Bishop Barron on "Will all be Saved?" w/ Ralph Martin
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- This clip was taken from a recent livestream with Ralph Martin. Watch the full interview here: • A Church in Crisis w/ ...
In this clip, Ralph talks about why, in his opinion, Bishop Barron sometimes gives the impression that "we're all going to heaven". Hint: it's all stems from Vatican II.
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Apologies for the original thumbnail. My team put that together and as soon as I saw the video live I asked them to change it, which they did immediately.
You're the man, Matt.
Wuduyumean I actually liked the original one better.
God bless you for the fraternal correction of your team. I saw the original thumbnail this morning - not sure how if you took it down 2 days ago (a RUclips problem?). I seldom leave comments, but I was going to on that one. I was concerned that the reference to BB was unnecessary. It was provocative CLICKBAIT. I am glad that you saw fit to change it. For me, the cheap clickbait left a bad taste in my mouth after listening to the excellent talk with Ralph Martin. Even at 2-1/2 hours it is definitely worth a second listen.
@@JackFalltrades they replaced Bishop Barron with Dr. Ralph Martin in the thumbnail. Personally I thought the original was better from an artistic and RUclips standpoint, but it's fine.
@@JackFalltrades no just the fact that he was in the thumbnail I think. I don't see the need for the change myself, but it is what it is.
Bishop Barron has a wonderful way of relating to people. By listening to him for the past 5 years, I was able to find my way back home to catholicism
Do you think catholicism is true?
@@kevinjunior_kid yes do you
@@parissturt2788 No... Because some of the teachings are against the Bible
@@kevinjunior_kid No book will interpret itself to us. Not even the Bible. Ultimately, it seems, the Bible is subject to your interpretation. I hope you are an infallible interpreter. Thousands of Protestant churches exist because they thought the other Protestants were teaching against the Bible.
@@bradleymosman8325 Alright then.. Who is Jesus Christ according to your faith..
As a gen Z Catholic convert, when Ralph began to talk about the failure of befriending the world, brought upon by Vatican 2 & various social movements, I began to get excited. He mentions bishops now recognizing the failure of this strategy I couldn’t help but shout “yes!” It’s time the Church stands in it’s whole beauty, not withholding any of the glory she brings to Christ!
As a part of gen z, I can confirm, the nice guy role certainly will not work with my generation. The Church should proclaim the gospels, boldly, & unapologetically.
AMEN!
@@778FraxK
And what is the truth? The Church of hundreds of years ago said that nobody but Catholic's will be saved. The Church of Vat II says that it is possible for people to be saved outside the Church. How can both teachings be harmonized with what Scripture says, that is the real question that should be answered?
@@778FraxK
I should have been more clear, I was referring specifically to the Papal Bull of Eugene IV (Council of Florence 1438-1445) when it says;
It firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that those not living within the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life, but will depart “into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels” [Matt. 25:41], unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock; and that the unity of the ecclesiastical body is so strong that only to those remaining in it are the sacraments of the Church of benefit for salvation, and do fastings, almsgiving, and other functions of piety and exercises of Christian service produce eternal reward, and that no one, whatever almsgiving he has practiced, even if he has shed blood for the name of Christ, can be saved, unless he has remained in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church.
I believe that even this seemingly harsh statement must be able to be reconciled with what Vat.II says. Possibly when it speaks of being "added to the flock before the end of life", it may at the very least, leave open the door for God to intervene in some mysterious way unknown to us, into the life of the one outside the Church, to reveal Christ and His Church to them, and allow them to either accept or reject Him at that point, even if it occurs as late as being at the moment of death.
" The Church should proclaim the gospels, boldly, & unapologetically."
The problem with that view is that it can lead catholics to go into simply telling "convert to Catholicism or you will go to hell" and that obviously doesn't bring no one into the faith, that's what Bishop Barron understands that trads don't.
@@elizabethkraszewski6603 I have never said that we shouldn't preach the truths of the faith. What I said, is starting with threats with hell is not how should we do it, if it was, then the Westboro Baptist Church would clearly be the church with most converts. Besides, the goal of being a catholic is not merely avoiding hell but being a saint both on earth as in heaven. A Catholicism fueled only by a fear of hell doesn't produce saints, it produces puritans. We should be catholics out of love of God and neighbor first and mostly and that's what we should always share. In fact, hell is no other thing than the absolute self-exclusion of God's love, as the Catechism says.
I am disappointed at this critic of Bishop Baron. He speaks to young people about the love of God which is greater than any sin and the source of our salvation. Christ came to call sinners to repentance, He condemns the sin and not the sinner. Bishop Baron emphasizes that the church need to build walls and bridges; to protect its values but also reach out to the bring the world. That finger-wagging approach to the gospel will not get this generation out of scientism. Bishop Baron is doing great work and should be encouraged.
O My Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of Hell and lead ALL souls to Heaven, especially those who are in most need of Thy mercy.
That is the Fatima prayer that the Mother of God taught the 3 shepherd children: Lucia, Francesco and Jucinta.
She also showed them a vision of HELL where the children saw HUMAN SOULS. The children were frightened nearly to death on seeing it. She also told them that more people go to Hell for sins of the flesh than any other sins and that they should pray and do penance so that others won't go there.
If you say" that's private revelation, we don't have to believe that " , i shall agree with you. However , that prayer comes from private revelation from the same series of apparitions. You can't dismiss one without the other.
So, if you are dismissing that human souls DO GO TO HELL, I suggest that you pray and FAST for those for whom you are hoping they don't go there.
You are both correct , While we pray for God's mercy, we must rember the old version of the Act of Contraction. "Because of the loss of heaven and the pains of Hell, "remember this old quote "the streets of hell are paved with the skulls of Bishops.
ruclips.net/video/H8UBT-3USeY/видео.html
there is no place as hell, hell fire is a fire that annihilates the wicked then the fire goes out, there is no limbo or purgatroy...and a priest cannot forgive your sins because he has enough of his own
Where and when was hell created in the creation story and why is the concept basically absent throughout the whole Bible?
I appreciate the reference Dr Ralph Martin made to the last few sentence of lumen gentium 16. I re-read the section and noticed the beginning of the this sentence: “But often men, deceived by the Evil One...” Deception by the evil one does not happen rarely, or occasionally, but OFTEN. 🤷♂️
How can we have a reasonable hope that all are saved when “often men, deceived by the Evil One.... exchanged the truth of God for a lie”
Thanks for your work Matt. 👍
Hey Ken - thoughtful comment! I would counter with this - does a mother hope that all her children will graduate from public school, even if it seems unlikely that all will?
@@angelicdoctor8016 apples and oranges
@@stevenhotho4094 both involve hope for the unlikely -- apples and apples
How can we have a reasonable hope that all men shall be saved? Because the Bible teaches it. Because the Church for the first 500 years up until Augustine, widely taught this. Because holy saints of God have taught it, men such as St. Gregory of Nyssa and St. Isaac of Syria taught it and have NEVER been declared heretics by any ecumenical council. Because God has defeated death by His death, so that there is no way that death can win and hold even one person. Because God is just and eternal torment would be the most unjust thing that God could do.
@@IrishEddie317 I really don't know what gospels you are reading.
I've listened to both Bishop Barron and Ralph Martin on this topic and I can't see where they differ. They both emphasise exactly the same points. Neither is unclear or divergent in their interpretation. If you're seeing a conflict, it's because you're not hearing either party properly. It's the style that differs between the two men only. The doctrine is clear on this - specifically being a Catholic has the greatest chance of getting you into heaven but we honestly don't know for certain. It isn't as easy as simply believing in God and being a Catholic, you actively have to be genuine in the practice of your faith and faith can be an extreme struggle at the best of time. Had I listened to people like Ralph Martin when I was agnostic I simply would have put him in the 'radical Christian' box and continued to live my life not believing in hell or the devil and not being convinced by the existence of God. I came back to religion because I was convinced that God truly loves me. Some people need the stick to be convinced and will be really won over by Ralph's style of argumentation, others like me need the carrot and are far more convinced by the Bishop Barron type approach. It's why we have a diversity amongst styles of Catholic preaching. The issue I have with Catholics like Matt Fradd (although I watch his content regularly and agree with most of it) is just the underlying need to sew division amongst Catholics. On one hand he criticises Bishop Barron for not calling Ben Shapiro to repent of his sin of adherence to Judaism (which is not a sin per se) and yet he gets defensive when others call him out to do the same to Dave Rubin. It's far more fruitful to focus on the Christian principles that both men already agree to. Ben is an extremely vocal pro-life advocate that we should support and Dave Rubin is a model example of appropriate dialogue between disagreeing parties. Will both go to hell for not being Catholic? We don't know, maybe, but I hope not. Who knows, in time both may become Catholic because of their engagement with Catholics like Bishop Barron.
