No one looks up too guys like Knish... because he is cold, intelligent and thinks about the bills. Guys like Mike make 2-3 million dollars then 2-3 years down the road they are broke maby living on the streets.
Knish represents what a true rounder is, even in today's poker scene. The vast majority of successful poker players aren't playing super high rollers or nosebleed stakes where they've sold 90% of themselves. That's the "glamorous" part of poker, but there are way more guys that nobody's ever heard of that grind a livelihood by being smart with their investment and being level headed. It doesn't look nearly as appealing as binking a big tournament for millions, but I respect that they've found a way to go through life on their own terms.
1:55 Knish offering to help him out by pulling some other strings and buying him some time indicates that he was a true friend. He wasn't just completely leaving him out in the cold. Not giving him the money was simply a matter of principle.
It wasn't so much principle as it was the fact that if Knish gives him the money Mike would likely feel like he skated by. Then eventually Mike would make another risky decision and would need Knish to bail him out, again. It would create a pattern of behavior in Mike and eventually Knish wouldn't be able to bail him out. Something Knish has probably seen many times from other gamblers, including himself.
Knish was always ready to help Mike out. He probably had more patience with Mike and his foul-ups than most folks would. It's almost as if Knish felt like Mike would either level out and have a decent life or end up like worm, so he was trying to help him move in the best direction. Ironically, Mike was doing the same thing with worm, who kept getting them both into trouble.
Knish evaluates the situation like a poker hand. "What's 2 grand buy you, a day? No, if i give it to you i'm wasting it." Yep, painful fold but it's the right play.
@@royfokerpoker1802 Yes, cause then he didn't know the situation. He thought Mike wanted to borrow around 1000 dollars, but when Mike says he needs 15, Knish understands that he's in serious trouble.
Nope hes the true rounder. Not everyone have moms-dads money to play until they go broke, some grown men have responsabilities and when they lose they dont just lose their money, they lose more (family house etc.). Damon in this scene is the solo guy who if he loses just fucks up his life, Knish is the grinder that has responsabilities, he plays to pay the bills.
The beauty of this scene is that on the surface it is intended to make you think Knish is the prick for saying no....But, from the comment section here, you clearly can see that in reality, that the scene identifies him as the righteous person who is making the proper decision while imparting knowledge.
Knish never needs a hand out. He’s always a step ahead. He gives Mike small loans, he gets him a job, and great advise. Not giving Mike the money was the right thing here. Mike would always go back to the well if Knish didn’t stop.
Bankroll Management and discipline. The 2 most important factors to being a successful rounder. If you don't have these, then even the best read skills and knowing pot odds and position isn't enough. I never played for huge money, but the room I used to visit in Houston I would go in with $200 for chips and not another dime in my wallet. I was willing to risk my entire $200 buy in on the first hand (and did so once) and walk away afterwords if necessary. That's was the discipline, at least for me. It kept me out of playing on tilt, risking dangerous amounts of money and living to fight another day.
having just bankroll management (takes minutes to learn) and discipline makes you a losing player by far. You need thousands more things than just these two.
👏 thats the Way i Play baby.. $150 and nothing more sometimes i loose it. But most of the time I leave 500+ depending how long I want to stay around for
Such a phenomenal job with that character too. I really do respect his game, as he's got the discipline not to gamble like a true rounder. LOVE this movie.
+Carl Bonroy A true grinder. He evaluates Mike's situation just like a poker hand. No point in wasting good money in a hopeless spot, folding is the correct play ("I give it to you I'm wasting it). And yet he can't help but get into Mike's story about putting a move on Chan. Just like a real rounder. Well written character and scene.
I always said this was the best scene in the movie, and I love the movie, and John stole the entire thing with his small part. Brilliant acting as always.
With no stones living life like a 9-5 but more stress cause can never make the more to bring you over the top. You guys lost on who's the poker genius in this movie.
