ESO - Fallout & Elder Scrolls Guides Hey also, I believe when I did a playthrough. I had the summoned spectral assassin than you receive from doing a contract earlier in the questline. I remember a piece of dialogue saying not to kill Cicero or along the lines of this. thought might have missed it, love the videos keep it up
ESO - Fallout & Elder Scrolls Guides You missed one ESO. If you have the spectral assassin active while going to dawnguard sanctuary he tells you that he'll kill the jester if you want but it's not what the dread father wishes. Another indication that Astrid is bad.
I challenge anyone to read through all of Cicero's Journals and kill him after. He basically saved the dark brotherhood from fading into obscurity, dragging the Nightmother halfway across Tamriel just to find a Listener after seeing everyone get murdered. Hes probably one of the better written characters with a decent back story and you also get to keep him as a follower which is rare as most followers are hopelessly boring and generic.
You forgot perhaps the most damning reason of all to spare Cicero: When you summon the Spectral Assassin (a power granted to you after one of your contracts), you revive the spectre of Lucien Lachance. Lachance was an original member of the Black Hand, one of the five leaders of the Dark Brotherhood, in the time of Oblivion's game, and he now resides in the void with Sithis. If summoned, he will (many times) mention doubt in Astrid's ability - making comments about her leadership abilities, hinting at the need for a sanctuary purification (a slaughter of all members of the Dark Brotherhood handed down directly from Sithis in order to rid the Brotherhood of those who break the tenets and, in Oblivion's case, traitors). He also mentions that he has great respect for "the Keeper's...sacred position within the Dark Brotherhood" in reference to Cicero. But perhaps the most important thing the spectral assassin says comes during the quest to kill Cicero, where (if summoned) he will remark: "I will kill this jester if you so desire, but there is a disturbance in the Void. Our Dread Father does not wish this." Sithis himself is discontent with Cicero being murdered.
Alexander Hovanec Sithis didn't do anything for me. Technically speaking, he's the reason I had to kill Narfi, so fuck it. I don't regret killing Cicero if it meant that Sithis is denied anything.
I find it hilarious that people are justifying sparing a murderer that attacked your other murderer friends, who you help murder. y'all nigga's need Talos.
I never understood why so many players loved Astrid when the same players thought Delphine was the worst. BOTH boss you around even though they should be in service to YOU, the listener/dragonborn.. Man I wish you could kill Delphine
Mia Rasmussen now that I think about it, they are pretty similar. Both are bossy jerks who think they’re better than you, and both try (and at least in my case, fail) to have you murder a cool character. Now if only Delphine would perform the Black Sacrament on herself... In a perfect world...
@@DresdenShuffle Nobody likes her dafuq? She is hot though but last I checked, you're not forced to be her slave if you don't want to. Joining the brotherhood and being Dragonborn, one is a choice but I guess that's too hard to comprehend.
SAME. In 120 hours of game she sent me like 10 assasins in different occasions. When I got to the cabin, I had no doubt. I crushed her skull with my battleaxe. Fuck you and fuck the stupid dark brotherhood.
Cicero is just loyal. That's all. Astrid broke the rules. He's an amazing assassin, too. He plays the dumb jester, and then when you laugh at him, and turn to walk away happy and smiling, he kills you quickly. He's so kind. I respect him. I killed him the first time, but I went back to save him. Imagine him killing vampires with the Dawnguard. Boom.
Da Best In Da Business Never killed him because I had summoned the astral Assassin, and he kept saying that the Dread Father didn’t wish it... I mean, not really impactful, but I’m nothing if not loyal.
I was a bit dissapointed how weak cicero was. He should have killed all the members of the fake brotherhood. Still spared him in the end, bitch astrid got what she deserved.
I always recruit NPC that I killed in the quest. If the NPC is not too bad, I will make them survive. I even resurrect frost giant, I think giant is quite peaceful if you do not attack them at first. I always take the elephant cheese before them and they do not attack me. But for some hateful NPC like Delphine, they need to die even no quest's requirement
I’ve had a very low tolerance for traitors since Oblivion’s Dark Brotherhood questline basically traumatized me and killed off my favorite NPC, Lucien. Astrid always seemed off to me too much for me to trust her and her decision to insult the Night Mother and ignore the tenets made me think of Lucien and how much he valued the Night Mother and the tenets and it made me dislike her even more so when she told me to kill Cicero I said ‘fuck that’. I ain’t killing the only real member of the Dark Brotherhood for some fake leader. And guess what Astrid’s bitch ass betrayed me for power and Cicero didn’t so guess who was right all along.
I remember my first playthrough of Oblivion. Seeing Lucien's dead body that the other members of the Dark Brotherhood killed broke my heart. I kept thinking I could revive him somehow, but when the game wouldn't let me. I wanted to kill every member of the DB that was standing around his corpse. "Traumatized" is the perfect word to describe my reaction when Lucien was killed off.
I actually decided to let Cicero live because I took pity on the dying man. And then I got caught trying to pickpocket him and he stood right the fuck up lmao
There is another reason why Cicero is a true member of the dark brotherhood, if you are on your way to Cicero in the dawn star sanctuary with the spectral assassin summoned, he said something like this:'there is a disturbance in the void, our dread lord does not agree with this' or something like that, by that he means that sithis does not want Cicero dead. EVIDENCE RIGHT THERE PEOPLE
Veezara was the best in my opinion. He was always calm, and never glorified himself. Also, he's very friendly during the questline. As a *Shadowscale* he was raised to be an assassin...too bad Astrid was in charge...
“None of the members have any connection to the night mother.” Actually, Festus. Festus Krex is looked down for actually believing Cicero and the Night Mother’s Return gives them a future. As he himself says “Without her, we are just a group of cutthroats.” While Abjorn sees Cicero and Nightmother as a “Jester and Corpse.”
Actually, Festus Krex does mention that he is glad that Cicero and the Night Mother have arrived, stating that their arrival is a "welcome return to tradition" So in a way Festus could be considered a "true" member of the Brotherhood.
The Dark Brotherhood could make a a thrilling movie, it has everything : charismatic and original characters ( Nazir, Vezeera, Babette ), betrayals, strongly emotional scenes ( the attack on the Falkreath sanctuary, the encounter with Maro etc ), lore ( Sithis, the Night mother )
Dark Brotherhood, the Thieves Guild, and Dawnguard are the best quest lines. They should be made into a trilogy by Peter Jackson. Followed by a Dragon Born, Main Quest Line, and Civil War trilogy. The latter being very similar to The Hobbit trilogy where you kill Smog (Alduin) and the battle of the 5 armies (Civil War).
I almost always spare him, because I think he is one of the best characters in the whole game (the most unique at least). The last time I killed him was because I wanted different gameplay. I think most of the people kill him because after all he stabbed Veezara and Arnbjorn and at the point everyone trusted Astrid (and did what she said). The funny thing is, Cicero can be more trusted than Astrid.
@@tk-hf4oz oh yeah Astrid is dumb asf, she nearly got everyone at the dark brotherhood killed. Cicero is just crazy. But i agree he is an interesting character.
@@1983SpringBonnie 6 months late but I still just wanted to say, he's an assassin for the dark brotherhood. Here's a quote "Sithis is worshipped by the Dark Brotherhood and many other cults." that should sum it all up
Veezara and Babete (the argonian and the vampire girl), Veezara was trained since he was born, to serve the dark brotherhood. And Babete, is sooo old, that in one of the conversations you can have with her, she talks about the time when the nite mother was still alive. Meaning she was already alive at that point. So i don`t think Cicero was the ONLY real member. But i DO agree that he is the only one REALLY following the old ways. From my point of view, more a leadership problem, than a mistake from the members.
Babete straight up tells you that Astrid's rules are more important. And Veezara doesn't care about it at all. Only Festus Krex (old mage guy) says good things about the old ways of the Dark Brotherhood, but ultimately he doesn't really care that much either. Sadly.
You are right about that. But i wasn`t talking about the way they see it or their inclinations. I was pointing that babete was around since the beginning, and veezara was raised for the pourpose of serving the Dark Brotherhood. So, they have every right to be counted as REAL Dark Brotherhood members. And to show that it was more a problem of their leader than a problem with them, even babete thinking Astrid is not wrong, she is still with us in the santuary of downstar. Even if she`s got her particular opinions, they are loyal to the person in command of the sanctuary. None of them oposed to the dark mother once it was proven that she was the real thing (at least no one i can remember right now). They was caught in a power strugle because of Astrid, and being loyal to her as the leader, they was afraid of cicero. About Veezara, i don`t think it is fair... i mean, he is as loyal as a dog. The poor argonian was created like a soldier from a veeeery young age. He is the kind of guy that do as he is told to do. and always follows and protect his leader. About Festus... it felt bad to see the old guy dead in the tree like that =/.
Your final point about Cicero is incorrect. He is not the only member of the Dark Brotherhood that has a connection to the old ways. Both Veezara and Babette have connections. Veezara talks about how he was once a Shadowscale, and Babette talks of how she was old enough to serve the Night Mother.
Marcus Julius Caesar unless I'm remembering incorrectly babette wasn't with the DB back then she just more or less took the opportunity to join. I want to say before Astrid took over a century or 2 ago
Festus mentions something about a "welcome return to tradition" when Cicero arrives with the Night Mother, and Astrid said she was taken in by the Dark Brotherhood when she was young. To me, everything points to this group being a legitimate branch of the Dark Brotherhood that was led away astray under Astrid's poor leadership. She wouldn't be able to reward you with Shadowmere or the ghost of Lucien LaChance if she wasn't a legitimate member of the Brotherhood.
Do you mean in spirit or physical? Her statue is in the center of Bravil in Oblivion. The citizens of Bravil called it the Lucky lady and the Night Mother's crypt was below it. The events of Oblivion took place 200 years before Skyrim.
If you go to kill Cicero with the spectral Assassin summoned he says that while he would help kill Cicero if you order it but that Sithius didn't want Cicero dead yet
That’s because that spectral assasin is the ghost of Lucien Lachance who was the speaker or listener(can’t remember) in oblivion, and everything astrid was doing was against what sithis and the night mother would want.
@CD Smith You know you can get a mod for that and you sadly, you can't make her not evil with another mod because no such mod exists. Oof.(You can spawn her back in though or resurrect her etc) I am probably going to do that and also keep Cicero around because I honestly would want both to serve as my royal assassins. Cicero would be my royal court jester and Astrid would be the master of assassins. Also because my character is with the Imperials, so in a sense, he and her would be on the same side for protecting the Emperor I suppose.
Honestly....I think Cicero has the best voice actor in the game...hands down. I mean....just listen to his conversation with the Night Mother. I always spare him and the first time I did and he returned and made that joke about killing me....I knew I did the right thing :D
his voice actor is amazing! theres so much life and personality in the voice... if only the facial expressions and animations showed how crazy he is lol
This is just my opinion and everyone has theirs.peace I joined the Dark Brotherhood because of Astrid, she Invited me and I joined with my own will. She's the new leader and her law is the one that I followed or will follow, I don't even know about the Night Mother or the old tradition in the first place, I don't care if our group is the Original Dark Brotherhood or it's just some kind of Assassins but I will not betray Astrid, she maybe betrayed me but it's just because of what she had become and she's not like that at first until Cicero came and talk about some listener, I'm fine being just a member, as I said Astrid is the leader of the group I joined at and the reason why I joined, not the Night Mother or Cicero.
The 5 tenants of the Dark Brotherhood were established for a reason so events like this would not happen and this all probably happened before way back in the beginning of the Dark Brotherhood's years. If you play Oblivion, Lucian LeChance will tell you all about that and why the 5 tenants are so vital to the functional running of the Dark Brotherhood. Astrid ignored them and that led to the downfall of HER group of "in name's sake" assassins guild. I would wager the Dark Mother or Sithis himself put voices and whispers of deceit into the mind of Maro to betray the deal Astrid offered him to punish Astrid for her betrayal of Sithis and breaking all the tenants. The Mafia and the cartels have parallel rules at the top of their organizations so that things do not fall apart and when people start breaking them the organization starts losing members one way or another.
The one thing that gives me comfort when I play the Dark Brotherhood Questline is that there is an afterlife for everyone. If you're a good person, you go to one of the good places. If you're a bad person, you go to a bad place. A werewolf? You get to hunt with the deadric prince of the hunt. A hero? Sovengarde. I just try to make their death as quick and painless as I can. Plus Cicero is the best character in the game. He has a personality larger than life.
