Great set of videos - Clear, easy to understand and with no fluff. Thanks. Only recently started matched betting so I'm glad I found your videos. 100th subscriber :-)
Clear explanation. 3 questions please: Has Rule 4 ever caused you a problem when covering the field? Assume you don't place any bets until Best odds guaranteed times have kicked-in? Have you ever been caught out with bookies changing the number of places they are paying during the day (if there have been non-runners). Cheers!
Cheers, thanks for watching! With rule 4 there is normally a reduction on the bookmaker's website, along with this the exchange also does the same thing and they generally even out. As for BOG it's always a good idea to wait until it becomes available for the extra profit! Bookmakers generally allow a certain amount of horses to drop out of the race before they can pull an extra place, with large fields this generally isn't a huge concern as lots of them would have to withdraw for this to occur. There is a guide on oddsmonkey in the training section which goes into all these questions in more detail :)
Yep it's recommended to split up your bets across different accounts and bookmakers to reduce the exposure on individual accounts. Thanks for watching Steve glad my content helps you out!
Would you back and lay a couple of hours before the featured race, or more closer to the race, odds usually be going all over the place close to the start of the race.
Hi there, With this strategy its best to start early in the morning (after 10am usually) it generally can take a few hourse to cover all the positions taking the best quality matches possible.
Great video my man. Just one question...if you're backing the entire field with Bet365 for example on one race won't that lead to a gubbing very quickly?
Hi Lee, Yep its likely that they would, it's best to split your bets across various bookie accounts to mitigate your chances of getting stake restrictions.
Hi there, No I wouldn’t recommend getting on the whole field with just one bet365 account, this would significantly increase your chance of being gubbed with bet365. And your right, combining liability is done in the background in milliseconds so you don’t need to worry about working it out yourself. Cheers, Liam
So do you need to have a number of bet365 accounts to make this work, or can you cover the field using different bookies? I only have 1 of each bookie, no multiple accounts.
Thanks Jaz, It's totally up to you and what stakes that you feel comfortable using. My reconnection would be to start off small and gradually build up as your confidence increases :)
My apologies - I disliked this in error - when in fact I really enjoyed it and your manner makes you feel it’s a one on one - I also like that you talk to us rather than at us - because of this I have now subscribed
Thanks. Some good info. Just getting started myself. One thing though. Surely if you cover the whole field, there is no way that the accumalative QL will be smaller than the lowest profitable horse. Take your example of River Nymph for instance. The total QL will always be more than the profit you get from that horse (regardless of manipulating stakes). Am I missing something. Also, on a race with 20 odd horses like this one, how many horses can you do per bookie? Finally, I noticed that you arbed a few horses. Surely that's not a good move? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Hi Eddie, good to hear your just getting started! This strategy of covering the whole field and making sure that your smallest potential EP profit is larger than the total accumulative QL is possible, but only on certain races where the bookie is paying out 1/4 odds on the place and there are lots of high match ratings highlighted in green throughout the day on the extra place matcher. Most of the horses you will be able to get on for really good matches throughout the day, just be sure to continue to refresh the EP matcher every 15/20 mins and new opportunity’s will continue to pop up for you. As you pointed out, there will be a very small section of horses, in some cases, which never have a good odds match on them, with this you can either get on them for a smaller extra place profit and if that horse was the land within the extra place you will be take a small QL overall (not ideal, but still positive EV in the long run). Alternatively, you could use any free bets that you have on the few horses which don’t have an odds match opportunity, or, lay the place in a higher place market and take a place arb for a guaranteed profit on that runner. It isn’t ideal but as you gain experience doing this you will find there are really easy ways around the issue to make sure you lock in a guaranteed profit. As for the amount of horses to get on per bookmaker, the general rule of thumb is to get on as many horses as the place payout from the bookmaker. For example, if they are paying out 5 places, 5 horses is the max you would be looking to get on. And finally, for taking arbs, small arbs slightly over 100% matches are fine, however avoid arbs that are to to high as they can come from bookmakers pricing their odds incorrectly. Hope this helps, Cheers Liam
@@ProfitPineapple thank you very much mate. Very helpful. Have you ever thought about doing a live stream one Saturday showing us the process for real? Or just record the process and upload later? I think it would be helpful. Thanks again for your swift reply and info. Much appreciated. Stay blessed. 😉
@@PST101 not a problem pal, at some point in the future I will be looking to start live streaming to help people get started with stuff like this, keep on the lookout 👍 Cheers Eddie
I’ve had quite a few people say that recently! I hadn’t noticed it until people started to point it out, but yeah, I can’t definitely hear a resemblance myself! 😂
Hi Peter, good question. This all depends on factors such as how much your looking to profit from the race and what size bankroll you are using. Generally horses with short back odds will require a larger e/w back stake with the bookmaker to ramp up the extra place profit. Horses with much greater back odds can be used with smaller stakes as larger profits can still be attained should they land within the extra place.
