(Now extinct) FASCINATING 1970's DMR lift control system by Express Lifts + MOTOR ROOM (Part 2)
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- Опубликовано: 16 сен 2024
- This an old 1970s Express lift. This is (*was) one of the last DMR control systems left in the country.
(best viewed in HD :)
*THIS EQUIPMENT HAS NOW BEEN RIPPED OUT - such a shame! :(
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This video shows the other three lifts in this motor room. You can also see the vertically mounted DC generators (four in a line). This are fairly quiet running, compared to others that I've seen (and heard!! LOL).
In this video (near the end) is the "dispatcher" that decides 'which lift goes to which level' on the next video. This is pure 'relay logic'.
The end of the video shows a modernised lift car, but the still the old DMR controller and drive exists (you'd never know!).
Most of this was made in the Express Lifts manufacturing offices in Northampton before it was closed.
Amazing stuff!
Hope you enjoy watching it.
Worked on many of these over the years, lots of arcs & buzzing. A good technician could fault find by ear alone. From my memory the biggest drama I used to have with these were the floor contacts behind the selector carriages, they would wear & cause intermittent faults. Great system, well ahead of it's time but very maintenance intensive. A system like that would never survive today, technicians are not given enough time to maintain something like this anymore. The Mark V common section was relay logic at its finest. Loved seeing the Darlek (vertical) MG sets.
As much as i like new energy efficient systems, i'm always fascinated by the shear ingenuity used in the making of the old electro-mecanical systems. Awesome video !
+gorman2001 Thanks! Would love to go back here and film some more stuff like the dispatcher panel with all those light bulbs, but sadly all this has gone :(
Brings back memories looked after quite a few DMR lifts whilst a technician on Express Lifts I knew these lifts inside out and back to front.
Now happily retired.
Regards,
Martin Dawson
Thanks for the message. I've heard from a few people that have worked (or even installed) these lifts. I would do anything to go back in time to the 80s to have a much closer look at these lifts. Passengers just press a button and get to a floor without being aware of the development that must have gone into designing and installing these beauties. Hat's off to the designers.
It was an engineers with big E. A lot of years in good working conditions. No problens after every big storm, no problems after not stabil voltage. Precision work!
Not a lift geek (yet!), just came across a few videos like this. What a lovely piece of electromechanical engineering this controller is!
"DMR" stands for "Direct Measured Regulation".
This is an excellent video of a now outdated control system. I hope that some of these wonderful old controllers could be preserved in a museum someplace.
It's great fun and so nearly human! The little Parvalux advancer motor leaping forward and the synchro faithfully running along behind trying to catch it up. The dispatcher thinking complex thoughts too fast for us to follow, then instructing its faithful servants to carry out the work in their more plodding manner. One day you will be able to see one working in the museum - but first we have to find it!
Electrical Museum, where is this if you don’t mind me asking?
Awsome!
I'd be like a kid in a playground if I ever was there. I'd be staring at those relays for hours. You're lucky!
I like the "Vero Board" at 5.40. The relays are are almost hypnotic.
One of the buildings I look after, Alexander house in Southend had 8 DC express machines until 2010. They were so reliable and were refitted by Apex using thyssens motors and kollmorgen control. They are now so unreliable, so much for modern technology. Lovely to see this video.
Listercurt Thanks :) Glad I got this footage when I did, only 3 months later the modernisation began. Wish I could have filmed the lightbulb panel on that dispatcher a bit more longer with some activity, but the guy I was with didn't want the passenger lifts moving under our control as it would have confused the security guards in the lobby. I have a little bit more footage from here somewhere, not much but I will have to try and find it.
I can't believe this is on here, this is the 2nd Lift video I've found
Looks like a mark IV dispatcher to me a the end awesome!!!!!!
Does the acronym DMR=Drag magnet Relay ?
I only ever worked on the DMR at Kodak House in Hemel.
