Porsche have never backed down from anything, they showed that with the 959 and their multiple Le Mans winning efforts when the company was basically bankrupt. They live for this stuff. These are Germans, not Americans, I'm just surprised we Italians didn't give them the idea.
A rotating gear assembly on a rotating crank assembly....for each piston. Balancing and timing that would be a huge nightmare for mechanics/engine rebuilders.
With the patent filing, they probably are making a jump on the EPA or equivalent agency requirements for allowable emissions, with the double burn, any left over fuel gets a post burn, as you said, replacing needs for maybe EGR valves and or Catalytic Converters. Not to mention how expensive in both waste and materials those CC's are.
It’s analogous to the second expansion piston solution used in steam engines of yesteryear. A clever way to extract a little extra push out of those hot pressurized gases.
Effiency of this can not depend on exhaust port velocity to pull in a fresh charge. It simply will not make much additional power at low RPM without a blower. This is why naturally aspirated two strokes (ported cylinder) have to 'get on the pipe', and Detroit diesel two strokes use a blower to make their power at low RPM.
So they found a way to make a compound engine that burns petrol. Hopefully this gets put into a car sooner rather than later, the potential of this needs to be explored. After all, just look at what compound engines did for ships 100+ years ago. Hell, the fastest steam train in the world had a compound engine.
The port arrangement will mean it needs forced induction (turbo or supercharger) as it’s very similar to the old Detroit diesel 2 strokes. If it’s only relying on the slight effect through scavenging there won’t be that great a performance gain, just added complexity. In any type of machinery, the simpler the better. This is just less reliability for some possibly dubious gains.
There are a 6-strokes to complete a cycle, but mathematicaly this is actualy a 3-stroke engine because it does a two combustions (2+4=6) and 6 devided by 2 is a 3.
Its tapping into the old Double Expansion Steam Engine concept as applied to ICE units. Honestly I was expecting a two banked/two sized piston solution using that concept... but here we are going with more complex.
Nice idea and I can see it working on a one cylinder proofing concept but in a multi cylinder engine no chance. Especially as we're literally on the cusp of all electric.
Nope. Mitsu GDI was first mass production gasoline direct injection - today found in nearly every new car. I had this engine (1.8L) and it truly worked - car was very fuel efficient.
Koenigsegg I think has the superior technology. Electric Valves it does away with camshaft all together and you can have any variable intake and exhaust valving
I’m wondering if the motivation is to have a more efficient onboard ICE for the purpose of acting as a generator for a ‘hybrid’ car that uses electric motors to power the wheels?
This somewhat makes sense if using forced induction and direct injection where the stoichiometric mix can be managed and unburnt fuel losses avoided - but N/A with port injection... really ?
While this is amazing tech I think Porsche is better off pursuing E fuels. E fuels would allow you to keep the conventional ICE design while still meeting the absurd environmental regulations.
Odd firing strokes isn't a problem. Motorbikes - at least performance ones - deliberately have weird power strokes in order to allow the tyres to have a period of lower force on them to increase overall cornering speed and traction. Now, the complexity? That's another story. I owned a Cayman S for a couple of years and one of the camshafts snapped. When it was in the garage the Porsche mechanic took me into the workshop and showed me where it had snapped. Right in the middle. His words were, 'That's odd. Normally they snap at the drive end.' My response being there's nothing normal in my book about a snapped camshaft. Thankfully the car was under warranty or I'd be looking at a 7K bill. Another bloke I know had a number of 911's one after the other. Every one had major issues, usually leaking seals on the drive. His sister had a convertible which decided to open up in the middle of winter by itself when it snowed.. Bottom line is that Porsches are no where near as reliable as these shows say they are and a super complicated engine? Yeah. I might give that a miss.
Can't wait for all the armchair engineers to come out of the woodwork and explain to the world how this engine is the worst thing ever made and Porsche's engineers don't know what they're doing, etc.
It's not that it's the 'worst' thing ever made (that title will remain with anything Stellantis makes), but the design makes the engine setup as complicated as that other engine Nissan created a couple years back. Putting more moving parts in an engine will most likely decrease the longevity and/or reliability.
