Looks like a lot of events that lead to the difficulties. It seems there could have been rain around that day so wet rails. It's the B1 so large driving wheels which I'm sure even on a dry day can be challenging to get going, starting on the gradient, has to go over a couple of sets of points. not to mention Pullmans are usually fairly heavy trains to pull. I was surprised to see the safety valves weren't lifting, fireman did well keeping it under control.
Yeah, did look like a combination of factors. Someone said that it was one of the coaches, it had a sticking brake, which along with the damp rails, and the fact she was going backwards meant very little adhesion.
It is often tricky starting a heavy train off that platform up hill across a point into a wet tunnel with a tight radius through the yard I've seen a few loose their feet from the start Repton comes to mind with her 440 wheel arrangement when I was a working member their in the 90's happened a couple of times whilst I was on duty especially on a first turn up the bank .
I wanted to know why don’t dig a tunnel and do an extension for the main line Train so they extend the new abandoned underground stations. Why couldn’t they use the part D78 Stock train doors on the sides and also restructure the front face of the A60 and A62 stock that includes the class 313, class 314 and class 315 remix and make them all together and also redesign them an overhead line and also make them into six cars per units and also having three Accessible Toilets on that six cars per units A60 and A62 stock trains and also convert the A60 and A62 stock trains into a Scania N112, Volvo TD102KF, Volvo B10M, Gardner 6LXC, Gardner 6LXB and Gardner 8LXB Diesel Engines and also put the Loud 7-Speed Voith Gearboxes even Loud 8-Speed Leyland Hydra cyclic Gearboxes in the A60 and A62 stock, class 313, class 314, and class 315 and also modernise the A60 and A62 stock and make it into an 11 car per unit so it could have fewer doors, more tables, computers and mobile phone chargers? A Stock Train and also having 8 DisaAccessiblelets on those A stock trains. why couldn’t we refurbish and modernise the waterloo and city line Triple-Track train tunnel and make it bigger and extend it to bank station, making it into a Triple-Track Railway Line so those 4 European countries such as Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden to convert the waterloo and city line Triple-Track Train tunnel into a High-Speed train? The Third Euro tunnel Triple-Track Train line to make it 11 times better for passengers so they could go from A to B. then put the modernised 11 car per unit A Stock and put them on a bigger modernised waterloo and city line Triple-Track train tunnel so it could go to bank station to those 4 European countries such as Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden. The modernised refurbished 11 cars per unit A stock could be a High Speed The Third Triple-Track Euro Tunnel Train So it is promising and 37 times a lot more possible to do this kind of project that is OK for London Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden. Oh by the way, could they also tunnel the Triple-Track Railway Line so it will stop from Buckinghamshire, Hertfordshire and Essex so that the Passengers will go to Germany, Italy, Poland and Sweden and also extend the Triple-Track Railway Line from Bank to Buckinghamshire, Hertfordshire and Essex Stations so that more people from there could go to Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden Easily. Why couldn't they extend the Piccadilly line and also build a brand-new underground train station so it could go even further right up to Clapton, Wood Street and also make another brand new tunnel train station in Chingford and could they extend the DLR? All of the classes 150, 155, 154, 117, 114, 105, and 106, will be replaced by all of the Scania N112, Volvo TD102KF, Volvo B10M, Gardner 6LXB, Gardner 6LXC and Gardner 8LXB Diesel Six carriages three disabled toilets are air conditioning trains including Highams Park for extended roots which is the Piccadilly line and the DLR trains. Could you also convert all of the 1973 stock trains into an air-conditioned maximum speed 78 km/hours (48 MPH) re-refurbished and make it into a 8 cars per unit if that will be alright, and also extend all of the Piccadilly train stations to make more space for all of the extended 8 car per unit 1973 stock air condition trains and can you also build another Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive Companies and they can order Every 17 Octagon and Hexagon shape LNER diagram unique minor no.13 and unique small no.11 Boilers from those Countries such as Greece, Italy, Poland, and Sweden, can they make Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive speeds by up to 117MPH so you can try and test it on the Original Mainline so it will be much more safer for the Passengers to enjoy the 117MPH speed Limit only for HS2 and Channel Tunnel mainline services, if they needed 16 Carriages Per units can they use those class 55’s, class 44’s, class 40’s and class 43HST Diesel Locomotive’s right at the Back of those 16 Carriages Per Units so they can take over at the Back to let those Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive’s have a rest for those interesting Journeys Please!!!, oh can you make all of those Coal Boxes’s 16 Tonnes for all of the 117MPH Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive’s so the Companies will Understand us PASSENGER’S!! so please make sure that the Builders can do as they are Told!! And please do something about these very important Professional ideas Please Prime Minister of England, Prime Minister of Sweden, Prime Minister of Germany, Prime Minister of Italy, Prime Minister of Poland and that Includes the Mayor of London.
