Boudicca's Obelisk in the Epping Forest Uplands (4K)
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- Опубликовано: 3 ноя 2018
- A walk in the Epping Forest Uplands in search of the Boudicca Obelisk. We also go through the grounds of Copt Hall and look at Warlies Park and the Temple.
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Great walk - two obelisks, a castle, a rotunda, a river, a bull, a shotgun, poisonous berries, a missing footpath and a sunset to boot. What more could one want? Thank you, John.
Brilliant summary Mariana - it really delivered
You are soo intelligent, interesting, and a quality that’s deeply attractive, humble. I luv the way you intersperse history & myth, time periods, eras, architecture, bios, the details are astounding!!!
Your camera work is peaceful & quiet, confident.
The fact you walked to Boudicca’s obelisk!! And you married an Aussie!!
I just L❤️VE you & your UT channel. Thank Y❤️U, John Rogers❣️❣️❣️
Thank you very much Gayle - very kind of you
Love, Love, Love your films! So peaceful and informative in these harsher times: it’s nice to see someone at ease with the world around them...
Thanks so much bennozoid- means a lot that you get that from the films
John Rogers, David Attenborough of walking. Love the ambience, pace, narration, scenery and accompanying music.
thanks so much ewelina - I love that tag-line
Very moving. That's such a great example of building being a form of poetry.
Beautiful walk, glad I'm not the only one to get lost 😀
your videos have a meditation quality especially with the selection of music. Really enjoying your walks!
Wonderful walk. Very much looking forward to your next outing.
thanks Kevin - just uploaded the new video, will be live at midday Wednesday
Fantastic walk John, I was watching this and was overcome with the urge to walk so I stopped it half way through and stuck my boots on and off I went at 19 00 in the dark with wind and light rain, this is how much you inspire me to keep walking, I did watch the rest of your video on my return, great stuff John, keep those feet moving mate 👍☺️
That’s brilliant to hear Ronnie, I’ve been housebound most of the week so can’t wait to out there at the weekend
Thanks John. Fantastic video and some beautiful shots.
Thanks T.A.
I very much enjoyed your thought process regarding the ability to percieve the natural beauty of a place, but still be mindful of the influence that the inhabitants have had on the location.
You perfectly gave substance to why I feel so appreciative of these Isles, after living in the untouched natural splendor of Oregon for a number of years. I had really not fully appreciated how utterly magical it is to see signs that our ancestors were living on this land, it gives a sudden channel to our past. That is, until I had the perceptive of walking in the countryside that has next to no signs of the previous inhabitants.
I'm rambling, but I very much wanted to thank you for sharing your philosophical musings while strolling along. That's really why I believe that your channel stands so above - because you share so much of yourself. It has become rare to find such sincerity and personal authenticity on RUclips.
Thanks for your kind words and insights Mark - there's magic all around
Another joyful journey, thanks for sharing. I agree with your comments on the psychogeography of the rural landscape. Where I live now is littered with the remnants of old lead mine workings, dry stone walls and ancient field enclosures. On the surface, it looks natural, bleak and as if no one has ever lived there! I was born and bred in South London, so I absolutely get that too😉.
thanks Tracey - I went to a great talk by somebody from the Forestry Commission years ago when I was doing an Arts Council funded psychogeography project and he showed this photo of a beautiful woodland with a stream then explained in detail just how highly managed it all was.
@@JohnRogersWalks I think it would be hard to find anywhere on these islands that hadn't been exploited by humans at some point in history.
Nice walk John. The atmosphere of the countryside in autumn somehow gets you closer to the history and better still the myths and legends of the area. You can somehow imagine stumbling across Boudica and her armies camped out among the trees. These stories are there to be enjoyed and not disproved as some historians set out to do.
We are lucky. There is so much hidden and waiting to be found in this area and being so close to London you would imagine more folk would come out to take advantage. But as you say maybe its all the nicer because they don't.
I completely agree Richard- I think the shortening of the days heightens our senses
Brilliant video John. Done loads of studying of Boudicca and I still think she's buried under Platform 10 at Kings Cross Station!!
