Can the DJI Goggles Replace your Fatshark Goggles for Analog Drones?
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- Опубликовано: 16 сен 2024
- Can the new guys in town create a better viewing experience than the old timers?
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This is literally the biggest thing pushing me towards getting that DJI setup for my wife - if it makes that usable for flying whoops, and I can build her some dedicated cruising rigs, that's the answer. Will definitely use those aff links - just have to wait and see if it's a firmware fix, or if it requires a V2 to really sort it.
@@tehllama42 so cool that your wife flys!!!!
So you should list what YOU want DJI to fix and have US ALL call them and ask when or if this is on their list... LOL and see if it gets moved UP that said list! :0)
Hey I was wondering where to get your fatshark goggles the all green ones are they custom? I cant find those anywhere thank you
There is an additional latency on the analog input of 150ms comparing with the fatshark. Tested with the LED ldr measured on a scope. Glass to glass latency Swift to fatshark 1 about 14ms, glass to glass latency Swift to dji analog input 164ms. So there is three chose of the strange not direct feeling. Glass to glass in digital mode I've even seen as low as 23ms, so that's the way to go with this goggles
That's the key information - I suspect there is some processing or something going on that is adding that latency, which is a bummer... maybe there is a straightforward fix.
There is no way that was 164 ms. That would be unflyable. NURK has no issues flying in close proximity. So whatever he was doing here was NOT causing 160+ ms of delay. I think someone posted that ntsc vs pal was causing the latency issue.
Resource links
Yeah, somehow I read that as 64ms - which is about what you get from a worst case combo of flying 16CH XSR with mismatched heartbeats through a Gen1 RunCam Eagle on a poorly tuned quad. When you go from that to a proper race quad latency, it feels precisely how they're describing... and I've accidentally tested precisely that in the last week, with about the same results
No really 164ms glass to glass, for my dji goggle at least. It was in pal mode so maybe if I try ntsc there is a difference. I will test that and make a video about in and give the link. I think because the goggle is all digital there is a analog video adc in there too convert the analog video to digital and that is adding the latency. Like a capture card in you computer. Always latency
Try racing the HD system with the DJI TX in DJI_HDL mode. It is 5ms frames (xfire is 6.67ms and switches up to 20ms in pretty short range). You need to also "set sbus_baud_fast=on" in CLI.
WIll try it out shortly!
@@NURKFPV Guys, This is great data, testing, and feedback!
Thanks for your efforts, (A lurking engineer)
I love how you just zip around your house like your flying a 2" quad.
Glad to see they've fixed these issues since this video was published.
Can the DJI FPV air unit be used for airplane/Fixed wing operations?? It does have 8 channels.
Changed my PIDs to match what you have on your Cinewhoop and it made a world of difference. Forgot where I found them earlier so I am just publicly thanking you here ;)
Could u share theses PID please? I am currently PID tuning my quad, but can’t find something perfect.
Hi Nurk,
I did notice lots of excitement about DJI new fpv system, so I would like to share the experience I had and have with DJI as a company as a “Big Rig” pilot. I do fly heavy platforms like Matrice 600 with DJI Ronin MX+Red and other(not important here) as 107. One thing DJI does all the time is once they get new gizmo or idea they completely abandon the support for older platforms. They just drop it. No more software updates, no more interest in keeping the expensive product released earlier up to date. Hope it will not apply to their new baby- fpv system, but won’t bet here, so I personally will wait with spending my money on DJI. Hope they will change their ways, but don’t really count on it.
Love your videos, especially the LR.
O yeah!!! Waiting for others to come out with H.D. is the way to go unless your really well off lol!!! This is a really expensive hobby but its worth it if you ask me!!!
Im a newbie and confused i thought with the dji goggles you have to run the air unit and you cant use other goggles with that system but i just seen you switch goggles with the same drone? But dude you can frickin fly holy shiz man !!!
very in
formative !! Give it a year maby 2 and we shall have digital ! Im excited
Thanks for doing the thorough testing! I'm glad you spent the time to record quantitative results from the DJI goggles rather than relying on you subjective observations. If there's some kind of signal processor that's introducing latency I'm curious if setting the refresh *slower* might help take load off that component and result in lower latency? Probably won't make any real difference, but it was a thought I had.
If I had this guy's setup of being able to take off from the roof, then I'd never need to leave home to do freestyle.
