Does the nhs have emergency medical doctors or critical care doctors that go out to patients on blue or green lights or are they in partnership with people like BASICS where they work with the nhs?
As PHEM Doctors are dispatched by NHS Ambulance EOCs , if they have a CERAD or similar the service they work for can authorise blues, the Police have nowt to do with it.
Hi! I recently stumbled on a video describing green lights in the US. In some states there voluntary firefighters have green lights like this, and like in the UK don’t have the right or way or rights to go through red lights. They are there called courtesy lights and they asked the general public to give way to them even it they don’t have to. Also in other states voluntary firefighters can have blue lights BUT no sirens and no right of way which is confusing, and Iin some states they can have red and white flashing lights like many firetrucks do and sirens to get to the fire house. Here in Sweden where i live we of course have ambulances with sirens and blue lights, BUT also emergency doctors in similarly looking cars striped in yellow with reflective decals and blue lights and sirens just like ambulances but with the text Emergency doctors on them. I just last weekend became aware that green lights in the UK signifies a doctor.watghing a video on emergency lights and a car kitted with green and blue lights like here in your video, with sirens. As a side note, in the US many campus security or industrial area security have green lights and some have amber lights instead, but can’t use them on public roads for some reason….
Hello Ollie this doesn’t link to the video, but was a talking point in one of my lectures, that being the Francis report (this details the failure in communication and of the Staffordshire hospital care workers: doctors and nurses to care for up to 60 patients which lead to their deaths) it highlighted a culture of business first patient care afterwards. The bare minimum was done for patients and in case patients were left on the floor and doctors expressed a sense of enjoyment thinking about papers they could write as the diseases patients suffered from progressed in unseen ways. As a doctor your self what do you think about this business first, patient after and have u experience this on a ward?
The Francis report and the Mid-Staffs incident in general are required reading in my opinion - definitely going to be the subject of a video before long but does feature in the resource I'm putting together at the moment. I have thankfully never seen that so far (albeit obviously only through my 3 clinical years at medical school and 6 months as a doctor). I can 100% imagine why that sort of thing would happen, however, but it would be a slow process as standards dipped with time. I think the response is to improve things like whistleblower protection and providing anonymity for staff wishing to speak up, among others.
@@OllieBurtonMed good to find out about your perspective and it’s good to hear u haven’t seen anything like that, thanks for taking the time to respond.
a decade or so ago I was working in Fareham on the way home we could hear wailers and a Land rover Discovery with roof mounted GREEN beacon shot past us through the red lights onto the M27 I asked my Dad and that I found out about the green light, it should be treated as a blue light, sadly he was on his way to a fatac on the A27 Junction with the A3M
0:39 The simple answer is yes, with a (currently) single proviso which I will explain. 3:05 There is no need to apply to the police for permission to install blue lights. They can be installed and used on any vehicle used in a manner designated in the law. i.e. An emergency vehicle, or vehicle used for police purposes, or other purposes (such as HMRC, Lifeboats, Coastguard etc). OK, this is rather complex, and very simple especially as there is a change in law due very soon, s19 Road Safety Act. An appropriately used/designated vehicle does NOT need any colour lights or sirens, or any markings to claim driver exemptions under the Road Traffic Act. It does not even need a specific type of person to be driving*, it is all about the vehicle's designation and use. It is a little different for ambulances (emergency medical vehicles), to claim the exemptions, it must be dispatched by an NHS ambulance trust, other than that, no lights, sirens, markings etc are required by law. A doctor dispatched by an NHS ambulance trust therefore can claim the exemptions. *A green light is only for doctors registered with the GMC. These are rare these days since the introduction of orcon times, Fast/Rapid Response medical units, an increase in the number of paramedics, ECPs and of course doctors on board, including the specialist trauma team ones run by the various HEMS there is practically zero need for a local GP to leave the surgery, jump in a car, and attend a patient as an emergency response. There are only 3 exemptions within the road traffic act, speed limits, treating red traffic lights as give way, and passing the wrong side of keep left/right signs/bollards. However, under the new legislation about to be introduced, to claim exemption from the speed limit, the driver must have completed, or be on the act of undertaking a recognised high-speed driving course. Ex-traffic cop from the days when we spent as much time in the classroom learning traffic law as we did learning to drive, over a time measured in months, not weeks, current emergency response driving instructor, and occasional ambulance driver.
