they are actually still being used. the high school of the city of Lenzburg still has a Kadetten maneuver every 2 years. and the cadets get one of these (but only with blanks)
@@pussyslayer2295 well at the Zürcher Knabenschiessen you (aged 13-17) get to shoot the current StGw90 once a year for 1CHF a pop out to 300 if you go during the training weekends. the actual competition is 25.- iirc.
My cadet rifle was a 22 cal Lee Enfield. Looked like a No 4, I think the official designation was No 7. As summer training camp we got to shoot FN C1s. I was thirteen years old and we had an Airborne Regiment sergeant teaching us how to usefull size battle rifles. A great memory.
These are rather common on the Canadian surplus market. I've seen them in person and listed at dealers for the past couple of years. Us Canadians have quite the obsession with Swiss firearms.
Btw they made 2 variations of it, the early ones like this one with long lightening cuts which proved to induce some weakness in the reciever, and ones with shorter lightening cuts to correct this issue.
@@TimDutch @@TimDutch i looked it up for you. The rifle cost a total of 73 francs. 30 francs of that were paid for by the federal government, while the rest had to be payed by the cantons and municipalities. I tried multiple times to reply with a link to the original document, but youtube keeps deleting my comments. The document is called Botschaft des Bundesrates an die Bundesversammlung, betreffend Beitrag an die Erstellungskosten neuer Kadettengewehre Modell 1897. (Vom 26. November 1897.)
I’m in the sea cadets and the highlights is getting to shoot SA80 although it’s an A1 it doesn’t matter as getting to shoot rifles is rare in Britain to its a pleasant treat
I wouldent be suprized if theres some floating around, the national guard still has M16A1s in inventory and the Airforce has friggen 605s floating around!
Ahhh, the 89's were NOT updated, the 89/96 was a new rifle with the updated bolt & similar features to the normal 1889. Most of THOSE 89/96's were updated into 96/11s, with new barrels, stocks and sights. The K11-M11 were simply that pattern of rifle having NOT been converted from 89/96s! :D ...I think ;)
@@charlieknight830 That's exactly what he said. The 89 was never updated to anything. Only the 89/96 was updated to the 11 pattern. 89/96's are difficult to find, because basically all are 11's now. The 89/96 was a new rifle and, though similarish looking, almost none of the parts were exchangeable with the 89. Particularly not the bolt and receiver, which really are the essential parts.
I have to correct you on something here. They did not update the Infanteriegewehr 89 but the successor of it the 96 ... those upgraded 96s are known as 96/11 whereas the 89s remained unchanged .. In case you are curious I own both guns and could also show you pictures were it's notable that the wooden stock was also upgraded to a pistol grip kinda thing
If you own this rifle it is worth to unscrew the butt plate, there is a good chance you can find a little letter inside. It appears that my was still in use in 1968, if anyone would like to see the photos just drop me a message.
Can the reduced power 7.5x55 Swiss ammo be substituted with standard GP11? For the lucky few who own this rifle I wonder if this can be shot using the slightly hotter load?
I've shot my K11 with GP11. The recoil is a bit rougher than with the PPU 7.5 I use, but I had no issues. Granted I only shot about 10 rounds of the GP11. No clue what would happen if you only use GP11.
It's not slightly hotter, the GP11 is 50% higher chamber pressure than the GP90. The gun would eventually fail and knock the action back into your cheekbones and get you a nice hospital visit. For that reason, the GP11 was made 1mm longer so it's impossible to accidentally feed it into an older gun.
Ian-I ordered a M1911 Schmidt-Rubin from a well known distributor and received a .22 conversion single shot! A neatly inlayed plate on the side of the butt says "Arn. Meierhans, Zurich" Was this the armorer that did the conversion? Are they safe to shoot (am assuming they are). The firing pin still hits the center of the .22 cartridge and the stock extractor will not extract and eject the .22 case. Is this worth keeping? It was the ;last of 6 M1911's from the distributor that I bought from. I own a K31 carbine which is a dream to shoot and really want a long rifle in 7.5 Swiss. Is it worth keeping to trade up? Cannot find much info online. Thanx for any info-John in Texas
Hello, I like your videos because I find the mechanics of the different systems very interesting ... I have little reference to weapons - but I always wonder at the old guns on the iron sights. I practiced a bit more with firearms decades ago, but I think the distances are utopian like 1000m. With the P1 (P38) I could hit something at 25m, with the UZI in 100m - the old G3 quite well af 300m with a lot of practice. Lying with the MG on maybe 500m with short bursts ... But 1000m with a normal rifle? Our old rifles also had different breakpoints - so if you wanted to hit a 10, you had to target a 7 at the bottom left ... what went wrong between 1905 and 1985?