I agree completely. Really great comment.
I also completely agree. Thanks for your eloquence.
Good comment. We should strive at all times to avoid infighting.
Awesomely said.
Love this comment. I agree with a lot. But just agreeing where we agree and not asking people to repent of non Christian ideals is how we have grown men who claim they feel like women in little girls' changing rooms. How do we ask people to consider their selfishness and sins and still spread God's bigger message of love? Repentance and doctrine is a tough message. The carrot approach is how Jesus got reduced to a happy hippie when He preached often about the reality of hell. I dont have an answer but I agree with you that both Barron and Martin are right and their messages appeal to us at different times on our journey towards heaven.
O my Jesus, forgive us our sins,
save us from the fires of hell;
lead all souls to heaven especially those who are in most need of
Your mercy.
Amen.
I don't want to contribute with any fingerpointing myself, but I'm seeing a lot of that in the comments here. I don't think this is healthy; provided we're charitable, respectful and interested in honest, informed dialogue aiming for the larger purpose that the Church was built for, there is zero problem in voicing theological disagreements with a Bishop, or Cardinal, or even the Pope. The point isn't to knock some people down a peg; it is, ultimately, to lead everyone a bit closer to Heaven.
It seems like we’re only allowed to “disagree” with the church from a right wing stance. What about standing up and demanding more compassion and kindness towards marginalized groups and people who are different from us, more of an emphasis on helping the needy and oppressed in this life? Seems like that always gets written off as a heresy
@@thebacons5943 What about it? That's just the standard Christian ethos - which is not to say that, therefore, prostitution and gender disphoria and a plethora of things promoted and celebrated by groups branded (with more or less reason) as "marginalized" are themselves to be promoted. If you ask _my_ opinion, though, I'd say all this talk of Right and Left is ultimately a pointless secular red herring; Christianity stands on its own feet as a complete cosmovision with inbuilt sociopolitical implications and aspirations - moreso if we recall it is the foundation of our modern Western civilization.
Matt why not have Bishop Barron on your show? Maybe Dr. Larry Chapp. Why lean towards folks that lean towards rad trad. I don't mean Ralph, and not other orthodox Catholics with a different perspective? I think you owe Bishop Barron or someone associated with Word on Fire abplace at the table. Let him explain his position. You and Ralph are great, but I think your short changing Bishop Barron. But of course like any media person you will probably only pick guests whose viewpoint you totally agree with. But Bishop Barron would make a great guest and there is much you would agree on and you could let him set the record straight. Anyway wish you and Ralph well.
Rad trad, lol
you seem to be making a lot of assumptions here. bishop barron has one of the biggest platforms of any american catholic. if his position needs clarifying, it's not matt's fault lol
How are you supposed to fight the left wing media if you can't project that on your own congregants in the Church?
To be traditional is to be Catholic. If people don't like that they can go join a Protestant denomination.
@@espi371 Who knows what that means? I don't.
Well, I did hear the same answer like bishop Barron 's answer on EWTN. Why does this topic continue with him? He did a video responding to Bishop Barron already. When I see video like this, it makes me feel sad. Because we are as catholics, we shouldn't tear others down.
He is giving fraternal correction. Whoever heard what Bish B said didn’t hear truth. Martin is correcting that with footnotes
Because are priests and bishops must speak the truth at all times. And act on the Truth. We can't have unity on falsehoods.
I understand the criticism against BB. I think there's another angle though that people aren't talking about, and I can't help but wonder if he's purposefully playing these cards close to the chest.
BB is a doorway to people who would otherwise remain outside the fold. Fire and brimstone isn't a one size fits all evangelical approach. BB is drawing people in with gentleness, non-aggresiveness, God as Good, and True, and Beautiful. He's warming them up, which they so desparately need, and softening the blow. Many people are hypersensitive to Christianity, especially the Church, and so you HAVE to meet them where they're at, even if that means giving them just "the good stuff" so to speak, for now.
People are already in so much pain, the idea of going to hell afterwards just because you're not part of an, at times, historically incredibly corrupt institution that is, by all appearence, at the hands of men who are just as sinful and fallible as anyone else, is incomprehensible. Another way of putting it, BB is casting a wide net; Jesus can sort it out later. Yes, some may never come to fully accept the Church in ALL Her teachings, some may never accept Jesus Christ, but others will, in time.
People are so broken right now, and it's not because they're bad. We're getting our butts kicked by generational sin. So much conflict and war and treason and betrayal and lies. So many broken families. People didn't fight in WWI and WWII and come back without any problems. My grandpa, who was otherwise a good Catholic man, daily mass-goer, was in some ways a horrible father. Way too strict and disciplinarian with my Uncles, all of whom fell away from the faith, while my grandpa was supposed to be this great Catholic? No.
The world is sick, and God knows it. I think that's one of the main reasons the Church appears so soft these days; it is! Yes, it's corrupted, and wicked people are trying to subvert it and take advantage of God's mercy, twisting and perverting it. But people are at a place right now where they need to be able to call out to God in anger and frustration and hurt, to really lean on Him as a father, who is all patient and kind and merciful, and not be rebuked for drowning in the misery of sin, so much of which was passed on to them by others. The culture is ripe for harvesting, and I get the unfortunate suspicion that many otherwise well-meaning "traditional Catholics" are thwarting the movements of the Holy Spirit in the Church, because they see the corruption and are conflating the two. God help us.
This is a really thoughtful analysis of the situation. Even though your comment is so long, I found every line was meaningful. Bishop B is indeed casting a wide net and it's effective. Sometimes, people who have been in the church for a long time and are hyper-aware of all the do's and don'ts can become so afraid of not doing everything "properly" they cease to see how people outside that faith sees the world, and so are ineffective in bringing them in.
Thank you for this response, you have explained perfectly what I wanted to say but was too annoyed to verbalise.
You don’t go looking for the lost sheep with a gun. You have to bring the sheep back to the fold first. Thank you.
This is so beautiful. Thank you and God bless you. 🙏
"Another way of putting it, BB is casting a wide net; Jesus can sort it out later. Yes, some may never come to fully accept the Church in ALL Her teachings, some may never accept Jesus Christ, but others will, in time." These are great and beautiful words!
No offense, but I'm going to give your comment a big "DUH". You are right 1000%. But my real question is: How do you guys not realize this???? Have you spent time outside of the Church at ANY point in your life? I fell away for 14 years. The idea that brimstone would have brought me back? You guys are larping like it's the middle ages. You're up against Nihilism.
Ralph Martin is one of my very favorite Catholic apologist and have been a fan of his for years! I believe Karl Rahner and Hans Urs von Balthasar were responsible for bringing in this church of nice, spirit of the age, theology into the church in the 60's. Unfortunately, Bishop Barron appears to be a huge fan of theirs. I agree with Martin, the 60's theology hurt the church and was happy to hear him say some bishops are finally recognizing it.
If we attempt to align ourselves of things of this world, we are doomed to fail.
The modern world needs to embrace the church, not the church needs to embrace the modern world.
I do love Bishop Robert Barron and he has done so much in my life and I am sure a lot of lives. By the way, today is his Birthday, thank God for him.
I love Bushop Barron too. He managed to explain the presence of Christ in the Holy Spirit especially.
I do watch his videos every Sunday
He’s done a lot for me too. Happy birthday to him. And God bless him. He’s a powerful evangelist. To me it’s not that his opinion is at all that will be saved. Its that the Lord‘s mercy is so infinite and his love for us is so unlimited to assume that you’re damned because you’re not a part of this small club… well
I love Bishop Barron as well but he is soft peddling the Gospel. It doesnt mean he is the AntiChrist,it just means he is wrong.
