I think if a man needs to ask the question "what does she need me for?" They've already counted themselves out of the equation. Man should NEVER define themselves based on what a woman has, but moreso on what he's worth himself. Nobody should define themselves based on how much money they make male or female.
Providing isn't always about materials and what you can buy. Provide a foundation and a backbone for your family. Provide morals and leadership. Provide wisdom and love/affection. Provide protection. I can buy my own things, but a man who can give me emotional and spiritual support is priceless.
I see that lots of these comments are your typical "brick wall" comments. No matter what the men are trying to say, it's that same "brick wall" reaction. No listening, no understanding, no objectivity. Just dismissive responses.
bigjayking24 LMAO? No I'm actually talking about someone I recently saw on a reality show who was blaming his issues on a girl from middle school. Never said I was talking to anyone. I hope you get over your trolling ways soon. 😘
I'm not sure about this episode.. I didn't really get a lot of the points they were trying to make..However, I caught that comment about black women having 'too much baggage' :/.. what does that even mean? .. and the comment about 'Black women think I'm too good for them because of my educational status' again huh? Which black women?...Maybe in actual fact that's what he personally feels towards them.. A lot of this was unsettling, I cant even describe it..
+MoChunks Show Exactly because I see so many educated black women dating bums or ex cons. So I don't get this idea that black women are out here running around with extremely high standards. If expecting a man to have a job and keep his dick in pants is too much to ask, then we have a bigger issue here.
You'd be surprised how many times in a day that the average square, nerdy, or non-ebonic speaking black guy hears the phrase "You seem like you only date white women". Or alternatively "Can you handle a black woman?" Even if you've only ever dated black women. Eventually you'll believe it if you keep hearing it over and over.
I was raised by both of my parents to be independent. I grew up in a traditional home. my mother a stay at home wife and my dad worked but they were dysfunctional and miserable. I grew up not wanting to be miserable like them. I got to many mixed signals, so dating for me was a disaster. I didn't have any kids along the way so I always got the sideways glance like something was wrong with me. one guy told me he thought there was something wrong with women who didn't have kids. of course I was insulted but not enough to become pregnant by just any man. I grew into a woman who felt wrong in her own skin. it's hard to turn off independence it's all you know. I dont boast about it, it's just how I survive. when I finally entered a long term relationship. I didn't know what to do. I had never been taught about men. I didn't know how to turn off the way I had always survived. I was taught how not to trust or rely on a man. do you know how hard it is to let go of taking care of yourself and letting someone help you. it's terrifying. ppl assume it's being all high and mighty,,, it's often complete FEAR!!!! oftentimes I don't know if I'm crossing the male ego or manhood line because I was never taught. I don't mean to make him feel like less of a man. I really don't. Sometimes I'm just clueless because I'm not used to being in a relationship with a man who values his manhood. so please be mindful other women might just not have the knowledge. men seem to expect a women to know how men work. that's not logical. we are not men we are women. many who didn't have a strong male figure to guide us. my dad was a part of my life but never taught me about men other then they cheat. worse lesson a girl could learn. I made it to the 2 yr mark in my first long-term relationship and it's really hard! He finally stopped accusing me of leaving at some point. probably because I'm pregnant now. that scares me. I'm new to this and it's all scary. I hate feeling scared and unsure. I hope I didn't make a mistake. Sometimes I miss the comfort of being single because it felt safe and familiar. guys sometimes you have to look beyond the independent women and recognize the scared lil girl.
+RavinJ I grew up in a home from both parents being there in my life and both parents worked. My dad was there for me as well being in the home and very involved in my life but he was unfaithful to my mom. That made me look at men different. I got on the defense too in dating and yes it was a disaster for me as well. Now I have a son and a husband. It has not been easy with my trust issues and then my husband had issues too. We both had parents that cheated on the other parent. It is hard for the both of us.
RavinJ... I really had some of the same experiences as you growing up, and even after years of marriage I still have a hard time relying on my husband... but slowly I have learned to trust him. I started small. When he told me he could or would do things I waited and watched... and when he did them I wrote them down in an email, praised him for doing them and relaxed a bit. Now we have a great partnership. You cannot easily undo the damage that childhood taught you but you can slowly evolve to relying on someone that has proven themselves to be reliable. Actions speak louder than words.
We might need to start replacing the word providing with participating. If you feel like because a women has possessions you can't provide for her, then just participate in her life. You bring yours to the table I bring mine to the table. Lets build businesses, property, wealth, savings, retirement, hell lets be a blessing to someone else and be givers. No one wants or should sit in struggle when they have fire in them to go get it all because it will make a man a feel a certain type of way about it. Men are not an accessory to me. I see a man as a compliment to me. With each other we can do even more. You are providing once you start participating it might not be how society told you to provide, which is being the sole care taker of the family. But lets face it, if you want to do anything of quality in this life you need two incomes to get there quicker. Just my thoughts.
"We might need to start replacing the word providing with participating"....I like that a lot. People regardless of status should be an active participant within the relationship in any facet.
I agree! I have a house and a car...but my profit margin doesnt allot me the ability (at this time) to buy more properties or a business...so partnering with a brotha with his 'shit together ' atleast can help us both have financial freedom and work for ourselves...Ive had alot of brothas swear I was being 'high saditty' because I like to talk about growth...
I really enjoyed this, I meet a pro black man and love our relationship. We meet off tinder, because I like to be at home cooking and reading. Bookworm ladies get out of the house and go to the museum or Barnes & noble and meet an intelligent man.
I think a some of the comments made were very one-sided especially by the young man in the middle. As an educated black woman I would love nothing more than to be with a black man like my father who is the head of the household. The disconnect comes from both sides: black men and women. I am very successful and proud of it but outside of the workplace would love for a man to take over. A lot of us do this because we have to but yearn for a strong black man to take over at the end of the day. Black men you are needed you are appreciated don't disregard us just listen and stop prejudging.
It's not that we "need you" we "want you" there's a huge difference. When I am in search for a partner/relationship I'm looking for what compliments me and that's what we need to look for. You should never be co-depending on anyone because what if they leave you, then what? You're gonna feel that abandonment and that's how psychological issues start
+Shanae4rmTX I think it may be because if they feel like if we need them then we are more compelled to stay when things aren't going well between us in the relationship
@@tylert271 Right. It's kind of abusive. They want a woman who couldn't leave even if she wanted to, because she doesn't have skills to make it on her own.
Thank You Married Man for your perspective. I thank him specifically because his POV is most similar to mine. It should not be anything wrong with a woman not needing a man (remember y'all said y'all don't want a woman to need y'all). We want y'all just like y'all want us, not need us.
love the guy on the right with the hat... a true black man hence y hes married to a black woman. we need more brothers like that. The guy in the middle with his head moving left to right.. trying to imitate the stereotypical blk woman the white media sells u.. its quite obviously hes got some blk woman hatred issues. I think the blk guy on the left may think hes a lil too good for most blk women but hopefully in time he will find a blk sister whose a Dr or scientists.. theres many of them about.
The idea of being a man for too long has only been having that provider label.. Now that black men are not the bread winner like they use to be they are lost? That says a lot.. That means you need to do more than come home with a check and sit on the couch... you actually may need to wash the dishes, or vacuum or check some homework.. I think the thought of more effort And participation at home scares them.. take the provider label of the table.. Now what are you offering?
Or they need to get better jobs if they feel so strongly that money determines their worth as a partner. If you feel that your manhood rests on how much money you make, then why stop at a job at the post office (I think one of them mentioned that job)? Why aren't you trying to start you own business or be in a managerial position? Black women are going to college and getting degrees so that we can make better money. Why are black men, if they feel that money is important for their identity, not following suit at the same or higher rates? It's sounding like they want to keep a post office job and have their women just go back to cleaning people's houses with their degrees.
@@digthewarmth they don't get better jobs because they're not qualified for better jobs LOL nor are most of us studious. Instead these days we just stay single and enjoy the simple life
I think black American males through time have lost the idea of what it is to be a man, America has become a society of customs and traditions, not culture, and the black male has lost his identity in the process. There is a difference between culture and tradition; traditions often come and go, as people move forward advance they meet new customs and traditions, and they tend to adopt those trends. As an African, I can wear hip hop clothing and listen to Rap music, but the way I approach day to day life may be in a cultural manner; the way I relate to my mother, father, auntie, uncle and members of community would be in a way that is fitting by my tribe or clan, the same applies with Asian and some European societies that are developed today, they may wear clothing and listen to music of distant origins, but they've managed to maintain the cultural aspects of their communities in their day to day lives. When people say "black Americans are not cultured", what they mean is that they do not have a way of life that is consistent with a shared idea by which people in a community adhere or subscribe to, most black American communities live by customs and traditions, they follow through trends of the generation at hand. In almost any Africa society being a father is not optional, society has certain expectations of an individual that if not met, they'll find it difficult to function in a community. As a man you are the protector and provider in the family, no matter how much your wife makes, a man has to commit to certain responsibilities in a home, unless you are handicapped or something, you have to able to meet exceptions of a father and husband, it sets an example for the male children in a home on what is expected of them as future fathers and husbands. There are many things that black American and African men can learn from each other, but I strongly urge black males to learn something about the African family structure, you need to get back to your roots on this one.