There are many, many different Afterlifes in the Elder Scrolls universe. Nords have Sovengarde. Of course it isn't exclusive to Nords, the become worthy for Sovengarde you have to die an honorable death or fall in battle. If you live a comfy life with no danger, you don't get that afterlife. Instead, depending on your race or your religion, you may go to Aetherius, or Sands Behind the Stars, or maybe you go to a Daedric Realm for being a worthwhile servant. Hell, being a Vampire or a Werewolf automatically lock you from having a regular afterlife. If you're a Vampire, you spend eternity with Molag Bal in Coldharbour in death. And you already explained Werewolves afterlife. The Dark Brotherhood choose to worship Sithis. They will all go to the Void when they die, and depending on their actions, either eternal peace or eternal suffering. Break the Tenets and you can guarantee a most unfortunate afterlife with Sithis. But be faithful to the ways of the Dark Brotherhood and you will be rewarded. Point is. Gods, Aedra, Daedra, afterlife, and all that stuff is very complicated. It's not like real life where the existence of God is debatable at the best of times, in the Elder Scrolls, there is no denying the existence of Gods. Both Aedra and Daedra exist and there is no denying unless you're an idiot. The afterlife reflects the person who died. Depending on your actions in life, your race, or your beliefs, these things will dictate where you go when you die. So overall, the one thing we can all agree on, is to cure yourself of Vampirism if you don't wish to suffer for the rest of eternity after death.
If youre an assaasin, youve chosen the bad afterlife by default, lol. Murdering people by choice just for money is in no way shape or form justifiable.
I just finished this quest. Damn that harlet Astrid. I left that trash beast burnt on the ground, crafted a bunch of potions for twenty minutes then came back in dressed in Cicero' s clothes and then a homerun swing to the face with the mace of Molag Bal. Astrid deserves nothing less.
i think we need to remember not only cicero respected the nightmother Gabriella said she deserved unwavering respect and support but thought cicero was too exuberant also festus krex welcomes cicero to the sanctuary and later stops being a jerk when he finds out you are the listener.
He stops being a jerk if you liste, to him enough in his dialogues, by staying silent. He gives the player the Nightweaver Band before you become listener if I'm not mistaken
One of the Tenets is "don't disrespect the Night Mother", something she does all the time, and another "don't betray the secrets of the brotherhood", something she also does by telling the commander about your plan. She breaks the rules herself so it makes sense to abandon them
@@zhangbill1194 correct because another tenant if i remember correctly is to never question a superior and to always do whatever task they order you to do. in oblivion you end up killing tons of innocent members of the dark brotherhood (i think it was members of the blackhand? cant remember) and you find out later that you were being lied to by someone above you hence it being their fault. lucien also gets killed because they think he is a betrayer but then you find out from the spectral assassin spell that he now resides in the void with his dread father
If you confront Astrid on why Cicero would attack her, she flat out admits that Cicero must have overheard her mocking the Night Mother, and says she thinks obeying the Night Mother and you being the Listener is ridiculous. I don't believe for a second that Astrid didn't plan for Cicero to overhear her, hoping it would provoke him into an attack. Cicero also says he feels slightly bad about what happened to Veezara, but that he got in his way, so he really was only going after Astrid, not any of the others. Besides, Lucien Lachance, your spectral assassin friend, flat out tells you that Sithis does not want you to kill Cicero and that the position of Keeper is sacred in the order. All in all, killing Cicero feels wrong, a rebellion against the true Dark Brotherhood. Killing Cicero is turning your back on the Night Mother and Sithis, and choosing Astrid's vision of the Dark Brotherhood, which isn't really the Dark Brotherhood at all. It's a shame that the game doesn't reflect this in the choice, because it doesn't make much sense for the Night Mother to respond to you if you betray the tenants and kill the scared Keeper not only against her wishes, but at the behest of a faithless pretender.
@@nickbrothwood1238 isnt that what they always were? The only difference between the modern Dark Brotherhood and the old one is that the modern one wasnt getting contracts from the nightmother.
"I don't believe for a second that Astrid didn't plan for Cicero to overhear her, " so you think she wanted Cicero to stab Veezara and endanger the lives of the otherer of the members? What would be the point of purposely enraging a person who's already crazy? If she wanted to get " Lucien Lachance, your spectral assassin friend, flat out tells you that Sithis does not want you to kill Cicero and that the position of Keeper is sacred in the order. All in all, killing Cicero feels wrong, a rebellion against the true Dark Brotherhood. Killing Cicero is turning your back on the Night Mother and Sithis" You say that like its a bad thing. Its not like the old brotherhood was more righteous than the new brotherhood, and its not like Sithis is good
Yellow Mask Dude fair point main reason i spare him he's an unkillable follower i play on ps3 so no mods there's only a select few followers that are unkillable in the normal game like Dereekthus Mjoll the Lioness Farkus Serana of course Cicero and Dark Brotherhood Initiates are the only one's i know of
Steve Stevenson even more he took the part where gandalf said dont be eager to deal out death and tells u thats why you should spare cicero... IF I'M IN THE DARK BROTHERHOOD I'M A ASSASIN DAMNIT
Initially, I ratted cicero out to the guards for being a mental annoying bastard, but after finding out that he only became mental because of his dedication to the nightmother and the brotherhood, I spared his life for being the last OG. Initially, I thought astrid was one of the coolest characters in the game, until it became more obvious of how jealous and un-professional she was seemingly becoming due to my importance to the brotherhood lineage. The betrayal was still quite a shock though, and it was pretty sad seeing the majority of the skyrim family sect being burned and slaughtered in the ruins, but it's that genuine surprise that adds to the list of reasons to why the dark brotherhood are the most interesting and engaging faction in all of tamriel. Hail Sithis.
That's what I'm saying! You can't spare her anyways. It's the matter in if you are going to keep Cicero alive or not. I was waiting for at least one person to say something about this.
So, if you decide to termintate the Brotherhood, you just killed a bunch of thugs using the name for profit, actually helping Cicero to rebuild the chapter under the Nightmother. If you join the Brotherhood, you kill the leader of the pretenders and recruit the survivors into the true Dark Brotherhood, as Listener. Dang :c
For those enjoying Skyrim and enjoy unique builds, here's one I'll be pitching to ESO. Hope you enjoy, as this took two damn hours to write. The Jack of All Trades. (Modded) The Jack of All Trades is a fresh faced young wood elf seeking glory in the land of Skyrim after leading a privileged life that allowed him to learn many things. The Jack of All Trades is well rounded character who doesn't just excel at one skill, but is proficient in many skills, and he wants to use them to help the people of Skyrim with an open mind and heart... But at what cost? The Jack of All Trades is a wood elf from Grand Tree in Valenwood. And will take advantage of the lover stone to start with, and then will eventually graduate to one of two stones: The Lord or the Lady, depending on which you value more; regeneration or defense. The main skills for the Jack of All Trades are Two Handed, Archery and Restoration, with minor skills in Light Armor, Enchanting and Smithing. Obviously it's a well rounded build that is going to take plenty of time to complete, but if you're patient, this character will come full circle and end up being incredibly balanced and prepared for any situation he will find himself in. Now we get to the backstory: The Jack of All Trades was born in Grand Tree to a Huntress mother and a smith father, both of whom met many people and made many friends due to their central location. The two were incredibly skilled at their work and business was always booming. His mother knew how to cut the most from any kill she made and his father knew how to craft remarkable weapons, like great-swords that weighed half of what they normally should. These techniques were passed onto the Jack of All Trades. The boy was very curious as a child, always wanting to learn more and was blessed with a sharp mind, a pure heart, and good looks to boot. The boy got the same experience his parents did but from a younger age: He met many different kinds of people who were traveling through Grandtree, strangers that sought his parents goods, old friends, warriors, priests and mages. The boy grew up knowing no hate for anyone and with the idea that everyone should have a chance to be a good person. Luckily, this meant the boy was open to teachings from these people. His father taught him basic smithing while his mother taught him to hunt. Mages and priests who came through showed the boy healing magics and enchanting. Warriors taught the boy proper sword techniques, all of which he learned with gusto. He also discovered there was little he wasn't good at, whether it was studying, training, working or charming the local boy's and girls in the village. He was an open minded kid. As he grew older, the people he knew would always return, but they also always left, only to return to tell him of the great lands he could only see in his dreams. He imagined seas of sand, icy coasts of endless water, mountains with snow caps that stretched into the clouds, and on his 18th birthday, he decided he was tired of waiting for the world to come to him. With the help of his father, he crafted a beautiful bow, a quiver of arrows, an Elven great sword and a Green good for the journey. His parents knew he could care for himself and with a heartfelt goodbye, the Jack of All Trades set out to see the world. Over the next 5 years, the boy would travel the world, learning as much as he could from people, doing various odd jobs for people, no matter who they were, and making friends across Hammerfell, Elsweyr, Daggerfall, and Cyrodil. Upon reaching the Imperial City, the boy finally hears about the conflicts in Skyrim. Motivated by the thought that people up there defiantly could use his help, he packs up his few possessions and heads towards the providence. From there he is captured on the border, and carted to Helgen. From here you know the story. After escaping with the Stormcloaks, the boy will be quite Distraught, as he no longer has the items he worked so hard to keep. But when he makes it to river wood with nothing but a longbow and iron great sword, this will not last long. He knew that a few kind deeds would go a long way and a little hard work wouldn't hurt him. Plus, he had plenty of skills to help him. He will work around riverwood, getting steel ingots, hunting animals for pelts, and chopping firewood This is where the mods come in. The Mods that are Absolutely necessary for this build are the Ranger, Paladin and Mercenary Armor Mods. These mods will grant you the needed weapons and armor for this build. Essentially, they reskin several weapons and armors to do more damage while retaining the desired Aesthetic. I also recommend getting the Forgotten Dungeons and Extra Bandit Camps, as it adds a lot of extra spots for the Jack of All Trades to train in, but these are not at all needed and simply make the experience more fun and make Skyrim more lively. Roleplaying for this character is quite simple. Your character is out to help people and make as many friends as possible. There is no job too demeaning, and no quest you cannot undertake. You want to experience as much of Skyrim as you can. You was to see everything people can offer. Always try to be nice, even to those who aren't nice to you. Give money to the poor, use money to persuade people, and try to resolve disputes peacefully. But if someone won't listen, do not fear drawing your weapon and slaying them. The Rangers play style is simple, when enemies are engaged, you'll draw your bow and fire, taking out as many enemies as you can before they get too close, then you switch to the sword and slice down whoever remains. If a fight gets too challenging, quickly get to safety and cast Restoration Magic. Use Quick Healing, and healing hands/heal other if you have a companion. You would never want to see a friend die. The factions for this build are incredibly different then others, as all of them are open to the Jack of All Trades. Even the 'Evil' ones. Remember: He's seeking a view of all people of Skyrim. He needs to keep an open mind to the many different backgrounds. It is Recommended you play in this order for the experience: Travel and meet the Jarls, become Thane in as many places as possible. Then Companions, Dawnguard, College of Winterhold, Main Quest, Dragonborn, Civil War, Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood. By the time he reaches the college, Dragons should be a pain in the ass. He will begin the Main Story, meeting the Cultists, and after Alduin is slain, he will travel to Sohlstiem. Upon his return, he will see the Civil War has escalated and he will side with the Imperials, upon discovering Ulfric Stormcloaks true nature. Companions can be anyone. I personally recommend you use your favorite. Vorstag and Janessa make great choices, for companion or spouse. The gear comes solely from the mods. You will get those materials at the beginning, leather, steel and firewood, and Craft the Mercenary Bow, mercenary Greatsword and Mercenary Advanced Arrows. For Armor, You will use the Green Paladins Mantle for a good, the Rangers Green Outfit, and the Rangers Brown Gloves and Boots. It gives an amazing Aesthetic that really makes you feel that Elven Ranger vibe this build gives off. Plus, it gives you a hunting bow and steel greatsword but with much higher damage rates, and faster attacks. Eventually, you'll craft the Legendary Paladin Greatsword and craft a Blessed Crossbow to match. Enchant your armor with Fortify Restoration, Two Handed and Archery to boost your primary Skills. Use a Gold And Emerald Necklace and ring for Jewelery, and if you have the Circlets with Hoods Mod, same with the circlet. Thank you. Hope you read this, this took nearly two hours of my life to type.
True but even the player itself was following Astrid at the very beginning, but if he was still alive after the attack and knew about Astrid's betrayal, he probably would be following the Night Mother just like Nazir
Lucien tells you that Sithis doesn't want Cicero dead. He says there's a disturbance in the Void and then he actually tells you "our dread father doesn't wish this" so it's confirmed in game that the "true dark brotherhood" way is to spare the jester. Sithis also gets pissed if you kill your employer for the emperor.
