Now I had to read this part in the original version (German is my first language) - and the newer translation sounds much more like Kafka, it's way better. I can confirm 😊 I've read Perdido Street Station by China Mieville translated to German by Eva Bauche-Eppers and immediately felt that this must be a good translation because her writing was extraordinarily good. I've read the second part of the trilogy, The Scar, in English and it felt so similar in tone. There was no great difference in style other than the one was in German and the other one in English. That's what a good translation does.
as a graduated translator who prefers to teach, I'd say your respect for translation is what makes your channel this oasis of multicultural wonder people are so lucky to find: thank you for every book and every review. 🌍
Amazing video! It has always fascinated me how different the approach to literary translation is in English speaking countries and the rest of the word! I can't judge Doborah Smith's translation since I can't speak Korean, but in the English translation of some of Murakami's books (I speak Japanese, so I was able to compare), there are whole passages missing, which, if that happened in my country, would be probably close to a scandal. The translation into my native language however isn't perfect, either; the translator uses really pretty, poetic, almost flowery language, but the tone is nothing like the original. I am currently doing a little bit of translation (a bit of fiction and non-fiction) myself and it is incredibly difficult to keep the tone and stay as faithful as possible to the original at the same time!
Fascinating! I would love to know your thoughts on more “loose” translations that some consider to be interpretations. I’m specifically thinking of translators like Anne Carson who write beautiful translations that deviate from the original texts’ voice (and sometimes plot) significantly. I’m still working my head around this question.
Awesome video - I always read in the original where I can, but I so appreciate translators for all the many, many languages I'll never learn. One of my favorite little books is *19 Ways of Looking at Wang Wei: With More Ways* by Eliot Weinberger, which presents us with 20+ translations of a classic Tang dynasty poem by Wang Wei, most into English but also into French, Spanish, and German (maybe one more?) If anything brings home that a translation is also a work of creative literature unto itself, this will. (and translating poetry brings a whole 'nother level of difficulty to a translation).
This is such a fantastic and interesting subject. I recently read Anna Karenina. I looked for information on the different translations to see which was "best". And man, that was a rabbit hole. One person had put together an article talking about the merits and criticisms of each translation... and there are several. There's some that are technically accurate, but are stiff or that fail to capture the feeling of the original. Or that capture the feeling, but feel outdated. And there are translations where the translator seems more concerned with putting their own stamp on it. And then there's those that try to modernize the story, to give it the feeling to us, now that it had on people who read it when it was originally published. There's no such thing as a perfect translation. And it's good to know about the differences and choose one that speaks to you. But when there's only one option, and you don't know the original language--which is the case for most translated books--you can only judge it by the writing.
Kafka would laugh while reading "The Metamorphosis" to his friends.... they say "A Thousand Years of German Humour is the shortest book in the World.'" Translation is fraught with difficulties, the opening line of L'Etranger by Camus in French reads: "Aujourd'hui, maman est morte. Ou peut-être hier, je ne sais pas. " How the translator translates "maman" determines how the reader will view Meursault the central character, if translated as 'mother' it would be too formal, if translated as 'mummy' it would seem too childish, some translators just leave in the French word "maman" because of this ambiguity.
I feel like there's definitely a vibe you pick up on and I don't think I can explain it very well but agree with everything you've said here. I want that newer Kafka translation now
I have the Barnes & Noble print, translated by a Donna Freed. She writes the opening line as "the emperor, Or so they say, has sent you - his single most contemptible subject, the miniscule shadow that has fled the farthest distance from the Imperial sun - only to you has the emperor sent a message from his deathbed." And the final line she gives as "but you sit at your window and dream it up as evening falls." I never cared for the writing, but it's definitely better than that hardcover version you have. Gives me a new perspective on it.
