By no means was it a fair test. Not spraying the box on the inside and elevating the work station off the surface and leaving the base wet and letting the box sit with everything in it for a while is the unfair equivalent to using a flow hood with a ripped filter or an inadequate fan.
You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what a SAB is. The idea isn't to create an air tight seal with gloves, that's just a glove box with turbulent (not still) air currents caused by said gloves. Hence this test is null and void unfortunately. Good comparison of a glovebox and FFU though.
It's really not even a good comparison. You have to wait a little while for all the dust to settle down in the SAB. He started taking measurements almost immediately. I'd love to see this same test again, but wait for 15 or 30 minutes for all the particulates to settle in the SAB.
Actual procedure for a SAB is to let it sit for 20 minutes after spray with 70% IPA. You litterally loaded the chamber with the room air by opening the sealed chamber then took a reading? A poor way to come to any scientific conclusion.
I have 2 issues with this video. That is most definitely not an SAB, and that is most likely not a flow hood (I cant tell because I cannot see it in its entirety). What you are showcasing is what is called a "glove box" as the cavity is sealed, and the gloves are attached. An SAB simply has holes with which you reach your hands through (gloved or not) into the workspace. And, a "flow hood" has an actual hood (walls and topping), or in the case of a vertical hood the FFU sits atop and has three walls creating an enclosure to work within. Either way, there is literally an enclosed workspace (except for the direction that faces you). Now, if I am incorrect, and theres an actual hood attached that I simply cannot see in this video, then my apologies for this particular point. All that being said, theres nothing wrong with either of these tools youve demonstrated in this video. Both will work perfectly fine for mycology with proper sterile technique. My only issue is the incorrect terminology you are teaching to beginners in this hobby.
So if you make one easy mod to the SAB your results will be better. Cover the inside of the lid with a cloth that has been wet with a bleach and water solution prior to positioning the box on top. But you still need to give it some time so the particles settle. I have had zero contamination using this little hack. Full disclosure this was not my idea. Sorry to say I forget the name of the creator who put this out but I would like to thank him!
Nice tip--thanks. I'm going to try this. Thought I'd add that 1 teaspoon of bleach to 32 oz of water is a good recipe for decontamination. This is what at least one cat rescue I know recommended to decontaminate and kill pathogens on things like cat carriers, boxes, etc. that other cats may have used.
I work in pharma manufacturing - best practise is 70% alcohol 15 min settle contact time then bleach some with 500 ppm strength (Milton) with same contact settle time. A small HEPA grade laminar flow far on top of the SAB would work I have seen many people do that.
Under 100 dollars is an understatement and 995 dolas for the hepa seems low, does that include the fan box and everything, idk maybe is cheaper in the US.
That's not a still air box. It's a glove box, and apparently much worse for mycology than a glove-less SAB, which allows some air to flow in and out. Gloved sealed boxes create turbulence as you move around and the unsterilized air is moving much more than in a non-sealed still air box.
bro, the point of the still air box is to wait a while after opening it to let the particles fall you'll have air currents in there with how quick you did it
I use a bionare air unit with a 99.99 percent hepa on a positive pressure lab and it works fantastic I’ve yet to have a single contam on any of my stuff
@Fresh Cultivators What if you took and and used a continuous fine mist sprayer with Clorox and mist down the walls so they were damp inside the SAB so particles wouldn't bounce off the walls and be trapped? This is what I'm planning to try so then I can flame sterilized inside the SAB without an explosion. I tried to search for this but I haven't found any information about anybody that tried it.
Yes, this would work but why not buy a box of syringes for $10 and just use a new syringe on every bag of grain spawn. I do this and have colonization free of contamination about 95% of the time. It takes you having to use fire 🔥 out, so there is no chance of blowing yourself up. I've blown myself up twice and it's no fun. I also stopped getting high before working with fire and it helped a lot as well 😅.
You didn't let the STILL AIR BOX get it's still air tho... You need to wait at elast like 1 hour before starting that timer inorder for the airparticles to actually fall dow on the flooring of the box... This test was sadly not sufficent in that wa, it was cool tho... But not at all accurate.
It’s not the instrument you need. You’ll need to look for an aerosol photometer and an aerosol generator to properly test the integrity of the HEPA filters.