Cheers Ian, appreciate it👍 The big race is of course the national which is on Saturday around 5pm. Hopefully there will be lots of opportunity there for us to all smash is some big profits!
@@ProfitPineapple was going to say, I've got all my money ready here for aintree, but the ratings are terrible, are you expecting anything worth your time today? And Saturday, is it just one race that's attractive? Or a cluster like Cheltenham? Thanks in advance
Hi there, Absolutely, if not much more dependant on which horse landed in the extra place. At big festivals like the upcoming grand national, there are lots of races which are all applicable for using this strategy on so there’s a massive opportunity for 1k + profits even on a smaller bank! Cheers, Liam
good video thanks, however surely you cant get away with placing so many back bets on different horses with the same bookmaker?? also what happens if there is a dead heat(as rare as they are)
Thanks, appreciate the kind words. No, I certainly wouldn't recommend betting on every horse with one account, make use out of as many bookie accounts you have available when using this strategy! And with dead heats I'm not 100% sure, I know there is a guide on OddsMonkey which goes into detail regarding this, I expect there would be a shared profit on the horse that landed within the extra place. Cheers, Liam
Hi there, yes you can manipulate your e/w back stake with the bookmaker to do this. The higher the rating on the extra place matcher the smaller the QL will work out at in relation to the extra place profit. This works really well on horses with high ratings and large back odds.
The place lay markets are just now becoming available on the exchanges so from this point until the start of the races you will be able to get on extra places. Personally, I would wait until tomorrow a few hours before each race when there are better matches and more liquidity. Cheers, Liam
When covering the field each horse would need to be covered to lock in a guaranteed profit. There are derivatives of this strategy which involve getting on one or two runners, these forms of targeting the EP generally rely on a long-term expectancy as opposed to taking a guaranteed profit there and then, however they require much less work. I have videos on my channel if you want to check them out!
Will the bookie not suss out what your doing very, very quickly if you are backing all the horses in a race with them i.e. 365 and stop you dead in your tracks post haste?
Hi Gary, You will certainly have to be much more subtle than the example shown in this video or it's likely you will be sussed out pretty quickly. Getting on no more than the number of horses paid in places is recommended for each account bookie account you use with this strategy
Im confused about how you wil end up making profit if that particular horse in your example, with the £81 profit ends up in the extra place? The combined ql after covering the field will surely be higher than that? Did i misunderstand something?
Good question, there is a spreadsheet on OddsMonkey like you said for covering extra places but that is for dutching the field, which is also another method you can use to lock in a profit! I will make a video in future going over all the different strategies that are available with extra places. Cheers, Liam
@@ProfitPineapple no worries mate. I see it as the same strategy, as you are still going for extra places, but it means you are guaranteed to win something rather than relying on luck to hit the extra place.
@@alanhaynes9672 Yeah they are very similar to be fair. If you cover the whole field using the way I showed in this video, you will guarantee a profit as every horse is covered and therefore one of them has to land in the EP. It's all about keeping your total accumulative QL smaller than your smallest extra place profit that you can take when using this method.
Hi Andy, The rule of thumb is to place as many each way bets as the bookmaker is paying out in places. For example, if a bookie is paying out 5 places the max you would want to be getting on with that bookmaker would be 5 horses.
No I certainly wouldn’t recommend getting on every single horse with bet365, that wouldn’t be great for account health! You can definitely get on a good few horses with them but I would recommend making use out of other bookmaker accounts that you have to cover the field fully
Hi mate Imp odds and rating work in tandem with each other based on how the EP matcher calculation works. I’ve done a video on RUclips about imp odds which goes into this in more detail. If you’re using the imp odds metric, high imp odds are of course what you are looking to get on. When the imp odds are high so too is the match rating, and when the imp odds are low the match rating is also low. I find it easier just to look at match rating as they both bounce off each other and are both being influenced by the size of the QL.