Zazz19 I was listening to a story today about Arthur Chu, a Jeopardy champion, who uses a lot of strategy and how that annoyed a lot of Jeopardy fans because it seemed to detract from the fun of the game and it reminded me of this scene. The basic argument between Knish and McDermott is whether this is work. What Knish does involves discipline, strategy, and more discipline. McDermott believes in occasionally playing hunches. McDermott correctly points out that grinding it out night after night making smart plays, never taking a chance, fighting a war of attrition gradually wearing your opponents down and counting on the odds in the long run (because in the long run, the only thing that is certain is that the odds will win in the long run) is not a helluva lot of fun. Might as well have a regular job. Knish, from his point of view points out that this is his regular job. It's how he pays the bills, not a vacation in Vegas. And since McDermott isn't just blowing a few dollars in Atlantic City on vacation, but risking his entire future with a dangerous gangster, he better smarten up and treat this like serious work, McDermott's a little smarter than the average player and he clearly knows how to grind it out. The problem is, he has all the hallmarks of a potential gambling addict. He isn't in it for the money, he's in it for "the thrill of victory" as Knish terms it. I've heard psychoanalytic theories that suggest that problem gamblers actually want to lose but I don't think that's it. What they are in it for is the emotional charge that gambling gives them. And you can't get an emotional charge from the Knish way. If you are someone who gambles frequently, the only way to consistently get an emotional charge from your gambling and not have it become "work" is by trying to beat the odds and no one, in the long haul, beats the odds.
+Jamey Roberts When I read is strategy I thought of that MANY OF YEARS AGO at least 5 years ago (and I would never ever play jeopardy). I never understood why people don't make stragies in most games. And his was so simple. I get rid of the big amounts first PRO- anyone answers wrong massive loss, Psychological blow of top prize being gone, etc.. CONS- I get daily double/rare and controllable betting, I answer wrong.
Jamey Roberts poignant and insightful. Likewise well written analysis that explains both the movies characters and their real life counterparts real or otherwise who exhibit these behaviors. The angle about 'wanting to lose' is new to me and kinda makes sense
Even if you’re Phil Ivey, putting your whole bankroll on one cash game is basically playing slots. Skill matters over a long time, in a single cash game luck is generally going to be the deciding factor on whether you win or lose.
Grinding for a living is not for everyone, because it is literally grinding. You're trying to keep your volatility as low as possible. You're going for the slow, steady income, and limiting your losses. But it takes a lot of discipline to put in the hours, day in, day out, whether you feel like it or not, and not chasing a big score, which could endanger your bankroll, or mean you can't pay the bills that month. You're taking out the adreneline, the emotion, the ego. You're playing a strategy that you know is an advantage in the long-term. Most poker players, especially younger ones, have neither the patience, discipline or desire to play this way. So (as others have pointed out), they'll have million one day and zero the next.
Bankroll management and mastering the fundamentals are two most important things in poker without question. You become a winning poker player by mastering the fundamentals and you stay a winning player by playing at the right stakes so your roll is never at risk. Keep chipping away and dont move up until you can more than afford it. You shouldnt even think about sitting down at a 1-3 game regularly unless you got at least 7500-10,000$+ behind. You cant play your best when the money is important and you're worried about losing. Live by this and your roll with slowly get bigger and bigger in the long run, assuming you're a good winning player which is very rare to be. It takes years of reading and studying and experience, trust me. Discipline and knowing the fundamentals is what separates poker players from the gamblers. People think Phil Helmuth is a joke but theres a reason hes one of the best tournament players to ever live and is consistently cashing over and over again. That guy is a fundamental master.
I dont think anyone that knows anything about poker ever questions Helmuths skill. Its that hes a giant man baby anytime he loses a big pot, makes the wrong read, or loses any hand to anyone he thinks is below him. . and lets be honest here. . . he thinks everyone is below him.
@@nfinitecontradiction6758 When you compare tournament ROIs most ppl are below him. He was never a great cash player tho. A lot of people are thinking the same as him when they take bad beats they just don't say it out load.
@@Dreamline78 Well the role she signed up for when the script was written was only meant to be a bit role. Just because you cast a popular and talented actress in the role doesn't change the fact that it wasn't meant to be a big role.
Gambling is sick and evil. You cant trust anyone else and you cant trust the game itself . We work too damn hard in this god forsaken world to risk our $. Gamblers will sell their souls if need be. And they will f you in the process.
I think you are getting it a little wrong. Knish is lecturing Mike about his mistakes, basiclly tell Mike he is an Fup. Mike is desperate and scared and doesn't need another lecture right at this time he needs help so... he says some things he shouldn't to Knish. Frankly, I don't think Knish was going to help Mike no matter what was said.
@@mr.anderson9938 Yeah and Knish is probably right not to help him, that said, I think its okay for Mike to ask for help without wanting to be lectured.
If I could play professionally, I'd be like Kinish. You can keep the glory. I'd be in it only for the money. To me, it's better than working a second job.
