These are really good points! But sometimes the problem lies on the Band side..... Can you do a rundown of red flaggs a band you apply for is a hot mess to stay out of? That'l be great!
Most of the points made work the other way too: if they show up late, are on the needle shit, don’t have drivers licenses and generally act like flakes -stay away.
I got thrown out of a band when I told the guitarists that they need to buy tuners and spare cables for practice because they kept forgetting their only cable or only tuner. So they threw me out rather than buy a $15 tuner and instrument patch cable.
Hehehe, I'm the bass player in my band I'm the most financially stable, I learn the material, write material, and I even mute and change my strings! And the only reason I've ever been late to practice is traffic I thank Glenn for teaching me how to play bass before I ever even touched one, and my dad, for making sure I was punctual, with a good work ethic
Glenn: musicians are everywhere and are easy to find! Also Glenn: Here's why 99% are completely useless! Love this. I've been saying this about the musicians in my area for YEARS.
It's really true. Most humans in general are kind of flaky and weird, and music obviously tends to attract "artistic" types (and a lot of people who just like the idea of being "artistic") who are even flakier and weirder than that.
No kidding about having hiring a friend as a band member. After almost four decades in private business, fifteen of that in real estate, I can tell you with absolute certainty that the best way to make best friends into ex-best friends is to have them as a roommate or business partner.
No# 11 is so me. I played for about 2 years with a "friend" of mine who never bothered to rhythm-check his fantastic riff ideas or record them properly, so I always ended up having to make them somehow musically comprehensible for the band to play together. Needless to say, he still played them his way and I was basically the only person who knew our songs start to finish. Last year he ghosted me for 3 months and I only found out through screenshots from our mutual friend that he screwed me over, saying I was too "strict" about our music and "made weird changes to his ideas" and left to become a pick-up artist. I guess good for us both after all, but it's still unfair that you have to endure all this shit just because you care. As a wise man once said, "When you lie in a coma, it's not you who suffers, it's the people close to you. The same applies when you're stupid." Oh, did I mention he was a bassist?
I feel you. I've also had a "friend" like that, who really could write great music but was too damn lazy to practice to a metronome or a track, so his rhythm was like that of an elderly dog humping a pillow. Not only that, but he never finished his stuff EVER. And despite being unable to play on beat and to complete the songs, he really wanted to "tie his life with music" and kept on constantly reminding me of this. It sucks that I found out all of this after trying to make music with this dude for a considerable amount of time. And yes, this friendship ended in the same fashion, so my guess is that halfassers never make for good friends or people.
I want to add one: RENT a practice space. Don’t hold band practice at a band members house. My band had a guitarist who canceled practice at the last minute and disappeared for about a week. He was holding about $1K worth of gear of mine and my bass player. Had to message his girlfriend and say “if we can’t make arrangements to get our stuff back, we’re just going to show up randomly to pick it up and we’re not ruling out police involvement either.” He ended up piling our stuff into his truck and delivering it to me. But he never made any apologies during that meeting. So yeah he’s gone.
OR….if you are going to practice at a band member’s house, take all your stuff with you. That’s what we do. We also are all adults who act our age rather than our shoe sizes and if anyone did leave anything behind, our drummer is cool enough that he wouldn’t steal it.
I was briefly in a band where two different groups practiced in the one bass player's garage. Suddenly one day every instrument in the place was gone. What a mess. SEVERAL thousands of dollars' worth of gear stolen. Thankfully the thieves were too lazy to carry amps or drums, and I had taken both my guitars home By the end of about ten days the bass player was beaming about the huge insurance check they got, and showing off some shiny new instruments, but everyone else was just screwed. A couple guitars turned up at local pawn shops and got returned but most were gone forever. Yes, it finally turned out later the bass player had set the whole burglary up with some friends of hers.
I once auditioned for a band years ago - I recorded it (by agreement - in case it was a "no", I wanted to know if I screwed up and didn't hear it), but I forgot to turn it off when I left the room so they could talk about me. On listening back to it...the first thing they said when they thought I was out of earshot was, "HE'S NOT A PRICK!". That one's stuck with me as bar #1 for auditionees to get past - the "not a prick" test. If they fail that one, much like the promptness and solvency tests, it's not worth asking any more questions.
Another goodie- during the Foo Fighters' audition for a guitar player, one of the first off the cuff comments about Chris was "And he didn't smell bad!"
@@pyroman6000 Chris is also a trooper live. I saw him, violently ill, with No Use For a Name in 1998 (maybe 97) with a bucket on stage, puking between songs.
Oh yeah, that seriously is a common very first question. If you have to travel, live, work, and perform with an asshole that none of you can stand, that band has problems.
@@petepeterson5639 I don't know much about Chris but I do know, puking can also be a sign of heroin use. I think it happens when they are trying to kick the habit. I don't know if he had that problem like so many at the time.
All of these are just generally good rules for being auditioned as well, because the process goes both ways. You don't want to hire a shitty musician, about as much as you don't want to get hired by a shitty band.
To build a band is to build a machine. You don’t add unnecessary things just cause they are available. You don’t add a boat motor to a bathtub just cause one shows up.
My best friend, a former metal guitarist and a colleague of mine in my undergrad music degree told me that he prefers working with classical musicians over rock and metal musicians because of the difference in professionalism he has noticed.
Two additional tips: 1, start then off on one of your harder songs. You need to know how well they handle your material, giving them something easy to start doesn’t give you the full picture. Our guitarist absolutely nailed his audition! 2, they actually show they want to be in the band! We had five people interested in singing for us, but most of them said they’d learn the songs then we never heard back from them! The guy we went with spent all his free time learning our songs!
I have tried to build several lineups over the years, and I feel like I can add two things to your advices: know that being in a band is kind of like being sentimentally engaged, hence you can foresee many of the members' behaviour with this kind of mindset, and the other one is knowing that there is ALWAYS a hierarchy in the group, so if you're not the type to be a leader you have to look for one that is good at it (usually, the leader in a band is the one writing songs and putting other meat on the barbecue). After, like, 10 years of trying to make my electro-alt-rock lineup I've sold all my instruments and quit music, because I've met most of the kinds of persons you have described, from the lazy one, to the high one, to the one with a delusion of omnipotence and got tired of trying. Another 10 years later I've come to terms that music is a part of me I can't get rid of and made my mistakes of the past my strongest point: you are welcome to embrace my cause, otherwise I'll do it myself, because I'M NOT DESPERATE TO NEED YOU. That's why I've started to learn singing, so I don't necessarily need a singer but I can sing my song myself instead of depending on others.
It's actually amazing, that in 2022 people can actually collect enough people who aren't complete (assholes, idiots, offended fuckwits, humourless morons, talentless twats, ideological bastards) to create actual music. Part of a recent meeting/audition was a 'question period' where my political opinion was scrutinized before I had even opened my guitar case. I didn't open it, picked it up, and promptly left. I won't play with people who are more concerned with what everyone else in the world is doing.
Reminds me "Hey Jude" lyrics You're waiting for someone to perform with And don't you know that it's just you, hey Jude, you'll do The movement you need is on your shoulder
Be clear up front what the goal of the band is. If you only plan on playing local (A couple hours drive) is different than planning on making it a professional career. The later means at some point you may have to choose to dump the job.
@@christopherconard2831 but in order to do so you need to have at least a reasonable chance of making a living by doing so. Me, I always chose low-level jobs that wouldn't collide with my music. Well, the result is, I'm 43, my CV is worth about as much as used toilet paper, I barely earn enough to stay alive and have been on a brink of homelessness more than once. Have I ever earned a living playing music? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no. Some extra cash? Yeah, sure, but not enough to survive. When you take chances you have to calculate them well. I didn't and well, here I am.
It's always fun to watch small local bands try their first 5 day tour and break up after the 4th show on the road. Finding people you can actually share close quarters with for days on end is one of the toughest tasks out there.
Glen, As a gigging musician, I am 66, and I've been at it since I was 15. I really hope that you get through to some younger players with this VERY TRUTHFUL AND USEFUL information. I've seen every one of the situations you talked about happen over my decades of situations from street performing to professional tours and everything in between.
If the significant other just drops them off and drives away, or makes clear they aren't in a band, just a chaffeur.. That is just a semi red flag for not having their own transportation but it is excusable. There have been plenty of those in the bands i've been but never ever take a musicians that insist their partner is part of the deal.
I once tried out a guy who was pussy whipped by this evil bitch of a wife who’s first words yelled in our presence was “THIS IS FUCKING BULLSHIT!” He didn’t last long. Ever since, I’ve had a complex about band members’ girlfriends; I know I shouldn’t judge someone who I don’t know but if I’m at a show and a musician is talking with me and their girlfriend chimes in I’m screaming in my head “NO ONE FUCKING ASKED YOU!”.
