The Bible doesn’t tell us what the books belong in the Bible. The 66 books we have share the same theme of the gospel, while not contradicting each other at all. Thus “we” don’t decide what books are canon, but we’ve discovered what books are canonical.
@devinhildebrandt2709 The Bible teaches Sola Scriptura. If there is no objective standard of truth, then anything goes. Is it alright for a married man to commit adultery with a 16 year old girl, promise fathers and mothers a higher spot in heaven if they would let a 37 year old man marry their 14 year old daughters, send men on missions and while they're gone marry their wives, marry two sets of sisters and two sets of a mother and her daughter, destroy a printing press that exposes your immorality, print phony $3 and $4 bills, set up an anti bank and when people want their money you can move out of state, threaten to kill the governor of Missouri, teach the first lie of Satan, "Ye shall be as gods," etc.?
The responses here present a stark contrast and an irreconcilable point of differentiation. When my LDS neighbors ask why we can't accept them as legitimate Christians in the way that we will accept other denominations, this is one of the primary reasons.
That’s okay, our version of Christianity is much more reflective of a loving father who wants for his children all that he has to offer. I honestly wouldn’t worship a god that is invisible.
@@Kapayapaanmanthe God described in the Bible is alone sufficient to maximally satisfy every desire we will have in the next life. There will be no need or desire for many of the things that Mormons seek from their Heavenly Father: namely, exaltation, celestial marriage, eternal families. God, knowing that we are maximally satisfied in His presence, does not need to give us these things in order that we find fulfillment. To think that we need to be married to be eternally happy is to undermine God’s greatness.
@@BNichols021 this logic only holds true for a mythical god. By all means, worship your invisible god, who apparently needs validation. I’m much more comfortable with a god the has the wherewithal to not play mind games with his children. If he were the god you are describing, there would be zero purpose to a family and marriage structure. Zero purpose to sexuality. A Complete waste, really. Think about it…there is absolutely zero logic in creating a human via male and female and having a family structure if It didn’t have purpose beyond this life. You god is merely a mythical god not worthy of worship.
@@Kapayapaanman Absurd. God is visible through Jesus Christ. Even in the Old Testament we have various Theophanies. God loves all who believe in Him and the one He sent, Christ Jesus, our Lord and Savior 🤍✝️
Great video, it always surprises me that the LDS community will claim that because they have a living prophet they can know the truth and have doctrinal unity. But once that claim is tested they all either don’t know or differ on their views on what should be pretty basic doctrine. But I’m always so glad to see that Christians from all over the country attending different churches and denominations are so unified on the essentials of doctrine. Because we have the Lord Jesus as our prophet, priest, and king.
Hey! I just made another video about this exact point. Check it out, if you're curious about this (the unity that all Christians have on essential doctrines): ruclips.net/video/IYBxPnNKsCw/видео.html
@@truthseek7987 not true at all, there are still disagreements on non essential doctrine. For example is it right to baptize babies, while both sides affirm that the other side are Christians and are saved because we disagree on this matter we have different denominations. But we have unity in the essentials. Not every doctrine is essential there are degrees of doctrine. If you have disagreements on 1 degree doctrines I.e. is their only one God and is he triune then you are not a Christian and not saved. If you disagree in 2nd degree doctrine I.e. should we baptize babies then you will be part of a separate denomination but still affirmed to be a Christian. If you disagree on 3rd degree doctrine I.e. eschatology then you can be part of the same denomination and even the same church.
@@jacobsamuelson3181 instead of reading something I didn’t say into what I said address what I actually said. I didn’t say baptism is nonessential, I said disagreeing on when someone needs to be baptized does not make the other side of the discussion not Christian. But there aren’t any “saving” ordinances, ”For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.“ Ephesians 2:8-9. Faith in the Lord Jesus of the Bible saves. I’m not saying that a person never needs to be baptized, I’m saying that you don’t need to be baptized to be saved (see the repentant thief on the cross). But all people who are saved will be baptized if they are able to, “Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do what I tell you?“ Luke 6:46
God worships a God..... really? And then they wonder why so many do not consider them Christians? This is some good seed planting! Lord, may they open their eyes to the huge inconsistencies in their belief system.
@jacobsamuelson3181 God, by definition, is infinite. The triune God, (3 in one) is eternal. This is foundational in Christianity (John 17:5). So, with this among many other foundational truths, we can understand biblical text. We know Jesus stripped himself of his glory and came as a servent (Philippians 2:7), which explains his communication with the Father. Understanding this puts scripture in context. All that is finite can't become a God. This is blasphemous. I see no inconsistencies in the Christian understanding of biblical text. But not only scripture, archeology has done a great work in the last several decades of proving the Bible. The LDS church will try to avoid this because there is nothing out there to back up the writings that were fabricated by a man who took the wives of other men. That too, is something the LDS are not to talk about. He is the one who came up with all the doctrines you follow. You should read commentaries and get a study Bible and weigh out what you learn from what your organization teaches. We don't wrestle against flesh and blood, but against spiritual forces. Satan (a fallen angel) uses deception to lead people away from the true Jesus as presented in the holy Bible, the Word that will never fail buy Joseph Smith said it did so he was sent to restore it. If a man today claimed a sensational story like Joseph Smith did, why would anyone believe him. Whatever goes against God's Word is how we know falsehood.
@DeathlessVindicator read my comment, I explained it. Context! Jesus was sent as a man, fully man fully God. In His mission to save sinners, he was a servant, he was our example. He prayed to God as we are to. As a man, he worshipped God. There is no contradiction in this understanding. The hypostatic union is not an easy thing to grasp and I'll admit that, but it's what is at the heart of your question. When Jesus resurrected, He ascended to rule and reign with God the Father. He is not worshipping God the Father or God the Holy Spirit. The Trinity is very complex and I cannot fully understand it myself but it's biblically sound.
@@romans1vs6teen John 20 has the Resurrected Lord and Savior state that he has a God. If the trinity was sound which it isnt, resurrected Jesus would have had a fine time to make it know that God was three in one being. But no, he was very clear that The Father and Him were separate beings and The Father even after resurrection was his God.
I am interested to know how an LDS views Isaiah 43: 10, 11? 10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. 11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.
@@Valhalla369 The LDS interpretation that makes this coherent with our doctrine is that in other places in the bible (and even Isaiah I believe) it uses this literary device of saying there is one thing and no other in order to show how much greater that thing is compared to all other things of that type. The specific example we use is that in Isaiah 47 where the city Babylon boasts how great it is, and that it exists alone, and there is none other beside it. So, we believe it is a literary device used to emphasize Jehovah's greatness over all other gods, similar to how Babylon is greater than all other cities. This also helps to explain the multiple references in both the old and new testaments to a plurality of gods.
@@Valhalla369 Isaiah they take to ONLY mean about idolatry. That there are multiple Gods but that we shouldn’t worship any other gods and have no other gods before our god. That to US there should be no other gods none before and none after. Which clearly is not what that verse actually says. But that’s what they claim.
I am a Christian, no longer Mormon. I know that I thought I knew the Bible Referenced from the Book of Mormon. I did not know my scriptures until I was reborn and could read God's word asit was meant to read, simple without any other book. God says it all!! In the Bilble alone. The one true living God.
It is no longer about who is considered right and who is considered wrong. God will sort that out. Our responsibility is to try to live by upright values and defend all people's right to peaceful practice of their religion or belief system. If one group loses their ability to peacefully practice their beliefs, the next group could lose their ability as well.
@@rugby4lifenone615 How can we live by upright values without trying to discern right from wrong? However, you are right God will judge and He says His Elect will help Him judge.
@@rugby4lifenone615 And you've just made a determination about what upright values are, for example what does making someone's life more difficult mean? However, the Bible says the bar is much higher. You must love the Lord your God with your whole heart. Even a moment in which you do not fully love God is sin. You also say that we should defend all people's right to peaceful practice of their religion or belief system, that's dogmatic. By what standard do you arrive here?
@@rugby4lifenone615 This is wrong, the Bible even tells us we should decide or "rightly divide" what is right and wrong. If you get salvation wrong, the outcome is death.
When I interviewed everyone, I asked a whole bunch of different questions - so more videos like this to come. Here's the playlist I'll post them to: ruclips.net/p/PLAs5K46GJ7ULZjylDof2NrsTVg8OXfsfm (We've done 2 others about "eternal life" that are on that playlist)
And we need types of videos that can contrast them in real time. Actually get protestants and LDS in one room to hash it out. I've been saying this for years now.
As a ex Mormon now just Christian. It is just a matter of not believing in the bible and the many transcripts. The Book of Mormon contradicts with the Bible. In the Mormon Church that’s why they say as far as the Bible is translated correctly. It leaves doubt and misbelief in Bible. Which gives way to false doctrine.
@@Kapayapaanman 1. The Bible repeatedly asserts how God is the Only God in existence. There are no other gods. 2. Jesus is God. 3. Jesus is eternal. So He has existed as God literally since eternity. 4. Jesus’s sacrifice on the cross ended the power of death and sin and corruption. This means there is nothing else we can do. This means that the idea of the “plan of salvation” is pointless and unbiblical. Now I’m going to list some contradictions between the Bible and D&C and Pearl of Great Price: 6. Baptisms by proxy are found nowhere in the Bible (and the verse Mormons often quote from Paul’s epistles to justify it is woefully out of context). 7. God does not live near the star/planet Kolob and time does not exist differently there. 8. God does not have a wife. 9. Marriage is not eternal (Jesus himself says this directly). 10. There are not three “heavenly levels”. 11. The scroll that is sometimes referred to as “The Book of Abraham” has been translated by actual Egyptologists and revealed to have been a random funeral scroll belonging to a normal Egyptian. 12. Plural marriage (either on earth or in heaven) is not and never has been biblical. 13. Sealing is a completely made-up concept with no Biblical basis, because, once again, marriage (and families) are not eternal. Obviously there are others (read the CES letter). I just wanted to list some more major “mainstream” ones. I can keep going if you’d like! I was never a Mormon or anything like that, I just enjoy doing research. It’s really easy to just learn about this stuff, you know?
