The problem with Apocalypse Engine games is not the huge learning curve, but the unlearning curve. Because it is so different you have to forget things you are so used to!
I adore Masks. I’ve run it at Free RPG Days at my FLGS multiple times and I’ve found traditional players have some pre-existing notions of things which might hinder them, fresh players including kids managed the player side pretty well. You’re right about the GM advice side, it was tricky at first but the advice and techniques have been really good even outside of PbtA and I love how they help reorient the GM towards thematic play. So far, I think this is my favourite superhero RPG after a couple of seasons of regular play and about four one-shots.
I just started a Masks campaign session with 3 players. The biggest hurdle for us is scheduling, and for me specifically as GM I need to spend more time doing some setting and encounter creation/management. We really enjoyed our first session last week, and I agree with most that you’ve said! I would say that while the learning curve can be steep, it’s a much better entry point for people who haven’t roleplayed before since it’s much less rulesy and crunchy. If you have some creative friends interested in making a story, PbtA games generally get picked up with ease when compared to the near-tactical-mini-game experience of DnD
Errata: You only need to check off 5 Basic Advancements before unlocking the upper tier advancements. Support the channel by joining my Patreon! www.patreon.com/thaumavore Newsletter sign-up: bit.ly/ThaumavoreNewsletter
THIS is where classic TTRPG's truly shine. This kind of incredibly unique, emotional, intelligent, well thought out, fully realized concept is the kind of thing video game studios would never dare tackle even though they REALLY should. Looking at Baldur's Gate 3 as an example, it feels like we JUST now are getting a video game equivalent of a true dungeons and dragons experience. I've wanted a "dream" custom superhero RPG video game all my life and sadly do not see it happening any time soon. (DC and Marvel REALLY want to push their established characters, thus Marvel's Midnight Suns caught me VERY pleasantly by surprise as a major step forward) But that's the beauty of pen, paper and imagination. ANYTHING goes. I cannot believe I have never heard of this game before. Especially considering I'm a lifelong White Wolf Games fan and thus familiar with more narrative / story focused TTRPG systems. I need to get this.
During the last three month since my first contact with a powered by the apocolypse game I became a pbta purist. Honestly I cant really enjoy any other system anymore (except forged in the dark- which is an evolution from ptba) especially since I am gming most of the time. It took some time to get my head arround the system but now it takes zero efford to prepare sessions and the stories we as group created so far are truely remarkable. I love it and I am happy to try this one soon, too.
This straight up is my favorite TTRPG of all time. Masks hits all the things I enjoy with tabletop roleplaying, superhero stories, and just meaningful narratives in general. I love this game so much, and it's definitely my go-to recommend for any and all TTRPG players branching out of DnD who want a little more narrative over mechanics.
This review is super well done. I was literally about to google the discord server when you pointed out you had included it below. I'll just click this subscribe button...
Wow, I was just wondering about this game last night before bed and magically your video appears. I'm glad you pointed out the specific tools it gives to a GM. Though I've only read the original Apocalypse World, I always found that to be its most revolutionary feature. Most games don't define the activities of a GM and seeing them laid out in a discrete way as rules is a really great tool for new GMs, who are most likely to wonder what to do when action stalls.
agree. i have played masks for a little bit. it is def similar to the original apocalypse world in that shifting labels and relationships are the focal point i think...my problem with masks and some pbta games is that attempt to codify every element of roleplay leads to almost equal amount of "crunch" as DnD....its just a different "crunch" that is focused on "moves"
I need to try this game now! I’m building a Super hero magic system rn and I’ve never heard of these narrative systems and check out Masks that sounds soooo awesome!
I actually finally got to play this one via a one-shot that might turn into a full-blown campaign and I like it. My character is a alien slime girl yeah I picked the Outsider playbook.
Having played PBTA's for years now, I wouldn't say it's hard for neophytes. PBTA games are challenging for players used to more traditional titles (D20, FFG, WoD, CoC, et al). However, the mechanics being narrative-first generally means that the less versed a player is in traditional tabletop mechanics the better they do. It's the baggage of builds, and the assumptions most games make on how to play that creates an environment that makes PBTA games hard to learn. This is also why they're popular but hard for most traditional players to get into. If you run PBTA like any other RPG, you won't have a fun time, and will often make mistakes. It will also codify certain behaviors that run counter to this style of game.