Bet the fireman was miffed his fire went out the chimney. 😂 Spectacular capture, though I do feel a bit sorry for crews when this happens and they have an audience, especially going past the MPD who'll likely be judging on their handling of the loco
Well you do see someone taking over the driving at the depot, so don't know if it was a trainee or what, but i don't think they got along with the loco
Yeah i was having a chat with him before i started filming. I think he was meaning that he had slipped to a standstill. Though i am no locomotive driver or expert so i couldn't tell you if it is possible or not
@@DSSteamVideos Surely that alone wouldn't have caused all that slipping, would it? I had guessed there was an issue, but i was more guessing oil/grease on rails
I saw a reverse sander on the center driver, how about the rear drivers? The stuck brake would explain it. Trains are only workable because steel wheels on steel rails rolls so freely, but it doesn't take much to dramatically raise rolling resistance. Many US locomotives used in the mountains had rail washers behind the rear drivers, to eliminate the drag of the car wheels crunching on the sand.
I am pretty sure that they only sand the driving axle (usually the middle wheel) although i could be very much mistaken. I would guess that's why a lot of 4-6-0 and 4-6-2 had trouble with wheel slip ( A1-A4's come to mind, along with Bulleid pacifics-though that was due in part to oil). I didn't thnk that a sticking brake would cause such drastic wheelslip, however there is the fact that you are trying to put down all that power through massive wheels.
My grandad who was a steam loco driver would have had a fit seeing that. Probably the same driver who stalled Repton coming out of platform 3. Lots of steam and slip, stalled just over the crossing.
As far as i am aware, the B1's have sanders for forwards and backwards, though i could be wrong. As for the brakes, i am sure that the stock is vaccum braked.
If i remember rightly, this was the afternoon pullman, so would've been the 3rd or 4th train that day, they had been running for a couple of days at least prior to this
Given he had a bit of difficulty even starting off. I would have thought there was a brake binding slightly. Needed the cords pulled - which is what they did at the shed but any driver should have realised that to start with.
At the time i thought it was an inexperienced driver, on top of damp/greasy rails. At least they managed to sort it at the depot though, but heard it slipping now and again on the way up to Goathland, though that may have been because they were trying to make up time.
From what i remember she didn't damage the track. However i do remember a rail tour a few years ago that involved a slipping locomotive, that left a whole lot of divots in the track, looked a right mess. Seen it with a couple of diesels too
@@Daniel-go4ux I do remember watching a video for of a locomotive pulling out tender first much like here. It started to slip and it looks like the regulator was forcefully thrown fully open on the engineer as it was... Well best to describe it was explosive wheel slip. It was green though so I don't think it was a Duchess. I don't know too much though as I'm more akin to American locomotives. If my profile pic wasn't a hint at that.
@@FRailFan Sounds like you are referring to 'Blue Peter' though i could be wrong. She certainly had catastrophic wheelslip, ended her running for a while. I was remembering a different one than that. Thought that looked American.