My first encounter with the brotherhood I was so pissed at Astrid. I knew she was bad from almost the start. I spared the jester even tho I hate him. From then on I take out the brotherhood in my play throughs. I do like the one guy Nazir. He does not seem to be a bad member but I just can't deal with the betrayal of Astrid to keep him around. Thanks to you ESO for the vids
The right way to go thru it was to spare Cicero. The story itself blatantly points at it. Astrid even sacrifices herself to make amends with what she turned the Brotherhood into. You dont so much kill her as she commits suicide. You just put her out of her misery as she asks you to do. Her character was misunderstood. She tries to keep the Brotherhood together by breaking the tenets. In her view, the tenets had already failed, and her group is all that's left of the Dark Brotherhood. Logically, she did the right thing. Cicero lived by tenets and his duty, alone with the Night Mother's corpse, and became a lunatic... That's the great part of the story. Astrid was a survivor and strong leader, but backstabbing and ruthless. Cicero was loyal and dutiful, but a pitiful fanatic obsessed with caring for a mummy. A sane person would have gone the Astrid route. I would have. It was almost like the story of Anakin. He became a Jedi because he the chosen one, he betrayed and helped destroy the Jedi, he lived up to his role and destroyed the Sith, including himself, and brought balance to the force. He saved the Jedi. I loved Astrid's character. And she was second only to Aela in hotness.
@SpiritWolf2K Bad for the Brotherhood, not evil, they're all evil exceot maybe the argonian (essentially brainwashed into an assassin as a child) and Cicero (too crazy to know what he's doing)
Fabien Dussere bro the dark brootherhood kill people who do evil like grelod she was actually racist to the orcs and she didn't want the kids to have a good and happy life
another thing you should have mentioned is that the spectral assassin, Lucien LaChance, tells you that while he will support your choice, Sithis does not want Cicero slain.
This is just my opinion and everyone has theirs.peace I joined the Dark Brotherhood because of Astrid, she Invited me and I joined with my own will. She's the new leader and her law is the one that I followed or will follow, I don't even know about the Night Mother or the old tradition in the first place, I don't care if our group is the Original Dark Brotherhood or it's just some kind of Assassins but I will not betray Astrid, she maybe betrayed me but it's just because of what she had become and she's not like that at first until Cicero came and talk about some listener, I'm fine being just a member, as I said Astrid is the leader of the group I joined at and the reason why I joined, not the Night Mother or Cicero.
So there is this method I found out after killing Cicero is that if you steal his clothes then once he's dead use the dead thrall conjuration master spell. You get him as a follower that can't interact but he still says his dialogue. Also if you kill once he is your zombie, steal his clothes, resurrect him And fast travel he will appear again with his clothes meaning you can get an infinite amount of Cicero clothes
well he says that he is not a very religious man cuz he was trained to be an assasin since his hatching and its all that he knows ( or lizard ) but he respect traditions, the only problem is that he is in favor with astrid.
Tbh almost all the members in both Skyrim and Oblivion are just glorified assassins. Go replay Oblivion, do the Dark Brotherhood quests and see if the other members are devout followers of Sithis and Night Mother. With the exception of some of the members of the Black Hand, they aren't, one of them even says something like "I don't know anything about Night Mother, but she pays me to kill so I don't care"
I know this was 4 years ago, but I am literally standing at the entrance to the cave and you made my decision super easy. Thanks for the heads up and the change of mind
You forgot to mention that Lucien Lachance tells you "I will kill this jester if you so desire, but there is a disturbance in the Void. Our Dread Father does not wish this." "The Keeper is a sacred position within the Dark Brotherhood. Ask yourself - do you trust the wisdom of our Lady?" That was the prime reason I let him live.
Luddmeister: My first DB playthrough, that is what convinced me. I was on the fence before that (Mostly because I didn't play Oblivion yet and at that time didn't know what a real DB was supposed to look like - I skipped straight from Morrowind to Skyrim).
Yes with no listeners the dark brotherhood in skyrim is not a real brotherhood..... with no listener it must be for profit kills.... not night mother orders. Cicero sees this and I agreed with him the first time I met him.
Ghalaxtic Mehses Last I checked even if you follow the Night Mother's orders, it's because someone performed the Black Sacrament, and has some gold ready for you.
OtomostheCrazy yes but how are they hearing the night mother??? Oh that's right they are not. They make up how they pick targets... without a listener they are just tong for profit killers... I don't think you understand how blasphemous it is to kill without a listener.
acid sk8r your right, as he was trained by the original brotherhood you can say he is the real deal. He also says he respects Mother but is not much for religion.
I honestly hated Delphai more than Astrid. I am the chosen dragon born, I rescue the old dude from hiding, clear out a huge base of operations and rebuild the blades with the best I have to offer rocking sick gear.... But util I kill parthanax and turn my back on the graybeads, I can't slay dragons and she's telling me that I am unwelcome ... and treats me with disrespect ... In the base I created. Grrrrr The times I thrashed her in nerd rage only to load... I read it was bugged and you had to kill him. And I had all my shouts. I should have checked after I killed main dude. Then talked to her. With Astrid it was business. You get used to that. Someone paid to have me killed. Sure later it became more personal but with a band of thieves or an assassin den you half expect that....even in the fist playthrough I felt my thief missions felt like a setup , more to them .... But she talks the blades up like some noble thing and I think her knife sunk the deepest. I hate her. She's nothing without my character and it's like the only 'guild' you don't become leader of.
this is why the settessential command is my favorite i said fuck it and just killed the fucking blades parthanax is one of my all time favorite elder scrolls characters right behind sheogorath
@@williamwaugh2004 played console. But fus ro dah'd her right off the mountain. If she's aggro towards me later, let her. If she can't die she can fall of a hundred mountains.
It's interesting how her dialogue develops. First she tells you that the blades served the Dragonborn, then she tells you that they protected and guided the Dragonborn and finally she orders the Dragonborn. It's a pity there isn't a mod that lets you inform the Thalmor where they are.
@@davenewton3576 I believe there is a mod where you can choose negotiate with The Blades and Paarthurnax and reach an understanding, leaving both alive and loyal to the Dragonborn, or straight up kill the blades and swear sole loyalty to The Greybeards instead. That's a question for r/Skyrim if you need further info, I can't provide any more than that. But siding with the Thalmor would be interesting, I wonder if that could also work as a choice in the Civil War, or the College quests
well you dont become leader of dawnguard too but yes at least Isran shows you lot of respect. Parthurnax is my boy he gives buff to shouts and saved me during first battle against Alduin while I was in panic behind a rock
I used to kill Cicero, until I summoned Lucien and he told me it was not right to kill the keeper. since I had cicero as a follower, I won't kill him again.
Moifaàmoimoi Betrays you because she thought you'd divide the family like Skyrim. It doesn't excuse her actions and the consequences of said actions, but she has a reason. Besides, she put a hit out on herself after realizing out what she did, so she wasn't all that bad.
OtomostheCrazy Yes. Yes she was. There is still the problem that she was fine with killing you, a vital figure in ALL their plans since recruited, because she was paranoid.
Zash of The Kyobi To be fair, you weren't really all that vital. I mean, she could've sent anyone else in your place to meet with the guy in the Nordic Tomb. All your assassinations could have been done by the others. In fact in the wedding mission, they give you advice on how to perform it. Almost any one of the others could have taken your place and performed it just as well. Besides, the way you make it sound, if anything tries to take your character's life, they are evil, plain and simple. That's actually kind of selfish in a role-playing sense. I mean, if they tried to kill you, and you killed them in self defense, there'd be an acceptable reason, but in this case, she tries to kill you (with the intention of keeping the Dark Brotherhood from being Divided, mind you), and you go to kill her, with the reason of revenge or retaliation as your justification.
OtomostheCrazy She's evil in the sense of betrayal. That much is sort of obvious. I mean I think its somewhat justified to consider somewhat you thought was your ally literally going to the commander of the guard to rat you out evil. She is quite literally the female Judas.
Zash of The Kyobi I wouldn't use Judas as an example beyond the action, because last I checked the one he betrayed not only saw it coming, but pretty much forgave him. Besides, depending on your game, you're way worse than her, since taking those assassination contracts would end up with you killing some of your friends (I'm still mad about Narfi).
Actually another cool little thing I found just the other day is that if you spawn lucien lahchance in ( sorry don’t know how to spell it off the top of my head) he talks about how sithis doesn’t want to kill Cicero and he think you should leave him
seab I am not sure I switched to PC during the last Console gen change. but the one I like the most is called "The Paarthunax Dilemma". That's all I know sorry
Oh my God! This is the first time I’ve seen this video. And I’ve been watching your videos for at least a year now. And even though Skyrim was made back in 2011 or so, and it’s about 12 years later, I want to redo everything I did to make sure Cicero survives. I had no idea what I was doing from the very beginning of play through because I just simply thought it was the right thing to do even though I was manipulated into the game. Now that I see the truth, I’m going to replay this entire game from scratch and do everything right that ES oh describes on his channel because I want to make the greatest outlook of my own character ever to be created in Skyrim. I love Skyrim, I love dragons, and I love all the aesthetics of Skyrim for over a decade now and it’s still not old to me. It’s still a beloved game in my heart.
I hate Astrid! Not only does she betray me because apparently even though in my mind I swore loyalty to her the first playthrough but my old chump Festus died cuz of her. In fact I hate her so much that I spared Cicero the second time around just to spite her. And then figured out I also liked cicero too. (cicero's marriage mod works well btw) I never kill him now. And I always have wine and ale and mead on me and celebrate over astrid's dead body now. (tears) Oh festus, you were like the grandfather I never wanted. We bonded over our mutual agreement over the ineptness and talentlessness of mages of winterhold and how Destruction magic is awesome especially if you turn your opponents to crispy bits.
i know this is a fairly old comment but saying he need a social life because he said why he hates astrid is like saying someone needs a social life if they talk about why they hate someone in a movie
The only reason i like her, is when i met her, she was sitting on a shelf, qith absolutely no indication of how the heck she got up there. *im still mesmerised to this day*
I think the entire Dark Brotherhood quest line was a way for the night mother to kill astrid, when you truly think about it, it all lead up to that in the end
I like to see it as a test . One last chance for Astrid to prove she is in fact a member of the Dark Brotherhood . And having failed the test she got what she deserved. As did the others for siding with her instead of their true Master, Sithis and the Night Mother.
If you summon the ghost, he will say that that Sithis himself doesn't want you to kill Cicero. He even aludes to the fact that Sithis and the Nightmother care about the clown, which is kinda unique.
By killing astrid when she kidnaps you, why cant you juts keep the others alive and join them then? That would solve many problems during the quest. and you can keep Cicero alive.
However, there should be a mod that can allow for that choice, however I do believe it does alter the story a bit so it'd be a rather big one....my favorite kind.
Have fun walking into a Sanctuary filled with assassins that follow Astrid loyally when you first start the Dark Brotherhood. Especially her werewolf husband.
You have to kill Astrid wether you kill Cicero or not. But definetly spare him. He has an amazing story of how he slowly came to madness. Also I recommend taking every single one of his diarys and read them in order, it just gave me goosebumps. Please: spare him
Mason Hoffman i want to spare him but when i saw him first i tough he was a creepy midget so i got him arested is there some way to get him back except for re-beginning?
I think it's implied that she is more of an honourless hypocrite, especially since she was leading a fanatical (but somewhat immoral) faction. I want to chose between killing two assassins, I would chose one with the least integrity.
Also, Christopher Lee (Saruman) helped the director with getting the right sound effect for a stab in the back... Because he was a British Government assassin in WW2.
Dyslexia has nothing to do with understanding or pronouncing a word. Saying "tenant" here instead of "tenet" is a simple misunderstanding of the words tenet.
KMM Please this guy's been doing this shit since day one, he'd go off and shoot at passing goats instead of caring about the interesting lore...fucking pathetic.
Cicero was not the only real Dark Brotherhood assassin. What about Festus Krex? He was eager to return to the old ways, respected Cicero, and defended the Night Mother.