You've created a great review of this game and the rules, and I'm hoping you or your comments section can help me. I'm part of a new group playing this game and we like the system, but we're having a horrible time with the Mask Move for the Janus playbook. We're trying to understand how this move works when stats can change every game, and sometimes move entirely away from where they started, and the Janus player has requested that no matter what we don't affect their Mundane score to keep it at +3, but that sounds like a horrible way of playing the game. Anybody understand how this move works that can explain, so I can explain. None of us can wrap our heads around why having mundane switch with another label once a game session even works, and in spite of the examples in the book we don't see that move exemplified through the examples. Also, if you saw this asked somewhere else, it was also probably me. I've been seeking this answer in videos all over youtube.
@@DaveThaumavore if you're interested in something lighter weight, I'd recommend looking into Barbarians of Lemuria as well. It's very fluid and flexible and heroic, which feels very Conan to me.
Well, I look at your stuff to get an idea for things I don't have, so looking at your reviews for things that I do have? That helps me calibrate what you say in relation to what I know I already like. I don't like a lot of superhero stuff because a lot of RPGs are about measurables, and there's no universe where Superman and Batman can exist as equals in a measurable sense. In terms of DRAMA? Then, that's a different story, and I think Apocalypse engine Supers makes the best kind of sense. "Masks" is really near the top of the Supers genre for me, and one of the best incarnations of the Apocalypse engine for sure.
I'm not really interested in superheroes or teenage drama, but I'm curious about the Apocalypse system. I think I may read the original Apocalypse World... Or maybe Dungeon World.
I strongly recommend you go to the original. Vincent Baker has some genius ideas about how to run RPGs that are useful for any GM of any game. Get them straight from the source!
I'm gonna test Masks this weekend and if everthing runs good we are gonna move from Mutants and Masterminds to Masks. I'm running a Boku no Hero campain and I feel the mechanics of M&M are getting in the way of my players fun, I already tryied to homebrew the system but got worse haha, so I really hopping Masks save us.
ICRPG is your best bet here. Masks is about teenage identity issues. It's not suitable for kids since they have no frame of reference or real understanding of that stage in life yet. At best, they would be trying to emulate what they've seen on TV or in movies, and that's not really satisfying for anyone. ICRPG-VC is just a straight-up supers deal.
That's just how it would go if I'd run it for my players. 😂 I'd try to run a semi serious game with some light hearted moments but my players would probably just turn it into a Watchman or The Boys TRPG with the personalities and humour from Teen Titans Go. Awesome review by the way. Love your content. I got the Warhammer Fantasy starter set because of you and Dungeon Craft.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
The problem with Apocalypse Engine games is not the huge learning curve, but the unlearning curve. Because it is so different you have to forget things you are so used to!
I adore Masks. I’ve run it at Free RPG Days at my FLGS multiple times and I’ve found traditional players have some pre-existing notions of things which might hinder them, fresh players including kids managed the player side pretty well. You’re right about the GM advice side, it was tricky at first but the advice and techniques have been really good even outside of PbtA and I love how they help reorient the GM towards thematic play. So far, I think this is my favourite superhero RPG after a couple of seasons of regular play and about four one-shots.
I just started a Masks campaign session with 3 players. The biggest hurdle for us is scheduling, and for me specifically as GM I need to spend more time doing some setting and encounter creation/management.
We really enjoyed our first session last week, and I agree with most that you’ve said! I would say that while the learning curve can be steep, it’s a much better entry point for people who haven’t roleplayed before since it’s much less rulesy and crunchy. If you have some creative friends interested in making a story, PbtA games generally get picked up with ease when compared to the near-tactical-mini-game experience of DnD
That's awesome. Very good point about people just getting into RPGs. They don't have to unlearn any paradigms first.
Errata: You only need to check off 5 Basic Advancements before unlocking the upper tier advancements.