Keys to a successful audition: 1. Show up 20-30 minutes early to get set up and be ready to start at the time specified. 2. Show up with fresh batteries and strings (bass players, this means you!) 3. If given a list of songs, show up overprepared. If they give you a few songs off their album to learn, learn them all! 4. Be willing to INVEST some money into your rig if necessary (looking at you bass players) 5. Take the time to do your homework, learn the songs, not just a close approximation or your interpretation. If they are serious, so should you be! Don't waste their time or yours by going into it half-assed.
This is all great advice. One of the best bands I've ever been in (was a member for over 10 years before we split up), I got to tour, record 4 albums, and have the best friends I could ever ask for, was thanks to a well prepared audition. They gave me a demo about 2 weeks before my audition. It had 9 songs on it. When I showed up for my audition, they asked me what songs I knew from it, and I said "All of them. We can play whatever you guys want to play." They all kind of looked at each other. We ended up jamming for a couple hours. Two weeks later, we were playing shows. Later on, they told me that they auditioned a bunch of musicians, and the most anyone knew going in was 3 songs. However, most of them only knew 2. They would play through the few songs they knew, and then spend the rest of the audition trying to teach them another song. I had the whole 9 song demo down, so the next time I jammed with them, they just had to teach me the 2 songs they had that weren't on the demo, which I picked up in one night. Preparation and a commitment to the craft is everything. If you're not an arrogant asshole, that's the icing on the cake.
The money one is interesting. I was working a low-paying job a few years ago and tried out as a vocalist for some band about 30-40 miles away from me. They told me up front that I was going to have to contribute a decent amount of money immediately for merch and other things of that nature and I told them my financial situation and they were shocked because I guess the band leader was making a decent chunk of change. They didn’t want to play locally at either of the main towns in the area (there’s a decent amount of venues between the two) and instead wanted to play in the nearest large city roughly two hours away exclusively. My idea of starting a band was what my previous bands did starting out: - Play shows locally - If a demand begins to rise because we’d get booked enough, invest in merch then - Also make and spend money for studio time if we felt a song or songs were ready for an audience Meaning I just got some weird vibes about the whole thing. We had a conversation and agreed to not take it further than that first practice. They’ve gone through a ton of band members since, I’ve played solo since and I’m still on good terms with that band leader and we give each other leads for booking. It honestly worked out for the best that way.
IMO, both paths are legitimate ways of approaching things. Out of curiosity I started a band years ago where our first show was the first of an all state US tour. Printed up shirts, CD's and a few other random things. Made enough to do another US tour a couple months later and a European tour about 4 months later. The whole thing came out of my curiosity of what's more important, building following first or image with the right group of people first. If you can find people who can drop everything and want to go away for a while, printing up merchandise to cover gas, food and hotel expenses isn't the worst way to get some fun road trips and memories. A local/regional following doesn't always translate to a bigger following, so at some point you do need to take the plunge and go for it if you really want to expand out into a touring gig.
@@Lethargy01 How'd you book that many shows without a following? In my experience you have to book some real small venues that are just willing to have anyone first and then get noticed enough where other venues are willing to take a chance on that night. Exclusively playing two hours away and printing up merch when there was no following yet didn't make sense to me and still doesn't. More often than not, you just end up with tons of t-shirts you'll use as rags because you couldn't sell them. It didn't make sense to buy the 500 shirts and whatever else they wanted.
@@ryanshinermusic Lots of internet/social media searching to find bands in various areas, then reaching out to them directly and asking if they're willing to help out in exchange for helping them if they ever come to our area. For every 20-50 bands I reached out to, 1-2 replied and booked us a show with them. Made some great friends along the way, but for sure you have to be willing to dive in and put yourself out there.
Glen is over playing the problems. It's not all this bad. Our guitar player is able to get a ride to our practice sessions from his parole officer. Our drummer's grandmother wakes him up on time and walks him to the bus stop. I put up a large sign over the practice room that says, 'No girlfriends allowed'.
I've played in about 30 local bands so far and if there's one thing I've learned is this: You can teach someone how to play better or sing better but you NEVER can teach someone a good work ethic. And this is where all the problems begin. The 2 rehearsal rule always works for me - If he did the same shit in the first 2 rehearsals (arrived late, came unprepared or drunk, forgot his gear) it's a huuuuuge red flag because it's not a mistake, it's a character.
I remember a band I was in 20 years ago. Singer- Jobless and no car. Drummer- Jobless and essentially no car (it was always broke). Guitarist- Had a job and working van. Me (bass)- Had job, college, and car. Band was together for a couple years. We practiced at the guitarist’s house 30 miles from everyone in the middle of nowhere (no annoyed neighbors, but waaay out in the middle of nowhere). My car eventually broke (after 6 years) and the guitar player still wanted to practice 4-5 times a week. That meant he had to pick everyone up instead of them constantly riding with me. After 2-3 months, he was getting mad (despite me having done it prior for months) because the drummer and singer never had gas money and they were always running late (insert “I needed pot” or “I was getting laid” excuse here). Finally, I told him that I was gonna have to cut back on practices to 1-2 times a week so I had time to work to get funds to replace my car sooner. Said it was only gonna take a month or 2 and I’d have fresh wheels that take the burden off him… Suddenly, I was out of the band because I “wasn’t dedicated enough”… ignoring the countless miles I racked up and how much time I invested outside of practice for the band itself (promotion, booking gigs, selling tickets, etc). Sure enough, the band disintegrated within 2 weeks after booting me out.
Seeing that video with the guy in a Mushroomhead shirt triggered me... let me tell you after years of opening up for Mushroomhead, that dude is the typical guy in the crowd you have to deal with. Pro tip for aspiring musicians: DON'T OPEN FOR MUSHROOMHEAD lol.
One band I was in had a rule at rehearsals that until we'd been through the set list and anything that came out of that there was no spliff break. Work first -- mess about later and see what comes out of it.
Ha once I was at practice, they wanted to smoke another blunt, I was like can we make music instead? They looked at me like I was crazy. Didn’t stay long after that
That's why i made my band solo. If you want to do something good - do it yourself. Better spend that time learning new instruments and skills than dealing with shitheads sabotaging your work. In 6 years of my musicianship only 2 (!!) people out of dozens were pleasure to work with. That's why vst drums are a thing.
In my experience, motivation goes a long way. Picking the musician with skills beyond yours, might not be as motivated to show up to practice every week, when they can learn your stuff in a day and show up once a month. Always make sure they're motivated! (Kinda goes to the commitment category though)
I'm 20 and have been looking for bandmates for a couple years now and just hit gold on craigslist with two guys who are really good and both songwriters. Three of us are moving forward together
I smoke pretty fuckin often, and I can’t imagine doing it before practice, an audition, or a gig. That sounds like the easiest way to embarrass the fuck out of myself.
I had a guy call up, wanting to audition for the lead guitarist spot in the band. Told me he knew this song and that song. He showed up for the audition with tab books, and started to play them so slowly, then I found out he was just starting to learn guitar! He said that, as a band, we were going to "grow and learn together.". I had to, sadly, say to him that I think he needs to do some more work before joining a band. He then told everyone he was in the band! I ended up telling him that the band is no more, that we had moved on. Also had a nutter who collected guns want the spot, but tried telling me that my rig was too big and that I needed a Line 6 Spider amp instead, like what he had, despite me saying that I have played in bands before with my rig, but the last straw was his son trying to steal my Xbox controller. That just ended it for me.
Sounds like you are the issue, how does someone that collects guns, a rig being too big and line 6 spider amps correlate together? On top of that you throw in an x box controller being stolen, how is that part of a guitar rig? I have been playing for over 30 years and never had a game controller in my effects rack, never had anyone complain it was "too big." I have played in a couple death metal bands in the Noteheast, playedamy of the great venues in New York including L'Amour, CBGB'S, The Bowery, Irving Plaza etc.I would proof read this comment and hopefully edit it, you started strong but the second half is totally bizarre.
Love the poster: Looking for done armed drummer for "Def Leppard" cover band!!! How smart: by not picking which arm, they doubled their chances of finding one!
Lol, I've dealt with almost all these issues and more. From my experience can I also suggest: - telling people you will be rehearsing at a rehearsal studio and they will need to pay their share. You will get rid of 90% of time wasters as they never want to put their hand in their pocket - If possible start off rehearsing nights after work. No person ever cancels last minute because they're hung over or want to go to the beach at 7pm on a Wednesday - During the audition process, hire a rehearsal room and gear. Allocate a few people different time slots and let them know you are supplying drums/amps for the audition. Hire the people who show up on time and don't blame the gear - Select a drummer and bassist who play well together and can lock in to each other's playing. If a bassist/drummer is trying out for bands but can't lock in with the other rythem instruments your band is doomed before it begins
Always trade up. never down. I was in a band where the weakest member drifted away, we lucked out and found a guy who was both more talented and had his shit together. It was a significant upgrade. Tragically he died and we made the bad, path of least resistance , decision to bring back the guy he had replaced. A regrettable choice!