Saying that Cicero is the only true Dark Brotherhood member is inaccurate. First, any Argonian born under the celestial sign of the Shadow is taken to be trained as a Shadowscale for the Dark Brotherhood in the Black Marsh. Second, there is no requirement that one have a connection to Sithis. Most Brotherhood members are common murderers. Once they take an innocent's life, the Night Mother informs a Listener who tells the Speaker who visits the murderer and gives them an initiation test. This means that so long as you respect the tenants as a member who has thus far been initiated, you are indeed true Brotherhood. Third, the player character is outright granted rank of Listener very early into their time with the Brotherhood. If that doesn't say true Dark Brotherhood, I don't know what does.
the problem was that none of the members would be inclined to follow the tenets because their stand in leader hates them. And you are granted the Listener rank because you are about the only option left to save the Brotherhood from Astrids inept leadership. The woman was so dumb she couldn't even guess trying to backstab your friends (or dare I say family members), with a guy you KNOW is aware you killed his fucking SON, would end badly. And the whole cult is build on the fact that a magical ritual done from anywhere in the world will make them aware of a new contract. You can't just suddenly decide you don't want to do that any longer. People are going to loose faith in you, and thus you will hardly get any contracts.
One problem with the Shadowscales: Veezara says that he is the last Shadowscale. The order is extinct and none are being trained anymore. Cicero also mentions in his journals that they considered reopening a Shadowscale training camp, but the idea was abandoned because they lacked the resources. In addition, Veezara dies during the Imperial attack, meaning there are truly no Shadowscales left after that event.
She's right to hate them, Sithis is not exactly a pleasent being, and the dark brotherhoods connection with him is somethign that would best be lost to history.
+Fredrik Dunge Traitor! The Dread Father is cold, loving, and always watchful for his children. He and our dear Mother shall one day return this wold of hateful light to the true dark nothingness it once was and should now be. And as for those like you, who took the vows and joined his family only to forsake him? You shall suffer as Astrid does now! Mwahahahahaha! >XD
How the fuck is she right to hate him? She literally signed up for this. That would be like joining the military achieve the rank of major and then decide you hated your country and try to destroy it. That is what she did you know? How is she the good guy in this? She is worse than scum because the Dark Brotherhood might be assassins and murderes, but they at least stick to a code. They are professionals that only go after people because they were hired to. Astrid just wants you to murder people she doesn't like and will backstab you the first chance she gets.
Found myself never wanting to kill Cicero again after point one. After point 5 I was disgusted with myself that I have ever killed Cicero in any of my games and declare it my mission to kill Astrid a hundred times over....
Honestly, I didn't even realize it was optional for some reason. My internal dialogue must've misunderstood his alternative as uselessly begging for his own life.
Remember to follow me on Instergram & Tweeter for behind the scenes footage at PAX! (LINKS IN DESCRIPTION).
ESO - Fallout & Elder Scrolls Guides instergram lol
***** I'm dyslexic too, friend.
ESO - Fallout & Elder Scrolls Guides Hey also, I believe when I did a playthrough. I had the summoned spectral assassin than you receive from doing a contract earlier in the questline. I remember a piece of dialogue saying not to kill Cicero or along the lines of this. thought might have missed it, love the videos keep it up
ESO - Fallout & Elder Scrolls Guides great I have to start a new character
ESO - Fallout & Elder Scrolls Guides You missed one ESO. If you have the spectral assassin active while going to dawnguard sanctuary he tells you that he'll kill the jester if you want but it's not what the dread father wishes. Another indication that Astrid is bad.
I challenge anyone to read through all of Cicero's Journals and kill him after. He basically saved the dark brotherhood from fading into obscurity, dragging the Nightmother halfway across Tamriel just to find a Listener after seeing everyone get murdered. Hes probably one of the better written characters with a decent back story and you also get to keep him as a follower which is rare as most followers are hopelessly boring and generic.
He's a creep though.
@@peoples2296 also the adoring fan from oblivion
@@OliviaKirgo He is not the adoring fan from Oblivion.
@@TemujinTheKhan it's all opinion
@@OliviaKirgo It's not an opinion. Cicero is a man. The adoring fan from oblivion was mer. It's just an easter egg.
You forgot perhaps the most damning reason of all to spare Cicero:
When you summon the Spectral Assassin (a power granted to you after one of your contracts), you revive the spectre of Lucien Lachance. Lachance was an original member of the Black Hand, one of the five leaders of the Dark Brotherhood, in the time of Oblivion's game, and he now resides in the void with Sithis. If summoned, he will (many times) mention doubt in Astrid's ability - making comments about her leadership abilities, hinting at the need for a sanctuary purification (a slaughter of all members of the Dark Brotherhood handed down directly from Sithis in order to rid the Brotherhood of those who break the tenets and, in Oblivion's case, traitors). He also mentions that he has great respect for "the Keeper's...sacred position within the Dark Brotherhood" in reference to Cicero. But perhaps the most important thing the spectral assassin says comes during the quest to kill Cicero, where (if summoned) he will remark:
"I will kill this jester if you so desire, but there is a disturbance in the Void. Our Dread Father does not wish this."
Sithis himself is discontent with Cicero being murdered.
Alec Sweet same and I already killed poor Cicero
Alexander Hovanec
Sithis didn't do anything for me. Technically speaking, he's the reason I had to kill Narfi, so fuck it. I don't regret killing Cicero if it meant that Sithis is denied anything.
wow! never knew this! that is so cool.
That's cool as fuck dude thank you for sharing
I find it hilarious that people are justifying sparing a murderer that attacked your other murderer friends, who you help murder. y'all nigga's need Talos.
Spare Cicero. Somebody has to oil the NightMother's body and it sure as Oblivion ain't gonna be me!
Oils it...
Preserves it...
MASTRUBATES IT!!
@Toori Baba Cicero approves of your style (Y)
Oil it with wildfire.
@@adolfgaming1761 who the fuck gave you the right to comment i want to die
@@dirge44 It’s a deleted line… 😂 Fully recorded by the voice actor… it’s awful…
I never understood why so many players loved Astrid when the same players thought Delphine was the worst. BOTH boss you around even though they should be in service to YOU, the listener/dragonborn..
Man I wish you could kill Delphine
Mia Rasmussen now that I think about it, they are pretty similar. Both are bossy jerks who think they’re better than you, and both try (and at least in my case, fail) to have you murder a cool character. Now if only Delphine would perform the Black Sacrament on herself... In a perfect world...
Oh you have no idea how much i tried....i think i invented new words of power while shouting at her...
They like her cause she's hot. They're idiots who think only with their dicks.
I ain't killing Parthurnax, Delph bitch😎
@@DresdenShuffle Nobody likes her dafuq? She is hot though but last I checked, you're not forced to be her slave if you don't want to. Joining the brotherhood and being Dragonborn, one is a choice but I guess that's too hard to comprehend.
Astrid sent an assassin after me in the early game so this is my way of getting revenge
Well thats why i know they are stupid
I killed her in the cabin for this same reason.
@@mayken6912 same xD
SAME.
In 120 hours of game she sent me like 10 assasins in different occasions.
When I got to the cabin, I had no doubt. I crushed her skull with my battleaxe. Fuck you and fuck the stupid dark brotherhood.
A assassin tried to kill me and suddenly a bear appear nearby
And I run, the bear kill the assassin
how can they become as a assassin?
Cicero is just loyal. That's all. Astrid broke the rules. He's an amazing assassin, too. He plays the dumb jester, and then when you laugh at him, and turn to walk away happy and smiling, he kills you quickly. He's so kind. I respect him. I killed him the first time, but I went back to save him. Imagine him killing vampires with the Dawnguard. Boom.
Da Best In Da Business Never killed him because I had summoned the astral Assassin, and he kept saying that the Dread Father didn’t wish it... I mean, not really impactful, but I’m nothing if not loyal.
I was a bit dissapointed how weak cicero was. He should have killed all the members of the fake brotherhood. Still spared him in the end, bitch astrid got what she deserved.
Y’all become good homies if ya spare him lol
I always recruit NPC that I killed in the quest. If the NPC is not too bad, I will make them survive.
I even resurrect frost giant, I think giant is quite peaceful if you do not attack them at first. I always take the elephant cheese before them and they do not attack me.
But for some hateful NPC like Delphine, they need to die even no quest's requirement
Imagine if Cicero could become a vampire..
I’ve had a very low tolerance for traitors since Oblivion’s Dark Brotherhood questline basically traumatized me and killed off my favorite NPC, Lucien. Astrid always seemed off to me too much for me to trust her and her decision to insult the Night Mother and ignore the tenets made me think of Lucien and how much he valued the Night Mother and the tenets and it made me dislike her even more so when she told me to kill Cicero I said ‘fuck that’. I ain’t killing the only real member of the Dark Brotherhood for some fake leader.
And guess what Astrid’s bitch ass betrayed me for power and Cicero didn’t so guess who was right all along.
I really should play Oblivion...only to get to know more about Lucien, my favorite dark brotherhood spectral assassin...
@@bajkotamas6285 You sleep rather soundly... for a murderer.
I remember my first playthrough of Oblivion. Seeing Lucien's dead body that the other members of the Dark Brotherhood killed broke my heart. I kept thinking I could revive him somehow, but when the game wouldn't let me. I wanted to kill every member of the DB that was standing around his corpse. "Traumatized" is the perfect word to describe my reaction when Lucien was killed off.
THIS exactly this!
Bajkó Tamás suffice to say I IRL bawled like a baby. Go play DB oblivion, it’s stellar.
I actually decided to let Cicero live because I took pity on the dying man. And then I got caught trying to pickpocket him and he stood right the fuck up lmao
This exact thing happened to me.
I just wanted the 500 good man, but because I don’t want to kill him I had to reload pretty far back
He said it doesnt matter to me after I took the money :D?
There is another reason why Cicero is a true member of the dark brotherhood, if you are on your way to Cicero in the dawn star sanctuary with the spectral assassin summoned, he said something like this:'there is a disturbance in the void, our dread lord does not agree with this' or something like that, by that he means that sithis does not want Cicero dead. EVIDENCE RIGHT THERE PEOPLE
The Vortex yes your 100/ right, I spent half an hour trying to get old Lucian to say this =D
The Vortex yeah, that ghost was Lucien Lachance, another Real and loyal member of the darkbrotherhood, who got killed for "betrayal" in oblivion
The Vortex 👍
it pissed me off how he died in oblivion
hmm the elder scrolls lore is pretty interesting is it worth to play the whole franchise from the beginning?
Veezara was the best in my opinion.
He was always calm, and never glorified himself. Also, he's very friendly during the questline. As a *Shadowscale* he was raised to be an assassin...too bad Astrid was in charge...
Hawt Sauz really wish I could've saved him. One of my favorite members.
Indeed, there's a cool mod in Skyrim Special Edition called " Veezara alive " it's pretty lore friendly.
Hawt Sauz oh shit, thanks for telling me!
Same to bad He cant become follower he also saves us from one certain quest and always being bullied.
😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
I have 99 problems and Astrid is every single one of them.
Tawny Embers Mae I killed Astrid
she'll die eventually ~
Mordecai Peter everyone will eventually
Lol
Tawny Embers Mae lmao Epic comment!!!
“None of the members have any connection to the night mother.”
Actually, Festus. Festus Krex is looked down for actually believing Cicero and the Night Mother’s Return gives them a future. As he himself says “Without her, we are just a group of cutthroats.”
While Abjorn sees Cicero and Nightmother as a “Jester and Corpse.”
Actually, Festus Krex does mention that he is glad that Cicero and the Night Mother have arrived, stating that their arrival is a "welcome return to tradition"
So in a way Festus could be considered a "true" member of the Brotherhood.
yep think so now 2 i never mentioned it + love makes blind(krex + astrid9
Joshua Seagondollar I always called him fetus ... oh
On top of that, Veezara was a Shadowscale so he was a real member of the Brotherhood literally since birth.
Mordirit yeah but he worshipped Astrid
Joshua Seagondollar Festus and Gabriela are the only ones who support the Nightmother and Cicero.
The Dark Brotherhood could make a a thrilling movie, it has everything : charismatic and original characters ( Nazir, Vezeera, Babette ), betrayals, strongly emotional scenes ( the attack on the Falkreath sanctuary, the encounter with Maro etc ), lore ( Sithis, the Night mother )
Dark Brotherhood, the Thieves Guild, and Dawnguard are the best quest lines. They should be made into a trilogy by Peter Jackson. Followed by a Dragon Born, Main Quest Line, and Civil War trilogy. The latter being very similar to The Hobbit trilogy where you kill Smog (Alduin) and the battle of the 5 armies (Civil War).
i prefer the A.G quest line from E.S IV
Vezeera? Who's that? Regardless, one of my favorite characters in the entire game is in the Dark Brotherhood: the Argonian Veezara!
