The Chrysler Carburetor Conundrum
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- Опубликовано: 21 окт 2024
- Common throttle and kickdown linkage adjustments can usually be traced to aftermarket Holley, Edelbrock and Summit carbs not matching up with the Mopar gas pedal ratio. Here's how to make them work.
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I hope you see this Uncle Tony.....wanted tk let you know that your videos are very helpful. Especially for guys new to the mopar scene. Than you good sir
Thank You Tony for the carburetor! Email sent. I’m stoked! I also sent a second email with pictures of the 55 Chevy.
Congratulations Dart dude. And your lucky twice you won't have to fabricate a cable setup for that turbo 350, provided its automatic.
Glad the carburetor went to someone who has a good use for it. Sounds like a cool project.
Congrats to the winner of the 3 barrel, if you need any help sourcing other parts for it, get ahold of me through the email in my video description and I would be happy to help ya
And if you want to quiz Jed live, come join him on my channel Monday evening: m.ruclips.net/video/JbcqO3PTZfg/видео.html
Thanks SSS!
@@dodgedartdude Congratulations! I hope you’ll post video of your project. It sure sounds cool.
@@dodgedartdude No problem man, I just want to make sure you have all of the right parts to make that 3 barrel work
Nice of you Jed.
Uncle Tony; You are an amazing source of information, the knowledge you have seems to be unending, I always learn something from your video's. You would have been a great teacher. Thank you for sharing with us.
I had a 1966 Plymouth sport fury with it 383 in it. I grabbed a thermal quad intake out of the junkyard and put a quadrajet carburetor on it. Luckily it was a quadrajet with bolt-on linkage so I could modify it but basically I just ran a long bolt out the side of the linkage. Then used to a piece of coat hanger to make a loop around the throttle cable so it was just pulling on the bolt separated the section with nuts and added the TV cable to it. It looked moderately janky but worked absolutely fantastic and all the ratios were great. I got 20 miles from the gallon with that setup with no overdrive all the way to California.
Great that you mentioned how important the transmission linkage is on a 727 or 904, and how to adjust it.
Unc Tony never cease to amaze me. Ole timers stock pile extra torq flights because they never have a guru like you.Learn by doing!
I'm old and not into fixing cars now but was a Mopar guy when I did. I subbed simply because Tony is a good guy with good info.
I own a ‘64 Cadillac with a Cadillac 429 in it, and the old school Hydramatic 4 speed automatic transmission (yes 4 speed, look them up, all cast iron and were used in WW2 tanks). They also use a throttle valve setup, and it’s so common for people to jack up their transmission shifting and throttles with the aftermarket carburetor swaps.
That adjustment Uncle Tony describes works! I did it to my '68 Fury VIP with a 318 2bbl with the three piece kickdown linkage. It'd been driving me nuts for weeks and I basically pushed the accelerator all the way to the back and held it down with something heavy. I then pushed down on the intermediate rod making sure it was all the way back. While holding it in place, I adjusted the rod that goes on the carburetor pin towards the front of the car until it was really tight. I then let off the accelerator. When it all went back in place, there was still a gap. I adjusted it until it was just touching the carburetor pin and then put the spring back on. Took it out and it now goes into passing gear every time and my shifts are not crazy early but as they should be. Thanks Uncle Tony!
Congratulations, George. Maybe Unc can get you on the show with that '55 Chevy.
Im dealing with linkage right now. You read my mind.
I certainly did get something out of that! This whole thing has been a mystery to me for years! Much needed info! You're the man, Tony!
Thank you! thank you! thank you Uncle Tony! This is THE video I've been waiting for. I believe you just saved my 904. I'm going to be able to install my edelbrock carb right. thanks a million
Tony, thanks for the explanation about the kick down linkage. I had to replace the carb on a 83 F-150 straight 6 with the AOD transmission and couldn't find a replacement that had the kick down attachment. I had a devil of a time getting the cable set up correctly. Your description of the 2-3 short shift was exactly what I experienced. Thankfully, I was able to work out the cable and get the old girl running right.
Big ups to you George. Real nice of Tony to give that to you. Good luck
The end of this video is GOLD -- I have the two-three immediate shift on my '87 D150 and had assumed all along it couldn't be the kickdown linkage because it drops down fine when cruising along and stepping on it. Same behavior way back on my very first car -- a '74 Charger -- both of them 727 auto's with 318. Charger had the slapstick so I pretty much manually shifted it all the time anyway, had 219K on it when it got totalled...