What kind of sub do you use? CVG? I like your method in your older vids where you would let the spawn colonize the substrate in a bag and then just put the block in a fruiting chamber. To me that looks like a easier, better way over mixing it up and spreading it out in a tub to colonize. You still growing that way???
Spraying disinfectant in a still air box is not optional. It's not just sterilizing surfaces, the aerosol in the air collides with particles and kills any biologicals on them.
Question. If i have a tall medical grade HEPA filter ($550) cant i just get some plastic sides cut to form an enclosure and turn that into a "flow hood"... Or heck jsut leave them off whats the difference between a flow hood like you have there and a medical grade HEPA air filter ?
Laminar flow. It’s a layered air flow with no turbulence. That’s the difference. If you use a filter use it on low setting. You can check by lighting a lighter in front of the air flow. If the flame bends more than 45 degrees it’s too high
@@BigL.10 If the gloves rip or don't fit a user, the entire box either needs to be repaired or replaced. If you place a collar in the holes, you can hose clamp gloves to it so that they're easily swapped out.
That isn't a still air box. That's a glove box. Big difference.
Wait, you didn't let the still air box settle like you're supposed to you just stuck it in with the turbulent air still going. FAIL
Nice observation, Teodor!
yay and I also use spray disinfectation, so there are particles but they are already dead.
Your comment is a fail, Teodor.
What I was going to say!
By no means was it a fair test.
Not spraying the box on the inside and elevating the work station off the surface and leaving the base wet and letting the box sit with everything in it for a while is the unfair equivalent to using a flow hood with a ripped filter or an inadequate fan.
You have a fundamental misunderstanding of what a SAB is. The idea isn't to create an air tight seal with gloves, that's just a glove box with turbulent (not still) air currents caused by said gloves. Hence this test is null and void unfortunately. Good comparison of a glovebox and FFU though.
It's really not even a good comparison. You have to wait a little while for all the dust to settle down in the SAB. He started taking measurements almost immediately. I'd love to see this same test again, but wait for 15 or 30 minutes for all the particulates to settle in the SAB.
Actual procedure for a SAB is to let it sit for 20 minutes after spray with 70% IPA. You litterally loaded the chamber with the room air by opening the sealed chamber then took a reading? A poor way to come to any scientific conclusion.
I have 2 issues with this video. That is most definitely not an SAB, and that is most likely not a flow hood (I cant tell because I cannot see it in its entirety).
What you are showcasing is what is called a "glove box" as the cavity is sealed, and the gloves are attached. An SAB simply has holes with which you reach your hands through (gloved or not) into the workspace.
And, a "flow hood" has an actual hood (walls and topping), or in the case of a vertical hood the FFU sits atop and has three walls creating an enclosure to work within. Either way, there is literally an enclosed workspace (except for the direction that faces you). Now, if I am incorrect, and theres an actual hood attached that I simply cannot see in this video, then my apologies for this particular point.
All that being said, theres nothing wrong with either of these tools youve demonstrated in this video. Both will work perfectly fine for mycology with proper sterile technique. My only issue is the incorrect terminology you are teaching to beginners in this hobby.
So if you make one easy mod to the SAB your results will be better. Cover the inside of the lid with a cloth that has been wet with a bleach and water solution prior to positioning the box on top. But you still need to give it some time so the particles settle. I have had zero contamination using this little hack. Full disclosure this was not my idea. Sorry to say I forget the name of the creator who put this out but I would like to thank him!
Does bleach need to be added wouldnt water work just as fine?
Nice tip--thanks. I'm going to try this. Thought I'd add that 1 teaspoon of bleach to 32 oz of water is a good recipe for decontamination. This is what at least one cat rescue I know recommended to decontaminate and kill pathogens on things like cat carriers, boxes, etc. that other cats may have used.
I work in pharma manufacturing - best practise is 70% alcohol 15 min settle contact time then bleach some with 500 ppm strength (Milton) with same contact settle time. A small HEPA grade laminar flow far on top of the SAB would work I have seen many people do that.
save your lungs, use soap water or isopropyl. Bleach is totally unnecessary and can harm you
@crazyethanyeahyeah do you have any photo's of the sab you are talking about?