@@Djnffnoeosmfasjjd RTA exemptions are solely about the use of a vehicle, as i said, thus with suitable authority where required, and where necessary training, a doctor car with or without green lights can be an ambulance and claim exemptions. So can my beat up old farm pickup, so can a ferrari, regardless of who is driving, what it looks like, what colour lights it has, what equipment is carried. Some of this came about because some legislation deemed ambulance owned and operated fast response cars with fully qualified air ambulance crews on board not to be ambulances, never mind just the ones crewed by paramedics, or the motorcycles often used. Under other legislation just put the word "ambulance " on the side of a vehicle, use it to carry the sick/injured and zap, it is an ambulance and entitled to different exemptions under different legislation. Applies to my pickup and a ferrari again. No colour scheme, lighting or crewing requirements, not even a requirement to keep a single plaster in it, just one word in two specified places, not even the front and rear Under yet further legislation, even most of the fully equipped, double crewed emergency ambulances you see out and about do not qualify as ambulances because the have not been specifically manufactured as such, and converted or adapted vehicles do not qualify. There's lots of different bits of legislation covering what is or is not and ambulance at different times under different circumstances, but for the RTA exemptions it is use, sometimes dispatching agency, and in some instances as of the end of this month from yet more different legislation, training.
@@stevesmith7530 It must be classified as an emergency vehicle and being used for ambulance purposes OR has been requested by an NHS ambulance service. The absence of emergency equipment would constitute dangerous driving in this scenario.
@@Djnffnoeosmfasjjd being used for ambulance purposes, makes it an ambulance under RTA. As I have said. If it is carrying sick or injured, RTA exemptions apply, subject to training from end of this month. If it is not carrying, but is en route to the sick/injured it is still an ambulance, but must be dispatched by an NHS ambulance Trust to claim exemptions. Not carrying something is never grounds for a WDC/DD charge, which relate purely to manner of driving, and as of the end of the month different standards apply to both charges to the standards of a normal motorist. Again these are purely about the standard of driving, and nothing to do with any equipment carried or lacking. The only definition of ambulance that even hints at any requirement to carry specified equipment is "a vehicle built, but not adapted or converted for the carriage of the sick or injured" Please, feel free to point me at relevant acts or statutory instruments. Off the top of my head I'm using RTA, MVLR, Road Safety Act, and Deregulation Act. The latest changes due on 30th being fro Road Safety Act 2006, which as it has taken nearly 20 years to create the required standards and definitions gives you an idea just how complex traffic law can be.
@@Djnffnoeosmfasjjd Being used as an emergency vehicle, ie the specified purpose makes it a defacto emergency vehicle. Ownership, driver, colour, markings, lighting etc are irrelevant. It is the use that makes it so under RTA, but not necessarily under other legislation that excludes practically every ambulance on the road from being an ambulance
Paramedics deal with immediate life-threatening situations, generally. They are highly skilled in immediate care for a range of incidents. Doctors require more training to diagnose and treat complex conditions. They can prescribe greater medication, and a lot of doctors tend to have specialist areas of medicine they have trained in. Sometimes, an incident requires the skills of a paramedic and a doctor.
We also in the UK UK doctor also have blue and green light this is normally doctor led team on HEMS , where the helicopter isn't available. They will respond to most life threatening calls, and dispatch out a helicopter some Air ambulance services in UK have different dispatch producers, For example if they have major life-threatening it not uncommon for them to dispatch out two air ambulances, This could be two doctor led teams Or the nearest HEMS unit that may not be a doctor on board, and then Hems unit responding with doctor. And they also do sometimes rare cases where HEMS Heli has been dispatched for a major call and diverted to a more serious call one happened in 2014 when a 17 year old fell down set of stairs and had sub bed glass tube go through him and great northern air ambulance was dispatched to a serious difference call when paramedic on sence then request for hems indemnity poor sod died in hostiplie
I can't seem to find ANY videos of Doctors cars with just green lights on, do you have any that you can put up here? Very informative video btw, thanks
I've been toying with the idea of getting a simple magnetic beacon for a few months. I'm a consultant obstetrician and occasionally have to respond in a big hurry when on-call. Not normally a problem but I live in a touristy costal area and a few times now I've been held up in traffic when responding and I'm worried with growing traffic it might become a bit of a nightmare come summer. However, I'm not sure how useful they'd be given the general lack of awareness on the roads these days.
i had a joke with my equine vet once, turns out they carry green lights incase of police emergency request, i.e. horse and car meet and horse needs to be dispatched quickly
@@Jsuttar Motor Vehicle Lighting Regulations, Road Traffic Act, Road Safety Act, Deregulation Act. The requirement for training to break the speed limit has been enacted withing Road Safety Act since my original post IIRC
Becoming a HEMS doctor would take an enormous amount of study and experience in emergency, ICU and anaesthetics. You would need to be a registrar at minimum. Not trying to discourage you, but just giving you a realistic idea of what your experience would need to be. Good luck!
