The original Macintosh hacked! Internal hard drive!
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- Опубликовано: 8 мар 2024
- Has anyone tried this hack before? I don't think so! #marchintosh
The original Mac 128k with internal Rodime drive :)
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Tools I regularly use
DeoxIT D5 Contact Cleaner
Hanstar 861DW Rework Station
Pro'sKit SS-331 Desoldering Station
UNI-T UT61E Auto Ranging Multimeter
UNI-T UT890D Manual Ranging Multimeter
MESR-100 mk2 ESR meeter
PINECIL Soldering Iron
PinePowerPSU
TS-100 Soldering Iron
AMTECH NC-559-ASM Flux
Kester 951 Flux pen
MaAnt Grinding Pen
Multicore 60/40. 0.38mm and 0.5mm solder
TL866 II Plus Programmer
RIGOL DHO800 70MHz four-channel digital scope
Tektronix 2246A 100 MHz four-channel analog scope
InfiRay P2 Pro Thermal Camera
PCBs from PCBWay.com :)
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Music by Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio 
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Support me on patreon.com/Epictronics
Join me on Twitter: twitter.com/epictronics1
Ahhhhhhhhh~ Someone who takes RF shielding seriously.
It's so refreshing.
And absolutely necessary in this case :)
@@Epictronics1 This feels really really strange that it helped.
There is a massive metal hard drive that way, why would an extra thin foil help?
Am I not seeing something? I strongly suggest running RAM and FDD tests
Just to be sure, did you connect "ground" lead on the new power supply to the ground/chassis?
With all the plastic standoffs it may well be actually floating unless explicitly connected
@@jwhite5008 The shield is connected to ground and reduces the noise coming from the PSU presumably affecting the HDD. I'm not an expert on RF, but there are many good videos on YT on the topic. Here is an example using sound to illustrate the effect of a grounded shield: ruclips.net/video/fpD_mDCViPE/видео.html
@@Epictronics1 I see. I misunderstood.
You might be unlucky enough that unamplified signal read from the heads could be corrupted by RF from the PSU.
Newer HDDs usually have some protection against that but this very old one actually might not or it might not be enough.
The HDD might be designed to be installed in a metal chassis or close to one.
This is plausible.
In this case more shielding might be necessary - even if it appears to be stable it not necessarily is.
However a shield might also prevent proper heat exchange.
I'd still recommend running a disk read test for an extended period of time.
the heads might be inside the aluminum shell.. but there's still airgap for the pcb and the wiring. which is probably whats being affected.
newer drives tend to keep the majority of the circuit paths tucked inside the drives lower shell, and on the side of the pcb that faces the shell, so they can put a large ground plane in there to mitigate most of the RF concerns. old drives tended to just be stuffed in large steel cages to combat rf.
he could probably get away with having a alu or steel panel cut to shape and screwed into the side of the drive itself, so it covers the pcb on that side, and extends up past the drive itself a little bit, but not so far it comes near the tubes yoke assembly.
I remember the first time I saw an original Mac in a high-end department store, it only had the internal drive, and after figuring out how to use the mouse, it couldn't do anything because it kept complaining it needed a floppy disk (maybe the system disk).
I realize it seems crazy not to know how a mouse works, but every computer used a keyboard and you typed commands up to that point.
Very impressive hack.. I m not surprised about the shielding issue, but it is shocking to see it will not work without that in place. I'm sure you've already come up with a bit cleaner of an example to fix that, but I think what you've done here is quite ingenious. I suppose double sided non-conductive shielding affixed will do the trick permanently. Nice job, really! (I am not sure how I missed this video last week. Lucky for me I got 2 this weekend!!)
Thanks. I'm thinking, I'll improve the shielding with self-adhesive EMI foil. But first, I need to find out if the analog board has enough power to eliminate the second power supply
Friends don’t let friends hack electronics without proper shielding 😊well done sir.
