Seeing that most of the ammo and armour sets are all real world, you can see how Nakita marked this as a in depth shooter survival for extreme millsim type people. Being able to know how different rounds and plates will react or how they bounce etc etc
@@gofuckthyself420 There isn't anything remotely realistic, accurate or true to life about EFT ballistics. 5.7 and 4.6 and some pistol rounds having better penetration than rifle rounds. If you want realism, see the Realism Mod for SPT EFT. Even then, there are core limitations in how these mechanics work that prevents even that mod from being truly realistic.
Best way to explain ricochet chance on EFT is to talk about the actual values. The true value uses 3 checks and 3 values. the values are X Y Z X = The Maximum Ricochet Chance Y = The Minimum Ricochet Chance Z = The MINIMUM IMPACT ANGLE of hitbox To calculate the above (If set to 30, the bullet MUST strike at, or above, 30 degrees from perpendicular [theoretically 0 degrees] to even start a ricochet calculation. If you hit 29 degrees, its zero chance, right out.) This value cannot go above 90 degrees (Due to Sphere hitbox) Pen Chance, ricochet chance, and all other stats on an ammunition DONOT AFFECT Ricochet chances. Trust me, or dont, but either way there is no code that even outlines or considers the type of ammo in the calculation. Armor durability does not effect ricochet chance either. Ricochet chance stats on helmets, visors, ets only use the X and Y Values, specifically how close they are from one another. (Higher minimum chance versus lower maximum chance = higher ricochet chance stat) The 3 checks are simple: Does bullet hit above the Z value? If so, roll for random number. If Not, penetrates. Does Random number equal less than X & Y Interpolations? If so, ricochet. If not, bullet penetrates. The Data set presented at 8:15 onwards is semi-accurate. The truth is its almost impossible to land a direct 90-degree hit ingame so the tak-kek ricocheting 10% of ammo is likely due to research error as presented below. The Tak Kek for some reason has much better stats than even high tier helmets for ricocheting (probably for the meme) Specifically: "x": 0.9 "y": 0.5 "z": 40 So the tak kek requires a 40 degrees hit to even start calculation. Though due to the fact the head shape hitbox is a sphere, the only practical flat portion of it is the crown (very tippy top of head) They likely were shooting eyes on, or side on. None of which are exactly flat areas on a sphere. There is always generally atleast a 10-20 degree error involved at the MINIMUM. Interesting thing, that may be a bug, btw. Helmets that ricochet will always, 100% of the time attempt to apply contusion (blurry vision) effects, but Straight up stopping bullets (level 2 round versus level 4 helmet) does not have a 100% chance. I assume this was put into place so a person couldnt just overpower your senses with head trauma via low-pen ammunition.
I love condors, I used to be such a rat about any "unnecessary" expenses but now I run them every raid. Surprisingly you get them back a lot of times too. Iirc they also don't glow in the fog like some others. They have definitely saved me before but only from like pst and buckshot
they saved me about a week ago from a scav with a flir shooting whatever ammo they get in the sv98 it comes with. got headshot and only had damage to the glasses. was so fuckin happy haha managed to take his flir too - unlucky!
Agreed, I'd love to see the comparison been the Ratnik and Ulach. If the Ratnik is almost as effective as the Ulach, then I might switch back to that beauty as I get them back from insurance far more often.
on the Ratnik you bet on the bounce chance, while the ULACH will block mid tier rounds and medigate enough dmg from hightier pen but low tier dmg rounds to survive 1 hit
I've bounced an M62 from Condors and have noticed that ULACH has saved my life dozens of times against ammo that should penetrate class 4 every time. So the high ricochet chance is extremely useful and happens more often than I previously thought. I believe each ammo also has a stat on ricochet chance so if you combine high ricochet chance bullets with high ricochet helmets you might see bullets bounce all over the place when clicking heads. SS190 is the first thing that comes to mind.
I’ve bounced M62 twice, BP once, and a few unknown rounds. Last night I even bounced off 1/1 dura condors. Mando mask has saved me from shotguns numerous times, also one time M62 and 2 times with 55a1 that I know of, and 545 BS once. It’s saved me a lot more than condors but that’s expected bc it’s full face and top of head. Do with this information whatever you wish!
I always snag broken Condors from Fence because I know that as long as I repair it, the ricochet chance remains the same. It's a lot cheaper than brand new Condors.
I caught the phrase “it seems higher pen rounds have a higher ricochet chance from the testing” if you click on individual rounds on the wiki, it gives you their ricochet chance probability stat. I don’t know if you knew this or if they actually are accurate/ work, but I felt like it was worth mentioning.