Knish to me is how I would like to play poker, yeah I don’t have some bracelet or possibly have a couple million bucks but I’m able to pay alimony, child support, own a delivery company even if a small operation where I have a couple employees or even just myself and still be able to hit the Russian Bathhouse to unwind, and do all that in New York City which has always been one of the most expensive cities in the country to live in. Knish was doing just fine, for all we know Mike could’ve either won a bracelet or placed and got a nice payday….Or he could’ve busted out on day 1 of the World Series, we just don’t know
This is a great scene because it does show you that you aren't going to just read a book and go play winning poker, it's a learned experience that takes time over many years and EXTREME discipline and if you do not follow those rules you end up like Mike here with a busted face begging for $15,000.
I understand the sentiment but the way it ends open ended is perfect , it's OK to have a standalone film . Just a beautiful work of art that's more than just poker I love it !
I pretty much agree with almost everything Knish says except that the WSOP isn't a pipe dream and it's never just "TV." The WSOP isn't going to stop based on one person's opinion on it. There's a reason why Phil Hellmuth won 15 bracelets. That being said, Mike shouldn't have been overconfident with his nines full. Especially not that long ago, I had to fold my flopped king high straight because I knew even before I saw my opponent show his six-nine of hearts after the river, that I wasn't going to bluff him into folding his straight the second time.
My life right now, feels like this movie and scene. I’m in this paradox of getting what I wished for, then having to Accept Reality, that maybe all this time I was Chasing a Pipe Dream. All of a sudden, now I’m just an 8-4 public worker for the hotel business, and feel like I’m Confined/Bound to it, and can do nothing more. I guess this is the way how I must Pay For It, with the Risks I took and Mistakes I made.
This movie was so ahead of its time, this is the movie that got my brother and father and myself into hold'em. The movie is accurate and we were still learning things in this movie after years of playing, we wld realizd how in depth and accurate the card games and strategy hold in the film.
These days when I play I am a poker player. I can and will take chances. Why? Because I’m in it to win it all. I play a couple tournaments a year, and rarely cash. I spent 18 months of my life about a decade ago as a grinder. I wasn’t as flush back then as I am now, and let me tell you it is a mind numbing way to play poker. Profitable? Yes. But I’d never want to rely on grinding poker as my primary means of income ever again.
It takes extreme discipline, sacrifice, and patience to be a true grinder. Most people doing it are not making a fortune. They simply grind out what they need to pay the bills. Probably not much extra.
it means he doesn't risk all his stack on one hand, iow "he grinds it out" by trying to get base hits rather than swinging for a home run on every pitch...its how you survive when you are taking risks for a living
tbh i think mike should have told him this time it was trying to help out a friend who would have been dead without him and not just recklessly gambling money like before, maybe he would have helped then once he understood the whole situation
I don't think he would have. He would have had sympathy for the situation, but would have changed his tune to "weren't you warned Worm was bad news? An albatross around your neck?" Knish wasn't going to be loaning him money, not with the level of debt which had been put on Mike.
Why didn’t Mike just take the 30k he had in the beginning of movie to Vegas? The WSOP main event is only 10k, so he had enough to buy into probably all the WSOP events.
Because there wouldn’t have been a movie, just like if he had hooked up with Famke Jansens character when she threw herself at him. He could’ve got with her, stayed in law school while grinding on the side with her and that would’ve been that.
that's ridicolous, there are 95 live events in the wsop today, back in those days there were fewer, sure, but probably about 50, some of them cost 10k or 5k that are not the main event. 30k is gonna only buy you into a few events.
30k at the time would have been plenty to enter the Vegas cash game scene, but not enough to use 10k enter the WSOP. But better than risking it all against the Russian mob.
Anyone who has the discipline and patience can win $500 a night at most any 2/5 or 5/10 table. You gotta know when to hold'em and know when to fold them. Its that simple.
In the film, the next lines in the scene are Damon talking about bluffing Johnny Chan in Vegas. They had to write in some obviously-fantasy story about him beating a legend to finish the scene, otherwise Tuturro would have completely stolen it.
Aaaaaaaaaah no. But he did play an important role in the script. People have to realize as enticing films are, they are just visual novels. In the script he plays an experienced rounder who attempts to show Mike the in's and out's of that world, and also how it can bring you to your knee's in a second. He is the father figure, voice of reason so to speak trying to actually stir Mike away from the life bc of his own experiences as a grinder, like a potential cautionary tale. Movie is about Mike. He is the protagonist and Kinish is just another character like worm or Gramma. A story has to have layers/other characters like a novel, and he plays that role. If you meant movie was really about Knish meaning some sort of metaphor, you could make that point using basically any other character. Jo his woman is trying to keep him away from the life.. Worm is trying to fight that and get him back into the life.. Knish is the voice, but enabling guy trying to be used as an example of how hard it is.. Gramma is the potential consequences. And the Professor is the character of an example of making a choice in life like risk or reward. Going for what you believe in but it comes w consequences, yet the risk has fulfillment. How movie was about Knish I would love to hear.
