Sounds like we need an independent body to moderate housing affordability (mostly by supply) relative to wages (similar to the RBA), because politicians have proved that they are incapable of fairly regulating the market. At bare minimum, a Royal Commission into the housing market... (as complicated as that may seem, we need to get the ball moving ASAP).
Can you define, 'Fairly Regulating' please Have you ever developed Property? Government is the sole reason why Developing Land is becoming more & more expensive
@@andrewkerr5296 Consumer protections only come into being after a protracted period of exploitation and complaints to their representatives from the victims. Is it your position that no exploitation of buyers by developers and builders has ever occurred? That there has never been such a thing as 'fly-by-night' developers who take the money and run, leaving buyers with partially or poorly built houses and no recourse? Historically it's the consumer who has copped it in the neck by shabby business practices. Even where developers run on such thin margins and collapse when materials increase in cost - these were business decisions by the developer, and while they may collapse, its still the consumer who wears the consequences. ... If your way of responding to a discussion is to attack commenters, your future in business is going to be short.
As someone overseas, I observe Australia as an increasingly entitled, elitist and almost feudal society where the established are obsessed with ever-increasing wealth at the direct expense of others. Landlords and peasants. In Sydney and Melbourne society today one can observe so many ostentatious displays of wealth (luxury cars, industrial-scale house renovations, holidays in Greece etc.) which are likely funded by property capital growth, negative gearing savings on income tax and rental income. No productivity there. Why can’t people build wealth from a productive profession and unleveraged investment in index funds?
Because building a business is high risk and the stats show that failure is highly likely. You then need to move down the risk scale and hence why housing is so popular as an investment and wealth building vehicle!
@JohnSmith-cu8yc The Australian government effectively backstops housing as an investment class. Maximum returns with no risk...An asymmetric risk/reward profile. Hence everyone floods into it.
simply,this is not a country,it's a colonised land of the then empire,it's a remote resource land of the empire,huge land,little population,labour very high,nothing made here will have competitive advantage,it mainly sell resources.for the size of this place,it needs at least 50 to 80million population to be able to run as a country,to make competitive products to make income.but then,who is willing to take a pay cut?thats also probably the nost important reason people migrate here,and the authority won't allow this to happen,not too soon by immgration,because this will shake the foundation of the current voting system,imagine 9 out of 10 people who vote are not your people,the government(system) is too weak for the labour needed,the labour now is too low to produce.
I mean, I can't necessarily blame people for jumping into property. Does come with a not giving a stuff about the effect outside of yourself, which I am sure John Howard was very gleeful about. It's the kind of decisions made by people with mental health conditions who are also high-functioning. Who wants to work under others if they don't have to? Who wants to do crap work, when you can lie back and see your bank account increase without any work? This then leads to, imho, a rotting of the brain and a stagnancy, which I am sure very few of them give a toss about. That stagnancy is fine in a city like Sydney where you can have friends, holidays, live a dream life. So, where's the downside?? Ah, when their kids have to leave Sydney because of your decisions. Then it hits home. Which is about.... now. Don't know if the BBoomers and Gen Xers are ready for that. They've never bothered to think about a Plan B (by and large). That whole "Australia is relaxed and comfortable". When the housing bubble does pop, well, it will be a revolution because you can decide change must never happen, and change says "well, it does". May take another 15 years though....
Companies can own industrial, active rural business (no land squatting) or commercial land only - no residential land at all. Unfortunately that will stop "daddy" buying an apartment for his daughter through a company and writing off on tax while she charges a flatmate "rent" to pay for her spending money while claiming Austudy.
The actual solution should be remove any undue tax incentives for property investors prompting people to make a fortune from a very basic human necessity. Nothing else... If someone argues that investors are helping to build more dwellings, that is an insane argument.. Why would someone invest for others to live in.. that is just to squeeze the renters... Instead, let the govt invest in properties for those who are newly coming to the country and when people have enough money to buy for themselves let them buy on their own in a more reasonable market. In short, remove the "investment" quotient at the expense of taxing system. Also ensure that all the money coming into real estate market is indeed white money, and not black money..
@@jobyjob_memoriesof1985 The whole taxation system favors wealthy and corporations many of whom pay little or no tax. That needs to change to a flat turnover tax but without deductions
Just thank your government whom allowed $401.6 billion foreign investment in Real Estate market for 2020 2021 2022 while the citizens was locked up in their homes and couldn’t cross state borders even so very few local citizens bought new homes . This amount of money was enough to overheat the market
Australia has a productivity issue. Australias economy relies on resources (holes), immigration to increase GDP and a housing ponzi. Housing builds wealth but it has no productivity. Until housing is addressed Australia can’t fix productivity as money is invested into housing and not endeavours which will increase productivity.
I agree with you and no one really cares about productivity. People can't see it and it's perceived as being used by bosses to make them work harder for no much in return. Money from a house - that's something they can hold, and it gives them status and cred. Most Aussies couldn't give a stuff about the economy. All of this is unfortunate.
Great interview. My take on this in a condensed version is that effectively, Australia has painted itself into a corner on housing to which it can't get out off without upsetting Baby Boomers & big business.
Good chat. People on average incomes don't necessarily buy averaged priced houses, usually we start off smaller, something more affordable. Don't compare your chapter 1 to Mum and Dad's chapter 40. Stay positive, save hard, cut back on the spending for two or three years to get a decent deposit/buffer together. Never give up. Things are only going to get worse in 2030's/2040's when the baby boomers die and that avalanche of way gets passed down.
Also houses are much bigger than 30/40 years ago and most households have dual income. A lot more stay at home mums in back in the day. Also the other big issue no one is talking about is the $500,000,000,000 ($50b) given out over COVID, that has purchased a lot of investment properties for business owners.
mate in Perth a great builder is shutting shop like a lot of Perth builders as new rule WA govt introduced means he has to have 250000 aud in cash sitting in a bank so he can get builders insurance!! absolutely mental. Obviously the big builders trying to kill off the competition, and paid off their mate sin charge to kill the little guys. terrible news for a place that already has nothing to buy only 4000 homes for sale in whole of Perth.
If youre building homes as a lead builder and your business doesn't have that kind of liquid cash available you probably shouldnt be building houses. IF something goes wrong how's he gonna fix it with no money?
@@Lewbahh yeah it's not just house builders sorry i may have been confusing. its any builder with license so renovators who just do kitchens or bathroom cutouts as well little trades people who maybe employee just one apprentice doing 30 grand jobs .