Thankyou Mr Matt,
A former Express apprentice anorak
Thank you that brought back a lot of memories for me. My Dad was service supervisor for Express in Newcastle and I got taken around so many lifts and motor rooms! The fun part was looking at the paper schematics for all that stuff that was in those cabinets, he could follow it no problem but it took me years to figure it out.
Sounds fantastic. I wish I could go back to the 90s and film some of the things that I saw. Being in the security industry, some of our door controllers were in lift machine rooms because the doors they controlled were near-by (motor room was a secure environment for it). Went into so many old motor rooms, but it was only when youtube came along that I wished I could go back in time and have filmed them.
The lift in this video was removed about 2 months after I filmed it, but if I COULD go back to just one lift I would go back to this DMR lift and film a lot more!
My exploits were in the 60's and 70's. I remember the change from Express grey to Express green paint schemes. The story I heard from people in the hierarchy was that they eventually ran out of the grey paint they used during the war to paint battleships! On the subject of the relays, I remember asking my dad if it was the same person at Abbey Works that wrote the numbers and letters on them, as they were always the same. He said no, but when you were trained as a draughtsman you developed a standard style!
Reminds me of the old Westinghouse all relay controllers. I recall two versions of those: one with oversized old style telephone relays and the newer (1970's version) with oversized flat spring relays (like the old telephone type U relays).
Fascinating - especially the use of the selsyn to create an exact analog of the car speed on the floor selector unit. That was clever :)
Thanks for this video!!
+Jim Dickenson This is my favourite video and I'd love to go back and get some more footage. Unfortunately this was filmed in 2009 I think, and the lifts were removed about 3 months afterwards. I've looked for the unedited raw footage but I deleted it :(
But I was thankful that I had the opportunity to film something. It was just after I got my first HD camera (720p back then) so happy days.
its such a shame no museums are around to show off all this amazing technology! I wish i had the chance to see this equipment in person but i'm just too young to have seen or worked on any of it. :(
+Julian Curmi - I agree with you - I think a lot of people would enjoy these old control and drive systems if they could see and understand them (even a little). Unfortunately, most people do not even know what exists 'behind' the elevator pushbutton panel so they have no idea of the number of approaches and the ingenuity that has gone into making elevator travel safe and efficient.
Regarding really old things... I have seen a number of the old slate panel type elevator control systems over the years - some working and some not. They are fascinating and usually go back to the 1920's through 1960's (1950's and 1960's often used ebonite instead of slate). The nice thing on those old controllers, they could mostly be fixed using basic tools and in a pinch you could always wind new coils for relays if one cooked itself :)
In Pittsburgh, as I recall seeing, some of the elevators in the very old buildings downtown used to run at about 550 VDC - this is close to the nominal voltage on the trolley lines, 600 VDC, which in the old days was everywhere. (The 600 VDC was generated by rotary converters, but that is another subject).
@@mrmattandmrchay Glad you filmed it in 720p. Wouldn’t it have sucked if you only had your 240p phone with you?
These are just the same as Alexander house, high speed DC motors and vertical Generators. The DMR control system had been upgraded at an earlier time. The older Lift engineers loved them but they needed lots of servicing. The most interesting part, was pressing the button on the 15th /top floor landing and hearing the generators start and the clunking of relays and contactors. :)
Yep, I know what you mean, like this... ruclips.net/video/35zgS_Hc4sM/видео.html see 08:45 :)
What looks like a Motor connected by chain to the divertor wheel is in fact the selsyn generator. The output of the generator is directly proportional to the actual lift speed. It is connected to the selsyn Motor which is located on top of the control panel. The motor speed is dependant on the generator output,and drives the Advancer panels in the auto section of the control system.