I don't believe that has any bearing - I cross referenced that against the testing list and it seemed to have no correlation. From speaking to a few folks, I think that gets used for material ricochet (like containers/boxes etc) rather than player armor
Been waiting for this one since we talked about apsx round for testing this and how stacking armor items behave for damage mitigation (Slaap plates on helmets/bastion helmet thing). Thanks for doing the science I don't have the patience for
Ammo itself also has a ricochet chance. Helmet "ricochet chance" stat is a bunch of angles, the "low-medium" display stat is an arbitrary representation of these angles. I could easily send you the angle stats for all these helmets, and ricochet chance of any ammo, if you wanted. I can also send code of methods that handle ricochets.
I have seen more than I am willing to commit to video :) You don't happen to have any info about blunt damage/mitigation though do you...? That's the real one I'm interested in XD If you do Discord me, I might not see the comment if it's a reply (weird RUclips studio thing)
@@Gigabeef Don't have discord unfortunately, but blunt damage works like this: float num1 = current durability / max durability * 100; float num2 = armorClass; float num3 = (121 - 5000 / (45 + num1 + 2)) * num2 * 0.01; float damage *= ArmorBluntThroughputValue * clamp(1 - 0.03 * (num3 - ammoPen), 0.2, 1); I don't recall exactly, but armor class may be represented as 100, 200, 300 etc. instead of just 1, 2, 3. Would have to do the math both ways to confirm. ArmotBluntThroughputValue is a stat each armor has, and its unique to each armor. The higher the number, the more damage it allows through the armor. Ammo penetration will be different at different ranges of course. The clamp works like this :(value, min, max). It returns value only if it is within min or max, and obviously returns one or the other if it is outside the limits. '*=' means the damage of the round is equal to itself multiplied by that sum. ArmotBluntThroughputValue also determines stamina drain from getting hit, as an aside.
@@LaughingMan44 This is very interesting. I assume a similar formula works for damage mitigation on penetration through armor? That float num3 is very familiar as it's part of the regular pen calc too - useful stuff thanks
@@Gigabeef I could be mistaken, but I think if the round penetrated this is the formula: float damage *= Clamp(ammoPen / (num3 + 12), 0.6, 1); So If I'm interpreting it right, the maximum damage reduction armor can do after penetration is 40%. That seems consistent with my experience in EFT and testing in SPT. Reading the code can be hard sometimes, it's all decompiled from the .dll, not from source code obviously. So a lot of it is badly obfuscated by the compiler, and most of the values are "num1" or "method_1", so sometimes it's hard to interpret. Fortunately for the armor calculations, most of the values are named. The downside of that being that often BSG's naming conventions are...strange and unhelpful to say the least.
I wonder whether you reached a max cap for ricochet chance. The Condor should have a lower ricochet chance than the trooper mask on paper, but not in your test, and at the maximum angle you have many more ricochets than any of the helmets did with any of the rounds at smaller angles.
Would love to see some testing done on raised face shields to improve ricochet chance on a helmet, combined with glasses for eyes. Really good info here ❤
Thankyou so much I've been wondering about this for a long time...not going to pretend it was the most exciting video (no fault of your own) but thank you so much.
@@Gigabeef well I have a dull dulset tone so if i’d done it, it would have been in the help you get to sleep category. Again really big thanks for doing it! Look forward to seeing your ricochet helmet one :)
Bullets only ricochet if they don’t penetrate. What’s happening is the condor is causing the ricochet and the trooper is stopping the round in the majority of cases where both are considered
from personal experience without any logging, i find BASTION and ULACH being the helmets most likely giving a ricochet, saved my ass so many times and that level 3 helmets are basically useless, they get penned all the time, even with shit ammo. (i dont ever use helmets that cant take headset, like 1-3x for lols per wipe in factory only altyn or something.)
That's interesting. I had two different assumptions were proven false or inaccurate 1. That ricochet stacked 2. That ricochet damage to armor was 1 Good stuff.
I’ve actually kept track of the exact number of times I’ve worn Condors for the last five weeks. I’ve bought and wore Condors exactly 61 times in five weeks and they’ve saved me quite literally zero times when having been shot in the eyes.
I wonder now how helmet stacking works with the slapp and Mando face. I saw on Reddit ppl were saying it rolls twice but not sure which rolls first or how much the bullet is impacted if it pens the first
There are no separate hitboxes for the different armors, which is why gigabeef mentions the trooper mask being much larger than the actual hitbox (much like other armors protecting entire arm while covering barely the elbows etc) . For some reason though, the system does not work like it used to, back when you could stack armored rigs with armor, which If I remember correctly checked the rig before armor. There is no reason why condors should take damage before actual helmet components.