I'm looking to open up a social media platform in the near future for all us Matched Bettors to ask any questions and help each other lock in as much profit as possible from Matched Betting using all the different offers that we have available. Il keep you posted on this. Cheers, Liam
Impressed with how you explained this especially combined liability
Thanks Johnathan,
I try break things down to be as simple as possible for people to understand.
Glad you enjoyed.
It looks like shared liability is automatic as long as you use the same exchange. Is that right?
Great set of videos - Clear, easy to understand and with no fluff. Thanks. Only recently started matched betting so I'm glad I found your videos. 100th subscriber :-)
Thank you Jeff, appreciate the kind words.
As you have only just started you still have so much profit on offer for you to make from matched betting.
@@ProfitPineapple Yes, still a few more Welcome Offers (and then reloads) to do.
@@jeffturnbullphotography That's good, I remember the welcome offers from when I first started matched betting, lots of nice easy profit available!
If you close your eyes... its Tyson Fury! Lol. Great video pal.
Haha!
Lots of people have been saying that!
Thanks for watching mate, much appreciated
Such a good video, you explained it so well. Thanks!!
Thanks Lizze!
Clear explanation. 3 questions please: Has Rule 4 ever caused you a problem when covering the field? Assume you don't place any bets until Best odds guaranteed times have kicked-in? Have you ever been caught out with bookies changing the number of places they are paying during the day (if there have been non-runners). Cheers!
Cheers, thanks for watching!
With rule 4 there is normally a reduction on the bookmaker's website, along with this the exchange also does the same thing and they generally even out. As for BOG it's always a good idea to wait until it becomes available for the extra profit!
Bookmakers generally allow a certain amount of horses to drop out of the race before they can pull an extra place, with large fields this generally isn't a huge concern as lots of them would have to withdraw for this to occur.
There is a guide on oddsmonkey in the training section which goes into all these questions in more detail :)
if you cover the whole field on one bookie, say bet365 aren't you going to get stake restricted right away after 1 bet of field coverage??
Great video Liam. All your stuff is helping tremendously. Would you use one bookie for all horses? (wouldn't that raise a flag with them?)
Yep it's recommended to split up your bets across different accounts and bookmakers to reduce the exposure on individual accounts. Thanks for watching Steve glad my content helps you out!
Just started with oddsmonkey, you are my go to mentor!
Thank you 👍
wont bet365 think it's fishy to back all the field though or do you back across different brokers?
Thanks so much for long this. Liked and subscribed!
Not a problem! Thanks for the sub, much appreciated!
Would you back and lay a couple of hours before the featured race, or more closer to the race, odds usually be going all over the place close to the start of the race.
Hi there,
With this strategy its best to start early in the morning (after 10am usually) it generally can take a few hourse to cover all the positions taking the best quality matches possible.
EXCELLENT Content Liam
Hi Liam. Do you use the same bet365 account for EP and 2ups? Great videos bytheway thank you for sharing your knowledge with us ✌
Good content btw mate
Cheers pal, appreciate it👍
Great video my man. Just one question...if you're backing the entire field with Bet365 for example on one race won't that lead to a gubbing very quickly?
Hi Lee,
Yep its likely that they would, it's best to split your bets across various bookie accounts to mitigate your chances of getting stake restrictions.
Do you need more than one account to do this?
This may be s silly question but how do you know which is the featured race?
Another great video. I’m fairly new to this. I’ve doubled my money so far, but I’ve also made some stupid mistakes. I’ll get the hang of it though.
If the longest shot wins and you end up with 5k in your betting account, how do you go about getting that back out without upsetting the bookie?
There is not a great deal you can do in that situation Barry, only take it out and hope the account lives to see another day!
Thanks for the Vid. Do you cover the whole field with just one 365 account ? is the combined liability done automatically from the exchange ?
Hi there,
No I wouldn’t recommend getting on the whole field with just one bet365 account, this would significantly increase your chance of being gubbed with bet365.
And your right, combining liability is done in the background in milliseconds so you don’t need to worry about working it out yourself.
Cheers,
Liam
So do you need to have a number of bet365 accounts to make this work, or can you cover the field using different bookies? I only have 1 of each bookie, no multiple accounts.
Probably a stupid question, but to clarify, you back every horse in the race in simple terms?