+Harry lomas Hi and thanks for the information. I think you know a little about this system, just wondering where the floor indicators are connected to this system? I ask this as, with a few Express installation, the floor indicator jumps 2-3 floors ahead just as the lift has started running? And I'm guessing that there are two parts to this selector so that one serves up (only when the collective state is UP) and the orher serves (or rather 'finds') active down calls? Thanks for your info. Sorry haven't replied recently as things are quite hectic here and i'm still trying to find time to edit my new movie (the Schindler one). Matt
mrmattandmrchay Matt: As with all Express high speed installations the selector circuit contained relays AV1-AV2 and AV3. these were advancer relays and would determine how many floors the selector would be ahead of the lift car. AV1 would advance the selector 1 floor and set the speed relays for a one floor run. Therefore the lift would travel at OF speed for the short distance.AV2 for 2 floor advance (slightly higher speed than OF.AV3 for anything above this. The 2 carriages are indeed UP and DOWN respectively.The slowing sequence is controlled by by a WELL TRANSDUCER positioned on the car top it is a complex bit of kit and is difficult to describe its operation by text. I actually installed some of these in Cardiff in the 1970s (BRUNEL BUILDING)
+Harry lomas Hi Harry - That's really interesting as I know that Brunel building very well! I actually went into the motor room of those express high rise. We had a Laser link between brunel house and knox court (over the road) for the access control system. The company was Legal and General (one of my previous companies customers). I spent a lot of time running between my house and Cardiff for this site.
I remember the cabinets in the motor room had "Express Traffic IV" on them, but I didn't know they were DMR? They used the same upright "pod" dc generator sets.
When they took off downwards, there was always a slight "up" movement first, but the lifts were quite smooth running. One thing I remember was the lights went off inside the car with "DO NOT ENTER" lamps at the back.
I have a few videos of the lifts in this Brunel house building here...
ruclips.net/video/5UcjD8vhxD8/видео.html
And I think these are the ones that you are referring to:
ruclips.net/video/PfeC9LC-Hz8/видео.html
The quality gets a bit better after 1:30. This was filmed during modernisation which is probably why the LED display was messed up (and it's how I got into the motor room, very briefly!).
They were modernised in about 2007 to Kone.
mrmattandmrchay Good afternoon Matt. Brunel House were certainly DMR when installed, i do not know what happened to the installations after that. From what i remember there were 9 lifts in the building, 8 passenger & a pass/goods elsewhere in the building. As you entered the main lobby there were 4 (lowrise lifts) then the 4 (high-rise). I installed the 2 Highrise lifts on the left hand side, from what i remember they travelled from G with the first stop being about 9 then every floor to the top.That seems so long ago and i was in my mid 20s.Th DO NOT ENTER flashing indicator at the rear of the car was a feature of the Express Mk4 despatch system' it was to let potential incoming passengers know that the lift was unavailable and was about to be despatched to a waiting call zone.
So a Selsyn motor is a synchronous motor. Is Selsyn a trade marked term?
When I first saw this stuff 26 years ago as a young Apprentice I was thinking about giving The elevator game Away to become A Milkman. Just as well I stuck it out and still going strong.
I wonder if they left those big DC machines in place, or if they ripped those out too...
10:36 that beautiful old panel. Wow. This has to be preserved at any cost.
I forgot it has been modernized, would you go back and look at it?
Would absolutely love to go back and film this again, one slight problem though, it was modernised about 3 months after I filmed it. It's looooong gone I'm afraid! :(
mrmattandmrchay something about those flashing Filament that reminds me of something.
._.
Thanks for that, yes just the same. I love the way the goods lift is reversed so as to hide it away from the main corridor. It's surprising how many passenger lifts get modernised but the harder working goods lifts don't. Maybe a good thing.
Listercurt That's the good thing about goods lifts, as they are hidden they tend to be modernised last! These ones were modernised about 2-3 months after I filmed them. Thank goodness that they were filmed before being ripped out.
Now that is an incredibly over-engineered controller/selector. Omg!
Those Generators You See were Nickednamed By Aussie Lift Mechanics as The Daleks from Dr Who.
Those MG sets were also called 'Daleks' here in the UK as well
Wow, what a load of these equipments in motoring is! Be-careful, I don't wanna such things any affecting by touching anything! Great video, mate!... (Oh gosh, it is!!!) 😯😏👍
Thanks for the comment
That's such a unique levelling system on the floor selector too! A whole seperate motor and chain drive system to move the levelling board up and down *droool*
The concept of this system (5:51) is very similar to the cartridge type rotary selectors (which I'm sure you;ve seen)
wow this is amazing! I never thought elevators we so complex! I guess nowadays a few silicon chips in a tiny box could do the same job. Looks like a big motor, is this a freight elevator?