I'm in a committed relationship with a black man with his own heating in air business & no kids. I have got to admit, I was that 'typical' angry black woman, overly aggressive when I got angry, throwing things, talking down to my man (calling him a bitch ass nigga) when we fought, I would get instant attitudes if I didn't agree with him about certain things. No I do not work but he provides and he pays all the bills. I must say once I started watching these RUclips channels about what black men want I started to look myself in the mirror and check myself at times. It was so hard because I started seeing the remarks men made on RUclips in myself. It was time to do some self evaluation. Since then we have been doing great. We're still thriving, building our foundation together, growing together & I couldn't be much happier.
😏 So if u buy your own $8 drink men are rendered useless..and if you accept a 'free' drink you are a user/money hungry/dependent??? Guys need to realize they need to bring more to the table than being a 'provider'. If you meet a self sufficient adult you should be happy..not wondering what she 'needs you for'. Just because a woman doesn't request financial assistance from you doesn't mean she has turned you into an accessory.
@bigjayking24 I'm fully aware of that HUN. Perhaps you're the one who needs to read between the lines....The 'drink' conversation comes up quite a bit so, take it literally and/or figuratively.Who's slow now? Again, your trolling is tiring.
Yes a new podcast. Always enjoy the discourse of the contributors, it gives me a sense of pride, in these black brothers and the production team, whom produced such insightful content.
I can see both sides , but my dad did not have as much as my mom . But she never made my daddy feel bad about it .Also I was a very busy lil girl so my dad having his own Business made it easy for him to care and keep me from getting into everything 😊
Thanks for sharing your honest opinions. I like the shirt btw...good music will feed your soul. I think the gentleman who said "am I accessory?" made a good point because I think that is how women have and currently feel a lot as well. It is a mutual respect thing when it comes to relationships. When you feel like an accessory you are being objectified. We all have our shortcomings because no one is perfect. It is about finding that other person that makes you whole. Thanks for sharing! Great conversation :)
I have my own because I dont like asking any man for money for something I want. Men expect an return on investment, anyhow. If we are dating, I will treat a man on his birthday and offer to pay the tip. If we are in a relationship, then its more of a cooperative situation. But if he wants my full cooperation, we MUST be in an exclusive monogamous relationship. Anything less will casue a retreat on my part FAST!
so if she can buy her own drink... you don't know what she needs you for... but if she assumes you are not down for the sisters then she's cutting herself short. how about we stop assuming and just get to know people. the problem theses days is that both men and women have such strong ideas about who they want as partners, they don't truly get to know a person. we don't talk, we don't take our time. it's all about this fast food dating. people are complex with emotions, past hurts etc. stop assuming and get to talking.
Upwardly mobile men shouldn't have a problem meeting a woman of substance if they're not trying to hookup with video vixen and love and hip hop types. Laws! Please evolve.
I really liked this episode. I think it talked a lot about the insecurities black men have today with the rapidly shifting gender roles. I don't think we get to hear that side too often. It's not that these men necessarily want to run a traditional household. I think they just recognize that the "provider, head of the household" position is no longer an automatic slot for them, and are questioning themselves and wondering what their place is in an independent black woman's life.
social status of the black man has always been a issue. these perceptions play into a relationship. so if a woman has a strong intellectual consciousness it can often lead to self awareness and misunderstanding because issues that affect his ability to stay true to himself.
FINALLY!!! A healthy, mature discussion from this series. This was very well done. Much love to the men of the panel. ps. To the man in the middle, I very much hope you can find some self love as well as wholesome romantic love soon because you often appeared quite bitter.
Im disappointed in this comment section. Only a couple of people picked up on the jewels the brothers (far left and far right) were dropping. Some of you ladies not getting it might want to evaluate what type of energy you're putting out, how you communicate your expectations for your partner, and if your emotionally ready to receive a man in a relationship. Sometimes we got to check where we're at mentally and emotionally otherwise that can cloud our judgement and perception of potential mates. (writing this as a woman who hopes more will see how relevant these men's comments are) Thanks to the men on the panel for being honest, truthful and vulnerable for a female audience.
I'm late, but THANK YOU! This is the EXACT reason that there is a disconnect between men and women.. This series is to provide INSIGHT, into the thoughts of a man... Not to be aggreable and politically correct.... Most women in these comments didn't attempt to receive the message for a better understating, only to find fault in what is being said...
The goal is to know your needs, communicate your needs, define, be and create the love you desire with a man. Also, codependent defines love addiction. Interdependent describes mutual, healthy love between two equally strong individuals who choose to harmonize their love.
Even though I don't agree with everything they said. Nor do they speak for all black men as whole. I must admit it was interesting to hear it from their perspective. My question is.... where do single women like myself meet eligible Black men and who ideally meet my standards and have some of their own? In my town......I have yet to come across anything worth it. It's discouraging. Oh well😩
DaMayorOfNewYork lmaoooo so you want it with a Jersey girl lol. Ok cool. The question is what do you bring to the table love? Yes I am over weight.....and???? Just because your not into plus size women doesn't mean no one else is. That's your loss and your shallow ass problem. I am healthy, and have no pre-existing health conditions at all. Why, because I am active and my weight is maintained. I bet that's hard to believe lol. People so easily look at what's on the surface and talk shit about what they don't know. Just so we're clear, I am proud to be me and all my glory at any size. Somebody should show you a thing or two about a woman with confidence. Hopefully, judging from how your so quick to judge and attack me and my character based off of two things. 1. My comment on what I would like and appreciate in a man (standards), 2. as you put it, my RUclips videos. Wait are you even black? Again judging by how your so quick to break down a black woman, whom you don't even know, there's no way a "black man" who is secure in himself needs to troll youtube to disrespect a black woman just for kicks or just because I have standards and I am clear on them. I love me, and I don't apologize about who I am for no damn body. I am sure there's a upstanding black man who can love me too and that is whom I'll entertain when that time comes. I am not gonna waste my time going to your youtube channel if you have one? Simply because I don't give a fuck who you are. You come across as upset.....the real question is what plus size black woman has hurt you? Do all of us innocent, single mothers, plus size, independent black women a favor. Go and talk to whom ever broke your heart. Not me hun. I don't know you, I did not ask for you opinion or for your Plus size, black woman single mother bashing session. Thanks for watching my videos though. Other than making a so called informed comment, obviously there had to be something about me to make you go through all that trouble to reply to a comment I made from Several months ago. No only that, but nobody gives a damn about. Trust me it ain't that deep. Take a deep breathe and focus on you and yours hun.
DaMayorOfNewYork Wow That must have took you all day lol. How did I know you would reply, lucky me lol. (I have to find humor in this) It's all good. Listen love even based off of all that....there is one fact and one fact only. You still don't know me and I still don't know you. So your 50 ok. I am 35 and yes I am still evolving. My lessons don't stop, and this may surprise you at 50, but neither do yours. I can only hope that after having the mindset you have or that you exemplified here in these comments, that you have met, your queen and that she is exactly what your looking for or at least what you feel she should be. Hopefully at 50 your in the best shape of your life and going 💪, Mentally, Physically, and most importantly spiritually. (Folks love to leave out God then wonder why they haven't gotten any where). Now you call yourself answering my question that I posed over 7 months ago? A lot could've happened in 7 months. Did you think about that.....no. I could be in fulfilling relationship with my King. But you assume that because I am "fat", "so-called" educated, looking for sex, etc as you so elegantly put it lol. That I am still around here posing myself as a product again as you put it. The question that I posed was (I'll paraphrase) ......Where do women like myself whom have standards, find decent black men that also have standards as well? That question was simply asking what type of venues other than your normal bars (which I don't do) can you meet decent men. See I love me some me, all of me and I appreciate my black men as well. Regardless of any hell I've been through in the past with my ex. I refuse to give up on my black man. But he has to come correct and no I am not settling for nothing. Not perfect, just correct. Plain and simple. Now I don't have to elaborate on "what coming correct means" because what's understood doesn't need to be explained. No I don't only hear what I want hear. But when someone chooses to take on the approach to attack a female (me), just to make a point, it become's impossible to hear or respect anything after that. To me it's whatever. At the end of the day what God has for me is for me, bottom line. At first I was annoyed by your comment and bashing on me and other black women like myself. But once you said how old you were it all made sense. You've obviously been through some major shit with women, whether self inflicted or due to no fault of your own. This is where you are in life and that's cool. But clearly, there's nothing I can say or waste my time trying to prove to you that'll change your views and vice versa. Nor do your views speak for all black men. Bottom line. I'm not out here selling my image or campaigning for nobody's son. I am content with who I am, being myself and staying true to what I believe I deserve in a man. That's it. When he comes cool, I just pray God send him ready and not nobody who's confused about what they want, has absolutely no respect for women, or playing around with my time. That's the shit I don't need, don't want and won't settle for, I don't give a damn how big I am or how marketable you or anyone may seem to think I am. As far as my size, again I am healthy and happy with who I am and that's all that matters. Yes when I was young I was much more active than I am today, as long as I am healthy, make an effort to eat healthy, and be active as much I possibly can, to me....that's all that matters. Anyone who can't accept me for me (appearance/size wise) can get a post marked invitation to kiss my beautiful "black" ass. It's not that deep for me to go out drop 50 lbs just to get no dude. Period!!! So with that being said thanks for your input, even tho I don't agree with all of the points you stress nor your delivery. Ultimately I get the point you were trying to make. You just seem a bitter about it and and aggressive. Even disrespectful, just to stress a point is not necessary at all. I sure hope that you find (if your still looking ) that skinny, tolerable woman, that meets your standards in whom your looking for. More power to her lol. Blessings and Happy Holidays to ya.