You know where this magic 3 and a half times comes from ? Back then you borrowed from the Savings Bank arm of the bank not the Commercial Bank arm and they would lend about 3x the average of your last 12mths savings....same for everyone there was no monopoly money to throw around at auctions you borrowed what you could borrow plus your savings plus a top up from mum and dad and if the house wasn't in budget you bought a cheaper one.... the vendors had to price accordingly....
The GFC was caused by a lot more than a drop in house prices, in fact that was a consequence of the sub prime collapse. Chris Minns & his government appear to have listened to the YIMBYs with his focus on infill housing and taking planning control from councils. The only way to fix house prices is for the various governments to start building affordable, basic, public housing for long term leases, which gives the government control of the size of dwellings. Build a lot of these in regional centres to take pressure off the main cities & stimulates regional cities. The Federal government can fund this by borrowing half a trillion to build infrastructure & housing, and by closing all the loopholes in the tax system & increasing corporate tax & resource rents.
What are the so called "loopholes"? Where do you think the financial resources and other reseources will come from and at what cost to the public will your scheme of government borrowing bring compared to the present situation of people funding their own housing directly.
Why u not mention that most MPs have multiple houses , which is a function of the corrupt Remuneration Commission which overloads public servants pay to absurd levels , incl their own
It honestly baffles me that kids these days are not out on the street protesting about housing affordability but are instead protesting about global warming and foreign wars. Doesn't give me a lot of faith in the future of housing affordability in this country. It's like they want to be slaves to the older generation.
i t seems fairly obvious. Those born before a certain period needed roughly 3x annual income for a mortgage. Young people these days are looking at 10+ years of annual income for a mortgage. Even as high as 13 to 14x median annual income if you want to live anywhere near a city where you'll be able to make a wage that will allow you. Australia's obsession with using property as an investment is ridiculous. IF you have a stock portfolio you accept that their is a risk involved. Older Australians are buying more property as investment and they don't seem to think that there is any inherent risk as they increase rent for their tenants to cover their losses and essentially there's no risk involved for them. But what kind of a human being needs more than a family home? How can you sleep knowing you're forcing another family to pay for your 4th investment property.
Lovely interview. Good context. I still think Fred Harrison states a very solid suggestion regarding land and rent. Worth deep consideration. 100% It was enriching to engage the historical context too, thank you. PP
Main factors for why house prices have gone ballistic: - Immigration / Population Growth. We've had the rate % of growth more than double since 2000 - CGT discount - Negative gearing - Monetary policy after GFC (abnormally low interest rates & QE money printing), this has made Property a bank account for most people - Deregulation of global financial industry in the late 90s, allowing people to borrow more easily - First home buyer grants - Loss of manufacturing / productive investment which has led money to pile into property instead
I'd put NIMBYs at the top, with immigration fourth. Immigration is lower than forecasted. Release land in suburbs like Haberfield, Bronte, Balmain, Kensington, all throughout Kurringgai. Easy to get at suburbs to the CBD. I would consider this number one and those poliies would be decimated. So cut immigration goes in instead, further cutting us off from global economic trends. e.g. cut immigration to those who work in AI so that some 78 year old can keep their house prices high and have no riffraff moving in?
You are right on some - 1. Immigration growth which puts more pressure on housing without a corresponding amount of productivity growth. 2. Monetary policy which pushed up inflation more which is presently not represented in CPI due to rents not being included (since 1998). 3. First home buyer grants. Not correct about Negative gearing which puts more resources into housing and makes rents cheaper for people than it otherwise would be. Not what you mean about loss of manufacturing. - Maybe so if you mean lack of apprenticeships.
Australia has had mass immigration since the Second World War, and in some ways, before Federation. We have only had a housing affordability problem, as Alan says, for around 20 years. The two are not synchronous.
@@CatastrophicalPencilwe had a short period of mass immigration after the Second World War when land was cheap. Between 1960 and the early 2000’s we had a sustainable level of around 70k per annum. This year we had 500k when land is expensive. Can you understand the difference?
After I sold some property in 2020, I'm anticipating a housing crisis in order to buy inexpensively. As a backup plan, I've been thinking about purchasing stocks. What recommendations do you have for the best time to buy? On the one hand, I keep reading and seeing trader earnings of over $500k each week. On the other side, I keep hearing that the market is out of control and experiencing a dead cat bounce. Why does this happen?
Most people are unable to stand a fall since they are accustomed to bull markets, but if you know where to look and how to get around, you can profit handsomely. It depends on your entry and exit strategy.
consider moving your money from the housing market to financial markets or gold due to high mortgage rates and tough guidelines. Home prices may need to drop significantly before things stabilize. Seeking advice from a financial advisor who understands the market could be helpful in making the right decisions.
When ‘Carol Vivian Constable’ is trading, there's no nonsense and no excuses. She wins the trade and you win. Take the loss, I promise she'll take one with you.
Amazing that Kohler has referred to the Reserve bank to support his views. The reserve bank that said in its oficial statement a little more than a year ago that inflation predictions and interest rates would not rise until at least 2024 and now is wavering about its decision to hold interest rates where they were last month. His silly a statement is if everyone expects prices to go up they will. So that is his brilliant analysis in a nutshell. - Expectations make price rises and not the amount of money people have to spend on things because they can spend their expected income not their actual income. I wonder who has recently paid for house at auction with a wallet full of expectations or even at real estate agent's office. ? I think I will trade few thousand expectations to see what I get some new stuff for Christmas.
I'm thinking we go have a sharky swim in:- 1. Limited Recourse Borrowing Facility 2. Annual Reviews of SMSFs 3. Cap tax refunds on "businesses" at 1 dwelling (residential or commercial).
I'd suggest, instead of spending almost $400 Billion on a handful of nuclear powered submarines to enrich the already mega-wealthy US & UK Military-Industrial Complex companies, that instead we spend over $100 Billion LESS ($262 billion) to build one million social affordable housing units for low & middle income earners & people on welfare (such as pensioners currently living in tents & cars), over the next 5-10 years. This would completely clear the backlog of demand for affordable housing (see Mission Australia's Housing crisis report from late 2022: one million affordable social housing units needed @ $262000 per unit to build=$262 billion). The subs aren't for Australia's defence anyway, they're for America's aggressive intent towards China & will probably spend most of their time thousands of kilometres from our shores, making a nuisance of themselves in the South China Sea off China's east coast. Spending on housing is NOT welfare. Some of the resulting housing could be offered for sale to low or middle income working Australians at a small profit. The rest would be rented, with rents pegged at 25% of household income, just like existing social housing. So there's an ongoing RETURN on the investment, unlike the subs, which will no doubt break down constantly & cost a small fortune to maintain. I voted fo Albanese. I've tended to be a Labor voter. Never again. I won't vote for Dutton either, he's an even bigger warmonger & "yes" man to his American masters. Next time I'm writing "Affordable housing NOT Subs. No More Wars" on my ballots. I'll be in the "informal" column.