Do i understand correctly that the farmost chain at 7:11 stops when the lift starts decelerating? The other chain then cuts out the 6 contacts on the 'extending' part of the selector one by one, cutting current to the field coil of the lennart set. That's why this thing decelerates so smoothly!
Must be a very expensive version of this lift. A demo version installed to impress new customers perhaps?
Do you have a video detailing the operation of that shuttle in a shuttle thing that mimics the car movement?
I really wish I could go back here and record a whole lot more, but this video was from 2011, 3 months before the lifts were modernised. And now, the building has been demolished!! Unfortunately, the video that I uploaded was most of the footage I had. So much time has passed, that anything else is long-gone! To record that floor selector (shuttle) would involve opening the back of the panel. The guy who I went with took me there (a lift engineer who was once on youtube called rizzbriff - the king of youtube lift videos in the 2010s) but he took me there at 4am!! So I didn't want to take too much of his time. If I'd done this today, then absolutely I would have asked him to open the whole panel, but it is what it is!
HOWEVER, I do have a very good idea of how it works. If you're interested then I think I can describe it.
mrmattandmrchay What a waste of money then, that means the lifts survived for only a few years after the modernisation
This sort of stuff should have been saved and offered to a museum for history and “working” demonstration but I doubt there is a lift museum.
When I see the DMR controller with the "card" that is pulled out in distance of two floors (as represented even by the "display" in the cabin) in start sequence, I want to ask - is it possible for this elefator to travel for one floor only (ie. 15 -> 14)?
Sorry for bad English.
+paul2no Yes it can do a one floor run.
A relay closes (OF) to signal a one floor run, preventing the lift from travelling too fast.
Would have loved to film that dispatcher more, but this was for the 3 lifts in main lobby. There was virtually no-one in the bldg and security would have noticed the lifts going up and down and would have cause issues! The lift I filmed was the fireman's lift.
I used to be an engineer in the Hemel region and remember the Kodak building-never went in there. Did you ever work on the large Fujitsu building in Bracknell (approx 15-20 flrs?). That was an Express installation with the orange lamps.
@harrihealey02 There would not be the expertise. Engineers today are trained on circuit board and software. But, like you, I'd love to learn more about how this machine is constructed as you can actually watch each component work. Beautiful piece of engineering and makes me wonder how many prototypes they had before they ended up with this incredible design!
I worked on my first DMR in 1967 at Drapers Gardens, Crown House in Barking, New Government Offices, then Rivermill House.
Regards,
Martin
Looks a fascinating building: www.skyscrapernews.com/picturedisplay.php?ref=2244&idi=Crown+House&self=nse&selfidi=2244CrownHouse_pic1.jpg&no=1 I've done a bit of googling and found that there were plans (aug2018) to demolish the tower block. I'd love to look around that tower but I very much doubt the DMRs are still there. I couldn't find Rivermill house though. These lifts are fascinating and I'd have loved to have had another opportunity to look at this technology once again. The building in this video is the Rolls Royce building near Victoria - also up for demolishion. These DMRs lifts were ripped out about 3 months after I filmed this, back in 2011.
All you need is electrical Trade.
Went to A Technical College to do Electrical.
Was offered Apprenticeship in 1985 for EPL / KONE.
Continued Tech College for 1st year of Apprenticeship passing Trade Course.
Continued Apprenticeship, went back to Tech College to do Industrial Electronics for 2 years passed. Then went to Institute of Technology to do Electrical Engineering Certificate, this was optional. I struggled with this course for 3 years but managed to just scrape in a Pass for it.
This was very impressive...."relay" logic" dispatcher also.....wow.....speechless....