@@Chilionloppu im not saying there is any logic behind it, because if you think about it there should be no damage to the condors unless there is full penetration, but then you would also be dead. however when you get hit with anything on the face the condors also lose armor points, even if you reflected a low pen round or took some buckshot to the face doing 1 damage, the condors will always get damaged which makes no sense, but still does stack the effect of ricochet chance. the hitboxes in this game desperately need a rework.
Excellent work. Weird that the medium ricochet's armor is so close to the high ricochet's results. Does the ricochet chance of the round itself affect the chance more than the armor?
Seems to have no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell - I only did it with one bullet but from the reddit testing, there's no correlation between the round's ricochet chance and the results they had. That was one thing I was most interested in!
THIS precise topic is what I'm looking for so far, I want to know if my Condor and Heavy Trooper is all for looks or it does have a function (ricochet mainly) to justify my kit :)) Thanks for the video, you're among the best Tarkov CC for infos 🤩👍 Although on some further readings I found out that ammunition has their own ricochet chance, I'm thinking it might help with min/max ricochet angle; my understanding came from World of Tanks penetration angle mechanics in which each round type has separate normalization angle for armor penetration calculation so that a relatively high pen round would have to hit much closer to 90* for successful pen all the while low pen round can hit at shallower angle and 'might' have a chance to 'bite' on the armor thus penetrating it (or NOT getting ricocheted). But all that is from different game 🥴 sooo the understanding might not be all accurate to Tarkov.
The round's ricochet seems to have no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell - I only did it with one bullet but from the reddit testing, there's no correlation between the round's ricochet chance and the results they had. That was one thing I was most interested in!
What about richochet chances of the bullets themselves? How do those matter? The EFT wiki states ricochet chances of each bullet being different too with AP SX at 60% whatever that means and for example Warmageddon at 90% and .300 Blackout AP at 10%.
Excellent call out. I was going to do the same. I've noticed ricochet off of Armor. I need to find the clip but I suspect that it could impact helmet, face shields, and glasses.
Seems to have no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell - I only did it with one bullet but from the reddit testing, there's no correlation between the round's ricochet chance and the results they had. That was one thing I was most interested in!
Lol my friend just died the other day in a firefight because the guy he killed richoched 7.62 BP off his condors🤣 he was streaming so we tuned in to his chat and he explained it😂
Instead of aiming at head, find a spot where your character has a good set of repeatable lines, then have the enemy walk forward into your line of fire. Otherwise figure out if there is a better way to keep the target more still. Maybe moving forward into corner, or backwards, or into a targeting line/ backwards from one line
My tatkov mate ALWAYS get ricochets on his helmets, even with the shittiest of lvl 3 ratniks he always gets head contusion but survives... but me ehhh I dont even use helmets anymore unless I loot it on someone I kill because I always get oneshotted through it Found an EXFILL with the face shield the other day and simply got one shotted through it from behind by M855 or something And we can't count how many times we killed some ultra Chad running around with a slick and a 300k rubles weapon but no helmet They're right, I'm not wasting my money anymore Maybe one day when Lady Luck turns but until them it's useless to me
So giga- do we know if the armor class 1 and 2 of the glasses and mask combined become the equivalent of class 3 ? Because I feel like this a secondary “assumed benefit” of stacking the condors and mask
Go back a couple years and find some data from when you could wear body armor and armored rigs together, those were the tanky days. The body armor would only start taking bullets once the rig was zeroed or penned and then it would be just a normal roll, although now with the damage reduction and drop off it could be different, who knows without testing~
Glasses are just not worth it imo because of the graphics bug that means at distance, they show through the fog way more than the rest of the character, I've headshotted people wearing glasses from distance where I wouldn't have been able to spot them because of that.
another aspect I'd like to know is do the armor ratings stack? if shot in the eyes while wearing both would they act as lvl3 armor? or would the round only need the penetration value high enough for one or the other?
This math was done back in the days when armor rigs first came out and could be stacked with normal armors. The lvl does not stack, but having layers was beneficial regardless - a good idea was to have, for instance, a lvl4 or 5 armor below and a lvl3 or 4 rig on top. The rig would tank smaller rounds and prevent damage to the better armor, which would then tank any bigger rounds that got through the rig. I don't recall whether a bullet's chance to penetrate the main armor was reduced after penetrating the rig, but I'm sure you can find the answer with some googling. But for instance two lvl3s definitely didn't form a lvl6 if that's what you're asking.