Thanks :)
Excellent workmanship, the drilling of the cage was a pleasure to watch 🙂
Thanks!
Nice! I thought the big issue with the connector was that it's RIVETED to the motherboard! You didn't show us the moment where you were drilling into the Macintosh Motherboard! :)
I didn't replace the ones of my SE because of that - now I also know they're not standard pitch so happy days!
haha, they are standard d-sub pitch, but different pitch from regular pin headers. The rivets were not difficult. I removed the solder and then drilled it from the connector side. no need to drill on mobo side. Just pull them out that way. Good luck!
I remember installing hyperdrives in 512k Macs back in the day.
I have the mac 128k since the end of the 80s, and it was really a pain for me. No one else had it, so no word files sharing, neither games diskettes 😂
Wonderful work!
The oversized screen geometry is triggering me however. These machines look better with the correct geometry (the floppy icon should measure 11mm x 11mm).
Yeah, I was in a hurry when swapping the tube. When matching a tube to an analog board one has to readjust all the settings. I only had time to quickly make it look ok to finish the video on time. I will be spending some time fine-tuning it eventually. Thanks
@Epictronics I love your channel and content. Keep up the good job. Greetings from Steven from the Netherlands
Thank you :) Say hello to Steven
0:38 I bouhht this kit. That was me. I paid $250 for it. The GCC HyperDrive only works on tbe 512k with the old ROMs as far as I am aware.
I only bought it because I wanted the mechanical hard disk from the kit - an MMI 112. They are very rare and I wanted one for my hard disk collection. Sadly, it doesn't work!
Sorry to hear the drive doesn't work, but congrats on getting the kit anyway. It's a pretty awesome and rare kit! Are there any other drives that are compatible with the controller?
Great video! Thank you for using period correct hardware. Tired of lazy modernization and SSD solutions.
I did a similar hack in 1986 with the much easier target Mac Plus 1MB. Because it has SCSI, just not internal SCSI. I put a fujitsu 30MB drive in it, on top of the floppy drive.
The thought crossed my mind just yesterday! I was going through my early SCSI drives and was thinking that I should install one in the Mac Plus :) I probably will in a future video.
Outstanding work and great video 👍👍👍
Thanks
You're making some of the best tech content on YT.
Thank you :)
This mod is brilliant! Great work! I’ve had issues testing floppy drives in Pluses that seemed to be EMI-related. People told me that I was wrong; it’s nice to get some additional EMI problem confirmation.
Thanks! Yep, don't throw away those C64 shields, use them in a Mac :)
I'm here for this kind of retro computing madness!
:)
Nicely done!
Thanks!
Love the channel. Smart trick with the glue on the connector pins
Thanks
I am sure somewhere i stumbled across a ide or fdd snap on fitting similar to a cloths peg in some OEM machines that was used for basic cable management it was sort of a V hinge shaped flat plastic strap with a clip on the end to clamp it flat.
I fixed up messy wiring on 286 or 386 based machines using aliexpress plastic bobby pins ( girls hair accessory )
i probably would have removed the pins one by one and inserted them into a proper connector in the same order
Wow what a crazy hack, nicely done!
And holy cow, yes get a fan in there ASAP 😂🥵
Thanks, Yeah, that Mac sure is toasty :)
Exceptional work!
Thanks!
Uhh... watch out: that castle is CURSED!!!
You could resolder the external port back on and still use it, with the internal floppy drive daisy chained off the HD20. The 512K and Plus ROMs are "HD20 aware." You can actually daisychain multiple HD20s and still connect a floppy drive, so long as the floppy drive is the last device in the chain. You'd need an external-to-internal Macintosh floppy cable adapter, but it would be possible.
You are going to like one of my planned videos :)
Kudos this was a great mod and so much work.
Thanks
What an awesome crazy hack!
Thanks :)
You might want to use a metal plate with more screws for attaching the harddisk to the drive cage, so that it doesn't just hang there so wobbly on two screws.
