elo filter range, Isis seems to be extremely favored in this match-up). I was wondering if you could think of why, because I can't, it's a bit of a weird statistic to me and I'm wondering if it's just random chance (after all we have something like 78 match-ups I think, not counting mirrors? It wouldn't be weird for at least 1 statistic to not be representative even with a 100+ game sample size).

    • @IamMagicAOM
      @IamMagicAOM  20 дней назад

      Really nice post, thank you

  • @aprenderTecnologia
    @aprenderTecnologia 17 дней назад

    Nice analyze!

  • @Bosnjak_Sandzaklija
    @Bosnjak_Sandzaklija 21 день назад +2

    Why not go for Freyja but rather for Heimdall? I don't understand, since Freyja provides some really good uogrades. For example, + percentage hitpoints on hereoes, which is really good if we are using them. Also, I find valkiries much better than other myth units. The only good thing here is a healing spring.

  • @SiegeofJerusalem1099FirstC-y3v
    @SiegeofJerusalem1099FirstC-y3v 20 дней назад +2

    make more commentaries

  • @itswakkowarner
    @itswakkowarner 21 день назад +1

    Your intro should be a rabbit being pulled out of a hat.

  • @КостянтинНовик
    @КостянтинНовик 21 день назад +1

    I started playing aom not so long ago, but as I understood gold control is winning a match against any opponent

  • @philipp561
    @philipp561 21 день назад +3

    Thanks a lot for the commentary, very insightful!
    One thing that I think you didn't talk about is what the Hades player's plan is. Like what is his win condition in this game? To a noob like me it just looks like he's letting himself get outboomed from the start and the only obvious idea we see is using Underworld Passage. Would he be able to get a stronger army if he could hold until lategame? Could he play for any other ideas in the midgame?

    • @IamMagicAOM
      @IamMagicAOM  21 день назад +1

      I think a strong feudal push with restoration might work as well, but feels a bit rough right now with Thors economy as strong as it is

    • @markvanderwerf8592
      @markvanderwerf8592 21 день назад +1

      Tough matchup for Hades but the Hades build wasn't economically greedy enough really, that second TC goes up by 5:50 but you can do like 4:50. That said Hades has to do a pretty extreme greed build and even then is behind in eco. The issue is that Thor get's his dwarven lead quite early and can easily build a second TC with Hersirs which also saves tremendous time and is just quite safe.
      Thor should be ahead in economy and armory tech but the other Gods should have the option to somewhat catch up or have better military. But for Greeks that isn't the case at the moment. In Greeks vs Norse I think Norse has the better army since the Toxotes got nerfed.

  • @TeamfightTactics-h2f
    @TeamfightTactics-h2f 21 день назад +1

    This kind of commentary is my favourite of yours. Could you do a Greek one in the future? The last Greek video was 1 month ago.

  • @RunicornST
    @RunicornST 20 дней назад +1

    Bro I love you

  • @cloudshifter
    @cloudshifter 14 дней назад

    In my situation I would probably get the freeze God power, draw his army in, freeze all of them and then with my numerous axemen and burning pitch would rush all his town centers as they can destroy it in only a few seconds. It's almost a minute for the freeze to wear off so it should be around 1-2 guaranteed town centers and an "ok" retreat. Then raid to force him to rebuild them as he is losing vills, if he pulls away I can always start destroying fortresses with the axemen as fast as the TCs. I don't need to directly fight his army, just create enough economic damage that in an exchange where I may go on par with his army or even lose I would still be ahead and he will have to burn more resources to get his army back up and multiple TC back up, if he is advancing that will also be a waste of time for his vills production. I will already have dwarven mine in mythic age that gives the full amount of gold + a whopping 70% bonus gather rate if I remember correctly.

  • @arthurnassar8677
    @arthurnassar8677 21 день назад +1

    He stopped making villagers from one of his TCs for 4 minutes (10 to 14 min., roughly). You were already ahead, but that was probably quite impactful.

  • @BA_AJC
    @BA_AJC 20 дней назад +1

    Hah! :) I told you about burning pitch day 1 lol try out a satir and Medusa with it. TA are the best siege in the game

  • @kickinon
    @kickinon 21 день назад

    Great video, question as a noob: is the "unit counters" guide on AOM Heaven accurate or outdated?

  • @meqx6028
    @meqx6028 21 день назад

    awesome videos

  • @hupsaiya
    @hupsaiya 21 день назад +2

    what are you using to draw arrows during the replay?

  • @AoLdarkrizen
    @AoLdarkrizen 21 день назад +2

    You got any opinion about full dwarves + armory upgrades but with 2 Ulfsark start (one scouts). Been doing it recently and it felt really good(can share full BO on discord if wanna)

    • @IamMagicAOM
      @IamMagicAOM  21 день назад

      what time do you advance?

    • @AoLdarkrizen
      @AoLdarkrizen 21 день назад

      @@IamMagicAOM 4-30

    • @markvanderwerf8592
      @markvanderwerf8592 21 день назад

      It's a really lousy version. An extra Berserk costs you 2/3rd dwarf in TC build time and is just super expensive. That build only advances at 4.30 with villager cutting and getting upgrades later.
      It's better to get a 2nd ox cart early. You can advance 4.30 getting the upgrades fast and you have a fair bit of time with your berserk to scout around your base. After building the temple just scout opponent with your berserk and build hersirs nonstop (which build your extra houses and great hall/longhouses).
      What is there that can punish you anyways? You are building non-stop Hersirs from your temple which are fully upgraded, you're getting a troll/valkyrie and you're dropping 1 or 2 production buildings at 4.30. The critical stuff you want to see from the opponent (which units are they going, do they expand or not) are best scouted around ~5 minutes anyway which you can still do.
      Simply put the cost of an early extra Berserk is massive and there are so many ways to catch up with scouting later that you really don't need another one.