Knish was always my favorite. Level-headed and intelligent; a true Rounder so to say.
Yep. The movie is called Rounders, and you assume that's to infer Mike is one. But Knish was the true rounder in this movie. A real grinder.
ChakaWhat agreed.
No one looks up too guys like Knish... because he is cold, intelligent and thinks about the bills. Guys like Mike make 2-3 million dollars then 2-3 years down the road they are broke maby living on the streets.
Knish represents what a true rounder is, even in today's poker scene. The vast majority of successful poker players aren't playing super high rollers or nosebleed stakes where they've sold 90% of themselves. That's the "glamorous" part of poker, but there are way more guys that nobody's ever heard of that grind a livelihood by being smart with their investment and being level headed. It doesn't look nearly as appealing as binking a big tournament for millions, but I respect that they've found a way to go through life on their own terms.
fsdgrsdgfsdg
Interesting the pecking order in the movie. Knish gives advice to Mikey> Mikey gives advice to Worm> Worm ... well you get the point
1:55 Knish offering to help him out by pulling some other strings and buying him some time indicates that he was a true friend. He wasn't just completely leaving him out in the cold. Not giving him the money was simply a matter of principle.
Not giving him the money was also being a true friend
It wasn't so much principle as it was the fact that if Knish gives him the money Mike would likely feel like he skated by. Then eventually Mike would make another risky decision and would need Knish to bail him out, again. It would create a pattern of behavior in Mike and eventually Knish wouldn't be able to bail him out.
Something Knish has probably seen many times from other gamblers, including himself.
@@Richie3Jack Yeah, that's what I meant by principle. He was teaching Mike a lesson.
Knish would only be enabling him
Tough love is what they call it
John Turturro adds a lot to every movie he’s in.
Except for transformers. Money grabbing. Would do the same. He has earned his ways
his kids eat.
He is the best in everything he ever plays.
A seriously underrated actor, guy pulls off every role excellently
Brain Donors FTW!
Knish was always ready to help Mike out. He probably had more patience with Mike and his foul-ups than most folks would. It's almost as if Knish felt like Mike would either level out and have a decent life or end up like worm, so he was trying to help him move in the best direction. Ironically, Mike was doing the same thing with worm, who kept getting them both into trouble.
Long story short. He saw himself in him and knew he could do it
Knish evaluates the situation like a poker hand. "What's 2 grand buy you, a day? No, if i give it to you i'm wasting it." Yep, painful fold but it's the right play.
Except 10 seconds earlier he actually offered it to him first lol
@@royfokerpoker1802 Yes, cause then he didn't know the situation. He thought Mike wanted to borrow around 1000 dollars, but when Mike says he needs 15, Knish understands that he's in serious trouble.
Nope hes the true rounder. Not everyone have moms-dads money to play until they go broke, some grown men have responsabilities and when they lose they dont just lose their money, they lose more (family house etc.). Damon in this scene is the solo guy who if he loses just fucks up his life, Knish is the grinder that has responsabilities, he plays to pay the bills.
Or he could just get a job?
@@hankster0878 Thats his job, true poker players count their winnings in hourly rate. That includes all expenses needed to live comparably
@@madabawi8879 Only broke wage slaves count their earnings by the hour.
@@abark Gambling is a vice and can be just as bad as any other. People who make a living off of it are not special.
@@abark You mean like the $1,000/hr corporate attorneys?
The beauty of this scene is that on the surface it is intended to make you think Knish is the prick for saying no....But, from the comment section here, you clearly can see that in reality, that the scene identifies him as the righteous person who is making the proper decision while imparting knowledge.
At the end of the day, his kids eat. Period. Having priorities, especially ones that aren't about yourself, is part of being a real adult.
Knish never needs a hand out. He’s always a step ahead. He gives Mike small loans, he gets him a job, and great advise. Not giving Mike the money was the right thing here. Mike would always go back to the well if Knish didn’t stop.
Bankroll Management and discipline. The 2 most important factors to being a successful rounder. If you don't have these, then even the best read skills and knowing pot odds and position isn't enough.
I never played for huge money, but the room I used to visit in Houston I would go in with $200 for chips and not another dime in my wallet. I was willing to risk my entire $200 buy in on the first hand (and did so once) and walk away afterwords if necessary. That's was the discipline, at least for me. It kept me out of playing on tilt, risking dangerous amounts of money and living to fight another day.
having just bankroll management (takes minutes to learn) and discipline makes you a losing player by far. You need thousands more things than just these two.
