It says a lot that even some JP players think it's too hard. Because at least JP will always settle on a single set of strats. NA is a mix right now of CODCAR and Aurelia so you basically have to learn two strats if you want access to all the PF parties.
The fight is designed to punish the entire alliance if one falls apart, mechanically it’s very easy, and not even close to as hard as M4, it’s just very body check heavy and that in a 24 man group is painful. After a few clears it’s ALOT easier
Chaotic is definitely (barely) doable for a random in pf. Main issue is people joining later prog points when they should clearly not be there, wasting 23 other people's time.
the more skilled people among the PF's hardly get to clear if they dont actually prog lie at some point after seeds / looming chaos. because people make a seed or looming chaos prog PF and if thats your prog point you spend 2 hours wiping to first towers. This is endless repeat essentially because everything after looming chaos is repeat with the exception of chasing aoe's. As sad as it is, and as much as i hate prog lieing, i almost cant blame a lot of the prog liars on the higher skill end of the bar.
@@Zyantasticyou summed me up in short... altho i have given up, i feel actually getting so frustrated, that i dont sleep anymore because i get so worked up and disapointed, doing m4s was far easier than this stuff
@ravennesvr8103 that makes me wonder if I should try my hand at savage. I've been so scared thinking I won't be able to understand the mechs but I gotta say having cleared this fight off my own back and by pulling my own weight has given me more confidence. I gave up on farming it tho, because I want to pull my hair out in chunks with these glue sniffing crayon eating goobers in farm parties.
Hmm... I'd rank Chaos somewhere between an Extreme and a Savage, but only because it has 24 people. But being part of the 24 groups feels so good when it works. That said, I think I have had to esuna and heal more in this than any Savage. Savage has, like, damage burst moments, but this damage 24/7 and I LOVE it.
It will be interesting to see what feedback the team takes on board for the design of these in the future. Its kind of a shame there isnt a liveletter or something soon that they could discuss this and FRU perhaps.
I'm just worried they'll over correct and we're right back at endwalker difficulty. The playbase will eventually get to the point that this fight will become a cakewalk once strats are solidified.
Even if there was a liveletter they wouldn't say anything. At most we will probably hear something in some random interview years down the line like we do with EW content.
The Fight isnt super complex but it has some annoying Body Checks that if missed starts snowballing into failure and with how (Atleast EU) PF is doing the alliance splits makes it hard to recover if some people die.
I love this series! It would be awesome if you could zoom in on some of the japanese, I'm trying to follow along and it would be cool to clearly see what the actual Japanese phrase is.
Ah, I can try to remember to link the original posts in the description at the very least! Would allow the use of rikaikun and the like to check on kanji : D
I like the fight but how easily the body checks can snowball into a wipe is a disaster. And I wanted actual hard mode alliance raid instead..we just got a hard 24 person extreme. Also the loot..ohboy the loot. Get more currency if theres new players to incentivise helping but..there's a finite number of uncleared to go through. Afterwards only getting a singular materia 2 per clear is butts. So either gotta decide farm one at a time with capable people or gamble getting more at the cost of..someone messing up their position despite specifically covering said positions during setup. Theres so much that fell short in this that I have to wonder what are they thinking there is no enjoyment to large number body checks nor will this be sustainable content unless in the future we end up with a discord like we have for baldesion arsenal.
I'm hoping they take the feedback on board and change things up for the next one, because it *is* a fun fight, and I think the first phase hits pretty perfectly- it's fast, it's a bit messy, it's not that hard to be in Alliance A in one PF and then Alliance B in the next, and while you definitely _can_ wipe it's hard for a couple of people making mistakes to kill an otherwise clean pull. The second phase is just too much for content on this scale- both the body checks, and the fact that depending on your alliance you can end up learning totally different sets of mechanics, so it can get harder and harder to find a group. I don't want the fight to be _easy_, and it'd be fine if too many mistakes meant you wouldn't beat enrage, but being completely walled in your prog when a few people out of 23 fuck up is awful.
