Scuba Regulator First Stages: Balanced V Unbalanced
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- Ooops! Yep, some of you noticed I accidentally posted the wrong video last week! Well, here is the right one! Slightly out of order, but here is a basic, simplified explanation of Balanced Vs Unbalanced regulators. What do those terms mean and should you spend your money on these features?
The scuba diving regulator is one of the more expensive pieces of dive gear. You want to spend money on quality... buy once, cry once! But scuba regulator manufacturers are very clever at coming up with marketing jargon to confuse the buying public. I'm here to cut through the BS and explain the engineering behind the features they try to sell you, so you can make an informed buying decision and get the best scuba regulator for your money and that's right for the type of diving you do!
Thanks for watching!
D.S.D.O
James
-----------------------------------------------
Want some Divers Ready! Swag? Head to The Dive Locker Store on our website! www.diversready.com/store
-----------------------------------------------
What do we dive? Our full and independently chosen gear choices are here:
bit.ly/divers-r...
------------------------------------------------
Connect with Divers Ready!:
Facebook: / diversready
Instagram: / diversready
Twitter: @diversready
------------------------------------------------
FOR MORE INFORMATION or to collaborate with Divers Ready! you can reach out to us via our website:
www.diversread...
-----------------------------------------------
If you want to take a PERSONALIZED dive course at any level with James from Divers Ready, you can contact us here:
www.miamitechn...
-----------------------------------------------
**Disclaimer: Divers Ready! firmly believes you can not teach someone to dive through the internet. We strongly urge people to ensure they receive dive instruction through an internationally recognized training agency and to dive safely and within the limits of their certification level at all times. Our channel is aimed at already-certified divers looking to further their skills.**
----------------------------------------------
In accordance with COPPA laws, please note that content on the channel Divers Ready is not specifically made for, or targeted at, children.
----------------------------------------------
Dive Safe. Dive Often.
#scubadiving #diversready #improveinspireexplore
Music used under license. Get yours here!
www.epidemicso...
Scuba Regulator First Stages: Balanced V Unbalanced
Though we are based in Florida, Hawaii, California, and Michigan have 100 ft and 300 ft ocean and lake underwater coral reef, shipwreck, cave diving, freediving, scuba diving, and closed circuit rebreather trips. To learn full face mask, beginner scuba diver, advanced scuba diver, tech scuba diver, cave diver you can reach out to a professional scuba diver. Everyone should get scuba diving insurance with Divers Alert Network.
We support all types of diving that can be found at PADI, DALLMYD, Dive Talk where they talk about cave divers react, Waterline Academy and BlueWorld TV.
We support all types of diving products, like a full face mask, fins, BCD, dive computer, regulators, closed circuit rebreather, underwater scooter, from many companies like Simply Scuba, Mares, Dive Rite, Cressi, Zeagle, Huish, Hollis, Scubapro, Shearwater, Garmin.
Face it the reason James has become so popular is because he gives explanation s that are easy for everyone to understand (K.I.S.S.). And he does it for subjects people have questions about and or he knows people need to understand based on his experience. Keep up the great work.
OCD / Pedants corner:
"balanced" or "balancing" refers to a pressure / force acting on both ends of a flow control device
"compensated" refers to a single ended pressure / force acting on said device
Therefor, to avoid confusing we shoud really refer to :
Hydrostatically compensated - refering to the output pressure increasing in absolute terms with depth so as to maintain the same differential (gauge) pressure under all conditions
Pneumatically balanced - refering to the effective reduction / nullification of flow control orifice area by the application of primary gas pressure to both sides of that orrifice in order to minimise changes in the pressure reduction ratio as primary gas pressure falls, ie maintaining the same IP gauge pressure as cylinder pressure changes
All modern (for the last 50 odd years or more) 1st stages are hydrostatically compensated, and these days most second stages are pneumatically balanced, meaning there is really no need in having the 1st stage also being pneumaticlly balanced. Becaause the step down ratio is very large for the 1st stage (3000psi dropped to about 140 psi, ie 20:1) the flow control area is small, and so a non pneumatically compensated 1st stage is no real deficit, simply because across sensible ratios (3000psi down to say 500 psi) the change in absolute IP is pretty small.