DaMayorOfNewYork My attitude..... you open the door for it. Like the old saying goes, if you don't have nothing nice to say, then don't say nothing at all. Another thing which is really creepy and disturbing, You reference sex and me wanting someone "getting between my legs" 3 times, in 3 separate comments. No I am not at all concerned with Someone getting between my legs. That is the farthest thing on my mind lol. I'm focusing on my family and my goals. But of course you wouldn't know that being you don't personally know me. I'm trying to figure out what about me puts off that perception of looking for man for just sex or anything less. Nothing. No I haven't mentioned my standards, why should I? My standards are not your problem. So no I am not commenting what my standards are. For what? You mentioned, Respecting my elders, I have no problem respecting my elders, nor taking advice when I ask for it. But keep in mind I never asked you, and how you brought it to me was out of pocket, from jump. Bottom line. All I asked was where was a good place meet decent upstanding brothers, lol that was all. You perceived that as me being the problem??? Now as a result of the comment, I am going back and forth with a 50 year old man, whom I don't know, about how I can make my self desirable and acceptable to get a man and to society smh. Like I needed a lesson in the first place. I am a firm believer that respect is earned and you, believe it or not disrespected me from the gate for no reason at all. Now I don't know how, what I said translated in to me being upset about my size???? No I am not upset at all. The one who pointed out my size was you from jump. I am all for keeping it real, but don't come for me period. For the last time I love me and all of me. But then again that's your opinion, so it's pointless to even feed into the bull shit. It is what it is. The only reason your going back and fourth with me over a 7 month old comment lol smh, is because you feel entitled because of your age. I don't give a damn how old your are it does not give you the right to disrespect anyone or pass judgement, period. It's pretty shallow and condescending of you. Smh. But again regardless, of that fact you don't know me and I don't know you from Adam. Bottom line you continue to Judge me and It's sickening to see someone my senior who may or may not be a black man. (I have no idea) tear down their own people smh (If you are black that makes it worse smh). A smart person knows when to keep it moving, especially when it's not my fight to begin with. Like my auntie always said, the last thing you want to be is an "old fool" smh. It's funny, 3 weeks ago I saw someone had replied to a comment I made on another Madam Noire video, on the topic of Hbcu's and the importance of a degree etc. I realized today that person was you. But I chose to ignore the comment. The only reason I even bothered today was because this time you took it a step further and attacked my, appearance and my integrity, why????? Simply for attention. Yup solely for "ATTENTION". Why I allowed myself to entertain the ignorance lol smh. So I am gonna move on with my precious time and enjoy the rest of my Saturday night with my family.
Hello, everyone I honestly get these men point but when I think about independence I think its more so of a complexity of women not feeling comfortable enough having to ask the guy for money to get something they want and 9 out of 10 the guy normally end up asking what you need it for? So, to me that would piss me off having to come home to a man (or should I say the man come home to me"being that stay at home wife that some men look for" having to ask you for money so I can get something I want) to me it just don't make since and I think that the whole independence thing is just that...women just don't feel comfortable asking men for money; well I should say some women don't feel comfortable. The way I see is I'm a grown ass woman and I wouldn't feel comfortable asking another grown-ass person who busted they ass working for money for something I want for my own personal use. I was just saying and hopefully someone get my point. Can you all imagine living the way some of our parents lived in the 40s & 50s? What do you guys think?
***** really but does that apply if you're in a relationship being self sufficient wouldn't apply right because the bills would be for both parties. Oh n trust if you understood what i said you'd see where I said how would this work if the ways of the women and men of that era was still affective today. Damn why it always have to be a negative ass person n yes i said negative because you clearly didn't read my post right. This isn't the 1940's DUH shit.
I would feel comfortable asking for money if money was set up the way it used to be. One person having a job to take care of the whole family used to work, but nowadays, one normal job won't take care of everyone, so the husband would have to have a Very high paying job, meaning having advanced degrees or having their own successful business. I would be fine to stay home if my husband is balling out-of-control at his job. But black men as a whole can't complain about black women not being stay-at-home moms when they don't have the advanced degrees to back it up (let me know if the statistics have changed and I'm wrong on that) or the businesses.
On a first day, I buy my own food and drink. If it's a good date and he ask me again, and I like him, he will treat the second date. And we play it by ear after that.....
why would you as a female go on a date and buy yourown food thats the stupidiest comment i ever heard....if you are incountering that problem date up and cancel a date if a guy is asking for half the money for the date the sperm chases the egg not the other way around
One mistake that we keep making is that we connect or equate professional success with personal success. We know plenty of people who are very successful in their professional life, but constantly go home alone. Women have almost been using their degrees as a substitute for how good a mate or wife she would be. Many women who call the shots at the office don't want to be dominant at home. Those are two different arenas. Many men also have conflated the two as well, otherwise more Black women would be in LTR's. It appears that nobody is teaching what real manhood is about outside of capable fathers as well as what real womanhood is about. Pointing to a scripture is just an inadequate one-size-fits-all approach. The elderly who are north of 60yo can really help here.
These types of topics need a more rounded panel. You can tell by the answers that only one of them is married. Maybe this a Cali thing cause some of their responses were very different from the south. However there is a narrative that is perpetuated, whether false or true, that a mate is more an accessory than a need.
looking at these comments I see a lot of the women aren't really taking in what the guys are saying. Almost like they want to hear what they want to hear if not then it doesn't matter.
One of the unfortunate cycles that continue is men express honest concerns and are condemned for it. Black men aren't attacking a woman's essence, he recognizes how replaceable the world has made him. First, the oppressor took him out of the home eliminating an authentic example of masculinity in the black family. Secondly, the opprosser has convinced Black women and men that they hate each other. Thirdly, this has created a cycle of individualistic minded people ( both men and women) who lack identity. While we date we are still becoming ( learning who we are and how to love) which becomes a crash course of love. This crash course method of finding love has played a huge role in ruining the black family dynamic. Hurt people continue to hurt each other bottom line. Often times what lacks in our relationships is both being accountable and lacking a desire to work through difficulty. Love is flawed because our ideas of love are toxic and fictional. Lastly, how many of us can count at least 2 examples of healthy loving black relationships? The examples must be of people you have a close relationship with. We lack healthy loving templates and so we suggest flawed oppinions and miseducated perspectives instead.
Also, who asked for a pat on the back? I missed that I guess. I thought the conversation was about the difficulty black men have with black women because being too strong or independent, as if a man is not needed. Nothing to do with a pat on the back. I pay mortgage, not rent, kind of tells me where you are.
Since women historically have viewed relationships / marriage as a form of financial stability and men have accepted it I don;t know that we can see our value outside of that..... that can lead to men not knowing their place in a relationship if they are not the bread winner.... it is reinforced by women at times.... and by other men at times....
I've seen that when men are ready to date exclusively and marry, they are well into their mid thirties and want women in their early twenties. So it's like if you dont get married in your early twenties, you won't get married, or at least the chances are significantly less. I love black men, but if I want marriage, I may have to look elsewhere for love to increase my chances of marriage.☝️
in this society you need money to pay bills not personality...no matter hoe nice a man is if he cant pay any bills i dont care if his personalityis like mother theresa
I personally don't have a problem with a woman being independent. I actually value that in a woman. I was raised by my grandparents and both of them worked. My grandma was a school bus driver and my grandfather was a steel mill worker and them both took care of the bills in the home. Both cooked, clean and help my aunts with their homework. So I learned from that and applied that to my life. My wife income is more than mine but I handle the bills just fine because I work and make money with my art. We both cook, clean and help our children with homework. My only problem with some independent women is that some that make over 6 figures wouldn't even look at a man that is not making 6 figures himself. There are plenty of men that has blue collar jobs. It shouldn't be a problem for a woman of that status to date a fireman, police officer, teacher ect. These days both need to take on the bills and home. It works I know because my wife and I are in the process of starting a business. Men and women should build each other to become that power couple. At the end of the day if we part ways I know she would be ok because she is a strong woman.
It seems like these men only want relationships with a Black women if it follows their ideals of the traditional story of a man being the financial provider. these men should adjust their masculinity and look at how they can provide in other ways. A women can pay the bill or be the homemaker or both. There are no set roles in relationships each and everyone is different. Also putting the blame on the black women for there not being enough black love is a cop out. My eyes were rolling this whole episode, but thanks for sharing your views.
+N'Dia Kai I listen to a financial radio show daily. Every caller that calls in is a white couple and each person makes the same money. Or, there are women that make more. They are white for the most part. For some reason, this is a big issue in the black culture. I always think because of how society treats our men, the home is the only place black men can feel powerful and if they dont have that then....... I never hear other cultures have this conversation.
+trfrierson That's because their women know how to let the men be men regardless of economics. Black women's attitude toward men that make less is very condescending. The feminist attitude doesn’t help either.