Do bullets really come out the barrel? I thought they come out your face like COD and a lot of other shooters. From seeing rengawrs video on right lean peak they can shoot you before you even see their barrel (though this might be a visual/collision model thing)
Each round has a ricochet chance associated with it as well. Interestingly APSX has a ricochet chance of 60% listed in the wiki. Perhaps that number is why you landed in that area at the shallowest angle possible during your testing? Strangely though rounds like 7.62 BP and BS have a relatively low number yet in the reddit test done on the helmets they had a shockingly high chance to bounce when at the 60 degree angle.... Tarkov math makes my brain hurt.
Only if it has a fraction behind the scenes. In our case it LOOKS like 0, but it isn't actually blacked - normally you can't heal it if it goes to actual 0 from a bleed for example
Glasses that bounce riffle ammo, whose brilliant idea was this? Surely they didn't know about the already insane amount of RNG already in the game before adding these, oh well, just another convoluted mechanic that will be broken by an update, somewhere down the line
If all this is true then why, in God's Grace, do I keep getting head, top of head 1 tapped through my full durability tier 4 helmets by rounds that only have a ~20% chance of penning? 7.62x39 PS is the sole reason why I'm gonna be bald by 30.
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So crazy how nikita could just GIVE us the info after so many years instead of us spending hours and hours and hours testing and speculating
He probably can't remember how it works either...And is watching those videos to figure it out ^^
Well content creators could just look at the client code easily, or use SPT to test things, but that would mean less content.
Seeing that most of the ammo and armour sets are all real world, you can see how Nakita marked this as a in depth shooter survival for extreme millsim type people. Being able to know how different rounds and plates will react or how they bounce etc etc
@@gofuckthyself420 There isn't anything remotely realistic, accurate or true to life about EFT ballistics. 5.7 and 4.6 and some pistol rounds having better penetration than rifle rounds.
If you want realism, see the Realism Mod for SPT EFT. Even then, there are core limitations in how these mechanics work that prevents even that mod from being truly realistic.
Think that's part of the game is learning.
The hard way
Best way to explain ricochet chance on EFT is to talk about the actual values.
The true value uses 3 checks and 3 values.
the values are
X
Y
Z
X = The Maximum Ricochet Chance
Y = The Minimum Ricochet Chance
Z = The MINIMUM IMPACT ANGLE of hitbox To calculate the above (If set to 30, the bullet MUST strike at, or above, 30 degrees from perpendicular [theoretically 0 degrees] to even start a ricochet calculation. If you hit 29 degrees, its zero chance, right out.) This value cannot go above 90 degrees (Due to Sphere hitbox)
Pen Chance, ricochet chance, and all other stats on an ammunition DONOT AFFECT Ricochet chances. Trust me, or dont, but either way there is no code that even outlines or considers the type of ammo in the calculation.
Armor durability does not effect ricochet chance either.
Ricochet chance stats on helmets, visors, ets only use the X and Y Values, specifically how close they are from one another. (Higher minimum chance versus lower maximum chance = higher ricochet chance stat)
The 3 checks are simple:
Does bullet hit above the Z value?
If so, roll for random number. If Not, penetrates.
Does Random number equal less than X & Y Interpolations?
If so, ricochet. If not, bullet penetrates.
The Data set presented at 8:15 onwards is semi-accurate.
The truth is its almost impossible to land a direct 90-degree hit ingame so the tak-kek ricocheting 10% of ammo is likely due to research error as presented below.
The Tak Kek for some reason has much better stats than even high tier helmets for ricocheting (probably for the meme)
Specifically:
"x": 0.9
"y": 0.5
"z": 40
So the tak kek requires a 40 degrees hit to even start calculation. Though due to the fact the head shape hitbox is a sphere, the only practical flat portion of it is the crown (very tippy top of head) They likely were shooting eyes on, or side on. None of which are exactly flat areas on a sphere. There is always generally atleast a 10-20 degree error involved at the MINIMUM.
Interesting thing, that may be a bug, btw. Helmets that ricochet will always, 100% of the time attempt to apply contusion (blurry vision) effects, but Straight up stopping bullets (level 2 round versus level 4 helmet) does not have a 100% chance. I assume this was put into place so a person couldnt just overpower your senses with head trauma via low-pen ammunition.