You mean, the GP1911? No. They are not compatible The GP1890 has a case length of 53.5mm and the GP1911 is 55.6mm long. You might be able to fit it into the gun but I don't recomend it - at least if you like the idea of your face remaining intact - as the GP90 generates about 37'000psi and the GP11 about 45'000psi. The old rifles are not made to withstand the higher pressure and might blow up in your face...
@@Supremaque Yes, it was the bolt first and foremost. It was primarily due to the rear locking lugs. The long distance between the bolt head and the locking lugs meant, that the bolt would flex and compress, causing headspacing and gas seal issues. I'm guessing metallurgy might also have played a part, as this science would have improved rapidly in that time. The 1897 pattern cadet rifles should to the best of my knowlege use the 96 pattern reciever and bolt. So, the cadet rifles should be able to safely handle the 1911 cartridge. Just don't don't take my word without double-checking, 'kay? ;)
I don't understand exactly what they did enough to say for sure, but from what I understand they figured if they reduced the muzzle velocity of the cartridge just the right amount, they could still use the same stops as are on the normal sight, and just change the distance markings. That way they didn't have to come up with a completely different sight, and they could use both cartridges in the same gun.
I suppose there is that argument to be made but when you consider most of the noteworthy rifles of the day and for several decades to come where turn bolt systems makes ya wonder. I mean hell even a lot of modern day sniper rifles are turn bolt systems . If straight pull offered superior target re-acquisition ya think modern sniper rifles would be all over that.
It could be that a home-grown design, (that clearly performed well in trials. I wonder what it was up against?), meaning little reliance on foreign manufacturers to supply, was a very strong point in favour. There were probably licencing & patenting issues in using other weapons & mechanisms that they didn't want to get involved with. Then there's military inertia, the fact that it's a superb system that doesn't need replacing, & the cost of re-equipping with a rotary-bolt, all add up to a long career with the Swiss military. Blokes channel is worth digging into for Swiss stuff: ruclips.net/video/HNbQdAtNhM8/видео.html
The Swiss stuck with a pattern they liked - they changed some of the internal mechanics, fiddled with the ammo etc but over all? Yeah, they stuck with what worked (till it was obsolete and needed replacement) :) Still, yeah, it does or rather: The K31 looks like that gun :)
Ian, I own a unissued K 31 Elesener Schwyz bayonet, it's in 100% condiction {BRAND NEW] I'm looking to sell it. I really need the cash, any idea it's worth? Please reply if you got the time, some dude offered me $300...Is that a fair price?
@@benbauer1257 Standard german is a very hard language to learn. Swiss german in itself is not a language but an umbrella term for allemanic dialects. However grammatic is simpler and vocabulary is more french influenced which in itself makes it easier to learn. The tricky part is to find sources to learn it.
Such a well thought out design. They even put a keyring at the back of the bolt so you could keep it handy.
i guess I'm kinda randomly asking but do anyone know a good website to stream new movies online?
@@coltonarchie9765, Negative. I use Roku but I know a guy that has an unlocked Firestick and he gets all kinds of stuff.
@Colton Archie lately I have been using Flixzone. Just search on google for it :)
@Colton Archie i would suggest FlixZone. Just search on google for it :)
@@coltonarchie9765 m4uhd.tv is quite good (or Movieorca).
they are actually still being used. the high school of the city of Lenzburg still has a Kadetten maneuver every 2 years. and the cadets get one of these (but only with blanks)
It's actually called "Freischarenmanöver".