The problem is if you do this, the demand for existing houses drastically decreases, leading to a massive drop in their value. Anyone facing financial stress that bought their home in the last 5-10 years would not be able to pay off their mortgage should they have to sell and a giant black hole of debt would destroy the economy the next time we hit a recession. Free house for 1 million families sounds great but try selling the other side of the coin to those that own homes already.
Kohler idea that cutting the capital gains would some how reduce the housing costs is so ill founded since it ignores the fact that it would dissuade people from investing into property which is always a factor that reducing the resources put into housing will help the situation.
Maybe if there was a reduction in investment in housing, Australia would stop being a retirement home for people who can't handle an AI-world, and we could create some startups that could compete with Spotify, Meta etc. Or keep some NIMBYs in Haberfield cosseted.
@@yesand5536 That's a maybe. Yes, more startups would be a way to go. The volume of immigration which is not skilled is problem in regards to people with those with few relevant skills arriving and putting more pressure on welfare without creating enough more wealth to balance out their dependency on government hand outs.
Australia has had some excellent leadership in policy and the opposite at other times, which is inherent in people and their collective representation in individuals. Ie we have a history to draw on, and "The Lucky Country" observation is not always ironic. The ancient Greek strategy of appointment of a Tyrant was made under the same circumstances as any choice of an individualised decision-making process, and the missing information In-form-ation of how a metastable personal proportioning of relative-timing ratio-rates Perspective, in this reciprocation-recirculation Actuality, is the basic "crisatunity" for everyone, without exception.
There was nothing about luck in 23 years of continuous growth, and nothing about wise politicians during this time. It was simply because of China buying the iron ore.
Absolutely insane that the relationship between average HOUSEHOLD income and house prices wasn’t explored, and what effect the rise of dual income households has had on this. Unsure if it’s touched on in the full essay but really can’t be bothered reading the whole thing just to find it’s not. I think you’ll find, with shared expenses etc a second full time income essentially lead to a massive increase in disposable income, leading to families being able to offer far more on houses leading to the steep increase in prices. Gone are the days of bachelors living on a wage that is set to provide for a family, a functioning household now needs two incomes to thrive, as a single income is enough for a single person to merely exist.
Royal Commission into housing. Govt has failed to ensure Australians can afford housing. cause=high stamp duty, council policy, money laundering, negative gearing, scam agents, poor quality.
fucking rediculous to pay 20k min for a 1m home for agent fee.all this plus stamp duty will eventually add on to the house value,unless the demand is less than supply.
Just thank your government whom allowed $401.6 billion foreign investment in Real Estate market for 2020 2021 2022 while the citizens was locked up in their homes and couldn’t cross state borders even so very few local citizens bought new homes . This amount of money was enough to overheat the market
@@stpOwner what were they meant to learn from the referendum? Did the whole land stolen thing disappear because people don't want to deal with giving the people they fked over any power again? Colonialist mentality is very retrograde, sorry, very Putinesque.
23:50 Labor wanted to address housing affordability in 2019 by reforming franking credits and removing negative gearing and they lost an election over it.
That is because fortunately people were not stupid enough to believe removing franking credits is a good way of building more wealth for all Australians. Franking credits improve their prospects of better retirement savings which in turn relieves the government from providing via higher tax more money for government pensions.
The actual solution should be remove any undue tax incentives for property investors prompting people to make a fortune from a very basic human necessity. Nothing else... If someone argues that investors are helping to build more dwellings, that is an insane argument.. Why would someone invest for others to live in.. that is just to squeeze the renters... Instead, let the govt invest in properties for those who are newly coming to the country and when people have enough money to buy for themselves let them buy on their own in a more reasonable market. In short, remove the "investment" quotient at the expense of taxing system. Also ensure that all the money coming into real estate market is indeed white money, and not black money..
Basically pets are an utter nightmare for landlords. In theory in victoria tenants should lodge an application for a pet and whilst the landlord is objecting to the pet at vcat they cant have the pet. In practice tenants are ignoring the rules and just getting pets. Ive seen kelpies, staffys, & american staffys in tiny motel type apartments in st kilda. I had a situation where i had two labs in an art deco apartment. When they left the floorboards required polishing, the painting needed to be redone and the garden was trashed. Landlords are sick of it.
Yep - that is about it but the appeals to the authorities seem to not consider the landlord whom they often treat a some sort of bad guy. That is a big reason rents are higher than they otherwise would be. Many landlords are sick of people trashing their rental property and seeing the trashy tenants get away with it.
Wow. What a comfy bubble you guys are in. I'm sure you get bloody wet with excitement every time a tenant has to ask you to put a photo up. . . or when you ignore roof leaks till rainy season is over. Soon LandLORDS will ban children too and require 30% of the tenants groceries. We're paying your mortgages and it's not a trade of goods and services. You're not investing. You're stealing.
@@geoffdeller7747, whether people like it or not, there will always be winners and losers in this type of situation. We can’t all be haves. That’s the brutal truth!
My dear fellow, when you made the statement 'trying to turn house owners into little capitalist', you raised my blood pressure. You see I am a very successful 'little capitalist' who has been removed from that position through deception, fraud and murder all conducted by 'little and big socialists'. I dedicated my life to allowing their activities to continue to completion, without resistance from myself. Now I am very well taken care of by the social housing system and able to look forward to a very comfortable life for the days I have left. Unfortunately the dominant system in education allows those with a very good memory but limited pre frontal lobe development to gain positions of office and direct our society without the foggiest notion of the accumulative results of their procrastination.
You smoking something? He's referring to comments made by Sir Robert Menzies in the 1950s. If mention of a historical comment gets your blood pressure up like that I suggest a hermit life with no Internet.