If it was getting a 'helping hand' from another loco, then yes, there would most likely be one on the rear, but for just 1 loco it really should be in front of the train. On this section of track the loco is usually facing the 'proper' way round, making it much easier to get up the gradient
The locomotive's smokebox would usually be facing towards Pickering because the harshest gradient is between Grosmont & Goathland Summit: 1 in 49. Maybe the weather had been damp as well? That sort of a struggle to get moving with such an important service..... I can imagine the comments when they got back after that turn.... The B1 was not an express passenger locomotive. More like a mixed traffic type.
I did not detect the sanders being utilised which would have helped a lot. Perhaps that system is too much bother on a heritage line. A lot of huffing and puffing but little progress, just like Boris Johnson!
I didn't either, though i am sure that they would use them to save 'stalling' on the 1in49. Not sure about whether they bother or not, not exactly a demanding system for sanding though
@@DSSteamVideos I'm intrigued as to how the dragging brakes were sorted as he doesn't seem to stop between his final bout of slipping, and finally getting away up the hill?
Excellent clip, very enjoyable. Cheers.
Looks like a lot of events that lead to the difficulties. It seems there could have been rain around that day so wet rails. It's the B1 so large driving wheels which I'm sure even on a dry day can be challenging to get going, starting on the gradient, has to go over a couple of sets of points. not to mention Pullmans are usually fairly heavy trains to pull.
I was surprised to see the safety valves weren't lifting, fireman did well keeping it under control.
Yeah, did look like a combination of factors. Someone said that it was one of the coaches, it had a sticking brake, which along with the damp rails, and the fact she was going backwards meant very little adhesion.
It is often tricky starting a heavy train off that platform up hill across a point into a wet tunnel with a tight radius through the yard I've seen a few loose their feet from the start Repton comes to mind with her 440 wheel arrangement when I was a working member their in the 90's happened a couple of times whilst I was on duty especially on a first turn up the bank .
A
Great video. Thanks for posting
I wanted to know why don’t dig a tunnel and do an extension for the main line Train so they extend the new abandoned underground stations.
Why couldn’t they use the part D78 Stock train doors on the sides and also restructure the front face of the A60 and A62 stock that includes the class 313, class 314 and class 315 remix and make them all together and also redesign them an overhead line and also make them into six cars per units and also having three Accessible Toilets on that six cars per units A60 and A62 stock trains and also convert the A60 and A62 stock trains into a Scania N112, Volvo TD102KF, Volvo B10M, Gardner 6LXC, Gardner 6LXB and Gardner 8LXB Diesel Engines and also put the Loud 7-Speed Voith Gearboxes even Loud 8-Speed Leyland Hydra cyclic Gearboxes in the A60 and A62 stock, class 313, class 314, and class 315 and also modernise the A60 and A62 stock and make it into an 11 car per unit so it could have fewer doors, more tables, computers and mobile phone chargers?
A Stock Train and also having 8 DisaAccessiblelets on those A stock trains. why couldn’t we refurbish and modernise the waterloo and city line Triple-Track train tunnel and make it bigger and extend it to bank station, making it into a Triple-Track Railway Line so those 4 European countries such as Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden to convert the waterloo and city line Triple-Track Train tunnel into a High-Speed train?
The Third Euro tunnel Triple-Track Train line to make it 11 times better for passengers so they could go from A to B. then put the modernised 11 car per unit A Stock and put them on a bigger modernised waterloo and city line Triple-Track train tunnel so it could go to bank station to those 4 European countries such as Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden. The modernised refurbished 11 cars per unit A stock could be a High Speed The Third Triple-Track Euro Tunnel Train So it is promising and 37 times a lot more possible to do this kind of project that is OK for London Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden. Oh by the way, could they also tunnel the Triple-Track Railway Line so it will stop from Buckinghamshire, Hertfordshire and Essex so that the Passengers will go to Germany, Italy, Poland and Sweden and also extend the Triple-Track Railway Line from Bank to Buckinghamshire, Hertfordshire and Essex Stations so that more people from there could go to Germany, Italy, Poland And Sweden Easily.