Other than that, good job.
Thanks!
A day of Mac hacks? Adrian Black also released a video on hacking memory into a mac a few hours ago.
8:50 you can easily remove the metal pins out of BLS connector plastic shells, buy a proper BLD, and it obviously comes with shell and pins separate, and then just slide all the pins with wires attached inside the new shell. It would take just a few minutes to remove all the pins. But gluing them together works too. You need to have them really pressed against each other to make sure all of them are actually glued without a crevice - especially laterally
The trick to removing the pins is to push the wire forward instead of tugging on it, slide a needle to the side, then under the locking latch, raise the latch, and then pull the wire out. If you try to lift the latch while tugging on the wire it's much harder to do.
If you are ok with destroying the plastic shell (which you then replace anyway) you can carefully snip the latch with very small cutters, or hook and snap the latch with a hook needle - this speeds up the process to a second or two per pin
Although I personally would have tried to find a matching connector and soldered a normal ribbon cable to such a connector.
13:50 If you need just one or two extra millimeters of depth occupied by the rear end of a IDCC ribbon cable, remove the rear plastic bracket and unfold the cable that it held. That thing is for cable retention, the cable can operate normally without one if you don't pull on it with considerable force.The next bracket plastic bracket underneath is for holding the pins in - don't remove it.
20:10 In addition to properly securing the shield, use double-sided tape to stick any cardboard on top of conductive shield to make it unconductive. Be sure to properly ground it with a rivet first. You can run a thin multi-braid stripped wire through the hole before riveting it to connect the wire to the metal more or less reliably.
Similarly you can make a shield easily with cooking aluminum foil and cardboard. Glue to the surface that seems duller. Not all glues work well so try a few you have, but it usually glues without issue.
It also feels really weird that that piece of shielding helped. It either should not be enough or not be necessary. I think there may be more to it like installing also broken a short or something. Try running memory and floppy tests and carefully removing the shielding.
That's very clever, thanks. I have a suitable cable with a matching connector for the controller but no good solution for connecting it to the mobo yet. There was one connector that would work, but it's obsolete and unobtanium unfortunately. Maybe I'll get lucky on eBay
@@Epictronics1 Sorry, I know little about MACs specifically so I erroneously assumed it's a standard D-Sub.
An obvious solution is to just solder the ribbon cable to the MOBO, securing it with a generous amount of silicon or rubber glue. The secret of preventing it from tearing off is to separate the wires for a couple of cm (an inch) and not at the very end, and securing with glue.
But there is no point if you already soldered a pin header.
Though I would recommend silicon-gluing the cable - connectors and all - to the MOBO anyway since detaching that now would mean pulling up a schematic and rechecking which you would probably like to avoid.
Or if you would like to avoid it looking hideous - stick a note with exact pinout by wire color somewhere in case you accidentally pull it off.
Oh and - it goes without saying - thanks for the work you do and videos you share!
@@Epictronics1 Oh I forgot!
Not sure if this is of any use to you but just in case:
You can also buy cardboard RF shield in local art stores and school supply shops. It is sold in colored paper section. Search for foiled cardboard or foil sticker which easily glues to cardboard and plastic.
Sometimes it's called gold/silver color cardboard though that could also mean just paint which is not usable for shielding. Paint appears matte, while foil is always glossy.
Unfortunately often the foil is extremely thin and covered by a thin layer of pvc which makes it almost impossible to attach a grounding wire with any reliability.
Personal inspection in a physical store is recommended but I don't know a reliable way to tell if it's good, unless you bring a multimeter to an art shop, at which point I'm not liable for an unexpected visit to a mental care facility...
My local supermarket also sells ~5cm wide (~2-inch) foil sticky tape in tools and glues section, and that is good for a shield.