The reason i like fpv is cause of the challenge of the build. The challege of the flight. This is too easy. When getting break up and making it under a bridge i go home to look at my go pro to be amazed at what i made. It was a challege. I guess im a soul flyer. And if u ever had a dji quad and it flew past u and youre digital feed is telling u its still coming. Then i lost trust in digital signals. Especially when im a mile out on a 1000mw vtx if done right it looks perfect. Feels great and i trust it.
Im a beginner!! do you recommend to buy fatsharks or wait and buy dji fpv googles?
the same reason you think they would hinder you in racing is why someone like me wouldn't be able to use them just yet with freestyle because I fly quick and snappy not slow and drifty when i freestyle but for a brand new beginner I would suggest using dji setup so they have the clear digital video feed, just make sure you know your limits of range because when digital goes out of range it cuts out not gets fuzzy haha
Nice job Nurk. I trust your sensitivity to latency more than my own.
Could it be a problem of just too big fov?
I thought sometimes racers fly with even lower than hdo fov to be more zoomed in...
Also if your goggles have larger fov your FPV cams lens should also be more wide angle I guess. But anyhow, great effort put into this video, thanks Paul!
So.. I may of missed it, does he have the same wobbly feel during racing if he used the DJI digital AIR units instead of feeding the goggles analog like he did in the video?
Thank you very much! Great comparison :)
"It was beeping at me through the window" - lmao!!!
Great review! I hope DJI continues to follow the path to perfecting the digital and analog AIO goggles.
For somebody just starting out, and looking to do primarily cinematic flying - I think this is actually still all good news. Can you fly a whoop with it? Can you fly a small 'pick style quad with it? Can you run dedicated HD rigs with it? For a lot of people, that would be a 'good enough' answer.
As somebody just entering the same vague pace Paul races at (I figure ~3s/lap off on that track), I notice latency anywhere in the system (like the latest OpenTX builds that fix the stupid FrSky D16 inconsistent latency issue and actually let you hit 12ms locked latency on 8ch), but for most people getting into the hobby, that's going to be really quite adequate. It's like trying to game competitively on 120ms ping, you have to basically relearn reactionary and instinctive stuff when going to a low-ping environment, and certain purely reactionary stuff just doesn't really exist as a thing when you're pushing the limit... but when you're looking at a 120g Air Unit anyway, I think that's a market DJI doesn't care about... yet.
But the real question is: Is Nurk a closet seamstress??
When I finally got the opportunity to see through the goggles it was Fat Shark and it was the 2nd set that they came out with. It was like sitting in a theatre watching a 32 inch tv from the seats in the back. The video was really bad. He says that the batteries were low. It was not immersive to me. I bought the DJI goggles v2 and hoping they are much better. There is no place around here you can actually see them.
I want to feel like I am sitting in the cockpit of the drone. I know its going to be screens at a distance but hoping its much better than the fat sharks. I like the video with the camera on the float plane. If that is what you see through the goggles, I will be super happy.
Great post!!! Flying in H.D. must be so much fun!!!!! Thanks 4 taking the time 2 post this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Great Flying & Great Channel!!
👍😀👍
Thank you for the comparison of freestyle and hardcore numbers in racing.. Enjoy the Breeze..👍🏻🍻👊🏻
Excellent content! Thank you for taking the time to go through all of this with everybody experimenting with DJI goggles... this is on point!👍👍
Uou got no antennas on the dji
Good evening my drone brother. Thanks for sharing this great video with us. I am seriously thinking on buying a pair of goggles, but not these. I am going to buy the Dji goggles, but the older model. Keep up the good work. Please keep those good videos coming.
Have a great evening Captain 👨✈️.
Thanks for all you do and please keep flying.
The old goggle were horrible and had even more latency
Well thanks sooo much for the updates about the older model goggles. So you are telling me that the older model goggles work worse than these new ones?
@@AdrianMateoDrones Yes the old ones (racing edition) had more latency
Great video. This is very interesting and helpful information. Thank you!
13:38 is just silly
any time you change the FOV (either for your eyes, or for your fpv cam lens) you will notice a huge difference in feel and it takes some time to get used to it. I used to fly headplay hd's.... it's just a completely different perspective.
I always heard that converting digital to analog signal takes time and horsepower.
I highly recommend running a wider FOV lens when you run wider FOV goggle. i bought a 1.4mm lens years ago to try this with the headplays... never got around to try it :-/
DATA!!!!
Very interesting and informative video. Was great that you tested freestyle and racing over multiple lipos. Cool that dji discussed the issues with you.