How amazingly timely! I'm reading The Brothers Karamazov right now, and the complexities and art of translation has been on my mind. I love the collaboration of it. Every translator brings something a little different to the table, for better or worse, but that's kind of great I think - an unread book is just a void until a reader picks it up and pulls meaning from it, translators included. Another reviewer always says re: translations to 'find a translation and translator that you get along with' and while I agree with that, it can be hard to find a translator who gets along with the original text in the first place. A more 1:1 translation might be more accurate, technically, but a translation that takes a little bit of creative liberty might do a _much_ better job of pulling the author's intent and personality forward into the new language. It's so interesting to think about, and I'm so happy that translators specifically are getting more attention for their work. 💚
This entire video (and the fantastic quote from 02:02 - 02:57) is a balm to my soul after spending the whole day ranting about the very real initiative by the Japanese government and private sectors to use AI for "high volume" manga translations. The Japanese Association of Translators are pushing back but ... the fact that this is on the table on an industry standardization level (and not just amateurs) is driving me insane. It's such an obviously stupid idea I truly have no words.
That is a gross injustice towards the necessary humanity that translators bring to their work. The creativity we see from manga translators should be celebrated constantly. Caleb Cook, my favourite manga translator, is one of the most creative writers in the industry. But none of that matters to capitalists and governments. Replace paid talent with AI and save so much money in the process, only to diminish the art they’re profiting from
@@WillowTalksBooks You summed up the whole poisonous capitalist mentality killing us all so eloquently. Reaching the end of a manga volume and reading through the translator's notes are genuinely one of my favorite things. The nuance, context, intention, artistry, etc. behind their choices and how deep their skill and care runs in their dialogue with the text/author always leaves me in awe. Not to mention the deeper appreciation for the material that it engenders. And Caleb Cook is so fantastic! I think Jocelyne Allen might be my personal favorite. ^_^
"A translator is a writer", good shot! The same thing was said when julio cortázar translated edgar allan poe's complete tales into spanish: a writer is the best translator of another writer.
Speaking of translators, here's something interesting about the impact they can have on literature. I recently moved to Brazil and have been taking classes. My teacher is a translator who loves to read, so I asked her what is a good Brazilian classic to check out. She said Dom Casmurro by Machado de Assis, but added "Make sure you get the one with the Helen Caldwell translation." I asked her why and it turns out it isn't just because Helen was a great translator (she was), but also because of the impact her work had on Brazilian literature as a result. Due to the nature of the story "Dom Casmurro" - the interpretation of the work had been hotly debated in Brazilian literary circles and the culpability of the woman Capitu. But it was her University of California publication in 1960 "The Brazilian Othello of Machado de Assis : a study of Don Casmurro" that introduced a new view and turned the entire literary debate in Brazil on its head, leading for the work itself to be reinterpreted by many Brazilians in a new light. I find it so interesting that an American had such a deep impact on the interpretation of one of the most famous works in Brazil and yet Americans -- even Brazilian-Americans like me -- never knew about it.
@@danielaweberdani I love it here! Brazil is a complicated country, but there is so much I love and appreciate about my new life here. The literature is amazing, so I am studying portuguese by reading good stories.
A person thinks a story and then writes it. Another person reads the written story, interprets it according to his understanding, and then writes what he understands the original writer has written about his thoughts. Can a translation be better than the original work? Better than what the author originally thought? What was originally written? I suppose that this is possible and that in that case, there are two authors.
Borges wrote that the original can be unfaithful to the translation. So yes. (He commented that English was his favorite language partly because, having both Latin and Saxon origins, it’s got two words for many, many concepts right there ready to go.)
@@GentleReader01 My native language is Spanish and I also struggle with English. But I have seen that there are English words that I miss in Spanish and Spanish words that seem heavier than their English counterpart.
@@EduardoRodriguez-du2vd Absolutely. And since one of the hallmarks of good writing is using language precisely, the better the original, the more work a good translation takes. I find the whole thing fascinating.
I'm reading The Eighth Life now, translated from German, and I'm just completely in love with the writing. It's definitely done well. I think it was also up for the Booker International?