I was like "ohh, glue?! I'd just grab a 2x10 dupont plug from my stash".. :) For once I'd have something "in stock" that could be useful here! As you can easily remove the contacts by lifting the little lip and then reinsert them into a larger connector. But gluing clearly works as well...
Yeah, that would have been a better solution. Unfortunately, I didn't have a BLD-20
@@Epictronics1 Your fix was something I would not have thought of myself and it seems to have worked!
That's quite mad but tremendously fascinating and impressive! 😉
Thanks :)
Great Hack Love The Video
Thanks!
one thing i don't miss from the past: hard disk. congrats for the mod though.
Thanks
Hey! I wanna get a WD raptor just to hear hard disk hard disking! lol. The newer ones and SSDs are all too quiet
What "past"? We're using ssds for the os and games but when you need to store terabytes it's still all about spinning magnetic storage.
Definitely a worthwhile upgrade, even if it's all a bit of a squeeze fitting it in! I was thinking that you might have been getting interference from the crt's deflection yoke rather than the power supply. 😀
Yeah, that's a bloody mess of interference going everywhere inside that little Mac lol. Apparently, the PSU seems to be the noisiest card.
The trouble with period correct mods is the availability of parts
it's the CRT yoke making your mac crash, maybe the PSU, but I would suspect the yoke.
512k Logic Board & Plus ROM = you can piggyback 512k more RAM chips on top of existing ones. And do add a quiet (noctua) fan - even at lowest speed it will be fine.
Is that possible? I googled but only found info about expansion boards for 1024k
@@Epictronics1 I had such a mac. 128k, RAM chips replaced to make-it 512 then one more set of chips piggybacked on top with some legs up and connected with wires. Was showing 1024KB total. Unfortunately I was a n00b at the time and did not take detailed pictures of that setup :(
@@psergiu Very interesting. I'd love to hack a "Mac 1024k"
I'm not a Mac guy, but man, that's hell of a job to figure it out
Thanks
Amber LEDs weren't that bright in the 80s.
Yeah, these are new and modern. I plan to replace it in a future video.
I miss boot sounds on pc like floppy and hearing the hdd work
The European Action Retro 🤣
Shenanigans!
Thank you for this great video. A very rudimentary question for the game Load runner, how do you dig a hole in the game? Which keys to press? Thank you very much
On a Mac 128/512k it's S and F. Thanks
@@Epictronics1 Thank you so much.$$$
Hi Mac Harvard.😁
RF shield from commands 64 i remember that LOL
oh by the way that transformer is causing hdd issues and that why you put shield there block transformer from sent wave into it
Starts with C and ends with 64... C-Tandy64? C-Amiga64? Maybe C-Nintendo64?
CPC 464
Hi , very imaginative and trying to preserve outside factory appearance
I wonder how long before a raspbery pi accessory is made to emulate the fdd signal to say IDE / SD card
As for the final shielding, curious if it is RF or magetic interference from the second psu that stops the hard drive from reading - does it stop the head from moving of the park position or does it affect the data stream being read and thus the cpu interprets the data file as garbage and unreadable
I have also seen expired credit cards used as a insulation barrier between cards, one technician that service our office used to gather all the used prepaid phone cards - they came in a thin plastic or a treated sort of wax paper style - he would line up the plastic cards and 'touch" them with a soldering iron, the adjoining seams would partially melt and join up. He had A3 and A4 sized sheets in his brief case and just 'snap them' to suit.
He came up with the idea when he was younger and working on terminals in the 80's that office people and medical staff would use the top of screens as "bacon and egg warmers" or place there coffee or soft drink on top of the screen.
He had custom wax paper internal hoods for the VT100 and VT52 terminals to serve as internal"umbrellas"
There are a lot of FDD SD-card emulators although I'm not sure if any are MAC compatible.
FDD interface is not that complicated or fast, it can be emulated by an arduino and there was a repo claiming to do just that.