What?? Kohler says superannuation companies don't get the benefit of the capital gains because they have lower tax rates. - What confused idea that assumes lower tax make some sort of difference to how much capital gain is made on an investment by an idividual or company. His focus on lower tax paid has led to that confusion. If he was right then 90% or 100% tax would make them get bigger benefit from a capital gain so they would be pushing for higher taxes. I can't see them doing that ! It is clearly a confused Adam Kohler style financial absurdity. Appallingly bad financial thinking.
A migrant couple in a regional town bought an ordinary cheap house and placed half a dozen people in rooms on the top floor. Cheap, if crowded, for renters, and owners have advanced their financial situation. Asian migrants work hard and don't whine, and put up with their situation till they get a foothold. They are to be admired. That said, the mass immigration policy favoured by of all people the Greens, is pressuring infrastructure, housing costs, the carbon footprint and crucially the environment. The so called far right party, One Nation, opposes mass immigration and environmental destruction from wind, solar and pumped hydro farms. Ideology should be kicked to the kerb in favour of pragmatism and moderate targeted immigration. By the way, I was one who favoured an end to negative gearing but could not vote directly for Shorten's Labor because an end to franking credits would have reduced a modest retirement income by a third.
You have raised some very valid points. Loss of franking credits will put more pressure on the government to fund pensions because those who have presently invested with returns from franking credits have looked after themsleves and minimised the number of dollars that government would otherwise have had to fork out in pensions. That demolition of franking credits would be appealing to some but just is stupid short sightedness.
It’s a simple solution.. limit the number of investment properties people can own to 3 for singles and 6 for couples.. this will take the demand out of the market of people just using bank loans to buy up all the properties
Yes, The idea that the government is going to fix things is just complete ruse. Cutting taxes that enrich government at everyone else's expense would be the best move, but they don't because they want the money. The stamp duty removal was part of the agreement which enabled the GST to be brought in but the state and territory governments never did it and the federal government didn't ensure they removed it because the Federal government would have been forced by the states to compensate them. There is no enforcement of laws or agreements when politicians are involved and they see loss of tax money is involved.
Just thank your government whom allowed $401.6 billion foreign investment in Real Estate market for 2020 2021 2022 while the citizens was locked up in their homes and couldn’t cross state borders even so very few local citizens bought new homes . This amount of money was enough to overheat the market
@@vivianoosthuizen8990 It's more than just Foreign Investment that impacts prices As far as I'm concerned it's my land, I'll sell to whoever the eff I want
Me thinketh heaps of affordable houses in Western Sydney and., sorry ladies no stone benchtop or........ensuite bathroom!@!?🤪😝😜🤣🤣🤣 P.S. How many., leapfrogs did we have to do, saving, investing, limited if any cafe late's let alone smashed avocados, working weekends and holidays to only be frowned upon by these mellinials (yes we will die quickly so you can get your 'no work'.....inheritance) for having the audacity to finally having a nice., mortgage free home in our.......senior years!@!?😝😜🤪😉
This is Alan Kohler's opinion less than three years ago. - "Obviously house prices are not a matter of supply and demand " Yet in this presentation he says they are. Alan Kohler also said then . " With all the debt there is now the reserve bank is going to struggle to put up interest rates". First he contradicts himself and makes a very poor prediction about interest rates. Then displays his poor understanding of finances and the economy that leads him into such a situation of getting both things wrong. Lesson - Don't take Alan Kohler's prediction or solutions or predictions seriously. After all he is on the ABC and that should be enough indication of presenting shallow misleading stuff. .
Alan Kohler - One of the worst financial reporters in the country who consistently passes on poorly researched ideas. He used to provide you tube videos on which one could comment but recently provides videos with no opportunity to comment due to his unwillingness to be able to come under scrutiny and reply with credible responses.
@@mrspeaker6720 For a start just go and look at the history of situations where governments have limited the prices or set the prices of products and what the outcome has been. Also see the history of what happens when such measures as taking measures that minimise investment in products results in higher prices or the products which is what abolition of negative gearing actually will do because it will reduce investment into housing. It is not something that will increase availability of housing but will reduce it result in in higher prices for housing. In respect to expectations the reality is expectations do not push up prices. Only the ability of prospective purchasers to actually pay will put up prices. The expectations are a figure of fantasy. Prices paid do not result from expectations neither do they cause inflation despite what the RBA says which is just another thing they get wrong like predicting no interest rises for few years only to find that they must cause them rise because they have misread the whole situation..
Sounds like we need an independent body to moderate housing affordability (mostly by supply) relative to wages (similar to the RBA), because politicians have proved that they are incapable of fairly regulating the market.
At bare minimum, a Royal Commission into the housing market... (as complicated as that may seem, we need to get the ball moving ASAP).
Supply and demand are equal. How can it be “mostly by supply”?
Can you define, 'Fairly Regulating' please
Have you ever developed Property? Government is the sole reason why Developing Land is becoming more & more expensive
@@andrewkerr5296 What - because they require standards be met, and the buying punter not be ripped off?
@@desembrey
Great Business model
Build shit & rip off the customer
You've clearly never ran a Business before
@@andrewkerr5296 Consumer protections only come into being after a protracted period of exploitation and complaints to their representatives from the victims. Is it your position that no exploitation of buyers by developers and builders has ever occurred? That there has never been such a thing as 'fly-by-night' developers who take the money and run, leaving buyers with partially or poorly built houses and no recourse? Historically it's the consumer who has copped it in the neck by shabby business practices. Even where developers run on such thin margins and collapse when materials increase in cost - these were business decisions by the developer, and while they may collapse, its still the consumer who wears the consequences. ... If your way of responding to a discussion is to attack commenters, your future in business is going to be short.
As someone overseas, I observe Australia as an increasingly entitled, elitist and almost feudal society where the established are obsessed with ever-increasing wealth at the direct expense of others. Landlords and peasants. In Sydney and Melbourne society today one can observe so many ostentatious displays of wealth (luxury cars, industrial-scale house renovations, holidays in Greece etc.) which are likely funded by property capital growth, negative gearing savings on income tax and rental income. No productivity there. Why can’t people build wealth from a productive profession and unleveraged investment in index funds?
Because building a business is high risk and the stats show that failure is highly likely. You then need to move down the risk scale and hence why housing is so popular as an investment and wealth building vehicle!