Dating up or down??? The answer is openness and awareness. As for the angie stone "brotha" comment, listen to the first 8 bars, again brotha. You should of referred to independent by lil boosie instead
Why is there such a stigma against a woman being independent? It's ridiculous. Independence is a result. It is your circumstance be it intentional or unintentional. If your single and of dating age, you should be independent, both parties. Why would a man want someone who needs to ride their coat tail. This argument about going to white women because black women wear this chip might be because you put it there. #BlackLove #OnlyABlackMan4Me
Because black women don't need us we don't need it so what's the point like I get your independent more but at the same time I'm like what the hell do you need a guy for if you have everything you need
We obviously don't have everything we need. Being able to take care of yourself financially is a basic need of all young adults. No one's getting married young anymore, so we have to support our single selves through at least our early 20s. Are women supposed to be using our parents' money and living with our parents until marriage? No, we want to live a fun adult life too outside of our childhood homes. So we have money to take care of ourselves. We still need love though and want a lifelong partner and a man of good morals who will help teach our children and give them confidence (because we're not going to be here forever, and we need a strong next generation) and who will protect us, and who has a vision that we can support to build a legacy. Men are worth more and should aspire to more than just bringing home money to take care of household expenses.
digthewarmth yeah but for me to date a good independent woman like do I have to have the same job statuses to do that like can I just be a garbage man and just make decent money and she could be happy with that instead of me just trying to trace her status cuz at the end of the day no man wants to chase a woman especially if it's for a job status you know
The question for independence is a survival skill. Black don't really have a choice when it's hard to find men that want or have drive enough to be a provider. Most men that can provide usually provide for other race of women.
DaMayorOfNewYork, I'd be interested to hear your opinion of what an independent white women is. Are you saying white women fix toilets, and repair cars and they do not call Dad, brother, baby daddy for that? I think your ending sentence confirms my point. If you are an adult and your single you are independent if your doing everything a "mature adult" is supposed to be doing, paying mortgage, bills, saving etc. Where exactly does it change from black woman to white woman? What I have observed of black men with white women, is the black man expecting nothing from a white women but to serve him, submit, and be quiet. Oh and occasionally, use Daddy's money to further his own agenda. I've personally witnessed this is the case more often than not. White people period, are born into this world with an unfair advantage. Anyone who can't recognize or acknowledge that ....well. That is a fact. It is up to every minority to go the extra mile to even attempt to catch up. Many of us have done that. Just because I call my brother to come fix my toilet, doesn't negate my independence. That's ridiculous.
Nice forum.... Great beginning but these young brothers are clearly limited. I'm their life experiences and lacking in the exchange overall... Bring in my experience gentleman
It's sad to say now but after watching your other videos I have to ask if every man on the panel is an actual born man or transgender. Because the women who are producing the show seem to think that it's the same when it is not.
First of all that is NOT the definition of codependency but that's not really important right now. This is like the 3rd forum of black men that I have watched that basically piss me all the way off! Its condescending for us to use dating up or down but it's cool to call us busted by your standards. Instead of complaining how about stepping up. The majority of the time she uses independent to address the need to deal with a man who is about bs. There was a time when we were codependent on men and got more shit then sugar. You want us to apologize for knowing our worth? The young brother on the left summed it up, black men still dont know who they are ,they follow trends. So black love is "cool and sexy" again? That's why you want it? Black love is more than sexy and cool because some body sang about it. It's necessary to our survival, it's one unit that has been the focus of disruption for centuries. That's not by accident and now y'all are willing accomplices. You feel weak because at one time we were your emotional dumping ground when society shit on you and we had no say. Now we do and we "make" you feel emasculinated? You feel that way on your own. When these same issues occur in other races y'all can't wait to be their savior but we have baggage?! Be honest and stop blaming us. Our struggle is just as hard and sometimes even harder because we are women in a man's arena fighting gender prejudices, racism, and the betrayal from our Kings. Weak and brokenness of the black man is not the doings of the black woman. We stepped up because we had to, we still have your children to raise.
Thank you.. you're statement is completely true. It's weird how many tell woman they need to be submissive like the woman in 40's 50's and 60's and I look back at my grandma and great grandma to only see that they have both been in divorce because the many of those times. Treated them like trash like lot of men of today do! It's just annoying at this point
If you feel emasculated then you should step up. As women we are looking for good Alpha's. We want the best. We are doing our best and so should you. It's not easy out here.
Why is black love so hard??? Because black women obtain success and make money then say they don't need a man. Whereas black men get money and look for a mate.
Needing a man and wanting a man are two different things. A lot of black men prefer to be needed versus wanted. When the "needy" relationship go south, that same man will label the women as a gold diggers.
+CatHarlem Therein lies part of the problem. Love is about companionship, enjoying someones' company but maybe I'm naive. Seems like nowadays some women are just looking to see what a man can do for them.
Carlton Banks. +Carlton Banks Obviously, you misunderstood my comment. A needy relationship is typically based on "what can you do for me". A lot of men select those type of women (maybe his self esteem is based on what he can provide, I don't know). However, if that's the relationship he wants, he shouldn't be surprised if she uses him and should resist putting all women in that category. If men select women who "want" them the relationships are typically based on Love, companionship, they enjoy each other's company and they compliment each other.
This man just said if she can buy her own drink then what does she need me for. So are you telling me you are only around to buy shit? Come on now... get your entire life. And then he said Black women think he's too good for them. Hhhaaaa he's delusional #iknowimlate
@ 6:48 to think that many Black Women do not believe they are ENUFF because of your achievements and higher education is a SAD MISPERCEPTION and it sounds pretty conceited and arrogant. There are PLENTY OF BLACK WOMEN of your status (and more) looking for those qualities in a Black man... minus the inflated ego. You psychologically believe this in your head so it is what you "think" you attract. I remember as a young woman my neighbor's brother used to come at me persistently. He new how to flip money 3-ways, he was quite attractive and drove a hot car. I wouldn't go out out with him EVER. His statement was "You can't handle ALL of this huh?" :/ SAD MISPERCEPTION... NO CONCEITED FOOL! I'M JUST NOT ATTRACTED TO you (you're not my type!)... Accept that.
6:45 Nah, I know So many educated black women who want educated black men and would jump at being able to be with one. and when educated black women are on a panel, the topic of there being a scarcity of equally- or higher-educated black men is Always a topic. (Notice that the question was even brought up here of "Do black women have to date down?" If it wasn't a well-known problem that black women want these black men but can't find them, then the question wouldn't arise.) The finger should be pointed at black men for deteriorating black love, because black male celebrities publicly put down black women and dark-skinned women (or don't shame men who do this), and young black men follow their lead.
What Black women are you finding that think you are too goodnfor them because of your education? Black women are now one of the most educated groups in America. So the question would be who are the women you are picking?
STD's and children out of wedlock has something to do with the man their with. Not their education level. A woman cant help if her cheating man brings home an STD or doesnt put a ring on her finger. As well as wearing other hair thing. What does that have to do with anything? I think I saw Kylie Jenner put out a wig tutorial on Instagram, you should ask her. All the women in my family have no issues finding men and being successful. And wearing our natural hair. You just sound really bitter and sad. Its okay. Im sure theres a couple shoulders around here you can lean on.
I think if a man needs to ask the question "what does she need me for?" They've already counted themselves out of the equation. Man should NEVER define themselves based on what a woman has, but moreso on what he's worth himself. Nobody should define themselves based on how much money they make male or female.
Untouched Jewel if she will outright tell me she doesn't need me, I automatically get rid of her
Providing isn't always about materials and what you can buy. Provide a foundation and a backbone for your family. Provide morals and leadership. Provide wisdom and love/affection. Provide protection. I can buy my own things, but a man who can give me emotional and spiritual support is priceless.
I see that lots of these comments are your typical "brick wall" comments.
No matter what the men are trying to say, it's that same "brick wall" reaction. No listening, no understanding, no objectivity.
Just dismissive responses.
How dare Black men say Black women have too much baggage when most often they are the ones who bought the 7 piece set!
😆Yes, the baggage thing kills me when they're the main ones still holding on to being dumped in the 9th grade.
bigjayking24 LMAO? No I'm actually talking about someone I recently saw on a reality show who was blaming his issues on a girl from middle school. Never said I was talking to anyone. I hope you get over your trolling ways soon. 😘
Yes, with their 800000 kids!
Yessssss amen 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
That's stupid,black women have to much fucking pride.
I'm not sure about this episode.. I didn't really get a lot of the points they were trying to make..However, I caught that comment about black women having 'too much baggage' :/.. what does that even mean? .. and the comment about 'Black women think I'm too good for them because of my educational status' again huh? Which black women?...Maybe in actual fact that's what he personally feels towards them.. A lot of this was unsettling, I cant even describe it..
I knooow. Wow...so many troubling statements made in this one. SMH
+MoChunks Show Exactly because I see so many educated black women dating bums or ex cons. So I don't get this idea that black women are out here running around with extremely high standards.
If expecting a man to have a job and keep his dick in pants is too much to ask, then we have a bigger issue here.
+madmann1000 sad but true
+madmann1000 exactly!
You'd be surprised how many times in a day that the average square, nerdy, or non-ebonic speaking black guy hears the phrase "You seem like you only date white women". Or alternatively "Can you handle a black woman?" Even if you've only ever dated black women. Eventually you'll believe it if you keep hearing it over and over.