@@Kapayapaanman Hi😊 Compare the verses from Ephesians with the verse from 2 Nephi. This is one example: Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 2 Nephi 25:23 For we know that it is by grace that we are saved, *after all we can do*
@@How.To.Get.Saved. I was hoping someone would bring this up! We don’t even need to go to the Book of Mormon. The Bible contradicts itself! James unequivocally teaches that faith alone isn’t sufficient. But as to the Book of Mormon reference, you clearly don’t understand the passage as it’s merely been fed to you by evangelical dogma. For some context , here are the following verses : 24 And, notwithstanding we believe in Christ, we keep the law of Moses, and look forward with steadfastness unto Christ, until the law shall be fulfilled. 25 For, for this end was the law given; wherefore the law hath become dead unto us, and we are made alive in Christ because of our faith; yet we keep the law because of the commandments. So it’s clear, they are made Alive in christ through faith, but keep the law because they are Jews living under the law of Moses.
@@Kapayapaanman According to the Bible, God commanded that only one temple was to be built. It must be in Jerusalem. There was only one high priest at a time. According to the Book of Mormon, there were multiple temples and multiple high priests. ********* In the Bible, it took over 183,000 men seven years to build Solomon's temple. In the Book of Mormon, a few men built a replica of Solomon's temple soon after they arrived. ******** According to the Book of Mormon, God cursed people with dark skin. Dark skin can turn white. 3 Nephi 2:15 According to the Bible, God never cursed anyone with dark skin. Dark skin can not turn white.
@Aaron shavhof; what i am saying is none of what is presented in said video is doctrine. So yeah, you could say this and that, but that's just personal interpretation. The church is led by a modern day prophet. So things can change due to modern revelation.
Can you guys explain how LDS views Isaiah 43: 10, 11? 10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. 11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.
If someone believes in the infinite regress of our 'ancestor gods', I cannot see any difference here from an atheist who believes in an infinite number of universes and their aliens that have lived before us, and we are just one link in that chain.. 😒
Interesting. When I was LDS I believed God was literally my "heavenly father" and yet today's LDS cannot even tell you who God is. How sad. But then you have to keep in mind that they have a different definition of god.
Yes they do. It is confusing, I agree. So is the Trinity confusing. But I want to ask you a question too. Why would you worship God when you believe he will allow about 90% of his creation to go to a torturous Hell, because they got their theology wrong in this life? Why is the one unforgivable sin that the Saviors atonement will not cover, incorrect theology about who he is? For an Evangelical, that excludes about 90 percent of his creation from salvation. So why would one choose to worship God knowing this.
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m God can do whatever he wants with his creation. If God were just, he would send everyone of us to hell. Why should God have to send his only Son to pay the penalty for our sins? Is that fair? . Because Adam sinned, the entire human race now has a sinful nature (Romans 5:12). But people do not go to hell because of Adam’s sin; they go to hell because of their own sin, which they freely choose (James 1:13-16). Since God is eternal, immutable, and infinite, and all sins are fundamentally against God, God has decreed the just punishment for sin must also be eternal (Matthew 25:46). God also created people to live eternally. So when someone commits a sin against another person, the offended person has also been eternally wronged. God, therefore, has deemed all who commit sin will go to hell because they have failed to meet His righteous standard; they have broken His Law of moral perfection. If God did not send people to hell for breaking His laws, it could be said that God is not just (Psalm 7:11). A good analogy is a court of law with a judge and a lawbreaker. A just judge will always convict the person who has been found guilty. If that judge did not pursue justice for the crime, he would not be a just judge (Deuteronomy 32:4). However, the good news is that God is also merciful. In His rich mercy, He made a way for sinners to avoid the punishment of hell by trusting in the atoning work of His Son, Jesus Christ (Romans 5:9). The penalty of sin has been removed and placed upon Christ on the cross (1 Peter 2:24). Because of the sacrifice of Christ, God is still just-the sin is punished-yet He is also merciful to all who believe.
@@jlewis8145So you are telling me that you worship God because he has saved YOU and about 10% of his creation because that is appropriately how many people have ever believed like you throughout exsistence on earth. Correct?
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m God doesn't send anyone to hell. People choose to go there. "God desires all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth."
@jlewis8145 Mormons do not choose to go to Hell just because they believe differently. They love God with all their heart. Even if they were wrong God must see that love is sincere. You have to see this!
The standard Christian concept of God always puzzled me. They claim he possesses all knowledge from all eternity, but that makes no sense. How could he have knowledge of things that have not even come into existence until he creates them?
1 Corinthians 8:4-6 is a reaffirmation of monotheism and the uniqueness of the Christian understanding of God, within the context of addressing idolatry. In this passage, Paul acknowledges that in the broader cultural context of Corinth, there were many "gods" and "lords" worshiped as part of pagan religious practices. However, he clarifies that for Christians, there is only one true God.
The question should be does the Bible teach that there is a god above God. Does the book of Mormon teach that there is a god above God. If neither book teaches that then no matter what a prophet says it isn't true 3:54
Christians just need to accept Jesus as God then John 20 answers the question. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
@jacobsamuelson3181 Jesus Christ is still fully God and fully man. Nothing has changed. As a man, Jesus ate, slept, wept, prayed to his Father in heaven and died. As God, Jesus forgave sins, created all things, performed miracles, accepted worship from the people, raised the dead, and even raised himself from the dead. John 2:19
@@Elizabeth-rk3do If Jesus was and is Fully God then He has a God and God has a God. There's no way around it. You even mentioning Satan right now shows how badly you don't want to accept John 20 where Jesus has a God. I understand it's not what the pastors have fed you but it doesn't mean it's not true.
Does God have a God above him???? Where do you arrive at the conclusion? How do latter day saints come to this conclusion? It doesn't even say this in the King Follett discourse. So how does anyone arrive at this conclusion?
@@Ralph419 yeah? OK now read the rest. "He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, THE SAME AS JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF DID; and I will show it FROM THE BIBLE... What did Jesus say?The scriptures inform us that Jesus said, as the Father hath power in himself, even so hath the Son power-to do what? Why, what the Father did. The answer is obvious-in a manner to lay down HIS BODY AND TAKE IT UP AGAIN. Jesus, what are you going to do? To lay down my life AS MY FATHER DID, and take it up again. Do you believe it? If you do not believe it you do not believe the Bible. The scriptures Here, then, is eternal life-to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all gods have done BEFORR YOU." That does not say anything about a God coming before God, that does not say God was a sinner, that does not say God needed a savior. That says he dwelt on am earth like Jesus, he laid down his life and took it back up again in immortality, like Jesus. Or in other words did it and showed Jesus how to do it and Jesus said the son does what he sees his father do. So again how does anyone arrive at the conclusion a God came before God? By speculation. Nothing objective stating that. Joseph never taught that God had a God. 🤦🏻♂️
Saying God had a God is as illogical as saying Aliens explain the beginning of life. Chicken and the egg problem. By definition of what God is He cannot have any above or before Him.
Yes, you guys look so credible when you interview random people on the street and cherry-pick the most ignorant Mormons. Good job. Im convinced, and I'll be denouncing my faith in the morning.
For what it's worth - I didn't cherry pick anyone. I posted the responses from all the Latter-day Saints I interviewed. I acknowledge that this is a random sample-and may not be representative... But I didn't cherry pick LDS responses. (I did only use about 75% of the Evangelicals that received this question-but only to not make the responses super repetitive)
Concerning the thoughts in my other comment. Please don't judge me harshly for these thoughts I have. Don't sentence me to eternal torture (Hell) like early Christians sentenced Joan of Arc to torture. Please dont see me as a heretic just for being a thinker. She hoped for God's grace as do I. I believe Christ died for my sins as he did for yours.
This is Revelations, 5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, 6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. The scriptures in my eyes are quite clear when they say God has a father. Families are divine. Families are made of separate personages. Don’t let creeds get in the way of truth.
That verse is also rendered as, “and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father-to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.“
I get that these passages are very difficult for my Mormon friends to understand who don't have an understanding of the Trinity but this passage is definitely not referring to other Gods. When the New Testament refers to "God and his Father," it is distinguishing between the Persons of the Father and the Son within the Trinity. Jesus is God, the Father is God, the Holy Spirit is God. They are the three who's and God is the what. This distinction does not imply that there are multiple gods or a hierarchy of gods, but rather it speaks to the relational and functional distinctions within the Godhead. The Father is often seen as the source or originator of divine action, with the Son (Jesus) carrying out the will of the Father, especially in the context of redemption and salvation. In the specific context of Revelation 1:5-6, the reference emphasizes the unique role of Jesus Christ as the mediator of God's grace and the agent through whom believers are made kings and priests unto God. It acknowledges the divine authority and relationship between Jesus (the Son) and God the Father, reinforcing the central Christian belief in Jesus' divinity and his integral role in the divine plan for humanity.
To a Mormon it would seem like that. But to a Christian, it would be like saying, “Does an uncreated being have a creator?” This shows how drastically different the god of Mormonism is from the God of the Bible. The Mormon god can rightly be compared to men as He once was one (unofficially but definitely). The biblical God is a totally different kind of being than a man.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do - Do you really think God is not capable of creating his own dwelling place? Your question is every bit as stupid as asking ... "Which came first? The chicken or the egg?"
@scotthullinger4684 In order to create something, you must live outside of and exist independent of what you are creating. In order to build a house, the builder must exist outside of and exist independent of the building. You can't be part of the home and build the home. ****** In order for a painting to be painted, the painter must exist outside of the painting and in no way be dependent on the painting. You can't be part of the painting and make the painting. ***** In order for the universe to exist, there must be someone who lives outside of the universe and is in no way dependent on the universe for his existence. That someone is God. God exists outside of the universe and is in no way dependent on the universe for His existence. Acts 17:24-25 The true and living God spoke the universe into existence from nothing, including the planet that the LDS Heavenly Father came from and the star Kolob that he lives near.
The only problem I have with this video is that you believe you have been given permission or have authority to say who is and who is not a Christian. Only Jesus Christ himself can say who is a true follower of him. Labeling people as not followers of Christ just shows how little you know or respect his teachings.
I agree in principle - only Jesus has this right-but Jesus HAS revealed who His "true followers" are: > "Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son." (2 John 9) > "So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples" (John 8:31) If we disregard what the Lord Jesus has spoken-then we are not Christians.
This is funny because the evangelicals basically sound like the pharisees and sadducees who would not be open to the possibility to Jesus not only being the Son of God but claiming to be God as he told them he was the I Am of Abraham days. Yes, the scripture is true to what they are saying, but heres the real question. If there is only one God, which of the two is actually God? Heavenly Father or his Son Jesus Christ? Dont bring up the trinity because the trinity is a Catholic doctrine, and many different christian denominations dont know that. In fact, over 80 percent of Christians today accept that theology to be the nature of God when it's also a made-up doctrine and not a true teaching of Jesus Christ.
