Understanding Autistic Rage - Navigating its Impact on Relationships
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- Опубликовано: 10 мар 2024
- Hi! I'm Orion Kelly and I'm Autistic. On this video I explore the topic of Autistic Rage. Plus, I share my personal lived experiences as an #actuallyautistic person. #orionkelly #autism #asd #autismsigns #whatautismfeelslike
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Orion Kelly is an #ActuallyAutistic vlogger (RUclipsr), podcaster, radio host, actor, keynote speaker and Autistic advocate based in Australia. Orion is all about helping you increase your understanding, acceptance and appreciation of Autistic people.
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As someone who does experience autistic rage please do know that it’s never okay to hit or abuse others, you can refrain from those behaviours even when you are enraged!
Thanks so much for saying this. I needed to know that somebody with ASD understood this. Because I myself am ND, I have OCD and Major Depressive Disorder. I was with my AuDHD EX for 13 yrs. I see too often on ND videos the assumption that partners or caregivers are by default healthy NT, and don't acknowledge that family or partners to those with ASD can also have a diagnosis that has its own challenges.
The notion that the person with ASD takes priority over everyone else is very prevalent and left me constantly trying to hide, diminish and take on the emotional turmoil for two while being the recipient of autistic rage. It caused so much resentment, self esteem plummeted and caused me to self harm as an outlet.
I constantly felt invalidated and dismissed, my own sensory and ND symptoms overlooked and even my attempts to end my existence were mocked as "dramatic and whiny" or that i was "an insufferable c*nt". I couldn't ask my partner to please let me disengage or consider my emotional state. My issues with auditory stimulus like screaming or aggression meant that I asked them not to yell while I'm a foot away from him, and i was told I was trying to control him.
I endured so much emotional and verbal ab**e, and it really reinforced trauma I had. He was slowly escalating to physical aggression, not just verbal. He just couldn't or wouldn't understand that other's needs mattered too, especially as partners with similar and overlapping symptoms. I was treated as NT in an insulting way because my diagnosis wasn't seen as equally important.
I'm convinced that if I'd stayed, I'd be in a DV situation. Thankfully, I'm in a new, wonderful relationship with a partner who has done the work to understand and communicate to the best of his ability while having respect and understanding for my own process.
@@ophilianecrI'm so glad you got yourself out of that dangerous and damaging situation and you're safe now.
Absolutely! It’s also not ok to be verbally abusive!
@@ophilianecran autistic person can also be a narcissist although rare
Unfortunately allistic people seem to think that it's inevitable and get rid of you before their "fears" come true.
The most important thing is to let an autistic person experience the rage by allowing them to rest and leave the situation without judging them and making them feel even worse.
This!
When is Self diagnosed 18 months ago, my mom started changing how she reacts when I’m having a rage or meltdown moment. And damn if I’ve never felt more seen and less judged. It made me wish we’d figured things out sooner, even tho trying to pursue things in the 90s wouldn’t have been great necessarily.
IF ONLY! No, instead then they add to it - instead they may leave me, triggering more abandonment trauma. They may escalate it worse than it needs to be. They think I'm YELLING AT THEM because it's a conscious choice I've made with some agenda behind it, not that I'm just flipping out and overwhelmed to the point of a breakdown...
@@MoonbearStartigerI actually experience both and think the best way to handle such situations -for me!- is to walk out, have a moment for myself to calm down and then for the other person to come to me and talk it out/hug ( luckily this mostly happens with people close to me)
This. Biggest thing in my fam.... It's ok to walk away if your feelings get too big😅.... Come back when you're calmer and able to communicate again.... Usually starts with hugs, apologies if anything was done/ said that was inappropriate ( slamming a door, hurtful words..... And this is for me, Dad, and Son ... Son is the only diagnosed Autistic person at this moment, also acute ADHD....... Hubby and I currently have diagnosis that are often misdiagnosed for undiagnosed Autistic people....( bipolar disorder type 1 and BPD for myself with past diagnosis of ADHD and Depression.... Got some other things looking into for myselves to get diagnosed as well..... Hubby has past diagnosis of general anxiety, social anxiety, and depression)😅
Things got so much easier for all of us, when we all realized it was better to allow each other time to walk away.
Helped my Hubby and I a lot, when we realized his " demon growl" anytime we asked him/ reminded him about a chore, needing to take a bath, etc.... was just his Go To Stim for transitions he's not expecting.... Now, as long as he " does the thing" within the time period agreed upon... We allow him to growl all he wants.... Cause he's not growling " At Us" .... He's growling at the situation, or himself 😅
I will say this..... I have to apologize to him for unkind words more often .... Than he has to us...( Hearing my parents words come out my mouth sometimes sucks... Especially cause I don't feel that way, except in that moment for some reason... But someone walks away, I come back... Apologize... and if there was a real worry behind the mess, explain, ex:
Unkind words said " I hope you never need a roommate in order to afford a place to live"
Worry behind the words
I know you need to Stim, but some of your stims will make living with a roommate difficult, and in this economy, you'll need one once Mom and Dad are gone( hubby and myselves are not doing well physically or mentally.... Just lucky Hubby can still work)
He wasn't ready to talk about that at that time....( Don't blame him, I'm not ready to face our failing health) Dad's working on mini talks about what's going on, what comes next, etc....during walks
Orion: "Autistic people pre experience incoming events"
Me in the shower: expend 95% of shower time planning every social interaction for the next day or week, every email at work, and trying to foresee every possible response. Or regretting past experiences.
Regret is my normal bedfellow. Right before I go to bed, I relive shit moments, embarrassing moments. Dreams suck.
This!!!! I refer to shower time as cringe time!
If we don't plan for a dozen different contingencies we wont have any idea how to react in the moment. We'll be stuck there, staring blankly, trying to process what has happened.
I write lists when I'm stressed. I write exactly what I'm going to say, what I'm going to do, how the day will plan out.
The night before is usually spent tossing and turning worrying about every possible scenario imaginable. I plan scripts for every possible conversation I can think of.
It's exhausting. I'm so tired.
I used to do that before I retreated into my isolated fantasy world. Now I just have debates and convos with myself and my one very likely autistic bff
I had a few autistic students in classes I used to teach, and I think I saw that stereotype of "sudden enraged Hulk" unfairly put on one of them by my coworkers. This one student was signed up for my after-school class, and other teachers tried to warn me that he was apparently really "scary" amd angry. I hadn't met him yet, so I heard their advice and hoped for the best.
I'll tell you this supposedly "scary" child was an absolute ANGEL in my class. He'd come up to my desk every day before class began and show me a new random object in his school bag, and I always appreciated him coming to say hi! He had a volunteer that would accompany him to classes in case he had troubles, but eventually the volunteer would drop him off in my class on his own because he was fine. The other kids had no problems with him, either! They all got along. My coworkers would ask me if I was okay with him in my class and I was SO confused by that question 😅
In fact, the ONLY time I saw this student become enraged was when another kid was picking on him in the middle of a regular class and wouldn't stop. I realized he wasn't just suddenly raging for no reason like the other teachers had me believe; he even seemed embarrassed by it after he calmed down. Sure his reaction wasn't GOOD, it was a bit scary, but it made sense! He only got mad when he couldn't handle being picked at. Odd that they left that VERY important detail out when they "warned" me about him...
From the austistic side, this is an all-too-common experience. Bullies are experts at baiting vulnerable kids and then getting sympathy from authority figures for the reaction that comes. Tbh, plenty of adult bullies play that game too. I was lucky enough to find safe spaces like your classroom where nonsense like that is unnecessary because everyone is getting their sensory and attention needs met, especially the bully types, so no one is instigating
@@lightbeingform yeah. And at least I can understand that behavior from children, but I really can't understand it in adults. It doesn't even take much to try to consider WHY a student might feel a certain way, instead of just placing a judgement on them and making that their whole personality
(but the autistic or otherwise ND students tended to be the ones I got along with best, so maybe that's no surprise on my end haha)
as somebody who was in school and has the same diagnosis. its not meant negativ, bc you are the exception that proofs what i say and i tend to speak a little bit more fgor germany than america. (68bewegung) but a sedated, underdeveloped nutjob too young to buy cigarettes is still way more advanced than the MOST teachers and you see a, the younger the classes the crazier the horrors.