@JohnSmith-cu8yc The Australian government effectively backstops housing as an investment class. Maximum returns with no risk...An asymmetric risk/reward profile. Hence everyone floods into it.
simply,this is not a country,it's a colonised land of the then empire,it's a remote resource land of the empire,huge land,little population,labour very high,nothing made here will have competitive advantage,it mainly sell resources.for the size of this place,it needs at least 50 to 80million population to be able to run as a country,to make competitive products to make income.but then,who is willing to take a pay cut?thats also probably the nost important reason people migrate here,and the authority won't allow this to happen,not too soon by immgration,because this will shake the foundation of the current voting system,imagine 9 out of 10 people who vote are not your people,the government(system) is too weak for the labour needed,the labour now is too low to produce.
I mean, I can't necessarily blame people for jumping into property. Does come with a not giving a stuff about the effect outside of yourself, which I am sure John Howard was very gleeful about. It's the kind of decisions made by people with mental health conditions who are also high-functioning. Who wants to work under others if they don't have to? Who wants to do crap work, when you can lie back and see your bank account increase without any work? This then leads to, imho, a rotting of the brain and a stagnancy, which I am sure very few of them give a toss about. That stagnancy is fine in a city like Sydney where you can have friends, holidays, live a dream life. So, where's the downside?? Ah, when their kids have to leave Sydney because of your decisions. Then it hits home. Which is about.... now. Don't know if the BBoomers and Gen Xers are ready for that. They've never bothered to think about a Plan B (by and large). That whole "Australia is relaxed and comfortable". When the housing bubble does pop, well, it will be a revolution because you can decide change must never happen, and change says "well, it does". May take another 15 years though....
Simple solution; only Australia citizens hold title to real estate. Not companies, not non-citizens only citizens.
Companies can own industrial, active rural business (no land squatting) or commercial land only - no residential land at all. Unfortunately that will stop "daddy" buying an apartment for his daughter through a company and writing off on tax while she charges a flatmate "rent" to pay for her spending money while claiming Austudy.
The actual solution should be remove any undue tax incentives for property investors prompting people to make a fortune from a very basic human necessity. Nothing else...
If someone argues that investors are helping to build more dwellings, that is an insane argument.. Why would someone invest for others to live in.. that is just to squeeze the renters... Instead, let the govt invest in properties for those who are newly coming to the country and when people have enough money to buy for themselves let them buy on their own in a more reasonable market.
In short, remove the "investment" quotient at the expense of taxing system. Also ensure that all the money coming into real estate market is indeed white money, and not black money..
@@jobyjob_memoriesof1985 The whole taxation system favors wealthy and corporations many of whom pay little or no tax. That needs to change to a flat turnover tax but without deductions
Just thank your government whom allowed $401.6 billion foreign investment in Real Estate market for 2020 2021 2022 while the citizens was locked up in their homes and couldn’t cross state borders even so very few local citizens bought new homes . This amount of money was enough to overheat the market
Holding title to real-estate in Australia should be reserved for Australian citizens.
Australia has a productivity issue. Australias economy relies on resources (holes), immigration to increase GDP and a housing ponzi. Housing builds wealth but it has no productivity. Until housing is addressed Australia can’t fix productivity as money is invested into housing and not endeavours which will increase productivity.
The french, a couple of centuries ago used to call landlords the 'sterile' class for the same reason.
Yeah basically
Totally agree.
I wonder if the government is so dumb that they do not understand this simple thing. Or are they just closing their eyes to it
I agree with you and no one really cares about productivity. People can't see it and it's perceived as being used by bosses to make them work harder for no much in return. Money from a house - that's something they can hold, and it gives them status and cred. Most Aussies couldn't give a stuff about the economy. All of this is unfortunate.
Great interview. My take on this in a condensed version is that effectively, Australia has painted itself into a corner on housing to which it can't get out off without upsetting Baby Boomers & big business.
Good chat. People on average incomes don't necessarily buy averaged priced houses, usually we start off smaller, something more affordable. Don't compare your chapter 1 to Mum and Dad's chapter 40. Stay positive, save hard, cut back on the spending for two or three years to get a decent deposit/buffer together. Never give up. Things are only going to get worse in 2030's/2040's when the baby boomers die and that avalanche of way gets passed down.
Also houses are much bigger than 30/40 years ago and most households have dual income. A lot more stay at home mums in back in the day. Also the other big issue no one is talking about is the $500,000,000,000 ($50b) given out over COVID, that has purchased a lot of investment properties for business owners.
mate in Perth a great builder is shutting shop like a lot of Perth builders as new rule WA govt introduced means he has to have 250000 aud in cash sitting in a bank so he can get builders insurance!! absolutely mental. Obviously the big builders trying to kill off the competition, and paid off their mate sin charge to kill the little guys. terrible news for a place that already has nothing to buy only 4000 homes for sale in whole of Perth.
If youre building homes as a lead builder and your business doesn't have that kind of liquid cash available you probably shouldnt be building houses. IF something goes wrong how's he gonna fix it with no money?
@@Lewbahh yeah it's not just house builders sorry i may have been confusing. its any builder with license so renovators who just do kitchens or bathroom cutouts as well little trades people who maybe employee just one apprentice doing 30 grand jobs .
@@Lewbahh It's ANYONE with a builders license. It's ridiculous.
Raise the loan to valuation ratio (LVR) for investment properties. That's it.
That will reduce the investment in housing which is totally Not what is needed.
Big fan of Alan Kohler 🙏👍
You know where this magic 3 and a half times comes from ? Back then you borrowed from the Savings Bank arm of the bank not the Commercial Bank arm and they would lend about 3x the average of your last 12mths savings....same for everyone there was no monopoly money to throw around at auctions you borrowed what you could borrow plus your savings plus a top up from mum and dad and if the house wasn't in budget you bought a cheaper one.... the vendors had to price accordingly....
funny when I bought my house ,Raywhite gave me a melbourne version of Monopoly game
The GFC was caused by a lot more than a drop in house prices, in fact that was a consequence of the sub prime collapse. Chris Minns & his government appear to have listened to the YIMBYs with his focus on infill housing and taking planning control from councils. The only way to fix house prices is for the various governments to start building affordable, basic, public housing for long term leases, which gives the government control of the size of dwellings. Build a lot of these in regional centres to take pressure off the main cities & stimulates regional cities. The Federal government can fund this by borrowing half a trillion to build infrastructure & housing, and by closing all the loopholes in the tax system & increasing corporate tax & resource rents.
^ Great advice - When will you run, we need more people like you then the muppets we have
What are the so called "loopholes"?