@@PerfectNormal exactly
Bishop Barron has never maintained that all people will go to Heaven.
He is quoting from the Catholic
Catechism - that we may have hope that all may be saved.
Read St. Paul - letter to the Corinthians about the Excellence of
Love.
Love is patient, Love is kind. Love is not boastful or envious or arrogant or rude. Love does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice in wrongdoing, but rejoices in the truth. It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.” St. Paul, First Letter to the Corinthians Chapter 13 verses 4-7
“ Love...bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. “
Perhaps you also disagree with St. Paul who says love “ hopes all things “.
EWTN Bible
Luke 13:23
23 And some one said to him, "Lord, will those who are saved be few?" And he said to them,
24 "Strive to enter by the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able.
I am looking for the narrow door.
I financially support Word on Fire AND Pints with Aquinas. I have learned so much and been very blessed by BOTH of these apostolates. Also, Bishop Barron was instrumental in bringing me back to my faith.
Like you I send $$ to PWA & WOF and also RM @ Renewal Ministries. Appreciated this talk and the thoughtful differences among all three platforms. I hate to see listeners spin it into division.
Same!
There is no HEll or Limbo or Purgatory...and a priest cannot forgive sins
@@DavidKing-qd3sp Is there Heaven? Can Jesus forgive sins?
@@montyrock4 .............Yes,
I agree with much of what's said here. However, I also think that Bishop Barren had done as much or more than any single priest, Bishop or lay person in bringing people to God and thinking about our faith in a true and mature way. Despite this stance you're taking about here, he has done a startlingly amazing job at evangelization. So... Anyway, he has said some things that seem too wishy washy, but has done so much good for souls and bringing them to God that his fruit is easily seen as good.
that is soooo true.
Maybe he could consider revising the wishy-washy bits. The problem with his statements around Hell is that they can invite a lazy attitude not only towards spreading the gospel but also in committing to it. As Ralph Martin points out, that wishful thinking attitude rather than a careful listening to what Vat II actually said has not served the Church's mission well. Fr Avery Dulles SJ addressed this issue well.
He said multiple times its with Balthasar, that we should hope that hell is empty, which is a totally different thing.
Sorry, but stating that "Jesus is the privileged way" is FAR MORE THAN wishy washy... What good is being an amazing evangelizer when APOSTOLIC TRUTH is not proclaimed at its most basic level??
@@dija5578 Yes, I take your point. Jesus did NOT say "I am the privileged way, the better truth and the best life".
Another thought - "How many people end up in Hell?" is the WRONG QUESTION. It's none of our business: see John 21:21-22.
ya apparently.. even though Jesus and Mary have warned and showed hell.. you saints.. does God lie does mary lie????
bb should ask himself that question…
Bishop Barron has NEVER maintained that all people will go to Heaven. He has simply reiterated the Catholic Catechism - that we may have the hope that all may be saved.
St.Paul.
Letter to the Corinthians: 13 -7
“ Love...bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.”
Do you also disagree with St. Paul?
Barron “hopes all go to heaven”. But Jesus doesn’t agree. Hell is not empty so how could ANYONE possibly “ dare to hope”? Nonsensical
@@Crusader33ad St. Paul dared to hope.
Pj Smith - would you point out the passage? Never heard that Paul held to the apokatastasis theology. In fact St Paul warns of condemnation in 1 cor 11 for sacreligious communion (that means hell), 95% of our bishops just OK’d it.
I would want everyone to be saved. But as a holy priest once said,” hell is filled with volunteers “.
@@Crusader33ad And this Holy Priest can name some people who are in hell? My guess is no.
That is simply his opinion.
And in what way have our Bishops okayed sacrilegious Communion for 95% of communicants?
Any person going receiving the Eucharist without confessing a Mortal sin is in danger of going to Hell.
But hope never dies. Why would I point out that passage? Because
I think St. Paul’s letter to the Corinthians sums up what love is perfectly. And he says “ Love...hopes all things.”
So I am sticking with him, as he is one of my Patron Saints ( name is Paula )
It is also in the Catholic Catechism.
I find the picture on this site to be unkind - looking to make fun of Bishop Barron. This is not Christ like behaviour. Bishop Barron is not perfect - who among us is? But I have never heard him make fun of a fellow Catholic, or any other person, for that matter.
@@Crusader33ad
St. Paul - 1 Corinthians 13
The Excellence of Love
Pretty blatant statements being made about Bishop Barron in the name of unity in the church. It's unfortunate to hear misrepresentations of Bishop's statements here of all places. You should know better than to suggest the whole of his position is encapsulated in 1 short homily and if he ever is to speak on an issue he needs to say all there is to say. Why not post a supplementary video adding to what he said, without all the criticism. WE CAN DARE TO HOPE because our God is an awesome God!
What is happening with this channel? The thumbnail is literally putting words into his mouth. I find myself subbing and Unsubbing from this channel on a regular basis as it swings from decent long-form interviews to a large does of hubris every now and then and comes across as a tad arrogant.
I know exactly what you mean. Arrogant is the right word. We all have our weaknesses. Sometimes we can be very prideful Because we feel like we know better than everybody else
I'm on the same boat, I'm gonna have to see in the next 3 uploads if I want to stay subscribed.
Btw, what was the original thumbnail and title?
@@ABB14-11 Yes, me too. I agree.
@@ABB14-11 it was the same words but they had put them on a picture of the. Bishop as a speech bubble coming out of his mouth. Disgraceful behaviour. Thanks for your reply. I felt a bit bad saying it but it’s been happening more and more.
Acts 4:12
There is no name under heaven and earth by which we can be saved, except in the name of Jesus.
I don't how videos like this one helps to the unity of the Church. I know there are false prophets and probably Bishop Barron has helped more than any other apologist out there, but lay people publically attacking or getting into confrontation with a successor of the apostles doesn't help much the Church.. In the end, Bishops in communion with the Pope have the power of binding and loosing not lay people with Phds like Taylor Marshal and others.
Matt: as far as I'm concerned Bishop Barron is doing more good right now than just about any English speaking Catholic in the world. If anyone thinks he is fluffy in the slightest on the need for repentance and conversion, they haven't watched or read enough of him. He has been attacked from all sides on points like these (and in a particularly malicious way) by the extreme right for his views on the "dare we hope" piece. They are always such misunderstood characterizations of his positions. He has spoken out extensively against these 'critiques', including the ones you discussed with Dr. Martin in this video. His interlocutors just don't seem to want to care about what he has to say in response.
That said in no way am I saying that Bishop Barron is above reproach. But there is a great deal of difference between legitimate criticism and calumny.
And the thumbnail that you used for this video is silly. I get you're trying to be a bit edgy and get views, but come on.
And Dr. Martin is a great guy and I'm usually aligned with most of his thinking. But parts of his recent book, especially his take on Adrienne von Speyr and Hans Urs von Balthasar, is a big head scratcher.
100% agree with you. The claims made in this video and in Dr. Martin's book are seriously questionable. Bishop Barron's position is far more tenable and needs to at least be acknowledged instead of mischaracterized.
yo, I need to know what the original thumbnail was!
Bishop Barron is awesome and amazing nevertheless. I'm very grateful to him for his sharing of knowledge so generously and lovingly.
You are saying Bishop Barron's strategy "doesn't work anymore", but I don't know a Christian who has helped convert more people to the true Church, and he still does it today... So Idk about this one, I get the point about some comments he has said, but overall I think he's such a great evangelist
Exactly he offers a mystical approach to understanding. He’s not gonna beat you over the head with tired talking points that do come from a place of love but are nonetheless tired. People aren’t looking to be moralized or brow beaten, they want a place of spiritual and intellectual refuge which bishop Barron demonstrates is contained in the Catholic Church. But at the same time bishop Barron understands that truth exist in a hierarchy
If you look at the numbers of practicing Catholics now, the number of baptisms, the number of Catholic weddings, the number of vocations now and compare them to prior to Vatican II, it is blindingly clear the strategy has not worked, just like Dr. Martin said.
@@eamonob84 It is clear that overall whatever the church has done since Vatican 2 has not worked, but Bishop Barron has had success. You cannot deny that. Maybe it's that he understands better what the council actually was asking for and he accomplished it better.