@@lightbeingform Can you say more on “because everyone is getting their sensory and attention needs met, especially the bully types, so no one is instigating”.
I am a later-in-life diagnosed ASD female and I am slowly coming to a place of empathy for some of my lifelong bullies, post No-contact and some time to heal. Your comment made me wonder: What are the needs of the bully that are healthy and do not harm me?? I do not want to be narcissistic supply, but if I can reasonably assist the other hurting persons in the relationships by meeting their needs….well….idk, your comment seemed to describe some sort of potential utopia that sounds great:) What pieces to the puzzle am I missing??
@@Nitsirk7131 It's actually never up to the victim to do anything to stop from being bullied. The best we can do is work on removing ourselves from their purview. If you can't, find allies. Negotiating With A Bully is a great book, btw
Orion, I concur with you on all points. I would add that my undiagnosed Dad's autistic rage definitely has additional trauma impact on me during childhood.
Exactly the same experience with me, my mother is still with him, he's better, but still does not know how to deal with the rage, and for religious reasons, my family (except me) does not seek a psychologist or psychiatrist for help, which is sad, but well, harder to change so late in life.
Ah yes! This for me also. My dad had rage issues but I believe it was because he could not cope with the demands of my mum. He was on the spectrum, albeit undiagnosed. It affected me but I understand him and his reasons…he was different once my parents divorced. I miss him terribly, well, I miss them both terribly actually
Now..... imagine the effects of our parents undiagnosed parents during World War 2 and highly volatile social times on them and how they were expected to raise us with love and growth.
I'm so sorry. This is my husband. He rages often and just does not understand the impact that it has had on the household (we have two older kids). I've asked, pleaded and cried to get him to either stop or walk away when he gets upset and all he does is firmly or angrily state that he's "not upset," or "not angry." He just says he's not going to wear a mask in his own house. I don't know what to do anymore. 😢
Gentle hugs to all of you.
7:21 OMG YES. why can't you just do what I do and explain your intentions first, an ask after we get on the same starting thought
I get autistic rage. I see how systems should work and when they don’t I lose it.
I can't stand stupid systems.
Something that triggers my rage: sudden schedule changes with little to no warning.
Nothing leads to me feeling disregulated faster than that.
yeah, blargh
😔Transitions...
I didn't realize how much it showed until my boss said "I know you hate changing things half way through" when I had never mentioned it 😅
Thanks for the vid!
guess you could say that is actually a decent manager who pays attention to his workers
@@randomCHELdad yeah. before i knew i was autistic, i yelled at my manager for changing my planned cashier role (that i hate) for my preferred actual job in petcare (which i like) one day. she was so confused why i was mad at her for helping me out and giving me the better job that i'd prefer. i tried to explain it, but she didn't understand why it would upset me.
I wish my managers would recognise that, instead they often make me do another task when I wasn't finished with the one I was doing.
boss gets a gold star for that
@@randomleopardcornManager: "Go do this thing."
Also my manager, while I'm in the middle of planning how to do the thing: "Come on, quickly! Go do it now!"
It's terribly sad to see marriages deteriorate and children traumatized because of this. In the end, almost everyone will say this one person's autism was the reason. While the autistic person probably had to swallow and self-regulate because of ten times the burden, and the outbursts were merely the echo of what they couldn't handle. And yet, the child frightened to the bones because of daddy's rage is very real.
Pretty sure both my parents were on the spectrum. In the late sixties. My childhood. Ouch.
Its a complex dynamic.
I'm autistic. I've experienced autistic rage in myself. Its horrid for all. As I came to understand myself as an autistic, I was more capable of recognising them and behaving more conciously.
I have experienced domestic abuse. That scarred me for life.
Now I am in a relationship with someone who can get angry. I am quite sure they are autistic too. They dont believe they are.. So i am torn between wether I am recognising autistic rage or just nasty anger. Either way, the more time passes, the less I feel I can deal with it and will eventually leave the idea of any relationships behind.
People are complex, coloured by their own history and beliefs.... Its not always as simple as good and bad. It's seldom black and whte. Which makes it all the harder for us to process.
In all honesty WOMEN have the worst and more frequent anger outbursts , and they can't calm down as quickly as men typically... yeah sometimes it could be dad's rage.... but 9 times outa 10 it's MUMS... only difference is women get away with it
I love how we are supposed to pity the oppressed autistic person while justifying their autistic rage that rains fire and hot embers, trauma, fear, violence and shock in the lives of everyone who has to be near them…the insanity of blame both ways but the autistic here get to blame the world and everything and everyone in it in attempts to justify their rage.
@@dantescave1 sounds like you've been hurt by this in your life. I'm sorry. Autism is not an excuse for abuse, and it doesn't explain away your feelings.
“Analysis paralysis” really gets to me.
I feel like my whole life is a failure bc of analysis paralysis 🙁
@@Gothgalactica I’m 52, and undiagnosed.
My husband makes fun of me for it. On the rare occasions that we’ve gone out to eat, he asks me where I want to go. I tell him I don’t know. He gets annoyed, so I ask him to give me 3 or 4 choices, so I can pick from them. Otherwise, we go nowhere.
Its really something you have to fight. On my own, I only get overwhelmed. But when I was in an abusive relationship, I was extremely easy to DARVO. If you dont find ways to control it, it will give people a way to control YOU.
It is totally okay to ask for understanding. But you have to know... There are people in the world that can see you can't self-soothe, and their eyes light up. Dollar signs, eureka! "Here is a controllable person."
That's why I wish there was therapy for the late-diagnosed. Bc a lot of us need to learn skills like that. We might be functional, but our assumption that others mean well and our tendency to be unable to control the overwhelm makes us basically chum for the abusive sharks.
Anger is basically catnip for those guys.
THIS ❤
Yep- I’m still not sure if my ex is a narc who likes doing this to me or an undiagnosed autistic person like myself
@@visionvixxen could easily be a bit of both. But one thing I, a diagnosed autistic person, have witnessed... I really don't feel the need to control people. I actually care very little. If they do not fit the patterns of behavior I wish, I just associate with them less. Narcissists really do feel the need to control people. So it could be both, but I feel the need to control is the difference.
I just burst into tears and people ask why I'm upset. It's hard to explain I'm actually in a rage 😂
I call the outbursts meltdowns and shutdowns still, because they still resemble them even though I have more control than I used to. Isolating myself always helps. I can cope safely and calm down.
I am late diagnosed autistic and ADHD and your videos have been so amazing to try and find the words to describe my mind. I got a job only a month or two after finding out. I experience meltdowns often and my manager continually points out that not many bosses are willing to talk things out. I understand this mentality but it feels very patronizing and like he is making me want to see him as so kind and humble. It made me even more upset in turn because I have already known that it is hard to get a job, especially with disabilities and in this economy. Thank you for your amazing content!
Most people (and you could be an exception) are not truly autistic and ADHD, but misdiagnosed as ADHD before the correct diagnosis of autism. The misdiagnosis is incredibly common.
@@charliewaters5289 People can absolutely be both. Without knowing their case history, you have no way of knowing. This is not helpful in the least to any part of the discussion and can be damaging. Completely inappropriate and uncalled for.
@@charliewaters5289 First, cite your sources for that claim, and Second, in this context, how is this information helpful and kind?
You may be right about your boss' virtue-signaling, or he may be trying to let you know that this is a rare situation and not to take it for granted.
I have autism and ADHD. They think that 40-60% of all having autism also have ADHD. I just wish there would be right from the start a more broader diagnosis than having to go to one assessment after the other.
Christ man. Thank you for this video. I have out bursts nearly every day and I do my best to hide them. I work as a mail man and am lucky to be alone for much of the day where I can just yell "FUCK" as loud as I can and no one else knows.
bus driver here, nothing like hopping off to check the engine compartment and yell into the white noise while people sit mere feet away, oblivious
Things never going the way my brain has "imagined & expected" it to, leading to profound disappointment, was the Bain of my existence, when I was younger. I'm so relieved to know I'm not alone in this way of thought! Thanks mate!