The best transalted fiction I've ever read has got to be "OUT" by Natsuo Kirino, translated by Stephen Snyder. I would have never guessed in a million years that it was translated from Japanese if I didn't know that beforehand. The four people I loaned it to agreed. It is really seamless and I've read other translated books which are a bit clunky and awkward in places, like the examples you give in this video. I am in awe of people who achieve the level of proficiency in another language that is required to do that kind of work. Like, WOW. Also, you make me want to read Kafka. lol.
I have Donna Freed’s translation of The Metamorphosis that Barnes and Noble published. I got it used, so the price was right, but I wonder how it compares to other translations.
I wish could find that translation of kafka I only could find an older translation which is fine sort of. It feels a little rough around the edges an the font is horrible which makes it a rough read which is a shame because I really like kafka. Hopefully I can find a much better translation in the future
Reflecting on trends is really important: in older German literature there is this phenomenon called “Romansprache” (the direct translation is novel language). Its a specific way of writing thats quite different from common spoken language and it’s very prevalent. When translating the translators would copy this style of writing. When Svetlana Geier translated Dostoyevsky into German, she was the first one to not adapt this style. And people discovered a completely different Dostoyevsky. Geier is the prime example of a great translator in every German literature course I ever took.
Now I had to read this part in the original version (German is my first language) - and the newer translation sounds much more like Kafka, it's way better. I can confirm 😊
I've read Perdido Street Station by China Mieville translated to German by Eva Bauche-Eppers and immediately felt that this must be a good translation because her writing was extraordinarily good. I've read the second part of the trilogy, The Scar, in English and it felt so similar in tone. There was no great difference in style other than the one was in German and the other one in English. That's what a good translation does.
Brilliantly put, I couldn’t agree more, and thank you for confirming my thoughts!
So true. Literary translators deserve much more appreciation (and remuneration).
as a graduated translator
who prefers to teach, I'd say
your respect for translation is
what makes your channel this
oasis of multicultural wonder
people are so lucky to find:
thank you for every book
and every review. 🌍
As a PhD candidate in Literature and Translation, this was such a good video, and the kind of video that makes me love your channel ♥
Thank you so much!
Amazing video!
It has always fascinated me how different the approach to literary translation is in English speaking countries and the rest of the word! I can't judge Doborah Smith's translation since I can't speak Korean, but in the English translation of some of Murakami's books (I speak Japanese, so I was able to compare), there are whole passages missing, which, if that happened in my country, would be probably close to a scandal. The translation into my native language however isn't perfect, either; the translator uses really pretty, poetic, almost flowery language, but the tone is nothing like the original. I am currently doing a little bit of translation (a bit of fiction and non-fiction) myself and it is incredibly difficult to keep the tone and stay as faithful as possible to the original at the same time!
This is such a succinct and impactful way to discuss translation - thank you
Yes to all of this. I don't speak Japanese but I have a feeling that Ginny Tapley Takemori translate Sayaka Murata's works so well.
I love your floral print! So pretty!
Fascinating! I would love to know your thoughts on more “loose” translations that some consider to be interpretations. I’m specifically thinking of translators like Anne Carson who write beautiful translations that deviate from the original texts’ voice (and sometimes plot) significantly. I’m still working my head around this question.
Awesome video - I always read in the original where I can, but I so appreciate translators for all the many, many languages I'll never learn. One of my favorite little books is *19 Ways of Looking at Wang Wei: With More Ways* by Eliot Weinberger, which presents us with 20+ translations of a classic Tang dynasty poem by Wang Wei, most into English but also into French, Spanish, and German (maybe one more?) If anything brings home that a translation is also a work of creative literature unto itself, this will. (and translating poetry brings a whole 'nother level of difficulty to a translation).
This is such a fantastic and interesting subject. I recently read Anna Karenina. I looked for information on the different translations to see which was "best". And man, that was a rabbit hole. One person had put together an article talking about the merits and criticisms of each translation... and there are several. There's some that are technically accurate, but are stiff or that fail to capture the feeling of the original. Or that capture the feeling, but feel outdated. And there are translations where the translator seems more concerned with putting their own stamp on it. And then there's those that try to modernize the story, to give it the feeling to us, now that it had on people who read it when it was originally published.