@@telotade2389*whoosh*
@telotade2389 He didn't claim or even remotely imply that you didn't.
👏 thats the Way i Play baby.. $150 and nothing more sometimes i loose it. But most of the time I leave 500+ depending how long I want to stay around for
Hard not to respect Knish.
Agreed, I love Knish's philosophy.
You little punk I play for money
Such a phenomenal job with that character too. I really do respect his game, as he's got the discipline not to gamble like a true rounder. LOVE this movie.
I love this part - the way Knish talks, what he says.
+Carl Bonroy A true grinder. He evaluates Mike's situation just like a poker hand. No point in wasting good money in a hopeless spot, folding is the correct play ("I give it to you I'm wasting it). And yet he can't help but get into Mike's story about putting a move on Chan. Just like a real rounder. Well written character and scene.
I always said this was the best scene in the movie, and I love the movie, and John stole the entire thing with his small part. Brilliant acting as always.
I concur the best scene in the movie
@@leeb905 Agreed. This scene and the "What choice?" Scene with the late Martin Landau.
John Turturro is one of MY all-time favorite actors. This is a guy who can do almost anything.
Not almost.
Any serious poker player needs a Knish in their life. For real.
knish is the serious poker player. McDermott is not
Any serious poker player needs to BE like Knish
With no stones living life like a 9-5 but more stress cause can never make the more to bring you over the top. You guys lost on who's the poker genius in this movie.
Any serious poker player is Knish.
@@ilovebrandnewcarpets h
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01:35 "stones? You little PPPANK"
The way he pronounces punk is gold.
Its his ny accent.
Is this super quiet for anyone else? Like almost inaudible?
+Brandon Anderson NO listen better
+Alex Langsam Cool, I see at least 6 other people agreed with me.
It's a little quiet but nothing outrageous.
I heard it fine
Check yours ears
Zazz19 I was listening to a story today about Arthur Chu, a Jeopardy champion, who uses a lot of strategy and how that annoyed a lot of Jeopardy fans because it seemed to detract from the fun of the game and it reminded me of this scene. The basic argument between Knish and McDermott is whether this is work. What Knish does involves discipline, strategy, and more discipline. McDermott believes in occasionally playing hunches. McDermott correctly points out that grinding it out night after night making smart plays, never taking a chance, fighting a war of attrition gradually wearing your opponents down and counting on the odds in the long run (because in the long run, the only thing that is certain is that the odds will win in the long run) is not a helluva lot of fun. Might as well have a regular job. Knish, from his point of view points out that this is his regular job. It's how he pays the bills, not a vacation in Vegas. And since McDermott isn't just blowing a few dollars in Atlantic City on vacation, but risking his entire future with a dangerous gangster, he better smarten up and treat this like serious work,
McDermott's a little smarter than the average player and he clearly knows how to grind it out. The problem is, he has all the hallmarks of a potential gambling addict. He isn't in it for the money, he's in it for "the thrill of victory" as Knish terms it. I've heard psychoanalytic theories that suggest that problem gamblers actually want to lose but I don't think that's it. What they are in it for is the emotional charge that gambling gives them. And you can't get an emotional charge from the Knish way. If you are someone who gambles frequently, the only way to consistently get an emotional charge from your gambling and not have it become "work" is by trying to beat the odds and no one, in the long haul, beats the odds.
That's why when you do catch that flash in the pan, you walk...or just drop down in stakes and be overrolled and have some fun...
+Jamey Roberts When I read is strategy I thought of that MANY OF YEARS AGO at least 5 years ago (and I would never ever play jeopardy). I never understood why people don't make stragies in most games. And his was so simple. I get rid of the big amounts first PRO- anyone answers wrong massive loss, Psychological blow of top prize being gone, etc.. CONS- I get daily double/rare and controllable betting, I answer wrong.
Jamey Roberts poignant and insightful. Likewise well written analysis that explains both the movies characters and their real life counterparts real or otherwise who exhibit these behaviors. The angle about 'wanting to lose' is new to me and kinda makes sense
There was/is this one guy who did/does beat the odds.
Knish's kids eat
+nicksixer Knish chases no pipe dreams...
Hahahahahhahaha
Swing for the fences when you can, just dont take food away from your kids.
😂😂😂😂😂
lol
Knish reminds me of my grandpa, sometimes I hate em but boy does he know how to smack some sense into ya!