I was raised by both of my parents to be independent. I grew up in a traditional home. my mother a stay at home wife and my dad worked but they were dysfunctional and miserable. I grew up not wanting to be miserable like them. I got to many mixed signals, so dating for me was a disaster. I didn't have any kids along the way so I always got the sideways glance like something was wrong with me. one guy told me he thought there was something wrong with women who didn't have kids. of course I was insulted but not enough to become pregnant by just any man. I grew into a woman who felt wrong in her own skin. it's hard to turn off independence it's all you know. I dont boast about it, it's just how I survive. when I finally entered a long term relationship. I didn't know what to do. I had never been taught about men. I didn't know how to turn off the way I had always survived. I was taught how not to trust or rely on a man. do you know how hard it is to let go of taking care of yourself and letting someone help you. it's terrifying. ppl assume it's being all high and mighty,,, it's often complete FEAR!!!! oftentimes I don't know if I'm crossing the male ego or manhood line because I was never taught. I don't mean to make him feel like less of a man. I really don't. Sometimes I'm just clueless because I'm not used to being in a relationship with a man who values his manhood. so please be mindful other women might just not have the knowledge. men seem to expect a women to know how men work. that's not logical. we are not men we are women. many who didn't have a strong male figure to guide us. my dad was a part of my life but never taught me about men other then they cheat. worse lesson a girl could learn. I made it to the 2 yr mark in my first long-term relationship and it's really hard! He finally stopped accusing me of leaving at some point. probably because I'm pregnant now. that scares me. I'm new to this and it's all scary. I hate feeling scared and unsure. I hope I didn't make a mistake. Sometimes I miss the comfort of being single because it felt safe and familiar. guys sometimes you have to look beyond the independent women and recognize the scared lil girl.
+RavinJ I grew up in a home from both parents being there in my life and both parents worked. My dad was there for me as well being in the home and very involved in my life but he was unfaithful to my mom. That made me look at men different. I got on the defense too in dating and yes it was a disaster for me as well. Now I have a son and a husband. It has not been easy with my trust issues and then my husband had issues too. We both had parents that cheated on the other parent. It is hard for the both of us.
RavinJ... I really had some of the same experiences as you growing up, and even after years of marriage I still have a hard time relying on my husband... but slowly I have learned to trust him. I started small. When he told me he could or would do things I waited and watched... and when he did them I wrote them down in an email, praised him for doing them and relaxed a bit. Now we have a great partnership. You cannot easily undo the damage that childhood taught you but you can slowly evolve to relying on someone that has proven themselves to be reliable. Actions speak louder than words.
Well said
We might need to start replacing the word providing with participating. If you feel like because a women has possessions you can't provide for her, then just participate in her life. You bring yours to the table I bring mine to the table. Lets build businesses, property, wealth, savings, retirement, hell lets be a blessing to someone else and be givers. No one wants or should sit in struggle when they have fire in them to go get it all because it will make a man a feel a certain type of way about it. Men are not an accessory to me. I see a man as a compliment to me. With each other we can do even more. You are providing once you start participating it might not be how society told you to provide, which is being the sole care taker of the family. But lets face it, if you want to do anything of quality in this life you need two incomes to get there quicker. Just my thoughts.
"We might need to start replacing the word providing with participating"....I like that a lot. People regardless of status should be an active participant within the relationship in any facet.
Heart Break Hotel Inc 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
I agree! I have a house and a car...but my profit margin doesnt allot me the ability (at this time) to buy more properties or a business...so partnering with a brotha with his 'shit together ' atleast can help us both have financial freedom and work for ourselves...Ive had alot of brothas swear I was being 'high saditty' because I like to talk about growth...
Heart Break Hotel Inc I wholeheartedly agree to the 'we need two incomes' 👏👏
I really enjoyed this, I meet a pro black man and love our relationship. We meet off tinder, because I like to be at home cooking and reading. Bookworm ladies get out of the house and go to the museum or Barnes & noble and meet an intelligent man.
A man knowing how to be a gentleman has nothing to do with a woman's independence!
I think a some of the comments made were very one-sided especially by the young man in the middle. As an educated black woman I would love nothing more than to be with a black man like my father who is the head of the household. The disconnect comes from both sides: black men and women. I am very successful and proud of it but outside of the workplace would love for a man to take over. A lot of us do this because we have to but yearn for a strong black man to take over at the end of the day. Black men you are needed you are appreciated don't disregard us just listen and stop prejudging.
Can we get an "Ask A Black Women" series?
It's not that we "need you" we "want you" there's a huge difference. When I am in search for a partner/relationship I'm looking for what compliments me and that's what we need to look for. You should never be co-depending on anyone because what if they leave you, then what? You're gonna feel that abandonment and that's how psychological issues start
Agreed! Why can't they just accept that the notion of being wanted FAR exceeds being needed?!! Why?
+Shanae4rmTX I think it may be because if they feel like if we need them then we are more compelled to stay when things aren't going well between us in the relationship
@@tylert271 Right. It's kind of abusive. They want a woman who couldn't leave even if she wanted to, because she doesn't have skills to make it on her own.
Thank You Married Man for your perspective. I thank him specifically because his POV is most similar to mine. It should not be anything wrong with a woman not needing a man (remember y'all said y'all don't want a woman to need y'all). We want y'all just like y'all want us, not need us.
Very well said!
love the guy on the right with the hat... a true black man hence y hes married to a black woman. we need more brothers like that. The guy in the middle with his head moving left to right.. trying to imitate the stereotypical blk woman the white media sells u.. its quite obviously hes got some blk woman hatred issues. I think the blk guy on the left may think hes a lil too good for most blk women but hopefully in time he will find a blk sister whose a Dr or scientists.. theres many of them about.
You noticed that too about the guy in the middle. He gives of angry vibes.
The idea of being a man for too long has only been having that provider label.. Now that black men are not the bread winner like they use to be they are lost? That says a lot.. That means you need to do more than come home with a check and sit on the couch... you actually may need to wash the dishes, or vacuum or check some homework.. I think the thought of more effort
And participation at home scares them.. take the provider label of the table.. Now what are you offering?
Or they need to get better jobs if they feel so strongly that money determines their worth as a partner. If you feel that your manhood rests on how much money you make, then why stop at a job at the post office (I think one of them mentioned that job)? Why aren't you trying to start you own business or be in a managerial position? Black women are going to college and getting degrees so that we can make better money. Why are black men, if they feel that money is important for their identity, not following suit at the same or higher rates? It's sounding like they want to keep a post office job and have their women just go back to cleaning people's houses with their degrees.
Excellent point
Great response!
ShonMuzik Productions spot on
@@digthewarmth they don't get better jobs because they're not qualified for better jobs LOL nor are most of us studious. Instead these days we just stay single and enjoy the simple life
I think black American males through time have lost the idea of what it is to be a man, America has become a society of customs and traditions, not culture, and the black male has lost his identity in the process. There is a difference between culture and tradition; traditions often come and go, as people move forward advance they meet new customs and traditions, and they tend to adopt those trends. As an African, I can wear hip hop clothing and listen to Rap music, but the way I approach day to day life may be in a cultural manner; the way I relate to my mother, father, auntie, uncle and members of community would be in a way that is fitting by my tribe or clan, the same applies with Asian and some European societies that are developed today, they may wear clothing and listen to music of distant origins, but they've managed to maintain the cultural aspects of their communities in their day to day lives. When people say "black Americans are not cultured", what they mean is that they do not have a way of life that is consistent with a shared idea by which people in a community adhere or subscribe to, most black American communities live by customs and traditions, they follow through trends of the generation at hand.
In almost any Africa society being a father is not optional, society has certain expectations of an individual that if not met, they'll find it difficult to function in a community. As a man you are the protector and provider in the family, no matter how much your wife makes, a man has to commit to certain responsibilities in a home, unless you are handicapped or something, you have to able to meet exceptions of a father and husband, it sets an example for the male children in a home on what is expected of them as future fathers and husbands.
There are many things that black American and African men can learn from each other, but I strongly urge black males to learn something about the African family structure, you need to get back to your roots on this one.
I'm in a committed relationship with a black man with his own heating in air business & no kids. I have got to admit, I was that 'typical' angry black woman, overly aggressive when I got angry, throwing things, talking down to my man (calling him a bitch ass nigga) when we fought, I would get instant attitudes if I didn't agree with him about certain things. No I do not work but he provides and he pays all the bills. I must say once I started watching these RUclips channels about what black men want I started to look myself in the mirror and check myself at times. It was so hard because I started seeing the remarks men made on RUclips in myself. It was time to do some self evaluation. Since then we have been doing great. We're still thriving, building our foundation together, growing together & I couldn't be much happier.
😏 So if u buy your own $8 drink men are rendered useless..and if you accept a 'free' drink you are a user/money hungry/dependent??? Guys need to realize they need to bring more to the table than being a 'provider'. If you meet a self sufficient adult you should be happy..not wondering what she 'needs you for'. Just because a woman doesn't request financial assistance from you doesn't mean she has turned you into an accessory.
+Erica Livinglife If you except a free drink you got a boyfriend for the night lol. Sometimes you arent on that when you go out.
Right.
@bigjayking24 I'm fully aware of that HUN. Perhaps you're the one who needs to read between the lines....The 'drink' conversation comes up quite a bit so, take it literally and/or figuratively.Who's slow now? Again, your trolling is tiring.
right! 😂😂😂
Yes a new podcast. Always enjoy the discourse of the contributors, it gives me a sense of pride, in these black brothers and the production team, whom produced such insightful content.