  • @Sam-es2gf
    @Sam-es2gf 21 день назад

    These Thor builds are very strong against defensive civs. Try out games against chronos/set, people that won't let you boom and mine freely.

  • @surgeonsergio6839
    @surgeonsergio6839 21 день назад +1

    2:28 Why's matreiuss' gold jumping between 1 and 151? Bug?

    • @IamMagicAOM
      @IamMagicAOM  21 день назад +1

      Not sure, interesting

    • @Averageromanian123
      @Averageromanian123 21 день назад +1

      No,he built temple decided there is another place where he would build the temple deleted the unbuilt foundation built it somewhere else.

  • @Catatafish420
    @Catatafish420 19 дней назад

    Every time i see Thor now I get a bit scared. I usually use Poseidon in 1v1 and have pretty good win rate with him. Last time I played Thor we were battling hard andi thought i was doing really good. before I could get to the third age he had a massive army and I couldn’t get to age 3 and he destroyed my second tc. After the game I looked at his base one tc and 6 longhouse. He just went straight military maybe that’s a good strategy too for Thor. I was overwhelmed by the amount of soldiers he was making and they were very strong.

  • @mattyIce42E
    @mattyIce42E 21 день назад +1

    I get where you're coming from. But seeing the state of Gaia and probably Atty in general, I've a hard time calling this broken. Yes, its pretty strong, but you sacrifice things in order to run this build (no scouting, kinda late advance time, opening yourself up to pressure, being very predictable). In my eyes it's cool to have some of these more unique builds (hey, and who doesn't wanna go full LARP and build only dwarves as Thor? 😂). But then again, you're competing on a completely different skill level than me and this stuff can get pretty annoying, I suppose. For my part, I simply enjoy having these kinda asymmetries in the game 😊.

    • @markvanderwerf8592
      @markvanderwerf8592 21 день назад

      4.30 isn't that late? Most builds up between 3.30 and 4.30, going up super early just doesn't add much especially since Centaurs have been nerfed. And yes other civs can potentially have very strong economic openings too. Gaia especially will have the two hero citizens and two economic upgrades and can drop a second TC very early to kind of keep up in economy. Still Thor economy is significantly better just because you get those dwarves so early and you can build second TC with a bunch of Hersirs while your economy is running full power.
      But it's a bit early to tell if it's too powerful. The build was nerfed a tiny bit having to take the chickens now and other civs have a bunch of other advantages which seem to even out sortof.

  • @radosawzegzua2821
    @radosawzegzua2821 21 день назад

    Zeus next !

  • @drakenhof-ki3kt
    @drakenhof-ki3kt 21 день назад +1

    hello im noob but i think if i was player hades i will take ARES WITH CYCLOPLE for aggression

  • @veganism_is_superior
    @veganism_is_superior 21 день назад +1

    buff norse

  • @LaughingCoffin-ub3oo
    @LaughingCoffin-ub3oo 21 день назад

    when im playin loki i go heimdallr to stop thor. i do double temple rush with 10 hersirs while im doing this i convert my army instantly 20 throwing axeman. throwing axeman is ranged INFANTARY unit not ranged archer unit so there is no good option to counter em when ur opponent playing norse cuz norse have no counter infantary unit except throwing axeman himself. and i go heimdallr cuz i sacrifice my einherjar in weird situtions. 20 throwing axeman with heimdallr boost is priceless. insane korean challenger vayne kitting mechanics and u know einherjar(btw im not sayin aneheri cuz i go 2 or more of em and in norwegian language if there is one of em u can call ANE(ONE)heri if there is bunch of em u should say einherjar :D nwm but if u cant control your economy dont even try my strategy. Im not talkin to pro players im talkin to players like me around 1300 to 1500 LP :D

    • @kickinon
      @kickinon 21 день назад

      Jarls counter axemen

    • @LaughingCoffin-ub3oo
      @LaughingCoffin-ub3oo 21 день назад

      @@kickinon its not even close but how u get heroic age when ur fighting how are you gonna get jarls anyways idk 😅

  • @TheGreatTusks
    @TheGreatTusks 21 день назад

    why not hit the goats a few times?

    • @Sam-es2gf
      @Sam-es2gf 21 день назад

      They made the goats 1hit kill last patch so they would be losing more potential food

    • @dovukeyn
      @dovukeyn 21 день назад

      because they nerfed it, herdables are one shot now.

  • @Raw_Filters
    @Raw_Filters 21 день назад

    I play controller and wish there was a way to just play other controller players. Can’t keep up with most pc players

  • @evbvini
    @evbvini 21 день назад +1

    i dont like the idea of no commentary

    • @PlayanBerserker
      @PlayanBerserker 21 день назад

      the idea is fine, sometimes i enjoy just watching and thinking for myself whats happening.
      take in mind that he will still do commentaries, is not like he will stop doing!

    • @IamMagicAOM
      @IamMagicAOM  21 день назад +2

      i'll do some before and after the game and then i'll post some videos with full commentary like this, mix it up a bit. (i only get a couple hrs a weekday to play, so producing content takes a considerable amount of time so i'm trying to balance my approach)

    • @PlayanBerserker
      @PlayanBerserker 21 день назад

      @@IamMagicAOM yeah thats totally fine! myself, enjoy either content anyway!

  • @EverlastingEons
    @EverlastingEons 21 день назад +1

    Hey Magic nice Videos, very educational! We are Swordfighting Club and did a little Video ourself a bit in Aom style if you mind check it out