I love how knish is always hovering over mikes shoulder in like every scene he’s in. Just teleports out of nowhere. Great movie.
sneaky sneaky
@@krissylee1491 very very
Wooooooooooo
Even if you’re Phil Ivey, putting your whole bankroll on one cash game is basically playing slots. Skill matters over a long time, in a single cash game luck is generally going to be the deciding factor on whether you win or lose.
Teddy Knish was the real hero of the movie.
Joey
Joey KGB
Joey teddy, teddy Joey
Yes, and R2-D2 defeated the Empire.
@@Evenflo76 Hey Joe Knish
Grinding for a living is not for everyone, because it is literally grinding. You're trying to keep your volatility as low as possible. You're going for the slow, steady income, and limiting your losses. But it takes a lot of discipline to put in the hours, day in, day out, whether you feel like it or not, and not chasing a big score, which could endanger your bankroll, or mean you can't pay the bills that month. You're taking out the adreneline, the emotion, the ego. You're playing a strategy that you know is an advantage in the long-term. Most poker players, especially younger ones, have neither the patience, discipline or desire to play this way. So (as others have pointed out), they'll have million one day and zero the next.
1:32 : Mike uses the line that Worm used about Knish earlier in the movie, LOL
Supposed to highlight the fact that he was being inauthentic. And Knish knew it.
He did inherit Worm's debt by standing by the wrong friend...
Could you make the volume a little lower? I can still make out four words.
And the end music blasts my ears off
Lol and your next vid loses you an eardrum.
Knish was the only rounder in this movie
How so?
@@v4v819 played the games that gave him regular tax free income. Didn’t chase the dragon
The best lines in any Matt Damon movie is when he gets chewed out for something
That’s because the entire movie is about Mikey being an idiot.
Yup like Ben Affleck chewing him out in Good Will Hunting
Bankroll management and mastering the fundamentals are two most important things in poker without question. You become a winning poker player by mastering the fundamentals and you stay a winning player by playing at the right stakes so your roll is never at risk. Keep chipping away and dont move up until you can more than afford it. You shouldnt even think about sitting down at a 1-3 game regularly unless you got at least 7500-10,000$+ behind. You cant play your best when the money is important and you're worried about losing. Live by this and your roll with slowly get bigger and bigger in the long run, assuming you're a good winning player which is very rare to be. It takes years of reading and studying and experience, trust me. Discipline and knowing the fundamentals is what separates poker players from the gamblers. People think Phil Helmuth is a joke but theres a reason hes one of the best tournament players to ever live and is consistently cashing over and over again. That guy is a fundamental master.
The vast majority of online players have years of "experience" but are still losing players.
I dont think anyone that knows anything about poker ever questions Helmuths skill.
Its that hes a giant man baby anytime he loses a big pot, makes the wrong read, or loses any hand to anyone he thinks is below him. . and lets be honest here. . . he thinks everyone is below him.
@@nfinitecontradiction6758 When you compare tournament ROIs most ppl are below him. He was never a great cash player tho. A lot of people are thinking the same as him when they take bad beats they just don't say it out load.
Rounders was such a great movie, all of the roles were cast just so perfectly.
Joe McKim check out Clowning a Rounders
Yes, including the under-utilized Famke Janssen.
@@Dreamline78 Well the role she signed up for when the script was written was only meant to be a bit role. Just because you cast a popular and talented actress in the role doesn't change the fact that it wasn't meant to be a big role.
They could’ve used a better person to play Johnny Chan.
We only miss Phil Helmut
This movie got me into poker and losing tons of money, love it
I did the same thing , but i noticed late and i will try to build up my bankroll and play for the money not for the victory
How did you lose tons of money do you play online poker? Cause this ain’t online poker buddy this is the real stuff
@@HiimFieldy they are both real you dumb fu k
Gambling is sick and evil. You cant trust anyone else and you cant trust the game itself . We work too damn hard in this god forsaken world to risk our $. Gamblers will sell their souls if need be. And they will f you in the process.
Knish was the actual hero in Rounders. Mike was a talented poker player w no bankroll management skills and fairly poor judgement.
Funny how if you decline helping a friend who got themselves into trouble they start insulting you and your character.
I think you are getting it a little wrong. Knish is lecturing Mike about his mistakes, basiclly tell Mike he is an Fup. Mike is desperate and scared and doesn't need another lecture right at this time he needs help so... he says some things he shouldn't to Knish. Frankly, I don't think Knish was going to help Mike no matter what was said.
Common trait with all addictive personalities.
@@PoppysGuitar knish has been helping him the whole time and by not giving him the money is also helping him , bail him out now and he learns nothing
@@mr.anderson9938 Yeah and Knish is probably right not to help him, that said, I think its okay for Mike to ask for help without wanting to be lectured.