It's far more important, imo, to have a balanced 2nd, because this both requires a much larger overal flow control orifice, (IP is only arround 140 psi) but also this provides a mugh bigger margin from freeflow events caused by changes in IP, whilst still delivering a robust low inhalation effort. ie the second can be tuned to sit closer to the point of freeflow across a wider range of IP's
That is a pretty great explanation and point made. Thank you for that.
Overbalancing - We have an IP creep at depth that we couldn't fix, so now it is a feature. LOL... half kidding... I hope.
depends on the 1st stage some are designed to have a increase in the IP of the regulator as the supply ( tank) pressure drops
I'm probably getting ahead of your "lesson plans." What are the pros and cons of using a balanced 2nd stage with an unbalanced 1st stage? And vice-versa?
I was thinking the exact same thing. Will I experience balanced performance if only the first or second stage is balance or do both stages need to be balanced?
@@HavikenHayes For example: I've seen people run the SP R195 2nd stage (unbalanced) on the SP Mk17 1st stage (balanced). Why? You used to be able to buy it as a combo, but SP no longer offers that configuration.
The reason for doing that is a specific target at cracking pressure. So a first stage shoots for a certain IP and your second stage opens at a certain cracking pressure. With a balanced second stage, you have an easier “crack” which is like how much it takes to get over a hill. They pair them with unbalanced first stages because usually they are extremely reliable and quite cheap. If you check out Scubapros bulletproof MK2 on RUclips you can see how durable unbalanced regulators can be with less moving parts.
I have a mk2 evo on a backup set I've never used. I'm not claiming vast knowledge or experience, but I've never seen anything other than a R095/190/195/295 paired with a mk2.
Only one of the stages need to be balanced. I dive a combination on an unbalanced first stage and balanced or unbalanced second most of the time. When I dive in cold water (
Ugh, Im driving myself into a straight jacket, trying to pick a regulator. Im about to pull the trigger on an Aqualung Legend MBS DIN. They claim an “overbalanced” first stage regulator.🤷♂️
Hi mate, been watching for a while, great channel, good info and ideas. But this time round just want to drop an observation that it doesn't seem terribly clear from this video that balanced piston regs exist as well, and to the squeaky new diver or layman, it almost seems as if you're saying that only balanced diaphragm regs exist which would of course be incorrect.
I dive both balanced piston and balanced diaphragm regs and they are both great options.
Apeks XTX50 Regulator, Din by Apeks You said this is a good regulator. I did find that it is balance. Is it piston? Can you tell me where to find that info or tell me? Thanks. FYI Love your videos been watching a lot of them
Thanks for including the overbalanced stuff, been asking for a straight answer on that one forever
"Overbalanced" really is "positively compensated" ie output pressure increases above the ambient pressure rise. All it achieves is to attempt to keep the second stage flow control orifice from having to open physically too much further the deeper you go.
As ambient water pressure increases, for the same volumetric airflow requirement, the mass flow rises, because the gas we inhale must be maintained at the (increasing) ambient water pressure, ie your inhalation gas density climbs. With an non pneumatically balanced second stage, having to open the orifice further to get the same volumetric flow means you have to inhale harder against the return spring (because that spring necessarily has a non-zero spring rate).
As most seconds are balanced these days, then that increase in effort is so small as to be effectively un-detectable under most normal circumstances, and you'd need an ANSI test machine to see it. Back in the day when most seconds were not pneumatically balanced, then yes, having a 1st stage that was "overbalanced" had some merit. (it probably still has some merit if you are pushing the limits of tech diving at ambient pressures upwards of 10 bar, ie deeper than 100m for example, but is totally irrelevant at rec depths)
Mares? What is strong and poor side?
Same for scubatec?
Great job. You are a good teacher with a wealth if information. Keep it up .
Standard regulator save 700 ... put it towards your drysuit ftw
While what manufacturer's tell us about balanced versus unbalanced is technically correct. However, is it true to the point of being able to deliver enough air at the depths an individual is diving? That is what really needs to be answered.