I have done a lot of work and reframing what i expect and it has helped me deal with that chaos. I cant know exactly whatll happen at work, but i can expect myself to get through it. Sorry if that doesnt make sense.
I've been developing a theory: I think this kind of response is a trauma response, specifically a CPTSD response. There's an excellent video series about answer and CPTSD and anger by Tim Fletcher which explains that 'angry outbursts' come from (put extremely simply) being forced, repeatedly, to repress our emotions. And as Orion explained, us autistic folk have been taught (read: emotionally abused into compliance) to interpret and 'moderate' our feelings in line with a majority neurotypical society. This fundamentally forces us to repress our genuine emotions, and thus we explode when that pressure and distress becomes too much to retain. I think that we need research to find out how autistic folk actually experience emotions, when they're feeling safe and comfortable and then develop ways of communicating and teaching that to neurotypical people. Fundamentally, I think if we reframe the 'symptoms' (read: signs of distress and/or socially inconvenient behaviours) as signs of a repeatedly traumatised individual, we'd get somewhere in reducing the stigma of autism and would help autistic people live healthier, safer and more happy lives.
I share your view on this. I view my autistic rage as my inner child, the traumatized one, not being able to be contained in that state of overwhelm.
@@joshstewart4528 exactly! When I think about what actually distresses me it's the intensity of emotions and the quantity of them. As a child that is so confusing and scary, so you express that - and get admonished for it, told you're overreacting, being dramatic, inappropriate, annoying, whatever. Which adds to that distress and then you get meltdowns and rage and shutdowns. The reality is we were born without the filters neurotypical people have and are being punished for it from our earliest days.
Main issues for me, having gone through a lot of episodes of rage, is the fact I feel guilt. It rang a bell when you said you felt like a crap dad. Same here. I felt a crap dad, crap employee and a crap partner. I still feel guilt about that, especially to my kids and now ex-wife. My kids actually had a period in their life when they feared me; trust me: that is not what someone should want as a dad. That last part is better now; I actually can communicate now that I might lose temper, instead of exploding out of nowhere, something I couldn't do when I was younger.
Apart from the guilt, I still have the fear that one day I will actually physically hurt someone because of the rage. The loss of control I experience during rage is fearsome to myself, as it is to the subject of the rage. I am actually suprised I made it to 50 without getting shot by police or getting arrested for beating up some asshole who kept pushing the wrong buttons.
If you don't mind sharing, were you always able to identify the feelings you were experiencing as anger and rage? I ask bc my autistic husband rages often, but when I ask him why he's angry or what he's upset about, he'll angrily state that he's "not angry." I have told him over and over that 99.9% of people overhearing him would say "That's anger." He just doesn't get it. My kids and I have trauma now bc we've always felt like we're walking across a mine field with him. Just wondering if you also have trouble identifying when you are angry. Thanks.
@@rrmother3748 Long reaction warning... Before I answer your question, a short disclaimer. There are more emotions, apart from anger, which I actively need to identify, because I am not always aware of what exactly I am feeling at a certain moment. It is a general pattern for me. I can only tell you what happens to me when I "explode" . Your husband is another person, and his anger might come from different sources. In other words I can't look in his head to see what triggers him. Secondly: if you and your kids are getting traumatised by the outbursts and anger of your husband, look for help. If your husband does not want that, explain to him what his anger does to you and the kids. You and the kids can't walk on eggs your whole lives. Anyhow; elements of what I will describe for you might also be true for your husband.
Short answer: I do not always identify the strong emotions I feel at certain moments as anger. When the stress is really high and I do meltdown or explode, I feel strong emotions, and they sometimes come by suprise for me. I don't feel it coming. I do feel the tension, sometimes I feel something is off, but when I explode, it is not a conscious process. It comes over me like a immensly strong wave; it overpowers me. I do not have the mental bandwith at such moments to identify the emotions as rage or anger. The realisation comes after the (large) incident is over. What is fearsome for the people around me is the sudden change they see from a reasonably calm, quiet man I usually am, to the thing I become when I am truly angry; it happens in a heartbeat. I fear myself. I am a control-freak when it comes to strong emotions and when I explode in this way, for me it feels like utter failure. Hence me feeling like being a crap person. Let me stress this again: I never physically hurt my ex-wife or kids. I can't hurt the people I love like that. Fact is when I felt that last barrier was beginning to crumble, I asked for divorce.
Apart from this (luckily increasingly rare) large explosions, there are also, what I call small incidents, where I get agitated for some reason and other people interpret that as anger. That's not anger in my book. I do not nearly feel the "anger" or strong emotions like when I explode. As said before: I cannot look in other persons heads, especially not in those of the non-autistics. If you never experienced the rage, the red mist or whatever you would like to call it, me being agitated is probably being what a lot of people would consider "angry". It is a matter of scale.
The biggest trigger for me is stress. Stress at work, stress about kids not doing great, stress about relations, stress about my own health etc. etc. Usually I can handle one big stress factor without much problems, for me the issue starts when more big stress-factors are going on together. There was a period when we were moving house, I had two switches in jobs shortly after another, oldest daughter was not doing good and going in a diagnosis process, and me and my wife were not doing great. That was not fun. I was a walking powder keg. As you understand, you will get in a negative spiral if that period is too long. Firstly the self control will fail at one point, and an explosion will occur, which will cause extra stress because it straines relationships, which creates more explosions.
For me the biggest help is the realisation I need to actively monitor myself for tensions, stress and methods for decompressing that stress. It is a process that takes energy. I cannot afford to let that go, just "live and see what happens". For example: I know this year I will have a couple of rather busy weekends between the last week of may and the last week of June, including being away from home and being in very loud and busy environments. I need to take that in account. I need to take my time off for that; I need to decompress.
For your situation: communication with your husband is key. He needs to be aware of his outbursts and what it means for you and the kids. In the end it is his choice to make his anger an active process of control. He will probably need help to achieve that tool. It might not be succesfull. On the other hand: if the kids are small, they will need room to be kids, which means noise, mess, toys everywhere.... Give your husband the time to decompress. Be aware of the fact that when he gets home from a busy day at work, screaming kids, playing with half the neighbourhood kids in your backgarden in a swimming pool or something, might be a tad bit too much. Especially if you spontaniously planned a dinner with guests at your house the same evening. You will both need to find a way in that, if you want your marriage to be a succes. You both have responsibilities in this, if not for yourselves then for the kids wellbeing. It is a delicate balancing act you all need to do. Husband needs to make an attempt to control his stress-levels (assuming that is the trigger...) and his emotions. You (and perhaps also the kids) will need him the room he needs to decompress, but also in a way that you do not lose yourselves. You need to stay his partner, not become his nurse, his thermometer, or his secretary to manage his agenda; your kids need the room to be kids, they should not need to tiptoo around dad for fear of an outburst. If you see the magnitude of the challenge, you will understand one of the first points I made: you need help. If you all succeed, celebrate that. Last but not least: Do not forget the guy he was, when you fell in love with him.
I wish you both much strenght and wisdom in the road ahead.
Taking the diagnostic tests and realizing that I am autistic has been one of the most life-affirming experiences I have every had. I am 50 years old, and it has only been through witnessing my son's struggles as a young adult that I began to see what my own were about. Autistic rage has damaged many of my relationships. I just thought I was broken from trauma, but as I got sober and started therapy, the outbursts did not leave- they got more intense. Understanding my Autism allowed me to have compassion for myself. I am not broken; I am autistic. And, I am worthy of the compassion that I give to others, too. Not crazy, just neurologically different.
I (a diagnosed autistic) was married to a man for 16 years I'm fairly sure was also autistic. His outbursts were terrifying and painful (physically and emotionally) and bewildering. A decade after getting away, I'm still a massive ball of anxiety like I've never been in my life and it's still wrecking my life.
I am undiagnosed/self-diagnosed autistic, and I always get a full-blown fit of rage when people purposely try to be annoying towards me, e.g. push or touch me, interrupting me, talk about me negatively with someone else while me being present, use my name for no reason, etc. And despite that, nobody understands why I get a fit and obviously it's always my fault according to all other people.
same (although, diagnosed)
I think anyone, not just people with Autism, would get totally pissed off, if they were subjected to those negative actions you described.