Imagine if Porsche were able to produce a turbocharged 6-stroke, 2-litre flat six, driving the rear wheels of a new car called the 119 - which would be the bodyshell of a 1973 RSR except in all carbon fibre, and superlight - no luxury interior - like the old 911R. Then, on top of this, put in a 5 kwh battery to drive the front wheels with 200 BHP of electricity. And give the owner a way to switch between them. And allow the 6-stroke to operate in "work mode" where it just charges the tiny battery to maintain electric-only progress.
So it's combining a Porsche flat 6 with a detroit diesel 2 stroke but probably without any of the good things from either....😂 And i bet it will have some strange harmonics with all the weight flying around while changing orientation 😂
It will work but there will be a host of issues with reliability. The gear on the crank will be another source of failure, the secondary injection ports too. I honestly don't see the point of this when Hydrogen and/or electric seems to be the future.
Get 20% OFF + Free International Shipping @Manscaped with code DRIVETRIBE at bit.ly/Manscaped-DT-YT-24 #manscapedpartner
Have you ever seen Kurt Caz' manscaped promos on his channel?
I'm never again eFing around with Porsche they the 👑👑👑👑
"How big engine is that"
"2.0L to 2.3L"
"Wait, which one?"
"Yes"
Marketing "laws" dictate that they use the bigger number haha
4 strokes is usually how long I last, not sure 6 strokes is useful for me.
I like to powerstoke
You usually get to _four?_ I'd love your staying power. I've being working my way up to 3 for years....
I throw in the towel at 2 strokes , it’s unnecessary I tell you
Time is money
Now that is going to be a unique sound
unlikely that will reach mass production. No sane person would buy this. Then again most new cars in western world are leases.
And i would assume a pretty hot running engine.
It will likely sound like two engines running out of slightly out of phase with each other.
Probably sounds like an expensive maintence bill as well
@@BurninSnowManit might need a twin V-mount cooling system
i would be quaking in my boots rn if i were a porsche mechanic
You mean laughing all the way to the bank
Porsche have never backed down from anything, they showed that with the 959 and their multiple Le Mans winning efforts when the company was basically bankrupt. They live for this stuff. These are Germans, not Americans, I'm just surprised we Italians didn't give them the idea.
Love the TDC reference.
I want engineering explained
Based on the
thumbnail I thought that is what I did.
Me too
Look for "driving 4 answers" video on this topic.
I walk inside the Renault showroom and ask for a Volkswagen too
@@JuiceLayer-z2r at least your example is actually viable 😂😰
Kudos to Porsche for trying to keep the internal combustion engine alive! From Synthetic Fuel to 6 strokes! Thank you Porsche!
Yea i jusr wished I had the money for it 😢😢
A rotating gear assembly on a rotating crank assembly....for each piston. Balancing and timing that would be a huge nightmare for mechanics/engine rebuilders.
For reals and let’s not forget the higher risk of detonation and grenading that rod.
This took so long to explain,his beard grew back
Great work on this! Explained it very nicely. And loved the little TDC reference :)
With the patent filing, they probably are making a jump on the EPA or equivalent agency requirements for allowable emissions, with the double burn, any left over fuel gets a post burn, as you said, replacing needs for maybe EGR valves and or Catalytic Converters. Not to mention how expensive in both waste and materials those CC's are.
All of the serviceable parts like chain guides and tensioners will definitely be easy to replace, requiring no special tools or transmission removal.
German cars requiring specialised tools and difficult maintenance/rebuild processes?! Say it ain't so, chief
Mike doing this nerdy stuff is his happy place. Nice one i love it. ❤️
0:43 .... bruh 🤣
Those are going to have to be some mighty strong planetary gears!
It’s analogous to the second expansion piston solution used in steam engines of yesteryear. A clever way to extract a little extra push out of those hot pressurized gases.
8:18 WOW, shades of the 904!
Always wonderful to think what humans can do with raw materiels. Construct truly marvelous things.
Great presentation of this new technology. I could imagine that this will change the standards. Thank you for this video, Mike.
Feel like the crank will be working hard and wearing fast
Effiency of this can not depend on exhaust port velocity to pull in a fresh charge. It simply will not make much additional power at low RPM without a blower. This is why naturally aspirated two strokes (ported cylinder) have to 'get on the pipe', and Detroit diesel two strokes use a blower to make their power at low RPM.
Porsche is first and foremost an engineering company!
