So far, I see that it has many interesting qualities. At times, a photo can look like a photo using the trichome process to some degree like from around the early 1900's. At other times, it's more on the "Lomography" side of things. I'm enjoying it so far. You might want to bring another camera with some "normal" color film with you if you are doing a shoot, especially if you're documenting something. Congratulations to Harman! I'd like to see them bring out another color film, one that's bit closer to reality but also special. Thanks for making such great videos!
Well it’s not a bad idea with bringing another camera but I wasn’t expecting such results. I used Orwo NC500, Lomo Turquoise in similar conditions and everything turned out much better 🧐
I'm really excited to try this film stock myself, hopefully soon! Thank you for the video, I'm jealous of the Scrapyard location, it looks like a dream place for taking photos 😄Pozdrawiam!
Just don’t be disappointed 😅 It’s great that Phoenix was made, no doubt about it but right now it’s not even ORWO level 😅 Pozdrawiam, czekam na kolejne filmy na kanale 🫡
I really liked these images. What some may consider "wrong" I consider nicely artistic. It makes me want to experiment with filters with the film. It inspires my desire to "paint" a photograph, rather than just imitate reality.
@@grainystories i always tell my students to blame accident when it goes badly, and curse it, but celebrate accident when the result is good, and drink to more happy accidents in future :) And never forget that one of the most wonderful art movements in history, surrealism, was built on accessing the unconscious. Sometimes the best art comes from not being in control. Meanwhile, I for one like the results that Phoenix gave you. It makes me want to try the film. Most film is very predictable and 'safe.' Dancing with the unpredictable adds spice to life, and getting away from the safety zone reminds us that we are firstly artists exploring our creativity. Your photographs were full of drama. That is what I liked.
@@artistjoh well, I really like your approach 😅 Maybe you’re right, I was disappointed about the results at first but after viewing those shots a few times while making this video I started to appreciate at least some of them. No doubt, they are not even close to what I was expecting but are they bad? 🤔
@@grainystories Good and bad are very much subjective conclusions. Because of that, individuals will often disagree over whether or not a result was one or the other. Ultimately, though, the only important thing, is how you relate to the results, because it is you who is artist and creator. I fully understand your consternation over the results not meeting your expectations, however, I will not be the only one who can appreciate the way the results transformed otherwise bland subjects into an interestingly poetic translation of the subjects with a drama of light and shade, and once you get over the need to be in full control, hopefully you too can appreciate the happy accidents for what they are. This is not dissimilar to my appreciation of 110 format film. Too many people dismiss it as simply 'too grainy.' I, on the other hand embrace the grain, and look for subjects that visually work well with grain, and thus the thing that other people see as a flaw, I simply see as a creative jumping off point. The flaw becomes the feature. Letting go like that, opens a new universe of possibilities. Early in the 20th century a Polish filmmaker, Ladislas Starevich accidentally discovered that bumping the model gave an interesting motion blur effect, and he started actively exploring motion blur. As a result he is now regarded as the father of both motion blur still photography, and in motion pictures, he invented stop-motion animation, both of which grew out of a happy accident. Most people would have said "dammit" and vow to not repeat it. Starevich instead said "that's interesting," and set out to explore it more. Few people realize that animations like Wallace and Gromit, or smoothing moving water using an ND filter and slow shutter both grew out of Starevich accidentally bumping the model in a photo shoot and liking the result. As William Klein once said, "blur is a natural part of life," and then made an entire career out of exploiting motion blur inspired by what Starevich was doing. I am an art history lecturer if you hadn't noticed :)
@@artistjoh Good or bad is subjective, no arguments here. I think that after watching a few videos about Phoenix I expected completely different results. So I had something completely different in my head and received something completely different from the lab. And that’s why I made this episode to show what you can expect from this stock, what are its limitations and I believe everyone could form their own conclusions. And it’s good to know why final images turned out that way to be able to use Phoenix for specific artistic visions ;) Like not only accept it but also understand it. I just like to know why 😅 For example to consciously underexpose the film to get specific “Mexico” look or to use it in even light to get this 80’s vibe. So yeah, all in all I’m pretty satisfied with the results because I could show some different perspective ;)
I really like the images you made - I thought the underexposed looked very cool and a bit surreal - and the over-exposed looked much more 'normal' - but I liked all of them! I think you had a real success with shooting this roll of Phoenix!