There's no such thing as a perfect translation. And it's good to know about the differences and choose one that speaks to you.
But when there's only one option, and you don't know the original language--which is the case for most translated books--you can only judge it by the writing.
Kafka would laugh while reading "The Metamorphosis" to his friends.... they say "A Thousand Years of German Humour is the shortest book in the World.'" Translation is fraught with difficulties, the opening line of L'Etranger by Camus in French reads: "Aujourd'hui, maman est morte. Ou peut-être hier, je ne sais pas. " How the translator translates "maman" determines how the reader will view Meursault the central character, if translated as 'mother' it would be too formal, if translated as 'mummy' it would seem too childish, some translators just leave in the French word "maman" because of this ambiguity.
I feel like there's definitely a vibe you pick up on and I don't think I can explain it very well but agree with everything you've said here. I want that newer Kafka translation now
I have the Barnes & Noble print, translated by a Donna Freed. She writes the opening line as "the emperor, Or so they say, has sent you - his single most contemptible subject, the miniscule shadow that has fled the farthest distance from the Imperial sun - only to you has the emperor sent a message from his deathbed."
And the final line she gives as "but you sit at your window and dream it up as evening falls." I never cared for the writing, but it's definitely better than that hardcover version you have. Gives me a new perspective on it.
How amazingly timely! I'm reading The Brothers Karamazov right now, and the complexities and art of translation has been on my mind. I love the collaboration of it. Every translator brings something a little different to the table, for better or worse, but that's kind of great I think - an unread book is just a void until a reader picks it up and pulls meaning from it, translators included.
Another reviewer always says re: translations to 'find a translation and translator that you get along with' and while I agree with that, it can be hard to find a translator who gets along with the original text in the first place. A more 1:1 translation might be more accurate, technically, but a translation that takes a little bit of creative liberty might do a _much_ better job of pulling the author's intent and personality forward into the new language. It's so interesting to think about, and I'm so happy that translators specifically are getting more attention for their work. 💚
This was so helpful! Thanks Willow!
This entire video (and the fantastic quote from 02:02 - 02:57) is a balm to my soul after spending the whole day ranting about the very real initiative by the Japanese government and private sectors to use AI for "high volume" manga translations. The Japanese Association of Translators are pushing back but ... the fact that this is on the table on an industry standardization level (and not just amateurs) is driving me insane. It's such an obviously stupid idea I truly have no words.
That is a gross injustice towards the necessary humanity that translators bring to their work. The creativity we see from manga translators should be celebrated constantly. Caleb Cook, my favourite manga translator, is one of the most creative writers in the industry. But none of that matters to capitalists and governments. Replace paid talent with AI and save so much money in the process, only to diminish the art they’re profiting from
@@WillowTalksBooks You summed up the whole poisonous capitalist mentality killing us all so eloquently. Reaching the end of a manga volume and reading through the translator's notes are genuinely one of my favorite things. The nuance, context, intention, artistry, etc. behind their choices and how deep their skill and care runs in their dialogue with the text/author always leaves me in awe. Not to mention the deeper appreciation for the material that it engenders. And Caleb Cook is so fantastic! I think Jocelyne Allen might be my personal favorite. ^_^
Thank you willow ❤❤❤
"A translator is a writer", good shot! The same thing was said when julio cortázar translated edgar allan poe's complete tales into spanish: a writer is the best translator of another writer.
Oh no! Just when I thought I had enough Kafka books!
You look gorgeous btw!
Thank you 🥹
Speaking of translators, here's something interesting about the impact they can have on literature. I recently moved to Brazil and have been taking classes. My teacher is a translator who loves to read, so I asked her what is a good Brazilian classic to check out. She said Dom Casmurro by Machado de Assis, but added "Make sure you get the one with the Helen Caldwell translation." I asked her why and it turns out it isn't just because Helen was a great translator (she was), but also because of the impact her work had on Brazilian literature as a result.