I can see both sides , but my dad did not have as much as my mom . But she never made my daddy feel bad about it .Also I was a very busy lil girl so my dad having his own Business made it easy for him to care and keep me from getting into everything 😊
Thanks for sharing your honest opinions. I like the shirt btw...good music will feed your soul. I think the gentleman who said "am I accessory?" made a good point because I think that is how women have and currently feel a lot as well. It is a mutual respect thing when it comes to relationships. When you feel like an accessory you are being objectified. We all have our shortcomings because no one is perfect. It is about finding that other person that makes you whole. Thanks for sharing! Great conversation :)
The guy on the right is so thoughtful!
I have my own because I dont like asking any man for money for something I want. Men expect an return on investment, anyhow. If we are dating, I will treat a man on his birthday and offer to pay the tip. If we are in a relationship, then its more of a cooperative situation. But if he wants my full cooperation, we MUST be in an exclusive monogamous relationship. Anything less will casue a retreat on my part FAST!
getting a return is not the same thing as looking for one.DaMayorOfNewYork
so if she can buy her own drink... you don't know what she needs you for... but if she assumes you are not down for the sisters then she's cutting herself short. how about we stop assuming and just get to know people. the problem theses days is that both men and women have such strong ideas about who they want as partners, they don't truly get to know a person. we don't talk, we don't take our time. it's all about this fast food dating. people are complex with emotions, past hurts etc. stop assuming and get to talking.
Men and women hardly ever agree but I notice a general lack of respect for what black men say. Yeah, we might not agree but this is their reality!
Upwardly mobile men shouldn't have a problem meeting a woman of substance if they're not trying to hookup with video vixen and love and hip hop types. Laws! Please evolve.
Love these! Good to hear another perspective.
I really liked this episode. I think it talked a lot about the insecurities black men have today with the rapidly shifting gender roles. I don't think we get to hear that side too often. It's not that these men necessarily want to run a traditional household. I think they just recognize that the "provider, head of the household" position is no longer an automatic slot for them, and are questioning themselves and wondering what their place is in an independent black woman's life.
social status of the black man has always been a issue. these perceptions play into a relationship. so if a woman has a strong intellectual consciousness it can often lead to self awareness
and misunderstanding because issues that affect his ability to stay true to himself.
FINALLY!!! A healthy, mature discussion from this series. This was very well done. Much love to the men of the panel.
ps. To the man in the middle, I very much hope you can find some self love as well as wholesome romantic love soon because you often appeared quite bitter.
Im disappointed in this comment section. Only a couple of people picked up on the jewels the brothers (far left and far right) were dropping. Some of you ladies not getting it might want to evaluate what type of energy you're putting out, how you communicate your expectations for your partner, and if your emotionally ready to receive a man in a relationship. Sometimes we got to check where we're at mentally and emotionally otherwise that can cloud our judgement and perception of potential mates. (writing this as a woman who hopes more will see how relevant these men's comments are) Thanks to the men on the panel for being honest, truthful and vulnerable for a female audience.
I'm late, but THANK YOU! This is the EXACT reason that there is a disconnect between men and women.. This series is to provide INSIGHT, into the thoughts of a man... Not to be aggreable and politically correct.... Most women in these comments didn't attempt to receive the message for a better understating, only to find fault in what is being said...
I'm listening. Good to hear how men think.
The goal is to know your needs, communicate your needs, define, be and create the love you desire with a man. Also, codependent defines love addiction. Interdependent describes mutual, healthy love between two equally strong individuals who choose to harmonize their love.
The guy in the t-shirt sounds like Wale lol
Even though I don't agree with everything they said. Nor do they speak for all black men as whole. I must admit it was interesting to hear it from their perspective. My question is.... where do single women like myself meet eligible Black men and who ideally meet my standards and have some of their own? In my town......I have yet to come across anything worth it. It's discouraging. Oh well😩
DaMayorOfNewYork lmaoooo so you want it with a Jersey girl lol. Ok cool. The question is what do you bring to the table love? Yes I am over weight.....and???? Just because your not into plus size women doesn't mean no one else is. That's your loss and your shallow ass problem. I am healthy, and have no pre-existing health conditions at all. Why, because I am active and my weight is maintained. I bet that's hard to believe lol. People so easily look at what's on the surface and talk shit about what they don't know. Just so we're clear, I am proud to be me and all my glory at any size. Somebody should show you a thing or two about a woman with confidence. Hopefully, judging from how your so quick to judge and attack me and my character based off of two things. 1. My comment on what I would like and appreciate in a man (standards), 2. as you put it, my RUclips videos. Wait are you even black? Again judging by how your so quick to break down a black woman, whom you don't even know, there's no way a "black man" who is secure in himself needs to troll youtube to disrespect a black woman just for kicks or just because I have standards and I am clear on them. I love me, and I don't apologize about who I am for no damn body. I am sure there's a upstanding black man who can love me too and that is whom I'll entertain when that time comes. I am not gonna waste my time going to your youtube channel if you have one? Simply because I don't give a fuck who you are. You come across as upset.....the real question is what plus size black woman has hurt you? Do all of us innocent, single mothers, plus size, independent black women a favor. Go and talk to whom ever broke your heart. Not me hun. I don't know you, I did not ask for you opinion or for your Plus size, black woman single mother bashing session. Thanks for watching my videos though. Other than making a so called informed comment, obviously there had to be something about me to make you go through all that trouble to reply to a comment I made from Several months ago. No only that, but nobody gives a damn about. Trust me it ain't that deep. Take a deep breathe and focus on you and yours hun.
DaMayorOfNewYork Wow That must have took you all day lol. How did I know you would reply, lucky me lol. (I have to find humor in this) It's all good. Listen love even based off of all that....there is one fact and one fact only. You still don't know me and I still don't know you. So your 50 ok. I am 35 and yes I am still evolving. My lessons don't stop, and this may surprise you at 50, but neither do yours. I can only hope that after having the mindset you have or that you exemplified here in these comments, that you have met, your queen and that she is exactly what your looking for or at least what you feel she should be. Hopefully at 50 your in the best shape of your life and going 💪, Mentally, Physically, and most importantly spiritually. (Folks love to leave out God then wonder why they haven't gotten any where). Now you call yourself answering my question that I posed over 7 months ago? A lot could've happened in 7 months. Did you think about that.....no. I could be in fulfilling relationship with my King. But you assume that because I am "fat", "so-called" educated, looking for sex, etc as you so elegantly put it lol. That I am still around here posing myself as a product again as you put it. The question that I posed was (I'll paraphrase) ......Where do women like myself whom have standards, find decent black men that also have standards as well? That question was simply asking what type of venues other than your normal bars (which I don't do) can you meet decent men. See I love me some me, all of me and I appreciate my black men as well. Regardless of any hell I've been through in the past with my ex. I refuse to give up on my black man. But he has to come correct and no I am not settling for nothing. Not perfect, just correct. Plain and simple. Now I don't have to elaborate on "what coming correct means" because what's understood doesn't need to be explained. No I don't only hear what I want hear. But when someone chooses to take on the approach to attack a female (me), just to make a point, it become's impossible to hear or respect anything after that. To me it's whatever. At the end of the day what God has for me is for me, bottom line. At first I was annoyed by your comment and bashing on me and other black women like myself. But once you said how old you were it all made sense. You've obviously been through some major shit with women, whether self inflicted or due to no fault of your own. This is where you are in life and that's cool. But clearly, there's nothing I can say or waste my time trying to prove to you that'll change your views and vice versa. Nor do your views speak for all black men. Bottom line. I'm not out here selling my image or campaigning for nobody's son. I am content with who I am, being myself and staying true to what I believe I deserve in a man. That's it. When he comes cool, I just pray God send him ready and not nobody who's confused about what they want, has absolutely no respect for women, or playing around with my time. That's the shit I don't need, don't want and won't settle for, I don't give a damn how big I am or how marketable you or anyone may seem to think I am. As far as my size, again I am healthy and happy with who I am and that's all that matters. Yes when I was young I was much more active than I am today, as long as I am healthy, make an effort to eat healthy, and be active as much I possibly can, to me....that's all that matters. Anyone who can't accept me for me (appearance/size wise) can get a post marked invitation to kiss my beautiful "black" ass. It's not that deep for me to go out drop 50 lbs just to get no dude. Period!!! So with that being said thanks for your input, even tho I don't agree with all of the points you stress nor your delivery. Ultimately I get the point you were trying to make. You just seem a bitter about it and and aggressive. Even disrespectful, just to stress a point is not necessary at all. I sure hope that you find (if your still looking ) that skinny, tolerable woman, that meets your standards in whom your looking for. More power to her lol. Blessings and Happy Holidays to ya.