"Purposely try to be annoying to me"
I think they are very few people purposely trying to be annoying to you. There are a few jerks in the world but I am finding that there is a tendency for autistic people to think that people are doing things TO them.
The things they are doing are completely normal in a neurotypical world, so I don't think they are actually doing things TO you on purpose for the most part.
I tried and tried and tried to get my (undiagnosed at the time) husband to understand that the children weren't doing anything TO him
@@angelahurd7478 No, people definitely do things on purpose to piss you off and be annoying. That is a neutotypical trait that NTs tolerate and laugh off. They can all F off.
@@angelahurd7478 I think also, sometimes when we have difficulty reading body language and facial expression, we default to thinking a person has harmful motives. It's a complicated thing. But man do I get it. I was bullied in school.
I'm such a mild-mannered guy, very placid. Often described as gentle. But every once in a while, I get so enraged. It takes over me. I'm afraid that I will say something I can't take back in my workplace. I have already blown up at some of my friends in the past and they were shocked. They're still my friends but my outbursts definitely permanently damaged the friendships. They don't know I'm autistic so it's one of the reasons I would like to tell them although on the other hand, I'm not sure if I want to tell others yet. Thanks for the video Orion.
While I want to ask, "How are they your friends and not know you're autistic?". I completely understand not telling people. The people I have told don't believe it because I'm not high support needs, rocking myself in the corner and muttering to myself. I also tend towards being overly helpful which somehow clashes with people's views of what autism is.
IDK about you, but my workplace meltdowns are almost exclusively other people not being held to the same standards as me and then getting in trouble for being the one that didn't meet those standards--i.e., X has to be done Y way, other people do it B way, you do it Y' way to adapt for whatever the physical restrictions are, and then you're in trouble for doing it Y' way while B way just completely gets ignored.
And I also find myself getting mate-baited at work. Where people act what appears to be friendly and there's no reciprocation when you think about it, all the while they're either purposefully setting you up or using you to get their work done. They don't know much about anything in my life even though I have to listen and know about everything they do and have had happen; I'm the last one to take breaks so everyone else can go first; I'm the only one bringing in food to share and am expected to take requests; I'm the only one expected to work off the clock in order to spend time with my "friends," etc.
Real friends, I am told, are not hurt by the truth--they hear it and try to do better. But I'm the only one expected to do that in most of my workplace relationships. I've really had to rework my idea of what a friend is from quantity and longevity of time to reciprocal acts. I hope they treat you better.
How you describe yourself and your friendship situation is exactly me! It's so helpful to know that I'm not alone.
i apologize in advance for how lengthy this is, it feels important
disclosing diagnosis is definitely something that takes a lot of courage. depending on the relationship or situation, it might help to just throw in your struggles casually here and there first. like instead of focusing on the fact that you’re autistic, maybe starting with telling them what you’re currently experiencing, this way they’ll have context before conclusion and they’ll be able to say “oh that makes sense now” instead of “you don’t seem autistic” because when people don’t have the evidence right in their face they get dismissive of reality. for example: you can tell them you’re experiencing sensory overload and need to take a break. if you need to stim so you can focus on this conversation/meeting/sit through this movie, tell them you need to fidget/stim so you can focus. if you experience food aversions, tell someone why you can’t eat certain foods (bc texture, temp, smell, etc). instead of letting them form these experiences as just a preference of yours, tell them it’s something you cannot do. personally i don’t want to take a break to gather my wits, i literally need a break from sensory stimulation or i might melt down; i don’t want to fidget because i’m restless or bored, i use fidgets so that i can retain and process information being given to me instead of forgetting it as soon as they stop speaking. these are things NT people think are optional self care, when they are legitimate coping mechanisms for us. it’s not for our comfort, it’s for our well being. after some of those moments with friends, they might have more understanding that you’re actually struggling with certain things and not whatever neurotypical interpretation they’ve developed for whatever they *do* notice (managers thinking an employee is unfocused when fidgeting, friends thinking their friend is careless because they won’t try the new food they just learned to make, or thinking their friend doesn’t like them because they like to hang out by getting lunch or coffee and we struggle in loud settings, or even the interpretation of being childish because of our preferences and needs and lack of experimentation).
once they have a foundation of seeing that you’re struggling, when you throw into conversation (once you’re comfortable) that you’re autistic they should be able to put the pieces together that THAT is why you struggle with these things, and if they don’t put the pieces together and hit you with the “really? are you sure?” you can fill in the pieces by reminding them of the times that you told them you were struggling and why, and let them know that that’s what autism causes for you.
it’s a process i struggle with myself. disclosing is important to me, and i have to navigate social cues i already struggle to understand to figure out what the pace of understanding is for each person/group in my life. WE have to baby THEM and explain it to them like they’re 5. i have not yet found a practical way around needing to save their feelings by masking while we tell them what autism actually is. if they don’t experience it, it just won’t make sense to them right away because, yeah, everyone experiences the things autistic people struggle with. getting them to understand that the very basis for a diagnosis is that we struggle with these things enough that it affects our daily functioning; and that they don’t have a diagnosis because it doesn’t keep them from functioning is SO difficult. sometimes especially when the person you’re trying to convey this concept to deals with other mental health conditions that do affect their daily lives.
i pray we all find people that make us feel comfortable enough to disclose diagnosis and safe enough to unmask. and i pray that the employment field catches up quickly. sooooo sick of managers being like “ur really high functioning” and thinking it’s a compliment lol
@@OGimouse1i couldve write the same myself. I related hard to your account. Im not letting anyone walk over me anymore at work. Even if i lose it. I had a bad burnout because of it and i got sick to the verge of almost dying
Totally relate
This is why i prefer living in rural areas. I hate having meltdows in public... so i try to predict "the stormy weather" and remove myself from the situation. Which is almost impossible in an urban environment.
I sware. Alternative therapy stole my idea when they started creating rage rooms.
The number one trigger for me is physical objects being where they're not supposed to be, or not being where they are supposed to be. My partner sometimes thinks that she is helping me by setting things out that she knows I'm going to use later, but she doesn't comprehend that I am incapable of finding things unless they are in their designated spot - this has led to so much anger and frustration that I've asked her to stop.
Yes I understand, I m also like that...and I'm probably OCD also... 😊
Holy crap! I lost it yesterday when I was trying to make coffee and my wife put the grinder in a different place. It wasn’t were it was supposed to be. I’m not alone!
Maybe autistics should live in communities together where they can live in protective, womb-like environs domestically…
@@BuckEbooThat sounds very scary. Your wife must tiptoe through her own house like a burglar, trying not to leave any sign that she was there.
@@er6730yeah, she must be really freaked out by her husband * gasp * asking her to stop! (sarcasm)
I used to have periodic episodes of what I now understand was “autistic rage”. The healthiest way to deal with it at that time was to go away for a day until I calmed and got in touch with my emotions involved. This frustrated those near ground zero. It was far better than staying in the situation and saying things that might have caused irreparable damage to that relationship.
I’ve learned that expectations are the biggest triggers for meltdowns and rage. Have diligently worked on letting go of expectations. Very challenging to do. Have learned that no matter how things play out, I’m going to be OK. This has become a daily truth, further reinforcing that letting go of expectations is extremely beneficial. No more rages, no more meltdowns, no more burnouts.
I was so close to that rage just moments ago.
Went down to the grocery store to buy some stuff. Usually a good time to do so. Rarely any people there this "early" in the day. Today there were people standing everywhere. Talking loudly. Sensory overload. I almost ran out of the store after paying. Could feel it building inside.
Scary..
This happens to me regularly when I have to go to the store. When I get stuck behind someone, or the checkout isn't working, I call it bad RNG. Picked it up from DarkSouls speedrunners. Sometimes the Random Number Generator screws you. It helps for some reason.
This makes sense of my outburst last week when my boss fired me after telling me 2 days prior that I'd be around for at least 2-3 more months. I'd been there 6 years. I tried to control my anger. I felt everything at once from anxiety, to anger, and betrayal. I couldn't settle down completely for days because my life was upended in seconds.
That is awful. Hopefully whatever's next will be a better, safer situation. Because that was BS.