Why couldn't they extend the Piccadilly line and also build a brand-new underground train station so it could go even further right up to Clapton, Wood Street and also make another brand new tunnel train station in Chingford and could they extend the DLR?
All of the classes 150, 155, 154, 117, 114, 105, and 106, will be replaced by all of the Scania N112, Volvo TD102KF, Volvo B10M, Gardner 6LXB, Gardner 6LXC and Gardner 8LXB Diesel Six carriages three disabled toilets are air conditioning trains including Highams Park for extended roots which is the Piccadilly line and the DLR trains.
Could you also convert all of the 1973 stock trains into an air-conditioned maximum speed 78 km/hours (48 MPH) re-refurbished and make it into a 8 cars per unit if that will be alright, and also extend all of the Piccadilly train stations to make more space for all of the extended 8 car per unit 1973 stock air condition trains and can you also build another Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive Companies and they can order Every 17 Octagon and Hexagon shape LNER diagram unique minor no.13 and unique small no.11 Boilers from those Countries such as Greece, Italy, Poland, and Sweden, can they make Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive speeds by up to 117MPH so you can try and test it on the Original Mainline so it will be much more safer for the Passengers to enjoy the 117MPH speed Limit only for HS2 and Channel Tunnel mainline services, if they needed 16 Carriages Per units can they use those class 55’s, class 44’s, class 40’s and class 43HST Diesel Locomotive’s right at the Back of those 16 Carriages Per Units so they can take over at the Back to let those Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive’s have a rest for those interesting Journeys Please!!!, oh can you make all of those Coal Boxes’s 16 Tonnes for all of the 117MPH Mayflower and Tornado Steam Locomotive’s so the Companies will Understand us PASSENGER’S!! so please make sure that the Builders can do as they are Told!! And please do something about these very important Professional ideas Please Prime Minister of England, Prime Minister of Sweden, Prime Minister of Germany, Prime Minister of Italy, Prime Minister of Poland and that Includes the Mayor of London.
I think you should run for prime minister of somewhere
That was painful.
Bet the fireman was miffed his fire went out the chimney. 😂
Spectacular capture, though I do feel a bit sorry for crews when this happens and they have an audience, especially going past the MPD who'll likely be judging on their handling of the loco
Well you do see someone taking over the driving at the depot, so don't know if it was a trainee or what, but i don't think they got along with the loco
I heard a spectator suggest the driver has stalled it.with I thought was quite funny,you cannot stall a steam loco
Yeah i was having a chat with him before i started filming. I think he was meaning that he had slipped to a standstill. Though i am no locomotive driver or expert so i couldn't tell you if it is possible or not
Stalling is the usual term. It's not like stalling a car, rather refers to when you just can't get going without a slip.
@@DSSteamVideos Surely that alone wouldn't have caused all that slipping, would it? I had guessed there was an issue, but i was more guessing oil/grease on rails
I saw a reverse sander on the center driver, how about the rear drivers?
The stuck brake would explain it. Trains are only workable because steel wheels on steel rails rolls so freely, but it doesn't take much to dramatically raise rolling resistance. Many US locomotives used in the mountains had rail washers behind the rear drivers, to eliminate the drag of the car wheels crunching on the sand.
I am pretty sure that they only sand the driving axle (usually the middle wheel) although i could be very much mistaken. I would guess that's why a lot of 4-6-0 and 4-6-2 had trouble with wheel slip ( A1-A4's come to mind, along with Bulleid pacifics-though that was due in part to oil). I didn't thnk that a sticking brake would cause such drastic wheelslip, however there is the fact that you are trying to put down all that power through massive wheels.
Fantastic footage indeed enjoyed
Great clip! Brill!
Take the handbrake off Gromit!
My grandad who was a steam loco driver would have had a fit seeing that. Probably the same driver who stalled Repton coming out of platform 3. Lots of steam and slip, stalled just over the crossing.