That was a trick I learned in the early 90's when I 1st started playing with older MOPARs. I was a bad boy when it came to the kickdown linkage, I just got under the car and wired for full throttle all the time. 😂
I mean, that's where it was going to be all the time anyway 🤷
@@yurimodin7333 only time it wasn't ,was when it was parked in the driveway.
And even that's subject to a smokey ripper burnout right there.
Yep, but remember to shift into neutral after you've ran it hard through the gears, otherwise it will want to downshift at maximum rpm as well.
Good stuff as usual Uncle!!! As a kid, I learned how important having the kickdown linkage, and it being adjusted right was. I went through so many 727s in my 68 Charger that we used a the dead ones as posts and made a fence...🤣
Ah the good old days when you could grab a big block trans from the junkyard for $65...
Thank u, I just got a 78 Dodge sportsman van/RV conversion and it's got a 2 barrel Holley carburetor on it, the throttle linkage and kickdown linkage are very unprofessionally welded together using different length bolts and other weird hardware pieces to make the linkage work together but I can't understand how it connects to the Holley carburetor it's the most bizarre thing I've ever seen in my life. Thank you for all that info though that really helps
AKA 'bowden cable' for the transmission. Great video Tony
congratulations George
I've only ever driven manual dodges with aftermarket cables which relocate the pivot point so I never would think that was an issue for automatica
The throttle linkage to the trans also provides for an increase in line pressure inside the trans.
Having dealt with this problem in HS I can personally testify Tony is 100% correct in this. You will also need to lengthen the kick down lever rod for the auto trans in most cases. I fabricated a longer one out of a piece of threaded rod from the hard ware store.
Awesome video Uncle Tony! I have one Dodge and it’s our RV. It was pretty neglected when we got it and I had good intentions of rebuilding the stock carb. Took it apart and then the auto store didn’t have a kit for it, so it sat on the healing bench for about 6 months, parts got lost and whatever else. Decided to just slap an Edelbrock on it and I had a hell of a time with these linkages. Since it’s an RV, it doesn’t get driven much, so it’s pretty low on my to do list, but now next spring I will do it up right. I got the video link saved in my “to do” notes on my phone. Thanks brother! Even though you’re a Mopar guy, you’re alright in my book.
Sounds like you found a great home for the carb. Job well done!
Similar deal here in Australia with my Ford XB GT running a Holley 600, however the cable pulls the bottom of the bracket from the front. The ratio of the pedal is just enough, however it was the location of the cable bracket on the inlet manifold which is too low and not allowing WOT. So I made up a new bracket so the cable pulls from a higher point and gives me full range.
Thanks Uncle Tony!! Good information for me as Ive been wondering about this topic!
the kick down linkage is one of the reasons i got deal my challenger, the previous owner left it off and burnt up the trans.... unfortunately it was a fresh rebuild too!!
Good tips. Also note the leverage on the arm is lower in this location, so the pedal will feel stiffer if the return springs aren’t set up and chosen correctly for it.
Uncle Tony you are spot on, I made the exact mistake but going to fix it now, thanks
Yeah, it sounds like the 3 Bbl is going onto a worthy project.
I am preparing to install a carburetor on a Dodge pickup. I have been looking for a video on the throttle and kick-down linkage. Thanks!!!!
Kickdown, also known as TV adjustment, Throttle Valve Pressure spool valve in the trans valve body. It works with the main line governor spool valve to boost main line pressure. That's what learned years ago in my apprentice schooling to become a licensed mechanic. But I'm old, so I maybe I'm off a bit on explaining it. Cheers,
My favourite throttle cables to use are the factory slant 6 ones and the factory 2 barrel small block ones. They are easier to use when using a high rise intake manifold and give you a little more room to play with getting the brackets all lined up. Good explanation on the linkage ratio too man. So many times I've had guys pedals go to the floor but not getting wide open throttle. Little tweak here and there and it's like a new engine with full power finally.
Thanks for that video. I was trying to figure out that problem. I have 86 Dodge Ram with 440 magnum. Thats exactly what i need to do.
Same deal with the Fords, and their old school solid kick down linkages. You have to have the lever on the carb, and you have to know how to adjust the kick down after it's installed. I was a whiz on those lol.
Gotta go out & look, just installed an Edelbrock on my 383 in my 66 Chevy C-10.
Good info Tony. My '70 slant six Belvedere wagon has a FiTech (yeah yeah, whatever) that is only getting 89% on the TPS at WOT. Lower the screw to gain some stroke. Makes sense!