@Elizabeth-rk3do No, it's not and it's definitely not in the Bible. The trinity states that all the 3 are 1 God, right? Again, which one is God? If so, show me in the Bible that it talks about the trinity without using the Nicene Creed as the theology basis of where the trinity comes from.
Is the word omnipresent in scripture? Yet we use this term to describe the nature of God because the scripture affirms this, the same way it affirms the Trinity. There's two types of evolving doctrine: 1. The stuff made up by men (God is unchanging). Ie multiple Gods and being able to become a God yourself. 2. And the type of doctrine that evolves and makes itself clear to us as our understanding of doctrine grows, much like a child's. This is the doctrine of the Trinity, which helps us to understand the relationship of the Father, the Sonz and the Holy Spirit, the three "who's," and the one "what" which is God.
@dinkledork4421 The world isn't omnipresent in scripture? If that were so, then there would have never been a reformation and so many different christian denominations in the world today. But yes, they are when it comes to the trinity because of the Roman Catholic faith who taught the Trinity doctrine. That's not a teaching that's from any other Christian faith. That is the only reason why the Trinity is well believed by so many Christians today. There are only two doctrines actually. The one of the lamb of God and the doctrine of the devil which is of man or not the teachings of the lamb. The trinity was made up by men and not of God and again, that's not in the Bible.
@truev6585 The trinity is based on the Bible. 1. There is only one God. 2. There are three persons in the Godhead. Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. 3. Each person is God. "Baptizing them in the name (singular) of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost." ******** Where is the LDS Heavenly Father mentioned in the Bible? Who created the LDS Heavenly Father with a body of flesh and bone? Who created the planet that he came from? Who created the star Kolob that he lives near? Who created all his wives? (Why does he need wives in the first place?) Why did he have to work his way to Godhood? Why does he damn people who deny the eternal principle of polygamy? D&C 132 Etc.
Steven saw Jesus Christ standing on the right hand of God. Sounds like at least two Gods there. Or is Jesus not God? Very confusing doctrine-the trinity.
@@beaumccraney8914we can speak of two persons of the Godhead being interacted with separately. This is also why we see the Son pray to the Father. And yet John says that the Son was “in the beginning with God and WAS God.”
Joseph Smith said that all the creeds of Christianity were an abomination, Christians were deceived by Satan, anti Christ, all wrong, and had the spirit of the devil in them. John Taylor said that Christianity was a perfect pack of nonsense.
It’s a matter of vocabulary and defining terms. It seems to me that Latter-day Saints changed their definition of _Christian_ two decades ago or so. LDS leaders used to have a much narrower view of the term than they do now. I’ve seen many quotes dating from 1971 to 2001 from LDS publications mentioning “so called Christianity,” “so-called Christian church,” “so-called Christian communities,” “so-called Christian scholars,” “where else shall we find true Christians except among the Latter-day Saints?” etc. But now they’ve widened the meaning. That’s their right, but why criticize evangelicals for having a narrower view? I (being an evangelical) believe a Christian is, among other things, (1) someone who *presently* possesses eternal life through faith alone in Christ alone and (2) someone to believes in the one true gospel and therefore belongs to the one true church. In your mind, does the first statement describe you? Do you believe that the second one describes me? Why are Latter-day Saints offended that we don’t use the same meaning of the word?
My question is, people believe Jesus is GOD, and yet in the Bible Jesus states that He was not GOD. He and the Father are not the same. I think this is where people make the mistake. We will not know if God (Yehovah) has a Father, but if we look into the Greek gods it might be true. We will only know when we meet him, according to Urantia Book there is one Supreme God and under him many other gods and Jesus is one of them, I dont know if I believe it but it is very interesting.
One thing you need to understand is that it is not a sin to use your mind or have a different opinion on scripture. Yes, the Mormons allow themselves to think beyond this universe and beyond one God. Perhaps there are different dimensions or definitions of eternity. There is more for us all to learn beyond this life. But the truth is, they only worship ONE God. And they have accepted the Atonement of Gods son. That is the Gospel in its simplicity. You call Mormons heretics and essentially sentence them to torture in fire after this life. Just like John Calvin played a part in Sevetus' torture by fire in this life. Just for thinking differently. Is this love?
@@altasadventures1139A simple question. Why do you worship God when you believe he will not save Mormons or about 90% of his creation when he put them in the situations that foster their beliefs? Do you believe that the one unforgivable sin that the Atonement will not cover, is incorrect theology about who God is?
@@altasadventures1139That is unkind of you to say. I do believe in Jesus and I have accepted his atonement. The Bible tells us to not judge so please do not judge me. And I am sorry for judging you. But I am curious. Do you think Mormons are saved?
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m Being raised in the Mormon faith (then left) and still having family that are Mormon, I can tell you this. God knows your heart! It is not for me to judge. I know where I am going when I leave this earth and I am only accountable for me.
@@janinewaldera5763 Thank you for that. I agree. God knows my heart. He knows that I wish with all my heart to do his will. He knows that I read my scriptures and I see contractiction in them (including the Bible). I see his love and I see his justice. And the only way I can reconcile them in my fallible mind is through the concept of degrees of Glory and Hope for those in Hell. (spirit prison like you have learned in your Mormon years). God knows my heart. He knows that I would sacrifice eternal comfort and ease in Heaven so that I can love and serve him by loving and serving his creation forever even if it is hard. You may expect to live in paradise with complete ease and peace for eternity. I know you will recieve that. I am happy for you. I am willing to learn, grow, do, serve, show charity to ALL of God's creation for eternity. Even those in Hell. It will be hard. It will not be all sunshine and rainbows. It will be 100% thinking and living for others. To do Gods will for eternity which I believe is to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man. That is what it means to think Celestial. God knows my heart Janine. He knows that when I try to believe like GLM, I am so devastated that I want to take my life. GLM believes that about 90% of God's creation will be tortured forever in Hell. They believe that the one sin that Christ's atonement does not cover, is incorrect theology about who he is in this life. That excludes most people, in their mind, from salvation. It is devastating. Who cares if I am saved Janine, when most people are not.
”But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ. For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.“ 2 Corinthians 11:3-4 What you call using your mind God calls being deceived. If a conclusion you come to disagrees with the Bible then you have been deceived.
There are three base problems with this youtube piece. First: the title "Mormons and Christians Respond" sets up a false dichotomy. It is therefore sloppy and agenda ridden. Second: interviewing believers of a given denomination does not necessarily reflect the doctrinal position of the denomination. It can be interesting as an overview of membership, but can misrepresent the official stance of the faith in question. It can therefore be misleading and agenda ridden. Third: the Evangelical respondent's typically reference the Bible to assert a monotheistic standard. The Bible does not assume monotheism. That is a view imposed on the text(s) and a naive reading of the same. It is long established in academic circles the Bible notes a monolatrous and/or henotheistic cosmology. This is the case found throughout the Bible. The Hebrew El compared to YHWH and/or Adonai is a simple example. Verses like "(F)or I am God, and there is none other; I am God, and there is none like Me" Isaiah 46:9 is a literary device known as incomparability rhetoric. It is a comparative statement, not an assertion of metaphysical singleness. It was a common rhetorical claim across the literature of the Ancient World. The same verbiage can be found in Ancient Egyptian, Babylonian, and Sumerian Texts about a given people's primary gods, for example. This is one of the issues with appealing to a text one doesn't understand the language and cultural setting it was written in.
The instigator behind the camera does not understand the scriptures. The Elders/Missionaries could see that those preachers had the spirit of contention which is of the devil, they sounded like the Pharisees that wanted to entrap our Savior with ignorant questions. These guys were not there to preach to these young men they were there to mock them. Why don't they share their beliefs instead of putting down other's beliefs. If God had a father or not I don't have to know, it does not pertain to my salvation. there are many things we don't understand now but we will know everything when we return to our Heavenly Father. I do believe Jesus Christ was Heavenly Father's first born in the Spirit world and so were we and lucifer but remember lucifer was an angel and later because of pride he became the devil. There's 3 different personages in the Godhead something yal don't understand. God the Father, Jesus Christ Jehovah Our Savior and the Holy Ghost the Comforter. We're not taught that Heavenly Father came down and had sex with Mary "Luke 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus. 32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: 33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. 34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man? 35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." "Matthew 22:.18 But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, Why tempt ye me, ye hypocrites." That's what the Missionaries should have said to the modern Pharisees and walk away like the older gentleman did.
You wrote, "If God had a father or not I don't have to know, it does not pertain to my salvation." For Christians, not only do we know God is the Most High (without any divine ancestors), but also that this has EVERYTHING to do with our salvation. Knowing the first, original, Most High God - to personally know him and have a relationship with him - this is eternal life. It not only pertains to our salvation. Knowing this God *is* the highest benefit of our salvation.
@@AaronShafovaloff1 Have you been to heaven? Do you know Everything about Heavenly Father and His Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost the Godhead? NO, you don't know everything. That's what I said if God has a Father or not I don't need to know in order to be saved. I know for sure that when we die we will all be surprised and so amazed at how beautiful heaven is. We will learn many more things. We will live there for eternity always learning. "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways,” declares the Lord. Isaiah 55:8." God is Perfect, Holy! Jesus said he's the way back to his Father he didn't say we need to know everything about our Almighty God to be saved "John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." We are Christians The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints bears His Name it's the Church/Gospel Jesus organize when he lived on this world, but after the apostasy the gospel was taken away and restored through Joseph Smith many years later that's my testimony. You can believe it or not that's your choice. "11 Articles of Faith says We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."
Selective editing at its finest. You pluck random Latter-day Saints off the street and ask them about a point of doctrine that has not been clearly revealed in all its detail. You then contrast that with evangelicals that don’t appear to be randomly selected off the street and it isn’t a point of doctrine that is in question for them. So when compared, it appears the evangelical is confident and the Latter-day Saint is confused in their more nuanced answer that required more thought in how to answer. Latter-day Saints’ view of God is radically different than a traditional Christian church. We don’t believe in creation ex nihilo. We believe that there is more than one God, but we only worship one God. What does that look like in the eternities? Is there one true creator God above all? Many of these questions are not clearly answered by Church doctrine. We learn line upon line, precept upon precept. If Latter-day Saint doctrine are examined fairly, I believe they are amazing and answer so many questions that have perplexed theologians and philosophers for centuries.
(For what it's worth - both were chosen randomly, and I didn't prepare anyone for the questions. I have no prior relationship with anyone who answered)
The takeaway, to me, is not that Latter Day Saints have differing opinions within their own church, but rather that they cannot affirm what is very clearly stated in the Bible like a Christian can. Every Latter Day Saint has to waffle on this very crucial doctrine because their framework does not allow for an answer that affirms the biblical text that most of those Christians cited.
