the fact that the discounts reduce the sell value of cards you buy is weird enough, but that it applies retroactively to cards you've already bought at full price is awful
Wouldn’t call it “awful.” Vouchers allow for three opportunities per ante to be purchased, so you can plan around it. It’s not perfect, but not impossible to work around.
Maybe if it gave 2 times the sell value as mult? That's probably way too op with egg so perhaps add a flat +2 in addition to the sell value for each sacrifice
A +1 or +2 to the sell value would do wonders for making the dagger viable in runs. Currently it’s only good as a pivot off of egg. The other problem is that the dagger has anti-synergy with loyalty card and blackboard, which makes it detrimental to many types of runs.
what about increasing chips a little bit as well? like a +5/+10 chips to give it a little edge. don't know if that wouldn't make a difference or be too op lol
I don't think it would be actually op to be 2x the sell value turned into mult, as you said, it would be very nice with egg, but I still think it would be kind of mediocre with anything else
Clearance Sale is actually bad for the dagger because it also reduces the base sell value of every card by 25%. Edit: I see that you figured it out, but it really hurt you early in the run because nearly every joker gave you less mult than you deserved.
Yeah some very quick math for the first 30 unique jokers I saw, you'd be spending like 20% more gold to get the same multi on the dagger. It's worth noting the reason it's so bad is because a lot of jokers fall in that 4 to 8 gold range where you either spend more gold per multi or the ratio stays the same. Especially 4 cost jokers before the clearance sale. They are both super common and the worst ones affected by the changed sell price.
It is insanely slow scaling and the cost of constantly buffing it is way too much. Maybe it can be okay with stencil or we get more synergies with destroying jokers, but as is youre much better off with something like a bus
I also want Hiker to be a good joker. Maybe if it scaled the scaling, so +1 the first time it hits a card then +2 the second, etc. I don't even know if that would be good yet or not, but it's a start.
Hiker seems alright to me. Especially in a 5 of a kind deck, were you are always playing the exact same 5 cards. It begins to suck when you're spreading it out over a lot of cards.
@@beautifulnova6088 Yeah, I know. I'm basically saying you want to play exactly the same hand every time. It's still not the most useful one, but it's not worthless. Combine it with like, Blueprint and the one that doubles the cards played (Yes, I know they are up there as some of the strongest jokers, but it's the run I happened to get with them) you can very easily buff the chips 4 times per hand. So after 2 hands with the same cards, they are nearly doubled in value.
I think it should work like the planet joker. The one where you use a planet card it gains .1x mult. .1x mult per joker eaten sounds way better and more balanced than gaining +sell value mult.
@@Deathpunch93 wdym? i put 6 to 10 as valyes it could've been, if it was 6 and the egg was worth 19, it would give +0.3x mult and 1 more to start off the next 6 gold
Dunno if you've tried this yet, the blind joker with blueprint is funny.. you can get +6 hands by duplicating the blind joker with blueprint, then move the blueprint to duplicate another joker as soon as the "battle" starts. In general the fact that you can move jokers anytime makes blueprint so good.
It'll probably make more sense in the full game when the runs are longer as it can scale as long as you keep buying jokers and gets rid of ones used temporarily with a small benefit.
It would be an extreme power if it gained half of the mult and chips from the destroyed card, example: destroy odd tood and now ceremonial dagger gives +10 chips to odds, and if you destroy a zane joker, half of its four of a kind mult goes to the dagger, ofc, it wouldn't be compatible with some jokers like blueprint
I think that in a world where it’s easier to put modifiers on Jokers like polyschrome would make the knife better since they drastically increase the sell value
if it is changed to add the buy price, or permently gives X0.1 per $ sell value, it can be acceptable as you know bus is common and add 1 mult per hand, equivlent to $1 per mult if you are stacking, and the dagger is uncommon and equivlent to $2 per mult,and takes 1 joker slot when stacking(and accidently kills the Xn joker if you forget to move the card)
My first suggestion for the dagger would be that it should at least also give you the sell value of the eaten Joker in gold as well as in mult. As it requires so much money to keep feeding the dagger, giving you the sell value back as a refund would partially offset the amount spent while still giving (typically) less mult than the eaten Joker would otherwise give.