I think a lot of these issues are due to people that like the IDEA of being in a band more than the actual effort involved. I’ve been in several bands and never had any of the issues discussed in this video. However, the common thread was that everyone in those bands was serious about their craft and worked hard at it. Also, in my experience, most good musicians underrate themselves, not the other way round.
"Don't sound well" isn't a theory thing. It's a "Can you hear it?" thing. When writing music, here's the mindset you have to be in: "You hear this on the radio. How quickly do you switch the channel, and what would it take for you not to do that?"
well maybe write it down or tab it out. . . . rather than expecting a newb to memorize 7 songs from one practice? Learning covers is possible off-line but hard to work on original work written by others on your own.
I played with a guy in an improv group who could sweep pick but had no idea how to palm mute. I was almost floored with astonishment. He picked it up quick enough. But I was still amazed.
You forgot to mention the idiot that has to have his girlfriend present at all band practices.This is a total Deal Breaker. Nothing worse than a Yoko onboard.
We just lost our bassist again, and that makes 3 over the past 4-5 months. Each had an issue you described. One didn’t have the skill/know the material, one was talented but didn’t show up/show up on time, and the most recent had financial issues. We are trying to start playing live so it’s sooooo frustrating. I finally just said “fuck it” and made backing tracks (it forces everyone to practice to a metronome so win/win) but I do hope to get someone to fill the spot.
I was happy you mentioned the "boyfriend/girlfriend" thing. "Romantic" relationships between band members are a time bomb to the band and it rolls into the 'priorities" and "friends" concept but with a lot more weight. My philosophy is that a band should be a primary relationship in it's own context and not have to compete with other primary relationships within the band. When the friends in the band come in already squishing body parts that's usually a bad sign. Certainly, juggling band members' ideocracies is hard enough without that kind of complication within the group. It was always a rule with me and every time that I'd make and exception (for myself and others) for the sake of a great band by any other measure -- I always regretted it.
I've been trying to start a metal band in birmingham alabama for the past 5 years. Sometimes you really do just have to either take what you can get, or have nothing.
@@Tarpull That works pretty well if you want to write all the material, and then hire a backing band to record and tour. But not so well if you just want to play out. Personally I never intended to become a big star, I just really enjoyed rehearsing twice a week and playing live a couple times a month.
I once had a drummer that sang backing vocals, in standard tuning he was struggling to hit a high "E", only just. I suggested we all down tune a semitone to give his voice a bit more room , drummer boy blew a fuse because, wait for it, We didn't have enough time to relearn all of the songs !, no matter how well I explained it to the goose he continued on his mindless rant. He got the shits and went outside for a smoke, while he was out we drop tuned, he returned, we said nothing and completed practice, I then told him what we'd done and he refused to believe we could have relearned all the songs in a "different tuning", I think some semblance of intelligence also helps when recruiting band members.....
my old band once auditioned a guitarist who showed up without a guitar strap. we asked if he wanted a tuner real quick before starting and he goes "nah, i just do it by ear". then he proceeds to play distorted electric guitar with his fucking thumb. no pick. needless to say, it was a no.
This is why I play all the parts myself nowadays.... All real instruments. I'm a drummer for over 30 years (primarily, I've also played guitar for most of that time) that got tired of unreliable, unprepared bandmates. I no longer have any problems😁
I think it is implied here but gonna say it anyway: IT'S NOT WRONG IF YOU DECIDE TO MAKE A BAND JUST FOR HAVE FUN WITH FRIENDS, BUT THAT HAS TO BE CRYSTAL CLEAR FROM THE FUCKING START.
Can we also include on that list some uptight, hot-headed, gate-keeping elite-wannabe musicians? Even though they can be HIGHLY intelligent and talented, they always either get into fights, constantly argue with other bandmates, refuse to listen to other people (including the sound guy and their own bandmates), talk smack about other musicians in the local scene, and complain about every single little thing. Oh yeah, and be sure to kick out the ones who screw you over business-wise. There's NO need for that negative BS! Love the video, Glenn!
That was a great video about integrity, loyalty, and character (or the lack of). You forgot one type of person who is the WORST of all. It's usually the "singer" who plays no instruments so does not KNOW the work and discipline involved. He has the talent and ability, sings just fine in high school chorus or madrigals but...IS NOT COMFORTABLE ON HIS OWN!!! By himself, making his own life moves he's not efficient. Around others he calms down and performs the task at hand. This is the "instinct boy." More specifically, the instinct over logic boy. He has a little voice inside and he hears and he obeys! Foresight is non-existent, self-confidence, yep...you guessed it...there is none...self reliance? 😂 The instinct boy has none, unless he's around others. Then his whole attitude changes. Someone like that is HIDING SOMETHING or several things. They "create" their own fantasy world for psychological reasons to compensate themselves for a deep fear or the lack of something else. They can MORPH into any of the aforementioned folks as well but is only shining people on that haven't yet done enough reading to learn somebody's "little game" which is to distract people from their musical work and prolong progress as long as possible (especially in the beginning). Go with the easy remedy. At some point the fool will make it clear he's not going to do his part, such as...taking on 8 things in the same 24. Make sure you spot the sign. Dealing with all of them is simple. The songs get done, or they don't get done. Whoever one way or another, makes the job more difficult than it has to be...identify the fool, bounce him, and keep working until you find a replacement. Join a union, ads, etc. and rock on!
OMG, the whole "Friend vs Professional" thing really hits the nail on the head a lot of the time in my humble experience. Now, in all honesty - my guitarist is also my best friend, but we've had YEARS of highs and lows in our friendship before we started playing together and about as many years after - we learned to quarrel and to step back and to make compromises with "our vision" because experience and time and failure taught us that no matter how much of our own ideas we sacrifice in the process, the end result of us working together and cutting, reworking and editing each other's parts is almost always better than what we can compose separately. However, this is a level of trust and understanding which takes time to build when you have clear "buddy "expectations and, heaven forbid, feelings of "owing" something to someone. Gods only know how many times I've heard the line "I know it's bad, but I can't tell him that - he's a friend and he's put so much effort into it and he helped me move after my break up and he's the dude who showed me how to hold a guitar and..." ... and it is not uncommon to outgrow people, but it is common too not own up to it, which is a problem in a band setting. With the exception of said guitarist, I personally have a better relationship with musicians I've worked with, who stated as "colleagues"/"band-mates" and ended up being friends, as opposed to friends who also play an instrument and want to try joining. There is a certain level of "detachment" you have with colleagues which helps you concentrate on the job at hand, which you don't always have when there is the emotional response between friends and the "power dynamic" which comes with friendships. Basically, you're more willing to accept ideas from people whom you judge based on their musicianship, instead of based on their horrible, HORRIBLE choices in terms of partners and booze. Also important to note - "professional" in this case is not meant to mean actually "paid professional", however given the amount of time, funds and effort music requires, even as just a hobby, it is impossible to not look for and require a bit of professionalism and job-like approach from a musician looking to jam with you, as opposed to, say, a random person you end up regularly drinking and hanging out with at the local watering hole.
I remember the last band I was in I had to leave because of my mental health (apparently not easy to be in a band when you don’t want to be alive anymore.) when I left one of them told me I need to stop doing drugs since that ruined my life and clearly I couldn’t handle it… I would only occasionally smoke with them and the same member was “let go of the band” after he permanently fucked up his hand after a night mixing of meth and alcohol about 6 months after I left. Now I’ve been sober for 3 years and they are still stuck with one single that no one has listened to because they don’t know how to advertise a show properly without it being the day before, let alone a single.
So just to be safe, do a drug test.Credit check. Criminal background. License and registration. Past Employment verification. At least 3 personal references. And last throw in a psychological evaluation. Then maybe get to know them.🤣 👍. Love you brother.