@@BNichols021 but you also have to realize that the belief, not doctrine, that god just always was, isn’t any more ludicrous than any Mormon claim. The LDS understanding of the nature of god is far more advanced than the evangelical belief in a magical god that can’t be seen.
@@BNichols021Did you watch Satan's Guide to the Bible. You accuse the LDS of not knowing the Bible, yet you think you can Apologize your way through any srcutiny you get for the skeptics.
@@Kapayapaanman 1. Explain why it is ludicrous 2. What matters is the truth value of the claim, not how “advanced” or rigorous the explanation is. 3. A God who is self-existent is far more impressive than one of a billion gods who are subject to laws of the universe.
Evangelicals hold a dogmatic opinion on a singular god while also confirming three with the Trinity while Mormons hold a cosmic wonder about the origins of the creator. If I had to pick, I'd choose LDS.
I understand the draw to wonder and mystery... But not all things are mysterious. The things that have been clearly revealed to us aren't mysteries. We, as creatures, have no right to be creative with revelation. We humbly *receive* what has been revealed to us. Christians are dogmatic because the Bible is so clear about this point. If God really revealed Himself in the Bible-then it would be a rejection of Him and His Word to disregard that.
Ok this video is wrong. Yes lds believe in eternal progression but we don't think that heavenly father worships a god above him. Lds religion is henotheistic/ monotheistic. Not polytheistic. No one is above heavenly father.
It just depends on the LDS member one talks to. In my street interviews with Mormons, about 2/3rds of them affirm that Heavenly Father perhaps was a sinful mortal before becoming exalted. Also, Joseph Smith himself affirmed that that an ancestor god preceded Heavenly Father in his "Sermon on Plurality of Gods" in History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 473-479. Note the way he uses the KJV of Revelation 1:6. Brigham Young and Wilford Woodruff doubled down on this. When you say, "we don't think that heavenly father worships a god above him", you should really just say, "I". You don't speak for the LDS tradition, or even a dominant view of LDS culture here. As much as evangelicals should avoid inaccurate generalizations of LDS canon, history, culture, etc. so should Mormons themselves stop making idealistic statements like, "We don't believe that!" This reminds me of LDS members responding to the notion that Mormons believe they will govern their own worlds/planets when they become exalted. "We don't believe that!" Only to have other members say, "Well, we kind of do", substantiated with quotes from LDS authorities.
This is like saying the Bible is true because it says so, because one verse is taken out of context, one that says it’s god-breathed. There are other gods, as recognized throughout the Bible.
2 things: 1) How is 2 Timothy 3:16 taken out of context? The entire point of that text is to comment on the "sacred writings" which make one "wise unto salvation" and which make the "man of God complete, equipped for every good work." The reason Scripture can do these things rests on it's nature-being God-breathed. 2) There are other created heavenly beings (sometimes called gods)...but there is no other being who can be compared to our God. Our God is the greatest conceivable being-He's been given no gift, He's never been taught by anyone. There is no Biblical reason to believe that a being above (or beside) God exists who is just like Him.
There is only one adonai (Lord/God), only one true, eternal Elohim (god-authority) There are false elohims, and people called auhorities (elohims) The true Elohim, the only Adonai, the supreme... YHWH
@jeffwilson4693 Your dad was not the first dad. Adam was the first dad. Your dad will not be the last dad. The true and living God is the first and the last. Isaiah 41:4; 44:6; 48:12; Revelation 1:17; God doesn't even know of any other God. It is not possible to have an infinite regression of causes. A god that had a mom and dad, who each had a mom and dad, ad infinitum. You can't cross an infinity to get to the first god.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do Your Dad is still your first and last Dad, your only Dad. So whether our God has a God, it doesn't change his status as our God, or we as his offspring. But if you are so mindful of the generations of man since Adam, what has your religion done for them in that regard. The LDS Church works tirelessly in Temples serving, sealing, and baptizing the dead. You only offer lip service for them and criticism for the only Church actually serving them and God. Wake up.
@jeffwilson4693 Your dad is not the first dad, and neither will he be the last dad. Everyone knows that they only have one dad. Your post is one of many reasons why Latter-day Saints are laughed at. You believe in an infinite regression of causes. 😔 Luke 16 - The rich man was already in agony in hell. Hebrews 9:27 It is appointed unto man once to die and after that the judgment. There will be no second chances. Even the Book of Mormon teaches this. Mosiah 2:36-39 Alma 34:32-35
NO - God doesn't have a God. But he has fellow Gods. Our God is The Most High God. We are taught that as we now are, God once was ... And also, as God now is, we may one day also become. No possibility of it, though, if we are disobedient and unrighteous.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do - The LDS church is not polytheistic. The church recognizes one God to whom me make our accounting - Jesus Christ, who shares the goals and purposes with his Father, God the Father, who are two entirely separate beings. We pray to God the father in the name of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is our advocate to the Father, as explained in scripture. Jesus Christ is the son of God in the flesh. To dumb it way down ... God the Father is the CEO, and Jesus Christ is the general manager and chairman of the board. The board are all the 12 apostles. The allegory falls apart if you try to take it too far, of course. But that's the general idea - dumbed way down for simpletons. To say that we are polytheistic suggests that we make our accounting to more than one Godhead. There are surely other gods in other realms, and they all have the same program. We earthlings make our accounting to ONE God - Elohim the Father. Jehovah is Jesus Christ, and is our advocate to Elohim, voluntarily achieved on our behalf. We properly pray to God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ. We do not properly pray to Jesus Christ himself, but we do indeed worship Jesus Christ, since he IS indeed our advocate to God the Father. The LDS church - the Mormon church - those are just nick names. The ACTUAL name of the church is this: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
@scotthullinger4684 The Book of Abraham 4 and 5 was polytheistic. D&C 121:32; 132:18-20, 37 are polytheistic. The Book of Abraham was shown to be fiction back in the 1960's. The thief on the cross prayed to Jesus. Do did Stephen in Acts 5.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do - Polytheism characterizes virtually all religions other than Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, which share a common tradition of monotheism, the belief in one God. Disbelievers can believe anything they want, but it hardly means that there is more than ONE God to whom we are responsible - And I don't give a crap about the "fiction" discovered in the 1960's about the book of Abraham. Just one set of disbelievers' lack of belief compared to the beliefs of theists. Those who deny ANY revealed truth are essentially atheists because they deny God. Problem is, they really have NO clue what or who it is they're denying. Such people merely identify something which they think they must deny. And the fact that the thief on the cross beside Jesus actually prayed to Jesus is meaningless. Jesus himself taught that we should pray to God the Father. But some people do, after all, unwittingly make mistakes. On the other hand ... SOME people choose to very deliberately stray into errors and mistakes by ignoring doctrine, and by ignoring and denying God. They are easily lead astray because they make no point whatsoever to ask of God for themselves, after first studying it out for themselves. God won't inspire an empty mind, but he surely WILL inspire a mind which seeks TRUTH - Go study some SHIT, and ask God if it's true after you decide it is. If you are sincere, and you actually expect a response, then the response you will rightfully get will be a stupor of thought - because your belief may be based on falsehood But if on the other hand your belief IS indeed based on TRUTH, then God will confirm the truth of things for you, if you ask in FAITH, actually believing you'll get a genuine response. The point here is that if you're truly SINCERE ... then you won't be stupid enough to study shit, and you'll know ahead of time how to recognize shit when you gleefully stumble upon it. If you're a damn FOOL, then you will FAIL, because God will not reward FOOLS. So what's the problem? The problem is that all the world's a FOOL ... except for the tiniest portion of individuals.
I love that the response from the evangelical Christians come without any hesitation! And they back up what they say with Scripture. Great video!
@@devinhildebrandt2709 66 book canon
The Bible doesn’t tell us what the books belong in the Bible. The 66 books we have share the same theme of the gospel, while not contradicting each other at all. Thus “we” don’t decide what books are canon, but we’ve discovered what books are canonical.
@@devinhildebrandt2709 If you don't have an objective standard of truth, then we can do whatever we want.
@devinhildebrandt2709 The Bible teaches Sola Scriptura. If there is no objective standard of truth, then anything goes.
Is it alright for a married man to commit adultery with a 16 year old girl, promise fathers and mothers a higher spot in heaven if they would let a 37 year old man marry their 14 year old daughters, send men on missions and while they're gone marry their wives, marry two sets of sisters and two sets of a mother and her daughter, destroy a printing press that exposes your immorality, print phony $3 and $4 bills, set up an anti bank and when people want their money you can move out of state, threaten to kill the governor of Missouri, teach the first lie of Satan, "Ye shall be as gods," etc.?
@@devinhildebrandt2709 Jesus Christ is my living Prophet, Priest, and King forever!
Why don't LDS prophets follow the teachings of Jesus Christ?
The responses here present a stark contrast and an irreconcilable point of differentiation. When my LDS neighbors ask why we can't accept them as legitimate Christians in the way that we will accept other denominations, this is one of the primary reasons.
That’s okay, our version of Christianity is much more reflective of a loving father who wants for his children all that he has to offer. I honestly wouldn’t worship a god that is invisible.
@@Kapayapaanmanthe God described in the Bible is alone sufficient to maximally satisfy every desire we will have in the next life. There will be no need or desire for many of the things that Mormons seek from their Heavenly Father: namely, exaltation, celestial marriage, eternal families. God, knowing that we are maximally satisfied in His presence, does not need to give us these things in order that we find fulfillment. To think that we need to be married to be eternally happy is to undermine God’s greatness.
@@BNichols021 this logic only holds true for a mythical god. By all means, worship your invisible god, who apparently needs validation.
I’m much more comfortable with a god the has the wherewithal to not play mind games with his children.
If he were the god you are describing, there would be zero purpose to a family and marriage structure. Zero purpose to sexuality. A Complete waste, really.
Think about it…there is absolutely zero logic in creating a human via male and female and having a family structure if It didn’t have purpose beyond this life.
You god is merely a mythical god not worthy of worship.
@@Kapayapaanman Absurd. God is visible through Jesus Christ. Even in the Old Testament we have various Theophanies. God loves all who believe in Him and the one He sent, Christ Jesus, our Lord and Savior 🤍✝️
@@louisgazor9422❤
Great video, it always surprises me that the LDS community will claim that because they have a living prophet they can know the truth and have doctrinal unity. But once that claim is tested they all either don’t know or differ on their views on what should be pretty basic doctrine. But I’m always so glad to see that Christians from all over the country attending different churches and denominations are so unified on the essentials of doctrine. Because we have the Lord Jesus as our prophet, priest, and king.