Support the channel by joining my Patreon! www.patreon.com/thaumavore
Newsletter sign-up: bit.ly/ThaumavoreNewsletter
THIS is where classic TTRPG's truly shine. This kind of incredibly unique, emotional, intelligent, well thought out, fully realized concept is the kind of thing video game studios would never dare tackle even though they REALLY should. Looking at Baldur's Gate 3 as an example, it feels like we JUST now are getting a video game equivalent of a true dungeons and dragons experience. I've wanted a "dream" custom superhero RPG video game all my life and sadly do not see it happening any time soon. (DC and Marvel REALLY want to push their established characters, thus Marvel's Midnight Suns caught me VERY pleasantly by surprise as a major step forward)
But that's the beauty of pen, paper and imagination. ANYTHING goes. I cannot believe I have never heard of this game before. Especially considering I'm a lifelong White Wolf Games fan and thus familiar with more narrative / story focused TTRPG systems. I need to get this.
During the last three month since my first contact with a powered by the apocolypse game I became a pbta purist. Honestly I cant really enjoy any other system anymore (except forged in the dark- which is an evolution from ptba) especially since I am gming most of the time. It took some time to get my head arround the system but now it takes zero efford to prepare sessions and the stories we as group created so far are truely remarkable. I love it and I am happy to try this one soon, too.
You talked about the Doomed and my brain went into a Doom Patrol-ish game played w this system :P I wanna run this game so much! Thank you for this!
This straight up is my favorite TTRPG of all time. Masks hits all the things I enjoy with tabletop roleplaying, superhero stories, and just meaningful narratives in general. I love this game so much, and it's definitely my go-to recommend for any and all TTRPG players branching out of DnD who want a little more narrative over mechanics.
This review is super well done. I was literally about to google the discord server when you pointed out you had included it below. I'll just click this subscribe button...
Good review! Personally, I've never used a playbook as an actual "book". I just print them out double sided and that works just fine.
Yeah that might be the actual correct way to use it. lol
This is the most helpful review I've seen so far. Thank you!
Wow, I was just wondering about this game last night before bed and magically your video appears. I'm glad you pointed out the specific tools it gives to a GM. Though I've only read the original Apocalypse World, I always found that to be its most revolutionary feature. Most games don't define the activities of a GM and seeing them laid out in a discrete way as rules is a really great tool for new GMs, who are most likely to wonder what to do when action stalls.
absolutely love this game, took the fundamentals of the PtbA system and really pushed it to perfection
Agreed.
This is a beautiful, thoughtful and very-well written review. Thank you!
Excellent review. I’ve played Masks and enjoyed it very much. I also don’t understand why this channel doesn’t have more subs. It’s fantastic!
Thanks! Yeah I don’t know, man. Algorithms or something!
I'm Glad you are the one reviewing it.
Tha is for this review. It has awakened a new interest.
agree. i have played masks for a little bit. it is def similar to the original apocalypse world in that shifting labels and relationships are the focal point i think...my problem with masks and some pbta games is that attempt to codify every element of roleplay leads to almost equal amount of "crunch" as DnD....its just a different "crunch" that is focused on "moves"
Another great video, those archetypes look pretty sweet. I might have to pick this one up.
Another great review! Thank you, Sir. :)
I need to try this game now! I’m building a Super hero magic system rn and I’ve never heard of these narrative systems and check out Masks that sounds soooo awesome!
One of mu favorite ttrpgs of all time. Brilliant game. The previous campaign I ran for a year was Masks, and it was just beautiful.
And of course, your review is spot on (including the steep learning curve. Yep, it's there)
Wow, a year-long Masks campaign. That is epic.
@@DaveThaumavore It was totally epic! And I also played a year and a half long campaign as a player. It too was amazing.
I was thinking of giving some highlights from the crazy stuff that went down in these campaigns but I can't decide where to start :)
@@eladhen2 Sounds like it could be many novels' worth of adventures.
interesting... i didn’t know there were rpg games made like this with interesting settings and characters so cool
I really like the sound of this game but I do wonder if my group of players will be up for playing teenage superheroes.
Never heard of this before today. But it sounds interesting!
I actually finally got to play this one via a one-shot that might turn into a full-blown campaign and I like it. My character is a alien slime girl yeah I picked the Outsider playbook.
Having played PBTA's for years now, I wouldn't say it's hard for neophytes. PBTA games are challenging for players used to more traditional titles (D20, FFG, WoD, CoC, et al). However, the mechanics being narrative-first generally means that the less versed a player is in traditional tabletop mechanics the better they do.