DaMayorOfNewYork My attitude..... you open the door for it. Like the old saying goes, if you don't have nothing nice to say, then don't say nothing at all. Another thing which is really creepy and disturbing, You reference sex and me wanting someone "getting between my legs" 3 times, in 3 separate comments. No I am not at all concerned with Someone getting between my legs. That is the farthest thing on my mind lol. I'm focusing on my family and my goals. But of course you wouldn't know that being you don't personally know me. I'm trying to figure out what about me puts off that perception of looking for man for just sex or anything less. Nothing. No I haven't mentioned my standards, why should I? My standards are not your problem. So no I am not commenting what my standards are. For what? You mentioned, Respecting my elders, I have no problem respecting my elders, nor taking advice when I ask for it. But keep in mind I never asked you, and how you brought it to me was out of pocket, from jump. Bottom line. All I asked was where was a good place meet decent upstanding brothers, lol that was all. You perceived that as me being the problem??? Now as a result of the comment, I am going back and forth with a 50 year old man, whom I don't know, about how I can make my self desirable and acceptable to get a man and to society smh. Like I needed a lesson in the first place. I am a firm believer that respect is earned and you, believe it or not disrespected me from the gate for no reason at all. Now I don't know how, what I said translated in to me being upset about my size???? No I am not upset at all. The one who pointed out my size was you from jump. I am all for keeping it real, but don't come for me period. For the last time I love me and all of me. But then again that's your opinion, so it's pointless to even feed into the bull shit. It is what it is. The only reason your going back and fourth with me over a 7 month old comment lol smh, is because you feel entitled because of your age. I don't give a damn how old your are it does not give you the right to disrespect anyone or pass judgement, period. It's pretty shallow and condescending of you. Smh. But again regardless, of that fact you don't know me and I don't know you from Adam. Bottom line you continue to Judge me and It's sickening to see someone my senior who may or may not be a black man. (I have no idea) tear down their own people smh (If you are black that makes it worse smh). A smart person knows when to keep it moving, especially when it's not my fight to begin with. Like my auntie always said, the last thing you want to be is an "old fool" smh. It's funny, 3 weeks ago I saw someone had replied to a comment I made on another Madam Noire video, on the topic of Hbcu's and the importance of a degree etc. I realized today that person was you. But I chose to ignore the comment. The only reason I even bothered today was because this time you took it a step further and attacked my, appearance and my integrity, why????? Simply for attention. Yup solely for "ATTENTION". Why I allowed myself to entertain the ignorance lol smh. So I am gonna move on with my precious time and enjoy the rest of my Saturday night with my family.
You are who you attract. If your standards are based on anything other than integrity and strength of character, you may never find him.
Ms Free all hope is not lost! Check out my book on Amazon. Why Every Black Woman Should Marry A Jewish Man. amzn.to/2EMhXMu
Hello, everyone I honestly get these men point but when I think about independence I think its more so of a complexity of women not feeling comfortable enough having to ask the guy for money to get something they want and 9 out of 10 the guy normally end up asking what you need it for? So, to me that would piss me off having to come home to a man (or should I say the man come home to me"being that stay at home wife that some men look for" having to ask you for money so I can get something I want) to me it just don't make since and I think that the whole independence thing is just that...women just don't feel comfortable asking men for money; well I should say some women don't feel comfortable. The way I see is I'm a grown ass woman and I wouldn't feel comfortable asking another grown-ass person who busted they ass working for money for something I want for my own personal use. I was just saying and hopefully someone get my point. Can you all imagine living the way some of our parents lived in the 40s & 50s? What do you guys think?
I feel the same way
*****
really but does that apply if you're in a relationship being self sufficient wouldn't apply right because the bills would be for both parties. Oh n trust if you understood what i said you'd see where I said how would this work if the ways of the women and men of that era was still affective today. Damn why it always have to be a negative ass person n yes i said negative because you clearly didn't read my post right. This isn't the 1940's DUH shit.
I would feel comfortable asking for money if money was set up the way it used to be. One person having a job to take care of the whole family used to work, but nowadays, one normal job won't take care of everyone, so the husband would have to have a Very high paying job, meaning having advanced degrees or having their own successful business. I would be fine to stay home if my husband is balling out-of-control at his job. But black men as a whole can't complain about black women not being stay-at-home moms when they don't have the advanced degrees to back it up (let me know if the statistics have changed and I'm wrong on that) or the businesses.
On a first day, I buy my own food and drink. If it's a good date and he ask me again, and I like him, he will treat the second date. And we play it by ear after that.....
why would you as a female go on a date and buy yourown food thats the stupidiest comment i ever heard....if you are incountering that problem date up and cancel a date if a guy is asking for half the money for the date the sperm chases the egg not the other way around
One mistake that we keep making is that we connect or equate professional success with personal success. We know plenty of people who are very successful in their professional life, but constantly go home alone. Women have almost been using their degrees as a substitute for how good a mate or wife she would be. Many women who call the shots at the office don't want to be dominant at home. Those are two different arenas. Many men also have conflated the two as well, otherwise more Black women would be in LTR's. It appears that nobody is teaching what real manhood is about outside of capable fathers as well as what real womanhood is about. Pointing to a scripture is just an inadequate one-size-fits-all approach. The elderly who are north of 60yo can really help here.
My only complaint I have about these videos is there is alot of generalization. Men generalizing women and vice versa.
06:15 spoke to my soul. It's a friggin pain into the ass!
These types of topics need a more rounded panel. You can tell by the answers that only one of them is married. Maybe this a Cali thing cause some of their responses were very different from the south. However there is a narrative that is perpetuated, whether false or true, that a mate is more an accessory than a need.
looking at these comments I see a lot of the women aren't really taking in what the guys are saying. Almost like they want to hear what they want to hear if not then it doesn't matter.
This episode describes my life...
One of the unfortunate cycles that continue is men express honest concerns and are condemned for it. Black men aren't attacking a woman's essence, he recognizes how replaceable the world has made him. First, the oppressor took him out of the home eliminating an authentic example of masculinity in the black family. Secondly, the opprosser has convinced Black women and men that they hate each other. Thirdly, this has created a cycle of individualistic minded people ( both men and women) who lack identity. While we date we are still becoming ( learning who we are and how to love) which becomes a crash course of love. This crash course method of finding love has played a huge role in ruining the black family dynamic. Hurt people continue to hurt each other bottom line. Often times what lacks in our relationships is both being accountable and lacking a desire to work through difficulty. Love is flawed because our ideas of love are toxic and fictional. Lastly, how many of us can count at least 2 examples of healthy loving black relationships? The examples must be of people you have a close relationship with. We lack healthy loving templates and so we suggest flawed oppinions and miseducated perspectives instead.
Also, who asked for a pat on the back? I missed that I guess. I thought the conversation was about the difficulty black men have with black women because being too strong or independent, as if a man is not needed. Nothing to do with a pat on the back. I pay mortgage, not rent, kind of tells me where you are.
Since women historically have viewed relationships / marriage as a form of financial stability and men have accepted it I don;t know that we can see our value outside of that..... that can lead to men not knowing their place in a relationship if they are not the bread winner.... it is reinforced by women at times.... and by other men at times....
Not sure what they mean by BW have surpassed BM professionally. But they haven't in earnings, regardless of degrees attained.
They out earn the average black man is what they mean
I've seen that when men are ready to date exclusively and marry, they are well into their mid thirties and want women in their early twenties. So it's like if you dont get married in your early twenties, you won't get married, or at least the chances are significantly less. I love black men, but if I want marriage, I may have to look elsewhere for love to increase my chances of marriage.☝️
Perfect explanation "Why would i want to date a woman who feels she's dating down to date me" condescending very.
what does dating down means? does a person's "character" is not considered the main ingredient in today's relationships?
in this society you need money to pay bills not personality...no matter hoe nice a man is if he cant pay any bills i dont care if his personalityis like mother theresa
I personally don't have a problem with a woman being independent. I actually value that in a woman. I was raised by my grandparents and both of them worked. My grandma was a school bus driver and my grandfather was a steel mill worker and them both took care of the bills in the home. Both cooked, clean and help my aunts with their homework. So I learned from that and applied that to my life. My wife income is more than mine but I handle the bills just fine because I work and make money with my art. We both cook, clean and help our children with homework. My only problem with some independent women is that some that make over 6 figures wouldn't even look at a man that is not making 6 figures himself. There are plenty of men that has blue collar jobs. It shouldn't be a problem for a woman of that status to date a fireman, police officer, teacher ect. These days both need to take on the bills and home. It works I know because my wife and I are in the process of starting a business. Men and women should build each other to become that power couple. At the end of the day if we part ways I know she would be ok because she is a strong woman.
i want the guy in the glass he is so smart
It seems like these men only want relationships with a Black women if it follows their ideals of the traditional story of a man being the financial provider. these men should adjust their masculinity and look at how they can provide in other ways. A women can pay the bill or be the homemaker or both. There are no set roles in relationships each and everyone is different.
Also putting the blame on the black women for there not being enough black love is a cop out. My eyes were rolling this whole episode, but thanks for sharing your views.
+N'Dia Kai I listen to a financial radio show daily. Every caller that calls in is a white couple and each person makes the same money. Or, there are women that make more. They are white for the most part. For some reason, this is a big issue in the black culture. I always think because of how society treats our men, the home is the only place black men can feel powerful and if they dont have that then....... I never hear other cultures have this conversation.
+trfrierson That's because their women know how to let the men be men regardless of economics. Black women's attitude toward men that make less is very condescending. The feminist attitude doesn’t help either.
+Devon Henry boy if you don't go somewhere
Why do Black men have to go to the club ‘to relax?’ That’s the last place you should expect to find a suitable life partner!