Thanks Nurk 👍😎
I have the DJI goggles but not the drone yet should I get this adapter to learn or should I just get a DGI air unit drawn thanks
Awesome video mate, informative and honest. Good job
I feel like a frame drop, it's just bypass some frame and then jump to the newer frame ahead, that what I feel if I used digital and analog
you are using the clearview as a repeater, so yes you may have a small delay, I do the same with 2.4 going into 5.8.
Good comment about the refresh rate. Problem about that is analog is stuck to 60fps in NTSC, or 50fps in PAL. So no benefit can be gained from the goggles higher refresh rate.
There is a video checking the latency -
Nathaniel Akkermans made a video - DJI FPV latency test
. - Dji mostly sucks at analog ;)
Really great video... enjoyed the analysis...
Great video! Answers a lot of questions. How are you able to get such a great feed from inside your house?
I would definitely encourage you to race the HD system, FalloCP lowered is best Global qualifier by more than 1 second on his 2nd DJI test run. If he was allowed to keep that best time he would be in a better position on the GQ list.
Does anybody want my HDOs? I have not used them since I bought the DJI FPV system.
Lol. I'm in the same boat. Built 2 quads with DJI gear and haven't flown analogue since.
@@Mark_R.Do you think that is fair? Whatever you think is fair ; and if I agree, lets make a deal.
$30
40 $ with free shipping to🇨🇭 😉
$40.01 and I’ll pay shipping 😉
thanks for this ! exactly what I needed to see !
Like on PC in gaming. It is skipping frames due the difference in input and display refresh rate. On PC they use V-sync to synchronise the output image. Without you might be skipping frames what feels like latency.
great stuff nurk! not sure if you tried further testing with this set up, but for freestyle, do you think you can fly analog using your method of plugging in your googles to the dji goggles? Is that slight delay very noticable? (note: I saw your summary around 26:00 mark,but wondering if you tested anything further?)
Great review NURK!!!
Good work man. Cheers.
I called them at release about the DVR ability of the AV Input and they couldn't tell me, as their engineers 'had never tested it.' So they were a non-starter for me.
its very odd that there is any additional lag compared to a fatshark module, theres obviously no need for there to be any additional processing so it must be some sort of step down in processing from the digital software instead of a bypass of the dji digital system. i really hope dji get this sorted because it will lower the cost of switching to dji and provide a great way into a full digital system by spreading the cost and delaying obsolescence of analogue systems.
ill bet the response time of the screens is bad and thats what's causing the issue.. with a high response time it would do exactly what we all felt when trying to fly with them and move quick... you can have a 240hz monitor but if the response time is shit then the monitor is still bad.. if that makes sense to ya :)
Good info. Thanks!
Really informative and well presented video. I'm new to drones (ex 3d Heli pilot) and wanted to ask this question. Still rekon DJIs are for me. Cheers.
the update fixed most of the issues he mentioned :) get them..
You should make a update video as DJI says the FW update will make less delay. would be nice to see what a pro thinks. thanks
did DJI analog system still like this in 2020?
Pretty stellar testing man, That picture must be super sexy to put up with all those negatives...
Yall can have your DJI's.. I'm simply not interested. Sticking with my HD2'S! Lol
Great video Nurk.
I would say it's like driving a family van on a very curvy road and your used to drive it with a racing car
DJI has that new self ejecting DC Plug. alot of people are having that issue with the power cable randomly coming out on its own, even in mid flight. my fatsharks when plugged in are not going to self eject the power cable.
Great video man 👍
This is really a video I have wanted to see.
I wonder if lowering the goggles refresh rate to match PAL/NTSC would help. I mean, you make the onboard processor processes more than twice the frames it really needs to. And if switching between the two makes a difference.
Also there is an HDMI in on the dji goggle, right? is there a good external analog receiver that outputs low latency HDMI, so that the dji goggle can remain in the digital realm? Which possibly could reduce its latency.
Watched it all Best review
Was I seeing that right, the Clearview was inside the house right in front of you while you flew outside? If so I'm kinda impressed how good the signal was.
Pretty weird, really. Maybe the way the DJI goggles process AV in? Really curious!
At that level the, cable between the reciever and the Goggles makes a difference. Seems to be a analog cable, how long is it?
If you are talking about latency. Practically, no it doesn't.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velocity_factor
So the analog on dji works only in 4:3? Can it do 16:9 the native aspect ratio?