So they found a way to make a compound engine that burns petrol. Hopefully this gets put into a car sooner rather than later, the potential of this needs to be explored. After all, just look at what compound engines did for ships 100+ years ago. Hell, the fastest steam train in the world had a compound engine.
It would be crazy if they slaped a turbocharger on it aswell
The port arrangement will mean it needs forced induction (turbo or supercharger) as it’s very similar to the old Detroit diesel 2 strokes. If it’s only relying on the slight effect through scavenging there won’t be that great a performance gain, just added complexity. In any type of machinery, the simpler the better. This is just less reliability for some possibly dubious gains.
@CattaroFuran Jep but European manufacturers, need to follow strict emissions, so its probably why they did this.
There are a 6-strokes to complete a cycle, but mathematicaly this is actualy a 3-stroke engine because it does a two combustions (2+4=6) and 6 devided by 2 is a 3.
Cant wait to see what a lot of boost does to those crankshaft gears.
I was so confused, thanks for the explainer
its like EGR inside engine
Was thinking thr same
Brilliant explanation! Thanks!
The infamous double dip, I know all about that 😂
Its tapping into the old Double Expansion Steam Engine concept as applied to ICE units. Honestly I was expecting a two banked/two sized piston solution using that concept... but here we are going with more complex.
Feels like efficiency at the cost of power reliability and simplicity.
Interesting stuff and great explanation. BTW, the valves in the animation to your left are moving in the wrong direction😮
Loved this video! Exceptionally well explained !
Seems more like a save the planet idea
Top Dead Centre fans gather here
I guess we need to find a use for phonebooths...
Thank you Porsche for keeping our dreams and futures bright
Yea if you cam afford a Porsche, I can't 😢😢
Well explained, Mike.
Nice work. Nice vid.
Holy maintenance, Batman
Looks like a mix of 4 and 2 stroke into one engine.
Nice idea and I can see it working on a one cylinder proofing concept but in a multi cylinder engine no chance. Especially as we're literally on the cusp of all electric.
Reminds of Smoky Yunicks hot vapor engine.
I'm interested in that bus in the back with the house doors on it.
This combution engine addict sees the silver lining!
Didn’t Mitsubishi do something similar with the GDI motor back in the late nineties
Nope.
Mitsu GDI was first mass production gasoline direct injection - today found in nearly every new car.
I had this engine (1.8L) and it truly worked - car was very fuel efficient.
Yet another example from engineers of "just cause you can doesnt mean you should."
How will it sound? Do you hear 2 “firings”?
6 strokes yes, but for petrol but for alternative combustion energy that Porsche is working on!
This feels more like a second channel upload
Let me know when they actually measure 50% thermal efficiency.
1 in ดูด
2comp อัด
3ign ระเบิด
4comp อัด
5ign ระเบิด
6ex คลาย
TDC 1,2 & BDC 1,2
What must this engine sound like ?! It's bonkers !
I wonder if it's going to sound like a v10. 🤔 that would be pretty sweet
This should boost torque right? Higher ratio of actions before a rotation of the crank?
This was my nickname in freshman year.
8:09 Not to be pedantic, but it was a 5.7L V10 (5733cc) in the Carrera GT instead of a 5.4L.
That is so pedantic. 😀
For more accuracy, delete the first and fifth word of your comment.
@@barryvyner1161 Not to be pedantic, but if he deletes the first word then the fifth word becomes "it".
@@barryvyner1161 I can play this game, highlight both words and delete them at the same time and he is correct. lol
Different strokes for different folks!
It’s like a combination between a 2stroke and a 4stroke. Interesting
This sounds like an EGR but with extra steps.
Koenigsegg I think has the superior technology. Electric Valves it does away with camshaft all together and you can have any variable intake and exhaust valving
I really want to hear what this would sound like.
This will change what cylinder count and arrangement is naturally balanced, right?
I’m wondering if the motivation is to have a more efficient onboard ICE for the purpose of acting as a generator for a ‘hybrid’ car that uses electric motors to power the wheels?
This somewhat makes sense if using forced induction and direct injection where the stoichiometric mix can be managed and unburnt fuel losses avoided - but N/A with port injection... really ?
the planetary gears will break like there's no tomorrow, put money on that. those additional air ports will probably also keep getting blocked.
I want to hear it
So how does it make the air fuel mixture on the second combination? With carburetor?