I need WOT @100% on the Slant. The 4,000 lb car needs all the help it can get on the dragstrip!
Mopar poetry:
My '70 Belvedere wagon,
Who's throttle I'm constantly fraggin'.
Well 13's it can't
For it's just a mere Slant,
But 18's are still fun while Draggin'!!!
Excellent explanation on the subject
I remember when I was 16 in 1985 I cobbled my beater dodge pickup. I tied the kickdown lever back with wire as I didn't have the means to hook it up to the different carb I installed. Luckily a friend of my dad saw it and corrected me.
Simplicity freak, I like that term. It describes me to a T. It likely describes all old school car guys.
Tony you need to talk about the governor, I found out depending on application Chrysler used different governors, if you adjust trans up and says changes into top under 4000rpm it's got the grandma governor, cars that were considered performance had governor to let you change at higher rpm. There is a place that sells the weights for what rpm you want. Thanks Bruce from NZ
My 727 Torqueflite does exactly that. Shifts under 4000 rpm at WOT in drive even with the transmission throttle linkage set correctly. I'm looking into changing the governor weights to lighter versions.
A&A trans sells high perf ones.
@@rtraymond I've been flipping through a Cope Racing Transmission booklet and they sell governor kits as well along with a split shift fix that I'm thinking about.
@@jewsrbad you can not adjust the kick down out of the spec of which it was setup for, you need to start looking at the governor.
I am no trans expert only what I have found out along the way, I think John Wilburn is pretty much a trans guru so he maybe able to shed more light on things with regards to governors, there is also an issue where I think the 1 2 or 2 3 shifts are quite close together and there is a spring for the valve body to change them so they are the same. Transmissions out of the factory are not set up for street rods more like every day drivers (economy/smooth) but we have the know how to make them how we like :)
Just more great tech, thanks Tony!
Great basic much needed information for the Mopar community thanks!
Congrats George!
Congrats George 👍😉
well, off to fix my linkage...
thanks!
Hey bud..could you into adjusting TV/kickdown cables some more. I've adjusted it wrong so many times I don't know how much more abuse my trans can take
I need my kickdown connected to my edelbrock 1406 on my 74 t bird with the 460
Hi Tony, I just put a 4 bbl and intake on my small block with 904...my problem is now my pressure arm is about 3-4 inches to short. do you have any advice or ideas? I am thinking of deleting the arm, putting a cable next to the throttle connection and using a spring on the arm at the trans... The spring should pull the arm back as the throttle is open I would think but you are the man and I am sure you have run into this a bunch of times... Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Side note... I decided you were right about not putting the 440 in my Charger, I am running the 318 original engine. we talked about it one night on live and the car only having 18k on it. Yes, the car is super low mileage but someone took the car apart years ago and pretty much lost all the parts they took off...like the interior and all the moldings. Then it was pretty much just forgotten about as far as i can figure. I have been piecing it back together, the brake system was completely seized and needed everything replaced. The tank was left partially full and has been a nightmare with varnish. I have had it running off the tank after an enzyme fill but damn it stinks lol I wanted the hide away headlights so that has pretty much been a chore to get everything to work with modern linear actuators but they do work. I am also painting it Panter Pink FM3 with everything blacked out and bought a power bilge hood for it. I am tossed up on doing the ralleys PP with black rings and centers or just black with the stainless. Like I said, the car has low mileage but nothing is really there to make it worth a lot of value so i am gonna build it the way I want it and enjoy the hell out of it :)
Damn. Didn’t know that. Chevy guy and always used the top hole. Never had a issue but still good to know.
Uncle Tony knows his shit.*
Great info as usual uncle Tony. Couldn't help but notice the brown case in the background. Looks like an old tape case? Would love to know what tapes you used to listen to?
Christina Aguilera, N’Sync, NKOTB, Spice Girls.
You can also buy a lever adaptor from Edelbrock that has the correct location for the throttle and tv linkage that fits the Carter and Holley carb.
Kickdown Also raises line pressure.
Well done.. This was new for me.
I've been drilling that hole for years and using a lokar kick down. Been working fine since 2002
Thanks, Tony!
Decent video, helped me a lot. Man, I wish you would have actually did that set up on a car. Would have been even better.
Great information Tony thank you
The carbs do not come with the Chrysler throttle linkage adapter. Those are sold separately. In my case, I use the Lokar cable setup for both the throttle and kickdown.
Thanks Uncle Tony!!!!
More Useful Wisdom!!!!