There's already a discord for it, but you're right, the fight isn't any more frustrating or hard then an EX, just more people. Sometimes you get good parties sometimes you won't. I have almost 30 clears and they've all been in pf. People will get better over time. Edit: the fight is super fun
the way people are doing spreads for mechanics is making the recovery part hard. having 1 Healer out on A/C side means if they die and you dont have a RDM/SMN in those side your Done.
@@EverianKalim yeah I agree with this one (and probably bias because my group are doing healer out strat and I'm the healer at alliance B). Good to be able to help raising A/C healers on the side while my heals still reach my assigned light party from alliance B.
Phase 1 feels like a pretty good difficulty for a Chaotic 24-man IMO. The mechs are not That hard but they come at you at a brisk speed and you also have a lot of personal responsibility to not clip other people, and is also pretty recoverable. Then Phase 2 happens and one person can easily wipe the whole raid :'3 Also as an Elemental DC player, I have used RF a few times but it seems to be for blind/fresh players; Nobody expects even getting to Phase 2. I don't know the current state of RF now tho, if it even pops anymore.
There is a difference between being casual and being ignorantly bad. For starters, even reclear teams still can't understand the ethics of not placing their doom hands in middle to screw others up. Like, when your timer is up your entire screen starts fading black with a massive heartbeat sound alert, yet people could still stand still and fire their hands off at others. How bad are they when such significant indicators are there and they are still clueless to what they should be doing. The whole fight is fun, and its not difficult. The difficult part is getting people to sharpen up their attention and awareness on what's going on around them when mechanics are happening. This applies to doom hands, middle tile movement(tanks c*ckblocking people while others are desperately begging them to move), side towers(people getting their towers wrong).
Man there is a DRK on EU who has made it into meme/mockery videos of the community on this raid. hes so bad that most of EU must have him blacklisted by now. he ignores every mech, literally EVERY mech, has 45 recorded PF attempts and 0 clears, and if he isnt logging himself, then he likely has much more that arent visible. he places his hands in a group of people, dies to knockback circle or getting knocked off, eats every doom, fails every tower, fucks up tank swaps. He got to swaps just by being brute force carried and raised like 15 times in the process. he started making his own PF's, i guess because people caught on to him and blacklisted/removed him from groups. His most recent one i saw was a "duty complete" tag, with bonus active in the description, hoping some unsuspecting people will carry him into his clear. its really sad people like that exist. I actually want content to be so hard that you cant clear it if you dont pull ur weight.
I think BA and DRS are way better designed espiacally because its not just one Boss. Having 24 ppl and everyone has responsibilitys to solve is really frustrating its making recovery nearly impossible by this amount of player you need to make sure there is room for fuck ups.
Not jusy that, due to the design of the raid itself, you could go 20 pulls never actually needing to do a certain thing, and suddenly you get it out of nowhere and get caught off gaurd
@@ravennesvr8103 i personally dont mind the randomness of the mechanic tbh. i personally think thats fun and could lead to funny situations. but yeah i can see why that would be really a pain to deal with
The mechanics arnt hard or bad. The issue I find is phase 2 has this cascading effect where it 1 person dies then 2 people die then 4 then 10 then it's just annoying. The coordination is what's "hard" the mechanics are fine. And that's what I hate about it the coordination of 23 other people
I'm just waiting for the price on the hair to keep dropping(would settle for 10m but might give at 15m). Would like the CoD mount but I can live without. None off the armor look good. Just didn't feel like doing this, 24 people is way too much and if you haven't done anything by now, rip in finding or getting a fresh party. Also hearing pf been bad. So it sucks when you got no one.