I think most likely the unamplified raw signal directly from the heads is the most likely culprit. It is milivolts x microamps, easily corruptible if not already rf-insulated.
The head motors takes much more considerable power to drive - not a thing that can easily be spoiled by RF.
While credit cards - specifically contactless ones - might do something they are quite bad for this since you cannot easily connect to a coil to ground it. Not recommended.
What the expired contactless cards are really useful for is preventing a thief from stealing money from your card by a concealed payment terminal close enough. Tests show gluing an old card to your wallet is MORE efficient than most "rf-secure wallets" in the market.
A shield can easily be created by gluing cooking aluminum foil to cardboard. It can also be just bought in art or school supplies stores as colored cardboard.
Placing liquids on top of CRTs was a recipe for disaster though
Thanks. I had different issues without the shield. Distorted graphics, hung system, missing folders, and sometimes the OS asked me if I wanted to initialize the drive
@@Epictronics1Hi, the distorted graphics is definitely a "rogue" magnetic field that is close to the crt
CRT's have the deflection yoke and most (many) have a set of magnets you can manipulate to pull out or shrink back a image, you can even make them move left / right / up down and make them bow inwards in the middle or bulge out
The other drive errors sound like read / right errors and the os is timing out or just going through the pick list of errors and eventually asking to reformat the drive as a last resort
To be honest if it happened to me, i would not have considered the use of shielding - actually i would have thought about the exposed single strand wired and possibly wrap them up in tinfoil , then paper for insulation as a trial - but some times that makes it worse as the problem could be cross talk between the wires in the flat ribbon cable as the single strand is only single insulated with plastic, some better rated cables have a copper wire, then the inner insulator, then a grease filled layer then a braided shield and another insulator - similar to co-axial cable
You are definitely a problem solver
What if you just used a vertically mounted DB19 connector? just solder the connector to the board pointing straight up, and solder all your jumper wires to a male db19 connector on top. You can find the connectors on the bay now. I dont knwo if you can find pcb mount ones, but you could use individual header pins to interface a standard solder cup connector to the pcb
Thanks, That was plan B. I'm sure it would work well. There might be an even better solution, I need to measure and check.
I bet you don't think this original mac is all that friendly or easy to use after all.
While the Compact Mac models were a pretty good design from the outside, they all have major shortcomings. That is especially true of this model.
The stock configuration is absolutely terrible. They really handicapped the machine to reach their desired price point, which they never even met as stripped down as it was. You can't do hardly anything with this mac without a ton of disk swapping. That 800k drive was not available then (when the computer was brand new). So it was obsolete in that sense the moment you wanted to turn it on. It was behaving like an out of date computer with all that disk swapping.
11:15 Camino '64, isn't it?
With all that EMI shielding, I think you just lost Adrian Black's subscription!
Seriously though, you're probably better off replacing that open frame power supply with one that's shielded. Probably don't need one as large as that just for an extra hard drive though.
As for the upgrade itself, I vaguely remember seeing a hard drive upgrade board that sat between the CPU socket and the CPU, I've never seen one that connects to the floppy drive interface. I can't imagine it's very fast, since it's designed for relatively slow floppy drives. But I guess it's better than nothing.
Ha ha, I kinda wished I had access to Adrian's trash can when I was looking for shields lol. To be fair, I have tossed all my C64 shields too. Luckily I had missed one. The piggyback board you are referring to is the Hyperdrive kit.
A lot of work for am old computer.
Interesting to see RF shielding actually serve a real purpose. (Pre-reupload comment) - Thanks for using an actual hard drive & not just an SD card adapter like everyone else.
Thanks. That shield didn't do much in the C64. But it made all the difference in this Mac :)
"Hackintosh"
The oldest Hackintosh?
Hole good for SD or Compact bFlash drive?
Only one way to find out : )
all this retro-movement is all about playing game....
The funny thing is that I rarely spend more than a few minutes playing a game after a finished project before I get the next project idea and move on :)