To all in this comment section, what it comes down to is if (and if yes, how much of) there is a distinction between the methods of Vatican II and the methods of Bishop Barron.
Jesus took Sister Faustina Kowalska o a tour of hell and there were people there. He told her that most of the people there, at that time, were those who did not believe in the existence of hell. So, we know that there are already some people there.
I will follow the narrow way that leads to life and not the universalist "everyone will be saved" stuff. If people really think hell will be only populated by demons, think again and study St. Teresa of Avila vision of hell (you will find it interesting to say the least).
Don't @ me i don't have the time and i'm fixed on my beliefs. God Bless.
yup...amen to that.
I don't agree with Mr. Martin's take on Vatican II, it seems he's positing that VII represents a hermeneutic of rupture, that is a breaking with tradition, but the vast majority of the pontiffs at the time (both left and right) as well as Benedict XVI and JPII were of the opinion that it in no way breaks with Church tradition but radically affirms it.
No he fully supports Vat II. He's only talking about how it's implemented.
He’s clarifying what Vatican II actually says.
No he isn’t he’s talking about the misconceptions & abuses done “in the spirit of VII”
What I see when a bunch of Catholics trash Vatican II is that they freak out over the apparent lack of belief in the Eucharist in others but fail to see their lack of belief in the legitimacy of Church Authority. 🤷♀️
Why did Vatican II rescind the Oath against Modernism 🤔?
I understand what your guys are saying, and I agree this post Vatican mindset - all can go to heaven after all - is now embedded in the Church. However, I didn't take Bishop Barron's comments as meaning that at all. I believe he was simply exploring the question, "Well, we know that God is abundantly merciful.... How far does that wonderful mercy go? What if, what if God has provided a way for most people to be saved?" I think he knows very clearly that most will not be saved and that hell is very real, but let's push these things a bit further.
I love Ralph's work, but I sincerely think he's off the mark on this issue. I've listened extensively to Bishop Barron on this issue, and he has NOT stated or even implied that all go to heaven. In fact, quite the opposite. As for Bishop Barron's views on Vatican II, he recently published a bound copy of the four conciliar constitutions along with commentary, as well as published a companion book by Father Blake Britton on Vatican II through Word on Fire Ministries. Both give accurate representations of the inspired genius of the council and an informed opinion on what went wrong after the council. In absolutely no way does Bishop Barron support the "paraconciliar" modes of implementation that came in the years following. Any frequent listener knows how much he despises the watered-down Catholicism that prevailed after the council; he mentions it often.
I've also listened to Bishop Barron's interviews with Ben Shapiro (an Orthodox Jew) and with Dave Rubin (an agnostic homosexual man in a same-sex civil marriage with another man). For his first meeting with both men, Bishop Barron's intent was clearly to find common ground, not the obvious differences between them. In keeping with his own oft-cited strategy of letting others be led to Christ through introducing them to the Church's beauty rather than through aggressive proselytizing, Bishop Barron drew in millions of views and left the door open to further discuss the beliefs of the Church with both hosts in the future. Both Shapiro and Rubin were clearly impressed with the non-aggressive approach and indicated they would have the bishop back. As a Catholic evangelist myself, I'd call that a win. The bishop could have bludgeoned them with the Catechism, but instead opted to play the long game and draw them in. Shapiro is a fairly pro-Catholic advocate of the Church in many respects, and Dave Rubin has recently announced that he firmly believes in God now.
I'm surprised that Matt Fradd and Ralph Martin, two highly intelligent and respectable disciples of Christ seem lost on this. There is no dispute here.
I enjoy and appreciate your shows; I don't always agree with your approach to the faith but those times aren't many! This is one of those times. Bishop Barron has more than proven to be a loyal son of the Church; as a Bishop, he is a successor of the Apostles; neither of you are. In large part, my return to the Church can be credited to first and foremost, God's grace and His choice of Bishop Barron to be a conduit of that grace. I'll stick with Bishop Barron in spite of your reservations.
In this video they completely misrepresented bishop Barron. He said explicit faith and practice of the Christian faith is the normative(privileged) way to heaven and that is the belief of the church. People should mind who they are and how little they know before attacking bishops. This is disrespect of authority and individualism.
@@pk47831 While its unfortunate that Bishop Barron's position was deplorably straw-manned and caricatured, I really doubt that it was intentional considering that they maintained a rather respectful (albeit mildly condescending) tone throughout the video.
@@Wanderer-s2c Explain how it was a strawman? I have read Bishop Barron's own explanation of his belief on his website, and he is not in line with what even VII says let alone, the Fathers, Scripture, the Doctors etc. It isn't disrespectful, or attacking. How is this disrespect of authority? It is libel to say they are disrespecting authority by criticizing a bishop. Bishops can, have, and will be wrong. Just because he is a bishop doesn't make him right.
They're not talking about loyalty, they're talking about theology. And what a mess implementing Vatican II was and still is.
@@pk47831 he said the word privileged and that word has different meanings and can be interpreted in different ways. He needed to mention Jesus, the Gospel and Isaiah 53.
I always enjoy listening to Ralph. God Bless you both. Viva Cristo Rey
Bishop Baron is 100% orthodox and HE was pivotal in my return to faith after years away from it. He has reached a huge amount of lasped Catholics and those outside the faith. I didn't agree with this take on him at all and imho he did explain the conditions without going into the detail that someone that did a PhD in that particular area might like him to. It was a general interview to reach a huge audience. If he had answered in great detail it might have been understood as nobody ever gets saved , so he would be damned by another for something else. This is criticism from the prayer on the bench not the one playing the ball with more talent and a bigger strategy.
Not addressing very serious sins that are DESTROYING your country is dereliction of duty. Plus he also ignores that targeted individuals are being remotely tortured. 🤷
Jonathan, I agree with some of what you said because like you I did hear the words of the Holy Spirit speaking through Baron during my reversion. But the biggest issue is his utilization of Von Balthazar’s theology is which is demonic because it goes against the truths spoken by Christ Himself. Further he needs to correct his words to Ben Schapiro when he essentially told him that he didn’t need to convert to Christianity to merit (favorable) eternal life.
I remember when the Ben Schapiro-Bishop Baron video dropped, a couple of my non-practicing Christian friends saw the video and saw this crescendo of beautiful philosophy and metaphysics only to be let down by Baron’s indifference to Christianity when Schapiro asked him if he needed Jesus to merit eternal life. Instead of leading these souls to Him, my friends made the inevitable cosmic shoulder shrug since the pastor they heard from gave them the ultimate message of indifference to His eschatological master plan.
He is not 100 percent Orthodox.
@@johnpglackin345 yes he is
Matt - agree with Catholic Bard - invite Bishop Barron on your show and have an open, honest dialogue with him instead of constantly saddling up with the Rad Trad echo chamber. Bishop Barron explained this whole issue on his Word on Fire website quite extensively. He is a real light and force in Catholic evangelization without having to do the trick-pony allegiance to anything related to Donald Trump.
What does Trump have to do with any of this? Are you a Christian or a Democrat first?
I am nourished and still I am by Bishop Baron’s talks . Thank you Bishop Baron. 🥰
I love bishop Barron before my returning to the faith of the church I've never heard anyone so well spoken in the matters of catholicism, the life, the meaning, the beauty. Ive watched the growing numbers of controversies on both sides about his approach, but my faith is in Bishop Barron he has called out so many to return to the church, many of this generation, the young that want a deeper embodying of tradition the value true religion holds. God bless him for it, and happy birthday, Amen
for real, he has done SO MUCH, and he has done so with intelligence, passion and love for all those who have fallen away! That's why so many people respond to him.
I suggest your Faith be in JESUS, not a sinner. The question is very simple, is Bishop Baron's statement consistent with what Our Blessed Lord said in the Gospels or not? If it is, KUMBAYA! Otherwise...be careful of the wolves dressed in Shepperd's clothing!!!!
The Fatima secret was meant to be revealed in 1960 , it wasn’t, Russia was meant to be consecrated, it wasn’t.
But in 1965 we have Vatican 11 and the new mass, and this was to bring unity with the Protestant faiths, and as the years have past trying to bring unity to all religions, ideologies, democracy, etc etc.