@@PoppysGuitar I don't think Knish had the money or Mike and he simply weren't close enough for him to put up that much for him.
Rounders...the ultra-rare "Whisper Version".
The movie is like this as well.
This is cuz they’re in the sauna house
Mike! He showed u the playbook he put together off his own beats!
What an ensemble of actors in this movie. And everyone killed it.
If I could play professionally, I'd be like Kinish. You can keep the glory. I'd be in it only for the money. To me, it's better than working a second job.
John Turturro act is always SUPERB because his kids eat
Knish was always the friend to him, not worm
You know what? You keep grinding out that rent money, Joe. That's real noble work you're doing.
Hahaha
That line always cracks me up.
Knish to me is how I would like to play poker, yeah I don’t have some bracelet or possibly have a couple million bucks but I’m able to pay alimony, child support, own a delivery company even if a small operation where I have a couple employees or even just myself and still be able to hit the Russian Bathhouse to unwind, and do all that in New York City which has always been one of the most expensive cities in the country to live in. Knish was doing just fine, for all we know Mike could’ve either won a bracelet or placed and got a nice payday….Or he could’ve busted out on day 1 of the World Series, we just don’t know
John Turturro is so talented. He can play poker, shoot pool, and bowl
I don't fully realize how right Knish was until I became a winning poker player myself. Too bad Mike wouldn't listen.
1:32 Thats basically what he said to Robin Williams in Good Will Hunting during their therapy sessions. lol
Nobody’s can deliver a line like Turturro
Knish also told Mike that Worm was a scumbag he should stay away from. Mike was loyal and a friend to a guy who at no time was the same to Mike.
Worm got himself expelled and refused to rat out Mike.
@@earlmcmanus194 So that obligates Mike to flush his own life down same pishadoo?
Someone get my boy Kinesh an oscar!
Truly special for all time with this incredible cast! ❤️
Online players would of refered to Knish as a nit. However, a nit does what he has to do to make money even it is't pretty or exciting.
Russ Abrahams nits don’t make money in poker
If you play for a living you don't give anything away.
@@allenpark8180 Well depends on the game. At a game with a bunch of spewy players, nits can print.
its hard to say no in a situation like that, but he knew he had to, Mike didnt deserve his help.
Between this scene and the scene about the judge being a rabbi, i cant tell which is the best in the movie.
One of my favorite parts of the film. Definitely real-life consequences and definitions
This is a great scene because it does show you that you aren't going to just read a book and go play winning poker, it's a learned experience that takes time over many years and EXTREME discipline and if you do not follow those rules you end up like Mike here with a busted face begging for $15,000.
John Turturro. Underrated.
Turturro rules
Great Scene. This movie should have had a sequel
I understand the sentiment but the way it ends open ended is perfect , it's OK to have a standalone film . Just a beautiful work of art that's more than just poker I love it !
Knish would never risk his whole bankroll at the table.
I pretty much agree with almost everything Knish says except that the WSOP isn't a pipe dream and it's never just "TV." The WSOP isn't going to stop based on one person's opinion on it. There's a reason why Phil Hellmuth won 15 bracelets. That being said, Mike shouldn't have been overconfident with his nines full. Especially not that long ago, I had to fold my flopped king high straight because I knew even before I saw my opponent show his six-nine of hearts after the river, that I wasn't going to bluff him into folding his straight the second time.
the best scene in a movie filled with great scenes. Absolutely steals the show!
My life right now, feels like this movie and scene.
I’m in this paradox of getting what I wished for, then having to Accept Reality, that maybe all this time I was Chasing a Pipe Dream.
All of a sudden, now I’m just an 8-4 public worker for the hotel business, and feel like I’m Confined/Bound to it, and can do nothing more. I guess this is the way how I must Pay For It, with the Risks I took and Mistakes I made.
Knish was the realist in this movie
This movie was on my top 5 of greatest of all time.
This movie explains why not to let ppl borrow money and you hurt them more. Name anyone person you gave money and they said you changed my life
Name one person you lent money to and you got it back!
You can learn 10times more from other's mistakes than from your own.
Turturro is amazing man.
This movie was so ahead of its time, this is the movie that got my brother and father and myself into hold'em. The movie is accurate and we were still learning things in this movie after years of playing, we wld realizd how in depth and accurate the card games and strategy hold in the film.
0:09 Me, whenever anyone makes unreasonable requests.