The Otis Gen2 Regen Drive actually returns unused power back to the buildings electrical system. Previously this unsed current was disapated via resistors as heat. And with older DC machines electric current was constantly being generated for nothing and if the control panel generator shutdown relay timers failed you end up with them wasting electricity as they constantly run all night and best part of the day when the elevators are not used.
That has synchronous drive. Very ahead of its time.
@harrihealey02 You can get a better view of the motor from one of the passenger lifts at 8:14. This is a gearless machine-the motor is on one end and the sheave(wheel to turn the cables) is on the other end - it's one big unit. These are only fitted on high rise. Normally the motor is much smaller, connects to a gearbox, then the sheave comes off of that. Cool eh!?
That down arrow shows because the lift does not serve floors 1-7 (no buttons), so an arrow shows instead when passing here.
That is one serious piece of elevator controller hardware, and the dispatch board, and the little lights a marvel of engineering, I've never seen sheaves that big before other than on a vertical lift draw bridge in Portland OR (Hawthrone Bridge) Bet there is serious 3 phase
electrical power running the generators and controllers.
Beautiful, Harmonious & Balanced Machine !
Indeed!
The majesty of "analog" machines (^_^)
What a great video ! a bit of history ! lovely old machines !
Wish wish wish I could go back here and do some more filming. Agreed these are fascinating but they were ripped out about 3 months after I filmed them. But at least I filmed them! Thanks for the comment
Those were the day's my friend,they will never end,lar,lar,lar ,lar,lar those were day's my friends.Those old electromechanical lift controllers were designed to last compered to modern day programmable logical controller's. I worked for express lift for 14 months and use service and repair D.M.R regulators or d.c motor speed controlers.
lovely contraption! Question. How can the floor selector be in sync with the cabin? The cabin is moving one motor which controls the floor selector's motor. But I guess they are not stepped motors, how can they stay in sync?
Great video, thanks. What do the six valves at 9:44 do?
@produKtNZ What a design!! Must have been many prototypes before they got to this!
Ever wonder what a CPU looks like inside? This times one million.
Look up the Eniac or Univac.
Reminds me of all my years working on Westinghouse DMRs in Toronto many years ago
Many a long night fault finding on this stuff back in the 80s. A long learning curve and i don't think i had grasped it all after years of working on it.
Express Lifts had an agreement with Westinghouse corp of America to exchange technologies and patents Hence the Express DMR was built under license from Westinghouse. I believe that part of this agreement also excluded either party from selling equipment in each others' home territories, hence no Express Lifts in the USA or Westinghouse Lifts in the UK. Although Westinghouse had a controlling interest in a UK lift manufacturer, I believe (H and C lifts)
Good NIGHT! And I thought the screwy thing running up and down was complicated. Who ever worked on this system was NOT paid enough! Very Good Video!
Lewie McNeely There were a few sites with this lift - this was very fast and complicated, and I suppose would have been Express's flagship high-speed lift design. But the design was (as far as I know) not around for that long, before microprocessors and PLCs (I/O) arrived. After that, who wants to install such a complicated system! This system was ripped out months after I filmed it - real shame, but glad I had a chance to film it (and it's in 720p).
That one was an electricians worst nightmare. Nothing simple there at all!
+Lewie McNeely Too right we were not paid enough, the DMR was a very complex system and although they were pretty reliable there was a lot of scope for failure.
I'd say! You did good to even come in to work on one of these.
AC as a control meathod for elevators has only really come into its own in the last 20yrs or so with the advance in electronics and equipment that can control the varible frequencies to provide smooth starting travel and stopping of elevators. Previously An AC lift would crash stop into level in an uncontrolled fashion. DC motors and controllers provided a more smooth form of travel and levelling via step up/down resistors. Because the UK has AC incoming a DC generator was required to convert.
Hi mrmatt,
maybe this is also interesting:
Old Otis 6850 Selector 1964 era in operation 50 years.
What are the lights at 9:44 on the right side? That looks like electronic cards with LED, but it can't be, I think. And are the relais seen on the left also part of the dispatcher? Does it work without any electronic devices like logic gates?