The Fatima secret holds the key to everything that is happening in the catholic and apostolic church today and the future, and the secrets from our blessed mother have been coming and warning mankind since her earliest apparitions.
God bless.
Janitor @ I’m afraid it you’re wrong and just saying it is proves nothing , Even the chief exorcist in Rome father Gabriel Armoth said Russia was never mentioned in any consecration by any pope.
The Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary by a specific act of a reigning Pope along with all the other Catholic bishops of the world was ordered in a Marian apparition by Our Lady of Fátima in 13 July 1917. Sister Lúcia dos Santos, one of the three visionaries publicly stated that at different times the Virgin Mary had given her a message of promise, that the consecration of Russia (as a country) would usher in a period of world peace.
A religious statue depicting Our Lady of Fatima, with her Immaculate Heart surrounded with thorns, a necklace chain of golden ball (of light) and barefooted as described by Sister Lúcia dos Santos at the Pontevedra and Fátima Marian apparitions.
The Vatican stated that Sister Lúcia declared to them in private correspondence during the 1980s that the consecration offered by Pope John Paul II in Saint Peter's Square on 25 March 1984 had been properly accomplished and was “accepted in Heaven”.
The authenticity of this is vehemently rejected by some traditionalist Catholics, including those at Fatima Centre, namely Father Nicholas Gruner, Christopher Ferrara, the SSPX, among others, who support claims of parallelism to the alleged Marian apparitions of Our Lady of Akita in 1973.
In addition to this Consecration, Pope Pius XII (1942), Pope John Paul II (1984), Pope Benedict XVI (2010) and Pope Francis (2013) have consecrated “the world” to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Pope Pius XII verbally consecrated "the peoples of Russia" in 7 July 1952 via his Papal bull “Sacro Vergente”.
To date, no ceremonial rite of Papal consecration has been specifically addressed to “Russia” per verbatim, nor invoked with the physical presence of the sum total of Catholic bishops present at the Vatican.
God bless 👍🙂
@@drjanitor3747 You're a blind fanatical SSPX I can tell or a similar facsimile. To call a holy man such as SAINT John Paul II an 'anti Pope' when even the most staunch supporters of Bishop Lefevbre would agree he was elected Pope fair and square and in perfect agreement with ALL Canon Laws of the Holy Catholic Church is pure ignorance to the fifth power borne out of pure hatred and stupidity. Heck, even the heretic Pope Francis was elected fair and square!!!! Go back to Faith School buddy!
Look at bishops Barron interviews with Ben Shapiro and David Rubin. They ask if they need to change their lives-. Barron’s answer: Christianity is the privileged way and atheists go to heaven too. That’s not traditional Catholic teaching. He did not say Christ is the way, truth and the life. He implied no need to convert. Cringeworthy
So true.. What part of John 14:6 does BP Barron not comprehend? It doesn't take a bunch of letters after my name to understand that chapter and verse very clearly.
He’s horrible
ST. POPE JOHN PAUL II: “Can God, who loves man so much, permit the man who rejects him to be condemned to eternal torment? The silence of the church is, therefore, the only appropriate position for Christian faith. Even when Jesus says of Judas, the traitor, “It would be better for that man if he had never been born” (Mt. 26:24) his words do not allude for certain to eternal damnation.”
ST. POPE JOHN PAUL II: “Eternal damnation remains a possibility, but we are not granted, without special divine revelation, the knowledge of whether or which human beings are effectively involved in it.
The thought of hell and even less the improper use of biblical images must not create anxiety or despair... The concept of hellfire, the fiery furnace and the unquenchable fire of Gehenna need to be interpreted as symbolic language... The risen Jesus has conquered Satan, giving us the Spirit of God who makes us cry, ‘Abba, Father!’ (Rm 8:15; Gal 5:6).”
Funny how they use Bishop Barron to get views and then attack him
He needs to be called to repentance
Exactly, classic straw man
These gentlemen, may God bless them, are mistaken in their understanding of Bishop Baron's position on the point of who will be saved.
Bishop Baron has fully, uncompromisingly, and clearly, endorsed the Catechism of the Catholic Church stating "In hope, the Church prays for the salvation of all."
This is not to be confused with the "expectation" that all people will be saved, which is not Bishop Baron's position.
I would think this is the position of all practising Catholics.
I dislike this video because you're been unfair to Bishop Barron’s point of view. I've heard him talk about this topic, and I don't think he's advocating for universalism. You should invite him to your show to talk about this issue.
If he was, he’d be espousing Freemasonry.
"Embrace the fullness of Judaism"???wth...Judaism says The Christ has not come yet...it's full alright; just not full of divinity.
Thank you for not misrepresenting Bishop Baron's comments like I've seen Michael Voris and Mother Miriam have. He hasn't said that "everyone will go to Heaven" only that we can hope everyone will accept the grace God gives them, if even only at the moment of their death.
I am pretty conservative, and to me universal reconciliation makes the most sense.
I find it deeply insulting to God to assume that we can somehow control the outcome by having all the right beliefs, the right faith, the right convictions, doing the right things, etc. This would essentially make us more powerful than God. It makes God our slave: ie, God HAS TO save me, because I did XYZ.
If salvation exists at all, it is happens because of God's choice and God's power - NOT because we checked all the right boxes and earned our ticket.
If hell exists, it is corrective and temporary. ie, even if you had to stay there a million years before you were made right, so be it.
You should seek theosis (union with God) because it is good for you. You live right because doing so makes you a better person. If you can't figure that out, that is your problem.
I would also like to point out that sometimes the conversion happens, through the grace of God, and seeing the brokenness around you; being a witness to the evils that walk this earth can create a conversion in someone's heart. This is what happened to me. It was a wake up call to how I lived my life and how I NEEDED to follow my Catholic faith not only for the saving of my soul but because I believed that there is more to life than the emptiness of this world. And this is what lead me back to the truth of the Church.
This is exactly what happened to me. God's grace definitely reached me at my lowest but I ignored it until recently. Finally, seeing how disgusting the world is becoming and being horrified made me realize if we all just do whatever we want and live however we want, the whole thing turns to crap awfully fast. I craved morality and goodness and truth, which of course comes from God and I reverted back to my Catholic faith.
New subscriber! I learned so much from this short clip. Can’t wait to see more videos. Thank you for the content. Praying for renewed faith and conversion of the whole world this Lenten season. I struggle with evangelizing as I don’t want to impose on others but goodness it’s so important.
Time and time again Bishop Barron would be unable to square up to Pope Felix III:
"Not to oppose error
is to approve it;
and not to defend truth
is to suppress it,
and indeed to neglect to confound evil men,
when we can do it, is no less a sin than to encourage them"
A Roman Catholic quoting the Bible!! Watch out...next he will say "No one comes to the Father but through me (Jesus Christ)!!!
I see many people that want to believe in Universal Salvation use the Fatima prayer( " O my Jesus forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of Hell and lead ALL souls into Heaven, especially those in need of Thy mercy") as proof that all souls will be saved. However, in that same series of apparitions, the Mother of God showed the shepherd children a vision of Hell in which the children saw HUMAN souls in Hell.
Then she said to them , "You see Hell where the souls of poor sinners GO! In order to save sinners God wishes to establish devotion to my Immaculate Heart..." She also told the children to pray and do Penace for sinners. ( That's all of us on the Earth or in Purgatory).
You may say , "well that vision the children saw was private revelation and i don't have to believe it ". I would agree. However, if you are going to recognize the Fatima prayer, then it follows logically that you should recognize the vision of Hell and the warning that souls do GO there.
She also told Sister Lucia ( one of the shepherds) that more souls go to Hell for sins of the flesh than any other sins.
So if your desire for Universal salvation is caused by anxiety about someone in your life, I suggest you pray and fast for him or her. Not seek comfort in a FALSE teaching.
God bless.
