For smaller boards 6 ways and under I fit rcbo . For the bigger houses we do with 14 ish circuits we fit high integrity dual rcd , 4 circuits on each rcd plus a few rcbos .
At 9:31, his estimate is way off. It is a hell of a lot more than 15 to 20%. The current prices are 12x Wylex MCB at £4.38 each plus 3x 40A RCD at £43.80 each, which totals £183.96 plus the board. 12 RCBOs at £32.34 each totals £388.08. More than DOUBLE the price.
A Wylex type A Rcbo is about £25 to £27 from TLC as I write (inc VAT), so you can knock £100 off that £384 bill, and there are a lot of cheaper options about. MK Sentry type A RCBOs are just £14.40 from the same supplier, which means you can knock a further £120 off that. In all, £170 or so for those dozen RCBOs. Three type A 63A MK RCDs alone cost £150 from TLC. Add in 12 MCBs, and that is another £50, so the Rcbo option is cheaper. What is more, you save 6 DIN slots, so might be able to use a smaller CU. That is not even the bottom of the market.
The price is always gonna be taken into account on dual rcd board and rcbo board I personally only fit rcbo boards I give the option for both however the benefits of the rcbo out way the price difference unwanted tripping of half the house is always something to consider if the customer still leans towards the dual rcd if that don't do it then I show them the pretty picture of the verso rcbo spd board
Hi, the regs aren’t miss quoted as you can still fit both a split load board and a main switch board with RCBOs onto a residential property. The key factor used to drive the industry towards RCBOs is the 30% factor of the RCD mA rating for earth leakage. That as well as the regs now clearly stating to use RCBOs on final circuits. Hope this helps
I’ve been using Verso rcbo with surge for about a year, (was using another brand with the same components for 2-3 years before) I’ll let the diy Daves fit the 63A splits as that’s not my customer. The IET are skirting around all sorts off scenarios and the regs are getting more vague with every edition. Roll on the 25th edition 😂
Thanks for being #TeamVerso ! Have you signed up to #MyInstall to get your points for your Verso boards? It would be nice to see the IET take a firmer stance on RCBOs and ensure a better standard of protection!
I wouldn’t entertain fitting a split load board, there is no way of being sure you have no more than 9ma leakage. As you guys say it’s best practice so RCBO’s it is. Keep up the great content 👍🏻
Thanks Paul 👍🏽 We agree, I think the IET will need to step in and take the decision away from people to make RCBO installs the minimum requirement before all electricians see it the way you do though! Thanks for the comment 👍🏽
@@navitascp I'd agree with you when it refers to domestic installs. However there may be good reasons for not using RCBOs in commercial and industrial installs and the regs need to make provision for that.
I guess the only people using split boards now apart from the local authorities which was mentioned in the vlog. That can only be price related .Are di wires who buying crap from Screwfix and alike .. or cowboy builders or sparks not registered who don't put their name to their work
It is surprising. We’ve had more feedback since this video from people who refuse to believe RCBO boards are a better option, as “they’ve never had a problem with spilt loads” I think some of this is mindset
What about a 3 phase RCD (+ N) with 3 phase bus bar and 3x2 MCB. This will take 10 ways (4 for RCD +6 for MCB). Less Individual wires and easier to install. Also looks better. Would that be cheaper? Reg from a German in Malaysia.
Maybe people get confused between budget and profit, I’ve been working on a new build redrow home site where the minimum house price us 500k, yet they fit split load duel rcd BG boards, terrible to fit cheap and nasty rubbish, i price my jobs based on my own recommendations and most customers appreciate that we know what’s best.
I sub contract for local authoritys in South Wales, they specify a split board only. The worrying situation the local authorities have is the number of AC type rcds out there in the feild.