@@maybayV2 NA in general cannot recover in fights. The moment things do not go exactly according to the diagrams, people mentally blue screen and have no idea how to fix it. Putting all healers out wouldn't do anything because of this. It's been a general NA PF problem for a very long time. Of course there are some players that have the quick thinking skills to try and recover, but many on NA just don't.
These things should just be massive HP sponge bosses with a tight DPS check to clear. Give us guaranteed gear drops on a weekly lockout. Midcore content will always be about a big grind, not difficulty spikes
I want more of these raids, the fight itself is very fun. I just want a bit of a higher entry barrier like most recent on content EX cleared or something like that. 7.0 MSQ being the only entry barrier results in a bunch of people thinking they can do this (get carried) because thats how they literally got through the MSQ. Its crazy we have tanks and healers not mitigating raidwides or transition phases, or people not interrupting interupptable castbars etc and then tell u to "just stop dying" when you ask them to use their kit.
I won't lie to you, you're totally damn right. I'm new by legacy player standards. Just finished EW. I'm not anxious playing Tank generally but on the first run of a dungeon i am, for reasons you mentioned... Just getting gibbed by some white screen transition that I'm apparently supposed to know to LB because "tHe fIgHt iS 4 yEArs oLD bRo" is kind of what makes me a tad shy. Now HEALER ANXIETY? Fuck i get that a looot and I'm new to Sage.
so far 38 clears, but i think. also, people do not KNOW what the word "Casual" means... im a casual, and i still raid n crap. theres a fine line between being bad, and being an actual casual. . . but the fight is pretty incredibly fun TBH! but, like the person below me said, thers 80% tower memes lol, the 2nd tower need to kind of tone the towers a TINY bit. but then again, its only been 3 days. . . . people need to understand that lmao im sure BA, was even much much much worse, since you die there you cant get rezzed unless someone SAC. and i an imagine, 42 people wiping to mechs ALOT. BA was annoyingly easy, boring and still is, everything in there is boring, same with DR-S, that place is boring AF.
@@goodestboy174 lmao This guy. . .and thats MY problem how? i spent christmas alone at home, everyone else was out of state. who are you to tell me what i am and am not lmao.. i found a farming party, and everyone stuck through the entire bonus.. your problems are not MY problems my entitled guy.
@esko911 Problem? Lol You're just not a casual. Nothing to get triggered or mald about. Not that serious to farm hardcore content 38 times in a row for three days - You're just not a casual player. Somehow, this has caused you to have a complete meltdown. Gotta make a meme out of this xD
A casual player would not have 38 clears. A player that can get this done would have the skills needed to complete ex and prog savage. You are more of a midcore to hard core player thinking that your casual.
@@umbralflow6883 honestly you just sound salty i was able to to do this without any of YOUR life problems or things you had to do... that group stuck together for the bonus my little dude, we were all just randoms. little dude trying to tell me stuff about MYSELF lmao jesus my dude.
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It says a lot that even some JP players think it's too hard. Because at least JP will always settle on a single set of strats. NA is a mix right now of CODCAR and Aurelia so you basically have to learn two strats if you want access to all the PF parties.
EU has settled on Aurelia (aka wfj) and that works, had multiple clears following that.
You can just learn one if you want, they're both good strategies
The fight is designed to punish the entire alliance if one falls apart, mechanically it’s very easy, and not even close to as hard as M4, it’s just very body check heavy and that in a 24 man group is painful. After a few clears it’s ALOT easier
I still see "Farm" parties wipe on first set of towers.
The problem is getting a clear at all LOL
@@amelveambitzya3592this, i spend 15 hrs already never ever gotten a decent loom yet and wipe immediately after swap
Such things are subjective..
M4s is my book is probably the easiest and most forgiving savage final that i have done sinds shadowbringers... for real
Chaotic is definitely (barely) doable for a random in pf. Main issue is people joining later prog points when they should clearly not be there, wasting 23 other people's time.
the more skilled people among the PF's hardly get to clear if they dont actually prog lie at some point after seeds / looming chaos. because people make a seed or looming chaos prog PF and if thats your prog point you spend 2 hours wiping to first towers. This is endless repeat essentially because everything after looming chaos is repeat with the exception of chasing aoe's. As sad as it is, and as much as i hate prog lieing, i almost cant blame a lot of the prog liars on the higher skill end of the bar.