Bruh now I regret living in Zürich
@@pussyslayer2295 well at the Zürcher Knabenschiessen you (aged 13-17) get to shoot the current StGw90 once a year for 1CHF a pop out to 300 if you go during the training weekends. the actual competition is 25.- iirc.
Interesting
Also in Zofingen but there it's every year
Love these old straight bolt rifles.
My cadet rifle was a 22 cal Lee Enfield. Looked like a No 4, I think the official designation was No 7. As summer training camp we got to shoot FN C1s. I was thirteen years old and we had an Airborne Regiment sergeant teaching us how to usefull size battle rifles. A great memory.
I'll support you and continue to watch your content no matter what platform you use mate.
Ty for the videos it was nice to meet you in Albuquerque NM with my dad keep up the good work! Nate
These are rather common on the Canadian surplus market. I've seen them in person and listed at dealers for the past couple of years. Us Canadians have quite the obsession with Swiss firearms.
Btw they made 2 variations of it, the early ones like this one with long lightening cuts which proved to induce some weakness in the reciever, and ones with shorter lightening cuts to correct this issue.
I want one of these. There’s something special about single shot centerfires.
I got one I can let go for $400 no replacement parts.
@@bigandlittlefirearms8395 It’s not .22. Check the description.
I have a K31 and love it.
Thank you, sir.
Thanks Ian!
I was looking at one today at the Lucerne gun show. It was for sale at 135 Swiss francs.
Gotta love the hand notches
These were not financed by the military. Local councils had to raise funds themselves to equip cadets.
I don't know the exact history of this rifle, but i can almost guarantee that the federal government heavily subsidized it, as they always do
@@monster2slayer The Chap lives in Switzerland so he will now what's the case.
@@TimDutch so do i
@@monster2slayer ok :)
@@TimDutch @@TimDutch i looked it up for you. The rifle cost a total of 73 francs. 30 francs of that were paid for by the federal government, while the rest had to be payed by the cantons and municipalities.
I tried multiple times to reply with a link to the original document, but youtube keeps deleting my comments. The document is called
Botschaft des Bundesrates an die Bundesversammlung, betreffend Beitrag an die Erstellungskosten neuer Kadettengewehre Modell 1897. (Vom 26. November 1897.)
I’m in the sea cadets and the highlights is getting to shoot SA80 although it’s an A1 it doesn’t matter as getting to shoot rifles is rare in Britain to its a pleasant treat
BR LNER 7220 There are no A1s in service. Do you mean the semi auto only L98A2?
I wouldent be suprized if theres some floating around, the national guard still has M16A1s in inventory and the Airforce has friggen 605s floating around!
Your sea cadets unit still has their rifles??
That is a good looking rifle. I can't believe someone bought #20 for $1265!
Even on Palm Sunday, Gun Jesus posts another great video . Amen !!!
Cadet Corps are also popular in Canada. As in Europe, Cadet Corps are for young boys and girls from age 12 through 18.
As always, thanks Ian!
Ahhh, the 89's were NOT updated, the 89/96 was a new rifle with the updated bolt & similar features to the normal 1889. Most of THOSE 89/96's were updated into 96/11s, with new barrels, stocks and sights. The K11-M11 were simply that pattern of rifle having NOT been converted from 89/96s! :D
...I think ;)
I concur. There are far more 89's knocking about than 89/96s. Which wouldn't be the case if most 89s got updated
@@charlieknight830 That's exactly what he said. The 89 was never updated to anything. Only the 89/96 was updated to the 11 pattern. 89/96's are difficult to find, because basically all are 11's now. The 89/96 was a new rifle and, though similarish looking, almost none of the parts were exchangeable with the 89. Particularly not the bolt and receiver, which really are the essential parts.
The shouldercracker :D
Austria was still using some wooden sticks quiet long
I have to correct you on something here. They did not update the Infanteriegewehr 89 but the successor of it the 96 ... those upgraded 96s are known as 96/11 whereas the 89s remained unchanged .. In case you are curious I own both guns and could also show you pictures were it's notable that the wooden stock was also upgraded to a pistol grip kinda thing
Would be cool if you could do a whole video on the lesser used straight pull system. Maybe next time you see a Mannlicher 95?