Yet again, John a wonderful walk that gives an insight to a fascinating area.
I grew up in Leytonstone but spent much time in this area walking and cycling. Most Wednesday evenings a group of us would cycle from Leytonstone to The Good Intent Pub in Upshire and in the winter would gather round a log fire before riding home through six inches of snow. Great times.
...and now I want to build a commemorative obelisk.
Thanks John for another great video, take care.
thanks Arthur
6:30 my word what a pillbox
this is why i love your videos john
thanks John - that is one of my favourite pillboxes
Another great film and another (Ackroyd) book purchased. Thanks John
Thanks Boyd - this was a great walk that will live long in the memory
A great walk. John, you no more than mentioned Boudica and my mind went straight to Michael Woods and then you mentioned him. I think Professor Woods is the biggest reason I love European and especially Britians ancient history. Cheers.🎒
Thanks Scott - I love Michael Wood's documentaries, he's a fantastic story-teller as well as historian
Your videos always fill me with nostalgia..warlies park was a favourite when I lived in waltham abbey as it was so close. There are some great Brook trails in there and various trails within the forest. I used to watch the cuckoo's there in spring. Lots of fallow deer heards too 👍 thanks for the uploads
thanks for sharing those memories Stu
We used to play in there as kids..supposedly haunted! Great video
I thank you so much for your video's. I am not from England and have no means to get to England. Your videos are educational as well as enjoyable to watch. Thank you again!
Thanks Tom - let's hope I can bring England a bit closer to you
Once again John I've watch this vid just Coz I can't take in all the information you share with us
Just been out and got this other London book I've not read a book in ages. aswell and on the hunt for highwaymans heath now
Big thank you for getting me out and reading again
Brilliant to hear Alfie, hope you enjoy it
I love this, so relaxing. The music is perfect too, made me think of The Detectorists. Psychogeography - love it.
I love the Detectorists so thanks for that Sue
Me too! One of my very favourite programmes. Much of it filmed in Essex.
Again great work John... Thank you. Epping forest was my playground. A remember kid from my local school found a Roman scabbard in the forest, perhaps a remnant of a Roman battle with Boudicca's warriors? Visiting from NZ in 2011..its still a magical place just as I remembered ... the trees welcomed me back home :-)
Thanks David - I can't even begin to imagine how exciting it would be for a kid to find a Roman artefact in the forest
What a lovely walk John thank you once again for sharing. I used to live in Somerset, it has such a beautiful landscape especially on the South Devonshire boarder. I’d walk the country lanes laced with the fragrance of Honeysuckle and hear the odd call of a pheasant. Such a stark experience for me now that I live in Stratford. These videos that you share inspire me to get out of the grubby streets of East London. Keep the boots on John!!
Thanks Michael - it is magical down there, and I want to walk in the Quantoks at some point. There's no chance of these boots coming off
A good way to relax is to watch one of your videos! 🙂👍
Great walk thanks John. Having a weekly walk mostly in rural Norfolk I found your comments about the built environment very interesting. We see examples of this every not only on the fens but on the higher arable land as well. Of course the estates like Oxburgh and Holkham are completely design by humans! Thanks for sharing really apricate your efforts Paul
thanks Paul
Once again thank youfor taking us along with your rambles.Much appreciated and as per usual full of new information.
Thanks Paul - it’s such a pleasure to share these walks
Thank you John once again to a fascinating walk ,that is an illiustration of the beauty of the countryside along with the history that it denotes, whether in myth and legend or in fact. I appreciate you for allowing me to enjoy this journey vicariously.
Thanks Humble that’s very kind of you
58 seconds in and I’ve already given it a thumbs up , love these videos 👍👍👍
Brilliant thanks Matt
great video John. Cant wait for the next
thanks John - I shot the next one on Monday - a fantastic walk around Gallions Point and North Woolwich
Thank you John, I can only echo all of the past comments, your walks are epic, thanks for inviting me.
Thanks Little Acorns - I feel like I walk with you all
Those walks where you don't get shot are always the best :)
They’re my favourite walks Lee - my old man taught me young to stand behind the gun
Absolutely magickal! Thank you John.