Under 100 dollars is an understatement and 995 dolas for the hepa seems low, does that include the fan box and everything, idk maybe is cheaper in the US.
That's not a still air box. It's a glove box, and apparently much worse for mycology than a glove-less SAB, which allows some air to flow in and out. Gloved sealed boxes create turbulence as you move around and the unsterilized air is moving much more than in a non-sealed still air box.
why did you stopped making videos?! you were making high quality information content with high quality sound and video.
bro, the point of the still air box is to wait a while after opening it to let the particles fall
you'll have air currents in there with how quick you did it
You can get a 24 / 24 flo for about 500 and it can last up to 10 years before a filter change.
vielen dank :)
I use a bionare air unit with a 99.99 percent hepa on a positive pressure lab and it works fantastic I’ve yet to have a single contam on any of my stuff
Great to hear the unit is working for you! Perhaps we'll make an update video when we get our hands on a similar unit and see what we find!
What a shame. We never got to see the real results of the SAB.
Can’t read the results on the HEPA filter screenshot! How much was it compared to the still box?
That’s a glove box, not a SAB. I would be interested in oven tek, and outside open air inoculation to be included
Appreciate the input, Mike!
@Fresh Cultivators What if you took and and used a continuous fine mist sprayer with Clorox and mist down the walls so they were damp inside the SAB so particles wouldn't bounce off the walls and be trapped? This is what I'm planning to try so then I can flame sterilized inside the SAB without an explosion. I tried to search for this but I haven't found any information about anybody that tried it.
Yes, this would work but why not buy a box of syringes for $10 and just use a new syringe on every bag of grain spawn. I do this and have colonization free of contamination about 95% of the time. It takes you having to use fire 🔥 out, so there is no chance of blowing yourself up. I've blown myself up twice and it's no fun. I also stopped getting high before working with fire and it helped a lot as well 😅.
@@boxingfanazM.O.Bdamn so the explosion is a possibility. Did my first inoculation in a SAB yesterday and was scared that could happen
how come he didnt test the cheap filters to prove they dont work?
Wrong instrument and procedure for testing HEPA filter integrity.
You didn't let the STILL AIR BOX get it's still air tho... You need to wait at elast like 1 hour before starting that timer inorder for the airparticles to actually fall dow on the flooring of the box... This test was sadly not sufficent in that wa, it was cool tho... But not at all accurate.
Could we get some new vids if you have the time ?! They’re very helpful
It just super obnoxious having to work within the confines of a SAB.
so if you just left that machine with the filter on it in the sab would it just filter all of the air in there?
Great test! Thanks for sharing. Could you please tell me the name of that instrument? The one used to measure contaminants.
It’s not the instrument you need.
You’ll need to look for an aerosol photometer and an aerosol generator to properly test the integrity of the HEPA filters.
What kind of sub do you use? CVG? I like your method in your older vids where you would let the spawn colonize the substrate in a bag and then just put the block in a fruiting chamber. To me that looks like a easier, better way over mixing it up and spreading it out in a tub to colonize. You still growing that way???
Spraying disinfectant in a still air box is not optional. It's not just sterilizing surfaces, the aerosol in the air collides with particles and kills any biologicals on them.
Question. If i have a tall medical grade HEPA filter ($550) cant i just get some plastic sides cut to form an enclosure and turn that into a "flow hood"... Or heck jsut leave them off whats the difference between a flow hood like you have there and a medical grade HEPA air filter ?
Laminar flow. It’s a layered air flow with no turbulence. That’s the difference. If you use a filter use it on low setting. You can check by lighting a lighter in front of the air flow. If the flame bends more than 45 degrees it’s too high
Can someone recommend a HEPA filter for a home built Flowhood?
good content
Shoule have used ulpa no?
No necessary
Attached gloves on a SAB is such a beginner mistake. I hate to see people who don't know what they are doing pretend like they do smh
Well what would you consider the right way to do it ?
What’s the difference?
@@BigL.10 If the gloves rip or don't fit a user, the entire box either needs to be repaired or replaced. If you place a collar in the holes, you can hose clamp gloves to it so that they're easily swapped out.
this test its not well done, you should at least wait 15 minutes after close the SAB to do the test ...
🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
While you have a scientific approach, there are many flaws in this testing.
Why overcomplicate things when you can refine them ?