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Ray's PINBALL Tech Tips #5 - FLIPPERS! Seek & Find NEW VERSION!
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- Опубликовано: 25 июл 2013
- Ray explains design and repair of pinball machine flipper assemblies.
NEW IMPROVED EDIT LINK: • Ray's PINBALL Tech Tip...
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It's this simple... Ray is The Man!
Absolutely fantastic video. Just started watching your videos over the holiday break, hours upon hours. Ray does some really intricate work and does it with such grace. Hard to find someone with the passion to do it correctly. Props to Ray and to everyone at GRC for taking the time to keep the game alive and to teach us in the meantime. Thank you!
Ray you make it look easy... you are not just good at showing the right way to solve and issue but also do a great job explaining why you are doing what you are doing. The most important lesson I have learnt from watching hours of your videos is to be methodical. Thanks again.
It's very obvious how passionate you guys are about pinball and making a good solid product. Thanks for not taking the easy way out and doing your best to keep these games running for years to come!
Ha! I love it! TNT Amusement sticker = sticker of death! I bought a couple of pins at the old Yardville auction that came from TNT. I had to replace boards because they crapped out as soon as I got home. The old boards that were "expertly repaired from TNT" were so badly hacked they were no longer repairable. Good call.
Just enjoyed a rewatch of this one -- 5 years later! Ray is a pro. Thanks guys.
Thanks a lot, Guys! Thank you for taking the time to make these vids. I've been envolved in the hobby a few years now. Your vids have helped teach me to repair my pins correctly. It's awesome to see the pride you take in your work.
The T2 manual calls for FL-11630 flipper coils, and that's what I used when I rebuilt mine. The 30s seemed more than strong enough to make the ramps consistently. The 29s would be more powerful, of course. I also changed the return springs to the later WPC style, rather than the tapered coil springs.
Props for organization of the truck. Amazing set up you guys have there!
Very informative! Nice clean work, Ray. I love looking at well organized parts drawers!
Thanks for the coil ohm test value comment -- just installed a brand new coil, kept blowing fuses, thought I was going out of my mind. Nope, it was a shorted (NEW) coil. Different new coil installed, all good! The newer fliptronic mechs are a lot snappier, too.
Wow u have it all in part s to fix machine s rad as amount of parts. I built a 3d printer kit the inside of a pin ball machine so much moveing macanical parts n Wier's plus ..im glad I building a lego moc build i geting Lego motors but im shaw I figer out how to make tecnic moveing part an truck spring from saspention .to shoot pin ball
Thank you so much for sharing this
I wish I could borrow Ray for a day to rebuild all my flippers. He makes it look so easy
He's probably rebuilt two or three... thousand sets! ;)
Ray is the man. I wish I had all of that info in your head bro.
Great vid thanks for sharing.
Great video. A lot of commercials though. Thanks for the tips. I wondered why some sleeves were hard to get out of certain solenoids. Makes sense now. I also appreciate the soldering tips. Pretty easy now, I always overheated stuff trying to heat both pieces at the same time.
Agree 100% Russ that new cabinet flipper switches are an absolute requirement. Thanks for your input here, especially in pointing out important facts we failed to mention &/or sharing your tips also! "T2 manual calls for..." ignited discussion over here. Ray is a stickler for "Always check the book" & this should have been mentioned. In this case, with T2 being a "long shot" machine, well the factory got it wrong. 629's preferred in our opinion. We should have explained... Room for improvement!
Nice video and fun to watch. Take care now.
Thanks.
Another thing that I think is important to do when rebuilding flippers of this type is to replace the cabinet flipper button switches as well. T2 is WPC but pre-Fliptronics; essentially using the same flipper wiring and theory of operation as System11. That means full flipper voltage is transmitted not only through the EOS switches but also through the cabinet flipper button switches, which are tungsten-contact leaf switches that also need spark-supression axial capacitors.
Interesting. The inlanes don't look to me like they're adjustable, but it does seem like the left inlane is not quite inline with playfield paint. The paint probably should not be used to align anything, but maybe I'll see if I can loosen the screws and effect it in some way. Gently. Thanks so much!