Due to the nature of the story "Dom Casmurro" - the interpretation of the work had been hotly debated in Brazilian literary circles and the culpability of the woman Capitu. But it was her University of California publication in 1960 "The Brazilian Othello of Machado de Assis : a study of Don Casmurro" that introduced a new view and turned the entire literary debate in Brazil on its head, leading for the work itself to be reinterpreted by many Brazilians in a new light. I find it so interesting that an American had such a deep impact on the interpretation of one of the most famous works in Brazil and yet Americans -- even Brazilian-Americans like me -- never knew about it.
oh welcome to brazil,
i hope you like our local
lifestyle as much as you
appreciated our greatest
author's work, cheers! 🇧🇷
@@danielaweberdani I love it here! Brazil is a complicated country, but there is so much I love and appreciate about my new life here. The literature is amazing, so I am studying portuguese by reading good stories.
@@Rotwood haha
you're being so kind,
"complicated" is to
say the least! 🙃
That's fascinating!
I really love Marjam Idriss's translations for Paradise Rot and Girls Against God :)
Paradise rot was so fantastic!
Thank you for sharing your knowledge about translated books.
Thank you for explaining what makes a good translation.
A person thinks a story and then writes it. Another person reads the written story, interprets it according to his understanding, and then writes what he understands the original writer has written about his thoughts.
Can a translation be better than the original work? Better than what the author originally thought? What was originally written?
I suppose that this is possible and that in that case, there are two authors.
Borges wrote that the original can be unfaithful to the translation. So yes. (He commented that English was his favorite language partly because, having both Latin and Saxon origins, it’s got two words for many, many concepts right there ready to go.)
@@GentleReader01 My native language is Spanish and I also struggle with English. But I have seen that there are English words that I miss in Spanish and Spanish words that seem heavier than their English counterpart.
@@EduardoRodriguez-du2vd Absolutely. And since one of the hallmarks of good writing is using language precisely, the better the original, the more work a good translation takes. I find the whole thing fascinating.
Thanks! That was excellent.
Thank you so much!
I have been waiting for this video thank you 🎉
I'm reading The Eighth Life now, translated from German, and I'm just completely in love with the writing. It's definitely done well. I think it was also up for the Booker International?
My anxiety about which translation to pick has stopped me reading a bunch of classics
Thanks
Thank you!
Brilliant video. BTW you need to narrate an audiobook
I have! I narrated The LGBTQ+ History Book last year :)
@@WillowTalksBooks found it ! Will listen to it this month
The best transalted fiction I've ever read has got to be "OUT" by Natsuo Kirino, translated by Stephen Snyder. I would have never guessed in a million years that it was translated from Japanese if I didn't know that beforehand. The four people I loaned it to agreed. It is really seamless and I've read other translated books which are a bit clunky and awkward in places, like the examples you give in this video. I am in awe of people who achieve the level of proficiency in another language that is required to do that kind of work. Like, WOW.
Also, you make me want to read Kafka. lol.
Snyder is the best J-E translator in my opinion. He also translated all of Yoko Ogawa’s works and they’re all gorgeous.
I have Donna Freed’s translation of The Metamorphosis that Barnes and Noble published. I got it used, so the price was right, but I wonder how it compares to other translations.
The newer translation is clearly better, but that hardcover edition is sooo pretty!
Yeah the Everyman Library is hard to resist! I have quite a few :)
I wish could find that translation of kafka I only could find an older translation which is fine sort of. It feels a little rough around the edges an the font is horrible which makes it a rough read which is a shame because I really like kafka. Hopefully I can find a much better translation in the future
Excellent. That you.
Reflecting on trends is really important: in older German literature there is this phenomenon called “Romansprache” (the direct translation is novel language). Its a specific way of writing thats quite different from common spoken language and it’s very prevalent. When translating the translators would copy this style of writing.
When Svetlana Geier translated Dostoyevsky into German, she was the first one to not adapt this style. And people discovered a completely different Dostoyevsky. Geier is the prime example of a great translator in every German literature course I ever took.
Thanks
Thank you so much!