Good summary
I love condors, I used to be such a rat about any "unnecessary" expenses but now I run them every raid. Surprisingly you get them back a lot of times too. Iirc they also don't glow in the fog like some others. They have definitely saved me before but only from like pst and buckshot
they saved me about a week ago from a scav with a flir shooting whatever ammo they get in the sv98 it comes with. got headshot and only had damage to the glasses. was so fuckin happy haha managed to take his flir too - unlucky!
You may not have regard for ricochet rolls. But I say to ricochet rolls . . 'I never want to give you up'.
Agreed, I'd love to see the comparison been the Ratnik and Ulach. If the Ratnik is almost as effective as the Ulach, then I might switch back to that beauty as I get them back from insurance far more often.
on the Ratnik you bet on the bounce chance, while the ULACH will block mid tier rounds and medigate enough dmg from hightier pen but low tier dmg rounds to survive 1 hit
Ive bounced many 366 762 9mm and 545 and 556 off the ratnik
I've bounced an M62 from Condors and have noticed that ULACH has saved my life dozens of times against ammo that should penetrate class 4 every time. So the high ricochet chance is extremely useful and happens more often than I previously thought. I believe each ammo also has a stat on ricochet chance so if you combine high ricochet chance bullets with high ricochet helmets you might see bullets bounce all over the place when clicking heads. SS190 is the first thing that comes to mind.
I would Love to see a Comparison with the Shattered Face Mask/Glorious Face Mask (stats for the 2 should be Identical)
Those masks are god tier early wipe.
I’ve bounced M62 twice, BP once, and a few unknown rounds. Last night I even bounced off 1/1 dura condors.
Mando mask has saved me from shotguns numerous times, also one time M62 and 2 times with 55a1 that I know of, and 545 BS once. It’s saved me a lot more than condors but that’s expected bc it’s full face and top of head. Do with this information whatever you wish!
I always snag broken Condors from Fence because I know that as long as I repair it, the ricochet chance remains the same. It's a lot cheaper than brand new Condors.
I usually just buy them from Prapor 16k a piece.
@@TheMrPandabeast i recently got 4 for under 800 roubles from fence, after repairing with armor kit they had around 17-19 durability, pretty good
@@f0ldz Damn that’s not bad at all. I’ve been checking his max rep store and there’s never anything good. Hit 6.00 rep with fence this wipe.
@@TheMrPandabeast How did you get so high? I'm on 1.55 rep.
@@NicholasLaRosa0496 run a lot of scav raids, do co-op extracts and use the vehicle extracts
the oldtimers of us calling the mando mask the boba mask...
But it says this is the way in the item description
@@Leo-km9xg trooper mask has been in the game longer than that show has existed.. it’s meant to be just a general Star Wars reference
Even before Din Djarin, I would call it mandolorian since it's not just Boba Fett's mask, but any mandolorian.
To me, Mando mask just references the T-Visor pmuch.
@@shatteredteethofgod was waiting for someone to say this 🤜🤛
I caught the phrase “it seems higher pen rounds have a higher ricochet chance from the testing” if you click on individual rounds on the wiki, it gives you their ricochet chance probability stat. I don’t know if you knew this or if they actually are accurate/ work, but I felt like it was worth mentioning.
I don't believe that has any bearing - I cross referenced that against the testing list and it seemed to have no correlation. From speaking to a few folks, I think that gets used for material ricochet (like containers/boxes etc) rather than player armor
Been waiting for this one since we talked about apsx round for testing this and how stacking armor items behave for damage mitigation (Slaap plates on helmets/bastion helmet thing).
Thanks for doing the science I don't have the patience for
Ammo itself also has a ricochet chance. Helmet "ricochet chance" stat is a bunch of angles, the "low-medium" display stat is an arbitrary representation of these angles. I could easily send you the angle stats for all these helmets, and ricochet chance of any ammo, if you wanted. I can also send code of methods that handle ricochets.
I have seen more than I am willing to commit to video :) You don't happen to have any info about blunt damage/mitigation though do you...? That's the real one I'm interested in XD If you do Discord me, I might not see the comment if it's a reply (weird RUclips studio thing)
@@Gigabeef Don't have discord unfortunately, but blunt damage works like this:
float num1 = current durability / max durability * 100;
float num2 = armorClass;
float num3 = (121 - 5000 / (45 + num1 + 2)) * num2 * 0.01;
float damage *= ArmorBluntThroughputValue * clamp(1 - 0.03 * (num3 - ammoPen), 0.2, 1);
I don't recall exactly, but armor class may be represented as 100, 200, 300 etc. instead of just 1, 2, 3. Would have to do the math both ways to confirm. ArmotBluntThroughputValue is a stat each armor has, and its unique to each armor. The higher the number, the more damage it allows through the armor. Ammo penetration will be different at different ranges of course. The clamp works like this :(value, min, max). It returns value only if it is within min or max, and obviously returns one or the other if it is outside the limits. '*=' means the damage of the round is equal to itself multiplied by that sum.