Meanwhile I just had a shit ton of these cars block intersections and denied people from going on their green lights for what I'm assuming was a funeral escort....if I don't see blue or a firetruck you're nobody.
No such thing as ambulance drivers. Paramedic, Technicians or trainees. Also Paramedics cannot drive with green light say when providing a BASICs response.
Wrong, and right. There are such things as ambulance drivers, and ECAs too. You are correct that a paramedic cannot use a green light, only doctors registered with the GMC can do that.
You “feel like” they’re an incredibly rare sight? How do you feel that? Do you mean “I think they’re a rare sight” or “I appreciate that they’re a bit of a rare sight”? Everything these days is “feel like” and it’s nonsense.
Does the nhs have emergency medical doctors or critical care doctors that go out to patients on blue or green lights or are they in partnership with people like BASICS where they work with the nhs?
I think the scarcity of the greenlights is because most PHEM doctors work with organisations like BASICS
As PHEM Doctors are dispatched by NHS Ambulance EOCs , if they have a CERAD or similar the service they work for can authorise blues, the Police have nowt to do with it.
Hi! I recently stumbled on a video describing green lights in the US. In some states there voluntary firefighters have green lights like this, and like in the UK don’t have the right or way or rights to go through red lights. They are there called courtesy lights and they asked the general public to give way to them even it they don’t have to. Also in other states voluntary firefighters can have blue lights BUT no sirens and no right of way which is confusing, and Iin some states they can have red and white flashing lights like many firetrucks do and sirens to get to the fire house.
Here in Sweden where i live we of course have ambulances with sirens and blue lights, BUT also emergency doctors in similarly looking cars striped in yellow with reflective decals and blue lights and sirens just like ambulances but with the text Emergency doctors on them. I just last weekend became aware that green lights in the UK signifies a doctor.watghing a video on emergency lights and a car kitted with green and blue lights like here in your video, with sirens.
As a side note, in the US many campus security or industrial area security have green lights and some have amber lights instead, but can’t use them on public roads for some reason….
Is this why nowadays doctors tend to ride with rapid response vehicles which does allow them to go through red lights?
yes and on top there is an attached driver.so stress free.
Hello Ollie this doesn’t link to the video, but was a talking point in one of my lectures, that being the Francis report (this details the failure in communication and of the Staffordshire hospital care workers: doctors and nurses to care for up to 60 patients which lead to their deaths) it highlighted a culture of business first patient care afterwards.
The bare minimum was done for patients and in case patients were left on the floor and doctors expressed a sense of enjoyment thinking about papers they could write as the diseases patients suffered from progressed in unseen ways.
As a doctor your self what do you think about this business first, patient after and have u experience this on a ward?
The Francis report and the Mid-Staffs incident in general are required reading in my opinion - definitely going to be the subject of a video before long but does feature in the resource I'm putting together at the moment.
I have thankfully never seen that so far (albeit obviously only through my 3 clinical years at medical school and 6 months as a doctor). I can 100% imagine why that sort of thing would happen, however, but it would be a slow process as standards dipped with time.
I think the response is to improve things like whistleblower protection and providing anonymity for staff wishing to speak up, among others.
@@OllieBurtonMed good to find out about your perspective and it’s good to hear u haven’t seen anything like that, thanks for taking the time to respond.
a decade or so ago I was working in Fareham on the way home we could hear wailers and a Land rover Discovery with roof mounted GREEN beacon shot past us through the red lights onto the M27 I asked my Dad and that I found out about the green light, it should be treated as a blue light, sadly he was on his way to a fatac on the A27 Junction with the A3M
0:39 The simple answer is yes, with a (currently) single proviso which I will explain.
3:05 There is no need to apply to the police for permission to install blue lights. They can be installed and used on any vehicle used in a manner designated in the law. i.e. An emergency vehicle, or vehicle used for police purposes, or other purposes (such as HMRC, Lifeboats, Coastguard etc).