My family use to compare me to Katie Ka-Boom from animaniacs. It was so frustrating because they saw it as just exploding over nothing but it wasn't. It was because they wouldn't listen to me, they told me to take my feelings to my room, they were also super overstimulating. It was so exhausting and frustrating.
Orion, you dear wonderful man. Of all the videos I've watched (yours & others), this one has made the most profound impact on me.
I was diagnosed last October, shortly after turning 65. All these years I've wondered, "what's wrong with me?" Only now, so late in life, I'm finally beginning to understand.
At a very young age I learned I had to internalize my emotions, especially anger. Because "good girls" weren't supposed to have tantrums or act out in negative ways.
I've been in "conventional" therapy for about 40 years, but have only begun to understand why I'm the person I am. I'm finally beginning to realize I'm not the bad person I've believed I was. I have real hope for the first time in my life.
Thank you, Orion, for giving all of us so much of yourself. But please take care of yourself. A lot of people are very grateful for what you're doing. Just remember: you owe us nothing. Our appreciation is unconditional. ❤️
Most girls/women in our society learn to "internalize" their emotions. And men, in most situations, learn to keep their negative emotions under control. A good thing1
@@cheralyse1352 I’m a bit confused by your reply; specifically the last sentence. Do you mean that it’s a good thing that society teaches females to internalize their emotions and males to control their negative emotions?
I am finding out in my mid forties and everything makes sense now, but i am also sort of falling apart because of it. The illusions i stood on aren't there anymore. Plus, my brain and body just can't keep up the charade like it used to, so I am running into a lot more burnout. But, the thing you said: "I'm beginning to realize I'm not the bad person I believed I was." It's so life changing, and I wouldn't go back even if I could. Whatever happens now, it's happening in the light of day.
@@lightbeingform 🫶🏻🫂🙏🏼
@@cheralyse1352 Men seem less controlled than women when it comes to anger. That is why more men are in prison than women.
I've been fired from so many jobs; mostly Asperger's related, dealing with coworkers and HR staff with borderline personality disorder (boy, are there a lot of them out there, at least in the US). When my field of work began transitioning to remote just before the pandemic, my life changed. Steady work, no issues. Way less stress, way less rage, and when I do rage, no one hears me but myself, hah.
🤯you just blew my mind with the HR BPD connection.
@@lightbeingformUncanny, isn't it? So many of them out there.
Rage is also an issue with bpd. I am both and have experienced both types of rages.
I daydream playing out things that are highly likely to be occurring next in my life. It’s brutal. Same for things that have already happened. Playback in full emotional HD! It’s quite difficult to cope most of the time. Nobody sees it nobody cares.
Keep up the good work fella 💙🏴
Sometimes it gets tiresome being different or misunderstood. When times are trying, it's a comfort to come here among the like-minded. It's a real "I feel your pain" moment with this channel. Thanks.
I don't get angry very often, but when I do, I see red and explode. Didn't understand why that was, now I know. Thank you! 🖖
It upsets me greatly that I am perceived (by some) as being an 'angry' person. At my core I really don't think this is true. I am just so overwhelmed, almost constantly, that my emotions sometimes come out as irritability and 'anger'. I'm currently on leave from work because I'm in burnout, and part of that is I don't seem able to 'reset' or come down to a baseline, release the emotions, what I mean is all the emotions just seem to stay put and build up, and I don't know how to release them, get them out of my system, and so I am just constantly at MAX level. I hate it. It's not like I want to feel like this. 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️
I feel the same. Im also at sick leave. Yeah the build up never stops and im just so tired. I was very disregulated a few months ago.
@@etcwhatever feel your pain. Hope you (we) find some relief. 💪❤️🙏
I’m 7 months into unpacking my entire life and brain. Thank you and others for helping me understand myself, Orion.
great wording, love that. me too
One of the worst relationship dynamics I ever had was with a partner who must be one of the vaguest people I've ever known. He would be very passive, no plans ever, and would throw a barrage of questions like "What do you feel like doing in the next few weeks?" or "Is it Ok if I come over at some point?". For most neurotypical people these are very inoffensive questions. For myself, the uncertainty and vagueness would send me in a spiral and drain me of all my emotional and mental resources. I would beg for him to tell me his schedule in advance, like let me know if he's staying after work for a beer. It had NOTHING to do with him and all to do with my need to meticulously plan my day. He would take it very poorly, like I'm trying to keep him away from his friends no matter how much I told him he could be away for 3 weeks, for all I care, as long as I get the exact time and date for departure and arrival. He did not believe me. He was genuinely thinking I was bullsh***ing him and I was a manipulative psycho who wanted to separate him from his friends. No matter how many times I would say "I swear I just want an updated schedule" he would think I'm lying and using my "technique" to make him feel guilty for going out... 🤦♀To this day, this man will go to his friends and family and talk about his traumatic relationship with me, where he was manipulated into abandoning his friends because I was jealous of their bond. I have never felt more misunderstood. What can I say... I'm grateful I've been in therapy for over a decade now and I had the tools to get over it fairly well. I'm also immensely grateful to not be triggered by this anymore and see my ex through a lense of empathy and understanding, rather than resentment. Still, it always stings when someone you care about refuses to see you for who you are. It feels like you're fighting windmills...
Wow I really empathize with you, especially your last few sentences. My wife left me and one of the factors was her not willing to do research into autism and me not seeking help soon enough. I feel abandoned and misunderstood. I hope I can end up where you seem to be, I still hold resentment.
@@natalie_v0.1 you will be ok. Few things are worse than the utter loneliness you feel in the company of someone who's supposed to love you.
The best thing you can do is learn about yourself, so you know what you need and what you can give.
And practice letting go of resentment. Even if it's only 10 seconds every day ✌️
Thank you for explaining these things. I can relate to everything you've just said. I'm always so placid, non confrontational that people think it's OK to bully me or make fun of my quirky ways - then the volcano finally erupts and my "anger" is way out of proportion to what just happened- so then I'm judged for that. People don't realise the frustration and that has been building for so long.
It is possible to let the pressure out little by little. Therapy helped me with this and it happens much less often.
I have been on both sides of this rage. There is no excuse for yelling at other people in an out-of-proportion manner. Apologies are always necessary! It doesn’t matter if you “can’t help it.” And it is possible to not abuse other people while being enraged.
It has nothing to do with excuses. Tonality and volume levels of speech are different from neurotypicals. This is true for the other neurodivergent groups. Add in alexithymia and it’s a total misunderstanding of mind types. To be fair, the social manipulation and indirectness of NTs is also abusive but because of subtly it becomes accepted. The rage is overload and often it is from improper behaviour of others.
@@Diverse_Interestsyou're so right, the sneaky cruelties of ND bad behavior are the rule, partly because it's less obvious but also because the majority protects its own
Thanks Orion for another great video!!! 🥰🥰Also a few extra points. #1. from "asking a question", give it a few seconds longer than you normally would to wait for an answer. sometimes this is enough to avoid a lot of negative reactions. #2. IF there is an outburst, and this outburst only lasts like 2 seconds. breathe. and then move on. IF the outburst is just that, an outburst. Like a teakettle "letting out steam", but only lasts like 2-3 seconds. It helps SO MUCH to just move on!! This is both great advice for parents of autistic kids and as a partner/friend of an autistic adult. (And WITHOUT commenting on it). Because "pointing it out" or "getting mad/frustrated", makes the outburst so much worse. In this case, where the "outburst" is made into a "bid deal", for the autistic person, it just compounds the situation. And makes it even more difficult to re-set. Saying "it't no big deal (ie you are overreacting) or make the autistic person feel even worse for having the reaction in the first place. And it takes time to "calm down" after autistic rage. (And having someone say "calm down" mostly increases MORE RAGE). End rant. ;) Hugs from Norway.
This makes so much sense. It helps to clarify why I blow up over seemingly trivial things, that others can do with ease.