ArmotBluntThroughputValue also determines stamina drain from getting hit, as an aside.
@@LaughingMan44 This is very interesting. I assume a similar formula works for damage mitigation on penetration through armor? That float num3 is very familiar as it's part of the regular pen calc too - useful stuff thanks
@@Gigabeef I could be mistaken, but I think if the round penetrated this is the formula:
float damage *= Clamp(ammoPen / (num3 + 12), 0.6, 1);
So If I'm interpreting it right, the maximum damage reduction armor can do after penetration is 40%. That seems consistent with my experience in EFT and testing in SPT.
Reading the code can be hard sometimes, it's all decompiled from the .dll, not from source code obviously. So a lot of it is badly obfuscated by the compiler, and most of the values are "num1" or "method_1", so sometimes it's hard to interpret. Fortunately for the armor calculations, most of the values are named. The downside of that being that often BSG's naming conventions are...strange and unhelpful to say the least.
Unless you're playing on a map with fog because BSG never fixed the way fog interacts with glasses so you can see them clear as day through fog.
I wonder whether you reached a max cap for ricochet chance. The Condor should have a lower ricochet chance than the trooper mask on paper, but not in your test, and at the maximum angle you have many more ricochets than any of the helmets did with any of the rounds at smaller angles.
Love these testing videos. It’s incredible that knowledge of this stuff hasn’t been figured out by now with how popular Tarkov is.
Condors literally saved my life & took a bullet straight to the glasses 😅 killed the guy and went on about my raid and extracted 😂
Would love to see some testing done on raised face shields to improve ricochet chance on a helmet, combined with glasses for eyes. Really good info here ❤
My guess is that the raised shield does nothing at all, from my understanding of the hitboxes and mechanics but you never know I suppose
Thankyou so much I've been wondering about this for a long time...not going to pretend it was the most exciting video (no fault of your own) but thank you so much.
Haha yeee I tried really hard to make it more interesting lmao but it was TOUGH. Did the job though :D
@@Gigabeef well I have a dull dulset tone so if i’d done it, it would have been in the help you get to sleep category. Again really big thanks for doing it! Look forward to seeing your ricochet helmet one :)
Bullets only ricochet if they don’t penetrate. What’s happening is the condor is causing the ricochet and the trooper is stopping the round in the majority of cases where both are considered
I got saved from TK'ing a clan mate by his condors ricocheting an M61 at 10yards.... I was almost as shocked as he was - lol
I’d love to see the data on the ratnik helmet! I wear it almost exclusively, great balance of stats and price
Yep agreed!
from personal experience without any logging, i find BASTION and ULACH being the helmets most likely giving a ricochet, saved my ass so many times and that level 3 helmets are basically useless, they get penned all the time, even with shit ammo. (i dont ever use helmets that cant take headset, like 1-3x for lols per wipe in factory only altyn or something.)
the fast lvl 3 faceshield also has a ricochet chance which is probably better than the mando mask
That's interesting. I had two different assumptions were proven false or inaccurate
1. That ricochet stacked
2. That ricochet damage to armor was 1
Good stuff.
Airwing would agree👍
I always tell people forget about trying to richochet a good round worry about stopping a shitty round from a scav
I’ve actually kept track of the exact number of times I’ve worn Condors for the last five weeks. I’ve bought and wore Condors exactly 61 times in five weeks and they’ve saved me quite literally zero times when having been shot in the eyes.
I ONCE bounced an M61 from my Condors and ONCE an M995.
deepdive into tarkovmultiverse with giga... who else🤷♂️ brilliant as usual 😌☝️😎
U are the tarkov's mad scientist!
very interesting. So you should also wear Ratnik helmet for high ricochet chance
I wonder now how helmet stacking works with the slapp and Mando face. I saw on Reddit ppl were saying it rolls twice but not sure which rolls first or how much the bullet is impacted if it pens the first
I’ve had 2 BP ricochet off of an enemy’s face before my unfortunate death in the Laboratory
They amount of times I 've been saved by condors makes every rouble's worth of those 16k.
I wonder if it calculates the glasses first because it counts the facemask as part of the helmet or something like that.