Le Misanthrope I have always thought that Bethesda could easily make spin off Elder Scrolls games based on The Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild
Honestly the Oblivion dark brotherhood would make a better movie than the Skyrim one.
Why is killing Cicero even an option?
The dude IS the Dark Brotherhood.
Before he came along, Skyrim's chapter were no more than edgy bandits.
Skyrim is an RPG about choice and consequence, not a scripted story-driven game
As far as im aware the only benefit to keeping him alive is dialogue, I find him irritating. So i think he's better as a mannequin.
I almost always spare him, because I think he is one of the best characters in the whole game (the most unique at least). The last time I killed him was because I wanted different gameplay.
I think most of the people kill him because after all he stabbed Veezara and Arnbjorn and at the point everyone trusted Astrid (and did what she said). The funny thing is, Cicero can be more trusted than Astrid.
@@tk-hf4oz oh yeah Astrid is dumb asf, she nearly got everyone at the dark brotherhood killed. Cicero is just crazy. But i agree he is an interesting character.
@@greendout9096 Yeah, it's a miracle Nazir and Babette survived. No thanks to Astrid!
Cicero is the result of a threesome between Sithis, The Night Mother and Sheogorath.
RRC7 Seven7
I don’t think Sithis had anything to do with it this time....
by the gods...
@@1983SpringBonnie 6 months late but I still just wanted to say, he's an assassin for the dark brotherhood. Here's a quote "Sithis is worshipped by the Dark Brotherhood and many other cults." that should sum it all up
Sithis and Sheogorath made a sandwich.😂
Veezara and Babete (the argonian and the vampire girl), Veezara was trained since he was born, to serve the dark brotherhood. And Babete, is sooo old, that in one of the conversations you can have with her, she talks about the time when the nite mother was still alive. Meaning she was already alive at that point.
So i don`t think Cicero was the ONLY real member.
But i DO agree that he is the only one REALLY following the old ways.
From my point of view, more a leadership problem, than a mistake from the members.
Babete straight up tells you that Astrid's rules are more important.
And Veezara doesn't care about it at all.
Only Festus Krex (old mage guy) says good things about the old ways of the Dark Brotherhood, but ultimately he doesn't really care that much either. Sadly.
You are right about that.
But i wasn`t talking about the way they see it or their inclinations. I was pointing that babete was around since the beginning, and veezara was raised for the pourpose of serving the Dark Brotherhood.
So, they have every right to be counted as REAL Dark Brotherhood members.
And to show that it was more a problem of their leader than a problem with them, even babete thinking Astrid is not wrong, she is still with us in the santuary of downstar. Even if she`s got her particular opinions, they are loyal to the person in command of the sanctuary.
None of them oposed to the dark mother once it was proven that she was the real thing (at least no one i can remember right now). They was caught in a power strugle because of Astrid, and being loyal to her as the leader, they was afraid of cicero.
About Veezara, i don`t think it is fair... i mean, he is as loyal as a dog. The poor argonian was created like a soldier from a veeeery young age. He is the kind of guy that do as he is told to do. and always follows and protect his leader.
About Festus... it felt bad to see the old guy dead in the tree like that =/.
Rafael de Oliveira yea they over killed Festus with all those arrows
guy in the background no lie, I cried
Jessica Matlock it's hard to see old people die especially ones in games and movies
Your final point about Cicero is incorrect. He is not the only member of the Dark Brotherhood that has a connection to the old ways. Both Veezara and Babette have connections. Veezara talks about how he was once a Shadowscale, and Babette talks of how she was old enough to serve the Night Mother.
Marcus Julius Caesar unless I'm remembering incorrectly babette wasn't with the DB back then she just more or less took the opportunity to join. I want to say before Astrid took over a century or 2 ago
The night mother was around about 30 years before the events of Skyrim.
You also get another member. The spectral assassin Lucien LaChance. The man that recruited you in Oblivion.
Festus mentions something about a "welcome return to tradition" when Cicero arrives with the Night Mother, and Astrid said she was taken in by the Dark Brotherhood when she was young.
To me, everything points to this group being a legitimate branch of the Dark Brotherhood that was led away astray under Astrid's poor leadership.
She wouldn't be able to reward you with Shadowmere or the ghost of Lucien LaChance if she wasn't a legitimate member of the Brotherhood.
Do you mean in spirit or physical? Her statue is in the center of Bravil in Oblivion. The citizens of Bravil called it the Lucky lady and the Night Mother's crypt was below it. The events of Oblivion took place 200 years before Skyrim.
If you go to kill Cicero with the spectral Assassin summoned he says that while he would help kill Cicero if you order it but that Sithius didn't want Cicero dead yet
Shawn Smith actually he says that the dread father doesn't wish this at all
That is excatly right that should
be point number 6
That’s because that spectral assasin is the ghost of Lucien Lachance who was the speaker or listener(can’t remember) in oblivion, and everything astrid was doing was against what sithis and the night mother would want.
Lucien was the most loyal.
cicero is too much for sithis
Reason 1 shes already married
Damn that companions dog. Haa... She deserve to be burned. (But still, she's literally hot.)
@CD Smith. There's probably a mod for that to
Really? So I rejected Lydia and Ysolda for nothing god dammit
Yeah, Astrid is clearly married to Death himself.
@CD Smith You know you can get a mod for that and you sadly, you can't make her not evil with another mod because no such mod exists. Oof.(You can spawn her back in though or resurrect her etc) I am probably going to do that and also keep Cicero around because I honestly would want both to serve as my royal assassins. Cicero would be my royal court jester and Astrid would be the master of assassins. Also because my character is with the Imperials, so in a sense, he and her would be on the same side for protecting the Emperor I suppose.
Honestly....I think Cicero has the best voice actor in the game...hands down. I mean....just listen to his conversation with the Night Mother. I always spare him and the first time I did and he returned and made that joke about killing me....I knew I did the right thing :D
his voice actor is amazing! theres so much life and personality in the voice... if only the facial expressions and animations showed how crazy he is lol
Andrzej Sapkowski Yeah I'll give him that, his voice actor is amazing.
I couldn't agree with your comment if i tried. Cicero has the most annoying voice in the game and I only kill him because of that.
This is just my opinion and everyone has theirs.peace
I joined the Dark Brotherhood because of Astrid, she Invited me and I joined with my own will. She's the new leader and her law is the one that I followed or will follow, I don't even know about the Night Mother or the old tradition in the first place, I don't care if our group is the Original Dark Brotherhood or it's just some kind of Assassins but I will not betray Astrid, she maybe betrayed me but it's just because of what she had become and she's not like that at first until Cicero came and talk about some listener, I'm fine being just a member, as I said Astrid is the leader of the group I joined at and the reason why I joined, not the Night Mother or Cicero.
The 5 tenants of the Dark Brotherhood were established for a reason so events like this would not happen and this all probably happened before way back in the beginning of the Dark Brotherhood's years. If you play Oblivion, Lucian LeChance will tell you all about that and why the 5 tenants are so vital to the functional running of the Dark Brotherhood. Astrid ignored them and that led to the downfall of HER group of "in name's sake" assassins guild. I would wager the Dark Mother or Sithis himself put voices and whispers of deceit into the mind of Maro to betray the deal Astrid offered him to punish Astrid for her betrayal of Sithis and breaking all the tenants. The Mafia and the cartels have parallel rules at the top of their organizations so that things do not fall apart and when people start breaking them the organization starts losing members one way or another.
The one thing that gives me comfort when I play the Dark Brotherhood Questline is that there is an afterlife for everyone. If you're a good person, you go to one of the good places. If you're a bad person, you go to a bad place. A werewolf? You get to hunt with the deadric prince of the hunt. A hero? Sovengarde. I just try to make their death as quick and painless as I can.
Plus Cicero is the best character in the game. He has a personality larger than life.
Sovengarde isn't specifically for "heroes" it's for anyone that faithfully worships the old ways (nordic version of the pantheon of the nine)
Why make it painless when you can have fun and make it painful???
There are many, many different Afterlifes in the Elder Scrolls universe.
Nords have Sovengarde. Of course it isn't exclusive to Nords, the become worthy for Sovengarde you have to die an honorable death or fall in battle. If you live a comfy life with no danger, you don't get that afterlife. Instead, depending on your race or your religion, you may go to Aetherius, or Sands Behind the Stars, or maybe you go to a Daedric Realm for being a worthwhile servant.
Hell, being a Vampire or a Werewolf automatically lock you from having a regular afterlife. If you're a Vampire, you spend eternity with Molag Bal in Coldharbour in death. And you already explained Werewolves afterlife.
The Dark Brotherhood choose to worship Sithis. They will all go to the Void when they die, and depending on their actions, either eternal peace or eternal suffering.
Break the Tenets and you can guarantee a most unfortunate afterlife with Sithis.
But be faithful to the ways of the Dark Brotherhood and you will be rewarded.
Point is. Gods, Aedra, Daedra, afterlife, and all that stuff is very complicated. It's not like real life where the existence of God is debatable at the best of times, in the Elder Scrolls, there is no denying the existence of Gods. Both Aedra and Daedra exist and there is no denying unless you're an idiot.
The afterlife reflects the person who died. Depending on your actions in life, your race, or your beliefs, these things will dictate where you go when you die. So overall, the one thing we can all agree on, is to cure yourself of Vampirism if you don't wish to suffer for the rest of eternity after death.
The night mover offers opportunity for a vampire
If youre an assaasin, youve chosen the bad afterlife by default, lol. Murdering people by choice just for money is in no way shape or form justifiable.
My only real problem with Cicero was his stabbing Veezera
sadly veezara dies anyway..... FOR ASTRID'S FAULT
But when you're at Dawnstar he does say he feels "slightly bad about [Veeraza]" which probably means quite a lot coming from him...
I'd feel worse if Astrid didn't also get him ruled out in her side of the story.
Jamie Bradish Babette said that he saved Astrid from Cicero, so basically he took a sword for Astrid, and that it wasn't on purpose.
he died naked too :(
The only reason I need to save Cicero: He's heckin great and a sweet little bean.
Alondra Munoz this is an underrated comment, 10/10, good post, I appreciate your perspective.
And he's frickin powerful
@@nalan122 He's so powerful that I killed him in 2 hits. Lmao
He's a sweetheart
Quite literally a bean lmao
I now regret killing Cicero. Thanks for this perspective.
I’m going to go back and redo the whole dark brotherhood quest line with this new perspective
Akira Kurusu I always spare
I always kill him he just annoys me
I’ve noticed that it’s a drastic 50/50 with Cicero. You either LOVE him or you HATE him and there’s no in between that I’ve seen. 😂
Akira Kurusu I do too even tho he was annoying
You had one job, Astrid.
Sithis the Dread Lord Actually she has five jobs and she somehow fucked up all of 'em.
Lukas Tran her husband is LITERALLY a werewolf
Lil Lu She dies anyway, nearly burning to death and realising that you just killed nearly everyone you wanted to protect...seems pretty good to me
Lmao
Sithis the Dread Lord SHE HAD ONE F*CKING JOB?!!!!!
Uhm, what you showed us was FRODO and Gandalf, not Bilbo.
Watzit Tuyah you're right. I think ESO meant to say that Gandalf talked about Bilbo to Frodo
So Cicero is to Golem as Dragon Born is to Frodo... Not buying it.
More like Dragonborn is to Legolas from that Elven bow he was wielding.
More like: Cicero is to Gollum as the Dragonborn is to Bilbo
He talked about Gollum. What the fuck mate
I just finished this quest. Damn that harlet Astrid. I left that trash beast burnt on the ground, crafted a bunch of potions for twenty minutes then came back in dressed in Cicero' s clothes and then a homerun swing to the face with the mace of Molag Bal. Astrid deserves nothing less.
Shes an assassin. Of course she stabs backs. Its the best ability in the game.
TSK23 Productions can’t remember if you can steal her soul and put it in a Black Soul Gem or not, but that would be the perfect revenge for me
You killed cicero????!!
@@bpls169 nah you could get cicero´s clothes when entering the dawnstar sanctuary for te first time
Hopefully you put her soul in a pair of boots
Herd they're reforming the DAWNGUARD!!!
Jesus 1999 Might go over and join up myself.
Jesus 1999 vapire hunting, where do i sign up?
HIIISSSSSSSSSS!!!....
never should have come here!
in an old fort... near Riften.
Veezara. He was there to help fight the imperials when you murdered a bride.