Great video Liam. Just starting out so what do you think the minimum E/W stake should be for beginners like myself.
Thanks Jaz,
It's totally up to you and what stakes that you feel comfortable using. My reconnection would be to start off small and gradually build up as your confidence increases :)
My apologies - I disliked this in error - when in fact I really enjoyed it and your manner makes you feel it’s a one on one - I also like that you talk to us rather than at us - because of this I have now subscribed
Not a problem, you are free to switch to a like if you wish :)
Thanks for subscribing!
Thanks. Some good info. Just getting started myself. One thing though. Surely if you cover the whole field, there is no way that the accumalative QL will be smaller than the lowest profitable horse. Take your example of River Nymph for instance. The total QL will always be more than the profit you get from that horse (regardless of manipulating stakes). Am I missing something. Also, on a race with 20 odd horses like this one, how many horses can you do per bookie? Finally, I noticed that you arbed a few horses. Surely that's not a good move? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Hi Eddie, good to hear your just getting started!
This strategy of covering the whole field and making sure that your smallest potential EP profit is larger than the total accumulative QL is possible, but only on certain races where the bookie is paying out 1/4 odds on the place and there are lots of high match ratings highlighted in green throughout the day on the extra place matcher.
Most of the horses you will be able to get on for really good matches throughout the day, just be sure to continue to refresh the EP matcher every 15/20 mins and new opportunity’s will continue to pop up for you.
As you pointed out, there will be a very small section of horses, in some cases, which never have a good odds match on them, with this you can either get on them for a smaller extra place profit and if that horse was the land within the extra place you will be take a small QL overall (not ideal, but still positive EV in the long run).
Alternatively, you could use any free bets that you have on the few horses which don’t have an odds match opportunity, or, lay the place in a higher place market and take a place arb for a guaranteed profit on that runner.
It isn’t ideal but as you gain experience doing this you will find there are really easy ways around the issue to make sure you lock in a guaranteed profit.
As for the amount of horses to get on per bookmaker, the general rule of thumb is to get on as many horses as the place payout from the bookmaker.
For example, if they are paying out 5 places, 5 horses is the max you would be looking to get on.
And finally, for taking arbs, small arbs slightly over 100% matches are fine, however avoid arbs that are to to high as they can come from bookmakers pricing their odds incorrectly.
Hope this helps,
Cheers Liam
@@ProfitPineapple thank you very much mate. Very helpful. Have you ever thought about doing a live stream one Saturday showing us the process for real? Or just record the process and upload later? I think it would be helpful. Thanks again for your swift reply and info. Much appreciated. Stay blessed. 😉
@@PST101 not a problem pal, at some point in the future I will be looking to start live streaming to help people get started with stuff like this, keep on the lookout 👍
Cheers Eddie
If I close my eyes it’s Tyson Fury
I’ve had quite a few people say that recently! I hadn’t noticed it until people started to point it out, but yeah, I can’t definitely hear a resemblance myself! 😂
How much would you reccomend staking on each horse. £10 ew or £20 ew?
Hi Peter, good question.
This all depends on factors such as how much your looking to profit from the race and what size bankroll you are using.
Generally horses with short back odds will require a larger e/w back stake with the bookmaker to ramp up the extra place profit.
Horses with much greater back odds can be used with smaller stakes as larger profits can still be attained should they land within the extra place.
Class as usual.. does the main events start tommorow?
Cheers Ian, appreciate it👍
The big race is of course the national which is on Saturday around 5pm.
Hopefully there will be lots of opportunity there for us to all smash is some big profits!
@@ProfitPineapple was going to say, I've got all my money ready here for aintree, but the ratings are terrible, are you expecting anything worth your time today? And Saturday, is it just one race that's attractive? Or a cluster like Cheltenham? Thanks in advance
Hi there
So with your bankroll could you quite easily make £1K profit per Saturday on the EP horse races?
Hi there,
Absolutely, if not much more dependant on which horse landed in the extra place.
At big festivals like the upcoming grand national, there are lots of races which are all applicable for using this strategy
on so there’s a massive opportunity for 1k + profits even on a smaller bank!
Cheers,
Liam
good video thanks, however surely you cant get away with placing so many back bets on different horses with the same bookmaker?? also what happens if there is a dead heat(as rare as they are)
This is exactly my question
Must be just laying as many as the place on each account
Thanks, appreciate the kind words. No, I certainly wouldn't recommend betting on every horse with one account, make use out of as many bookie accounts you have available when using this strategy!