Factory Mopar transmission linkage works great the problem is the Lokar cables can drive u nuts setting it up the ratio needs to be 1 to 1 in regards to the length of pull from the carb to the distance the cable moves the trans lever. I used a Ford style Holley carb and this worked for me. Measured the distance from the throttle cable to center of carb butterfly shaft 1-3/16" then drilled a hole the same distance below the center of butterfly shaft. Installed the cable with original trans lever. Take the inner cable ferrel and pull on it till u feel slight resistance when it just contacts the spring inside the trans from that point measure with a dial indicator how far it moves before it hits its stop this number must be the same as the carb pulls the cable out , within a 16th of an inch. Adjust the length of the lever on the trans so they bottom out at the same time. If for instance if the carb can't open W.O.T u make the trans lever slightly longer.
Holley 20-7 - Holley Throttle Lever Extensions $12.30 at Summit. You really need this on Holley 4160 and other similar universal carbs. No need for drilling. Three screws (little bolts). On the other hand, the carb stud is easy to lose when swapping carbs and hard to find. I believe Classic Industries carries this, but it is not cheap. And cutting the head off an old bolt and putting a bunch of nuts and washers on it is not too slick either. :)
Mopar V8's from the era were made with a wider carb, like an AFB, AVS, or Thermoquad. The extension has the extra width needed. "What about the factory 4160's Chrysler used between 68 and 73?" you say. Well, they had the extension built into the linkage on the base plate.
This video really needed pictures of the linkage and the lever extension. Also, if you ignore the Trans linkage and wire it forward, you get early shifts. Just as bad, if you wire it backward, you get late, hard shifts. Equally bad.
I felt bad that the carb in the video had it's choke removed. At least the tower wasn't cut off.
Great info unk I have not messed with many mopars but I have heard about the adjustment needs to be correct on the kickdown👍👍
The Holley carburetor throttle cable adapter for Chrysler is Holley part number #8021. It also comes with the kickdown cable adapter.
Once again the part number is
Holley #8021
Thanks have a great night.
You can also raise the line pressure and it will raise the shift points
Sounds like you need to make the drive to Conneticut to do a vid on setting up a 3bbl
Thanks Tony.
If you are going from 2 barrel to 4 barrel there is a kickdown linkage extender you can buy, rather than welding a piece in. I converted my early Valiant throttle pedal to a later model by grafting the late model pedal to the early bracket and horizontal rod, I had to make sure when the pedal touches the floor that the cable at the carby end was at full throttle, then I could weld the horizontal rods together. If you get that wrong and the cable at the carby end bottoms out and the pedal hasn’t touched the floor you will pull the little crimped lead ball off your cable when you boot the throttle.It was a fiddly job but now my peddle is further to the right and better to use than the old heel mounted peddle, on our right hand drive Valiant it was to far to the lft.
Are the any decent videos for setting up a lokar style cable on edelbrock carb and intake? I've been tryng to find info for it but there doesn't seem to be much out there. Awesome video btw.
It seems like most cars i fix wont open full throttle. I generally have to make a bracket to make it work. Particularly if its a rod instead of a cable. People always get those wrong and not just on Holleys
This is a great example of the importance of adjusting things. It makes the difference between a car that goes really well or drives like a total dog.
Adjustment is everything.
I have seen so many cars that have had tons of money spent on fancy engine parts to make a ton of power and because of bad throttle and transmission adjustments the cars don't even go as good as stock and the owner is disappointed.
The devil is in the detail.
If the throttle pressure is not set correctly or delayed, there will not be sufficient clamping force with the front clutch. Under a load in 3rd gear, the front clutch will slip and be the first thing to burn up. Always refer to the fsm for proper adjustment procedure.
Hey Tony didn't even have a throttle lever adapter to show the people what they needed? I think they're only like thirteen or fourteen dollars and it solves all those problems
Have a question for you. I have a 1991 Dakota 3/4 ton 4x4. With a 5.9 magnum V8. It is holly fuel injection. But has a old school kick down lever lever set up not a cable. Can you tell me how to set up.the kick down on the set up.
Curious question, not sure the answer, You say that not using the kick down kills trans, I understand that, BUT, What If you drive your automatic like a standard, manually shifting it up or down gears? With no Kick down attached?
If anyone is looking for the conversion bracket part number for Edelbrock, its a 1481. Naturally, its not included with the new carbs. I just installed one on my 68, and it works perfectly with both the throttle and TV (kickdown) linkage.
Once again thx for the tech advice
Wish this applied to a 1980 Ford Bronco stock throttle cable and a Summit 600 carb.
that info would've been nice when i put my ede 1406 on my chrysler bb 400 now i know thank you
How about the adjustment on a th 350 Tony? I think it's similar.