@@Zyantasticyou summed me up in short... altho i have given up, i feel actually getting so frustrated, that i dont sleep anymore because i get so worked up and disapointed, doing m4s was far easier than this stuff
@ravennesvr8103 that makes me wonder if I should try my hand at savage. I've been so scared thinking I won't be able to understand the mechs but I gotta say having cleared this fight off my own back and by pulling my own weight has given me more confidence.
I gave up on farming it tho, because I want to pull my hair out in chunks with these glue sniffing crayon eating goobers in farm parties.
Every party is a tower party *rocks back and forth*
Hmm... I'd rank Chaos somewhere between an Extreme and a Savage, but only because it has 24 people.
But being part of the 24 groups feels so good when it works.
That said, I think I have had to esuna and heal more in this than any Savage. Savage has, like, damage burst moments, but this damage 24/7 and I LOVE it.
It will be interesting to see what feedback the team takes on board for the design of these in the future.
Its kind of a shame there isnt a liveletter or something soon that they could discuss this and FRU perhaps.
I'm just worried they'll over correct and we're right back at endwalker difficulty. The playbase will eventually get to the point that this fight will become a cakewalk once strats are solidified.
@@Cafinebiasedstrats are solidified. It's just ppls are... How to put it... So monkaSteer it's amazing how they manage any content.
Even if there was a liveletter they wouldn't say anything.
At most we will probably hear something in some random interview years down the line like we do with EW content.
@@hawgacrux Yeah thats true
The Fight isnt super complex but it has some annoying Body Checks that if missed starts snowballing into failure and with how (Atleast EU) PF is doing the alliance splits makes it hard to recover if some people die.
Thats not even they annoying part. It's the player base and is unwilling to learn. Literally day one 5 to 6 pull people atart leaving. Its annoying.
i am a random.
i can only do phase 1.
Let's be real. You can't even do hands without your hand slapping everyone around it.
You’ll get there!
Can confirm, worst perfoming player in a clear, two demimateria I lucked into. 99% of XIV gamers are always one clear away from getting those wings.
I love this series! It would be awesome if you could zoom in on some of the japanese, I'm trying to follow along and it would be cool to clearly see what the actual Japanese phrase is.
Ah, I can try to remember to link the original posts in the description at the very least! Would allow the use of rikaikun and the like to check on kanji : D
Chaotic is super fun, and i hope we get more in the future. So many new people who dont raid are doing these and its a very very good thing imo.
I like the fight but how easily the body checks can snowball into a wipe is a disaster. And I wanted actual hard mode alliance raid instead..we just got a hard 24 person extreme.
Also the loot..ohboy the loot. Get more currency if theres new players to incentivise helping but..there's a finite number of uncleared to go through. Afterwards only getting a singular materia 2 per clear is butts. So either gotta decide farm one at a time with capable people or gamble getting more at the cost of..someone messing up their position despite specifically covering said positions during setup.
Theres so much that fell short in this that I have to wonder what are they thinking there is no enjoyment to large number body checks nor will this be sustainable content unless in the future we end up with a discord like we have for baldesion arsenal.
I'm hoping they take the feedback on board and change things up for the next one, because it *is* a fun fight, and I think the first phase hits pretty perfectly- it's fast, it's a bit messy, it's not that hard to be in Alliance A in one PF and then Alliance B in the next, and while you definitely _can_ wipe it's hard for a couple of people making mistakes to kill an otherwise clean pull.