Unified on essential doctrine? If that was the case there wouldn’t be denominations!
Hey! I just made another video about this exact point. Check it out, if you're curious about this (the unity that all Christians have on essential doctrines): ruclips.net/video/IYBxPnNKsCw/видео.html
@@truthseek7987 not true at all, there are still disagreements on non essential doctrine. For example is it right to baptize babies, while both sides affirm that the other side are Christians and are saved because we disagree on this matter we have different denominations. But we have unity in the essentials. Not every doctrine is essential there are degrees of doctrine. If you have disagreements on 1 degree doctrines I.e. is their only one God and is he triune then you are not a Christian and not saved. If you disagree in 2nd degree doctrine I.e. should we baptize babies then you will be part of a separate denomination but still affirmed to be a Christian. If you disagree on 3rd degree doctrine I.e. eschatology then you can be part of the same denomination and even the same church.
@@1689-Cigars I don't know how you can call saving ordinances non essentials. You whole religion apparently is non essentials.
@@jacobsamuelson3181 instead of reading something I didn’t say into what I said address what I actually said. I didn’t say baptism is nonessential, I said disagreeing on when someone needs to be baptized does not make the other side of the discussion not Christian. But there aren’t any “saving” ordinances, ”For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.“ Ephesians 2:8-9. Faith in the Lord Jesus of the Bible saves. I’m not saying that a person never needs to be baptized, I’m saying that you don’t need to be baptized to be saved (see the repentant thief on the cross). But all people who are saved will be baptized if they are able to, “Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do what I tell you?“ Luke 6:46
Lol, I wish I was standing there when you asked Justin Peters.
God worships a God..... really? And then they wonder why so many do not consider them Christians? This is some good seed planting! Lord, may they open their eyes to the huge inconsistencies in their belief system.
We worship Jesus as God who also worships his Father who is God. Read John 17 and 20 and Tell me how inconsistent that is in biblical teaching.
@jacobsamuelson3181 God, by definition, is infinite. The triune God, (3 in one) is eternal. This is foundational in Christianity (John 17:5). So, with this among many other foundational truths, we can understand biblical text. We know Jesus stripped himself of his glory and came as a servent (Philippians 2:7), which explains his communication with the Father. Understanding this puts scripture in context.
All that is finite can't become a God. This is blasphemous. I see no inconsistencies in the Christian understanding of biblical text. But not only scripture, archeology has done a great work in the last several decades of proving the Bible. The LDS church will try to avoid this because there is nothing out there to back up the writings that were fabricated by a man who took the wives of other men. That too, is something the LDS are not to talk about. He is the one who came up with all the doctrines you follow. You should read commentaries and get a study Bible and weigh out what you learn from what your organization teaches. We don't wrestle against flesh and blood, but against spiritual forces. Satan (a fallen angel) uses deception to lead people away from the true Jesus as presented in the holy Bible, the Word that will never fail buy Joseph Smith said it did so he was sent to restore it. If a man today claimed a sensational story like Joseph Smith did, why would anyone believe him. Whatever goes against God's Word is how we know falsehood.
You don’t believe Jesus is God Almighty and that he worships his God?
@DeathlessVindicator read my comment, I explained it. Context! Jesus was sent as a man, fully man fully God. In His mission to save sinners, he was a servant, he was our example. He prayed to God as we are to. As a man, he worshipped God. There is no contradiction in this understanding. The hypostatic union is not an easy thing to grasp and I'll admit that, but it's what is at the heart of your question.
When Jesus resurrected, He ascended to rule and reign with God the Father. He is not worshipping God the Father or God the Holy Spirit. The Trinity is very complex and I cannot fully understand it myself but it's biblically sound.
@@romans1vs6teen John 20 has the Resurrected Lord and Savior state that he has a God. If the trinity was sound which it isnt, resurrected Jesus would have had a fine time to make it know that God was three in one being. But no, he was very clear that The Father and Him were separate beings and The Father even after resurrection was his God.
This is so good!
I'm LDS, I appreciate how respectful you were in how you asked the questions.
You should reconsider
I am interested to know how an LDS views Isaiah 43: 10, 11?
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.
@@Valhalla369 The LDS interpretation that makes this coherent with our doctrine is that in other places in the bible (and even Isaiah I believe) it uses this literary device of saying there is one thing and no other in order to show how much greater that thing is compared to all other things of that type.
The specific example we use is that in Isaiah 47 where the city Babylon boasts how great it is, and that it exists alone, and there is none other beside it.
So, we believe it is a literary device used to emphasize Jehovah's greatness over all other gods, similar to how Babylon is greater than all other cities. This also helps to explain the multiple references in both the old and new testaments to a plurality of gods.
@@Valhalla369 Isaiah they take to ONLY mean about idolatry. That there are multiple Gods but that we shouldn’t worship any other gods and have no other gods before our god. That to US there should be no other gods none before and none after. Which clearly is not what that verse actually says. But that’s what they claim.
@@Valhalla369 they also agree there is no other savior. But believe this references Yahweh not Elohim.
I am a Christian, no longer Mormon. I know that I thought I knew the Bible Referenced from the Book of Mormon. I did not know my scriptures until I was reborn and could read God's word asit was meant to read, simple without any other book. God says it all!! In the Bilble alone. The one true living God.
Praise God! He is so good, that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us and drew us to Himself.
It is no longer about who is considered right and who is considered wrong. God will sort that out. Our responsibility is to try to live by upright values and defend all people's right to peaceful practice of their religion or belief system. If one group loses their ability to peacefully practice their beliefs, the next group could lose their ability as well.
Does the Bible say Jesus is God?
@@rugby4lifenone615 How can we live by upright values without trying to discern right from wrong? However, you are right God will judge and He says His Elect will help Him judge.
@@rugby4lifenone615 And you've just made a determination about what upright values are, for example what does making someone's life more difficult mean? However, the Bible says the bar is much higher. You must love the Lord your God with your whole heart. Even a moment in which you do not fully love God is sin. You also say that we should defend all people's right to peaceful practice of their religion or belief system, that's dogmatic. By what standard do you arrive here?
Because of the LDS doctrine, they overwhelmingly answer yes to this question
I philosophically and biblically explore this question in my book, Mormonism: Impossible.
If you are presupposing Sola and Tota Scriptura. You are incorrect in many ways.
All is possible with God. You just have to trust in God and lean not to your own philosophies. He then will guide your path.
Yup, and the way He does that is through His Word, which is incompatible with Mormonism in about 10k ways. @@jacobsamuelson3181
@@rugby4lifenone615 it never was about who is right and wrong. It is always about what is true and what is not.
@@rugby4lifenone615 This is wrong, the Bible even tells us we should decide or "rightly divide" what is right and wrong. If you get salvation wrong, the outcome is death.
We need more these type of videos with different questions
When I interviewed everyone, I asked a whole bunch of different questions - so more videos like this to come. Here's the playlist I'll post them to: ruclips.net/p/PLAs5K46GJ7ULZjylDof2NrsTVg8OXfsfm
(We've done 2 others about "eternal life" that are on that playlist)
@@GLM
I’m really excited. This is a great way to show differences. I think it will help the LDS tremendously.
And we need types of videos that can contrast them in real time. Actually get protestants and LDS in one room to hash it out. I've been saying this for years now.
As a ex Mormon now just Christian. It is just a matter of not believing in the bible and the many transcripts. The Book of Mormon contradicts with the Bible. In the Mormon Church that’s why they say as far as the Bible is translated correctly. It leaves doubt and misbelief in Bible. Which gives way to false doctrine.
Where does does the Bible contradict the Book of Mormon?
@@Kapayapaanman
1. The Bible repeatedly asserts how God is the Only God in existence. There are no other gods.
2. Jesus is God.
3. Jesus is eternal. So He has existed as God literally since eternity.
4. Jesus’s sacrifice on the cross ended the power of death and sin and corruption. This means there is nothing else we can do. This means that the idea of the “plan of salvation” is pointless and unbiblical.
Now I’m going to list some contradictions between the Bible and D&C and Pearl of Great Price:
6. Baptisms by proxy are found nowhere in the Bible (and the verse Mormons often quote from Paul’s epistles to justify it is woefully out of context).
7. God does not live near the star/planet Kolob and time does not exist differently there.
8. God does not have a wife.
9. Marriage is not eternal (Jesus himself says this directly).
10. There are not three “heavenly levels”.
11. The scroll that is sometimes referred to as “The Book of Abraham” has been translated by actual Egyptologists and revealed to have been a random funeral scroll belonging to a normal Egyptian.
12. Plural marriage (either on earth or in heaven) is not and never has been biblical.
13. Sealing is a completely made-up concept with no Biblical basis, because, once again, marriage (and families) are not eternal.
Obviously there are others (read the CES letter). I just wanted to list some more major “mainstream” ones. I can keep going if you’d like! I was never a Mormon or anything like that, I just enjoy doing research. It’s really easy to just learn about this stuff, you know?
@@Kapayapaanman Hi😊
Compare the verses from Ephesians with the verse from 2 Nephi. This is one example:
Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
2 Nephi 25:23 For we know that it is by grace that we are saved, *after all we can do*
@@How.To.Get.Saved. I was hoping someone would bring this up! We don’t even need to go to the Book of Mormon. The Bible contradicts itself! James unequivocally teaches that faith alone isn’t sufficient.
But as to the Book of Mormon reference, you clearly don’t understand the passage as it’s merely been fed to you by evangelical dogma.
For some context , here are the following verses :
24 And, notwithstanding we believe in Christ, we keep the law of Moses, and look forward with steadfastness unto Christ, until the law shall be fulfilled.
25 For, for this end was the law given; wherefore the law hath become dead unto us, and we are made alive in Christ because of our faith; yet we keep the law because of the commandments.
So it’s clear, they are made Alive in christ through faith, but keep the law because they are Jews living under the law of Moses.
@@Kapayapaanman
According to the Bible, God commanded that only one temple was to be built. It must be in Jerusalem. There was only one high priest at a time.
According to the Book of Mormon, there were multiple temples and multiple high priests.
*********
In the Bible, it took over 183,000 men seven years to build Solomon's temple.
In the Book of Mormon, a few men built a replica of Solomon's temple soon after they arrived.
********
According to the Book of Mormon, God cursed people with dark skin. Dark skin can turn white. 3 Nephi 2:15
According to the Bible, God never cursed anyone with dark skin. Dark skin can not turn white.