I love this topic, I definitely suffer from this autistic rage too. Something what really helps me with expectations was when I learned the phrase "expectations are like premeditated resentments". I try to have the idea that the only constant when others are involved is change. It's like I try to hack my brain to think the unexpected is the constant. It doesn't work when I'm in a flow state of a super regular routine usually but it really helps in one off experiences and in relationship situations with loved ones. Also with people I interact with I try to remember that we are all hopefully in a state of growth and therefore will be constantly evolving in our reactions and habits. I can find patience in my own mind if I can somehow see as many changes as possible as a systematic upgrade for society. Sadly a lot of changes I have trouble finding the positive direction that it's shifting society into, in which case I usually turn to humor to give me a processing break... It's those sensory changes that can really get to me... Especially like a fan or florescent lights. I know I catch myself spiraling and I have to remind myself to look for sensory input I can shut off.
Florescent bulbs and fans really do suck
Going to try this!
Thank you! That was one comment to copy paste into my life.
This
Oh, my, goodness. Expectations are like premeditated resentments. Oh the relief at just reading that is palpable, Ive known for a while my biggest trigger is broken expectations, but little mantras tend to help me so thank you for this.
One of your best and most important videos, Orion. I was diagnosed at 40 and then just left to it, like, hey You're autistic....now off you go buddy!😮. I'm am desperately trying to understand myself and this, amongst many of your other videos, is very helpful, so thank you
There is no help from so called “professional’s”.All they are there for is money and the title.All they do is Gaslight and Stigmatize.Then,like you said,just say off ya go.I am 40 and only recently realized I had Asberger’s after meeting my husband who also has it.Ive been researching my whole life to try to figure out why I never “fit” in anywhere basically.Once I met him and started looking into Asberger’s everything! finally made since and lined up.I told my Psychiatrists that they had mis-diagnosed me and explained why and still! they gaslit me and tried to tell me I don’t “seem” Autistic! Like they would know.They have no clue about Autism.Ive studied Psychology and they teach all but like 10 min worth of material on Autism in their “curriculum’,and that is only about male Autism.Their Industry is a joke…
I'm going through this at the moment you're timing is impeccable I have to repeat a year of university I was harassed by a class so called mate and it wasn't taken seriously I hadn't any supports in place I've been like the hulk for 4 days with no way to even have the outburst
My anger was peaked when my abusive narc ex punched me or her other abusive behaviours. Plus she would goad me in all kinds of ways to get a rise out of. In the end I exploded and it just played into her hands, “look at you all aggressive, you nutter, you monster…”. Pure frustration, exacerbation and I had no where to escape from it, hence the explosion. Always followed by guilt and shame that I exploded. I’m away from that now, but I still get loss of control from frustration from life, NT’s etc. As you say it’s constant pressure. Pressure to fit in, conform, expectations etc…it’s mostly misinterpreted as acting childish or attention seeking etc…it’s just bloody hard dealing with people who do not understand…but it’s ok for them to get angry at me though, it’s ok for them to bully, dismiss…
Wow, I just wanted to reply buddy. I have just very recently (after years) realised that I have been the subject to narcissistic abuse at the hands of my ex wife. She would treat me absolutely terribly, I really mean this, for months and months at a time with me biting my lip and rising above it, and then when I eventually lost my cool (shouted and swore), then that was used to further the accusations - 'ahh see you're totally out of control, flip out over nothing, abusive'. And then I would be the one heart broken for my outburst and further laying myself out to try and make it better. It's taken me a long time to realise what has been happening. I'm very early in coming out of this and putting clear boundaries around our contact (we have a child together), but I really do believe I have some PTSD or at least some trauma from years of systematic belittling and psychological manipulation. Anyways...leave it there ..just wanted to send a reply. 👍
@@SDR-fj7on Hope you are having a decent day. I really hope you are ok and are getting some help with this my friend. Yes im diagnosed with cptsd from it all. You resonate with me and very similar circumstance (no kids thankfully). Yeah there are so many things I could say, or over-share, but I won’t, as I don’t want to trigger you, you’ve been through enough. I have a therapist now, she’s good and I’m lucky as well that she is also on the spectrum, so understands me! I would say, without knowing you and what you’ve said, that you do indeed have trauma induced by your experiences with this woman. But you understand a fair bit and have taken steps, ie boundaries and hopefully some therapy? Thank you for taking the time to comment, I really appreciate it. I’m glad it resonated with you. Yes it’s early for you, but, you are taking steps to heal. The years of gaslighting etc have taken a toll on us both, we’re still here, still fighting!. Hey if you want to talk ever, I’m here. Well, not very easy on this platform, but here if you want to post a comment etc. take good care and I wish you all the very best on your journey with your child 👍👏💪
@@HaakonOdinsson really lovely response dude. Thank you. It's so nice to know that someone out there understands and believes you isn't it. ❤️💪😎
@@SDR-fj7on I believe you 100% my friend and it was a pleasure . Thank you for being brave (it’s not easy!) and finding the strength to say no more. I’ve been there, no one believing you. Why would they, she a woman, a mother. In my case, a woman, a mother and also a carer in the community for vulnerable elderly people. We have to fight that first and foremost. Judged. Hope you can find solace for yourself and your child. I imagine she uses the child as a weapon against you. You did the right thing…she’d probably only poison the child’s mind against you, thus making things infinitely harder. I respect your character. Hope you’re well, take care. As I said here if you want to chat…albeit public 👍☮️
@@SDR-fj7on apologies, writing too fast, lol. Yes it’s a great feeling, well, it’s more than that really. It’s validating to be believed. The stress of it all evaporates or at least lessens a great deal. I’ve been dismissed, put upon, bullied etc all my life. My therapist made me feel like I’m believed and that she validated me in regard to that and also being on the spectrum…people dismiss that as well. It’s nice to stick an invisible middle finger to all the disbelievers 🙂💪
The terribly sad thing is that we see frustrating and emotional responses in so many people, NT as well, in an outburst and we don't look at the way we can behave to other people to help all people to be safe in their minds.
People need to do better across the board and help people to not end up in rage whoever they are
that's a mental health population size kind of problem
As a late and recently diagnosed autistic person, I am still trying work out what it all means. But wow it feels like you have used the cliff notes on my life to make this video. It’s overwhelming to realise that others experience life the way I do. Thank you.
"As a late and recently diagnosed autistic person," you write quite well.
@@ismailabdelirada9073lots of us do!
I am in the same boat. Isn't it something to find out we are in such good company? I feel like my spaceship came and took me home lol
@@lightbeingform : I've begun to think we're all chosen by God -- and for something more than a lifetime of trials, although that is part of it.
Thank you 🙏🏽 I’ve always felt I was broken and mean for loosing myself unexpectedly. Understanding this is helping me so much.
So very true, Orion... especially at the workplace... 😔
My fiancé and I both have autism (and ADHD). He takes almost any kind of criticism as an insult. So, I will state what I am trying to accomplish with my next statement before I say it. This has helped tremendously.
I, on the other hand, get frustrated when my plans fall apart. Three things will happen. I'll get emotional, seemingly out of nowhere. My brain will bluescreen and stop functioning. It feels impossible to move past the information and my head will go around in circles like it's buffering. OR, my ADHD kicks in and I get a million thoughts per second. With no means of pinning them down. And if I'm not frustrated at the situation. Someone gets frustrated at me for the above reasons. Which leads to me becoming frustrated because I can't help it.
I have the opposite problem,I'm too cool and calm and am used to bullying and aggressive,abusive behavior.I never rage, but because of bottling up abuse, i've got a leftsided heartweakness already by the age of 24.I only accept peaceful understanding, healthy minded people in my life. And i'm already 47 by now.
I have been fortunate enough to have learned how to exit situations and advocate for myself so I blow up less, but the reality is some people will bully, bait, and trap you if they sense you have this vulnerability. At this point, my outbursts have a protective coating of full-on fawning just to get me safely out of a relationship where I can cut contact without triggering the bully into worse behaviors. Because there are people who will justify awful things - stalking, violence, slander - if you for one second lose your cool and tell them they are being an a!
Thank you Orion, for helping me to feel like it's ok to be me. Late diagnosed AuDHD, and still combing through the past and present through the lens of Autism and understanding my behaviors and patterns. So much of my intensity is internalized and has caused many health issues, so I guess the second half of my life will be focused on learning what my actual capacity is, how to honor it, and how to embrace myself without so much shame.❤
@jessicaburrows6596. This you've, written could be me. Honestly, I couldn't have said it better. I'm in the exact same boat. I'm 51 and newly diagnosed with AuDHD. Life changing and a helpful lens that explains so much about my entire, crazy, tempestuous, exhausting, round-peg-in-a-square-hole life.