A bit overcritical if you're just looking for some guys to make a band with, have fun. And grow Seems to me some of these rules would only apply to people who are trying to do this for a living or taking it VERY serious! And I'm not saying hes wrong for those reasons In truth it is very hard to find the right musicians. For me, if you CAN find one who shows up on time, has a good personality and gets along with others, has working equipment/gear/transportation, and a steady income hold on tight! Then look for these two traits next...1. Are they enthusiastic and dedicated, and 2 are they improving? If this happening you've found a Rare find. For a dad band, hobby band, or a band looking to gig in the future I think this is the perfect kind of guys to build with. And I've been doing this for a while. That only works for those with patience, and the ability to nurture and grow as a group and a band and a band. If you're selfish or looking for something fast before something fast this would obviously not work
Supposedly Jeff hanneman never drove a car in his life. I saw an interview with Kerry King where he said literally every time Slayer ever practiced he picked Jeff up, and he never once saw him drive a vehicle. Just thought it was an interesting story, not trying to argue against Glenn's point. You definitely need a car
I'm not that old fashioned but taking a guitar for a drink in the afternoon at a local rock music bar will have unattached musicians chatting and offering to jam. Likewise facebook groups, show yourself playing something and a location attached and you'll get people.
I'm currently in a band with friends and it's not going very well. The singer actually writes all the songs and produces them himself (he plays multiple instruments). The band exists to play live, that's it. And I think the studio versions of the songs he made suck. But it's impossible to tell him because he cannot take any criticism. I've had to tell him that I will never speak freely about what I think of his production skills ever again, because I want to stay his friend. I think I might have some advice that could be valuable to him, but what's the point if he doesn't listen ? His album has been delayed by a year and a half at this point and if it ever comes out, my bet is it's gonna be a trainwreck. At this point, I don't want to be the "I told you so" guy... I just don't care anymore. He brought his own failure to himself and I did what I could to prevent it. I don't want any part in this album anymore, because I'm trying to stay professional with people that aren't. It saddens me that he invested a lot of his money in this project and that he will probably lose every penny of it, but I am still his friend and I respect his choices. He may learn a valuable lesson if he can look back on what he did wrong.
To be fair I didn't pick up the guitar to get chicks, I was 5. No one knew I even played til I was 14 when a girl in my class said musicians are hot so yeah
Most, or possibly all of this is really just one diagnosis question after the other from the list I had to fill out when confirming I had ADHD. Edit: yup, all of this.
We auditioned a guy who walked into our rehearsal space and said "Heads up, I'm an alcoholic so I might be too drunk to drive to practices or shows". Verbatim. Safe to say that guy got the swift boot
Damn, LOL. Well, on the plus side, at least he was honest and upfront with you right out of the gate, instead of finding out during your first live gig with him 😬
when i used drugs i wrote great songs but i was no best musician. Then I stopped using drugs and now I play better than I do songs. I still do not regret my decision at all.
One point you forgot with substance abuse is it's likely to get your gear stolen. My last band had a guitarist that was clearly on drugs. Long story short, he pawned one of my amps without my permission. What do you think he bought with the money?
It's not really a thing. Merely holding a guitar on stage will not make you hot. It's not being a band that gets you laid, it's success and status. So, if you are in a succesful band - it will help.
Man, this has helped tremendously! I'm trying my best to recruit band members (2 guitarists, a bassist and drummer) and it has not been easy. But I shall not give up! Cheers!
I could do without the assumption that the person watching this is a heterosexual male, but this is good advice and I plan to take it into account! Thank you
Can you imagine how many 80s bands we wouldn’t have if these good and concise rules had just been laid out as clearly back then? After being in bands for 35 years, all true points. Great vid.
Lol. 1) i have been looking for fellow musicians around my area for 6 years now, online as well as offline, and all i can find are top 40 cover bands, oldies and bluesrock. the few metal bands around are either pro-level with a full on touring plan already set up, requiring you to travel with them for 10 months a year, while the rest is usually beginners playing power chords - which is fine, but doesnt really appeal to me.
My worst band experience was the drummer we had. Alcoholic, ALWAYS late to practice and we had a show and we had to set up his stuff on stage in hopes that he shows up and he showed up at the last possible second. Absolute disaster. Good video Glen.
Here's one more important point that I'm missing on this list: NO! EGO! TRIPS! If a band of e.g. 5 people vote 4/5 for something and you are the 1/5 who votes against it, well, guess what - you have to oblige to the majority. If you don't, you are on a ego-trip and not capable of being in a band, because that's not how it works...
Make sure your band members don't have kids. I'll never play in a band with someone who has kids again. If someone has kids the band is defacto not a priority. Kids equal no band commitment by default.
The older the kids are, the less of a problem they are. I had drummer who had two teenage daughters whom the rest of the band never even met. He ended up being fired but his kids were not a factor in that.
My band is looking for a singer, we have had lots of inquiries. but unfortunately not one could impress us. 😕 we won't drop our standards for someone who isn't willing to put in the work, and even got called out for it by someone we tried. He wasn't happy we said it wouldn't work. Anyway we have 9 demos but no vocals and just over a year in. Take care and be safe 👍
I'm also waring pants. I do have ads up kijiji and Facebook. I haven't gone to shows just due to the "end of the world" But I'll definitely be out this summer.
These are really good points! But sometimes the problem lies on the Band side..... Can you do a rundown of red flaggs a band you apply for is a hot mess to stay out of? That'l be great!
Most of the points made work the other way too: if they show up late, are on the needle shit, don’t have drivers licenses and generally act like flakes -stay away.
That said: I think it’s a good idea too.
I got thrown out of a band when I told the guitarists that they need to buy tuners and spare cables for practice because they kept forgetting their only cable or only tuner. So they threw me out rather than buy a $15 tuner and instrument patch cable.
@@myopicautisticmetal9035 Seriously?! JFC - some people, man! I'm the kind of guy where if I could afford it I'd show up with spare guitars and amps!
Someone is running the band (album art, shows, gigs, ect.) without the whole band agreeing to the decisions. Cost money and destroys the music.
Unfortunately, this describes about 90% of musicians out there regardless of genre. Not even limited to music. Reliable people are hard to find.
I hear you...
Which is why....I refuse to work with any fellow musicians.
I only work with clones of myself. Unfortunately I hate myself and am going through all 11 warning signs
@@pjcb 😂😂😂
YUP.... Same problem here in Montreal....
Hehehe, I'm the bass player in my band
I'm the most financially stable, I learn the material, write material, and I even mute and change my strings!
And the only reason I've ever been late to practice is traffic
I thank Glenn for teaching me how to play bass before I ever even touched one, and my dad, for making sure I was punctual, with a good work ethic
You and me both!
Youre a unicorn
Nerd
You're the only one.
As Hemingway once said, “Write drunk. Edit sober.”
Glenn: musicians are everywhere and are easy to find!
Also Glenn: Here's why 99% are completely useless!
Love this. I've been saying this about the musicians in my area for YEARS.
Yep! Easy to find guys who just want to jam. Only 1% of them can play a song all the way through with a decent level of musicianship.
JOIN DA CLUB😎... Here in Montreal it's a Catastrophe of Musicians...
Completely USELESS!!🙄
oh.....i'm afraid it "is" true...
I’ve been saying this about people for years…. Maybe would want to get really close to less than 5 out of 100 folks.
It's really true. Most humans in general are kind of flaky and weird, and music obviously tends to attract "artistic" types (and a lot of people who just like the idea of being "artistic") who are even flakier and weirder than that.
'Sewers of Utah' that's a band name right there.
Hell yeah! 🤟😆
That's what I'm calling my next album.
😂😂 a punk rock band name to be exact, can't be more "underground" than that hey? 🤣🤣
How about *the sewers of Portland!?*
Or *the sewer that is Portland!?*
@@NPC-fl3gq You're not funny, interesting, or intelligent, go away cliche boy.
I can’t explain how hilariously well-timed this video is.
The pic of Jon Schaffer...oh man I lost it
No kidding about having hiring a friend as a band member. After almost four decades in private business, fifteen of that in real estate, I can tell you with absolute certainty that the best way to make best friends into ex-best friends is to have them as a roommate or business partner.
Isnt the point of being in a band playing music with people you dont hate?
@@Cooldudehero123 Give it some time.....
Business is definitely risky. But roommates?? Nah.
Yep
They might be a sex offender?
How the hell do I find a guitarist for my pop punk band now?
No# 11 is so me. I played for about 2 years with a "friend" of mine who never bothered to rhythm-check his fantastic riff ideas or record them properly, so I always ended up having to make them somehow musically comprehensible for the band to play together. Needless to say, he still played them his way and I was basically the only person who knew our songs start to finish.
Last year he ghosted me for 3 months and I only found out through screenshots from our mutual friend that he screwed me over, saying I was too "strict" about our music and "made weird changes to his ideas" and left to become a pick-up artist. I guess good for us both after all, but it's still unfair that you have to endure all this shit just because you care.
As a wise man once said, "When you lie in a coma, it's not you who suffers, it's the people close to you. The same applies when you're stupid."
Oh, did I mention he was a bassist?