Only Just Discovered These Amazing videos. Thank you so much for putting the time and effort in to share such tranquil settings and showcase this part of London.
I have lived in Leytonstone for over 37 years and can truly say there is no place like Home.
Many thanks indeed - I love making these videos and sharing my appreciation of the area, so always great to read comments like this. I was over at the Hollow Ponds the other night near sunset thinking how blessed we are to live here
Thanks John, always look forward to going for a walk with you.
cheers Bob
A totally enchanting walk, John, through a very magical landscape. Glad you got home safe and sound.
You can't beat being out in the open countryside
Great video..Thanks!!
Thanks Route 66 - it really lifts the soul
Another lovely walk John...I cast these to watch on my TV...makes me feel like I'm walking with you...really nice & thanks for the quality of your videos. I'm newly retired and hope one day to visit the UK hopefully stay a month or so...and do some walks, I know I can't go everywhere so these let me visit places I would never get the chance to see...just wonderful! Thank you!
Thanks so much for that wonderful comment- hope you make it here one day
Only just found you, thank you for your films! love your walks/storytelling, relaxing for me thanks John.
many thanks Stephen
Thank you for your walks. You live in such a beautiful place.
Thanks Debra - I’m so grateful to have this on my doorstep
Love it John..A fantastic trip round my world.
Thanks Stef
Thank you John, you really are an inspiration!
thanks so much Les
Wonderful video! It was such a pretty walk. Thank you for the history on route - and of course for assuring us that you were on track make it home that evening!
Love your walks places that I walked myself as a kid, but you bring to light the history surrounding the area, which I knew little of thanks.
God i do love your walks thanks john
thanks so much 4thEye - did a great walk yesterday
Thank you john for another lovely video and for educating me as I have been to epping so many times during my lifetime but had no knowledge at all about the obelisk. Maybe I will check it out sometime. Glad you didn't get shot by the way. The sunsets are great at this time of year, I live opposite claybury park and enjoy them every evening., bob.
Thanks so much Bob - you have one of the best views in London
Loved this walk thanks.
Your walk's are amazing 😁 love them all,you kind of feel your actually on the walk's with you, very informative and taking us to places we'd never go ourselves and the accompanying music 🎶 is great to keep on walking, Goose
That was beautiful. The 4K really showed the colours well.
thanks Malcolm - it was a bit of plunge shooting and uploading in 4K but I think it's definitely worth it
Thanks John for showing me yet more things that I didn't know about the area. I'd seen the rotunda from the road but did not know about the obelisk. I think I read somewhere that some bronze? spear heads were found at Warleys and where the obelisk is on the brow of the hill is a logical place for a last stand by an army being persued accross the Lea valley. Seems we are awash with history. P.S. Went ghost hunting in Copped Hall when it was a romantic ruin!
thanks for that tip Richard - I'd be interested in looking into some of the archaeology of the area. Ghost hunting in the Copped Hall ruin sounds brilliant
Fair play to you John, love the film, good to be back.got some catching up to do video wise, interesting knowledge my friend love it .
thanks Richard - it was a great walk, glad you enjoyed it - hope you like the others you're catching up on
I continue to shield , your programmes are taking me ‘ out there ‘ . Greatful thanks xxx
Really enjoying all your walks into the hidden parts of Greater London. If you're planning a trip to SW London I would recommend a walk from Putney through the Heath to Wimbledon Common. You can link onto Richmond Park at Roehampton Gate where you can walk through the middle and out the other side at Richmond Gate. Finish the walk at Richmond via Richmond Hill and one of the classic views of the Thames made famous by Turner. I enjoyed this walk during the hot summer and is certainly a classic walk through history in one of the greenest parts of London
thanks for that Spuddles - sounds like a great walk, I'll add it to the list
Just caught up with this great walk talking about 2 things I knew nothing about despite growing up with the Cobbins Brook at the bottom of our garden in Waltham Abbey: the Boudicca Obelisk and the myth of her bleeding out into the brook. To add to the history of Warlies Park, when I was at school in the 70s it was run as a residential Barnado’s school, and the son of the head was a school friend.
ah thanks buddy another great show cheers.