And with dead heats I'm not 100% sure, I know there is a guide on OddsMonkey which goes into detail regarding this, I expect there would be a shared profit on the horse that landed within the extra place.
Cheers,
Liam
This still profitable?
How do you keep the QLs small? Do you just tweak the stake to get it?
Hi there,
yes you can manipulate your e/w back stake with the bookmaker to do this.
The higher the rating on the extra place matcher the smaller the QL will work out at in relation to the extra place profit.
This works really well on horses with high ratings and large back odds.
When can you start betting on aintree? Is it 10 am on the day when it changes to post market? Thanks :)
The place lay markets are just now becoming available on the exchanges so from this point until the start of the races you will be able to get on extra places.
Personally, I would wait until tomorrow a few hours before each race when there are better matches and more liquidity.
Cheers,
Liam
hi , Im a beginner and I wonder how many horses do I have to bet on each race.
thank you
When covering the field each horse would need to be covered to lock in a guaranteed profit. There are derivatives of this strategy which involve getting on one or two runners, these forms of targeting the EP generally rely on a long-term expectancy as opposed to taking a guaranteed profit there and then, however they require much less work. I have videos on my channel if you want to check them out!
You’ll need a massive bankroll for this lol
Will the bookie not suss out what your doing very, very quickly if you are backing all the horses in a race with them i.e. 365 and stop you dead in your tracks post haste?
Hi Gary,
You will certainly have to be much more subtle than the example shown in this video or it's likely you will be sussed out pretty quickly.
Getting on no more than the number of horses paid in places is recommended for each account bookie account you use with this strategy
Im confused about how you wil end up making profit if that particular horse in your example, with the £81 profit ends up in the extra place? The combined ql after covering the field will surely be higher than that? Did i misunderstand something?
Sometimes you may need to get on a few horses twice with different bookies when the odds become a little more favourable
Why dont you just use a spreadsheet? There's one on Oddsmonkey ready made and its way quicker than doing it this way
Good question, there is a spreadsheet on OddsMonkey like you said for covering extra places but that is for dutching the field, which is also another method you can use to lock in a profit!
I will make a video in future going over all the different strategies that are available with extra places.
Cheers,
Liam
@@ProfitPineapple no worries mate. I see it as the same strategy, as you are still going for extra places, but it means you are guaranteed to win something rather than relying on luck to hit the extra place.
@@alanhaynes9672 Yeah they are very similar to be fair.
If you cover the whole field using the way I showed in this video, you will guarantee a profit as every horse is covered and therefore one of them has to land in the EP.
It's all about keeping your total accumulative QL smaller than your smallest extra place profit that you can take when using this method.
@@ProfitPineapple very true 👍
Are you not going to get gubbed doing this?
How many horses would you recommend to place with each bookie? 2 or 3 ?
Hi Andy,
The rule of thumb is to place as many each way bets as the bookmaker is paying out in places.
For example, if a bookie is paying out 5 places the max you would want to be getting on with that bookmaker would be 5 horses.
You don't use Bet365 for the whole field do you? Surely that'll get you gubbed
No I certainly wouldn’t recommend getting on every single horse with bet365, that wouldn’t be great for account health!
You can definitely get on a good few horses with them but I would recommend making use out of other bookmaker accounts that you have to cover the field fully
@@ProfitPineapple Thanks for that. Great vid and will give it a go.
@@ednaplate appreciate the kind words, glad you enjoyed 😀
Reev this you?
Why are you concentrating on rating rather than implied odds? That makes no sense
Hi mate
Imp odds and rating work in tandem with each other based on how the EP matcher calculation works.
I’ve done a video on RUclips about imp odds which goes into this in more detail.
If you’re using the imp odds metric, high imp odds are of course what you are looking to get on.
When the imp odds are high so too is the match rating, and when the imp odds are low the match rating is also low.
I find it easier just to look at match rating as they both bounce off each other and are both being influenced by the size of the QL.
Bingo LIAM
Liam , do you have FB or Instagram ?
I'm looking to open up a social media platform in the near future for all us Matched Bettors to ask any questions and help each other lock in as much profit as possible from Matched Betting using all the different offers that we have available. Il keep you posted on this.
Cheers,
Liam