Great video series. You already helped answer several issues I have had.
+Joe Ruggiero Season 3 on our new channel! Stick with us! :)
+GRC Pinball I have been told that if you have low voltage coming into the transformer and have weak flipper performance, you can use the "high tap" lug vs. the Normal lug. Is that true - if so, is it a matter of just moving that one wire from Normal to High? or do you need to do other things for a correct repair? This of course would be after a flipper rebuild if they still seemed weak.
+Joe Ruggiero Maybe we ask Ray in the next tech episode? Great question! ;)
+GRC Pinball Awesome! Yes please
+Joe Ruggiero I just realized I made a mistake with that last question, what I had heard was that using the high tap lug would boost bumper performance. (maybe flipper's too?) Thanks
Keeping the coil lugs on the opposite end of the stops seems to reduce impact vibration from compromising the solder joints. It does make the EOS capacitor wires longer (if the flippers require them) and usually requires loosening the power supply and return wires in the harness for some slack.
Isn't the new coil on backwards? Now the strain of stopping the rod transfer more easily to the coil connectors and eventually might break the soldering.
Opinions vary on that theory sir. It's covered in some future episode somewhere? General conclusion is that it's not critical.
Your friend there is the man! I wish you guys where in my neighborhood.
Maybe one of us should move? ;)
For screws that are stuck because of locktite - I have one of those giant old solder irons for doing tin. I think it's 200 watts or so - it has a cloth cord on it like a toaster. Seems like it takes forever to get fully hot. If there is room, I put the chisel tip of the iron directly on the screw head for as long as I dare, then quickly try to unscrew the fastener. The heat really weakens the locktite and can allow removal of the fastener.
Hot air reflow machine works better, as you can set the temperature such that it'll break the bonds in the locktite without melting any nearby plastics.
The first 24 seconds of this video are quite fascinating, actually.
that's cool you got banana flippers as a matter of fact I just recently purchased a Time Warp last year it still has the original banana flippers on it got it for a good price and love it.
We have one now. No thanks for banana flippers though! ;) ruclips.net/video/zmy_nnYB8w8/видео.html
This video is worthy of another share great
Very detailed and extremely helpful video. Thanks!
Thanks for the video.... Any thoughts on adding Molex connectors on wires which are soldered to the flipper coil lugs making servicing easier?
helped me with my T2 flipper repair....thanks guys
I have a Dungeons and dragons pinball my top right flipper drops when I hold the flipper button. I rebuilt my lower flippers and put new points on my top right flipper and now I don’t know why it drops when I use it. Can you guys help? Btw great videos
Ray is The Genius.
Good work Ray very helpful thanks
Thanks for this video!
Sure fixed my weak left flipper!!
Funhouse is fun ones more!
Great video! I have a question what would cause weak flipper hold on a SEGA? My Space Jam right flipper hold is weak when ball come back from orbit the flipper will fall if holding.
I think I got this one without asking Ray? Your Sega coils only have two posts. There is no "hold winding" as it is controlled by they aforementioned flipper board. The EOS switches, if even present on your machine, would only control features like "lane change." Appreciate your participation! Good luck with your soldering adventure!
when its done its gonna be the most interesting eatpm on the planet!!!!!
Good video I wish ray was in NYC!
That seems fine. A lot of guys swap in 29s on T2 because of the long shots. I try to stick to the manual in most cases (not all) as well, but I am finding the 30s to be strong enough for me in my game. No replacement plastic sets for T2 are available yet...
I think he should have fitted the coil with connections away from the coil stop end. Like it was originally . Also tinning the wire first is good but I was taught that you try and make a mechanical connection of the wire , by fitting it through the lug on the coil and then soldering the wire into place. The soldering and the soldering iron were a bit slack.
I hear ya Paul. What's happened is the metal inlanes are worn where they meet the flippers. The ball then hits the flipper rubber... The only fix for that WAS to reposition the inlanes further up. But NOW replacements are available from "Cliffy Protectors" Woo Woo!