Thanks so much David
with some uderstanding of geology, geograp and landscape history one can begin to see the palimpcest of nature and man interwoven in a most complex and fascinating tapestry.
Love all your films John. You should do a meet up so all your followers can come and say hello😎 would be great to meet you some day
Thanks Leo - hoping to announce something for next year but a meetup would be great- would have to be a walk
I think I like you, real stuff, not contaminated .Thanks!
Great Video John...you're a brilliant presenter, film maker, psychogeographer/historian and deserve a much bigger audience!
Thanks so much Martin - much appreciated
As always, a great video. Still plodding through them in no particular order. We have a Boudicca legend near where I live. Her last resting place is supposedly on a hill above Kings Norton, on the outskirts of Birmingham The site is now occupied by a McDonald's (formerly a pub)!
I’m with you in that, knowing about the lives of humbler people who did all the work. Fascinating and I can relate to that. 👍
Love the films...grew up in the area (pre m11, m25 etc). Might interest you to know that the name "Roding" seems to emanate from northeast Bavaria where it occurs as both a town name and seperately as a district, with them both being close to Saxony with a bit of the Czech Republic getting in the way. If you follow a line west/north west you will find place names with Saxon type endings (e.g. 'ing etc). Follow the line roughly across the French border into the German part of Lorraine and you will come to a village called Epping! Let your imagination enjoy the rest! Cheers and the again for the videos.
Thanks for that info Godfrey
Thank you John.
My pleasure Simon - thanks for watching
A gem of a walk
Interesting walk beautiful countryside thankyou
thanks Trevor
Great little video John. Yes, I think you're right, the supposed link with Boudicca almost certainly comes through an incorrect association between Ambresbury Banks Hill Fort and the Iceni. Although, as you point out, during the Iron Age, when the hill fort's ramparts were originally raised, what is now Waltham Forest would originally have been part of the territory of the Trinovantes. Where you go off on a tangent though is by saying that there is no actual archaeological evidence for any of the candidate sites for Boudicca's last battle.
In fact, the Cuttle Mill area of Paulerspury in Northamptonshire, which, according to at least one contemporary source, 'has topography very closely matching that described by Tacitus of the scene of the battle, and where large quantities of human bones of both sexes, and including children, have been found over a wide area together with fragments of Roman pottery from the 1st century', is currently one of the locations which are most generally favoured. The fact that large numbers of weapons are rarely if ever found is primarily due to the fact that the best preserved ones were usually sent back to Rome, along with the other spoils of war that were paraded through the streets of the city as part of the customary Roman military 'Triumphs'. These were ritualized mass celebrations that marked the end of each successful campaign abroad. The rest were usually melted down and recycled by the contingents of blacksmiths and armourers who accompanied each separate Roman legion on campaigns such as the one in Britain during which Boudicca met her end. The Roman army used huge amounts of iron whilst on campaign. As well as the usual things that you would expect them to use, like arrowheads and horseshoes, huge numbers of nails were needed for all those timbered forts that they would put up, a classic example of which can be found close to another main candidate site for Boudicca's last battle at Mancetter along Watling Street.
William Cowper, the eighteenth century poet, wrote a popular poem, "Boadicea, an ode", in 1782, almost certainly under the influence of Raphael Holinshed's sixteenth century 'Chronicle', in which Boudicca gets a mention. The same source may likewise have influenced Francis Beaumont and John Fletcher's Jacobean play, 'Bonduca', which was written in 1610. Some, if not all, of this sixteenth and seventeenth century material may have figured in the background of whoever it was who spawned the local tradition that Boudicca had died, supposedly after a battle at Ambresbury Banks, in nearby Epping Forest. However, given the date of the two obelisks and the rotunda at Warlies Park House in Upshire close at hand, another strand of Proto-Stukeleyite Druid Revivalism could have been at work somewhere along the line.