Man, those Demon 👿 carbs look awesome! I remember when they first came out, I thought Holley finally retooled!.. but no, Holley is still Holley, 99% the same as they always been, I always wanted one, but when I bought a new carb, it was a 750 Holley double pumper! I bought it for my 385 stroker, but have it on my 454, I may buy another for my 385, maybe I'll find a deal on a old Demon 👿carb, I'd like one I can use with boost, convert to a blow through, I'd like to add boost to the low compression 454, only a bar, bar 1/2, boost, from a pair of ebay turbo's of course, I can't afford anything else, haha, great video!
Once again the Chevy guys have it easy...
that cuts both ways........Ford never made 2 of anything so good luck with that mess. Chrysler usually has 2 or maybe 3 ways of doing something(the old way and the new way but fairly similar and sometimes interchangeable). Chevy parts....."well they're all the same anyway so lets just guess at what parts they need when we package them up".....you know how many variations in just gaskets there are on a Gen1 small block.....bottom of timing cover, thin vs thick, half a dozen intake manifold gaskets, the china wall only gets RTV because we all gave up on getting the right thickness of gasket. 3+ Tooth counts on the ring gear PLUS starter shims, one-piece rear main vs 2 piece, short water pump vs long water pump. Us gearheads gotta stick together especially with all the junk parts out now.
Yep, we’re blessed in that regard.
Distributor to the rear of the engine? Not so graceful as age creeps in on us.
@@yurimodin7333 as an owner of both dodge and chevy and also one who used to be a huge chevy guy I MUCH prefer my dodges. Just the power steering pump bracket BS from deleting AC was a pain in the butt. Got to tighten the belt with a prybar also.. distributor is a little easier for chevy besides when you remove the intakethe distributor got to come out. Also has to mesh the cam gear and oil pump at the same time. Chevys are definitely not popular because of easy of use 😂
@@ChrisTheBmxGuy I like them both. I am usually a mopar guy but my current project is GMC/Chev. One thing we both can agree on tho is Blue Oval BOOOOOOOOO.
my doesn't downshift right
only shifts to 2nd at 24mph
and only shifts to 3rd at 50mph
doesn't kickdown
and the only way for it to shift from 3rd to 2nd is slowing down to 30ish mph
and a 2nd to 1st if i stop, sometimes when i slowdown to a crawl
Does the linkage move back and forth as you move the carb open? There should be about a half inch of slack before it moves back from when the throttle is closed. This is the stuff Tony didn't show, unfortunately.
Delayed upshifts even when you are using only light pressure on the throttle suggests the transmission lever is pushed back too far. A guy showed me his 383 Satellite years ago. It was more extreme than yours. It was making the trans overheat. It would have lasted for years since he drove it daily. A previous owner had wired the arm all the way back. You have two adjstments for "bands", one doesn't even need you to drop the pan. It is on the side. Perhaps you could have that looked at.
I suppose you already considered low fluid. You have to check it while it is in neutral. But you'd feel the slippage if it was low enough to slow upshifts.
@@auteurfiddler8706 904 and the stock linkage
also been driving it like that for 4 years daily
Too bad UTG wasn't around ten years ago, when I had a buddy who made the mistake of taking his '69 Road Runner clone to a mechanic shop when he couldn't get the 3310 Holley he installed to run right. They fixed it with a fancy new aftermarket accelerator pedal and linkage assembly, to the tune of nearly $300.00. He was none too pleased when I showed him the problem could have been solved by drilling one hole, for free.
I remember I had a 69 Charger and forgot to hook up the kick down cable once. It sqeeled the tires kicking down from 3rd to 1st in front of people. I thought it was the transmission breaking, but no, just a loose cable.
I've always understood the kickdown is 1:1...if you get what I mean. Is this correct??????
Throttle kick down is super important. Have seen many trans smoked do to bad geometry. 700r4 killer new manifolds with makeshift bracket just kill trans.
Chevy carburetor whisperer I found the tag that was to indicate bending bar 727 pressure link 1978 Dodge Detroit assembly Line
Hey uncle Tony I got a question for you were I can contact you directly?
More Greatness. Lokar makes a good linkage for aftermarket carbs. Nothing for 4100 and LATE AOD Trans.
You just saved my life
i got something out of it, thank you
Great video/topic
Can you talk about your opinions about the country going to California standards?
Awesome video! You just saved my ass!
Yes,,,thanks!