You win this one.
Great video.
I’ve heard something new today. Thank you!
I'm in a RUclips video with Justin Peters. This is a pretty big deal...for me.
❤❤❤ thank you for exposing religious denomination
Fundamental and foundational. Get this wrong, and the rest of your theology will be wrong, guaranteed.
@Aaron shavhof; what i am saying is none of what is presented in said video is doctrine. So yeah, you could say this and that, but that's just personal interpretation. The church is led by a modern day prophet. So things can change due to modern revelation.
Can you guys explain how LDS views Isaiah 43: 10, 11?
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour.
Could you look into the Urantia Book, very interesting teachings about God.
If someone believes in the infinite regress of our 'ancestor gods', I cannot see any difference here from an atheist who believes in an infinite number of universes and their aliens that have lived before us, and we are just one link in that chain.. 😒
The infinite regress isn’t an official doctrine and is more just speculation on certain teachings.
Interesting. When I was LDS I believed God was literally my "heavenly father" and yet today's LDS cannot even tell you who God is. How sad. But then you have to keep in mind that they have a different definition of god.
Yes they do. It is confusing, I agree. So is the Trinity confusing.
But I want to ask you a question too.
Why would you worship God when you believe he will allow about 90% of his creation to go to a torturous Hell, because they got their theology wrong in this life?
Why is the one unforgivable sin that the Saviors atonement will not cover, incorrect theology about who he is?
For an Evangelical, that excludes about 90 percent of his creation from salvation.
So why would one choose to worship God knowing this.
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m God can do whatever he wants with his creation. If God were just, he would send everyone of us to hell. Why should God have to send his only Son to pay the penalty for our sins? Is that fair?
. Because Adam sinned, the entire human race now has a sinful nature (Romans 5:12). But people do not go to hell because of Adam’s sin; they go to hell because of their own sin, which they freely choose (James 1:13-16).
Since God is eternal, immutable, and infinite, and all sins are fundamentally against God, God has decreed the just punishment for sin must also be eternal (Matthew 25:46). God also created people to live eternally. So when someone commits a sin against another person, the offended person has also been eternally wronged.
God, therefore, has deemed all who commit sin will go to hell because they have failed to meet His righteous standard; they have broken His Law of moral perfection. If God did not send people to hell for breaking His laws, it could be said that God is not just (Psalm 7:11). A good analogy is a court of law with a judge and a lawbreaker. A just judge will always convict the person who has been found guilty. If that judge did not pursue justice for the crime, he would not be a just judge (Deuteronomy 32:4).
However, the good news is that God is also merciful. In His rich mercy, He made a way for sinners to avoid the punishment of hell by trusting in the atoning work of His Son, Jesus Christ (Romans 5:9). The penalty of sin has been removed and placed upon Christ on the cross (1 Peter 2:24). Because of the sacrifice of Christ, God is still just-the sin is punished-yet He is also merciful to all who believe.
@@jlewis8145So you are telling me that you worship God because he has saved YOU and about 10% of his creation because that is appropriately how many people have ever believed like you throughout exsistence on earth. Correct?
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m God doesn't send anyone to hell. People choose to go there.
"God desires all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth."
@jlewis8145 Mormons do not choose to go to Hell just because they believe differently. They love God with all their heart. Even if they were wrong God must see that love is sincere. You have to see this!
The standard Christian concept of God always puzzled me. They claim he possesses all knowledge from all eternity, but that makes no sense. How could he have knowledge of things that have not even come into existence until he creates them?
How couldn't He?
@@shishsquared because things that don't exist can't be objects of knowledge?
@@Infideles wait do you think God is contained by creation?
1 Corinthians 8:4-6
1 Corinthians 8:4-6 is a reaffirmation of monotheism and the uniqueness of the Christian understanding of God, within the context of addressing idolatry.
In this passage, Paul acknowledges that in the broader cultural context of Corinth, there were many "gods" and "lords" worshiped as part of pagan religious practices. However, he clarifies that for Christians, there is only one true God.
How would you go about proving the contradictions in genesis?
Go to Answers in Genesis.
Or Got Questions
The question should be does the Bible teach that there is a god above God. Does the book of Mormon teach that there is a god above God. If neither book teaches that then no matter what a prophet says it isn't true 3:54
Christians just need to accept Jesus as God then John 20 answers the question. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
Jesus was speaking as a man.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do When you say "was" are you implying that Jesus is not currently a man? When did Jesus stop being a man and became fully God?
@jacobsamuelson3181 Jesus Christ is still fully God and fully man. Nothing has changed.
As a man, Jesus ate, slept, wept, prayed to his Father in heaven and died.
As God, Jesus forgave sins, created all things, performed miracles, accepted worship from the people, raised the dead, and even raised himself from the dead. John 2:19
If Jesus is God, then he is not the brother of Satan.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do If Jesus was and is Fully God then He has a God and God has a God. There's no way around it. You even mentioning Satan right now shows how badly you don't want to accept John 20 where Jesus has a God. I understand it's not what the pastors have fed you but it doesn't mean it's not true.
Does God have a God above him???? Where do you arrive at the conclusion? How do latter day saints come to this conclusion? It doesn't even say this in the King Follett discourse. So how does anyone arrive at this conclusion?
See Joseph Smith papers, Wilford Woodruff account of the King Follet sermon. "he was once a man like us and the Father was once on an earth like us"
Joseph Smith was mentally ill. 😔
They arrive at this conclusion because of trinitarian dyslexia and dysphoria.
@@Ralph419 yeah? OK now read the rest.
"He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, THE SAME AS JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF DID; and I will show it FROM THE BIBLE... What did Jesus say?The scriptures inform us that Jesus said, as the Father hath power in himself, even so hath the Son power-to do what? Why, what the Father did. The answer is obvious-in a manner to lay down HIS BODY AND TAKE IT UP AGAIN. Jesus, what are you going to do? To lay down my life AS MY FATHER DID, and take it up again. Do you believe it? If you do not believe it you do not believe the Bible. The scriptures Here, then, is eternal life-to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all gods have done BEFORR YOU."
That does not say anything about a God coming before God, that does not say God was a sinner, that does not say God needed a savior. That says he dwelt on am earth like Jesus, he laid down his life and took it back up again in immortality, like Jesus. Or in other words did it and showed Jesus how to do it and Jesus said the son does what he sees his father do.
So again how does anyone arrive at the conclusion a God came before God? By speculation. Nothing objective stating that. Joseph never taught that God had a God. 🤦🏻♂️
@@Elizabeth-rk3do yeah that doesn't answer my question. Please be more helpful to the question. How does anyone arrive at that conclusion?
Saying God had a God is as illogical as saying Aliens explain the beginning of life. Chicken and the egg problem. By definition of what God is He cannot have any above or before Him.
Yes, you guys look so credible when you interview random people on the street and cherry-pick the most ignorant Mormons. Good job. Im convinced, and I'll be denouncing my faith in the morning.
For what it's worth - I didn't cherry pick anyone. I posted the responses from all the Latter-day Saints I interviewed. I acknowledge that this is a random sample-and may not be representative... But I didn't cherry pick LDS responses. (I did only use about 75% of the Evangelicals that received this question-but only to not make the responses super repetitive)
If these Mormons can't say with any confidence and surety why do they insist on speculating in something that is obvious blasphemy..
Concerning the thoughts in my other comment.
Please don't judge me harshly for these thoughts I have. Don't sentence me to eternal torture (Hell) like early Christians sentenced Joan of Arc to torture. Please dont see me as a heretic just for being a thinker. She hoped for God's grace as do I. I believe Christ died for my sins as he did for yours.
This is Revelations,
5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,
6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
The scriptures in my eyes are quite clear when they say God has a father.
Families are divine. Families are made of separate personages.
Don’t let creeds get in the way of truth.
That verse is also rendered as, “and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father-to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.“
Why don't you worship God's father?
I get that these passages are very difficult for my Mormon friends to understand who don't have an understanding of the Trinity but this passage is definitely not referring to other Gods.
When the New Testament refers to "God and his Father," it is distinguishing between the Persons of the Father and the Son within the Trinity. Jesus is God, the Father is God, the Holy Spirit is God. They are the three who's and God is the what. This distinction does not imply that there are multiple gods or a hierarchy of gods, but rather it speaks to the relational and functional distinctions within the Godhead. The Father is often seen as the source or originator of divine action, with the Son (Jesus) carrying out the will of the Father, especially in the context of redemption and salvation.
In the specific context of Revelation 1:5-6, the reference emphasizes the unique role of Jesus Christ as the mediator of God's grace and the agent through whom believers are made kings and priests unto God. It acknowledges the divine authority and relationship between Jesus (the Son) and God the Father, reinforcing the central Christian belief in Jesus' divinity and his integral role in the divine plan for humanity.
@@dinkledork4421 Nice answer.
It's like saying do Pastor haved Pastor 😂😂😂😂
To a Mormon it would seem like that. But to a Christian, it would be like saying, “Does an uncreated being have a creator?” This shows how drastically different the god of Mormonism is from the God of the Bible. The Mormon god can rightly be compared to men as He once was one (unofficially but definitely). The biblical God is a totally different kind of being than a man.
Do god's haved God
😂😂😂😂😂Many who are meant misunderstood scriptures 😂😂😂😂
NO... and we do NOT Hie to Kolob lol
Who created Kolob?
@@Elizabeth-rk3do - Do you really think God is not capable of creating his own dwelling place? Your question is every bit as stupid as asking ... "Which came first? The chicken or the egg?"
@scotthullinger4684
In order to create something, you must live outside of and exist independent of what you are creating.
In order to build a house, the builder must exist outside of and exist independent of the building.
You can't be part of the home and build the home.
******
In order for a painting to be painted, the painter must exist outside of the painting and in no way be dependent on the painting.
You can't be part of the painting and make the painting.
*****
In order for the universe to exist, there must be someone who lives outside of the universe and is in no way dependent on the universe for his existence.
That someone is God. God exists outside of the universe and is in no way dependent on the universe for His existence. Acts 17:24-25
The true and living God spoke the universe into existence from nothing, including the planet that the LDS Heavenly Father came from and the star Kolob that he lives near.
You should have added Catholics and Orthodox since they also believe in the Trinity and are true Christians.
Why did the Catholics kill Christians?
Read the original hebre Bible and you will see that Joseph Smith wasn't off base about the Eloheim. I say this as a non Mormon btw.