OK, this is rather complex, and very simple especially as there is a change in law due very soon, s19 Road Safety Act.
An appropriately used/designated vehicle does NOT need any colour lights or sirens, or any markings to claim driver exemptions under the Road Traffic Act. It does not even need a specific type of person to be driving*, it is all about the vehicle's designation and use. It is a little different for ambulances (emergency medical vehicles), to claim the exemptions, it must be dispatched by an NHS ambulance trust, other than that, no lights, sirens, markings etc are required by law. A doctor dispatched by an NHS ambulance trust therefore can claim the exemptions.
*A green light is only for doctors registered with the GMC. These are rare these days since the introduction of orcon times, Fast/Rapid Response medical units, an increase in the number of paramedics, ECPs and of course doctors on board, including the specialist trauma team ones run by the various HEMS there is practically zero need for a local GP to leave the surgery, jump in a car, and attend a patient as an emergency response.
There are only 3 exemptions within the road traffic act, speed limits, treating red traffic lights as give way, and passing the wrong side of keep left/right signs/bollards.
However, under the new legislation about to be introduced, to claim exemption from the speed limit, the driver must have completed, or be on the act of undertaking a recognised high-speed driving course.
Ex-traffic cop from the days when we spent as much time in the classroom learning traffic law as we did learning to drive, over a time measured in months, not weeks, current emergency response driving instructor, and occasional ambulance driver.
You’re wrong I am afraid. A doctor car displaying green lights is not an ambulance, hence they do not receive exemptions.
@@Djnffnoeosmfasjjd
RTA exemptions are solely about the use of a vehicle, as i said, thus with suitable authority where required, and where necessary training, a doctor car with or without green lights can be an ambulance and claim exemptions. So can my beat up old farm pickup, so can a ferrari, regardless of who is driving, what it looks like, what colour lights it has, what equipment is carried. Some of this came about because some legislation deemed ambulance owned and operated fast response cars with fully qualified air ambulance crews on board not to be ambulances, never mind just the ones crewed by paramedics, or the motorcycles often used.
Under other legislation just put the word "ambulance " on the side of a vehicle, use it to carry the sick/injured and zap, it is an ambulance and entitled to different exemptions under different legislation. Applies to my pickup and a ferrari again. No colour scheme, lighting or crewing requirements, not even a requirement to keep a single plaster in it, just one word in two specified places, not even the front and rear
Under yet further legislation, even most of the fully equipped, double crewed emergency ambulances you see out and about do not qualify as ambulances because the have not been specifically manufactured as such, and converted or adapted vehicles do not qualify.
There's lots of different bits of legislation covering what is or is not and ambulance at different times under different circumstances, but for the RTA exemptions it is use, sometimes dispatching agency, and in some instances as of the end of this month from yet more different legislation, training.
@@stevesmith7530 It must be classified as an emergency vehicle and being used for ambulance purposes OR has been requested by an NHS ambulance service.
The absence of emergency equipment would constitute dangerous driving in this scenario.
@@Djnffnoeosmfasjjd being used for ambulance purposes, makes it an ambulance under RTA. As I have said. If it is carrying sick or injured, RTA exemptions apply, subject to training from end of this month. If it is not carrying, but is en route to the sick/injured it is still an ambulance, but must be dispatched by an NHS ambulance Trust to claim exemptions.
Not carrying something is never grounds for a WDC/DD charge, which relate purely to manner of driving, and as of the end of the month different standards apply to both charges to the standards of a normal motorist. Again these are purely about the standard of driving, and nothing to do with any equipment carried or lacking.
The only definition of ambulance that even hints at any requirement to carry specified equipment is "a vehicle built, but not adapted or converted for the carriage of the sick or injured"
Please, feel free to point me at relevant acts or statutory instruments.
Off the top of my head I'm using RTA, MVLR, Road Safety Act, and Deregulation Act. The latest changes due on 30th being fro Road Safety Act 2006, which as it has taken nearly 20 years to create the required standards and definitions gives you an idea just how complex traffic law can be.
@@Djnffnoeosmfasjjd Being used as an emergency vehicle, ie the specified purpose makes it a defacto emergency vehicle. Ownership, driver, colour, markings, lighting etc are irrelevant. It is the use that makes it so under RTA, but not necessarily under other legislation that excludes practically every ambulance on the road from being an ambulance
This was good info mate.