Flipper Board it is! I had a 1N4148 diode blow up somehow. I've ordered a new board, but I'm going to try to replace the diode and use it as an upgrade board on my Hook pin. Then maybe I can add EoS switches? Still not sure if that's possible. But I'd like to, for the sake of my coils. Now comes the scary time when I have to teach myself how to desolder/solder on an actual board. :x Just waiting for my soldering station. Thanks for the advice! Needs more Tech Tip videos! xD
Excellent!
Any thoughts on coil lug placement relative to the coil stop? Clay Harrell recommends keeping the lugs away from the coil stop. ? Maybe wire length was the issue on this one.
Lol, 2hrs, 3 days a week! Thanks for the video.
Seems like there are a few different opinions on this. Got conflicting answers from Ray even with a "Doesn't matter, technician's preference." But also included - "put it in as factory or the wires (like you said about wire length but also orientation) will be under stress." Interesting question. Thanks for bringing it up. What is Clay's reasoning for lugs away from end stops? Interested to know - always learning!
still debating the black rose Russ. need to check it out again, remind me to come over this week one night, if youre available
I'm just a hobbyist, but I'm always working on improving my tech. I'll give JimG a call and see when he's heading your way and tag along or something.
Well friend, long distance diagnostics is certainly flawed. The easiest, cheapest relative item would be the associated cabinet flipper switch. No harm in replacing it first. However, our gut says flipper control board failure. We replace them quite often. Rottendog offers an upgraded & universal flipper control board "FLP023" that we install regularly. Runs about $80 from Arcade Shop. Best of luck. Please share your success story when you figure it out!
Leave the wire length, make a hook, feed it through the coil lug and solder. Doing it flat like that makes it prone to coming off over time with flexing of the wires.
I love this video. Bring back tech tips blah blah etc.
I have a question about single stern coils in flippers, how do you make the electrical scheme, because i'm quite stuck there
Don't understand this question. Perhaps call Stern tech line.
Here's a tech tip. Ray said to use a magnetic nutdriver. If your nutdriver is not magnetic leave the socket end stuck to the game's speaker magnet overnight and tada! Magnetic nutdriver.
Great video. What kind of flux does Ray use,what gage solder, and what wattage iron?
Great magnet tip sir. The less professional of us use it often! Your new questions should be answered among this lengthy video: ruclips.net/video/AW2gyTVMblE/видео.htmlm20s
Thanks. I saw that after I asked the question. A lot of my questions are being answered by just watching all your videos. I've been binge watching like mad. Feel like I know you guys personally now Mike. But Ray's sports team theory also applies here. You guys are my pinball heroes but you don't give a rodent's rear about us....say it ain't so...lol..
Best tip ever....clean clean clean...I've found more problems with my machine just by doing that.
good business to be in. You can charge a premuim since not to many do house calls or have experience.
great video thanks
+fitter108 Thanks! Visit us often! :)
fantastic video....i have one T2...im from argentina.... yo make a serious and great job....
who makes your wire strippers....nice
what did you clean the wood with?
Excellent, again. I was waiting for the part about flipper angle -- my High Speed has the right-flipper "ball bounce" Ray mentions, making it really difficult to hit the lefthand Freeway loop -- but the camera's eye wandered off at that part! What screws!? I need to fix that - it is really frustrating. :)
I've got a Baywatch and my shark flipper recently started to struggle under the weight of the ball. When I test the coil it's strong, but when I'm in game it's weak. My machine is in near perfect condition and I replaced the coil but it still behaves exactly the same. Any advice is greatly appreciated.
I enjoyed it while I had it, but I don't miss it too much. JY has also been fun but it's available, as is Black Rose...(hint,hint)
T2 plastic set... If I could get paid for every time I go on that parts hunt? We have the chrome/lighted apron & also a chrome door (stolen from Jim's Fish Tales when it came thru.) Found the stainless/chrome "plastic set" for T2 over in wherever it costs 200+ Euros + shipping. Ouch! Would prefer regular repros but might get stuck breaking the bank on this T2... Ask Jim about the parts total on his EatPM!?