The only problem I have with this video is that you believe you have been given permission or have authority to say who is and who is not a Christian. Only Jesus Christ himself can say who is a true follower of him. Labeling people as not followers of Christ just shows how little you know or respect his teachings.
I agree in principle - only Jesus has this right-but Jesus HAS revealed who His "true followers" are:
> "Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son." (2 John 9)
> "So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples" (John 8:31)
If we disregard what the Lord Jesus has spoken-then we are not Christians.
This is funny because the evangelicals basically sound like the pharisees and sadducees who would not be open to the possibility to Jesus not only being the Son of God but claiming to be God as he told them he was the I Am of Abraham days.
Yes, the scripture is true to what they are saying, but heres the real question. If there is only one God, which of the two is actually God? Heavenly Father or his Son Jesus Christ?
Dont bring up the trinity because the trinity is a Catholic doctrine, and many different christian denominations dont know that. In fact, over 80 percent of Christians today accept that theology to be the nature of God when it's also a made-up doctrine and not a true teaching of Jesus Christ.
The trinity is based on what the Bible teaches. Either you haven't read the Bible or you don't understand the trinity.
@Elizabeth-rk3do No, it's not and it's definitely not in the Bible. The trinity states that all the 3 are 1 God, right? Again, which one is God? If so, show me in the Bible that it talks about the trinity without using the Nicene Creed as the theology basis of where the trinity comes from.
Is the word omnipresent in scripture? Yet we use this term to describe the nature of God because the scripture affirms this, the same way it affirms the Trinity.
There's two types of evolving doctrine:
1. The stuff made up by men (God is unchanging). Ie multiple Gods and being able to become a God yourself.
2. And the type of doctrine that evolves and makes itself clear to us as our understanding of doctrine grows, much like a child's. This is the doctrine of the Trinity, which helps us to understand the relationship of the Father, the Sonz and the Holy Spirit, the three "who's," and the one "what" which is God.
@dinkledork4421 The world isn't omnipresent in scripture? If that were so, then there would have never been a reformation and so many different christian denominations in the world today. But yes, they are when it comes to the trinity because of the Roman Catholic faith who taught the Trinity doctrine. That's not a teaching that's from any other Christian faith. That is the only reason why the Trinity is well believed by so many Christians today.
There are only two doctrines actually. The one of the lamb of God and the doctrine of the devil which is of man or not the teachings of the lamb. The trinity was made up by men and not of God and again, that's not in the Bible.
@truev6585 The trinity is based on the Bible.
1. There is only one God.
2. There are three persons in the Godhead. Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.
3. Each person is God.
"Baptizing them in the name (singular) of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost."
********
Where is the LDS Heavenly Father mentioned in the Bible?
Who created the LDS Heavenly Father with a body of flesh and bone?
Who created the planet that he came from?
Who created the star Kolob that he lives near?
Who created all his wives? (Why does he need wives in the first place?)
Why did he have to work his way to Godhood?
Why does he damn people who deny the eternal principle of polygamy? D&C 132
Etc.
If you believe in the trinity you also believe that there is more than one God.
That’s not what the Trinity implies. One God, three persons. Not three gods, three persons
Steven saw Jesus Christ standing on the right hand of God. Sounds like at least two Gods there. Or is Jesus not God? Very confusing doctrine-the trinity.
@@beaumccraney8914we can speak of two persons of the Godhead being interacted with separately. This is also why we see the Son pray to the Father. And yet John says that the Son was “in the beginning with God and WAS God.”
@@beaumccraney8914
There is only one God.
There are three persons in the Godhead. Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.
Each person is God.
@@Elizabeth-rk3doIf each person is God and there are three persons, then there must be at least three Gods.
Title makes no sense- members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints ARE Christians, too!
As a non LDS it drives me NUTS that other "Christians" claim LDS are not Christian.
Christians would not say that there may be a heavenly grandfather - an ancestry of the gods above God.
Joseph Smith said that all the creeds of Christianity were an abomination, Christians were deceived by Satan, anti Christ, all wrong, and had the spirit of the devil in them.
John Taylor said that Christianity was a perfect pack of nonsense.
@@AaronShafovaloff1 Unless you've never been Christian yourself. Then you would have no idea what Christians would say.
It’s a matter of vocabulary and defining terms. It seems to me that Latter-day Saints changed their definition of _Christian_ two decades ago or so. LDS leaders used to have a much narrower view of the term than they do now. I’ve seen many quotes dating from 1971 to 2001 from LDS publications mentioning “so called Christianity,” “so-called Christian church,” “so-called Christian communities,” “so-called Christian scholars,” “where else shall we find true Christians except among the Latter-day Saints?” etc. But now they’ve widened the meaning. That’s their right, but why criticize evangelicals for having a narrower view?
I (being an evangelical) believe a Christian is, among other things, (1) someone who *presently* possesses eternal life through faith alone in Christ alone and (2) someone to believes in the one true gospel and therefore belongs to the one true church. In your mind, does the first statement describe you? Do you believe that the second one describes me? Why are Latter-day Saints offended that we don’t use the same meaning of the word?
goofy ahh
My question is, people believe Jesus is GOD, and yet in the Bible Jesus states that He was not GOD. He and the Father are not the same. I think this is where people make the mistake. We will not know if God (Yehovah) has a Father, but if we look into the Greek gods it might be true. We will only know when we meet him, according to Urantia Book there is one Supreme God and under him many other gods and Jesus is one of them, I dont know if I believe it but it is very interesting.
John1:1-3
One thing you need to understand is that it is not a sin to use your mind or have a different opinion on scripture.
Yes, the Mormons allow themselves to think beyond this universe and beyond one God. Perhaps there are different dimensions or definitions of eternity. There is more for us all to learn beyond this life.
But the truth is, they only worship ONE God. And they have accepted the Atonement of Gods son.
That is the Gospel in its simplicity.
You call Mormons heretics and essentially sentence them to torture in fire after this life. Just like John Calvin played a part in Sevetus' torture by fire in this life.
Just for thinking differently.
Is this love?
@@altasadventures1139A simple question. Why do you worship God when you believe he will not save Mormons or about 90% of his creation when he put them in the situations that foster their beliefs?
Do you believe that the one unforgivable sin that the Atonement will not cover, is incorrect theology about who God is?
@@altasadventures1139That is unkind of you to say. I do believe in Jesus and I have accepted his atonement.
The Bible tells us to not judge so please do not judge me. And I am sorry for judging you.
But I am curious.
Do you think Mormons are saved?
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m Being raised in the Mormon faith (then left) and still having family that are Mormon, I can tell you this. God knows your heart! It is not for me to judge. I know where I am going when I leave this earth and I am only accountable for me.
@@janinewaldera5763 Thank you for that. I agree. God knows my heart. He knows that I wish with all my heart to do his will. He knows that I read my scriptures and I see contractiction in them (including the Bible). I see his love and I see his justice.
And the only way I can reconcile them in my fallible mind is through the concept of degrees of Glory and Hope for those in Hell. (spirit prison like you have learned in your Mormon years).
God knows my heart. He knows that I would sacrifice eternal comfort and ease in Heaven so that I can love and serve him by loving and serving his creation forever even if it is hard.
You may expect to live in paradise with complete ease and peace for eternity. I know you will recieve that. I am happy for you.
I am willing to learn, grow, do, serve, show charity to ALL of God's creation for eternity. Even those in Hell. It will be hard. It will not be all sunshine and rainbows. It will be 100% thinking and living for others. To do Gods will for eternity which I believe is to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man. That is what it means to think Celestial.
God knows my heart Janine. He knows that when I try to believe like GLM, I am so devastated that I want to take my life. GLM believes that about 90% of God's creation will be tortured forever in Hell. They believe that the one sin that Christ's atonement does not cover, is incorrect theology about who he is in this life. That excludes most people, in their mind, from salvation.
It is devastating. Who cares if I am saved Janine, when most people are not.
”But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ. For if someone comes and proclaims another Jesus than the one we proclaimed, or if you receive a different spirit from the one you received, or if you accept a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it readily enough.“
2 Corinthians 11:3-4
What you call using your mind God calls being deceived. If a conclusion you come to disagrees with the Bible then you have been deceived.
There are three base problems with this youtube piece.
First: the title "Mormons and Christians Respond" sets up a false dichotomy. It is therefore sloppy and agenda ridden.
Second: interviewing believers of a given denomination does not necessarily reflect the doctrinal position of the denomination. It can be interesting as an overview of membership, but can misrepresent the official stance of the faith in question. It can therefore be misleading and agenda ridden.
Third: the Evangelical respondent's typically reference the Bible to assert a monotheistic standard. The Bible does not assume monotheism. That is a view imposed on the text(s) and a naive reading of the same. It is long established in academic circles the Bible notes a monolatrous and/or henotheistic cosmology. This is the case found throughout the Bible. The Hebrew El compared to YHWH and/or Adonai is a simple example. Verses like "(F)or I am God, and there is none other; I am God, and there is none like Me" Isaiah 46:9 is a literary device known as incomparability rhetoric. It is a comparative statement, not an assertion of metaphysical singleness. It was a common rhetorical claim across the literature of the Ancient World. The same verbiage can be found in Ancient Egyptian, Babylonian, and Sumerian Texts about a given people's primary gods, for example. This is one of the issues with appealing to a text one doesn't understand the language and cultural setting it was written in.
The instigator behind the camera does not understand the scriptures. The Elders/Missionaries could see that those preachers had the spirit of contention which is of the devil, they sounded like the Pharisees that wanted to entrap our Savior with ignorant questions. These guys were not there to preach to these young men they were there to mock them. Why don't they share their beliefs instead of putting down other's beliefs. If God had a father or not I don't have to know, it does not pertain to my salvation. there are many things we don't understand now but we will know everything when we return to our Heavenly Father. I do believe Jesus Christ was Heavenly Father's first born in the Spirit world and so were we and lucifer but remember lucifer was an angel and later because of pride he became the devil. There's 3 different personages in the Godhead something yal don't understand. God the Father, Jesus Christ Jehovah Our Savior and the Holy Ghost the Comforter. We're not taught that Heavenly Father came down and had sex with Mary "Luke 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name Jesus. 32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: 33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. 34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man? 35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." "Matthew 22:.18 But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, Why tempt ye me, ye hypocrites." That's what the Missionaries should have said to the modern Pharisees and walk away like the older gentleman did.
You wrote, "If God had a father or not I don't have to know, it does not pertain to my salvation."