It's the baggage of builds, and the assumptions most games make on how to play that creates an environment that makes PBTA games hard to learn. This is also why they're popular but hard for most traditional players to get into. If you run PBTA like any other RPG, you won't have a fun time, and will often make mistakes. It will also codify certain behaviors that run counter to this style of game.
@3:00 looks like his identity isn't the only thing that young guy is going to be struggling with.
You've created a great review of this game and the rules, and I'm hoping you or your comments section can help me. I'm part of a new group playing this game and we like the system, but we're having a horrible time with the Mask Move for the Janus playbook. We're trying to understand how this move works when stats can change every game, and sometimes move entirely away from where they started, and the Janus player has requested that no matter what we don't affect their Mundane score to keep it at +3, but that sounds like a horrible way of playing the game. Anybody understand how this move works that can explain, so I can explain. None of us can wrap our heads around why having mundane switch with another label once a game session even works, and in spite of the examples in the book we don't see that move exemplified through the examples. Also, if you saw this asked somewhere else, it was also probably me. I've been seeking this answer in videos all over youtube.
Would you ever do a review of Modiphious' Conan rpg, or Vurt? Your reviews are fantastic!
Thanks! Vurt has been on my list for a while. The only Conan game in my sights is Astonishing Swordsmen and Sorcerers of Hyperborea.
@@DaveThaumavore if you're interested in something lighter weight, I'd recommend looking into Barbarians of Lemuria as well. It's very fluid and flexible and heroic, which feels very Conan to me.
I honestly would love to see larian Studios do a game based on this as we saw just how well they did a dnd video game.
Well, I look at your stuff to get an idea for things I don't have, so looking at your reviews for things that I do have? That helps me calibrate what you say in relation to what I know I already like.
I don't like a lot of superhero stuff because a lot of RPGs are about measurables, and there's no universe where Superman and Batman can exist as equals in a measurable sense. In terms of DRAMA? Then, that's a different story, and I think Apocalypse engine Supers makes the best kind of sense. "Masks" is really near the top of the Supers genre for me, and one of the best incarnations of the Apocalypse engine for sure.
I'm not really interested in superheroes or teenage drama, but I'm curious about the Apocalypse system. I think I may read the original Apocalypse World... Or maybe Dungeon World.
Something World
@@DaveThaumavore Anything World!
I strongly recommend you go to the original. Vincent Baker has some genius ideas about how to run RPGs that are useful for any GM of any game. Get them straight from the source!
@@maxducoudray You're right. It's on the list now.
I just did a video on Urban Shadows, another great pbta game
I'm gonna test Masks this weekend and if everthing runs good we are gonna move from Mutants and Masterminds to Masks. I'm running a Boku no Hero campain and I feel the mechanics of M&M are getting in the way of my players fun, I already tryied to homebrew the system but got worse haha, so I really hopping Masks save us.
love angsty teenage superhero shows, might pick this up!
Hmm. This sounds like it would be a good vehicle for a RWBY campaign... **ponders...**
Not a bad idea!
I dunno, a superhero game where powers aren’t really a focus just doesn’t excite me.
Which is better for playing with kids? Masks or ICRPG’s Vigilante City?
Thanks in advance.
ICRPG is your best bet here. Masks is about teenage identity issues. It's not suitable for kids since they have no frame of reference or real understanding of that stage in life yet. At best, they would be trying to emulate what they've seen on TV or in movies, and that's not really satisfying for anyone. ICRPG-VC is just a straight-up supers deal.
@@DaveThaumavore I appreciate your time and advice. I’m going to purchase ICRPG VC to run with my kids.
So Teen Titans but the players will act all goofy like Teen Titans Go! but make edgelord actions like Titans.
I feel like you put some thought into that comment. So I will just say sure.
That's just how it would go if I'd run it for my players. 😂 I'd try to run a semi serious game with some light hearted moments but my players would probably just turn it into a Watchman or The Boys TRPG with the personalities and humour from Teen Titans Go. Awesome review by the way. Love your content. I got the Warhammer Fantasy starter set because of you and Dungeon Craft.
It seems more like a mod of dungeon world than a own pbta, but it s not a problem