Thank you! It’s not that I don’t like those shots but the result surprised me a little bit and probably I was excepting something different. But I’m so glad you like them 😍 and in hindsight, I like them much more
Well, the sun was already setting behind the buildings but those shots were done from different angles so at least the second one should be ok, because the sun was more or less behind me 🧐
I'll be honest. While I greatly appreciate the efforts Harman went through and everything, I do have to say I don't like Phoenix at all. You can do some cool stuff with it if you REALLY set everything up for this specific film; grainydays had some pretty nice shots in his Phoenix videos. But then again, everything else mostly looks terrible to me. Latitude, grain, colors... most of your shots also look very underexposed which resulted in VERY overblown contrast in many shots. All the "overexposed" images look a lot better, at least. The way it turned out, for what I'm looking for in a film, this isn't it. Harman said very clearly in their factory tour how they were looking for an emulsion that they could easily produce with what they already had at hand. This makes me think their capabilities for improving on this formula or creating anything more sophisticated are very limited. I'd love for them to prove me wrong, though.
Yeah, I was also very exited about Phoenix after watching Grainydays video and I was pretty shocked after picking up my developed roll. I wasn’t really aware how contrasty and limited is this stock and my shots are not the best recommendation but well I need to shoot it one more time to make a final judgement. You’re right about the emulsion, it’s based on XP2 so they literally used the only foothold they had 😅 For now Phoenix just shows that someone still cares about the film. On the other hand, we have enough experimental stocks from Lomo 🧐
@@grainystories It's great that we have some variety in film stocks, othervise everything would look like same old portra and hp5. At that point we could all just shoot digital tbh.
@@jyrkijyrki9392 yes, it’s great to have a choice but at the same time I can’t ignore the cons of Phoenix. I exposed it at the box speed and it turned out to be very contrasting and very limited and that’s what the video’s about 😅 Maybe someone after watching this episode won’t ruin the roll like me 🙈
So far, I see that it has many interesting qualities. At times, a photo can look like a photo using the trichome process to some degree like from around the early 1900's. At other times, it's more on the "Lomography" side of things. I'm enjoying it so far. You might want to bring another camera with some "normal" color film with you if you are doing a shoot, especially if you're documenting something. Congratulations to Harman! I'd like to see them bring out another color film, one that's bit closer to reality but also special. Thanks for making such great videos!
Well it’s not a bad idea with bringing another camera but I wasn’t expecting such results. I used Orwo NC500, Lomo Turquoise in similar conditions and everything turned out much better 🧐
I'm really excited to try this film stock myself, hopefully soon! Thank you for the video, I'm jealous of the Scrapyard location, it looks like a dream place for taking photos 😄Pozdrawiam!
Just don’t be disappointed 😅 It’s great that Phoenix was made, no doubt about it but right now it’s not even ORWO level 😅 Pozdrawiam, czekam na kolejne filmy na kanale 🫡
I really liked these images. What some may consider "wrong" I consider nicely artistic. It makes me want to experiment with filters with the film. It inspires my desire to "paint" a photograph, rather than just imitate reality.
Yeah, but those artistic effect were completely unintended and unconscious 😅
@@grainystories i always tell my students to blame accident when it goes badly, and curse it, but celebrate accident when the result is good, and drink to more happy accidents in future :)
And never forget that one of the most wonderful art movements in history, surrealism, was built on accessing the unconscious. Sometimes the best art comes from not being in control.
Meanwhile, I for one like the results that Phoenix gave you. It makes me want to try the film. Most film is very predictable and 'safe.' Dancing with the unpredictable adds spice to life, and getting away from the safety zone reminds us that we are firstly artists exploring our creativity. Your photographs were full of drama. That is what I liked.
@@artistjoh well, I really like your approach 😅 Maybe you’re right, I was disappointed about the results at first but after viewing those shots a few times while making this video I started to appreciate at least some of them. No doubt, they are not even close to what I was expecting but are they bad? 🤔
@@grainystories Good and bad are very much subjective conclusions. Because of that, individuals will often disagree over whether or not a result was one or the other.
Ultimately, though, the only important thing, is how you relate to the results, because it is you who is artist and creator. I fully understand your consternation over the results not meeting your expectations, however, I will not be the only one who can appreciate the way the results transformed otherwise bland subjects into an interestingly poetic translation of the subjects with a drama of light and shade, and once you get over the need to be in full control, hopefully you too can appreciate the happy accidents for what they are.
This is not dissimilar to my appreciation of 110 format film. Too many people dismiss it as simply 'too grainy.' I, on the other hand embrace the grain, and look for subjects that visually work well with grain, and thus the thing that other people see as a flaw, I simply see as a creative jumping off point. The flaw becomes the feature. Letting go like that, opens a new universe of possibilities.