The second phase is just too much for content on this scale- both the body checks, and the fact that depending on your alliance you can end up learning totally different sets of mechanics, so it can get harder and harder to find a group. I don't want the fight to be _easy_, and it'd be fine if too many mistakes meant you wouldn't beat enrage, but being completely walled in your prog when a few people out of 23 fuck up is awful.
There's already a discord for it, but you're right, the fight isn't any more frustrating or hard then an EX, just more people. Sometimes you get good parties sometimes you won't. I have almost 30 clears and they've all been in pf. People will get better over time.
Edit: the fight is super fun
The fight is super fun. but it's severely punishing if even 1 person out of the 24 messes up and I can see why it's difficult
It's actually insane that FRU is more savable than Chaotic.
the way people are doing spreads for mechanics is making the recovery part hard. having 1 Healer out on A/C side means if they die and you dont have a RDM/SMN in those side your Done.
@@EverianKalim yeah I agree with this one (and probably bias because my group are doing healer out strat and I'm the healer at alliance B). Good to be able to help raising A/C healers on the side while my heals still reach my assigned light party from alliance B.
Phase 1 feels like a pretty good difficulty for a Chaotic 24-man IMO. The mechs are not That hard but they come at you at a brisk speed and you also have a lot of personal responsibility to not clip other people, and is also pretty recoverable. Then Phase 2 happens and one person can easily wipe the whole raid :'3
Also as an Elemental DC player, I have used RF a few times but it seems to be for blind/fresh players; Nobody expects even getting to Phase 2. I don't know the current state of RF now tho, if it even pops anymore.
There is a difference between being casual and being ignorantly bad. For starters, even reclear teams still can't understand the ethics of not placing their doom hands in middle to screw others up. Like, when your timer is up your entire screen starts fading black with a massive heartbeat sound alert, yet people could still stand still and fire their hands off at others. How bad are they when such significant indicators are there and they are still clueless to what they should be doing. The whole fight is fun, and its not difficult. The difficult part is getting people to sharpen up their attention and awareness on what's going on around them when mechanics are happening. This applies to doom hands, middle tile movement(tanks c*ckblocking people while others are desperately begging them to move), side towers(people getting their towers wrong).
Man there is a DRK on EU who has made it into meme/mockery videos of the community on this raid. hes so bad that most of EU must have him blacklisted by now. he ignores every mech, literally EVERY mech, has 45 recorded PF attempts and 0 clears, and if he isnt logging himself, then he likely has much more that arent visible. he places his hands in a group of people, dies to knockback circle or getting knocked off, eats every doom, fails every tower, fucks up tank swaps. He got to swaps just by being brute force carried and raised like 15 times in the process. he started making his own PF's, i guess because people caught on to him and blacklisted/removed him from groups. His most recent one i saw was a "duty complete" tag, with bonus active in the description, hoping some unsuspecting people will carry him into his clear. its really sad people like that exist. I actually want content to be so hard that you cant clear it if you dont pull ur weight.
I think BA and DRS are way better designed espiacally because its not just one Boss. Having 24 ppl and everyone has responsibilitys to solve is really frustrating its making recovery nearly impossible by this amount of player you need to make sure there is room for fuck ups.
Even farming parties are still having a hard time, lol
the mechanics themselves arent that hard, but given more people have more individual responsibility makes it prone to a lot of errors
Not jusy that, due to the design of the raid itself, you could go 20 pulls never actually needing to do a certain thing, and suddenly you get it out of nowhere and get caught off gaurd
@@ravennesvr8103 i personally dont mind the randomness of the mechanic tbh. i personally think thats fun and could lead to funny situations. but yeah i can see why that would be really a pain to deal with
I hope it fades away into obscurity like criterion. Such a waste.