I've been watching a lot of your lift videos (they interest me) and all the machinery from these old lifts looks complicated as feck how they used to work!! Can't get me head round it haha. One of my mates is an engineer with Kone I should ask him
Thanks :) This is one of my favourite videos and I would love to have filmed some more here. What I find is, when I've filmed something I realise how it works and then want to go back and film certain items again - too late here as these lifts were modernised many years ago now.
My next video is another relay motor room with explanations of how it works.
+Sam Fitton No good asking a Kone engineer about a DMR with a Mk4 despatcher system it would be like sending a Skoda mechanic to a Rolls Royce.
HERE IN ROMANIA, THOSE TYPES OF "EXTINCT" LIFTS ARE VIRTUALLY IN EVERY BUILDING WITH MORE THAN 4 FLOORS!
Would love to see a few of them, but I think they are mostly the same design everywhere? When I went to Chernobyl/Pripyat, all the lifts were the same design, which I wasn't aware of until we visited.
@@mrmattandmrchay
As far as I know elevators in Romania are different from those in Russia/Ukraine, but they may be similar to each other.
Yes, this all makes sense. The H+C COPs and fixtures appear in the US and I did wonder why
Super! Nice!
The '70s were a great era for lifts!
Synchro transformer/motors relating the position information to the selector. High level electromechanical automation
Its for handwinding the lift. To be honest I doubt its ever been used as the machines are mounted upside down it would take at least 5 people or more to carry out this procedure.
Second questions coming to mind. What is the purpose of the DC generators? and a general note... Ensure you keep captions on screen for long enough that us slow readers can read without pausing constantly.
Wow, i am impressed such a nice technical design.
No silicon chips and software. is this a dc system? Why the generators?
GREAT! i love the old system, very solid state =)
Brilliant system - doubt if you'll find it anywhere anymore. This was ripped out about 2-3 months after I filmed it. Real shame, fascinating design.
mrmattandmrchay What a crime... :( This video is fascinating. The flippin' things they could do with relays back then!!!! I am actually a design engineer and I work with micro-controller units all the time, but just like with steam engines, you can replace them with something more modern, but it won't be as magical and beautiful. ;)
At least there are 20+ more GEC Express DMRs in Hong Kong.
there is a local mental hospital where m mom works and there is still an elevator from 1955 like a green elevator with big black buttons beautiful wood on the inside
Technik, die begeistert.
At 49, I came up through the trade right at the tail end of when all this stuff was still in service so I know it very well. However the guys with glassy eyes over it are all 20 years older than me and anyone younger has no idea what it even is.
I know what you mean, I'm 51 now I served my apprenticeship at Express,
Ah them wert'days!!!. The only DMRs I ever worked were in Hemel Hempstead
I only know what the DMR controller is because of this channel, I’m 16 and I am very grateful to have found Matt’s channel. Such cool technology. Also such a shame that not many young kids are interested in electronics and stuff like this, it’s all around us and is amazing when you think about how electromechanical switches control an entire lift system.
Very well looked after both by owner and service company.
Right about 9 minutes into your video you show a shot of the Silvostat box too bad the lift wasn't in motion! You would have had a great show! This machine looks to be a later build DMR as the dispatching logic looks to be TTL (transistor/transistor Logic) The carded array of lamps is the dispatching logic module, so it looks to be a set of 3 lifts, the dispatching module tells which lift to answer which call from the hallway. If you watch, you could see the lifts responding and the lamps extinguish as they arrive at their destinations. All this equipment is USA designed by Westinghouse Elevator which was Otis elevators largest competitor in the USA market. Westinghouse is now owned by Schindler.
Eric Brandt Cool! Interesting!! I didn't see the Silvostat box on the lift that I was filming. The story was, I was with a guy who was showing me everything. The lift we were running up and down was the fireman's lift. He didn't want to run the 3 passenger lifts as this might have left security in the lobby wondering why the lifts were going up and down at midnight. It's a bit of a shame as I really wanted to study that dispatcher and the lamps display. So we couldn't run the passenger lifts at all :(Anyway, the Silvostat box I didn't notice on the fireman's lift. Really glad you are able to tell me about some of this stuff. It was all removed about 3 months after I filmed it, so it's long gone. Would have loved to return to study it further.