Where do you think the financial resources and other reseources will come from and at what cost to the public will your scheme of government borrowing bring compared to the present situation of people funding their own housing directly.
Why u not mention that most MPs have multiple houses , which is a function of the corrupt Remuneration Commission which overloads public servants pay to absurd levels , incl their own
It honestly baffles me that kids these days are not out on the street protesting about housing affordability but are instead protesting about global warming and foreign wars. Doesn't give me a lot of faith in the future of housing affordability in this country. It's like they want to be slaves to the older generation.
I guess they don't see much point protesting. Can you imagine the pile on from the MSM and Boomer TV (Sky news).
i t seems fairly obvious. Those born before a certain period needed roughly 3x annual income for a mortgage. Young people these days are looking at 10+ years of annual income for a mortgage. Even as high as 13 to 14x median annual income if you want to live anywhere near a city where you'll be able to make a wage that will allow you. Australia's obsession with using property as an investment is ridiculous. IF you have a stock portfolio you accept that their is a risk involved. Older Australians are buying more property as investment and they don't seem to think that there is any inherent risk as they increase rent for their tenants to cover their losses and essentially there's no risk involved for them. But what kind of a human being needs more than a family home? How can you sleep knowing you're forcing another family to pay for your 4th investment property.
Alan Kohler on ABC: Its a very complex issue that doesn't have any obvious solution
Alan Kohler here: Here is why its happening and how to solve it.
It does have an obvious solution.
Lovely interview. Good context.
I still think Fred Harrison states a very solid suggestion regarding land and rent. Worth deep consideration. 100%
It was enriching to engage the historical context too, thank you. PP
Main factors for why house prices have gone ballistic:
- Immigration / Population Growth. We've had the rate % of growth more than double since 2000
- CGT discount
- Negative gearing
- Monetary policy after GFC (abnormally low interest rates & QE money printing), this has made Property a bank account for most people
- Deregulation of global financial industry in the late 90s, allowing people to borrow more easily
- First home buyer grants
- Loss of manufacturing / productive investment which has led money to pile into property instead
I'd put NIMBYs at the top, with immigration fourth. Immigration is lower than forecasted. Release land in suburbs like Haberfield, Bronte, Balmain, Kensington, all throughout Kurringgai. Easy to get at suburbs to the CBD. I would consider this number one and those poliies would be decimated. So cut immigration goes in instead, further cutting us off from global economic trends. e.g. cut immigration to those who work in AI so that some 78 year old can keep their house prices high and have no riffraff moving in?
You are right on some - 1. Immigration growth which puts more pressure on housing without a corresponding amount of productivity growth.
2. Monetary policy which pushed up inflation more which is presently not represented in CPI due to rents not being included (since 1998).
3. First home buyer grants.
Not correct about Negative gearing which puts more resources into housing and makes rents cheaper for people than it otherwise would be.
Not what you mean about loss of manufacturing. - Maybe so if you mean lack of apprenticeships.
Economic investigator Frank G Melbourne Australia is still watching this very informative content cheers Frank as subscriber 😊
What's the point? I see you saying the same thing in the Martin North videos but you cannot influence anything in the gov policies. Come on mate
Thank you for finally acknowledging mass immigrations negative effects
Australia has had mass immigration since the Second World War, and in some ways, before Federation. We have only had a housing affordability problem, as Alan says, for around 20 years. The two are not synchronous.
@@CatastrophicalPencilwe had a short period of mass immigration after the Second World War when land was cheap. Between 1960 and the early 2000’s we had a sustainable level of around 70k per annum. This year we had 500k when land is expensive. Can you understand the difference?
After I sold some property in 2020, I'm anticipating a housing crisis in order to buy inexpensively. As a backup plan, I've been thinking about purchasing stocks. What recommendations do you have for the best time to buy? On the one hand, I keep reading and seeing trader earnings of over $500k each week. On the other side, I keep hearing that the market is out of control and experiencing a dead cat bounce. Why does this happen?
Most people are unable to stand a fall since they are accustomed to bull markets, but if you know where to look and how to get around, you can profit handsomely. It depends on your entry and exit strategy.
consider moving your money from the housing market to financial markets or gold due to high mortgage rates and tough guidelines. Home prices may need to drop significantly before things stabilize. Seeking advice from a financial advisor who understands the market could be helpful in making the right decisions.
I will be happy getting assistance and glad to get the help of one, but just how can one spot a reputable one?
When ‘Carol Vivian Constable’ is trading, there's no nonsense and no excuses. She wins the trade and you win. Take the loss, I promise she'll take one with you.
She appears to be well-educated and well-read. I ran an online search on her name and came across her website; thank you for sharing.
Thanks
Amazing that Kohler has referred to the Reserve bank to support his views. The reserve bank that said in its oficial statement a little more than a year ago that inflation predictions and interest rates would not rise until at least 2024 and now is wavering about its decision to hold interest rates where they were last month.
His silly a statement is if everyone expects prices to go up they will.
So that is his brilliant analysis in a nutshell. - Expectations make price rises and not the amount of money people have to spend on things because they can spend their expected income not their actual income.
I wonder who has recently paid for house at auction with a wallet full of expectations or even at real estate agent's office. ?
I think I will trade few thousand expectations to see what I get some new stuff for Christmas.
I'm thinking we go have a sharky swim in:-
1. Limited Recourse Borrowing Facility
2. Annual Reviews of SMSFs
3. Cap tax refunds on "businesses" at 1 dwelling (residential or commercial).
Remove negative gearing
Remove capital gains tax discounts
Introduce laws to stop land banking (restricting supply of housing)
Moderate permanent immigration
I'd suggest, instead of spending almost $400 Billion on a handful of nuclear powered submarines to enrich the already mega-wealthy US & UK Military-Industrial Complex companies, that instead we spend over $100 Billion LESS ($262 billion) to build one million social affordable housing units for low & middle income earners & people on welfare (such as pensioners currently living in tents & cars), over the next 5-10 years. This would completely clear the backlog of demand for affordable housing (see Mission Australia's Housing crisis report from late 2022: one million affordable social housing units needed @ $262000 per unit to build=$262 billion). The subs aren't for Australia's defence anyway, they're for America's aggressive intent towards China & will probably spend most of their time thousands of kilometres from our shores, making a nuisance of themselves in the South China Sea off China's east coast. Spending on housing is NOT welfare. Some of the resulting housing could be offered for sale to low or middle income working Australians at a small profit. The rest would be rented, with rents pegged at 25% of household income, just like existing social housing. So there's an ongoing RETURN on the investment, unlike the subs, which will no doubt break down constantly & cost a small fortune to maintain. I voted fo Albanese. I've tended to be a Labor voter. Never again. I won't vote for Dutton either, he's an even bigger warmonger & "yes" man to his American masters. Next time I'm writing "Affordable housing NOT Subs. No More Wars" on my ballots. I'll be in the "informal" column.