I feel you. I've also had a "friend" like that, who really could write great music but was too damn lazy to practice to a metronome or a track, so his rhythm was like that of an elderly dog humping a pillow. Not only that, but he never finished his stuff EVER. And despite being unable to play on beat and to complete the songs, he really wanted to "tie his life with music" and kept on constantly reminding me of this. It sucks that I found out all of this after trying to make music with this dude for a considerable amount of time. And yes, this friendship ended in the same fashion, so my guess is that halfassers never make for good friends or people.
If he decides to become a pickup artist at any point, you dodge a bullet regardless of the situation my friend.
@@rinnimalfy3453 it's just as if I read about my experience
Proof Dave Mustaine is a genius
Haha. Becoming a pickup-artist requires precisely this delusion of grandeur and lack of self-reflection.
I want to add one: RENT a practice space. Don’t hold band practice at a band members house. My band had a guitarist who canceled practice at the last minute and disappeared for about a week. He was holding about $1K worth of gear of mine and my bass player. Had to message his girlfriend and say “if we can’t make arrangements to get our stuff back, we’re just going to show up randomly to pick it up and we’re not ruling out police involvement either.” He ended up piling our stuff into his truck and delivering it to me. But he never made any apologies during that meeting. So yeah he’s gone.
OR….if you are going to practice at a band member’s house, take all your stuff with you. That’s what we do. We also are all adults who act our age rather than our shoe sizes and if anyone did leave anything behind, our drummer is cool enough that he wouldn’t steal it.
I was briefly in a band where two different groups practiced in the one bass player's garage. Suddenly one day every instrument in the place was gone. What a mess. SEVERAL thousands of dollars' worth of gear stolen. Thankfully the thieves were too lazy to carry amps or drums, and I had taken both my guitars home
By the end of about ten days the bass player was beaming about the huge insurance check they got, and showing off some shiny new instruments, but everyone else was just screwed. A couple guitars turned up at local pawn shops and got returned but most were gone forever.
Yes, it finally turned out later the bass player had set the whole burglary up with some friends of hers.
@@dogslobbergardens6606 Wow, ripped off by your own band member? That's really low and also really stupid.
I once auditioned for a band years ago - I recorded it (by agreement - in case it was a "no", I wanted to know if I screwed up and didn't hear it), but I forgot to turn it off when I left the room so they could talk about me. On listening back to it...the first thing they said when they thought I was out of earshot was, "HE'S NOT A PRICK!".
That one's stuck with me as bar #1 for auditionees to get past - the "not a prick" test. If they fail that one, much like the promptness and solvency tests, it's not worth asking any more questions.
I'll play with a minimally competent friend over a talented asshole EVERY time.
Another goodie- during the Foo Fighters' audition for a guitar player, one of the first off the cuff comments about Chris was "And he didn't smell bad!"
@@pyroman6000 Chris is also a trooper live. I saw him, violently ill, with No Use For a Name in 1998 (maybe 97) with a bucket on stage, puking between songs.
Oh yeah, that seriously is a common very first question. If you have to travel, live, work, and perform with an asshole that none of you can stand, that band has problems.
@@petepeterson5639 I don't know much about Chris but I do know, puking can also be a sign of heroin use. I think it happens when they are trying to kick the habit. I don't know if he had that problem like so many at the time.
Man, I love Glen's angry logic. His disdain for lazy/dumb musicians never gets old.
so easy to complain
All of these are just generally good rules for being auditioned as well, because the process goes both ways. You don't want to hire a shitty musician, about as much as you don't want to get hired by a shitty band.
To build a band is to build a machine. You don’t add unnecessary things just cause they are available. You don’t add a boat motor to a bathtub just cause one shows up.
I think in your example you should definitely do that. Every bathtub needs a boat motor...
@@SyntheticFuture 😄😄😄😄😂😂😂😂
Not everyone can operate a sail bathtub
My best friend, a former metal guitarist and a colleague of mine in my undergrad music degree told me that he prefers working with classical musicians over rock and metal musicians because of the difference in professionalism he has noticed.
Two additional tips:
1, start then off on one of your harder songs. You need to know how well they handle your material, giving them something easy to start doesn’t give you the full picture. Our guitarist absolutely nailed his audition!
2, they actually show they want to be in the band! We had five people interested in singing for us, but most of them said they’d learn the songs then we never heard back from them! The guy we went with spent all his free time learning our songs!
I have tried to build several lineups over the years, and I feel like I can add two things to your advices: know that being in a band is kind of like being sentimentally engaged, hence you can foresee many of the members' behaviour with this kind of mindset, and the other one is knowing that there is ALWAYS a hierarchy in the group, so if you're not the type to be a leader you have to look for one that is good at it (usually, the leader in a band is the one writing songs and putting other meat on the barbecue).
After, like, 10 years of trying to make my electro-alt-rock lineup I've sold all my instruments and quit music, because I've met most of the kinds of persons you have described, from the lazy one, to the high one, to the one with a delusion of omnipotence and got tired of trying.
Another 10 years later I've come to terms that music is a part of me I can't get rid of and made my mistakes of the past my strongest point: you are welcome to embrace my cause, otherwise I'll do it myself, because I'M NOT DESPERATE TO NEED YOU. That's why I've started to learn singing, so I don't necessarily need a singer but I can sing my song myself instead of depending on others.
I always said, being in a band was like having 4 girlfriends !!!
@@MickH60 with none of the same benefits.
It's actually amazing, that in 2022 people can actually collect enough people who aren't complete (assholes, idiots, offended fuckwits, humourless morons, talentless twats, ideological bastards) to create actual music. Part of a recent meeting/audition was a 'question period' where my political opinion was scrutinized before I had even opened my guitar case. I didn't open it, picked it up, and promptly left. I won't play with people who are more concerned with what everyone else in the world is doing.
Reminds me "Hey Jude" lyrics
You're waiting for someone to perform with
And don't you know that it's just you, hey Jude, you'll do
The movement you need is on your shoulder
All very good points but there's a caveat: heaving a steady job and being able to go on tour can be (and usually is) mutually exclusive.
Be clear up front what the goal of the band is. If you only plan on playing local (A couple hours drive) is different than planning on making it a professional career. The later means at some point you may have to choose to dump the job.
@@christopherconard2831 but in order to do so you need to have at least a reasonable chance of making a living by doing so. Me, I always chose low-level jobs that wouldn't collide with my music. Well, the result is, I'm 43, my CV is worth about as much as used toilet paper, I barely earn enough to stay alive and have been on a brink of homelessness more than once. Have I ever earned a living playing music? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no. Some extra cash? Yeah, sure, but not enough to survive. When you take chances you have to calculate them well. I didn't and well, here I am.
The best case scenario is having a job that provides vacation days.
A real skill, even being a cook, you can find work anywhere any time.
It's always fun to watch small local bands try their first 5 day tour and break up after the 4th show on the road. Finding people you can actually share close quarters with for days on end is one of the toughest tasks out there.
Glen,
As a gigging musician, I am 66, and I've been at it since I was 15. I really hope that you get through to some younger players with this VERY TRUTHFUL AND USEFUL information. I've seen every one of the situations you talked about happen over my decades of situations from street performing to professional tours and everything in between.
Huge red flag to look for: Does the prospect walk into the audition with their significant other? If the answer is yes: Thanks for coming, BYE.
If the significant other just drops them off and drives away, or makes clear they aren't in a band, just a chaffeur.. That is just a semi red flag for not having their own transportation but it is excusable. There have been plenty of those in the bands i've been but never ever take a musicians that insist their partner is part of the deal.
Stupid comment, having a significant other come in and enjoy themselves is harmless. Really ignorant comment there
I once tried out a guy who was pussy whipped by this evil bitch of a wife who’s first words yelled in our presence was “THIS IS FUCKING BULLSHIT!” He didn’t last long. Ever since, I’ve had a complex about band members’ girlfriends; I know I shouldn’t judge someone who I don’t know but if I’m at a show and a musician is talking with me and their girlfriend chimes in I’m screaming in my head “NO ONE FUCKING ASKED YOU!”.
omg. ew :/
Keys to a successful audition:
1. Show up 20-30 minutes early to get set up and be ready to start at the time specified.
2. Show up with fresh batteries and strings (bass players, this means you!)
3. If given a list of songs, show up overprepared. If they give you a few songs off their album to learn, learn them all!
4. Be willing to INVEST some money into your rig if necessary (looking at you bass players)
5. Take the time to do your homework, learn the songs, not just a close approximation or your interpretation.
If they are serious, so should you be! Don't waste their time or yours by going into it half-assed.