Me too! Huh, what do you know... Turns out I'm not alone in this. I look forward to my future now. Decades of failures, trauma, shame and horrible abuse from health (s)care-givers. It's very, very hard to work through the rage against my abusers. Some days it feels like I'm drowning in rage. Some days I'm incredibly happy and excited to live a life adapted to me. It's an emotional bouncing on every wall.
I definitely identify with being disappointed when things are never as great as I imagine them. I either try to go into situations without any prior knowledge (I hate spoilers!) or just be pessimistic so my experience is better than I expected.
I have ADHD and am the partner of a person living with Autism, ADHD, and GAD. Focusing on Autistic Rage is really helpful because I feel I have lumped too many things into "meltdowns" or "near meltdown."
I am interested to hear more of the overlap/venn diagram between them and how support from others such as myself should differ between the two.
Thank you for being a wonderful, vulnerable resource with a good balance of humour. ☺️
Two things instantly push me over the edge and into a rage: technology not working and people being inconsistent, especially at work. My hands are shaking as I type because of one (and a half) of these.
Here's a thought that really helped me avoid the frustration when having too many options. If you have multiple options that feel acceptable to you, it's almost always because they all are equally good. In the past I couldn't resist picking those options apart until I found a differentiating feature that allowed me to pick the one single best option. Such a waste of energy for almost no return on investment. Nowadays I recognize these multiple good options and know that if I can't see which one is best, they all are equally acceptable, so I just pick the first one. Or just roll the dice. Rational pragmatism is the optimal path. Think about your energy and invest it in better things. Recognize that sometimes two different routes to your destination have the exact same travel distance.
I appreciate your practical advice on this
Emotional dysregulation is not exclusively an autistic trait, I also want to note. Folks with ADHD have struggles with these things as well!
Yes, and in other disorders as well.
Thank you for making this video. The rage has been a white elephant in the room for a long time.
I often play stuff out in my head in advance, too, but because I am kind of a pessimist, or maybe because I've had so many bad experiences,it plays in my head as kind of damage control, with very low expectations, and then it seems to go pretty well and my expectations are usually exceeded, and thus, events like this can be quite enjoyable. It can make it difficult for me to accept the good times in life, though.
The bit about being interrupted, I absolutely get the rage. If I'm practising guitar and I'm interrupted more than once, that's it - everything gets switched off and hung up as I'm too frustrated to continue.
And talking about goals of perfection... my anxiety is largely due to the idea of not being able to do something perfectly, so I put it off and stress about it. Again, playing guitar is one of these things, challenging video games, DIY around the house, cooking... etc etc etc...
Than you Orion, I Requested this topic. I deal with autistic rage and this really with help the people in my life. My spouse might understand why i am reacting. I learned a lot on this one. Thank you .!!!
Thankfully I don't rage (C-PTSD) I shutdown. I feel like it has less impact perhaps than a rage, but in that way, no one knows what's happening with me, even I didn't until all this autistic info. found me. I would just become mute and still when overwhelmed. Must be far more disruptive to others when it manifests as rage, I feel for you Orion. Keep breathing dude - haha I can hear you reading this..'keep breathing?? well I'm not planning on stopping that so - done' hahaaa Thanks Orion. x
I have c-ptsd, too! I've never heard of anyone else combining Audhd and c-ptsd. I too, cannot scream at anyone - and never ever have I even defended myself against beatings. So the rage only circulates on the inside, where it eats me.
@@sksk-bd7yv There are so many crossovers between these 'symptoms', it's hard to know where one stops and the other starts.
Yes! Is this me, a mask - or some other weird thing? Am I overwhelmed by stimuli, or triggered by ptsd trigger? Possibly a tummy bug? HOW am I supposed to know?
Brilliant thank you... that needs to be shared with everyone who knows me!
"expectations are premeditated resentments" is a motto that I learned in Al-Anon (which is for children and loved ones of alcoholics) It's helped in many situations "managing my expectations" I so relate to what you said about building up an event ahead of time ..only to be completely let down ..and it doesn't even matter if I try not to have an expectation..but Just being aware that I know that's going to be a disappointment.. buffers my let down a bit.. It's like attempt to imagine the worst so that the outcome is always a pleasant surprise by comparison! Thank you for this video and insight, I hope I can get some people to watch it. It's absolutely correct the question: "What do you want for dinner?" Does induce dreadful "rage" feelings.
Side Note: I legally changed my name in adulthood.. and I discovered only afterward ..to a name that literal means "one who rages" (haha)
I loved this video! The part where you talked about setting expectations for future events and then being disappointed by their outcome when they didn't actually meet the narrative you had in your head, especially resonated with me!
I also pregame new scenarios to try to get the event right ahead of time. Somehow after decades of experience on the matter, I still feel anxious over how disappointing reality ends up being. Always too many variables.
I’m currently fighting for rights to see my autistic son. My ex-partner has made it extremely difficult to see my child and just before Christmas after 5 attempts to see my son and countless times making changes in my life to see my son I had a autistic rage towards my ex-partner and said something that I didn’t mean at all I’ve struggled with autism for 49 years and feel very manipulated by most people in my life and the worst is from someone that at one stage supposedly loved me.
Partners and ex-partners have no obligation to understand us or provide us with anything. That's something we all should understand, being autistic is not our fault, but how we decide to treat our family and close relatives is OUR choice. I had learn to properly convey what I feel and how I feel to my husband, because If I didn't change and just assumed people should conform to who I am, I would end up alone, with no friends nor family. Being autistic is not a stamp to allow bad behavior. If you feel like out of control, seek therapy on how to, rage outburst cannot be avoided, but how we deal with them can totally be. I'm not saying we should do it to everyone, but if you really care about something or someone, you should definitely go the extra mile to meet them at least half the way, otherwise they will feel the same as you in your last words: unloved, uncared.
@@hellequinmThank you for saying that. It needs to be said. Our own suffering shouldn't blind us to other people's humanity.
I don’t even remember how I stumbled upon your video but it LITERALLY just changed my life. The way I just cathartically cried! Not angry! But cried! 😭All my life and years and years spent on therapy, this was the validation I needed. This is a true blessing. 🙏🏻Thank you for articulating my behaviors and for making this video to spread awareness for us. 🤌🏻🫶🏻✊🏻🫡🖤
I had a family member who had uncontrollable rages, to the point he would get phyiscal. In todays time, that would not be acceptable.
Thanks Orion! You're helping me understand my autistic spouse so much better! ❤
I really appreciate it. Thanks.
I do the exact same thing. Play the entire event already in my head beforehand.
This makes so much sense. I had problems with anger for a long time- seemingly fine, then an explosion. I worked on recognizing when my emotions were amping up, which has helped a lot, and understanding my Autism has helped even more.
I've been through this several times in my life (before I was formally diagnosed 9 years ago this week). My narcissistic mother and grandmother would push my buttons to get a rise out of me. I would end up being called names, viciously scolded, and even physically abused by them.
I went through this at work, too.
Orion, it's happening now as I write, bubbling under the uncertainty and unpredictability that is happening right now for the reasons you have mentioned here.
Thank you for putting this on video.
Peace and All Good.