I have this gun, and it is quite interesting indeed.
If you own this rifle it is worth to unscrew the butt plate, there is a good chance you can find a little letter inside. It appears that my was still in use in 1968, if anyone would like to see the photos just drop me a message.
Great video, and an interesting rifle. You should look at the Norwegian m/1906 guttekarabin/Boys' carbine if you have the chance.
Not even getting notifications on these videos anymore, time to switch to PH
I got a notification from Full 30 and nothing from here.
Matthew Mason got it from here.
I got a notification about 3 minutes ago.
I Just got notified on RUclips.
Matthew Mason I got mine about an hour ago, maybe recheck your sub settings?
i have one of these rifled in 30 30 , does anyone know how many were atcually re barreled in 3030
Can the reduced power 7.5x55 Swiss ammo be substituted with standard GP11? For the lucky few who own this rifle I wonder if this can be shot using the slightly hotter load?
I've shot my K11 with GP11. The recoil is a bit rougher than with the PPU 7.5 I use, but I had no issues. Granted I only shot about 10 rounds of the GP11. No clue what would happen if you only use GP11.
It's not slightly hotter, the GP11 is 50% higher chamber pressure than the GP90. The gun would eventually fail and knock the action back into your cheekbones and get you a nice hospital visit. For that reason, the GP11 was made 1mm longer so it's impossible to accidentally feed it into an older gun.
Do a video on the K31!
Ian-I ordered a M1911 Schmidt-Rubin from a well known distributor and received a .22 conversion single shot! A neatly inlayed plate on the side of the butt says "Arn. Meierhans, Zurich" Was this the armorer that did the conversion? Are they safe to shoot (am assuming they are). The firing pin still hits the center of the .22 cartridge and the stock extractor will not extract and eject the .22 case. Is this worth keeping? It was the ;last of 6 M1911's from the distributor that I bought from. I own a K31 carbine which is a dream to shoot and really want a long rifle in 7.5 Swiss. Is it worth keeping to trade up? Cannot find much info online. Thanx for any info-John in Texas
My grandpa has this type of rifle
We need one on the k31
Hello, I like your videos because I find the mechanics of the different systems very interesting ...
I have little reference to weapons - but I always wonder at the old guns on the iron sights.
I practiced a bit more with firearms decades ago, but I think the distances are utopian like 1000m.
With the P1 (P38) I could hit something at 25m, with the UZI in 100m - the old G3 quite well af 300m with a lot of practice. Lying with the MG on maybe 500m with short bursts ...
But 1000m with a normal rifle? Our old rifles also had different breakpoints - so if you wanted to hit a 10, you had to target a 7 at the bottom left ... what went wrong between 1905 and 1985?
can you do review on RT 20 anti material rifle?
So, stupid question: I must have missed this in the video, but is this rifle capable of firing the standard 7.5x55mm cartridge?
You mean, the GP1911?
No. They are not compatible The GP1890 has a case length of 53.5mm and the GP1911 is 55.6mm long.
You might be able to fit it into the gun but I don't recomend it - at least if you like the idea of your face remaining intact - as the GP90 generates about 37'000psi and the GP11 about 45'000psi.
The old rifles are not made to withstand the higher pressure and might blow up in your face...
@@Bird_Dog00 Thanks!
@@Bird_Dog00 It was a Schmidt-Rubin 1889 bolt that was a problem am I right?
Isn't Cadet Rifle have the same bolt as Schmidt-Rubin 1896/11 Rifle?
@@Supremaque Yes, it was the bolt first and foremost.
It was primarily due to the rear locking lugs. The long distance between the bolt head and the locking lugs meant, that the bolt would flex and compress, causing headspacing and gas seal issues.
I'm guessing metallurgy might also have played a part, as this science would have improved rapidly in that time.
The 1897 pattern cadet rifles should to the best of my knowlege use the 96 pattern reciever and bolt. So, the cadet rifles should be able to safely handle the 1911 cartridge.
Just don't don't take my word without double-checking, 'kay? ;)
@@Bird_Dog00 I'm torn between curiosity and common sense :>
i can almost hear the bloke drooling.