Completely agree. There should be a program of maintenance that involved retrofitting these for Type A devices asap. Get in touch with us on our Instagram, we’d love to support you with this 👍🏽
Cost is definitely the main reason in my area, but if you take pride in your work and company you should be fitting RCBO boards as a minimum. Nice to see junni on his RUclips debut, the guy is a living legend
The problem with saying you should have RCBOs as a minimum is that Joe Bloggs will have priced up a new CU on Screwfix. When you give him a quote for an RCBO board, which if they have 8-10 cuirciuts can be double the price of a split load board, he will instantly assume you are trying to rip him off and up-sell him stuff he doesn’t think he needs. He will then turn to Bodge It and Scarper Ltd, who happily throw a Screwfix special on his wall for half the price. The result is that quality installers get an unfair repuation as a ripoff merchant and the customer has a poorly installed system. Why not offer a split laod board if it means the customer will uprade their 1960’s board to something that is far safer even if not top of the line.
@@JK50with10 I completely agree with you there! That is this issue with domestic electrical work at the moment, too many people will put in a cheap Screwfix board etc. I just try to promote best practice and without a doubt I have lost jobs along the way, I believe that in the next 10years that rcbos/afdds with be the norm and I just like to stay ahead if I can so that a board I’m fitting now won’t be obsolete as such in a few years. But you are correct in your statement.
I know I wouldn’t want a new property to have a split load in it if I was a prospective buyer. Maybe if consumers were more aware then developers would be forced into going down the best practice route, with all the modern appliances being piled into dwellings these days consumers are heading for a fall with potentially problematic levels of leakage.
No excuse for not fitting RCBOs. The cost difference over the lifetime of the CU is peanuts. Ideally manufacturers ought to be designing CUs and breakers with both neutral and line bus bars, which would radically simplify the wiring inside the CU.
No, .. however I am kind of put off by the verso brand, we were called to a certain new build where the main electrical contractor used mostly verso products, we found that the majority of the single and 2 gang sockets had issues with the CPC, when tested.. missing earth.. neutral faults... All verso products not just a couple either. The client asked up to swap out with a different brand, which sorted the faults.
Hi can you please email us with more details about this as we’ve not had any reports of this in the past? Myinstall(@)versoelectrical.go.uk we would really like to know more
@@navitascp unfortunately I can't, without the permission of my employer.. who was called to sort out lots of issues, and the client would have taken it up with the original developer.
No disrespect to verso or any manufacturer. Until split load boards are no longer available on retailers shelves, the simple solution of RCBO boards will never solve itself. The client won't have a cheaper alternative anymore.
Agreed. Until the option is removed by a change in regulation there will always be a market for split load boards. We actually think this may come in the 19th. Amendment 2 has edged it that way a little already
Can't wait to see all the sparkies commenting in 10 years.. "There's no way I fit those RCBOs without the integral AFDD and SPD. They're for all the people that still install ring finals.." Talk about moving the goal posts...
RCBO's all day for me. If the faceless one in the council office specs it, then it's on his head but how the hell can you possibly calculate 9% leakage across a group of circuits that you have no idea what they will end up supplying !
Give money to make the perfect grounding in your house and not rely on the one offered by the provider. If you install a dual rcd or rcbo fusebox must be the second that concerns you....
For smaller boards 6 ways and under I fit rcbo . For the bigger houses we do with 14 ish circuits we fit high integrity dual rcd , 4 circuits on each rcd plus a few rcbos .
At 9:31, his estimate is way off. It is a hell of a lot more than 15 to 20%. The current prices are 12x Wylex MCB at £4.38 each plus 3x 40A RCD at £43.80 each, which totals £183.96 plus the board. 12 RCBOs at £32.34 each totals £388.08. More than DOUBLE the price.
Have you compared it to the price of a Verso board?
A Wylex type A Rcbo is about £25 to £27 from TLC as I write (inc VAT), so you can knock £100 off that £384 bill, and there are a lot of cheaper options about. MK Sentry type A RCBOs are just £14.40 from the same supplier, which means you can knock a further £120 off that. In all, £170 or so for those dozen RCBOs. Three type A 63A MK RCDs alone cost £150 from TLC. Add in 12 MCBs, and that is another £50, so the Rcbo option is cheaper. What is more, you save 6 DIN slots, so might be able to use a smaller CU.