This is all great advice. One of the best bands I've ever been in (was a member for over 10 years before we split up), I got to tour, record 4 albums, and have the best friends I could ever ask for, was thanks to a well prepared audition. They gave me a demo about 2 weeks before my audition. It had 9 songs on it. When I showed up for my audition, they asked me what songs I knew from it, and I said "All of them. We can play whatever you guys want to play." They all kind of looked at each other. We ended up jamming for a couple hours. Two weeks later, we were playing shows. Later on, they told me that they auditioned a bunch of musicians, and the most anyone knew going in was 3 songs. However, most of them only knew 2. They would play through the few songs they knew, and then spend the rest of the audition trying to teach them another song. I had the whole 9 song demo down, so the next time I jammed with them, they just had to teach me the 2 songs they had that weren't on the demo, which I picked up in one night. Preparation and a commitment to the craft is everything. If you're not an arrogant asshole, that's the icing on the cake.
Bass players who sing and Drummer do all the work every one else enjoy the ride !
After that lecture I'm glad I'm a one-man looper band. Bahahaha, I suck.
I’m only halfway through this video and I’m convinced you based this whole thing around my band’s former guitarist
Please do the reverse video too, aka "11 mistakes to avoid when joining a band".
The money one is interesting.
I was working a low-paying job a few years ago and tried out as a vocalist for some band about 30-40 miles away from me.
They told me up front that I was going to have to contribute a decent amount of money immediately for merch and other things of that nature and I told them my financial situation and they were shocked because I guess the band leader was making a decent chunk of change.
They didn’t want to play locally at either of the main towns in the area (there’s a decent amount of venues between the two) and instead wanted to play in the nearest large city roughly two hours away exclusively.
My idea of starting a band was what my previous bands did starting out:
- Play shows locally
- If a demand begins to rise because we’d get booked enough, invest in merch then
- Also make and spend money for studio time if we felt a song or songs were ready for an audience
Meaning I just got some weird vibes about the whole thing. We had a conversation and agreed to not take it further than that first practice. They’ve gone through a ton of band members since, I’ve played solo since and I’m still on good terms with that band leader and we give each other leads for booking. It honestly worked out for the best that way.
IMO, both paths are legitimate ways of approaching things. Out of curiosity I started a band years ago where our first show was the first of an all state US tour. Printed up shirts, CD's and a few other random things. Made enough to do another US tour a couple months later and a European tour about 4 months later. The whole thing came out of my curiosity of what's more important, building following first or image with the right group of people first. If you can find people who can drop everything and want to go away for a while, printing up merchandise to cover gas, food and hotel expenses isn't the worst way to get some fun road trips and memories. A local/regional following doesn't always translate to a bigger following, so at some point you do need to take the plunge and go for it if you really want to expand out into a touring gig.
@@Lethargy01 How'd you book that many shows without a following? In my experience you have to book some real small venues that are just willing to have anyone first and then get noticed enough where other venues are willing to take a chance on that night.
Exclusively playing two hours away and printing up merch when there was no following yet didn't make sense to me and still doesn't. More often than not, you just end up with tons of t-shirts you'll use as rags because you couldn't sell them. It didn't make sense to buy the 500 shirts and whatever else they wanted.
@@ryanshinermusic Lots of internet/social media searching to find bands in various areas, then reaching out to them directly and asking if they're willing to help out in exchange for helping them if they ever come to our area. For every 20-50 bands I reached out to, 1-2 replied and booked us a show with them. Made some great friends along the way, but for sure you have to be willing to dive in and put yourself out there.
Glen is over playing the problems. It's not all this bad. Our guitar player is able to get a ride to our practice sessions from his parole officer. Our drummer's grandmother wakes him up on time and walks him to the bus stop. I put up a large sign over the practice room that says, 'No girlfriends allowed'.
I think we're all guilty of being 'that guy' sometimes.
I've played in about 30 local bands so far and if there's one thing I've learned is this:
You can teach someone how to play better or sing better but you NEVER can teach someone a good work ethic. And this is where all the problems begin.
The 2 rehearsal rule always works for me - If he did the same shit in the first 2 rehearsals (arrived late, came unprepared or drunk, forgot his gear) it's a huuuuuge red flag because it's not a mistake, it's a character.
I remember a band I was in 20 years ago. Singer- Jobless and no car. Drummer- Jobless and essentially no car (it was always broke). Guitarist- Had a job and working van. Me (bass)- Had job, college, and car. Band was together for a couple years.
We practiced at the guitarist’s house 30 miles from everyone in the middle of nowhere (no annoyed neighbors, but waaay out in the middle of nowhere). My car eventually broke (after 6 years) and the guitar player still wanted to practice 4-5 times a week. That meant he had to pick everyone up instead of them constantly riding with me. After 2-3 months, he was getting mad (despite me having done it prior for months) because the drummer and singer never had gas money and they were always running late (insert “I needed pot” or “I was getting laid” excuse here).
Finally, I told him that I was gonna have to cut back on practices to 1-2 times a week so I had time to work to get funds to replace my car sooner. Said it was only gonna take a month or 2 and I’d have fresh wheels that take the burden off him…
Suddenly, I was out of the band because I “wasn’t dedicated enough”… ignoring the countless miles I racked up and how much time I invested outside of practice for the band itself (promotion, booking gigs, selling tickets, etc). Sure enough, the band disintegrated within 2 weeks after booting me out.
Guitarists, ego over empathy.
@@sirhandelno3 I promise not all of us are like this
Because you play the Bass, I'm sure Glen won't believe a word of this.
If your drummer isnt fighting the baby eating shadow government, then he's probably one of them.
Seeing that video with the guy in a Mushroomhead shirt triggered me...
let me tell you after years of opening up for Mushroomhead, that dude is the typical guy in the crowd you have to deal with. Pro tip for aspiring musicians: DON'T OPEN FOR MUSHROOMHEAD lol.
One band I was in had a rule at rehearsals that until we'd been through the set list and anything that came out of that there was no spliff break.
Work first -- mess about later and see what comes out of it.
Ha once I was at practice, they wanted to smoke another blunt, I was like can we make music instead? They looked at me like I was crazy. Didn’t stay long after that
That's why i made my band solo. If you want to do something good - do it yourself. Better spend that time learning new instruments and skills than dealing with shitheads sabotaging your work. In 6 years of my musicianship only 2 (!!) people out of dozens were pleasure to work with. That's why vst drums are a thing.
Amen.....same here, it's why I'm a one man project.
I have to agree unfortunately. It is ok of once in a while a bandmate shows up late or not at all, but from my experience this happens routinely.
@@thegodfather5842 In my experiences, I've found it impossible to work with fellow musicians....period. One-Man-Metal I remain.
In my experience, motivation goes a long way. Picking the musician with skills beyond yours, might not be as motivated to show up to practice every week, when they can learn your stuff in a day and show up once a month.
Always make sure they're motivated!
(Kinda goes to the commitment category though)
I'm 20 and have been looking for bandmates for a couple years now and just hit gold on craigslist with two guys who are really good and both songwriters. Three of us are moving forward together
Beautiful.
Awesome. Best of luck to you guys!
The substance thing is super important. Whenever I worked with potheads, it was indeed a total nightmare.
I smoke pretty fuckin often, and I can’t imagine doing it before practice, an audition, or a gig. That sounds like the easiest way to embarrass the fuck out of myself.
I had a guy call up, wanting to audition for the lead guitarist spot in the band. Told me he knew this song and that song. He showed up for the audition with tab books, and started to play them so slowly, then I found out he was just starting to learn guitar! He said that, as a band, we were going to "grow and learn together.". I had to, sadly, say to him that I think he needs to do some more work before joining a band. He then told everyone he was in the band! I ended up telling him that the band is no more, that we had moved on. Also had a nutter who collected guns want the spot, but tried telling me that my rig was too big and that I needed a Line 6 Spider amp instead, like what he had, despite me saying that I have played in bands before with my rig, but the last straw was his son trying to steal my Xbox controller. That just ended it for me.
Damn. I hope everything turned out okay. I've been trying to put together a band for a year now, and it's not easy.
@@chasesvocalrange2540 I ended up playing bass in another band, but am slowly getting back to this project. Just got to find a rehearsal space!
@@Vindicator18 Ah. Well, I haven't played guitar in years. I wanna get back into it. I'm just trying to find the right motivation to do so.
Sounds like you are the issue, how does someone that collects guns, a rig being too big and line 6 spider amps correlate together? On top of that you throw in an x box controller being stolen, how is that part of a guitar rig? I have been playing for over 30 years and never had a game controller in my effects rack, never had anyone complain it was "too big." I have played in a couple death metal bands in the Noteheast, playedamy of the great venues in New York including L'Amour, CBGB'S, The Bowery, Irving Plaza etc.I would proof read this comment and hopefully edit it, you started strong but the second half is totally bizarre.
@@potatolew4495 "in the noteheast, playedamy"
lol, looks like you could do some proofreading, too. You missed a space after a period as well.