James Stonne Tell bloke the line forms behind me.
William Prince We have one already and done the vid ;-)
Yep the bloke and the chap have done it already. Lol.
How did they make the cadet cartridge and normal cartridge have the same bullet velocities at a 100m ?
I _think_ he meant to say that the full-power cartridge had the same velocity at 100m as the cadet cartridge had at the muzzle.
Regolith that make sense
So how dose this related to rifle sight
Thank you
I don't understand exactly what they did enough to say for sure, but from what I understand they figured if they reduced the muzzle velocity of the cartridge just the right amount, they could still use the same stops as are on the normal sight, and just change the distance markings. That way they didn't have to come up with a completely different sight, and they could use both cartridges in the same gun.
Are you telling me that the cadet only has put his sight to 100m to shoot point Blank?
What is it with the Swiss and straight pull rifles?
Keeping the rifle as still as possible whilst operating the bolt (no torque) means you can re-acquire your target quicker?
I suppose there is that argument to be made but when you consider most of the noteworthy rifles of the day and for several decades to come where turn bolt systems makes ya wonder. I mean hell even a lot of modern day sniper rifles are turn bolt systems . If straight pull offered superior target re-acquisition ya think modern sniper rifles would be all over that.
It could be that a home-grown design, (that clearly performed well in trials. I wonder what it was up against?), meaning little reliance on foreign manufacturers to supply, was a very strong point in favour. There were probably licencing & patenting issues in using other weapons & mechanisms that they didn't want to get involved with. Then there's military inertia, the fact that it's a superb system that doesn't need replacing, & the cost of re-equipping with a rotary-bolt, all add up to a long career with the Swiss military.
Blokes channel is worth digging into for Swiss stuff: ruclips.net/video/HNbQdAtNhM8/видео.html
They build rifles like the build clocks and watches. Very Well.
The GP11 bullet has a nickle-cupric jacketed bullet, so not specifically copper, and certainly not copper in color.
Wait a Kindergerwehr?
So jrotc or ccf
This should be in Bf1, it looks really unique
Hey RUclips #LeaveForgottenWeaponsAlone
If you're going to get kicked off you might as well whip out the really interesting guns before you go.
Looks like a K31
The Swiss stuck with a pattern they liked - they changed some of the internal mechanics, fiddled with the ammo etc but over all? Yeah, they stuck with what worked (till it was obsolete and needed replacement) :)
Still, yeah, it does or rather: The K31 looks like that gun :)
Big Ben77 You mean the k31 looks like this and all the other Swiss straight pull rifles.
DreamingFlurry I agree, kinda like how the Russians are with the AK and us with the M16
Ian, I own a unissued K 31 Elesener Schwyz bayonet, it's in 100% condiction {BRAND NEW] I'm looking to sell it. I really need the cash, any idea it's worth? Please reply if you got the time, some dude offered me $300...Is that a fair price?
I belive is a good looking rifle... But the bolt is kinda weird...
"Kaddetengewehr" German sounds way cooler when talking guns,guns,guns.
Just means Cadet Rifle, but it sounds so much cooler in German.
These look like they can be easily converted to semiauto
And Canada
BANNED
I really want a straight pull k31 for my collection, and to feature on my channel.
Spit Flush Classic Firearms has them in stock.
I got one for fairly cheap at a local Pawn Shop. I check often for what they get in. I think I paid $350 for my K31. No buttstock slip though :(
Goonygoon84 Those slips are cool when you find them
Goonygoon84 you mean troop tag. Both my k31 and k11 didn't have one. I don't mind. It's just makes the story more mysterious.
Spit Flush they are good rifles. If you want one for your channel you could borrow mine if your near NJ.
625/0 like and dislike ratio
3 people who did not like Swiss Rifles.
Swiss and German language is confusing
German is kinda simple when you get it. Swiss German less so.
@@benbauer1257 Standard german is a very hard language to learn.
Swiss german in itself is not a language but an umbrella term for allemanic dialects. However grammatic is simpler and vocabulary is more french influenced which in itself makes it easier to learn.
The tricky part is to find sources to learn it.