Great vid! Is there anyway possible to make a video explaining more in depth on how to align the flippers correctly? I just got a Revenge From Mars and these are out of wack. There are all kinds of arguments on the forums as to whether you should use the toothpick or not. I don't know how to do either one. I am a complete newb. The holes on here look like the flippers would be way too high. Thanks!
Thanks for the info!!! Now if I could figure out how to make my loop multi switches work without buying new ones. Please keep making these great videos! I have spent hours watching them.
I like the toothpick alignment, if your used to the standard Williams flippers positions, and where they land for backhands and such, that's the alignment I like.
Thanks! I have decided to use the straight edge method to align them for now. On my machine the toothpick method left the flippers way too high.
p fritts I have hot shot need to align one flipper
My Who Dunnit has a flipper that flips strong, but it is slow to return, and will only return half way some times. Any suggestions?
Check for worn out, wrong, and/or binding parts. Check for ample clearance between bell crank and hub. Suggestion? Replace everything old, worn, & wrong.
I shall.... Thank you very much. I'll let you know what I find!
Rays proof these machines are like boats. i'm glad he exists but he's a dying breed. He needs to start a school
You've got to be kidding. Which of those names was the "terrible" one? We love those guys! Obviously (since you seem to know your stuff) you don't work at T*T. Pinball hobbyist? As local as you are, you should def come in! You hiding from us?
Just curious. Where you hail from? What shop is lucky to have you? Grab a soldering pencil & hang out with us! Plenty to do around here! :)
Oh ok - gotcha.
IDK what anyone says, WPC flippers are the best flippers in the industry. Perfect amount of stroke, snappy, accurate and durable.
+John W Powell Total gash floppy limp crap flippers! Data East and Gottlieb are way better, big and strong, for real MEN who like to flip! Though admittedly, Bally/Williams did make the most entertaining games in their WPC era haha :)
I need a kit 73 darling and bal kick co
I don't understand why throw the apron away? You can take any stickers off right
Anything touched by TNT is trash.
They most certainly are not adjustable... the only way to do that (in the past) was to either elongate the holes in the playfield or in the inlane metal pieces to compensate for wear. Now, new replacement metal pieces are available.
So Guys,the 29s are good coils for my Bride of Pinbot?
So can you send me some of those Fastenal organizers? :P
Do they have a site?
I looked all over in stores and online and for the life of me cannot find anything like them.
I really need it for the spare parts I am going to need to stuff some place. >.
Gameroom Collectibles / Pinball
Oh? They must not advertise them in the stuff they send me. I'll have to go into the store and seek them out. ;)
Were is he from I my cyclone need some love
The main problem with repairing pinball machines is this: Who the bloody hell has a set of imperial ANYTHING? I had to go digging in my father's workshop, in a really dark and dirty place, to get some nasty old imperial drivers and shit.
18:18 LOOOOL
You miss to film the most important ...how to position correctly the flipper with inlane and screw it correctly. Yes he talk about it but you don’t film it.
i bet russ misses his Eatpm ;)
I'll take 2 at that price.
I could well have done without that intro - but the video is great! Thanks guys.
uggh, yes who talked me in to buying that?
he can buy yours, as is, at parts cost? $25k. what a bargain! who talked you into that poseatpm?
18:18 what a stupid reaction....
takes one to know one....
i used to watch TNT videos when i was new to the hobby. the games look nice on video but i realize now that does not show any of the actual quality of work. i must say i am not impressed, that's not a wear and tear. the quality of the soldering work is downright shameful, i do much better work and i have no formal training. if i soldered something and it looked like that (my work doesnt look like that), i would cut it off and do it again until it was right. people pay allot of money for their games, and his prices are well above "street value"..... you have to have some desire to do good quality work.
i like what i see on your channel. you not only show what good quality work looks like you try to show others how to do the work.