I was hoping EVs would push combustion engines to get weird but this just seems overcomplicated.
I would like to know how they are going to keep those secondary intake ports from becoming gunked-up.
Love Porsche ❤❤❤
It’ll probably sound like it’s lower revving even if it’s spinning at 8K rpm
While this is amazing tech I think Porsche is better off pursuing E fuels. E fuels would allow you to keep the conventional ICE design while still meeting the absurd environmental regulations.
Porsche is already leading the way in this as well, though.
Shuttle shout out to TDC. 🤣🤣🤣
Odd firing strokes isn't a problem. Motorbikes - at least performance ones - deliberately have weird power strokes in order to allow the tyres to have a period of lower force on them to increase overall cornering speed and traction.
Now, the complexity? That's another story. I owned a Cayman S for a couple of years and one of the camshafts snapped. When it was in the garage the Porsche mechanic took me into the workshop and showed me where it had snapped. Right in the middle. His words were, 'That's odd. Normally they snap at the drive end.' My response being there's nothing normal in my book about a snapped camshaft. Thankfully the car was under warranty or I'd be looking at a 7K bill.
Another bloke I know had a number of 911's one after the other. Every one had major issues, usually leaking seals on the drive. His sister had a convertible which decided to open up in the middle of winter by itself when it snowed..
Bottom line is that Porsches are no where near as reliable as these shows say they are and a super complicated engine? Yeah. I might give that a miss.
You’re talking about firing orders on motorcycles. Not strokes
I'll try to explain that to my 40yo 944. Any issue I’ve had was due to user and maintenance/repair errors of someone else.
TL;DR porsche wants to implement a new EGR system so that they can meet future emissions standards
Those planetary gears are just another costly repair job waiting to happen.
now can we get a turbo for each intake please?
I need to hear the sound of this
This gave some hope to the gearheads.
That planetary gear is going last 100k miles, not.
Wait, this engine has been confirmed? There was only a patent filed and people jumped on it like it's a thing now.
Can't wait for all the armchair engineers to come out of the woodwork and explain to the world how this engine is the worst thing ever made and Porsche's engineers don't know what they're doing, etc.
It's not that it's the 'worst' thing ever made (that title will remain with anything Stellantis makes), but the design makes the engine setup as complicated as that other engine Nissan created a couple years back. Putting more moving parts in an engine will most likely decrease the longevity and/or reliability.
Your prophecy came true! You are like an Oracle! Very wise!
Imagine saying that about even a single German engineer. Lol.
Probably not the best culture to target.
50% efficiency? I will believe it when I see it. It would mean a vehicle that gets 20mpg will be getting close to 30 mpg.
That means the cams are gonna be extra long
Imagine if Porsche were able to produce a turbocharged 6-stroke, 2-litre flat six, driving the rear wheels of a new car called the 119 - which would be the bodyshell of a 1973 RSR except in all carbon fibre, and superlight - no luxury interior - like the old 911R.
Then, on top of this, put in a 5 kwh battery to drive the front wheels with 200 BHP of electricity.
And give the owner a way to switch between them. And allow the 6-stroke to operate in "work mode" where it just charges the tiny battery to maintain electric-only progress.
So it's combining a Porsche flat 6 with a detroit diesel 2 stroke but probably without any of the good things from either....😂 And i bet it will have some strange harmonics with all the weight flying around while changing orientation 😂
New engine is very promising but.. when it breaks.. ouch!
It won't break, it's a Volksw-.... oh....
So you guys saw What the D4A channel did.
This might be the worst idea they’ve ever come up with ever since they put their Tiger 1 engine on the heavier Tiger II
I can't wait to hear it scream
This looks like a nightmare to work on if you ever have to
Love it
Does it bug anyone else that the animation shows the valves going the wrong way?
Just me?
Ok...
how do you prevent the oil from sticking on the bottom intake in this engine?
Piston works as valve itself. Just like in 2-stroke.
The valves are moving the wrong way in that animation
Its kind of like less complex sleeve valve engine.
Wouldn't this put more strain on the block
Interesting concept if it actually works.
It will work but there will be a host of issues with reliability. The gear on the crank will be another source of failure, the secondary injection ports too. I honestly don't see the point of this when Hydrogen and/or electric seems to be the future.