+Eric Brandt from what i remember Eric the hallcalls were allocated to each individual lift by the NCS board mounted top rear of the despatch section cabinet. This was the nearest car selector which was quite simply a lot of in-line resistors which directed an incoming call via the road of least resistance to an individual lift AUTO section. Do you remember much about this equipment?
In the us this is a Westinghouse DMR. In Chicago same equipment in sears tower now called willis tower.color is blue not otis green.
How were this controlled? I don't understand how many relays just connected to each other makes a lift logic Do these also have lots of transistors put to gether like an modern CPU but in a different place?
rates right up there with a gold flight!
Could you remember if the passenger lifts which have recieved the cab refurbishment was also modernised with the fireman’s lift?
At 1:37 it looks like that is a stepper motor, probably controlled by en ancoder on the cab, that drives the floor selector. You can see it make just one more step at the end.
From you description i presume you have been invited to the manufacturer to film this. Did they give you a technical description of the installation? It must have long since lost its 'top secret' status by now!
Wow that is incredibly complicated! It seems almost a shame that the same can now be done in silicone! I presume these are in a block of flats or something? What is the big yellow emergency winding wheel for?
This is like a huge mechanical pinball machine.
+Premium fuel only No. Not even close.
+Premium fuel only My mate had an old pinball machine so I know exactly what you mean :)
+mrmattandmrchay
Yeah I've seen those, they remind my of this very much!
wow
So what can cause floor levelling failure?
I was recently in a 1970s Otis lift which stopped half way above the selected floor 10 and did the same on floor 12 but stopped correctly inline with floor 14. It was the type with push and pull landing doors that would not open when on 10 and 12 despite the sliding interior doors still opening as normal. Both doors opened normally on 14.
What can cause this, could it be faulty floor selector tape? Also why does the interior door open? Thanks.
The only name for the people who design these lift control systems is genius's.
Absolutely! I have a jukebox video coming soon from 1985 - it's very much like old lift technology! Again, how the heck did they design it!
@mrmattandmrchay so from what i understand for every floor there is a different program so if someone pressed 7 in the lift on the 5th floor the lift would go up two floors but if the lift is on the 6th floor the program changes so the lift only goes up one floor?
Where is Part 2 to "Used to be PETRIFIED of these! Does this CLASSIC OTIS LIFT work?"
This motor that moves the chain, is it a synchro? How does it keep in sync with the elevator position?
+Elvis Pfützenreuter That thing at 0:01 (with the chain) is wired to the motor on top of the cabinet at 00:10. This design meant that there no longer needed to be a mechanical link between the cabinet and the motor.
I have a lift eng friend that took me here and showed me around. Apparently sometimes it can go out of sequence.
+mrmattandmrchay Hello Matt, it most certainly could go out of sych,due to the fact that the advancer motor and the selsyn (self synchronised) motor were connected together mechanically by a clutch, which if not adjusted or became oil impregnated would slip.Also the selector chains had to have the correct tension (not too tight) these were adjusted at the top and bottom of each carriage after being checked with a spring balance.
Ah cool, I didn't know that. Just trying to understand which part of the system that name came from.
Your camera was not happy about the EMF next to that generator!
How many floors were actually in this building? On the elevator going up I counted 13 floors, and the flashing floor indicators in the machine room varied which I would expect with multiple elevators, some went up 18 and stopped at the top of the indicator board. Which I am assuming were high speed express cars from a sky lobby somewhere with in the building.
15 floors. It's the old Rolls Royce building near Victoria. Lifts were modernised 3 months after filming this, I believe the building is now going to be demolished. There were 2 banks of 3 passenger lifts and one fireman's lift.
@@mrmattandmrchay Wow this installation was the Rolls Royce of traction elevators in a mid rise building. Huge gear-less machines, sheaves, double wrapped, complex floor selector, floor relays. and speed control. I have seen videos of gear-less traction machines installed in some mid rise building with 2:1 roping. The old Rolls Royce Building did indeed have express elevators. A marvel of engineering.