No Bishop Barron....it's quite the opposite! We're all going to hell! I've figured it out already. We've all been left behind! 😑😒
Thank you, thank you, thank you! If we love our neighbors we want them with us in eternity. Love them enough to tell them the truth 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
In one breath he mentions Satan led to the repudiation of authority... and mentioned questioning authority in a bad light, then turns around and does the same thing to bishops and a pope. I have a problem with this train of thought. I sometimes disagree with bishops and even pope Francis in what they say or support but I feel obligated to do what they say because they are in authority. That is where God put them as our Shepard's I should go where the lead. I miss Benedict xvi, he made sense to me bu God chose Francis for a reason and I will follow. Truth be told I see more duplicity in this speakers statements. I will follow my bishop and do what he says, that I think is the safest path for a Catholic. God will see that I followed the authority he established and not my own. I will serve and bend my knee.
Despite the supportive comments for Bishop Baron below, I think that the Bishop must know what he is doing, he must know that he avoids saying certain things and probably in order to keep in with the Francis pontificate. He is not stupid. For goodness sake, he is a Bishop, after all. Knowing this, his not telling the whole truth is tantamount to telling a lie and it is very serious indeed, especially for one in his position. It certainly appears that he is putting politics before Church teaching.
Bishop Barron doesn't say everyone is going to heaven ! Please listen to him rather than judging. He says he doesn't know. God will decide who is saved. To suggest anything else is very very presumptuous. I think people may have a few shocks in store when we get there.
Clickbait titles and thumbnails are usually cool but I feel like this one's not in good taste. Your video does good explaining the occasional ambiguity of his language, but not everyone on RUclips is going to watch a video fully; many times they just watch the first few seconds or just look at the title and description.
It's also his birthday today so maybe it's not the best time to be criticizing him; it'd have been better to publish this a different day.
I love your content brother, and I'll keep supporting you with my views, but I'd love to see you exercise better judgement in the future when it comes to publishing content like this.
@@OrthoLou okay, but you’re still risking some else’s reputation. It’s different if you’re creating a misleading title about yourself but when it’s about others it’s rude and uncharitable.
@@OrthoLou still the title is too dirty and unstylish
@@OrthoLou maybe but that's a fairly prevalent epidemic among online content consumers. TikTok saw that people's attention spans were getting shorter and capitalized on that; that's why RUclips started implementing shorts.
So maybe it's on the consumers, but then the content creators are also not helping the situation if they don't change how they handle their videos.
I completely agree. My team put that together. As soon as I saw it I changed it.
@@PintsWithAquinas thank you! Don't give your team too hard of a time, they probably didn't mean to make him come across like that.
You're a good man Matt 🙂
Seems like a cheap shot to me, especially with the original thumbnail. I believe Matt and Ralph to be straying into territory that could be regarded as misrepresentation of Bishop Barron.
So let me get this straight: You're slamming Bishop Barron (who, by the way, has prompted my interest in Catholicism), and next you're criticizing the Pope/papacy (the direct successor of St Peter, whose authority Catholics are supposed to accept.) So are you Protestants, Lutherans, or...what? I'm asking in all sincerity.
I too would like to know the answer. Criticism of the Pope isn’t all bad but sometimes it comes from a place of pride, which is the last time I checked, a sin.
A little disappointed to see this from Matt. The headline doesn’t do justice to Ralph Martin’s discussion and makes him sound like a Church Militant hack.
Does the Catholic world really need another version of T. Marshall? Loosing me really fast with the last few videos.
Watching T. Marshall just further proved to me that being Catholic and knowing a lot about religion doesn't mean you know or love God.
Yes, I agree. Well said.
@@ABB14-11 : I support your contention.
@@ABB14-11
In what way does T. Marshall not know or love God? And YOU know and love God in a more perfect way than he?
@@OrthoLou the bit you said about not knowing what's in a man's heart is true. I don't know what's in his heart and I'm sorry my comment suggested that he didn't know God and I did. I really don't know if I'm close to God at all. Truth is important and if that's what he does then that's good. It's just that I notice that some religious people, like T. Marshall, have so much knowledge but they're not kind, compassionate, or humble. It's like we missed the point of being Christ-like. We focus so much on do's & don't and telling people off, we lose the heart of Jesus in us. I know simpler "less educated" people who taught me more about God and, I believe, they have the Spirit strongly in them. Again, sorry if my comment was hurtful in any way. If you're a fan of Marshall and his love of truth, by golly, good for you! Keep loving what you love, after all, I'm just some kid on the internet.
Not a fan of Catholic charismatics, (aka Protestant wannabes) who am I likely to support?
Thank the Lord our God for Bishop Barron.
His net worth 1-5 million. Not bad. He’s the Joel osteen of the Catholic Church. His Bible study is a joke.
@@rickdockery9620 bruh, why'd you even go through the trouble of finding someone's net worth? Plus, nothing good is gonna come out of judging someone based on how much they earn.
@@ABB14-11 yes cuz the apostles were after those $$$. Successor lol
@@rickdockery9620 nothing wrong with making money though, maybe he uses it for his ministry? you never know ya' know?
@@rickdockery9620 firstly secular priest don't take a vow of poverty.. Secondly Joel Osteen net worth is oil the 100's of millions .. Talk about blowing things way way out of proportion ... lol
I'm pretty sure I have to side with Barron's view, which, in his own words, you can hear here: ruclips.net/video/dmsa0sg4Od4/видео.html
God's mercy and forgiveness are perfect and infinite, but he isn't going to nail your foot to the floor to keep you in his presence.
He technically did that when we were nailed with Him to the Cross😆
“If I ascend to heaven, you are there! If I make my bed in Sheol, you are there!” - Ps. 139:8
His mercy is that no matter what you choose, He’s never gonna let you go, anymore than a loving father would let their child jump off a bridge without, first, doing everything in their power to make sure that never would happen. A human life is far more precious than its will to self-destruct. At the end of the day, if our “no” (which is subjected to change) has the final say over God’s eternal “yes”, then we are more sovereign than God. Unless your beliefs are Calvinistic, and you believe that God wills some to paradise while willing others to damnation, then that would be a different position of faith altogether.
“God does nothing as a judge that he wouldn’t do as a father. And I will accept nothing in the description of God that I would find abhorrent in a man.” - George MacDonald
Thanks for the inspiration, sometimes it's hard to believe that with all the evil people commit in the world especially abortion.
Will all be saved? Who cares? Who knows the answer - no one. This discussion is not worth the time.
I like Ralph Martin. He is a soft speaker BUT he is super intelligent and tells it like it is. I would love to see Fr. Isaac Mary Relyea give his input on the Bishop of the Internet.
Sure sounds to me that a lot of people are adamantly hopeful that hell will be full. Sad.
If my church history remembers that Orgin, and one of the 13 century saints taught that . I left the church, I was a Southern Baptist for a bunch of years . I was drawn to them because of the doctrine of Once saved always saved. However, upon reflection on it . I could see the danger in that. Especially when there is no one to hold you accountable for your sins. Returned to Holy Mother the Church. I am sorry that I ever left. Let me say though I did learn a lot.
Origen is a condemned heretic
Bishop Barron is truly trying to convert souls. You can't convert anyone by just telling them to "convert." It requires example, patience, virtue. THAT is what I think Barron is doing. Can anyone imagine how many people he is bringing to the Catholic Church? Probably many souls. Just maybe even one day Ben Shapiro.
Go to any funeral, it's all the same: Everyone goes to Heaven b/c that's what 99% of the people actually believe.
Everyone does go to heaven, but a lot of people are going to go to heaven through hell first. Remember, Christ and St. Paul said that we shall reap what we have sown here on earth. Jesus said that the wicked will be held until "the last farthing is paid."
@@IrishEddie317 Our Lady at Fatima showed us the reality that many souls are actually in Hell. She was preparing us for the Modernist heretics in the Church who believe in the "Hell is empty" lie.
Come in really, a beat-up on Bishop Baron. He is genuinely engaging with the culture through intelligent apologetics and presentation of the Gospel. With all due respect Matt your show is like a club perpetuating a more radical right wing perspective. That’s fine but really leave the man alone…………We can all read the gospel, Jesus words and LG and make our own minds up. It’s not clear who gets saved. The bishop had a view leave it at that.
You say Jesus isn't clear about what we need to do to inherit salvation?