Just as I d expect, an express engine pulling Pullman coaches in reverse , most undignified !!!🙄😄
Looks like 61264 is really struggling to get grip
Does the B1 have sander's for reversing? Was this train vaccum or Westinghouse? Nice footage.
As far as i am aware, the B1's have sanders for forwards and backwards, though i could be wrong. As for the brakes, i am sure that the stock is vaccum braked.
Was this the first train to operate that day? Or the first train for several weeks?
If i remember rightly, this was the afternoon pullman, so would've been the 3rd or 4th train that day, they had been running for a couple of days at least prior to this
Given he had a bit of difficulty even starting off. I would have thought there was a brake binding slightly. Needed the cords pulled - which is what they did at the shed but any driver should have realised that to start with.
At the time i thought it was an inexperienced driver, on top of damp/greasy rails. At least they managed to sort it at the depot though, but heard it slipping now and again on the way up to Goathland, though that may have been because they were trying to make up time.
Well rail maintenance crew won't be too happy about that. Wheel slipping especially from steam locomotives can cause access wear.
From what i remember she didn't damage the track. However i do remember a rail tour a few years ago that involved a slipping locomotive, that left a whole lot of divots in the track, looked a right mess. Seen it with a couple of diesels too
@@Daniel-go4ux Yeah wasn't there a video for that on RUclips?
@@FRailFan I am not sure, there probably was/is. If my memory is correct, i believe it was a Duchess?
@@Daniel-go4ux I do remember watching a video for of a locomotive pulling out tender first much like here. It started to slip and it looks like the regulator was forcefully thrown fully open on the engineer as it was... Well best to describe it was explosive wheel slip. It was green though so I don't think it was a Duchess. I don't know too much though as I'm more akin to American locomotives. If my profile pic wasn't a hint at that.
@@FRailFan Sounds like you are referring to 'Blue Peter' though i could be wrong. She certainly had catastrophic wheelslip, ended her running for a while. I was remembering a different one than that. Thought that looked American.
Doesn’t appear to be being fired correctly
Maybe first day on the. Job😮
When was this
Pretty sure this was back in March 2019, as i was there for 60009's visit
Daniel4468 it was Battle of Britain’s Class City of Wells that was visiting because 60009 was unavailable
So it was....this damn memory :( That is why i have the vid of the 'volcano' on the climb to goathland...
I hope she got up the 1 in 49 alright
Yeah she made it eventually XD
doesnt help the ancient 25mph either
Why didn’t someone just say “Sod it?”.
Had it been me, yeah i would've! On the other hand, you can't disappoint passengers
As far as I know, when a train goes uphill the loco must be behind it, not in front of it...
If it was getting a 'helping hand' from another loco, then yes, there would most likely be one on the rear, but for just 1 loco it really should be in front of the train. On this section of track the loco is usually facing the 'proper' way round, making it much easier to get up the gradient
Not so
The locomotive's smokebox would usually be facing towards Pickering because the harshest gradient is between Grosmont & Goathland Summit: 1 in 49.
Maybe the weather had been damp as well? That sort of a struggle to get moving with such an important service..... I can imagine the comments when they got back after that turn....
The B1 was not an express passenger locomotive. More like a mixed traffic type.
Shows how little you know.
I did not detect the sanders being utilised which would have helped a lot. Perhaps that system is too much bother on a heritage line. A lot of huffing and puffing but little progress, just like Boris Johnson!
I didn't either, though i am sure that they would use them to save 'stalling' on the 1in49. Not sure about whether they bother or not, not exactly a demanding system for sanding though
@@Daniel-go4ux Providing there is a store of dry sand to be used.
@@DSSteamVideos I'm intrigued as to how the dragging brakes were sorted as he doesn't seem to stop between his final bout of slipping, and finally getting away up the hill?
Unless a B1 is fitted with rear sanders, they might not be much use running backwards?
@@mcollier4566 I'm not that well up on LNER locos but most things I've been on do have trailing sand
Bet crew grtvribbed back atvgrosmont shed
Parlez vous Anglais s'il vous plait! (lol)