5 clears so far. It's definitely my most fun content in the whole game. I love this and I hope they do more
The mechanics arnt hard or bad. The issue I find is phase 2 has this cascading effect where it 1 person dies then 2 people die then 4 then 10 then it's just annoying. The coordination is what's "hard" the mechanics are fine. And that's what I hate about it the coordination of 23 other people
I'm just waiting for the price on the hair to keep dropping(would settle for 10m but might give at 15m). Would like the CoD mount but I can live without. None off the armor look good. Just didn't feel like doing this, 24 people is way too much and if you haven't done anything by now, rip in finding or getting a fresh party. Also hearing pf been bad. So it sucks when you got no one.
A big reason why NA is even having difficulty atm is because they refuse to change to the all healers out strat.
NA can't recover, all healer out wouldn't solve anything
@vimimi Idk what you mean. I'm already up 30 clears on NA.
But its always A or Cs platform healer dying, making recovery impossible.
@@maybayV2 NA in general cannot recover in fights. The moment things do not go exactly according to the diagrams, people mentally blue screen and have no idea how to fix it. Putting all healers out wouldn't do anything because of this. It's been a general NA PF problem for a very long time. Of course there are some players that have the quick thinking skills to try and recover, but many on NA just don't.
The fight is brain dead easy when you pay attention to your job mechanics and know your line and your role
its not hard people are just bad at coordinating outside of call. it's hardly extreme grade.
These things should just be massive HP sponge bosses with a tight DPS check to clear. Give us guaranteed gear drops on a weekly lockout. Midcore content will always be about a big grind, not difficulty spikes
I want more of these raids, the fight itself is very fun. I just want a bit of a higher entry barrier like most recent on content EX cleared or something like that. 7.0 MSQ being the only entry barrier results in a bunch of people thinking they can do this (get carried) because thats how they literally got through the MSQ. Its crazy we have tanks and healers not mitigating raidwides or transition phases, or people not interrupting interupptable castbars etc and then tell u to "just stop dying" when you ask them to use their kit.
I won't lie to you, you're totally damn right. I'm new by legacy player standards. Just finished EW. I'm not anxious playing Tank generally but on the first run of a dungeon i am, for reasons you mentioned... Just getting gibbed by some white screen transition that I'm apparently supposed to know to LB because "tHe fIgHt iS 4 yEArs oLD bRo" is kind of what makes me a tad shy.
Now HEALER ANXIETY? Fuck i get that a looot and I'm new to Sage.
just make more 8 man content, its the standard
so far 38 clears, but i think.
also, people do not KNOW what the word "Casual" means... im a casual, and i still raid n crap.
theres a fine line between being bad, and being an actual casual. . .
but the fight is pretty incredibly fun TBH!
but, like the person below me said, thers 80% tower memes lol, the 2nd tower need to kind of tone the towers a TINY bit.
but then again, its only been 3 days. . . . people need to understand that lmao
im sure BA, was even much much much worse, since you die there you cant get rezzed unless someone SAC. and i an imagine, 42 people wiping to mechs ALOT.
BA was annoyingly easy, boring and still is, everything in there is boring, same with DR-S, that place is boring AF.
You're not a casual if you have cleared it 38 times during the Holidays when the rest of us are with our families and kids.
@@goodestboy174 lmao This guy. . .and thats MY problem how? i spent christmas alone at home, everyone else was out of state. who are you to tell me what i am and am not lmao.. i found a farming party, and everyone stuck through the entire bonus.. your problems are not MY problems my entitled guy.
@esko911 Problem? Lol You're just not a casual. Nothing to get triggered or mald about. Not that serious to farm hardcore content 38 times in a row for three days - You're just not a casual player. Somehow, this has caused you to have a complete meltdown. Gotta make a meme out of this xD
A casual player would not have 38 clears. A player that can get this done would have the skills needed to complete ex and prog savage. You are more of a midcore to hard core player thinking that your casual.
@@umbralflow6883 honestly you just sound salty i was able to to do this without any of YOUR life problems or things you had to do... that group stuck together for the bonus my little dude, we were all just randoms. little dude trying to tell me stuff about MYSELF lmao jesus my dude.