Where else is it acceptable for a man to approach a woman?
@@bigfellamike1913 the mall, a library, coffee shop. Anywhere that doesn't provide liquor 🥃
Yes
Dating up or down??? The answer is openness and awareness. As for the angie stone "brotha" comment, listen to the first 8 bars, again brotha. You should of referred to independent by lil boosie instead
Why is there such a stigma against a woman being independent? It's ridiculous. Independence is a result. It is your circumstance be it intentional or unintentional. If your single and of dating age, you should be independent, both parties. Why would a man want someone who needs to ride their coat tail. This argument about going to white women because black women wear this chip might be because you put it there. #BlackLove #OnlyABlackMan4Me
DaMayorOfNewYork you're right. We need to drop this 'independent woman' shite!
Because black women don't need us we don't need it so what's the point like I get your independent more but at the same time I'm like what the hell do you need a guy for if you have everything you need
We obviously don't have everything we need. Being able to take care of yourself financially is a basic need of all young adults. No one's getting married young anymore, so we have to support our single selves through at least our early 20s. Are women supposed to be using our parents' money and living with our parents until marriage? No, we want to live a fun adult life too outside of our childhood homes. So we have money to take care of ourselves. We still need love though and want a lifelong partner and a man of good morals who will help teach our children and give them confidence (because we're not going to be here forever, and we need a strong next generation) and who will protect us, and who has a vision that we can support to build a legacy. Men are worth more and should aspire to more than just bringing home money to take care of household expenses.
digthewarmth yeah but for me to date a good independent woman like do I have to have the same job statuses to do that like can I just be a garbage man and just make decent money and she could be happy with that instead of me just trying to trace her status cuz at the end of the day no man wants to chase a woman especially if it's for a job status you know
@@digthewarmth Well said.
The question for independence is a survival skill. Black don't really have a choice when it's hard to find men that want or have drive enough to be a provider. Most men that can provide usually provide for other race of women.
The guy with the glasses is playing himself - dude black women don't think they aren't good enough for you, I assure you.
You can't say that because you don't know what he goes through daily.
Melinda Pierre I can say that because I'm a black woman surrounded by black women.
Just like you're speaking on your experience, he is talking about his. No two people in this world goes through the same thing.
+A Jackson speak for yourself!
the brother with the glasses need to watch sargewp videos
Although I may not agree with most of their views, it's good to actually hear another viewpoint and hear someone's else's perceptive of things.
DaMayorOfNewYork, I'd be interested to hear your opinion of what an independent white women is. Are you saying white women fix toilets, and repair cars and they do not call Dad, brother, baby daddy for that? I think your ending sentence confirms my point. If you are an adult and your single you are independent if your doing everything a "mature adult" is supposed to be doing, paying mortgage, bills, saving etc. Where exactly does it change from black woman to white woman? What I have observed of black men with white women, is the black man expecting nothing from a white women but to serve him, submit, and be quiet. Oh and occasionally, use Daddy's money to further his own agenda. I've personally witnessed this is the case more often than not. White people period, are born into this world with an unfair advantage. Anyone who can't recognize or acknowledge that ....well. That is a fact. It is up to every minority to go the extra mile to even attempt to catch up. Many of us have done that. Just because I call my brother to come fix my toilet, doesn't negate my independence. That's ridiculous.
Nice forum.... Great beginning but these young brothers are clearly limited. I'm their life experiences and lacking in the exchange overall... Bring in my experience gentleman
It's sad to say now but after watching your other videos I have to ask if every man on the panel is an actual born man or transgender. Because the women who are producing the show seem to think that it's the same when it is not.
a hit dog will holler lol
This is one of the reasons why I dont date black men, they are fro most of them very confused and conflicting
First of all that is NOT the definition of codependency but that's not really important right now. This is like the 3rd forum of black men that I have watched that basically piss me all the way off! Its condescending for us to use dating up or down but it's cool to call us busted by your standards. Instead of complaining how about stepping up. The majority of the time she uses independent to address the need to deal with a man who is about bs. There was a time when we were codependent on men and got more shit then sugar. You want us to apologize for knowing our worth? The young brother on the left summed it up, black men still dont know who they are ,they follow trends. So black love is "cool and sexy" again? That's why you want it? Black love is more than sexy and cool because some body sang about it. It's necessary to our survival, it's one unit that has been the focus of disruption for centuries. That's not by accident and now y'all are willing accomplices. You feel weak because at one time we were your emotional dumping ground when society shit on you and we had no say. Now we do and we "make" you feel emasculinated? You feel that way on your own. When these same issues occur in other races y'all can't wait to be their savior but we have baggage?! Be honest and stop blaming us. Our struggle is just as hard and sometimes even harder because we are women in a man's arena fighting gender prejudices, racism, and the betrayal from our Kings. Weak and brokenness of the black man is not the doings of the black woman. We stepped up because we had to, we still have your children to raise.
Thank you.. you're statement is completely true. It's weird how many tell woman they need to be submissive like the woman in 40's 50's and 60's and I look back at my grandma and great grandma to only see that they have both been in divorce because the many of those times. Treated them like trash like lot of men of today do! It's just annoying at this point
i like the one with the glasses you guys need to hook my up! whats his instagram page
pointing the finger right back. Black men choose interracial relationships. twice as much as Black women do.
what kind of club??????????????????????????????
If you feel emasculated then you should step up. As women we are looking for good Alpha's. We want the best. We are doing our best and so should you. It's not easy out here.
Listen he can be a fucking garbage collector for all I care, bring yours, I bring mines. Let’s be great together
black women are the poorest people based off race and gender. so what are they talking about. PS most of their degrees are not in STEM
Bye troll!
I know a lot of black women in STEM. Stop generalizing
Why is black love so hard??? Because black women obtain success and make money then say they don't need a man. Whereas black men get money and look for a mate.
Needing a man and wanting a man are two different things. A lot of black men prefer to be needed versus wanted. When the "needy" relationship go south, that same man will label the women as a gold diggers.
+CatHarlem Exactly!
+CatHarlem Therein lies part of the problem. Love is about companionship, enjoying someones' company but maybe I'm naive. Seems like nowadays some women are just looking to see what a man can do for them.
Carlton Banks. +Carlton Banks Obviously, you misunderstood my comment. A needy relationship is typically based on "what can you do for me". A lot of men select those type of women (maybe his self esteem is based on what he can provide, I don't know). However, if that's the relationship he wants, he shouldn't be surprised if she uses him and should resist putting all women in that category. If men select women who "want" them the relationships are typically based on Love, companionship, they enjoy each other's company and they compliment each other.
Carlton Banks No it’s because when black women have their shit together their more likely to not deal with bullshit
This man just said if she can buy her own drink then what does she need me for.
So are you telling me you are only around to buy shit? Come on now... get your entire life. And then he said Black women think he's too good for them.
Hhhaaaa he's delusional
#iknowimlate
Dude to the left. U kinda put it out u available. U single. A sista going give u a shout out. Thxs letting it be known.
I concur!!!!!!!! I was thinking the same thing and he is very handsome!! lol
@ 6:48 to think that many Black Women do not believe they are ENUFF because of your achievements and higher education is a SAD MISPERCEPTION and it sounds pretty conceited and arrogant. There are PLENTY OF BLACK WOMEN of your status (and more) looking for those qualities in a Black man... minus the inflated ego. You psychologically believe this in your head so it is what you "think" you attract.
I remember as a young woman my neighbor's brother used to come at me persistently. He new how to flip money 3-ways, he was quite attractive and drove a hot car. I wouldn't go out out with him EVER. His statement was "You can't handle ALL of this huh?" :/ SAD MISPERCEPTION... NO CONCEITED FOOL! I'M JUST NOT ATTRACTED TO you (you're not my type!)... Accept that.
6:45 Nah, I know So many educated black women who want educated black men and would jump at being able to be with one. and when educated black women are on a panel, the topic of there being a scarcity of equally- or higher-educated black men is Always a topic. (Notice that the question was even brought up here of "Do black women have to date down?" If it wasn't a well-known problem that black women want these black men but can't find them, then the question wouldn't arise.) The finger should be pointed at black men for deteriorating black love, because black male celebrities publicly put down black women and dark-skinned women (or don't shame men who do this), and young black men follow their lead.
Is this panel of men really accurate though? Who chooses who to be on the next series? Clearly, they don't represent all black men ...just sayin!!
Blacks shouldn't date at all maybe then we can stop making more useless clones.
What Black women are you finding that think you are too goodnfor them because of your education? Black women are now one of the most educated groups in America. So the question would be who are the women you are picking?
+General SDE www.professu.com/black-women-are-ranked-the-most-educated-group-by-race-gender/
STD's and children out of wedlock has something to do with the man their with. Not their education level. A woman cant help if her cheating man brings home an STD or doesnt put a ring on her finger. As well as wearing other hair thing. What does that have to do with anything? I think I saw Kylie Jenner put out a wig tutorial on Instagram, you should ask her.
All the women in my family have no issues finding men and being successful. And wearing our natural hair. You just sound really bitter and sad. Its okay. Im sure theres a couple shoulders around here you can lean on.
they are educated but they are broke because of school loans..and this is coming from a black women
Cry me a river!!!!
Dude to the left. U kinda put it out u available. U single. A sista going give u a shout out. Thxs letting it be known.