Can you test if the airframe helmet with airframe chops and the face shield together have double the ricochet chances for the jaws area?
Perhaps in future, good idea
I was about to say that this testing is huge and even hard to think of, but then you told about this redditor. Damn this guy is insane.
Emercom camping scav bounced buckshot of my condors. Made my head red and had a heavy bleed. He must’ve been tilted.
Really enjoy your vids! Great work.
Awesome Video, I've wanted to know the answer to this since I started!
Fun fact: the hitbox of condors glasses is so big that even when wearing and altyn or rys T, head eyes will damage the condors.
There are no separate hitboxes for the different armors, which is why gigabeef mentions the trooper mask being much larger than the actual hitbox (much like other armors protecting entire arm while covering barely the elbows etc) . For some reason though, the system does not work like it used to, back when you could stack armored rigs with armor, which If I remember correctly checked the rig before armor. There is no reason why condors should take damage before actual helmet components.
@@Chilionloppu im not saying there is any logic behind it, because if you think about it there should be no damage to the condors unless there is full penetration, but then you would also be dead. however when you get hit with anything on the face the condors also lose armor points, even if you reflected a low pen round or took some buckshot to the face doing 1 damage, the condors will always get damaged which makes no sense, but still does stack the effect of ricochet chance. the hitboxes in this game desperately need a rework.
Man's a genius
I literally got a ricochet con the condor from the mounted .50 cal from a scav
Excellent work. Weird that the medium ricochet's armor is so close to the high ricochet's results.
Does the ricochet chance of the round itself affect the chance more than the armor?
Seems to have no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell - I only did it with one bullet but from the reddit testing, there's no correlation between the round's ricochet chance and the results they had. That was one thing I was most interested in!
Great video ,im using that combo for a long time
THIS precise topic is what I'm looking for so far, I want to know if my Condor and Heavy Trooper is all for looks or it does have a function (ricochet mainly) to justify my kit :)) Thanks for the video, you're among the best Tarkov CC for infos 🤩👍
Although on some further readings I found out that ammunition has their own ricochet chance, I'm thinking it might help with min/max ricochet angle; my understanding came from World of Tanks penetration angle mechanics in which each round type has separate normalization angle for armor penetration calculation so that a relatively high pen round would have to hit much closer to 90* for successful pen all the while low pen round can hit at shallower angle and 'might' have a chance to 'bite' on the armor thus penetrating it (or NOT getting ricocheted). But all that is from different game 🥴 sooo the understanding might not be all accurate to Tarkov.
The round's ricochet seems to have no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell - I only did it with one bullet but from the reddit testing, there's no correlation between the round's ricochet chance and the results they had. That was one thing I was most interested in!
it's weird it checks the condors first
watching shit like this just blows my mind of how complicated tarakov's game mechanics actually get...
What about richochet chances of the bullets themselves? How do those matter? The EFT wiki states ricochet chances of each bullet being different too with AP SX at 60% whatever that means and for example Warmageddon at 90% and .300 Blackout AP at 10%.
Excellent call out. I was going to do the same. I've noticed ricochet off of Armor. I need to find the clip but I suspect that it could impact helmet, face shields, and glasses.
Seems to have no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell - I only did it with one bullet but from the reddit testing, there's no correlation between the round's ricochet chance and the results they had. That was one thing I was most interested in!
Lol my friend just died the other day in a firefight because the guy he killed richoched 7.62 BP off his condors🤣 he was streaming so we tuned in to his chat and he explained it😂
Ha!
This is very interesting
Condors save lives
3:32 I don't know man, if I got shot directly in the face, my heart would skip a beat at least
My glasses have only ever ricocheted a 7.62 ps from a player scav, was pretty lucky xD
Instead of aiming at head, find a spot where your character has a good set of repeatable lines, then have the enemy walk forward into your line of fire.
Otherwise figure out if there is a better way to keep the target more still. Maybe moving forward into corner, or backwards, or into a targeting line/ backwards from one line
My friend ricocheted 338 Lapua AP with the trooper mask
That guy was so lucky
saw that first clip live! haha
My tatkov mate ALWAYS get ricochets on his helmets, even with the shittiest of lvl 3 ratniks he always gets head contusion but survives... but me ehhh I dont even use helmets anymore unless I loot it on someone I kill because I always get oneshotted through it
Found an EXFILL with the face shield the other day and simply got one shotted through it from behind by M855 or something
And we can't count how many times we killed some ultra Chad running around with a slick and a 300k rubles weapon but no helmet
They're right, I'm not wasting my money anymore
Maybe one day when Lady Luck turns but until them it's useless to me
I would use outplayed but it doesnt work with windows 11 insider builds that im stuck with
i like ur math
Warthunder players might be familiar with this.