Get an 8 ball, Tarot & Superposition & crank your deck to mac out on these, then each time a random joker tarot spawns use it & place the joker to the right of it
One addition to make it way better would be the ability to enable or disable it. You want it to be played first before all your times multipliers in the late game but then you would have to eat something every round. Youre kinda forced to make it the 5th joker when you dont want to remove any
Tried to use this joker recently, then supernova outscaled it so fast 🤡 I even sacked a holographic joker to it and not much happened. This thing depends on egg and that’s sad
I can’t stand the ceremonial dagger even though I think it’s a cool idea and the flavor of it is cool but it’s just too weak. They just gotta buff it a bit
Probably doesn’t help a knife build (which needs a good passive economy) when you sacrifice a _negative business card_ (super consistent passive economy) immediately? The Dagger only works with a really strong passive econ, but it doesn’t really work in this iteration until you get access to all the other vouchers and cards (notably Satellite). The Hone voucher combined with a consistent passive income Joker allows you to buy expensive foil/holo/poly jokers easily, which you can then determine which way they are more valuable in either keeping or feeding.
@@samuellanghus1455 I accomplished it last night while trying out random seeds, got a blind skip for a spectral pack, turneda whole set into 9s, from there I managed to beat it after 9 attempts of learning the seed, now to do a blind seed.
@@bobson_dugnutt In fifty-two hands, you would have _no_ deck. Besides, I don’t think you realize how that would impact the complexity of what hands you go for. Higher-end straights kill off middle cards; flushes even out the distribution automatically. It’s not as easy as you might make it sound.
![I Can’t Launch My Ship! [Starship Hunter] - Hearthstone: The Great Dark Beyond](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Xv17Oh8jQHg/mqdefault.jpg)
the fact that the discounts reduce the sell value of cards you buy is weird enough, but that it applies retroactively to cards you've already bought at full price is awful
Wouldn’t call it “awful.” Vouchers allow for three opportunities per ante to be purchased, so you can plan around it.
It’s not perfect, but not impossible to work around.
Maybe if it gave 2 times the sell value as mult? That's probably way too op with egg so perhaps add a flat +2 in addition to the sell value for each sacrifice
Maybe if it gave half the sell back money that’d be cool so you aren’t losing all the sell value
A +1 or +2 to the sell value would do wonders for making the dagger viable in runs. Currently it’s only good as a pivot off of egg. The other problem is that the dagger has anti-synergy with loyalty card and blackboard, which makes it detrimental to many types of runs.
@@pyritepanx That's a pretty good idea! Makes it much less money intensive
what about increasing chips a little bit as well? like a +5/+10 chips to give it a little edge. don't know if that wouldn't make a difference or be too op lol
I don't think it would be actually op to be 2x the sell value turned into mult, as you said, it would be very nice with egg, but I still think it would be kind of mediocre with anything else
Clearance Sale is actually bad for the dagger because it also reduces the base sell value of every card by 25%.
Edit: I see that you figured it out, but it really hurt you early in the run because nearly every joker gave you less mult than you deserved.
That definitely seems like an unintended consequence of Clearance Sale, and hopefully they patch that effect out.
Yeah some very quick math for the first 30 unique jokers I saw, you'd be spending like 20% more gold to get the same multi on the dagger.
It's worth noting the reason it's so bad is because a lot of jokers fall in that 4 to 8 gold range where you either spend more gold per multi or the ratio stays the same.
Especially 4 cost jokers before the clearance sale. They are both super common and the worst ones affected by the changed sell price.
It is insanely slow scaling and the cost of constantly buffing it is way too much. Maybe it can be okay with stencil or we get more synergies with destroying jokers, but as is youre much better off with something like a bus
But it's really funny with the egg
If you have egg it's like a dromedary
just remember stencil needs to be on the right, so start the blind with dagger on the right then move it left
I also want Hiker to be a good joker. Maybe if it scaled the scaling, so +1 the first time it hits a card then +2 the second, etc. I don't even know if that would be good yet or not, but it's a start.
Hiker seems alright to me. Especially in a 5 of a kind deck, were you are always playing the exact same 5 cards. It begins to suck when you're spreading it out over a lot of cards.
@@thexp905 different instances of the same card are tracked separately for it.
@@beautifulnova6088 Yeah, I know. I'm basically saying you want to play exactly the same hand every time. It's still not the most useful one, but it's not worthless. Combine it with like, Blueprint and the one that doubles the cards played (Yes, I know they are up there as some of the strongest jokers, but it's the run I happened to get with them) you can very easily buff the chips 4 times per hand. So after 2 hands with the same cards, they are nearly doubled in value.
I think it should work like the planet joker. The one where you use a planet card it gains .1x mult. .1x mult per joker eaten sounds way better and more balanced than gaining +sell value mult.
I like this idea a lot actually.
i like this,but i think the good middle ground is 0.1x mult gained for every 6 - 10 dollars from sacrificing a Joker's sell value
@@Qyubij how would that work for the egg? Would the mult stack or would it just be incompatible?