That last tip felt like it was coming from a place of personal experience, either first or third person. Would love to hear how that went down.
Yeah, that seemed curiously specific 😹
Love the poster: Looking for done armed drummer for "Def Leppard" cover band!!! How smart: by not picking which arm, they doubled their chances of finding one!
Lol, I've dealt with almost all these issues and more. From my experience can I also suggest:
- telling people you will be rehearsing at a rehearsal studio and they will need to pay their share. You will get rid of 90% of time wasters as they never want to put their hand in their pocket
- If possible start off rehearsing nights after work. No person ever cancels last minute because they're hung over or want to go to the beach at 7pm on a Wednesday
- During the audition process, hire a rehearsal room and gear. Allocate a few people different time slots and let them know you are supplying drums/amps for the audition. Hire the people who show up on time and don't blame the gear
- Select a drummer and bassist who play well together and can lock in to each other's playing. If a bassist/drummer is trying out for bands but can't lock in with the other rythem instruments your band is doomed before it begins
Always trade up. never down. I was in a band where the weakest member drifted away, we lucked out and found a guy who was both more talented and had his shit together. It was a significant upgrade. Tragically he died and we made the bad, path of least resistance , decision to bring back the guy he had replaced. A regrettable choice!
RIP your cool friend
I think a lot of these issues are due to people that like the IDEA of being in a band more than the actual effort involved.
I’ve been in several bands and never had any of the issues discussed in this video. However, the common thread was that everyone in those bands was serious about their craft and worked hard at it. Also, in my experience, most good musicians underrate themselves, not the other way round.
Avoid people who "play by feel": you will spend a lot of rehearsal time explaining rhythm, melody and why certain ideas just don't sound well.
Have them feel they’re way to the door.
"Don't sound well" isn't a theory thing. It's a "Can you hear it?" thing.
When writing music, here's the mindset you have to be in: "You hear this on the radio. How quickly do you switch the channel, and what would it take for you not to do that?"
@@pauliusmscichauskas558 Dude, millions of people enjoy Nicki Minaj and mumble rap.
@@Sphereal and?
"Quit playing with yourself and go put on some pants."
Suspiciously looks at room corners for hidden cameras...
Don't forget guys... practice is for homework. Rehearsal is applying your practice. Learn the material so our time isn't wasted when we get together!
well maybe write it down or tab it out. . . . rather than expecting a newb to memorize 7 songs from one practice? Learning covers is possible off-line but hard to work on original work written by others on your own.
The thing about 11 is that once you realize one person is the professional and one person is the friend, the friendship is never the same after.
100% this!
I played with a guy in an improv group who could sweep pick but had no idea how to palm mute. I was almost floored with astonishment. He picked it up quick enough. But I was still amazed.
You forgot to mention the idiot that has to have his girlfriend present at all band practices.This is a total Deal Breaker.
Nothing worse than a Yoko onboard.
We just lost our bassist again, and that makes 3 over the past 4-5 months. Each had an issue you described. One didn’t have the skill/know the material, one was talented but didn’t show up/show up on time, and the most recent had financial issues. We are trying to start playing live so it’s sooooo frustrating.
I finally just said “fuck it” and made backing tracks (it forces everyone to practice to a metronome so win/win) but I do hope to get someone to fill the spot.
I was happy you mentioned the "boyfriend/girlfriend" thing. "Romantic" relationships between band members are a time bomb to the band and it rolls into the 'priorities" and "friends" concept but with a lot more weight. My philosophy is that a band should be a primary relationship in it's own context and not have to compete with other primary relationships within the band. When the friends in the band come in already squishing body parts that's usually a bad sign. Certainly, juggling band members' ideocracies is hard enough without that kind of complication within the group. It was always a rule with me and every time that I'd make and exception (for myself and others) for the sake of a great band by any other measure -- I always regretted it.
I've been trying to start a metal band in birmingham alabama for the past 5 years. Sometimes you really do just have to either take what you can get, or have nothing.
At that point I’d just work alone and get money to hire pros when the studio time comes
@@Tarpull That works pretty well if you want to write all the material, and then hire a backing band to record and tour. But not so well if you just want to play out.
Personally I never intended to become a big star, I just really enjoyed rehearsing twice a week and playing live a couple times a month.
Reel Big Fish said it best; "Don't Start a Band."
Damn, I've experienced almost all of this shit in the 80's when I played the club scene.
Add: are they in other bands already? & if so: which band takes precedence?
Who ever has the show date booked first.
@@xxcelr8rsideally, but that’s not usually how people prioritise things
“We’ll maybe good musicians can still be a bit difficult to come across”- And the truth comes out…
Good MUSICIANS are easier to find than good PEOPLE who are musicians.
I once had a drummer that sang backing vocals, in standard tuning he was struggling to hit a high "E", only just. I suggested we all down tune a semitone to give his voice a bit more room , drummer boy blew a fuse because, wait for it, We didn't have enough time to relearn all of the songs !, no matter how well I explained it to the goose he continued on his mindless rant. He got the shits and went outside for a smoke, while he was out we drop tuned, he returned, we said nothing and completed practice, I then told him what we'd done and he refused to believe we could have relearned all the songs in a "different tuning", I think some semblance of intelligence also helps when recruiting band members.....
Used to play in a band with a guy on the sex offender register. We didn't know til we organised an all ages gig and he disappeared.
my old band once auditioned a guitarist who showed up without a guitar strap. we asked if he wanted a tuner real quick before starting and he goes "nah, i just do it by ear". then he proceeds to play distorted electric guitar with his fucking thumb. no pick.
needless to say, it was a no.
I’m SO glad that you mentioned substance abuse. I know it sounds totally square, but that issue is vitally important.
Very difficult to work when the singer brings 8 cans of beer for himself -- and runs out within an hour
@@keithsquawk Yeah it's a real bad sign if they can't even scrape together a full 12-pack.
I kid, I kid!
REALLT NEEDED THIS THANKS GLENNN
This is why I play all the parts myself nowadays.... All real instruments. I'm a drummer for over 30 years (primarily, I've also played guitar for most of that time) that got tired of unreliable, unprepared bandmates. I no longer have any problems😁
I think it is implied here but gonna say it anyway: IT'S NOT WRONG IF YOU DECIDE TO MAKE A BAND JUST FOR HAVE FUN WITH FRIENDS, BUT THAT HAS TO BE CRYSTAL CLEAR FROM THE FUCKING START.
@DFV Louderilk that's the kind of issue that annoys me the most because then starts the "blame game" of "who makes us suck?"
Be wary of anyone who says they're "the most dedicated one of all of us"
Dedicated until a woman (or man) gets involved.
They like to talk about how dedicated they are right before passing out from some sort of opiate or alcohol combination
@@shaunkellison1761 that's very close to some of my experiences🤣🤣
Can we also include on that list some uptight, hot-headed, gate-keeping elite-wannabe musicians? Even though they can be HIGHLY intelligent and talented, they always either get into fights, constantly argue with other bandmates, refuse to listen to other people (including the sound guy and their own bandmates), talk smack about other musicians in the local scene, and complain about every single little thing. Oh yeah, and be sure to kick out the ones who screw you over business-wise. There's NO need for that negative BS! Love the video, Glenn!
That was a great video about integrity, loyalty, and character (or the lack of). You forgot one type of person who is the WORST of all. It's usually the "singer" who plays no instruments so does not KNOW the work and discipline involved. He has the talent and ability, sings just fine in high school chorus or madrigals but...IS NOT COMFORTABLE ON HIS OWN!!!
By himself, making his own life moves he's not efficient. Around others he calms down and performs the task at hand.
This is the "instinct boy." More specifically, the instinct over logic boy. He has a little voice inside and he hears and he obeys!
Foresight is non-existent, self-confidence, yep...you guessed it...there is none...self reliance? 😂 The instinct boy has none, unless he's around others. Then his whole attitude changes. Someone like that is HIDING SOMETHING or several things. They "create" their own fantasy world for psychological reasons to compensate themselves for a deep fear or the lack of something else.
They can MORPH into any of the aforementioned folks as well but is only shining people on that haven't yet done enough reading to learn somebody's "little game" which is to distract people from their musical work and prolong progress as long as possible (especially in the beginning).
Go with the easy remedy. At some point the fool will make it clear he's not going to do his part, such as...taking on 8 things in the same 24. Make sure you spot the sign.
Dealing with all of them is simple. The songs get done, or they don't get done. Whoever one way or another, makes the job more difficult than it has to be...identify the fool, bounce him, and keep working until you find a replacement. Join a union, ads, etc. and rock on!
OMG, the whole "Friend vs Professional" thing really hits the nail on the head a lot of the time in my humble experience.