You know who is and is not going to heaven-you understand Gods unfathomable mercy and his perfect justice? Good luck with that. Our Lord said to St Faustina that we will spend eternity figuring out Gods Mercy. Bishop Baron is engaging with a largely uncatechised audience and an unchurched culture…….99% of what I have heard from him is very sound. Before you remind me I understand that St Faustia received private revelation. Keep up the good work Matt but please unity, not at the expense of truth but Baron is not the enemy. The saying ‘Fiddling on the roof while Rome burns’ springs to mind.
🙏
Hi. Listening to this again with two men I respect highly, Ralph Martin and Matt Fradd, both of whom have impacted my life in different ways for the good. However, I feel that until conversations have been had with Bishop Barron about this topic, I don't think he should be judged and condemned because of one video. It seems that all the incredible work that he has done - engaging with and evangelising the churched and the non-churched alike - is in danger of being eradicated in a cloud of suspicion and innuendo. I think it is particularly unhelpful doing so in a public forum, especially in social media. I commend Bishop Barron on not responding - to my knowledge - to the criticism meted out, some of which has been foul. I think it would serve the Church much better if pundits sought this as an opportunity to bring further healing and unity to the Church and not an opportunity to pick at one dubious talk. Today our gospel reading is Jesus sending out the disciples (the Church) on mission. Maybe we should be concentrating on this and not debating the possible sins of our brothers.
7:47 Excuse me, have the two of you ever read Matthew 25 31-46 ? P.eople that have never heard of Jesus, will get eternal life. Because they unknowingly did good to him.
I know it's not much, but I run a video game memes and mixing RUclips channel and I try to insert tiny shards of Catholicism into what I make, to sort of try and unify my genuine beliefs with what I love doing. Maybe this sort of integration of Faith isn't as profound as pulling a Mother-Teresa, but it's at least something. I think that's what Vatican II actually envisioned us to be doing, and that's my two cents to add to this conversation.
God will save all and be their God after correction in lake of fire. Even Hitler will be saved and the worst of humans once they are punished.
I get what you're saying: that since Bishop Barron isn't so clear what he's saying is verging on heresy and other people might fall into a kind of complacency when it comes to evangelization and the saving of souls.
What I notice and have experienced in his ministry though is he is still very faithful to the catholic faith and extremely passionate about evangelizing the culture without compromises (just look at the work he and his team have produced). He's brought so many people to God and the catholic faith in a non-threatening exclusivist finger-pointing way that most catholic evangelists do cause he focuses on how beautiful God is rather than how impossible salvation is. Therefore we focus on God's strength rather than ours. The thing is, I think his goal is to draw people in first so that we can allow grace to work. Once we are open, we become ready to accept the difficult teachings and become willing to start evangelizing ourselves. That's my experience at least, and the many testimonies of people he's reached is witness to that.
That's a very good point, I think it's just disconcerting to practicing Catholics who (should) know it's not that simple for salvation. Focusing on the loving majestic God who loves us as a Father is so important as well.
Thank you for this comment, I was hoping to see an objection to this critic of Bishop Baron. The finger-wagging approach to evangelism will not get young people to see the beauty and love of God which is the reason for our salvation. Christ came to call sinners to repentance and not condemn them.
@@fhdhjydv1547 God will judge based on knowledge too, if they don't know for no fault of their own God will not be unfair.
That's why priests will have a lot more work to do.
as padra pio said when someone told him he didn't believe in hell the Holy monk said " you will when you get there ,"
They kept us away from church and the Eucharist long enough that many feel now that church is unnecessary.
Yeah that was a terrible move. Still can't believe that happened.
CIGARS....the host of this show smokes cigars - aren't our bodies the temple of the holy spirit and we should not defile it
I know.
I really like a lot of what was said here. It has given me a lot to think about.
However, to think that preaching to non-Catholics is as simple as saying 'repent and believe in Jesus, so you can go to heaven' is also 'naive'. If this was the best way to preach than JWs with megahorns at train stations would be raking in the converts everyday.
I believe that it is from depth of understanding of the teachings of Jesus, as well as the joy and peace of the Gospel life, that we can genuinely evangelize others in a way that touches their hearts.
Quality over quantity. I’d rather have a smaller amount of good Christians than a larger amount of milk toast Christians
Bishop Barron talks to and challenges those who do not believe. He goes out into the world as a true evangelist should. My experience with Matt Fradd is inviting only like minded people to his show while wagging fingers outwardly to others. I find him helpful to listen to occasionally as I find his guests enlightening but always using at least an ounce of discernment. In addition Bishop Barron has been immensely helpful in explaining the Gospel. It is possible to bring the joy and love of Christ to all without watering down the faith or beating them over the head with it.
Let’s say you’re right about Matt Fradd. How does it follow that he is wrong in critiquing him on this point? Careful not to commit the ad hominem!
Thank you for this. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who thinks this way. I like them both, but I think Matt's wrong on this point on evangelization
I strongly agree. Bishop Barron has done so much good, and is so intellectually amazing, that it feels deeply wrong and not pragmatic to criticize him at all. Matt Fradd can sometimes be a bit cheeky.
Wonderful reply and I agree completely. Bishop Barron is interested in expanding his church. Unfortunately, there's a lot of elitist snobbery in certain circles. The condescending way that Fradd laughs off the idea that "everyone is going to heaven" is proof of that. As if these two are in on some joke that the rest of us idiots can't comprehend.
Bishop Barron is concerned with appearing "nice" not with conversion. Look no further than the interview that is cited in this clip with Ben Shapiro. Barron makes zero attempt to invite him to the faith and actually implies Ben is just fine the way he is.
Approach this from another angle; Barron believes all are likely saved. If thats the case, why do any hard work reaching out and evangelizing? His own position on this issue robs him and others of the motivation to actually go into the world and convert people.
Finally, you are dead wrong about Matt inviting likeminded people. He has literally hosted over a dozen debates with people who he disagrees with. His last debate was literally a month ago (oct 20). Your either ignorant of his work (which begs the question why claim to know what he does) or a liar.
In contrast, Bishop Barrons hides from debate with Catholics who disagree with him (just see here him dodging Mr. Martin who is a scholar on this exact topic). Can you name one time Bishop Barron didnt hide from Catholics disagreeing with him? When he was on Catholic Answers, he has them screen his calls to avoid anybody who will disagree with him. He is cowardly. In contrast to Matt who actually puts himself out there and has genuine debate with people. Matt's discussion with Tim Gordon, for example, was one of constant debate and disagreement.
I totally agree with Bishop Barron though. The Blessed Virgin Mary herself sent an angel to teach the three young children in Fatima a prayer she wants added to the end of every decade of Her rosary. It's a prayer of extreme Faith in God's infinite Mercy, Hope, and Love.
The Fatima Prayer/Decade Prayer:
“O my Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell,
lead ALL SOULS to Heaven,
especially those most in need of Thy mercy. Amen.”
A small part of me will always believe in universalism, through one man (Adam) all fell, through one man (Christ) all were saved. Also nothing unclean shall enter heaven so purgatory is where most people will be purified
Can't save Lucifer or force salvation on people who have freewill. For not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven. Mt 7:21-23
If that were the only passage in the New Testament I might agree with you.
@@AJMacDonaldJr Even well known verses that are talking about hell (gehenna) are debatable, for example ‘everlasting punishment’ is correctly translated from Greek as eonian (age of) chastisement - which pertains to the view of correction.
Theres also verse like 1 Tim 4:10 which flat out say “we have put our hope in the living God who is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe”
@@Mickyboi1 The Sheep and the Goats. "And these [goats] shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matthew 25:31-46).
@@AJMacDonaldJr yeah, people don't realize how long 'everlasting' is!
IF it were up to God..it's true. He wants every one of us in Heaven with Him.
BUT...it is NOT up to God! It is up to YOU!
Correct, Kitty. God does not send people to hell. People choose hell, rather than repentance and forgiveness. I once heard a holy priest say, "There is no one in hell who did not really want to go there."
A Muslim would tell you that you need to repent and reject your pagan idea of 3 gods. Now, obviously, you believe the Muslim is incorrect and aren't going to repent of what you believe to be the truth? But what if the Muslim is right? Wouldn't you hope that God would be merciful and judge you for what you sincerely believed? Or would you just gladly say, "Oh, I guess I was wrong" and trot happily to Hell? That's all Bishop Baron was telling Ben Shapiro. Ben is Jewish because he believes that's the truth. Why would you expect him to repent of what he believes is true?