Early in the 20th century a Polish filmmaker, Ladislas Starevich accidentally discovered that bumping the model gave an interesting motion blur effect, and he started actively exploring motion blur. As a result he is now regarded as the father of both motion blur still photography, and in motion pictures, he invented stop-motion animation, both of which grew out of a happy accident. Most people would have said "dammit" and vow to not repeat it. Starevich instead said "that's interesting," and set out to explore it more.
Few people realize that animations like Wallace and Gromit, or smoothing moving water using an ND filter and slow shutter both grew out of Starevich accidentally bumping the model in a photo shoot and liking the result. As William Klein once said, "blur is a natural part of life," and then made an entire career out of exploiting motion blur inspired by what Starevich was doing.
I am an art history lecturer if you hadn't noticed :)
@@artistjoh Good or bad is subjective, no arguments here. I think that after watching a few videos about Phoenix I expected completely different results. So I had something completely different in my head and received something completely different from the lab. And that’s why I made this episode to show what you can expect from this stock, what are its limitations and I believe everyone could form their own conclusions. And it’s good to know why final images turned out that way to be able to use Phoenix for specific artistic visions ;) Like not only accept it but also understand it. I just like to know why 😅 For example to consciously underexpose the film to get specific “Mexico” look or to use it in even light to get this 80’s vibe. So yeah, all in all I’m pretty satisfied with the results because I could show some different perspective ;)
I really like the images you made - I thought the underexposed looked very cool and a bit surreal - and the over-exposed looked much more 'normal' - but I liked all of them! I think you had a real success with shooting this roll of Phoenix!
Thank you! It’s not that I don’t like those shots but the result surprised me a little bit and probably I was excepting something different. But I’m so glad you like them 😍 and in hindsight, I like them much more
Like the orange- kinda mexico- vibe 👌
All in all is not so bad 😅
On the tge merry go around... Could it be that you were shooting into the sun? As in, sun in the background of the photo?
Well, the sun was already setting behind the buildings but those shots were done from different angles so at least the second one should be ok, because the sun was more or less behind me 🧐
Shoot only 1 roll of phoenix and honestly it looks like expired svema/orwocolor from 80s, just with normal iso, instead of 3-25
Exactly! 😅
Just like Soviet TV 😂🤣😁
I'll be honest. While I greatly appreciate the efforts Harman went through and everything, I do have to say I don't like Phoenix at all. You can do some cool stuff with it if you REALLY set everything up for this specific film; grainydays had some pretty nice shots in his Phoenix videos. But then again, everything else mostly looks terrible to me. Latitude, grain, colors... most of your shots also look very underexposed which resulted in VERY overblown contrast in many shots. All the "overexposed" images look a lot better, at least.
The way it turned out, for what I'm looking for in a film, this isn't it. Harman said very clearly in their factory tour how they were looking for an emulsion that they could easily produce with what they already had at hand. This makes me think their capabilities for improving on this formula or creating anything more sophisticated are very limited. I'd love for them to prove me wrong, though.
Yeah, I was also very exited about Phoenix after watching Grainydays video and I was pretty shocked after picking up my developed roll. I wasn’t really aware how contrasty and limited is this stock and my shots are not the best recommendation but well I need to shoot it one more time to make a final judgement. You’re right about the emulsion, it’s based on XP2 so they literally used the only foothold they had 😅 For now Phoenix just shows that someone still cares about the film. On the other hand, we have enough experimental stocks from Lomo 🧐
I developed Pheonix in ECN-2 and also pulled it one stop
and it looks significantly better, ends up having improved contrast and latitude
@@thatfellarosto maybe that’s a solution 😂 I have to order this film one more time and try different settings on a camera.
@@grainystories Even pulling one stop in c41 definitely helps a lot too!
You underexposed, simple as that. Rate it at 125 iso and you're good.
Not as simple, because not every shot was underexposed. Rating at 125 will solve some problems but won’t change characteristic of this film.
@@grainystories It's great that we have some variety in film stocks, othervise everything would look like same old portra and hp5. At that point we could all just shoot digital tbh.
@@jyrkijyrki9392 yes, it’s great to have a choice but at the same time I can’t ignore the cons of Phoenix. I exposed it at the box speed and it turned out to be very contrasting and very limited and that’s what the video’s about 😅 Maybe someone after watching this episode won’t ruin the roll like me 🙈