Now, in all honesty - my guitarist is also my best friend, but we've had YEARS of highs and lows in our friendship before we started playing together and about as many years after - we learned to quarrel and to step back and to make compromises with "our vision" because experience and time and failure taught us that no matter how much of our own ideas we sacrifice in the process, the end result of us working together and cutting, reworking and editing each other's parts is almost always better than what we can compose separately.
However, this is a level of trust and understanding which takes time to build when you have clear "buddy "expectations and, heaven forbid, feelings of "owing" something to someone. Gods only know how many times I've heard the line "I know it's bad, but I can't tell him that - he's a friend and he's put so much effort into it and he helped me move after my break up and he's the dude who showed me how to hold a guitar and..." ... and it is not uncommon to outgrow people, but it is common too not own up to it, which is a problem in a band setting.
With the exception of said guitarist, I personally have a better relationship with musicians I've worked with, who stated as "colleagues"/"band-mates" and ended up being friends, as opposed to friends who also play an instrument and want to try joining. There is a certain level of "detachment" you have with colleagues which helps you concentrate on the job at hand, which you don't always have when there is the emotional response between friends and the "power dynamic" which comes with friendships. Basically, you're more willing to accept ideas from people whom you judge based on their musicianship, instead of based on their horrible, HORRIBLE choices in terms of partners and booze.
Also important to note - "professional" in this case is not meant to mean actually "paid professional", however given the amount of time, funds and effort music requires, even as just a hobby, it is impossible to not look for and require a bit of professionalism and job-like approach from a musician looking to jam with you, as opposed to, say, a random person you end up regularly drinking and hanging out with at the local watering hole.
I remember the last band I was in I had to leave because of my mental health (apparently not easy to be in a band when you don’t want to be alive anymore.) when I left one of them told me I need to stop doing drugs since that ruined my life and clearly I couldn’t handle it… I would only occasionally smoke with them and the same member was “let go of the band” after he permanently fucked up his hand after a night mixing of meth and alcohol about 6 months after I left. Now I’ve been sober for 3 years and they are still stuck with one single that no one has listened to because they don’t know how to advertise a show properly without it being the day before, let alone a single.
"When you break up, the band is OVER. Sure, there are exceptions to the rule, but you are NOT Fleetwood Mac."
So just to be safe, do a drug test.Credit check. Criminal background. License and registration. Past Employment verification. At least 3 personal references. And last throw in a psychological evaluation. Then maybe get to know them.🤣 👍. Love you brother.
I need to turn this shit off and go practice
A bit overcritical if you're just looking for some guys to make a band with, have fun. And grow
Seems to me some of these rules would only apply to people who are trying to do this for a living or taking it VERY serious! And I'm not saying hes wrong for those reasons
In truth it is very hard to find the right musicians. For me, if you CAN find one who shows up on time, has a good personality and gets along with others, has working equipment/gear/transportation, and a steady income hold on tight! Then look for these two traits next...1. Are they enthusiastic and dedicated, and 2 are they improving? If this happening you've found a Rare find. For a dad band, hobby band, or a band looking to gig in the future I think this is the perfect kind of guys to build with. And I've been doing this for a while.
That only works for those with patience, and the ability to nurture and grow as a group and a band and a band. If you're selfish or looking for something fast before something fast this would obviously not work
Supposedly Jeff hanneman never drove a car in his life. I saw an interview with Kerry King where he said literally every time Slayer ever practiced he picked Jeff up, and he never once saw him drive a vehicle.
Just thought it was an interesting story, not trying to argue against Glenn's point. You definitely need a car
I'm not that old fashioned but taking a guitar for a drink in the afternoon at a local rock music bar will have unattached musicians chatting and offering to jam.
Likewise facebook groups, show yourself playing something and a location attached and you'll get people.
My computer doesn't complain constantly about the" Deep State" or " Chemtrails" or insist I use only the gear they recommend..
I'm currently in a band with friends and it's not going very well. The singer actually writes all the songs and produces them himself (he plays multiple instruments). The band exists to play live, that's it.
And I think the studio versions of the songs he made suck. But it's impossible to tell him because he cannot take any criticism. I've had to tell him that I will never speak freely about what I think of his production skills ever again, because I want to stay his friend. I think I might have some advice that could be valuable to him, but what's the point if he doesn't listen ? His album has been delayed by a year and a half at this point and if it ever comes out, my bet is it's gonna be a trainwreck. At this point, I don't want to be the "I told you so" guy... I just don't care anymore. He brought his own failure to himself and I did what I could to prevent it. I don't want any part in this album anymore, because I'm trying to stay professional with people that aren't.
It saddens me that he invested a lot of his money in this project and that he will probably lose every penny of it, but I am still his friend and I respect his choices. He may learn a valuable lesson if he can look back on what he did wrong.
To be fair I didn't pick up the guitar to get chicks, I was 5. No one knew I even played til I was 14 when a girl in my class said musicians are hot so yeah
Most, or possibly all of this is really just one diagnosis question after the other from the list I had to fill out when confirming I had ADHD.
Edit: yup, all of this.
Can you do a video on how to get gigs, please T_T
Definitely would LOVE to see this video made
10:54 Booze is the _least_ of Bobby Liebling's problems.
We auditioned a guy who walked into our rehearsal space and said "Heads up, I'm an alcoholic so I might be too drunk to drive to practices or shows". Verbatim. Safe to say that guy got the swift boot
Damn, LOL. Well, on the plus side, at least he was honest and upfront with you right out of the gate, instead of finding out during your first live gig with him 😬
i found 2 drummers on craigslist...also a stalker. "junkies and drunks" be a good band.🤣🍻
when i used drugs i wrote great songs but i was no best musician. Then I stopped using drugs and now I play better than I do songs. I still do not regret my decision at all.
One point you forgot with substance abuse is it's likely to get your gear stolen. My last band had a guitarist that was clearly on drugs. Long story short, he pawned one of my amps without my permission. What do you think he bought with the money?
I'd like to hear more about this 'joining a band will get you laid' thing.
With the music I played, it prevented me getting laid.
It's not really a thing. Merely holding a guitar on stage will not make you hot.
It's not being a band that gets you laid, it's success and status.
So, if you are in a succesful band - it will help.
Man, this has helped tremendously! I'm trying my best to recruit band members (2 guitarists, a bassist and drummer) and it has not been easy. But I shall not give up! Cheers!
I could do without the assumption that the person watching this is a heterosexual male, but this is good advice and I plan to take it into account! Thank you
Lol, I definitely didn't pick up a guitar to get laid. Nobody plays free jazz to get laid.
As l often said to people as a mechanic. You have a serious problem, you need professional help and your car is fucked up too !!!!!!
It took me five fucking minutes to make flyers, and it's not that difficult to go around and put them up.
Oh watching this right now….
Good video Glenn!!! 👍🏼
Anger control problem. dDealt with that too many times.
Can you live in a van with this person for 2 years if on tour???
Flyer at a music store?!? There ya go again assuming people can read!
Can you imagine how many 80s bands we wouldn’t have if these good and concise rules had just been laid out as clearly back then? After being in bands for 35 years, all true points. Great vid.
Lol. 1) i have been looking for fellow musicians around my area for 6 years now, online as well as offline, and all i can find are top 40 cover bands, oldies and bluesrock. the few metal bands around are either pro-level with a full on touring plan already set up, requiring you to travel with them for 10 months a year, while the rest is usually beginners playing power chords - which is fine, but doesnt really appeal to me.
My worst band experience was the drummer we had. Alcoholic, ALWAYS late to practice and we had a show and we had to set up his stuff on stage in hopes that he shows up and he showed up at the last possible second. Absolute disaster. Good video Glen.
Here's one more important point that I'm missing on this list: NO! EGO! TRIPS! If a band of e.g. 5 people vote 4/5 for something and you are the 1/5 who votes against it, well, guess what - you have to oblige to the majority. If you don't, you are on a ego-trip and not capable of being in a band, because that's not how it works...
Make sure your band members don't have kids. I'll never play in a band with someone who has kids again. If someone has kids the band is defacto not a priority.
Kids equal no band commitment by default.
The older the kids are, the less of a problem they are. I had drummer who had two teenage daughters whom the rest of the band never even met. He ended up being fired but his kids were not a factor in that.
My band is looking for a singer, we have had lots of inquiries. but unfortunately not one could impress us. 😕 we won't drop our standards for someone who isn't willing to put in the work, and even got called out for it by someone we tried. He wasn't happy we said it wouldn't work. Anyway we have 9 demos but no vocals and just over a year in.
Take care and be safe 👍
I'm also waring pants.
I do have ads up kijiji and Facebook.
I haven't gone to shows just due to the "end of the world"
But I'll definitely be out this summer.