@@nuca5104 the point is that it isn't our place to judge, and that's the Church's teaching. Neither you nor I know what's in the heart of another. God knows, and that's why God has reserved the responsibility of judgement for Himself. Only He can judge justly. But you completely ignored the thrust of my comment: what if Catholicism is wrong? What if Christianity is wrong? Wouldn't you hope that God takes mercy on you for believing something wrong? Jesus said that we will be judged by the same measure we use to judge others. So why would you judge someone more harshly than you would hope to be judged yourself? To Ben Shapiro, Judaism is the truth and Christianity is heretical. Let God judge Ben by what's in his heart. Why is it so hard to not try and do something that God has reserved for Him alone?
@@nuca5104 I'm not saying that some people aren't culpable at all. And I'm not saying that all people will go to Heaven, and neither did Bishop Barron. What I am saying, and what the Church teaches, is that it really isn't our place to decide culpability. As I said, neither nor I nor the good Bishop Barron knows what's in the hearts of other men. You said that if it turned out that Christianity were incorrect that you would hope that God would have mercy on you. So why is it wrong to hope that God will have mercy on others who believe differently than we do? St. Paul also wrote that God told Moses that He would have mercy on whom He has mercy. Why is it so hard to just say "I don't know if you're going to Heaven or not. That isn't my place. But I have hope that God will have mercy on people of all belief systems," which is essentially what Bishop Barron said to Ben Shapiro, and it's also what the Church teaches. It isn't our business to tell anyone if they're damned or saved. All we can do is tell them what we know and pray for them.
And when you say someone is "willingly rebelling," you're pretending that you know what's in that person's heart. You don't. Just remember that God will judge you with the same measure by which you judge others. Personally, I'll pray that He judges you less harshly than you're judging Mr. Shapiro
@@nuca5104 it's funny that you think you can accuse me of speaking specifically when I've used generalizations, but then cry foul when I return the same to you. You accused me of saying that everyone is going to Heaven because they follow their truth. I never said any such thing, nor did I insinuate it. All I said, and what you seem to have a real problem with, is that it isn't any of my business who is going to Heaven and who isn't. Because that's God's decision. This will be the last comment I make to you, because I'm about to get real unkind, and I'm making a sincere effort not to do that. I'm also going to block you, because if you respond to me again with your "holier than thou" fundamentalist protestant attitude, and I have to read your drivel, I'm not going to be able to contain myself. So I'm going to remove myself from a situation that will lead me to sin. Peace be with you
This is the best comment I have read !!!!!!!!
Paul was perfectly clear. In Adam, all die. In Christ, all live. He doesn't refer to hell in any of his letters. On the contrary, Christ's redemption was presented as cosmic and all-embracing. "God has bound all men to disobedience in order to have mercy on them all... For from him, and through him, and to him are all things."
The true Goliath (sin and death) has been defeated by the true David, as evidenced by the resurrection. Christ broke into the strong man's house and plundered it, freeing the captives. Those living in the land of darkness saw a great light. Joy to the world indeed. The gospel is the best news imaginable.
By contrast, the everlasting torment of most human souls is the worst news imaginable. Not much joy to the world in this proclamation. It's an anti-gospel.
True repentance is living your life in the light of Christ's victory, a victory which reveals the boundless power, wisdom, grace and goodness of God.
False repentance is living your life in the terror of a monstrous, incompetent God and his threat of everlasting damnation.
I like that description. It would truly be an "incompetent God" (and a monster as well) who would create sentient beings knowing that they would fall in Eden and then billions would be damned forever and this God had no plan nor ability to bring them out of it.
The early Christians were universalists after all why would Augustine have to speak of these people if it was not a popular opinion at the time.
Just because something sounds to good to be true doesn't make it untrue. If one of your own children committed an atrocious crime, would it be right for you to eternally burn them in fire as punishment? No a finite act of sin in a finite being could never be worthy of infinite punishment. How much more is this true of those who never commit terrible acts but instead lead normal lives and yet according to your teachings burn eternally.
If God in his infinite foreknowledge created a world in which his children whom he loves and died for would be put into a situation in which they are separated from him and surrounded by evil and temptation (essentially set up to fail) and then judged them off their actions with eternal consequences, how could we consider this God just?
Most people do bad things because they believe them to be good. People hate religion because they believe religion is evil not because they themselves are evil. They might even commit atrocious acts of terrorism but they still believed they were doing good. And in those whom are serial killers it tends to be the case that they were born with some type of malfunction or trauma that deprived them of theirs moral sensibilities. Even in the worst cases it can be borderline proven that externalities were the cause of their moral deficiencies not their conscious desire to sin.
Does this deprive them of any responsibility? Of course not, but it does mean that the punishment doesn't fit the crime.
If God is merciful enough to die for us, and yet if we were to make the mistake of dying before getting babtized because of ignorance and God cuts ties with us at our death then God of the bible doesn't sound like the God of the afterlife.
Amen ❤️
Except if you were to continually deny God then that would be an infinite act since the soul is eternal.
@@emmanuelrossi3087 it would be absolutely incomprehensible for someone to eternally deny God. Especially if our inclination towards sin is destroyed.
It would be on par with a mentally ill person continuing to harm themselves. A person in their right mind could not logically deny the truth. So how could God allow you to go on existing as a mentally ill person in the afterlife? I can only imagine that in the end God heals our will, he gives us complete coherent understanding. You could theoretically deny God at that point but it would be almost impossible.
Besides God is infinitely wise and just. I could see someone temporarily being stubborn, but even the most stubborn person to ever exist could not hold up for eternity. God would know exactly how to heal this person and know exactly what happened in their life to make them like this.
Universalists will have a very rude awakening in Hell.
“People make a big leap from possibility, to probability to virtual certainty”
I was raised in a very V2 super progressive form of cafeteria Catholocism. This was not good for my life path to say the least.
People need to hear the TRUTH even if it hurts! It's supposed to hurt, how else can you heal.
What do think the reaction of a mother would be if she got to Heaven and learned her child was in Hell?
It's all nonsense
I love Jesus, Dr Ralph helped us in Syria
i was studying Islam when Jesus spoke to me and told me I was Christian...i was trying to save my marriage to a muslim man...i was away from the Church when i married him..but was a baptised Catholic...i was willing to convert...but i needed to find truth...i did ..he came to me...seek AND YOU WILL FIND,,
If you read the journal of saint Faustina number 1697 you will know how God saves people.
I find it rather weird that Matt thinks that Bishop Barron is ""giving the impression" that all are saved..
What does that actually mean. ????
I never got the impression that Bishop Barron was saying any such thing....
I was born a Catholic and had no clue how I needed to pursue a relationship with God every day by repentance and faith, no clue. Only by joining with holy people and being taught by them am I learning. If I were born as a non believer I know I would have founded some evil cult and the world would have celebrated it because I'd wear flowers in my hair all the time. Thank you Ralph Martin for speaking the full truth.
I think that's a very common story, and mine too. I think post-Vatican II catechesis in the Church has been awful. We grow up knowing nothing about our own faith.
if you had no clue then u failed to listen. You are now being led astray by heretics
@@SoCal9705 thats so truth, they have watered down so much
Right. Many say that those ignorant of the faith are not to blame. True, but those who keep them in ignorance are then to blame. Imagine how many souls have been deprived of the Truth because too many in the church don't want to tell them the hard truths.
I enjoy and respect Bishop Barron but he honestly doesn't challenge me very much. He says a lot but rarely with full clarity and boundaries. I'd much rather hear a teaching in simple language that makes a muddy world more clear. I lean more traditional but I have to say I have yet to be let down by Fr Mike (Schmitz), he is a regular guy, regular language, and yet-he has never, ever missed an opportunity to challenge his viewers/listeners in his teachings. I appreciate that so much!! He played a huge role in bringing me back to the Church and in my husband's conversion from a fully devoted Protestant to an even more fully devoted Catholic (he entered into the Church on Pentecost Sunday).
Welcome home to your husband! That is fantastic news.
Thanks be to God.
Regarding Bishop Barron, it appears to me that he's gotten soft since his appointment as Auxiliary Bishop.😕