That is not even the bottom of the market.
Cost is the main reason.
With budgets so tight at the moment a lot of it comes down to what people can afford
That’s a great point! Cost of living now could have a large impact on the decision of board
@@navitascpall safety devices from eye protection, hearing protection all the way to an rcbo and everything inbetween should be tax free.
The price is always gonna be taken into account on dual rcd board and rcbo board I personally only fit rcbo boards I give the option for both however the benefits of the rcbo out way the price difference unwanted tripping of half the house is always something to consider if the customer still leans towards the dual rcd if that don't do it then I show them the pretty picture of the verso rcbo spd board
Love the picture idea 💡 😜
For private work I only install rcbo boards,for the local authority work in carmarthenshire I install the split load spd boards they spec.
We are actually on the specification for CCC. We have been told they will be moving over to RCBO later in the year 👍🏽
Your miss quoting the regs. Section (ii) is for residential premises. (I) is a general usage. You can use split load in a non residential place.
Hi, the regs aren’t miss quoted as you can still fit both a split load board and a main switch board with RCBOs onto a residential property.
The key factor used to drive the industry towards RCBOs is the 30% factor of the RCD mA rating for earth leakage. That as well as the regs now clearly stating to use RCBOs on final circuits. Hope this helps
I’ve been using Verso rcbo with surge for about a year, (was using another brand with the same components for 2-3 years before) I’ll let the diy Daves fit the 63A splits as that’s not my customer.
The IET are skirting around all sorts off scenarios and the regs are getting more vague with every edition.
Roll on the 25th edition 😂
Thanks for being #TeamVerso ! Have you signed up to #MyInstall to get your points for your Verso boards?
It would be nice to see the IET take a firmer stance on RCBOs and ensure a better standard of protection!
I wouldn’t entertain fitting a split load board, there is no way of being sure you have no more than 9ma leakage. As you guys say it’s best practice so RCBO’s it is. Keep up the great content 👍🏻
Thanks Paul 👍🏽
We agree, I think the IET will need to step in and take the decision away from people to make RCBO installs the minimum requirement before all electricians see it the way you do though! Thanks for the comment 👍🏽
@@navitascp I'd agree with you when it refers to domestic installs. However there may be good reasons for not using RCBOs in commercial and industrial installs and the regs need to make provision for that.
23% still using split loads! That’s so much higher than I thought it was
I guess the only people using split boards now apart from the local authorities which was mentioned in the vlog. That can only be price related .Are di wires who buying crap from Screwfix and alike .. or cowboy builders or sparks not registered who don't put their name to their work
It is surprising. We’ve had more feedback since this video from people who refuse to believe RCBO boards are a better option, as “they’ve never had a problem with spilt loads” I think some of this is mindset
What about a 3 phase RCD (+ N) with 3 phase bus bar and 3x2 MCB. This will take 10 ways (4 for RCD +6 for MCB). Less Individual wires and easier to install. Also looks better. Would that be cheaper? Reg from a German in Malaysia.
Maybe people get confused between budget and profit, I’ve been working on a new build redrow home site where the minimum house price us 500k, yet they fit split load duel rcd BG boards, terrible to fit cheap and nasty rubbish, i price my jobs based on my own recommendations and most customers appreciate that we know what’s best.
Agree! Thanks for watching
I sub contract for local authoritys in South Wales, they specify a split board only. The worrying situation the local authorities have is the number of AC type rcds out there in the feild.