I have DJI racing edition goggles and I saw somebody on RUclips connect the fimi a3 But I can't figure out how to connect the drone to my fimi x8 se can you tell me how?
I know this is a bit of an older video .. curious if the dji goggles Dvr analog yet ?
I'm thinking that it might be how they process picures different in center and peripherally? I don't use the system yet but cant really see from a technical stand point why the anlogue should get a higher latency than Fattsharks (if they don't process that image in some way). If they just project the analogue signal it's just the latency of the screen that might differ from Fatsharks and that cant be within what can be felt in the sticks. I was gonna use mine both witth RapidFire and digital but I both race and freestyle so before I know what it is you guys felt, for sure in black and white, I think I will hold off. :/
I want to boo this video like you were booing other pilots at Mid America Throwdown but you provided good information so I appreciate that.
You should do a slowmo camera light flash and count frames to find out the latency.
The input lag has been fixed by software updates, is that correct?
@NURK FPV clearview or rapid fire what’s ur preference
Is the no dvr still accurate?
You think the drl courses would be even more intense in hd, or how does it handle lights ?
What receivers do you use on your drones for your futaba radio?
Is it possible that the dji transmitter could perform better ?
You have to change bf to nstc not auto. So it reduces latency in analog.
does every drone pilot have a cold all the time?
Sounds like they don't give much of a shit about analog at all tbh.
Not surprised they're trying to force a walled garden on these goggles. Make using analog just enough of a pain in the ass and they'll be able to lock you into the DJI camera system only. Easiest thing they could have done was just to put a cheap 5.8 receiver in it, but nope.
Your house is perfect spot for FPV.
How do you pair it ??? Or even turn it on?
The fatsharks and the goggles might operate at 60hz but the cameras on the drones (the analog ones at least) only operate at 30 for NTSC and 24 for PAL. So the refresh rate means very little in this instance.
IDK what the camera on the DJI system operates at though.
60 for ntsc and 50 for pal, with interlacing. 120 hz monitor would make no difference.
@@trapromo 120 / 60 = 2. With means two frames on the screen shows the same one picture from the Camera, if you use 60. If you use 50 on the Camera the framerates dosen't match. It makes a difference.
The 3d prints for mounting modules to the DJI goggles you talked about, you have sources for it?
iFlight sells them
You forgot to ask DJI what's up with the power connector. I think it's should be more solid than it is. Comes undone too easily. And I have seen other owners mentioning the same experience.
you could have thrown a stopwatch in from of the quad and measured the latency difference and settle the matter.. :)
I had the same thing happen with glyphs and the dock king hdmi. It's enough delay to screw you up. It's probably latency in the interface but I am no expert lol. It will never feel normal.
they are missing the community if none of the analog support is in the roadmap...
Thanks for the test. If they improve the analogue aspects I could see myself crossing over...Is it possible you could do a latency test with the goggles and compare with the HDO?
you didnt have your antennas on your dji goggles .
He was using the clearview receiver.
So called Drone racing is more like obstacle racing. I would prefer to see drone racing like stock car, then formula 1
Very good video ;))))
Do a video with the rapid fire in (Y)
How did you get the green shell for the hdo’s?
Drone racing league
NURK FPV well there goes me getting one, lol.
29v lipo? are you using 7s? good video
No my voltage scaling is messed up haha
Thank you Mr. Nurk for your thorough Wurk! I was really surprised how many FPV pilots are ready to sell their analog gear after trying digital. Since quads and whoops can record HD, I can’t watch any normal DVR anymore. I am sure I won’t go back once I try DJI digital. Might I be an HD whore 🤷🏻♂️🤣?
If you can afford it why not!!? I would love to fly with H.D. goggles!!!! Happy flying brother!!
DRONE review man of all drones might just do that soon my friend. Happy flying!
The analog cameras output at 27 fps, the dji refresh rate is much higher than that, could be why it feels off, ive noticed that myself. Some cameras are better, some have 0 weirdness some are absolutely unflyable.
My fatsharks are on eBay. Don't race, only freestyle and I'm not 1/2 the pilot Nurk is so a bit of latency is imperceptible to me. I just like seeing where I'm going.
All the green
How did you manage to get a 28volt pack :D
That is some serious drone shit if iv ever seen some! Lol
There is no really big advantage to 120hz panel because NTSC is 60hz
... the 120hz reduces eye strain .... good luck :-)