The problem is if you do this, the demand for existing houses drastically decreases, leading to a massive drop in their value. Anyone facing financial stress that bought their home in the last 5-10 years would not be able to pay off their mortgage should they have to sell and a giant black hole of debt would destroy the economy the next time we hit a recession. Free house for 1 million families sounds great but try selling the other side of the coin to those that own homes already.
@@dancampbell1107 "Free house for 1 million families" They should not be free ever, but offered at much better price with very little or no markup
If you remove the subsidies on cars (~5$ per Km ) and land speculation (huge), most of our problems will disappear.
Kohler idea that cutting the capital gains would some how reduce the housing costs is so ill founded since it ignores the fact that it would dissuade people from investing into property which is always a factor that reducing the resources put into housing will help the situation.
Maybe if there was a reduction in investment in housing, Australia would stop being a retirement home for people who can't handle an AI-world, and we could create some startups that could compete with Spotify, Meta etc. Or keep some NIMBYs in Haberfield cosseted.
@@yesand5536 That's a maybe. Yes, more startups would be a way to go. The volume of immigration which is not skilled is problem in regards to people with those with few relevant skills arriving and putting more pressure on welfare without creating enough more wealth to balance out their dependency on government hand outs.
Australia has had some excellent leadership in policy and the opposite at other times, which is inherent in people and their collective representation in individuals.
Ie we have a history to draw on, and "The Lucky Country" observation is not always ironic.
The ancient Greek strategy of appointment of a Tyrant was made under the same circumstances as any choice of an individualised decision-making process, and the missing information In-form-ation of how a metastable personal proportioning of relative-timing ratio-rates Perspective, in this reciprocation-recirculation Actuality, is the basic "crisatunity" for everyone, without exception.
There was nothing about luck in 23 years of continuous growth, and nothing about wise politicians during this time. It was simply because of China buying the iron ore.
Great video, but where is the acknowledgement that the entire banking system is a criminal scam?
If only I had bought while I was learning to read and write in Primary School.
homes are 50% taxed by State Government by “lifetime” GST and Stamp Duty. Gov tax is Housing inflation-pure and simple fact.
100%.
Absolutely insane that the relationship between average HOUSEHOLD income and house prices wasn’t explored, and what effect the rise of dual income households has had on this. Unsure if it’s touched on in the full essay but really can’t be bothered reading the whole thing just to find it’s not. I think you’ll find, with shared expenses etc a second full time income essentially lead to a massive increase in disposable income, leading to families being able to offer far more on houses leading to the steep increase in prices. Gone are the days of bachelors living on a wage that is set to provide for a family, a functioning household now needs two incomes to thrive, as a single income is enough for a single person to merely exist.
The homeowners rent out their rooms so we have to be careful about divide.
Royal Commission into housing. Govt has failed to ensure Australians can afford housing. cause=high stamp duty, council policy, money laundering, negative gearing, scam agents, poor quality.
fucking rediculous to pay 20k min for a 1m home for agent fee.all this plus stamp duty will eventually add on to the house value,unless the demand is less than supply.
Just thank your government whom allowed $401.6 billion foreign investment in Real Estate market for 2020 2021 2022 while the citizens was locked up in their homes and couldn’t cross state borders even so very few local citizens bought new homes . This amount of money was enough to overheat the market
Separate categories for housing. Owner occupy becomes utility . Investor rental remains in financial a$$et market.
24:16 - Truth
Get rid of capital gains discounts and negative gearing. Another thing, pause immigration until this s. show is sorted out. Simple
Forget immigration as your top priority, hit the NIMBYs instead. Stop asinine 'heritage' pearl clutching by councils.
If sovereignty was never ceded then what is Australia?
These activists sit in echo chambers and didnt learn from the referendum 😂
@@stpOwner what were they meant to learn from the referendum? Did the whole land stolen thing disappear because people don't want to deal with giving the people they fked over any power again? Colonialist mentality is very retrograde, sorry, very Putinesque.
23:50 Labor wanted to address housing affordability in 2019 by reforming franking credits and removing negative gearing and they lost an election over it.
They should've just stfu got voted in and did it anyway. They do it with everything else.
That is because fortunately people were not stupid enough to believe removing franking credits is a good way of building more wealth for all Australians.
Franking credits improve their prospects of better retirement savings which in turn relieves the government from providing via higher tax more money for government pensions.
lots of great info, home ownership rates must rise... no more rent slaves
The actual solution should be remove any undue tax incentives for property investors prompting people to make a fortune from a very basic human necessity. Nothing else...
If someone argues that investors are helping to build more dwellings, that is an insane argument.. Why would someone invest for others to live in.. that is just to squeeze the renters... Instead, let the govt invest in properties for those who are newly coming to the country and when people have enough money to buy for themselves let them buy on their own in a more reasonable market.
In short, remove the "investment" quotient at the expense of taxing system. Also ensure that all the money coming into real estate market is indeed white money, and not black money..
Basically pets are an utter nightmare for landlords. In theory in victoria tenants should lodge an application for a pet and whilst the landlord is objecting to the pet at vcat they cant have the pet. In practice tenants are ignoring the rules and just getting pets. Ive seen kelpies, staffys, & american staffys in tiny motel type apartments in st kilda. I had a situation where i had two labs in an art deco apartment. When they left the floorboards required polishing, the painting needed to be redone and the garden was trashed. Landlords are sick of it.
Yep - that is about it but the appeals to the authorities seem to not consider the landlord whom they often treat a some sort of bad guy. That is a big reason rents are higher than they otherwise would be. Many landlords are sick of people trashing their rental property and seeing the trashy tenants get away with it.
Wow. What a comfy bubble you guys are in. I'm sure you get bloody wet with excitement every time a tenant has to ask you to put a photo up. . . or when you ignore roof leaks till rainy season is over. Soon LandLORDS will ban children too and require 30% of the tenants groceries.