Hi James. Thank you for goot trial of explaining a bit challenging subject. However, there were some misinformation included, like the balancing process. It is not the diaphram but the valve itself around which the pressure is guided. The idea is to eliminate the extra force created by the tank pressure. Another a bit misleading info was the explanation of ambient pressure transfer in the case of Apeks DST. Yes, the explanation itself is correct. However, one does not need any silicon window etc to get yhe force tranferred. DST is sn environmentally shielded version. If you compare it to UST, which is not rnvironmentally shielded, you see the difference. Anyhow, both gets ambient pressure to the outer side of the diaphram. In UST the water is directly in contact with the diaphram and in DST there is the dry chamber mechanism. In fact UST has more precise ambient response.
About to grab a Mk2 for my pony system.
James.... i think it's time we see some more sexy underwater footage with that fancy pants new rig you have :)
what about the question of: at what depth do you need a balanced regulator.?.. do recreational divers need it?
Not really. The benefit of balanced regulators kicks in around 130ft.
Hello! Thanks for all the great videos! After watching balanced vs unbalanced, at what depth does it become important (or even noticeable) to have a balanced regulator?
Hi Karen! 130+ft!
At what depth does the difference in air delivery become noticeable for a recreational diver?
Good question but I'm not sure there's a good answer because it's not only depth but also tank pressure that contribute to a change in breathing effort. So if you are at 100 ft. with 750 psi (a bad idea), then you might notice a difference. The same 100 ft. with 3200 psi (a much better idea), then my guess is you won't. A third variable is how well tuned your second stage is. If you have it set to breath super easy, then you may not notice it becoming harder to breath over time. I have dove to over 130 ft. on unbalanced regs and didn't notice much of a difference. If most or all of your diving is warm water, not deep (above 60 ft) and only 10-15 dives a year, then any modern reg. will work fine. If you have dove rental gear to over 60-70 ft. and didn't notice a difference in breathing, then this really isn't much of an issue.
Finally, I'd say shop around. Not all balanced regulators are super expensive. I use Deep 6 regulators (1st and 2nd stages), they come with all the bells and whistles and are balanced. Their top of the line Signature model 1st stage is $300 and the second stage is $150.
On the only unbalanced breathing reg that Dive Rite sells, they specifically recommend that it be used 50 feet and above. IMO there is little reason not to get a balanced reg. The price difference is often pretty smaller, less than $100 the last time I looked.
So. The Mares Abyss is an unbalanced regulator. However it is pretty much the only one that goes against the grain of unbalanced regulators. The more demand on the regulator (the greater the flow) the easier it is to breath off of it.
I was just talking to my service tech about this last night. He has the equipment and software to run the test on any system and provide a print out with 2 lines. One at 500psi. And one at 3000psi. He says all unbalanced regs when tested curve up as the air demand increases, meaning it takes a bigger draw to breath air off of it. But the Mares Abyss curves downward, like that of balanced systems. Quite the phenomena. I have the graphs to back it up haha
I just discovered your channel. Top drawer all the way. great explainations ... I will be watching more of what you have if it's similar. Thanks. :)
Thanks so much for that explanation! DGX Gears XTRA -advice please. Yes/no?
The subject of suggesting which regulator design and brand, you really need to understand the individual divers situation. That's why so much of the time you are going to get it depends as an answer.
Good infos thanks…
My recommendation, if you are a technical diver you absolutely want a balanced regulator. The harder question is for recreational divers.
Thank you James. Good to share basics. Hope this helps !
Watching back the entire series as i look to get my first set of regulators!
Great explanation of the differences. Really enjoying this series
Txxxxx❤
I was discussing with a friend the theory some people have of varying a spare mouthpiece with them. Is it not possible to breathe off a reg without one? I’m sure it’s no fun, but just was wondering for hypothetical arguments over beer.
It is defintely possible to breath from a regulator without a mouth piece. It may be easier or harder depending on the design but possible nontheless. and not too hard. Give it a go in a pool to see.
Another great video. Thanks!
Thank you for the information for a newbie and it does help as it can be intimidating when going into a dive shop when the sales person starts talking about these things.
And unfortunately many dive shop employee's don't know what they are talking about. Do your research.
Environmentally Balanced ? Or Environmentally Sealed ? 🤦🏽♂️🤣
Great series. Thank you!
You're very welcome! Dive safe.
Very interesting. Having done the Dive Master course I'm surprised that I wasn't taught that at some point.