Thank you for the video! Once again it helped me accept myself just a bit more. I'm not as bad a human being that I've always felt. Somehow your videos make me feel safe. I've watched them for the past six months when I need comfort. It's strange. So thank you from the bottom of my heart from the other side of the 🌎❤
Your videos are simultaneously validating (glad it's not just me), re leaving, helpful and a bit depressing (realizing it's not just going to go away)
Maybe to give you a bit of hope, it may be true that it won't go away, but it's possible for it to get easier to deal with. 🤍 It's not easy, but it's not impossible
Thanks Orion. I rarely become angry towards others, but when i do its usually justified, and i dont ridicule or attack them, i just state how i feel, and if im becoming super emotional, I try to leave. I know im not perfect at it, and when somethin goes wrong I always put it on myself first, but somehow the way i am honest and blunt sets off people's ableist 'problematic' sixth sense, or thin slice judgments, even with friends who should know me better. The problem is how people perceive me to be, telling me if im ever upset its my own fault, or i express it in the wrong way, while they let their anger be an excuse to ostracize me, gossip, and make generalizations about what kind of person i am. This is difficult because i cannot do the same, i see them as reasonable, good people, I value them, I try so much, but they are not good friends to me, and i had to give up even though i still believe in them
For myself I've adopted a stoic system towards self acceptance as my primary method to deal with the emotional outbursts/autistic rage. I'm still depressed and going through continual breakdowns but my self-hatred has reduced a lot and the absolute violence I experience has been brought into my direct control which is something new to me. It's taken me over 7 years to get here ad a few (way too close) calls with my mortality to keep my head in the game but there is progress being made. The rage episodes still happen but sometimes the emotional impact is delayed, which so far only happens when I'm either tripping or stupidly high, so I can sometimes disengage from the situation and go lock myself away and deal with the overflow in my normal way.
Thank you so much for this comment! You validated me. I had a horrible experience last night. I've only gone clean for a week, so I needed to tell you I'm grateful for your comment.
I did not realize that self acceptance is an aspect of stoicism. It is absolutely the foundation of my sanity!
I have always had issues with my temper, and controlling my emotions. Ive always struggled to express how i feel aswell, i often turned to scriptive language to convey whats goin on inside. Most people think Im being funny, when Im actually trying to tell u whats going on inside. Most times my whole interaction with people is following a script until i get home and zero out.
I dont physically lose control, but the emotional rollercoaster and outburts, can often pop up in other habits that ive developed to channel thr surge of emotions that i dont know what to do with. This video was soo good, thank u
this is like the best video I have seen in my entire life to explain the complexities of my entire life's experiences.
I wanna copy this video and chop it into small segments so I can share with specific people the specific situation (maybe I write your words on cards or something) related to whatever goes on that leads to my life being a living hell because someone else refuses to understand the lack of intent in the things they see me do which are a reflex to the intensity of living life in current society.
The overall pressures and expectations are almost always too damn much, and I want 'life' to stop being such a hell on earth because other people refuse to understand the damages they are causing by doing whatever they are doing within my sensory range that drives me to hide inside, and leaves me to experience feeling out of control most everyday of my life.
I could have a better life if everyone understood like you do Orion.
Damn good video. thank you for putting to words what I kept trying to tell people across my life who refused to understand I was not choosing the behaviors on purpose, and were completely reactionary behaviors due to what they were doing around me. I feel it is a miracle I'm still alive and not institutionalized at this point. Institutions are hell for me, I know, I been in them, they make living life far worse than living in a cheap "affordable housing" apartment surrounded by triggering noises.
Glad to see you back m8
been reading through comments feeling like everybody here is so frickin smart, brave, kind - one thing i haven't seen anyone mention yet is how yes can be helpful to take space and release it physically (yell, cry, stim, whatever), but also key to know that these moments take a LOT out of you physically and mentally and even add to overstimulation if it goes on very long. We have to prioritize our rest and relaxation just as much. I think of it as decompressing from whatever pushed me in the first place. I also find it handy to distinguish between: 1)letting myself momentarily release rage and moving on to recover, and 2) spending a bunch of time rehearsing it. Or else it just keeps getting worse.
Very good point
Sometimes I am the most laid-back person ever with a very slow temper. Other times I have a 'flash temperament' where one moment I seem very calm on the outside, the next moment I am suddenly extremely angry.
Man, you have to stop reading my mind! hahah Normally I just shutdown every form of expression (body language, face, voice) when I have the rage, I just wait till it comes down and then I analyze the situation and see if there is a way to say what bothered me in an elegant really respectful way, and only if it's something I feel justified rationally, since I have to choose my "battles". Learned really early that if I just let it all out, people just respect me less and hear me even less, so I try to play the diplomatic way, but sometimes it's really hard, my wife knows when I have the rage even when I say nothing, but she knows how to deal with it, luckily, which is basically waiting, and hugging me after some time.
This is one of my biggest challenges, especially at work because the business model is for neurotypicals. It can be very triggering, but I need a decent paying job.
I'm working on walking away & self talk as well as havening. Its not perfect but helping.
i know this is sort of a thing for neurotypical people to help understand us- but honestly i just love watching stuff like this because it sort of gives me a feeling of understanding and it helps me understand myself better- i don't know how to word it the video just makes me happy i like being represented
I have been living in the "terrible twos" my entire life. Thank you for explaining this. I tell myself i am a monster most of the time.
Your videos have helped me understand my autism better than any other resource. They also help greatly help in explaining myself to my family. So many aspects of my “new” life now make sense because of the way you explain the autistic experience, and it’s making it easier, if not easy, to accept myself. Autistic Rage and the impact it has had on me and those close to me, I now realise has been the most difficult part of my existence. Firstly being aware it is even a thing, that I am not choosing to be an emotional rollercoaster and that I just need to try harder to control my emotions, gives me some peace and clarity. Secondly hearing someone else describe what I have experienced my whole life, in such an accepting and confident manner, is allowing me to process this new information about myself differently. It is without the shame and guilt I usually feel when I become aware of some new aspect of how my brain works. It also helps me feel less separate. Thank you Orion, you are helping me a great deal
at 53 and just diagnosed this year, this makes so much sense of my life
I'm so relieved to start understanding this. Thank you for your video. I've grown up around non-diagnosed autistic people and it's been hard to understand them. Their outbursts have also impacted me growing up. It's just wonderful to understand.
I cried watching this because when you said the part about pre experiencing situations, it's what I'm constantly doing. I practice in my mind the different scenarios, what I'll say, what they'll say, positive or negative. I'm engaged and I feel like my autistic rage is having an adverse affect on my relationship. I feel like if I don't practice better behaviors that I'll lose him. I spent all night thinking of how to convey certain things I've been feeling for a year. I also narrate everything out loud very often. Sometimes I think I do it to not hear this weird noise in my head. Does anyone else have a constant sound or two in your head? Right now I hear 2 or 3. Maybe I'm weird...Thank you for this video ❤
The rage can be lessened with practice. Notice what causes it and then work on lessening or finding new ways to deal with those things. Counseling can help.
Oh gosh I can relate to this!
Pre-expecting to get fired is exactly why I would just quit. Especially if I was already having a hard time. And by quitting, I mean, just not going in again.
And your insight into *PREEXPECTATIONS IS PROFOUND!* 🤯
Gosh, the plane metaphor got me.
I'm sitting here, crying and laughing at the same time. It so true!
Thanks for your explanations and examples, and the great presentation. ❤
Oh my gosh! I could almost hug this man. You put into words everything I go through every single day. It is so frickin hard!
I always run things through my head, especially visiting family, driving to see them, I have an expectation of when I'd get home but i never do get back in time. I worry if my car will break down how will I cope, I don't stop playing scenarios in my head till I get home. I had an autistic rage but with a neighbor, due to them trying to tell me what to do. I was verbal but not aggressive I was arrested and put in a cell for 20 hours
. I now only go out once a week for shopping. To try and stop my triggers, I have been judged way to many tmes it's just easier to stay in
I have found that you are the best person on RUclips to explain autism in the way that I have it or at least as close as I can get. You voice is good to listen too and you explain things well. You would be a great person to have an Autistic talk with. Sharing your video.
When I was single, an old farmer gave me advice on marriage. "Expect nothing, get everything". In other words, set your expectations low. I apply that advice in any time I'm anticipating something good even to the point of catastrophizing. Then, almost everything goes better than expected. 😂
BTW, great channel. ❤
I want to add that the distancing and the avoiding all known triggers can also happen from the autistic person's side, with equally devastating distancing
Stellar video, Orion. Explains so much of my husband‘s hurtful, scary behavior. Sadly, I thrive on possibilities and subtleties. I deeply appreciate your vulnerability here.
Thank you, Orion, once again for all the helpful information. You are amazing.
I have to find the right medication (right now it’s Auvelity) to prevent autistic rage from making my everyday communication casually suicidal, fatalistic hyperphantasia. No cognitive behavioral therapy worked.
Medication? I mean that's going to affect you in more ways than just that.
Maybe your around the wrong people and they make you feel worse