He will be remembered
Ahh..he was a good boi....R.I.P. Veezara...
i think we need to remember not only cicero respected the nightmother Gabriella said she deserved unwavering respect and support but thought cicero was too exuberant also festus krex welcomes cicero to the sanctuary and later stops being a jerk when he finds out you are the listener.
He stops being a jerk if you liste, to him enough in his dialogues, by staying silent. He gives the player the Nightweaver Band before you become listener if I'm not mistaken
That extra clip form lord of the rings to hit the 10 min mark😂
The Lord of the rings clip was just to get the video up to 10 minutes. 😂
Nexus Intake You do realize that the whole if it's above ten minutes it makes more money thing is a myth.
Doesn`t it allow you to add more ads ?
It's not a myth. It lets you put more ads on the vid and the youtube algorithm favours those videos aswell.
Drelas Its not a myth. More ads=more money
Gandalf and "Bilbo" xD
Is that fur......coming out of your ear?🤔
Anti Famous someone is having a bad day
Meg Wieting shut up meg.
Anti Famous that's a good insult man I wish you well with that attitude
Shannon Turner
No, it just me turning into a werewo---AARRRRRRRGGHH! *howls*
Shannon Turner why yes, I'm a Kajiit
Surprised she was against the tenets...it was hardly Thieves Guild levels of restriction, just some very basic laws to prevent total anarchy.
One of the Tenets is "don't disrespect the Night Mother", something she does all the time, and another "don't betray the secrets of the brotherhood", something she also does by telling the commander about your plan. She breaks the rules herself so it makes sense to abandon them
What do you mean? Thieves Guild has rules? Ya know...besides respect?
@Ok Ok yea but you were ordered by someone else in the dark brotherhood so i think the death/thieft was their fault
@@zhangbill1194 correct because another tenant if i remember correctly is to never question a superior and to always do whatever task they order you to do. in oblivion you end up killing tons of innocent members of the dark brotherhood (i think it was members of the blackhand? cant remember) and you find out later that you were being lied to by someone above you hence it being their fault. lucien also gets killed because they think he is a betrayer but then you find out from the spectral assassin spell that he now resides in the void with his dread father
"That's not a horker, that's my wife"
We all know Astrid's no horker
If you confront Astrid on why Cicero would attack her, she flat out admits that Cicero must have overheard her mocking the Night Mother, and says she thinks obeying the Night Mother and you being the Listener is ridiculous. I don't believe for a second that Astrid didn't plan for Cicero to overhear her, hoping it would provoke him into an attack. Cicero also says he feels slightly bad about what happened to Veezara, but that he got in his way, so he really was only going after Astrid, not any of the others. Besides, Lucien Lachance, your spectral assassin friend, flat out tells you that Sithis does not want you to kill Cicero and that the position of Keeper is sacred in the order. All in all, killing Cicero feels wrong, a rebellion against the true Dark Brotherhood. Killing Cicero is turning your back on the Night Mother and Sithis, and choosing Astrid's vision of the Dark Brotherhood, which isn't really the Dark Brotherhood at all. It's a shame that the game doesn't reflect this in the choice, because it doesn't make much sense for the Night Mother to respond to you if you betray the tenants and kill the scared Keeper not only against her wishes, but at the behest of a faithless pretender.
Darkness returns when Silence dies.
Aye, Astrid's version of the dark brotherhood makes them look like a bunch of glorified mercenaries.
@@nickbrothwood1238 isnt that what they always were? The only difference between the modern Dark Brotherhood and the old one is that the modern one wasnt getting contracts from the nightmother.
"I don't believe for a second that Astrid didn't plan for Cicero to overhear her, " so you think she wanted Cicero to stab Veezara and endanger the lives of the otherer of the members? What would be the point of purposely enraging a person who's already crazy? If she wanted to get
" Lucien Lachance, your spectral assassin friend, flat out tells you that Sithis does not want you to kill Cicero and that the position of Keeper is sacred in the order. All in all, killing Cicero feels wrong, a rebellion against the true Dark Brotherhood. Killing Cicero is turning your back on the Night Mother and Sithis"
You say that like its a bad thing. Its not like the old brotherhood was more righteous than the new brotherhood, and its not like Sithis is good
@@JoeDirtisawsome Oh yeah...
Cicero is a hilarious psychopath that worships the ground you walk on and Astrid is a bitch. I don't need 5 fucking reasons to kill Astrid.
Maybe i am insane, or mad, but i love cicero and the adoring fan
by azura by azura by azura! You're a adoring fan of the adoring fan tooo!
ur not mad for loving cicero, but u are for loving the adoring fan
Yellow Mask Dude fair point main reason i spare him he's an unkillable follower i play on ps3 so no mods there's only a select few followers that are unkillable in the normal game like Dereekthus Mjoll the Lioness Farkus Serana of course Cicero and Dark Brotherhood Initiates are the only one's i know of
Bestfriends forever with Cicero, and will kill Astrid as many times as needed.
"When Gandalf and Bilbo are talking about the creature Gollum" THAT'S FRODO ESO! NOT BILBO!
Steve Stevenson even more he took the part where gandalf said dont be eager to deal out death and tells u thats why you should spare cicero... IF I'M IN THE DARK BROTHERHOOD I'M A ASSASIN DAMNIT
Hey Steve? Cicero? Maybe, but we aren't sparing him are we?
Steve Stevenson look Man he's a elder lore guy not rings
Eh, I'm sure he realized his mistake. Just not worth writing any correction. We zealots, err, I meant "fans" know what he meant...
Fans can blow me... _crickets_ I'll get my coat.
At first i wanted to kill him but as soon as i went into the sanctuary to find him he made me love him with his adorable personality
Umm... Cicero is simply amazing. The end. Also, Astrid has the Blade of Woe.
No she has boobs so she can't.
And do not forget that if you destroy the brotherhood and do not join them you can never get Shadowmere.
Yeah...although...when you think about it....the Blade of Woe is just a Daedric Dagger with Vampire enchantment XD
Yeah. But did you know that Astrid has the powers to make certain skyrim players' blade longer?
@@billymiles6870 Eeh I think fast travel is better 1000%
Initially, I ratted cicero out to the guards for being a mental annoying bastard, but after finding out that he only became mental because of his dedication to the nightmother and the brotherhood, I spared his life for being the last OG. Initially, I thought astrid was one of the coolest characters in the game, until it became more obvious of how jealous and un-professional she was seemingly becoming due to my importance to the brotherhood lineage. The betrayal was still quite a shock though, and it was pretty sad seeing the majority of the skyrim family sect being burned and slaughtered in the ruins, but it's that genuine surprise that adds to the list of reasons to why the dark brotherhood are the most interesting and engaging faction in all of tamriel. Hail Sithis.
SpaztallicA hail talos
Hail!
Hail Sithis and The Night Mother!
Morag Tong flagged this comment as offensive. Eat shit, Sithis!
Astrid is still a cool character, she just got angry.
Cicero is my boy I can't kill him
same, I never have
hes so fucking annoying
I couldn't kill Cicero even if I hated him. Astrid's cuntishness far exceeds Cicero's annoyingness.... But I love Cicero, he's a darling.
Alec Sweet but doing talk mad shit like your boy no they don't
Alec Sweet yep he's a g
Astrid’s death is scripted anyway.
That's what I'm saying! You can't spare her anyways. It's the matter in if you are going to keep Cicero alive or not. I was waiting for at least one person to say something about this.
@@KingDez808 i accidently casted healing hands on her indtead of firebolt and she stilled died FROM HEALING
@@giosmack49 😭😂
thedankdonkie 123 i got a mindfuck from that
Thats what dark soul Gems are for
So, if you decide to termintate the Brotherhood, you just killed a bunch of thugs using the name for profit, actually helping Cicero to rebuild the chapter under the Nightmother. If you join the Brotherhood, you kill the leader of the pretenders and recruit the survivors into the true Dark Brotherhood, as Listener. Dang :c
For those enjoying Skyrim and enjoy unique builds, here's one I'll be pitching to ESO.
Hope you enjoy, as this took two damn hours to write.
The Jack of All Trades. (Modded)
The Jack of All Trades is a fresh faced young wood elf seeking glory in the land of Skyrim after leading a privileged life that allowed him to learn many things.
The Jack of All Trades is well rounded character who doesn't just excel at one skill, but is proficient in many skills, and he wants to use them to help the people of Skyrim with an open mind and heart...
But at what cost?
The Jack of All Trades is a wood elf from Grand Tree in Valenwood. And will take advantage of the lover stone to start with, and then will eventually graduate to one of two stones: The Lord or the Lady, depending on which you value more; regeneration or defense.
The main skills for the Jack of All Trades are Two Handed, Archery and Restoration, with minor skills in Light Armor, Enchanting and Smithing. Obviously it's a well rounded build that is going to take plenty of time to complete, but if you're patient, this character will come full circle and end up being incredibly balanced and prepared for any situation he will find himself in.
Now we get to the backstory:
The Jack of All Trades was born in Grand Tree to a Huntress mother and a smith father, both of whom met many people and made many friends due to their central location. The two were incredibly skilled at their work and business was always booming. His mother knew how to cut the most from any kill she made and his father knew how to craft remarkable weapons, like great-swords that weighed half of what they normally should. These techniques were passed onto the Jack of All Trades. The boy was very curious as a child, always wanting to learn more and was blessed with a sharp mind, a pure heart, and good looks to boot. The boy got the same experience his parents did but from a younger age: He met many different kinds of people who were traveling through Grandtree, strangers that sought his parents goods, old friends, warriors, priests and mages. The boy grew up knowing no hate for anyone and with the idea that everyone should have a chance to be a good person. Luckily, this meant the boy was open to teachings from these people. His father taught him basic smithing while his mother taught him to hunt. Mages and priests who came through showed the boy healing magics and enchanting. Warriors taught the boy proper sword techniques, all of which he learned with gusto. He also discovered there was little he wasn't good at, whether it was studying, training, working or charming the local boy's and girls in the village. He was an open minded kid. As he grew older, the people he knew would always return, but they also always left, only to return to tell him of the great lands he could only see in his dreams. He imagined seas of sand, icy coasts of endless water, mountains with snow caps that stretched into the clouds, and on his 18th birthday, he decided he was tired of waiting for the world to come to him. With the help of his father, he crafted a beautiful bow, a quiver of arrows, an Elven great sword and a Green good for the journey. His parents knew he could care for himself and with a heartfelt goodbye, the Jack of All Trades set out to see the world. Over the next 5 years, the boy would travel the world, learning as much as he could from people, doing various odd jobs for people, no matter who they were, and making friends across Hammerfell, Elsweyr, Daggerfall, and Cyrodil. Upon reaching the Imperial City, the boy finally hears about the conflicts in Skyrim. Motivated by the thought that people up there defiantly could use his help, he packs up his few possessions and heads towards the providence. From there he is captured on the border, and carted to Helgen. From here you know the story.
After escaping with the Stormcloaks, the boy will be quite Distraught, as he no longer has the items he worked so hard to keep. But when he makes it to river wood with nothing but a longbow and iron great sword, this will not last long. He knew that a few kind deeds would go a long way and a little hard work wouldn't hurt him. Plus, he had plenty of skills to help him.
He will work around riverwood, getting steel ingots, hunting animals for pelts, and chopping firewood
This is where the mods come in.
The Mods that are Absolutely necessary for this build are the Ranger, Paladin and Mercenary Armor Mods. These mods will grant you the needed weapons and armor for this build. Essentially, they reskin several weapons and armors to do more damage while retaining the desired Aesthetic.
I also recommend getting the Forgotten Dungeons and Extra Bandit Camps, as it adds a lot of extra spots for the Jack of All Trades to train in, but these are not at all needed and simply make the experience more fun and make Skyrim more lively.
Roleplaying for this character is quite simple. Your character is out to help people and make as many friends as possible. There is no job too demeaning, and no quest you cannot undertake. You want to experience as much of Skyrim as you can. You was to see everything people can offer. Always try to be nice, even to those who aren't nice to you. Give money to the poor, use money to persuade people, and try to resolve disputes peacefully. But if someone won't listen, do not fear drawing your weapon and slaying them.
The Rangers play style is simple, when enemies are engaged, you'll draw your bow and fire, taking out as many enemies as you can before they get too close, then you switch to the sword and slice down whoever remains. If a fight gets too challenging, quickly get to safety and cast Restoration Magic. Use Quick Healing, and healing hands/heal other if you have a companion. You would never want to see a friend die.
The factions for this build are incredibly different then others, as all of them are open to the Jack of All Trades. Even the 'Evil' ones.