It's probably a Synchro-Resolver system, certainly looks that way.
the cabine looks like normal but the machine is sooo huge? wow
@TarzanAndConz I think you've described it better than me :)
RIZZBRIFF had the BEST videos, why did he disappear from RUclips anyways?
I guess there is a large potential for failure and breakdown with such a complex system of relays etc.
Is it the tower abandoned in 2005?
I wonder if a tiny EMP spike was the cause of interesting camera(?) glitch just after 1:13, or if it was something else.
That's my old camera, the first HD (720p) one that I owned. I think there was something wrong with the camera or the memory card, as it did this in most videos. Spend a lot of my editing time chopping these frames out of videos :/
@@mrmattandmrchay Ah, I see, it was just an artifact then. I saw a comment somewhere noting that it was a common problem (MP4 encoding error, I think it said) with that specific model of Sony. Glad to hear you've upgraded :) and thanks for letting me know.
The dispatcher is relay based or solid state / microprocessor ?. The logic behind multiple lift linked and the optimun path and time is SERIUS bussiness that still, on microprocessor / PLC / SW looks like tons of program (I think that his logic could be as complex as you want). Well, there were relay based computers ... so nothing is impossible. Nice room. I didnt understand this selector thing very well. Do you have any other video covering this ?. Cheers
+38911bytefree The dispatcher section is completely relay based , the floors of the building are separated into ZONES usually 4 floors to a ZONE. As a call entered the system the zone relay for that call would start to find the nearest available lift car. If it was not allocated within a certain time the call was given priority over all other landing calls. The Express MK 4 as it was known is universally recognised as the best and most efficient relay based dispatch system in that era. It was very complex and could be an absolute nightmare to fault find on.
Peter Lomas WOW, that sounds impressive for relay logic. It this from the 70s ?.
+38911bytefree Yes early 70s, it was based (i am informed) on the Westinghouse Selectomatic system of the late 60s. It was updated during the next decade until it became redundant with the introduction of PLCs, which in my opinion were no better than what they replaced but were less costly to manufacture.
+38911bytefree tell you what. .. i would LOVE to refilm this. But unfortunately when I filmed it, it was because it was imminently going to be ripped out and modernised. I very much doubt there are any more left especially in the UK. Facinating stuff isn't it? Ive also looked for my original footage to see if there is anything that I could add to this video but that's gone too :( Ive been sent some additional info on this kit by Pete Lomas. Going through it is quite a task. Id like to say that I'll make a separate video when ive understood it more but this is possibly something that I can due afyer I've retired in another 30 years time lol.
Sir do you know how to troubleshoot this?.
We have a unit like this in our site it opens in car call but in hall call it just lands but won't open.
Have a look down the comments for 'Danny & Joanne'. Expand the comment, you will see Peter Lomas - leave a message for him, he may be able to help? For me, I was just filming the equipment - I have a very basic understanding of a few items, but nothing that's going to help you fix your fault. Please let me know how you get on as I'm interested! I would love the opportunity to film one of these again. My email is mattw.youtube@virginmedia.com if you have any photos? Many thanks.
and it drives soo fast thats unbelievalbe
Is anyone knows how to troubleshoot this need help .
We have one here in Dubai it won't open in landing call only in car call
Where is the place when these lifts was installed?
It's a tall building in Victoria, London. The old rolls royce office block, but these are LONG gone!
@@mrmattandmrchay this is so sad… in my opinion DMR’s were one of the best lifts… thank you!!
i like this old system
Pooi
Hai Daniel
like wow
i think the camera was glitching out becouse of all the electric stuff, also who watches this in 2018?.
Nah... that's my first HD camera (only 720p) it always did this. Never did solve it so think it was just because it was the first generation of HD cameras and probably a design bug or something
good
thanks :)
@produKtNZ Yeah, cool isn't it :)
that is one powerful elevator. it sounds like it's very fast too
It did go 4 m/s.