@@Deathpunch93 Well, enhanced rares and negative uncommons sell for better than than $10 IIRC, so it wouldn’t be limited to just NorthernLion.
@@Deathpunch93 wdym? i put 6 to 10 as valyes it could've been, if it was 6 and the egg was worth 19, it would give +0.3x mult and 1 more to start off the next 6 gold
Dunno if you've tried this yet, the blind joker with blueprint is funny.. you can get +6 hands by duplicating the blind joker with blueprint, then move the blueprint to duplicate another joker as soon as the "battle" starts.
In general the fact that you can move jokers anytime makes blueprint so good.
That's what icely puzzle does to abuse 'ride the bus' multiplier
That ending is how most of my flush builds seem to go.
It'll probably make more sense in the full game when the runs are longer as it can scale as long as you keep buying jokers and gets rid of ones used temporarily with a small benefit.
unfortunately it doesn't
It would be an extreme power if it gained half of the mult and chips from the destroyed card, example: destroy odd tood and now ceremonial dagger gives +10 chips to odds, and if you destroy a zane joker, half of its four of a kind mult goes to the dagger, ofc, it wouldn't be compatible with some jokers like blueprint
I think that in a world where it’s easier to put modifiers on Jokers like polyschrome would make the knife better since they drastically increase the sell value
Spectral Packs? Wheel of Fortune?
@@samuellanghus1455 Spectrals are rare by themselves, wheel is 1 in 5. And there's almost always better option.
@@Ranto294 Hone? Skipping blinds?
if it is changed to add the buy price, or permently gives X0.1 per $ sell value, it can be acceptable
as you know bus is common and add 1 mult per hand, equivlent to $1 per mult if you are stacking, and the dagger is uncommon and equivlent to $2 per mult,and takes 1 joker slot when stacking(and accidently kills the Xn joker if you forget to move the card)
Lmaoo that ending was rough lmaoo
My first suggestion for the dagger would be that it should at least also give you the sell value of the eaten Joker in gold as well as in mult.
As it requires so much money to keep feeding the dagger, giving you the sell value back as a refund would partially offset the amount spent while still giving (typically) less mult than the eaten Joker would otherwise give.
Get an 8 ball, Tarot & Superposition & crank your deck to mac out on these, then each time a random joker tarot spawns use it & place the joker to the right of it
You should try 4 finger + smeared joker for incredibly easy straight flushes, very fun build
One addition to make it way better would be the ability to enable or disable it. You want it to be played first before all your times multipliers in the late game but then you would have to eat something every round. Youre kinda forced to make it the 5th joker when you dont want to remove any
I paired dagger joker with hollow joke r that gives *mult per empty space, decent enough to get to late game.
Tried to use this joker recently, then supernova outscaled it so fast 🤡 I even sacked a holographic joker to it and not much happened. This thing depends on egg and that’s sad
I can’t stand the ceremonial dagger even though I think it’s a cool idea and the flavor of it is cool but it’s just too weak. They just gotta buff it a bit
Probably doesn’t help a knife build (which needs a good passive economy) when you sacrifice a _negative business card_ (super consistent passive economy) immediately?
The Dagger only works with a really strong passive econ, but it doesn’t really work in this iteration until you get access to all the other vouchers and cards (notably Satellite).
The Hone voucher combined with a consistent passive income Joker allows you to buy expensive foil/holo/poly jokers easily, which you can then determine which way they are more valuable in either keeping or feeding.
do we know what seed this is
I've completed every hand type except for 5 of a kind. Just can't ever get enough Planet X. Random seeds too.
Spectral pack “all one suit” and/or Abandoned deck help considerably.
You will need Tarot and spectral packs up the wazoo.
@@samuellanghus1455 I accomplished it last night while trying out random seeds, got a blind skip for a spectral pack, turneda whole set into 9s, from there I managed to beat it after 9 attempts of learning the seed, now to do a blind seed.
What if dagger destroyed the right most card in your played hand every turn adding it chip value to its mult?
Could work, not sure how fun it'd be tho
That's way too strong. Gains 2-10x mult per hand compared to 1x for bus. And it lets you thin out your deck.
@@bobson_dugnutt In fifty-two hands, you would have _no_ deck.
Besides, I don’t think you realize how that would impact the complexity of what hands you go for. Higher-end straights kill off middle cards; flushes even out the distribution automatically.
It’s not as easy as you might make it sound.
Certificate and golden ticket are worse
What’s certificate again?
it swaps chips and mult when a gold seal card is scored
Killing your negative joker for just 5 mult hurt so bad I had to stop watching
W
4th