Remember: He's seeking a view of all people of Skyrim. He needs to keep an open mind to the many different backgrounds.
It is Recommended you play in this order for the experience: Travel and meet the Jarls, become Thane in as many places as possible. Then Companions, Dawnguard, College of Winterhold, Main Quest, Dragonborn, Civil War, Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood. By the time he reaches the college, Dragons should be a pain in the ass. He will begin the Main Story, meeting the Cultists, and after Alduin is slain, he will travel to Sohlstiem. Upon his return, he will see the Civil War has escalated and he will side with the Imperials, upon discovering Ulfric Stormcloaks true nature.
Companions can be anyone. I personally recommend you use your favorite. Vorstag and Janessa make great choices, for companion or spouse.
The gear comes solely from the mods. You will get those materials at the beginning, leather, steel and firewood, and Craft the Mercenary Bow, mercenary Greatsword and Mercenary Advanced Arrows. For Armor, You will use the Green Paladins Mantle for a good, the Rangers Green Outfit, and the Rangers Brown Gloves and Boots. It gives an amazing Aesthetic that really makes you feel that Elven Ranger vibe this build gives off. Plus, it gives you a hunting bow and steel greatsword but with much higher damage rates, and faster attacks.
Eventually, you'll craft the Legendary Paladin Greatsword and craft a Blessed Crossbow to match.
Enchant your armor with Fortify Restoration, Two Handed and Archery to boost your primary Skills. Use a Gold And Emerald Necklace and ring for Jewelery, and if you have the Circlets with Hoods Mod, same with the circlet.
Thank you. Hope you read this, this took nearly two hours of my life to type.
gay
I just liked the comment purely from the effort you put into this comment, bravo. (even though I read non of it)
John Hancock Hancock my favorite companion and romance. :3
Veezera is a black scale he was donated so he kinda is a true member too
True but even the player itself was following Astrid at the very beginning, but if he was still alive after the attack and knew about Astrid's betrayal, he probably would be following the Night Mother just like Nazir
JELLOOOL did you meant to say 'demoted'?
Lucien tells you that Sithis doesn't want Cicero dead. He says there's a disturbance in the Void and then he actually tells you "our dread father doesn't wish this" so it's confirmed in game that the "true dark brotherhood" way is to spare the jester. Sithis also gets pissed if you kill your employer for the emperor.
Ah. Shit. I killed the employer...
HUH!? what?! Where do i find that out? Does Lucien tell me that?! Holy shit!
Does Lucien have the most character in the whole game? WTF?!
The ghost of Lucian La Chance advises not to kill Cicero if he's summoned when you confront him .
Veezara and Cicero were the good bois
And Lis, the spider.
R.I.P my favorite frostbite spider.
F Veezara
Why did my homeboy Veezara have to die😭😭😭😭
My first encounter with the brotherhood I was so pissed at Astrid. I knew she was bad from almost the start. I spared the jester even tho I hate him. From then on I take out the brotherhood in my play throughs. I do like the one guy Nazir. He does not seem to be a bad member but I just can't deal with the betrayal of Astrid to keep him around.
Thanks to you ESO for the vids
A. Lee Martin II wait you kill the brotherhood because you hate Astrid?...
Kills nazir because I Astrid your a douche
The right way to go thru it was to spare Cicero. The story itself blatantly points at it. Astrid even sacrifices herself to make amends with what she turned the Brotherhood into. You dont so much kill her as she commits suicide. You just put her out of her misery as she asks you to do.
Her character was misunderstood. She tries to keep the Brotherhood together by breaking the tenets. In her view, the tenets had already failed, and her group is all that's left of the Dark Brotherhood. Logically, she did the right thing. Cicero lived by tenets and his duty, alone with the Night Mother's corpse, and became a lunatic... That's the great part of the story. Astrid was a survivor and strong leader, but backstabbing and ruthless. Cicero was loyal and dutiful, but a pitiful fanatic obsessed with caring for a mummy. A sane person would have gone the Astrid route. I would have.
It was almost like the story of Anakin. He became a Jedi because he the chosen one, he betrayed and helped destroy the Jedi, he lived up to his role and destroyed the Sith, including himself, and brought balance to the force. He saved the Jedi.
I loved Astrid's character. And she was second only to Aela in hotness.
I mean you kill Astrid anyway by doing the questline. Also the Ancient Shrouded armor is some of the best armor in the game. I do it for the swag.
@SpiritWolf2K Bad for the Brotherhood, not evil, they're all evil exceot maybe the argonian (essentially brainwashed into an assassin as a child) and Cicero (too crazy to know what he's doing)
"She's evil." I mean I kind of got that from our first meeting, when she kidnapped me and asked me to kill one of three strangers.
''She's evil'', you're in the dark brotherhood bro...
Fabien Dussere bro the dark brootherhood kill people who do evil like grelod she was actually racist to the orcs and she didn't want the kids to have a good and happy life
ciel malfoy They kill people for money and for a bloodthirsty deadric Lord, they ain't some kind of dark justiciar guild ^^
lol exactly
ciel malfoy what did narfi, do
Sithis is not a deadric lord/prince. Sithis is one of the 2 creatures that first lived into that universe. One of the 2 eldest of gods. x3
another thing you should have mentioned is that the spectral assassin, Lucien LaChance, tells you that while he will support your choice, Sithis does not want Cicero slain.
Lucien is one of the more interesting characters from Oblivion, it was sad when they killed him.
6:33 when he gives you that look, you know you're not gonna be able to walk in the morning
Your argument was presented effectively and clearly. It was well thought out and demonstrated a vast game-knowledge. Kudos, you earned a sub.
think Cicero is a prime example of why skooma should be left alone
Richard Peterson Even Khajiit knows when they have had enough skooma.
Best reason to spare him is for his hilarious dialogue as a follower
Elliott Gaming What does he say?
Liam Kelly if i spy a singing bird ill snap his neck before its heard.
"Lets kill someone... ;D!"
i saw a dwarf i saw a dwarf... oh wait(forgot the last part ;( )
sorry no dwarf
I always spared Cicero, always like him,he is this your everyday average Maniac killer, not too different from your in-game character.
Hey I was a demented killer not a Maniac one. Ya can keep that Northern Shivering Isle nonsense to ya self. Southern Shivering Isle or bust.
Lets kill someone!
mr. reality My in game charachter has a tendency to sacrifice followers to boethia though, so it might not work out.
"ciceroll"
>dark brotherhood
>moral implications
hmmmm
lmao
_hmmmmmm_
This is just my opinion and everyone has theirs.peace
I joined the Dark Brotherhood because of Astrid, she Invited me and I joined with my own will. She's the new leader and her law is the one that I followed or will follow, I don't even know about the Night Mother or the old tradition in the first place, I don't care if our group is the Original Dark Brotherhood or it's just some kind of Assassins but I will not betray Astrid, she maybe betrayed me but it's just because of what she had become and she's not like that at first until Cicero came and talk about some listener, I'm fine being just a member, as I said Astrid is the leader of the group I joined at and the reason why I joined, not the Night Mother or Cicero.
except she betrays you. regardless of your alliegiances, astrid effectively threw you out of the guild.
you're so wrong, very wrong and she didn't threw you out though, you might have missed something so if you have time go for another play/play-through.
What about his clothes? I don't want to kill him but i want his clothes.
MTK and they also expensive as fuck
MTK if you let him live, he gives it to you after restoring the dark brotherhood
there at the front part of dawnstar's sanctuary when you go to murder him
MTK. Wanting to be a jester I see hmmm!
So there is this method I found out after killing Cicero is that if you steal his clothes then once he's dead use the dead thrall conjuration master spell. You get him as a follower that can't interact but he still says his dialogue. Also if you kill once he is your zombie, steal his clothes, resurrect him And fast travel he will appear again with his clothes meaning you can get an infinite amount of Cicero clothes
You said all of them were glorified assassins but the argonian shadowscale wasn’t he’s another true member
well he says that he is not a very religious man cuz he was trained to be an assasin since his hatching and its all that he knows ( or lizard ) but he respect traditions, the only problem is that he is in favor with astrid.
Josh Taylor yeah technically he is not. He follows astrid not the Night Mother.
Gabriella, Festus, and Babette also has at least some respect for the Night Mother and Sithis. Nazir doesn't seem to care too much.
Tbh almost all the members in both Skyrim and Oblivion are just glorified assassins. Go replay Oblivion, do the Dark Brotherhood quests and see if the other members are devout followers of Sithis and Night Mother. With the exception of some of the members of the Black Hand, they aren't, one of them even says something like "I don't know anything about Night Mother, but she pays me to kill so I don't care"
I know this was 4 years ago, but I am literally standing at the entrance to the cave and you made my decision super easy. Thanks for the heads up and the change of mind
Same here😂
You forgot to mention that Lucien Lachance tells you
"I will kill this jester if you so desire, but there is a disturbance in the Void. Our Dread Father does not wish this."
"The Keeper is a sacred position within the Dark Brotherhood. Ask yourself - do you trust the wisdom of our Lady?"
That was the prime reason I let him live.
Luddmeister: My first DB playthrough, that is what convinced me. I was on the fence before that (Mostly because I didn't play Oblivion yet and at that time didn't know what a real DB was supposed to look like - I skipped straight from Morrowind to Skyrim).
Diddo man, I trust in the words of my spectre buddy, and my death horse, everyone else is fair game :p
And speaking of the death horse... Shadowmere, if you attack Cicero at a location where Shadowmere is present, Shadowmere will attack you.
Yes with no listeners the dark brotherhood in skyrim is not a real brotherhood..... with no listener it must be for profit kills.... not night mother orders. Cicero sees this and I agreed with him the first time I met him.
Ghalaxtic Mehses
Last I checked even if you follow the Night Mother's orders, it's because someone performed the Black Sacrament, and has some gold ready for you.
OtomostheCrazy yes but how are they hearing the night mother??? Oh that's right they are not. They make up how they pick targets... without a listener they are just tong for profit killers... I don't think you understand how blasphemous it is to kill without a listener.
Ghalaxtic Mehses right. That's why astrid said what she said when she was dying and preformed the black sacrament on herself.
8:05 But what about Veezara wasn't he a shadowscale and was basically born an assassin
Yeah, but Veezara wasn't following the Night Mother's orders, he was following Astrid's.
acid sk8r you wastied 8:05 mins of ur life to comment this
acid sk8r your right, as he was trained by the original brotherhood you can say he is the real deal. He also says he respects Mother but is not much for religion.
Dylan Wade That's because Veezara isn't one for religion. He lived to serve the Sanctuary, as did I...
but hes dead now
Wait doesn't Astrid die whether Cicero dies or not?
Yes 😂🤣 that's why the title and video is kind of misleading.
Yes...thats why ultimately, Cicero was right.
I like how the thumbnail says "She's evil", well no shit XD
Yeah she Dark Brotherhood. LOL
Wait, are you telling me that a group of professional murderers might not be the most kind and trustworthy people? I'm shocked!
A Black Screen shes that special kind of evil that no one likes not even evil people
I honestly hated Delphai more than Astrid. I am the chosen dragon born, I rescue the old dude from hiding, clear out a huge base of operations and rebuild the blades with the best I have to offer rocking sick gear.... But util I kill parthanax and turn my back on the graybeads, I can't slay dragons and she's telling me that I am unwelcome ... and treats me with disrespect ... In the base I created.
Grrrrr
The times I thrashed her in nerd rage only to load...
I read it was bugged and you had to kill him. And I had all my shouts. I should have checked after I killed main dude. Then talked to her.
With Astrid it was business. You get used to that. Someone paid to have me killed. Sure later it became more personal but with a band of thieves or an assassin den you half expect that....even in the fist playthrough I felt my thief missions felt like a setup , more to them .... But she talks the blades up like some noble thing and I think her knife sunk the deepest. I hate her. She's nothing without my character and it's like the only 'guild' you don't become leader of.
this is why the settessential command is my favorite i said fuck it and just killed the fucking blades parthanax is one of my all time favorite elder scrolls characters right behind sheogorath
@@williamwaugh2004 played console. But fus ro dah'd her right off the mountain. If she's aggro towards me later, let her. If she can't die she can fall of a hundred mountains.
It's interesting how her dialogue develops. First she tells you that the blades served the Dragonborn, then she tells you that they protected and guided the Dragonborn and finally she orders the Dragonborn.
It's a pity there isn't a mod that lets you inform the Thalmor where they are.