As I think you pointed out, Warlies was originally part of the lands belonging to the Abbots of Waltham before the dissolution of the monasteries, before becoming the home of Samuel Foxe, son of the martyrologist, during the seventeenth century. In 1715, on the death of the then owner, Christopher Davenport, the estate was inherited by his daughter, Frances, whose husband, Richard Morgan, who you also mentioned, designed and built the classical rotunda and obelisks in 1737, supposedly to commemorate the death of Boudicca.
There is evidence to suggest that the landscaping at Warlies may have been influenced by similar innovations at Kew Palace on the Thames, where a Hermitage had been constructed between 1731 and1733 by William Kent, who was subsequently commissioned to build a Merlin's Cave there some two years later in 1735. At the time Kew was the home of Frederick Lewis Prince of Wales (1707-1751), eldest son of George II and Father of George III, who had been initiated into the Rites of Freemasonry, on 5th November 1737 'at an 'occasional' lodge' at Kew Palace. Stukeley, it should be remembered, had been initiated in 1721, and his decision, in 1722, to adopt the pseudonym of Chyndonax, shows that 'his inclinations towards identifying with the druids in a personal capacity' was almost certainly carried out under direct masonic influence. On the face of this evidence it is highly probable that the whole Boudicca myth that has somehow become associated with Warlies Park has its origins in early eighteenth century Druid Revivalism. A social phenomena rooted in what is generally referred to as 'Speculative Freemasonry'.
For some of the arguments for and against what has for many years been one of the primary candidate sites for the supposed location of Boudicca's last battle, check this well drafted paper on the academia.eu website:
www.academia.edu/12813670/Boudicas_Last_Battle_the_Mancetter_candidacy
Many thanks for that Rupert and when I read your comment does make sense. I'd seen a reference to a site along Watling Street but couldn't remember where it was and being further from Londons seems to make more sense. Let's hope that one day there's a way to confirm the location given its importance
@@JohnRogersWalks There is a whole chapter about this in my 'Legendary London' book which I will let you see shortly. In the meantime, that account of Ackroyd's is basically a hasty rewrite of Tacitus. Cassius Dio has more detail, but Tacitus was actually there. Interesting review of Ackroyd here: www.openlettersmonthly.com/issue/book-review-foundation/
Hi, little bit of local info....when the Debden industrial estate was being built, the builders discovered the site of a Roman military camp or fort. The former Hilger & Watts factory had an impressive little display of Roman helmets and swords etc, which were found on the site, displayed in their entrance lobby. The artifacts were in quite good condition (but a bit rusty and battered) as I remember, and I recognised an officer's helmet just as shown in the history books.
You say that you missed Epping Forest while away in Devon and Somerset. (Really pining for it!). The same thing happened to my husband and me on a holiday in the New Forest last year. We wanted to go back home and walk in Epping and Upshire. No offence to the other wonderful and truly beautiful places in Britain, but Epping Forest and Upshire just take up a space in the soul that becomes a kind of addiction. Great videos by the way! Very uplifting and relaxing to watch. 😀
I love a stile. Always a little challenge and it means you’re in countryside. 👍
I grew up in Upshire in the 80s & 90s and spent many a day walking the areas you covered. They have changed considerably since then, most notably the demise of the cricket pitch at Warlies Park and the instatement of Cobbins brook flood defences. Also a lot of the grass pastures of the Corporation of London Park used to be wheatfields. It’s still an amazing place to visit and I do go back from time to time. I remember spending spending sunny autumn days picking blackberries on Copped hall green or exploring the grounds of Copped hall before it was purchased by the trust and fishing in Cobbins pond, now also gone. To be honest, I’d say it was a much nicer place to visit than it is now and the corporation of London & time it’s self have actually ruined the place with its park but maybe that’s just my nostalgic view. Anyway, a nice video. Thanks for sharing
I think if man was there then man had to make changes, alter their surroundings to suit their needs and demands fed by the desire of survival. Amazing to think that we see these alterations to our landscapes with the belief that it is natural. Thank you for sharing John, thoroughly enjoyed coming along on this as you are a fantastic host. Take care man.