These days when I play I am a poker player. I can and will take chances. Why? Because I’m in it to win it all. I play a couple tournaments a year, and rarely cash. I spent 18 months of my life about a decade ago as a grinder. I wasn’t as flush back then as I am now, and let me tell you it is a mind numbing way to play poker. Profitable? Yes. But I’d never want to rely on grinding poker as my primary means of income ever again.
See, this here is a real friend.
I love his advice for starters
I've been here so many times in my life
Where? In kanishs spot or matt damons?
I've watched people have the conversation about buy ins, and it never goes like this.
If I had Knish's style and not McDermott's style. I still be playing no limit hold em.
It takes extreme discipline, sacrifice, and patience to be a true grinder. Most people doing it are not making a fortune. They simply grind out what they need to pay the bills. Probably not much extra.
Best scene of this movie because what they both say is the truth.
Tough love for a brother.
it means he doesn't risk all his stack on one hand, iow "he grinds it out" by trying to get base hits rather than swinging for a home run on every pitch...its how you survive when you are taking risks for a living
Wish they made a sequel with Mike, Worm, Knish and KGB all playing against each other.
Both very talented
tbh i think mike should have told him this time it was trying to help out a friend who would have been dead without him and not just recklessly gambling money like before, maybe he would have helped then once he understood the whole situation
I don't think he would have. He would have had sympathy for the situation, but would have changed his tune to "weren't you warned Worm was bad news? An albatross around your neck?" Knish wasn't going to be loaning him money, not with the level of debt which had been put on Mike.
Matt Damon plays a good conscious degenerate gambler.
This scene never stood out to me until I got myself in the hole as well. LMAO
Turturro is so good in this scene
Why didn’t Mike just take the 30k he had in the beginning of movie to Vegas? The WSOP main event is only 10k, so he had enough to buy into probably all the WSOP events.
Because there wouldn’t have been a movie, just like if he had hooked up with Famke Jansens character when she threw herself at him. He could’ve got with her, stayed in law school while grinding on the side with her and that would’ve been that.
that's ridicolous, there are 95 live events in the wsop today, back in those days there were fewer, sure, but probably about 50, some of them cost 10k or 5k that are not the main event. 30k is gonna only buy you into a few events.
He was going for tourneys and cash games but i think he was also playing because of his own ego, he thought he was better than Teddy KGB.
30k at the time would have been plenty to enter the Vegas cash game scene, but not enough to use 10k enter the WSOP. But better than risking it all against the Russian mob.
Excellent Dialogue here.
Knish gives great advice:)
Carmine Falcone ladies and gentlemen
Joey Knish had two brothers, Potato Knish and Kasha Knish. They both worked behind the counter at Nathan's Famous in Coney Island.
Anyone who has the discipline and patience can win $500 a night at most any 2/5 or 5/10 table. You gotta know when to hold'em and know when to fold them. Its that simple.
In the film, the next lines in the scene are Damon talking about bluffing Johnny Chan in Vegas. They had to write in some obviously-fantasy story about him beating a legend to finish the scene, otherwise Tuturro would have completely stolen it.
Great actors
Turturro cooking this movie
Your best friend is the one who tells you the most truth.
Tough love
1:08 no truer words "this time there is no money. I have you 2 grand what's that buy you, a day? Nah, I give it to you, I'm wasting it."
Movie was really about Knish
Aaaaaaaaaah no. But he did play an important role in the script. People have to realize as enticing films are, they are just visual novels. In the script he plays an experienced rounder who attempts to show Mike the in's and out's of that world, and also how it can bring you to your knee's in a second. He is the father figure, voice of reason so to speak trying to actually stir Mike away from the life bc of his own experiences as a grinder, like a potential cautionary tale. Movie is about Mike. He is the protagonist and Kinish is just another character like worm or Gramma. A story has to have layers/other characters like a novel, and he plays that role. If you meant movie was really about Knish meaning some sort of metaphor, you could make that point using basically any other character. Jo his woman is trying to keep him away from the life.. Worm is trying to fight that and get him back into the life.. Knish is the voice, but enabling guy trying to be used as an example of how hard it is.. Gramma is the potential consequences. And the Professor is the character of an example of making a choice in life like risk or reward. Going for what you believe in but it comes w consequences, yet the risk has fulfillment. How movie was about Knish I would love to hear.
bmillerdrums cool dude
He is always the absolute best supporting actor.
Best cast ever.
reminds me of some of the stock market investors today - some play for the high score, some play for the long run. We will see who lasts..
It's like he shapened up after Color of Money.
Such a true scene . A poker player not a gambler
Knish has stones..:
Never make a deal with the Phantom.
Great scene. Always considered John Turturro a great actor.