How many Ambulances are involved I RTA?
Can I ask why a doctor would got to an accident as opposed the paramedics??
Paramedics deal with immediate life-threatening situations, generally. They are highly skilled in immediate care for a range of incidents. Doctors require more training to diagnose and treat complex conditions. They can prescribe greater medication, and a lot of doctors tend to have specialist areas of medicine they have trained in. Sometimes, an incident requires the skills of a paramedic and a doctor.
We also in the UK UK doctor also have blue and green light this is normally doctor led team on HEMS , where the helicopter isn't available.
They will respond to most life threatening calls, and dispatch out a helicopter some Air ambulance services in UK have different dispatch producers,
For example if they have major life-threatening it not uncommon for them to dispatch out two air ambulances,
This could be two doctor led teams
Or the nearest HEMS unit that may not be a doctor on board, and then Hems unit responding with doctor.
And they also do sometimes rare cases where HEMS Heli has been dispatched for a major call and diverted to a more serious call one happened in 2014 when a 17 year old fell down set of stairs and had sub bed glass tube go through him and great northern air ambulance was dispatched to a serious difference call when paramedic on sence then request for hems indemnity poor sod died in hostiplie
I can't seem to find ANY videos of Doctors cars with just green lights on, do you have any that you can put up here? Very informative video btw, thanks
I've been toying with the idea of getting a simple magnetic beacon for a few months. I'm a consultant obstetrician and occasionally have to respond in a big hurry when on-call. Not normally a problem but I live in a touristy costal area and a few times now I've been held up in traffic when responding and I'm worried with growing traffic it might become a bit of a nightmare come summer.
However, I'm not sure how useful they'd be given the general lack of awareness on the roads these days.
Yeah there definetely needs to be more awareness of the green lights 100%. It's important doctors get where they need to quickly.
Why dobt they use surens?
Sirens are for emergency vehicles only, though some all green light doctors may use sirens, though that may not be legal.
i had a joke with my equine vet once, turns out they carry green lights incase of police emergency request, i.e. horse and car meet and horse needs to be dispatched quickly
No, they don't because they aren't legally allowed. Green lights are for GMC registered doctors and some specialist nurses only.
@@OpvectorUK No, green lights are only allowed for GMC doctors. No nurses.
THANK YOU. Amazing explanation
And unfortunately wrong.
@@stevesmith7530do you have information and sources to support your claim?
@@Jsuttar Motor Vehicle Lighting Regulations, Road Traffic Act, Road Safety Act, Deregulation Act.
The requirement for training to break the speed limit has been enacted withing Road Safety Act since my original post IIRC
Would you review Jim Nduruchi
Could I become a air ambulance doctor?
I'm sure you could! I'll try and find one to come on and discuss how to get into it!
Becoming a HEMS doctor would take an enormous amount of study and experience in emergency, ICU and anaesthetics. You would need to be a registrar at minimum. Not trying to discourage you, but just giving you a realistic idea of what your experience would need to be. Good luck!
I have questions!
I have ideas for other topics!
Meanwhile I just had a shit ton of these cars block intersections and denied people from going on their green lights for what I'm assuming was a funeral escort....if I don't see blue or a firetruck you're nobody.
We don't have funeral escorts in the UK. Only emergency vehicles can be fitted with blue/green lights.
This is the strangest and most seemingly pointless concept I’ve ever heard of.
Doctor's car??? are they also called Fly Car Ambulances
No such thing as ambulance drivers. Paramedic, Technicians or trainees. Also Paramedics cannot drive with green light say when providing a BASICs response.
Wrong, and right. There are such things as ambulance drivers, and ECAs too. You are correct that a paramedic cannot use a green light, only doctors registered with the GMC can do that.
You “feel like” they’re an incredibly rare sight? How do you feel that? Do you mean “I think they’re a rare sight” or “I appreciate that they’re a bit of a rare sight”? Everything these days is “feel like” and it’s nonsense.
I feel like someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. 🙈
I feel like you’re not very fun at parties…
@@BallyBoy95 nope. Someone is just fed up with how stupid the World is getting and isn’t half asleep like the rest of you.
@@epictetus9766 Please tell us more about how you’re so woke 🥱
Something makes me feel that you're not familiar with basic English language patterns, and I feel like you're overanalysing.