For Christians, not only do we know God is the Most High (without any divine ancestors), but also that this has EVERYTHING to do with our salvation. Knowing the first, original, Most High God - to personally know him and have a relationship with him - this is eternal life. It not only pertains to our salvation. Knowing this God *is* the highest benefit of our salvation.
@@AaronShafovaloff1 Have you been to heaven? Do you know Everything about Heavenly Father and His Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost the Godhead? NO, you don't know everything. That's what I said if God has a Father or not I don't need to know in order to be saved. I know for sure that when we die we will all be surprised and so amazed at how beautiful heaven is. We will learn many more things. We will live there for eternity always learning. "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways,” declares the Lord. Isaiah 55:8." God is Perfect, Holy! Jesus said he's the way back to his Father he didn't say we need to know everything about our Almighty God to be saved "John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." We are Christians The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints bears His Name it's the Church/Gospel Jesus organize when he lived on this world, but after the apostasy the gospel was taken away and restored through Joseph Smith many years later that's my testimony. You can believe it or not that's your choice. "11 Articles of Faith says
We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."
Selective editing at its finest. You pluck random Latter-day Saints off the street and ask them about a point of doctrine that has not been clearly revealed in all its detail. You then contrast that with evangelicals that don’t appear to be randomly selected off the street and it isn’t a point of doctrine that is in question for them. So when compared, it appears the evangelical is confident and the Latter-day Saint is confused in their more nuanced answer that required more thought in how to answer.
Latter-day Saints’ view of God is radically different than a traditional Christian church. We don’t believe in creation ex nihilo. We believe that there is more than one God, but we only worship one God. What does that look like in the eternities? Is there one true creator God above all? Many of these questions are not clearly answered by Church doctrine. We learn line upon line, precept upon precept.
If Latter-day Saint doctrine are examined fairly, I believe they are amazing and answer so many questions that have perplexed theologians and philosophers for centuries.
(For what it's worth - both were chosen randomly, and I didn't prepare anyone for the questions. I have no prior relationship with anyone who answered)
The takeaway, to me, is not that Latter Day Saints have differing opinions within their own church, but rather that they cannot affirm what is very clearly stated in the Bible like a Christian can. Every Latter Day Saint has to waffle on this very crucial doctrine because their framework does not allow for an answer that affirms the biblical text that most of those Christians cited.
@@BNichols021 but you also have to realize that the belief, not doctrine, that god just always was, isn’t any more ludicrous than any Mormon claim. The LDS understanding of the nature of god is far more advanced than the evangelical belief in a magical god that can’t be seen.
@@BNichols021Did you watch Satan's Guide to the Bible. You accuse the LDS of not knowing the Bible, yet you think you can Apologize your way through any srcutiny you get for the skeptics.
@@Kapayapaanman
1. Explain why it is ludicrous
2. What matters is the truth value of the claim, not how “advanced” or rigorous the explanation is.
3. A God who is self-existent is far more impressive than one of a billion gods who are subject to laws of the universe.
Evangelicals hold a dogmatic opinion on a singular god while also confirming three with the Trinity while Mormons hold a cosmic wonder about the origins of the creator. If I had to pick, I'd choose LDS.
I understand the draw to wonder and mystery... But not all things are mysterious. The things that have been clearly revealed to us aren't mysteries.
We, as creatures, have no right to be creative with revelation. We humbly *receive* what has been revealed to us. Christians are dogmatic because the Bible is so clear about this point. If God really revealed Himself in the Bible-then it would be a rejection of Him and His Word to disregard that.
God clearly says He is the only God. Then random humans say "Well we aren't entirely sure"
@@silaaron76And you say "the Bible is infallible and the only word of God."
@@Imtryingtobelikejesus-m1m Yes.
Yes Trinitarians hold to an illogical unreasonable God and LDS hold to logical reasonable one.
Ok this video is wrong. Yes lds believe in eternal progression but we don't think that heavenly father worships a god above him.
Lds religion is henotheistic/ monotheistic. Not polytheistic. No one is above heavenly father.
It just depends on the LDS member one talks to. In my street interviews with Mormons, about 2/3rds of them affirm that Heavenly Father perhaps was a sinful mortal before becoming exalted.
Also, Joseph Smith himself affirmed that that an ancestor god preceded Heavenly Father in his "Sermon on Plurality of Gods" in History of the Church, Vol. 6, p. 473-479. Note the way he uses the KJV of Revelation 1:6.
Brigham Young and Wilford Woodruff doubled down on this.
When you say, "we don't think that heavenly father worships a god above him", you should really just say, "I". You don't speak for the LDS tradition, or even a dominant view of LDS culture here.
As much as evangelicals should avoid inaccurate generalizations of LDS canon, history, culture, etc. so should Mormons themselves stop making idealistic statements like, "We don't believe that!" This reminds me of LDS members responding to the notion that Mormons believe they will govern their own worlds/planets when they become exalted. "We don't believe that!" Only to have other members say, "Well, we kind of do", substantiated with quotes from LDS authorities.
This is like saying the Bible is true because it says so, because one verse is taken out of context, one that says it’s god-breathed.
There are other gods, as recognized throughout the Bible.
2 things:
1) How is 2 Timothy 3:16 taken out of context? The entire point of that text is to comment on the "sacred writings" which make one "wise unto salvation" and which make the "man of God complete, equipped for every good work." The reason Scripture can do these things rests on it's nature-being God-breathed.
2) There are other created heavenly beings (sometimes called gods)...but there is no other being who can be compared to our God. Our God is the greatest conceivable being-He's been given no gift, He's never been taught by anyone. There is no Biblical reason to believe that a being above (or beside) God exists who is just like Him.
@Kapayapaanman The bible only makes reference to Yahweh and false gods.
There is only one adonai (Lord/God), only one true, eternal Elohim (god-authority)
There are false elohims, and people called auhorities (elohims)
The true Elohim, the only Adonai, the supreme... YHWH
There is one God and then there are spiritual beings that sometimes humans worship as gods. Different meanings.
@@Fede_uyz are you admitting Jesus isn’t god?
My Dad has a Dad. But my Dad is still my Dad.
But your dad is not the first dad and he is not the last dad.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do Yes actually everyone's Dad is first and last as we each have only one.
@jeffwilson4693 Your dad was not the first dad. Adam was the first dad. Your dad will not be the last dad.
The true and living God is the first and the last.
Isaiah 41:4; 44:6; 48:12;
Revelation 1:17;
God doesn't even know of any other God.
It is not possible to have an infinite regression of causes. A god that had a mom and dad, who each had a mom and dad, ad infinitum.
You can't cross an infinity to get to the first god.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do Your Dad is still your first and last Dad, your only Dad. So whether our God has a God, it doesn't change his status as our God, or we as his offspring. But if you are so mindful of the generations of man since Adam, what has your religion done for them in that regard. The LDS Church works tirelessly in Temples serving, sealing, and baptizing the dead. You only offer lip service for them and criticism for the only Church actually serving them and God. Wake up.
@jeffwilson4693 Your dad is not the first dad, and neither will he be the last dad. Everyone knows that they only have one dad.
Your post is one of many reasons why Latter-day Saints are laughed at. You believe in an infinite regression of causes. 😔
Luke 16 - The rich man was already in agony in hell.
Hebrews 9:27 It is appointed unto man once to die and after that the judgment.
There will be no second chances. Even the Book of Mormon teaches this.
Mosiah 2:36-39
Alma 34:32-35
NO - God doesn't have a God. But he has fellow Gods. Our God is The Most High God.
We are taught that as we now are, God once was ...
And also, as God now is, we may one day also become.
No possibility of it, though, if we are disobedient and unrighteous.
So then the LDS church is polytheistic.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do - The LDS church is not polytheistic. The church recognizes one God to whom me make our accounting - Jesus Christ, who shares the goals and purposes with his Father, God the Father, who are two entirely separate beings. We pray to God the father in the name of Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ is our advocate to the Father, as explained in scripture. Jesus Christ is the son of God in the flesh. To dumb it way down ... God the Father is the CEO, and Jesus Christ is the general manager and chairman of the board. The board are all the 12 apostles. The allegory falls apart if you try to take it too far,
of course. But that's the general idea - dumbed way down for simpletons.
To say that we are polytheistic suggests that we make our accounting to more than one Godhead. There are surely other gods in other realms, and they all have the same program.
We earthlings make our accounting to ONE God - Elohim the Father.
Jehovah is Jesus Christ, and is our advocate to Elohim, voluntarily achieved on our behalf.
We properly pray to God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ. We do not properly pray to Jesus Christ himself, but we do indeed worship Jesus Christ, since he IS indeed our advocate to God the Father. The LDS church - the Mormon church - those are just nick names.
The ACTUAL name of the church is this: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
@scotthullinger4684
The Book of Abraham 4 and 5 was polytheistic.
D&C 121:32;
132:18-20, 37 are polytheistic.
The Book of Abraham was shown to be fiction back in the 1960's.
The thief on the cross prayed to Jesus. Do did Stephen in Acts 5.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do -
Polytheism characterizes virtually all religions other than Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, which share a common tradition of monotheism, the belief in one God. Disbelievers can believe anything they want, but it hardly means that there is more than ONE God to whom we are responsible -
And I don't give a crap about the "fiction" discovered in the 1960's about the book of Abraham. Just one set of disbelievers' lack of belief compared to the beliefs of theists. Those who deny ANY revealed truth are essentially atheists because they deny God. Problem is, they really have NO clue what or who it is they're denying. Such people merely identify something which they think they must deny. And the fact that the thief on the cross beside Jesus actually prayed to Jesus is meaningless. Jesus himself taught that we should pray to God the Father. But some people do, after all, unwittingly make mistakes. On the other hand ... SOME people choose to very deliberately stray into errors and mistakes by ignoring doctrine, and by ignoring and denying God. They are easily lead astray because they make no point whatsoever to ask of God for themselves, after first studying it out for themselves. God won't inspire an empty mind, but he surely WILL inspire a mind which seeks TRUTH -
Go study some SHIT, and ask God if it's true after you decide it is. If you are sincere, and you actually expect a response, then the response you will rightfully get will be a stupor of thought - because your belief may be based on falsehood But if on the other hand your belief IS indeed based on TRUTH, then God will confirm the truth of things for you, if you ask in FAITH, actually believing you'll get a genuine response.
The point here is that if you're truly SINCERE ... then you won't be stupid enough to study shit, and you'll know ahead of time how to recognize shit when you gleefully stumble upon it. If you're a damn FOOL, then you will FAIL, because God will not reward FOOLS. So what's the problem? The problem is that all the world's a FOOL ... except for the tiniest portion of individuals.