Thanks so much Darrell for your continued engagement
Reading your book "This Other London" a passage on page 53 about the Greenway and East Ham Church resonates especially in the company of Boudicca's Obelisk
" The strait path that I was so scornful of earlier now opens up like a song line leading directly to the centre of my destination. The can of Stella Artois becomes my ayahuasca, a potent tribal brew that opens up channels of enlightenment. Amazonian Indians drink this hallucinogenic draught as part of a Shamanic initiation ceremony. Through the ritualistic imbibing of Belgium lager I see the Greenway as a Ley Line marked out in turds that takes me to the locked gates of the ancient East Ham Church"
A very fitting passage for this video I thought.
Thanks John for this video and book
thanks for reminding me of that passage Raj - that was a great walk, loved writing that book
Fantastic. Awesome. Keep up the good work. From a fellow leytonstonian 👍🏻
Cheers Adam
I do a bit of Roman history so thanks for that John,. Until next time.
thanks so much for watching Jag - really looking forward to listening to some more of your tunes, I've just bought a tin of plectrums with the hope of being able to make some of my own music
That station was a bit of a bonus.
Absolutely- particularly as I had a date with my wife and thought I might be an hour late
The local equivalent of Boudica's uprising hereabouts (Netherlands but close to the German border) would be the battle in the Teutoburg Forest, where a Roman army consisting of multiple legions was annihilated. They've renamed an entire mountain range for that, built some monuments that are not as modest as the obelisk, and yet it's been only several decades since they've found the probable site. And there are people that aren't convinced yet. So no wonder there's no clear archaeology for Boudica.
thanks for that Christiaan - I seem to have underestimated how hard this stuff actually is
at risk of repetition, i always find it strangely comforting when you come to journey's end - whether at a station or in a pub. i don't know why, but, that's my reaction😊
@7:06 Teasels, Caprifoliaceae, the seeds in which are irresistible to the wonderfully tropical-looking European Goldfinch, Britain's most beautiful bird: Fact! 😁
My home county Carmarthenshire in south Wales has several of those pillboxes as well, in several locations on the southernmost part of the county
Love the bit where there are two of you looking at the Obelisk
Landscape as pamilmpsest. Cheers, John :D
beautifully expressed Arthur - thank you
Would like to see you do the Colne valley regional walk
Towards the end of the walk I bet you were "roamin in the gloamin" - I mean walking in the half light. The digital camera makes it look like daylight. It's a useful feature of modern cameras but it would be nice to have a button to press that would render dark as dark. Beautiful walk, thank you!
ha wish I'd thought of saying that btY an - I was being a bit lazy and shooting those pieces to camera in Auto mode - if I kept the camera in Manual you'd see how dark it was - good tip for future though
That short clip of exmoor is just up the road from me. Its my favourite road on exmoor
About the Westfield comment, I am so grateful that I am not someone who seemingly unthinkingly trudges to the shops every weekend, both for not wanting to be in that environment in our limited time on earth and also everything that goes with unnecessary consumerism.
your walking into the history books of eternal light
that's a beautiful sentiment - thank you
Recently found your videos and love them, especially as I grew up and lived mostly in the Lea Valley. By the way Upshire is pronounced Up-shy-er.
My playgrounds as a kid.
I had a similar experience in a field in Northern New South Wales many years ago. A shot rang out and that immediately ruined the ambience. A more civil means of showing dissatisfaction would have been appreciated. Great video as always. Cheers.
Third watch.
Love this one
Would have loved to have seen the inscriptions on the obelisk and temple.
We still have several pillboxes here, which I believe are listed buildings.
lovely video I started to worry about you toward the end and hoped you might consider calling an uber, but then that would be cheating lol. thanks to the local bus
Looking at all that flatland you can imagine how natural it was for chariots to race about it.
I wonder if it would be safe and/or allowed to camp in one of those bunkers for a night?
So, what happened to Boudicca's camp at Amesbury Banks?
JL and Barbara Hammond 'The Village Labourer' and John Rule 'Labouring People in C18th England'. Asa Briggs, E.P. Thompson and his wife Barbara, all good 'history from below' historians.
Thanks for those references Davie - will seek them out
Sometimes it not distance but knowledge that hides a place.
I agree with the farmland and Westfield comment. We don't have much true natural, wild land in this area. It's all squares of farmland