Completely agree. There should be a program of maintenance that involved retrofitting these for Type A devices asap. Get in touch with us on our Instagram, we’d love to support you with this 👍🏽
Cost is definitely the main reason in my area, but if you take pride in your work and company you should be fitting RCBO boards as a minimum. Nice to see junni on his RUclips debut, the guy is a living legend
It does seem to be the overriding factor in the choice when not on specified project. Great to see you going best practice as always Wayne 🙌🏽
@@navitascp always will my friend and I only use the best products #verso
The problem with saying you should have RCBOs as a minimum is that Joe Bloggs will have priced up a new CU on Screwfix. When you give him a quote for an RCBO board, which if they have 8-10 cuirciuts can be double the price of a split load board, he will instantly assume you are trying to rip him off and up-sell him stuff he doesn’t think he needs.
He will then turn to Bodge It and Scarper Ltd, who happily throw a Screwfix special on his wall for half the price. The result is that quality installers get an unfair repuation as a ripoff merchant and the customer has a poorly installed system. Why not offer a split laod board if it means the customer will uprade their 1960’s board to something that is far safer even if not top of the line.
@@JK50with10 I completely agree with you there! That is this issue with domestic electrical work at the moment, too many people will put in a cheap Screwfix board etc.
I just try to promote best practice and without a doubt I have lost jobs along the way, I believe that in the next 10years that rcbos/afdds with be the norm and I just like to stay ahead if I can so that a board I’m fitting now won’t be obsolete as such in a few years. But you are correct in your statement.
Agree 💯 although if you look at the regs now as far as amendment two stands, it states the use of rcbo ms for domestic final circuits should be used
I know I wouldn’t want a new property to have a split load in it if I was a prospective buyer. Maybe if consumers were more aware then developers would be forced into going down the best practice route, with all the modern appliances being piled into dwellings these days consumers are heading for a fall with potentially problematic levels of leakage.
💯 agree. Although the issue with this would be driving the message to the end user.
Unfortunately it isn’t in the developers interest (some not all)
No excuse for not fitting RCBOs. The cost difference over the lifetime of the CU is peanuts. Ideally manufacturers ought to be designing CUs and breakers with both neutral and line bus bars, which would radically simplify the wiring inside the CU.
Watch this space ;)
The cost is the issue. Price of these need to come down.
Prices of RCBOs and Mainswitch boards are exceptionally competitive now 👍🏽 have you seen ours?
No, .. however I am kind of put off by the verso brand, we were called to a certain new build where the main electrical contractor used mostly verso products, we found that the majority of the single and 2 gang sockets had issues with the CPC, when tested.. missing earth.. neutral faults... All verso products not just a couple either. The client asked up to swap out with a different brand, which sorted the faults.
Hi can you please email us with more details about this as we’ve not had any reports of this in the past? Myinstall(@)versoelectrical.go.uk we would really like to know more
@@navitascp unfortunately I can't, without the permission of my employer.. who was called to sort out lots of issues, and the client would have taken it up with the original developer.
No disrespect to verso or any manufacturer. Until split load boards are no longer available on retailers shelves, the simple solution of RCBO boards will never solve itself. The client won't have a cheaper alternative anymore.
Agreed. Until the option is removed by a change in regulation there will always be a market for split load boards. We actually think this may come in the 19th. Amendment 2 has edged it that way a little already
Can't wait to see all the sparkies commenting in 10 years.. "There's no way I fit those RCBOs without the integral AFDD and SPD. They're for all the people that still install ring finals.." Talk about moving the goal posts...
It would be a good sign of electrical safety progression 👍🏽 always a good thing to try an improve standards 🙌🏽
Errr not a chance. Split boards for peeps who still use ring final circuits. Don't know what a wago is and use twin and earth for outside lights.😂😂😂😂
RCBO's all day for me. If the faceless one in the council office specs it, then it's on his head but how the hell can you possibly calculate 9% leakage across a group of circuits that you have no idea what they will end up supplying !
Totally agree!
9% ?
Give money to make the perfect grounding in your house and not rely on the one offered by the provider. If you install a dual rcd or rcbo fusebox must be the second that concerns you....