We're paying your mortgages and it's not a trade of goods and services. You're not investing. You're stealing.
Nice to know we're still being shat on by John Howard and his misguided policies.
I don't think they were misguided; I think they helped EXACTLY the kind of people they were targeting. The haves over the have nots!
Now turbo charged by Labor
@@geoffdeller7747, whether people like it or not, there will always be winners and losers in this type of situation. We can’t all be haves. That’s the brutal truth!
My dear fellow, when you made the statement 'trying to turn house owners into little capitalist', you raised my blood pressure. You see I am a very successful 'little capitalist' who has been removed from that position through deception, fraud and murder all conducted by 'little and big socialists'. I dedicated my life to allowing their activities to continue to completion, without resistance from myself. Now I am very well taken care of by the social housing system and able to look forward to a very comfortable life for the days I have left.
Unfortunately the dominant system in education allows those with a very good memory but limited pre frontal lobe development to gain positions of office and direct our society without the foggiest notion of the accumulative results of their procrastination.
Get off the pipe bro
You smoking something? He's referring to comments made by Sir Robert Menzies in the 1950s. If mention of a historical comment gets your blood pressure up like that I suggest a hermit life with no Internet.
What?? Kohler says superannuation companies don't get the benefit of the capital gains because they have lower tax rates.
- What confused idea that assumes lower tax make some sort of difference to how much capital gain is made on an investment by an idividual or company. His focus on lower tax paid has led to that confusion. If he was right then 90% or 100% tax would make them get bigger benefit from a capital gain so they would be pushing for higher taxes.
I can't see them doing that !
It is clearly a confused Adam Kohler style financial absurdity.
Appallingly bad financial thinking.
A migrant couple in a regional town bought an ordinary cheap house and placed half a dozen people in rooms on the top floor.
Cheap, if crowded, for renters, and owners have advanced their financial situation.
Asian migrants work hard and don't whine, and put up with their situation till they get a foothold.
They are to be admired.
That said, the mass immigration policy favoured by of all people the Greens, is pressuring infrastructure, housing costs, the carbon footprint and crucially the environment.
The so called far right party, One Nation, opposes mass immigration and environmental destruction from wind, solar and pumped hydro farms.
Ideology should be kicked to the kerb in favour of pragmatism and moderate targeted immigration.
By the way, I was one who favoured an end to negative gearing but could not vote directly for Shorten's Labor because an end to franking credits would have reduced a modest retirement income by a third.
You have raised some very valid points. Loss of franking credits will put more pressure on the government to fund pensions because those who have presently invested with returns from franking credits have looked after themsleves and minimised the number of dollars that government would otherwise have had to fork out in pensions.
That demolition of franking credits would be appealing to some but just is stupid short sightedness.
What should we do about the NIMBYs?
We need a new city. Making our exsisting cities denser in population is making them feel more intense.
It’s a simple solution.. limit the number of investment properties people can own to 3 for singles and 6 for couples.. this will take the demand out of the market of people just using bank loans to buy up all the properties
Letting people buy up to 6 houses🤣🤡💩
Sovereignty stuff is a turnoff. Please just get to the point of the topic.
For who?
Get Government the **** out of our Lives would be a start
Problem is, very few are prepared to own what they say. Good on you mate.
Yes, The idea that the government is going to fix things is just complete ruse. Cutting taxes that enrich government at everyone else's expense would be the best move, but they don't because they want the money. The stamp duty removal was part of the agreement which enabled the GST to be brought in but the state and territory governments never did it and the federal government didn't ensure they removed it because the Federal government would have been forced by the states to compensate them. There is no enforcement of laws or agreements when politicians are involved and they see loss of tax money is involved.
Just thank your government whom allowed $401.6 billion foreign investment in Real Estate market for 2020 2021 2022 while the citizens was locked up in their homes and couldn’t cross state borders even so very few local citizens bought new homes . This amount of money was enough to overheat the market
@@vivianoosthuizen8990
It's more than just Foreign Investment that impacts prices
As far as I'm concerned it's my land, I'll sell to whoever the eff I want
That is how a fire economy works
Study Michael Hudson
Yep.
And it needs to be unfucked!
@@schrenk-dby people who are ducks, good lu5
That ridiculous bit at the start was rubbish !
Which bit?
Me thinketh heaps of affordable houses in Western Sydney and., sorry ladies no stone benchtop or........ensuite bathroom!@!?🤪😝😜🤣🤣🤣
P.S. How many., leapfrogs did we have to do, saving, investing, limited if any cafe late's let alone smashed avocados, working weekends and holidays to only be frowned upon by these mellinials (yes we will die quickly so you can get your 'no work'.....inheritance) for having the audacity to finally having a nice., mortgage free home in our.......senior years!@!?😝😜🤪😉
Woke wont fix housing shortage
Well said!!👏👏
What are you talking about?
This is Alan Kohler's opinion less than three years ago. - "Obviously house prices are not a matter of supply and demand " Yet in this presentation he says they are.
Alan Kohler also said then . " With all the debt there is now the reserve bank is going to struggle to put up interest rates".
First he contradicts himself and makes a very poor prediction about interest rates. Then displays his poor understanding of finances and the economy that leads him into such a situation of getting both things wrong.
Lesson - Don't take Alan Kohler's prediction or solutions or predictions seriously.
After all he is on the ABC and that should be enough indication of presenting shallow misleading stuff.
.
Alan Kohler - One of the worst financial reporters in the country who consistently passes on poorly researched ideas. He used to provide you tube videos on which one could comment but recently provides videos with no opportunity to comment due to his unwillingness to be able to come under scrutiny and reply with credible responses.
Can you be more specific about his poorly researched ideas?
@@mrspeaker6720 For a start just go and look at the history of situations where governments have limited the prices or set the prices of products and what the outcome has been. Also see the history of what happens when such measures as taking measures that minimise investment in products results in higher prices or the products which is what abolition of negative gearing actually will do because it will reduce investment into housing. It is not something that will increase availability of housing but will reduce it result in in higher prices for housing.
In respect to expectations the reality is expectations do not push up prices. Only the ability of prospective purchasers to actually pay will put up prices. The expectations are a figure of fantasy. Prices paid do not result from expectations neither do they cause inflation despite what the RBA says which is just another thing they get wrong like predicting no interest rises for few years only to find that they must cause them rise because they have misread the whole situation..
You lost me at your self signalling abbo shit
So she lost a racist. What a tragedy.