@@davenewton3576 I believe there is a mod where you can choose negotiate with The Blades and Paarthurnax and reach an understanding, leaving both alive and loyal to the Dragonborn, or straight up kill the blades and swear sole loyalty to The Greybeards instead. That's a question for r/Skyrim if you need further info, I can't provide any more than that. But siding with the Thalmor would be interesting, I wonder if that could also work as a choice in the Civil War, or the College quests
well you dont become leader of dawnguard too but yes at least Isran shows you lot of respect. Parthurnax is my boy he gives buff to shouts and saved me during first battle against Alduin while I was in panic behind a rock
I used to kill Cicero, until I summoned Lucien and he told me it was not right to kill the keeper. since I had cicero as a follower, I won't kill him again.
Samantha Golding got to listen to your old boy Lucien.
Psst, I killed the entire Dark Brotherhood!
I am Unicron except Babette, who is strangely absent from the Sanctuary at that time.
I mean either way Astrid dies so it's cool
bro she literally betrays you
that's reason enough
Moifaàmoimoi
Betrays you because she thought you'd divide the family like Skyrim. It doesn't excuse her actions and the consequences of said actions, but she has a reason.
Besides, she put a hit out on herself after realizing out what she did, so she wasn't all that bad.
OtomostheCrazy Yes. Yes she was.
There is still the problem that she was fine with killing you, a vital figure in ALL their plans since recruited, because she was paranoid.
Zash of The Kyobi
To be fair, you weren't really all that vital. I mean, she could've sent anyone else in your place to meet with the guy in the Nordic Tomb. All your assassinations could have been done by the others. In fact in the wedding mission, they give you advice on how to perform it. Almost any one of the others could have taken your place and performed it just as well.
Besides, the way you make it sound, if anything tries to take your character's life, they are evil, plain and simple. That's actually kind of selfish in a role-playing sense. I mean, if they tried to kill you, and you killed them in self defense, there'd be an acceptable reason, but in this case, she tries to kill you (with the intention of keeping the Dark Brotherhood from being Divided, mind you), and you go to kill her, with the reason of revenge or retaliation as your justification.
OtomostheCrazy She's evil in the sense of betrayal. That much is sort of obvious. I mean I think its somewhat justified to consider somewhat you thought was your ally literally going to the commander of the guard to rat you out evil. She is quite literally the female Judas.
Zash of The Kyobi
I wouldn't use Judas as an example beyond the action, because last I checked the one he betrayed not only saw it coming, but pretty much forgave him.
Besides, depending on your game, you're way worse than her, since taking those assassination contracts would end up with you killing some of your friends (I'm still mad about Narfi).
Actually another cool little thing I found just the other day is that if you spawn lucien lahchance in ( sorry don’t know how to spell it off the top of my head) he talks about how sithis doesn’t want to kill Cicero and he think you should leave him
Very good video! Can you make a video about wether you should kill, or not kill, Paarthunax? :)
Captain Crazy Paarthunax is the best dragon in Skyrim no on should kill him ever
considering all the mods to make it so you can let him live AND still be a Blade the community has spoken!!
acyour do those mods exist on console?
seab I am not sure I switched to PC during the last Console gen change. but the one I like the most is called "The Paarthunax Dilemma". That's all I know sorry
seab-1 yes it exist.
Oh my God! This is the first time I’ve seen this video. And I’ve been watching your videos for at least a year now. And even though Skyrim was made back in 2011 or so, and it’s about 12 years later, I want to redo everything I did to make sure Cicero survives. I had no idea what I was doing from the very beginning of play through because I just simply thought it was the right thing to do even though I was manipulated into the game. Now that I see the truth, I’m going to replay this entire game from scratch and do everything right that ES oh describes on his channel because I want to make the greatest outlook of my own character ever to be created in Skyrim. I love Skyrim, I love dragons, and I love all the aesthetics of Skyrim for over a decade now and it’s still not old to me. It’s still a beloved game in my heart.
I hate Astrid! Not only does she betray me because apparently even though in my mind I swore loyalty to her the first playthrough but my old chump Festus died cuz of her. In fact I hate her so much that I spared Cicero the second time around just to spite her. And then figured out I also liked cicero too. (cicero's marriage mod works well btw) I never kill him now. And I always have wine and ale and mead on me and celebrate over astrid's dead body now. (tears) Oh festus, you were like the grandfather I never wanted. We bonded over our mutual agreement over the ineptness and talentlessness of mages of winterhold and how Destruction magic is awesome especially if you turn your opponents to crispy bits.
DaiXi Mindyuk I never thought skyrim can affect one so much , I suggest you to buy a social life
Alexander Winterburn So tell me, what are you doing here? *Deep* in the comment section?
I was just passing by when I saw that obnoxious comment so one decided to reply
i know this is a fairly old comment but saying he need a social life because he said why he hates astrid is like saying someone needs a social life if they talk about why they hate someone in a movie
The only reason i like her, is when i met her, she was sitting on a shelf, qith absolutely no indication of how the heck she got up there. *im still mesmerised to this day*
I think the entire Dark Brotherhood quest line was a way for the night mother to kill astrid, when you truly think about it, it all lead up to that in the end
I like to see it as a test . One last chance for Astrid to prove she is in fact a member of the Dark Brotherhood . And having failed the test she got what she deserved. As did the others for siding with her instead of their true Master, Sithis and the Night Mother.
exept the argoion
Hail Sithis!
If you summon the ghost, he will say that that Sithis himself doesn't want you to kill Cicero. He even aludes to the fact that Sithis and the Nightmother care about the clown, which is kinda unique.
Using the clip to get to ten minutes is ok, but could you at least announce it right??? It's Frodo not Bilbo!!!😂
Felin Fee Exactly what I was going to say.
Literally unwatchable. What a sperg
don't like it? try not watching. leave a dislike and move on, no need to waste yours or anyone else's time
MetaChrome64 your here in 2018 too lol
By killing astrid when she kidnaps you, why cant you juts keep the others alive and join them then? That would solve many problems during the quest. and you can keep Cicero alive.
No that starts the destroy the dark brotherhood quest where you have to kill everyone in the sanctum.
However, there should be a mod that can allow for that choice, however I do believe it does alter the story a bit so it'd be a rather big one....my favorite kind.
You can kill one of the 3 get the password then kill Astrid
Have fun walking into a Sanctuary filled with assassins that follow Astrid loyally when you first start the Dark Brotherhood. Especially her werewolf husband.
That actually makes letting them die to her action feel better.
You have to kill Astrid wether you kill Cicero or not. But definetly spare him. He has an amazing story of how he slowly came to madness. Also I recommend taking every single one of his diarys and read them in order, it just gave me goosebumps. Please: spare him
Mason Hoffman i want to spare him but when i saw him first i tough he was a creepy midget so i got him arested is there some way to get him back except for re-beginning?
~ done
Sorry I killed him a long time ago
Why would i kill Cicero. HE IS MY LITTLE FUCKEN HOMIE.
When you get him arrested he kills the couple at the Loreius Farm.
This quest line is so well thought definitely one of my favorite RPG quests ever
festus is the only other 'true' darkbrother hood member.
Jamie Cudine how
Jamie Cudine could make a case for Gabriella too
What about Babette though?
Jamie Cudine y’all crazy the only “true” member is Lis smh
But the thing is if the others were ‘true’ members, why did only Nazir and Babette survive the sanctuary sacking?
Wait are you telling me that the leader of the dark brotherhood is..... evil...
Loaded Dice oh gee I never knew
*I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO* *BELIEVE ANYMORE*
I think it's implied that she is more of an honourless hypocrite, especially since she was leading a fanatical (but somewhat immoral) faction. I want to chose between killing two assassins, I would chose one with the least integrity.
Right?!
What did you call me?
That quote at the end from LOTR is more powerful once you know the original author fought in the trenches of WWI.
ZarPof what was the quote
Also, Christopher Lee (Saruman) helped the director with getting the right sound effect for a stab in the back... Because he was a British Government assassin in WW2.
Come on Avril Lavigne can't be THAT evil
Oh but she is that evil and more, a lot more.
Tenet not tenant.
Michael Mangold he has dyslexia
Timey wimey
He watches doctor who
Krieg The psycho don't be a ass "Conductor of the POOP TRAIN"
Dyslexia has nothing to do with understanding or pronouncing a word. Saying "tenant" here instead of "tenet" is a simple misunderstanding of the words tenet.
video length 10:01, you really know no shame LOL
Nigga's gotta eat
KMM money money money moooney, MAaanaaay
Dalla Dalla..
Clorox bleach god damn you are legit on every video
KMM Please this guy's been doing this shit since day one, he'd go off and shoot at passing goats instead of caring about the interesting lore...fucking pathetic.
Sparing Cicero was the hardest thing I've ever done in the game. bastard's so annoying.
Lae Rivera lol
I didnt. Hated that annoying little shit.
Wanted to spare him but his 500 Septims said otherwise.
i just pickpocketed him lol
Lae Rivera annoying as hell, but a great voice actor
Cicero was not the only real Dark Brotherhood assassin. What about Festus Krex? He was eager to return to the old ways, respected Cicero, and defended the Night Mother.
He died because Astrid was a traitor
great video, could you maybe to a vampire hunter build? thnx. :-)
AGuideToWitchcraft checkout FMs vampire slayer build
step 1: join dwnguard
step 2: ???
step3: ultimate vampire hunter ggnore
step 4: profit
Enhanced Dwarven Crossbow with fire and shock enchantment.
Kills every vampire in sight.
Saying that Cicero is the only true Dark Brotherhood member is inaccurate.
First, any Argonian born under the celestial sign of the Shadow is taken to be trained as a Shadowscale for the Dark Brotherhood in the Black Marsh.
Second, there is no requirement that one have a connection to Sithis. Most Brotherhood members are common murderers. Once they take an innocent's life, the Night Mother informs a Listener who tells the Speaker who visits the murderer and gives them an initiation test. This means that so long as you respect the tenants as a member who has thus far been initiated, you are indeed true Brotherhood.
Third, the player character is outright granted rank of Listener very early into their time with the Brotherhood. If that doesn't say true Dark Brotherhood, I don't know what does.
the problem was that none of the members would be inclined to follow the tenets because their stand in leader hates them. And you are granted the Listener rank because you are about the only option left to save the Brotherhood from Astrids inept leadership.
The woman was so dumb she couldn't even guess trying to backstab your friends (or dare I say family members), with a guy you KNOW is aware you killed his fucking SON, would end badly.
And the whole cult is build on the fact that a magical ritual done from anywhere in the world will make them aware of a new contract. You can't just suddenly decide you don't want to do that any longer. People are going to loose faith in you, and thus you will hardly get any contracts.
One problem with the Shadowscales: Veezara says that he is the last Shadowscale. The order is extinct and none are being trained anymore. Cicero also mentions in his journals that they considered reopening a Shadowscale training camp, but the idea was abandoned because they lacked the resources.
In addition, Veezara dies during the Imperial attack, meaning there are truly no Shadowscales left after that event.
She's right to hate them, Sithis is not exactly a pleasent being, and the dark brotherhoods connection with him is somethign that would best be lost to history.
+Fredrik Dunge Traitor! The Dread Father is cold, loving, and always watchful for his children. He and our dear Mother shall one day return this wold of hateful light to the true dark nothingness it once was and should now be. And as for those like you, who took the vows and joined his family only to forsake him? You shall suffer as Astrid does now! Mwahahahahaha! >XD
How the fuck is she right to hate him? She literally signed up for this.
That would be like joining the military achieve the rank of major and then decide you hated your country and try to destroy it. That is what she did you know? How is she the good guy in this? She is worse than scum because the Dark Brotherhood might be assassins and murderes, but they at least stick to a code.
They are professionals that only go after people because they were hired to. Astrid just wants you to murder people she doesn't like and will backstab you the first chance she gets.
"Ciceroll"
or as he calls him in other videos, cinnamon-roll xD
Cigerette Roll
Been playing this game for years and never thought to spare him until now and he’s my favorite follower he just always says the most random stuff
Gandalf and *BILBO???* ARE YOU MAD???
either a mistake or a joke, not that serious :P
Mr Coeus its frodo and gandalf
Gandalf and BILBO? That's Frodo
Found myself never wanting to kill Cicero again after point one.
After point 5 I was disgusted with myself that I have ever killed Cicero in any of my games and declare it my mission to kill Astrid a hundred times over....
Honestly, I didn't even realize it was optional for some reason. My internal dialogue must've misunderstood his alternative as uselessly begging for his own life.
My favourite part of the questline was the start in the old shed where you had to kill one of the people. Killing all three was truly enjoyable
Even the mother?