I'm a Maus enjoyer so I am very familiar with rounds ricocheting
@@zachrowe6271 *laughs in heatspam*
So giga- do we know if the armor class 1 and 2 of the glasses and mask combined become the equivalent of class 3 ? Because I feel like this a secondary “assumed benefit” of stacking the condors and mask
Go back a couple years and find some data from when you could wear body armor and armored rigs together, those were the tanky days. The body armor would only start taking bullets once the rig was zeroed or penned and then it would be just a normal roll, although now with the damage reduction and drop off it could be different, who knows without testing~
Good point, I don't know currently :)
Could you do Airframe Chops+Faceshield combo test?
Maybe in the future, it takes SO long 😂
Glasses are just not worth it imo because of the graphics bug that means at distance, they show through the fog way more than the rest of the character, I've headshotted people wearing glasses from distance where I wouldn't have been able to spot them because of that.
Only some glasses do that, Condors are not one of them
I would love to know if zeroed helmets and Condors still have the same chance to ricochet as the undamaged ones. :v
Ricochades 🕶
another aspect I'd like to know is do the armor ratings stack? if shot in the eyes while wearing both would they act as lvl3 armor? or would the round only need the penetration value high enough for one or the other?
This math was done back in the days when armor rigs first came out and could be stacked with normal armors. The lvl does not stack, but having layers was beneficial regardless - a good idea was to have, for instance, a lvl4 or 5 armor below and a lvl3 or 4 rig on top. The rig would tank smaller rounds and prevent damage to the better armor, which would then tank any bigger rounds that got through the rig. I don't recall whether a bullet's chance to penetrate the main armor was reduced after penetrating the rig, but I'm sure you can find the answer with some googling. But for instance two lvl3s definitely didn't form a lvl6 if that's what you're asking.
headbutted an lps gzh out of the air this wipe
Do bullets really come out the barrel? I thought they come out your face like COD and a lot of other shooters. From seeing rengawrs video on right lean peak they can shoot you before you even see their barrel (though this might be a visual/collision model thing)
Yes, they come out of the barrel.
It comes out of the barrel on your screen - how that gets represented on their screen is another matter hah
Each round has a ricochet chance associated with it as well. Interestingly APSX has a ricochet chance of 60% listed in the wiki. Perhaps that number is why you landed in that area at the shallowest angle possible during your testing? Strangely though rounds like 7.62 BP and BS have a relatively low number yet in the reddit test done on the helmets they had a shockingly high chance to bounce when at the 60 degree angle.... Tarkov math makes my brain hurt.
I think the ricochet chance on the ammo stats does nothing, but it's very hard to tell
Shattered mask master race
it doesent matter if its 762 or 9mm its the ricochet chance what matters
I ate a m80 shot head on with condors
is that now true? That you can heal head / thorax with "0 hp" while still being alive???
Only if it has a fraction behind the scenes. In our case it LOOKS like 0, but it isn't actually blacked - normally you can't heal it if it goes to actual 0 from a bleed for example
That Ronin chart is wack, I have witnessed more than one ricochet from it this wipe.
Glasses that bounce riffle ammo, whose brilliant idea was this? Surely they didn't know about the already insane amount of RNG already in the game before adding these, oh well, just another convoluted mechanic that will be broken by an update, somewhere down the line
If all this is true then why, in God's Grace, do I keep getting head, top of head 1 tapped through my full durability tier 4 helmets by rounds that only have a ~20% chance of penning?
7.62x39 PS is the sole reason why I'm gonna be bald by 30.
Sadly Outplayed always disabled my numpad so I uninstalled it, good program otherwise
I couldve sworn Nikita said a blacked head was a bug. Was this changed, patched, or did he just troll?
He did say it was a bug in a podcast. It's never been mentioned since then and its been awhile.
Yep he said it was a bug. Never got changed - hopefully it doesn't I think it's ok as it is tbh
@@Gigabeef Agreed. It's an amazing feeling to actually survive like that. You take any damage and you're dead.
One may read the title wrong.
Why didn't you both just go prone, then?
BasedBeef
3:12 what the actual fuck?
tl; dr?
they do bounce, it doesn't seem to stack
Sup gigabeef, I've used outplayed for a while now and in intensive scenes it frame rate drops servery, you got any tips for that
Hmm are you using NVENC to encode or your CPU? Maybe lower the bitrate