I just did this upgrade and this is my first impression. The speaker sounds amazing. I can feel the mid bass more and the vocals sounds fuller. Which I feel makes the imagine have a lot more presence. Next is just doing some measurements for technical curiosity purposes. I’ve always been a klipsch fan starting with the rf7 gen1. After experiencing what this crossover can do, I think klipsch can do better. Especially at the price of these rf7 iii.
@@johnadams3116 I am, kit arrived today but it will be a few weeks before i can do the work. I solder very often with another hobby so no big deal there. I can take pics along the way. This is my 2nd set of RF7 IIIs, first set was replaced under warranty. SPL from a horn took a crap. Knowing what I do now, likely a cross over component. Shame of it is, the first pair sounded amazing, 2nd set sound like completely different speakers and sound like garbage and that god awful klipsch ear fatigue came with this 2nd pair.
@@johnadams3116 meant to also say I’ve just upgraded my amp from a Parasound A23 to a Parasound JC5, the upgrade really highlights the speakers weakness.
I actually really love the sound of these speakers the way they are. God forbid I go against the grain but I have a dedicated room for these in a 2ch system and they are quite spectacular. They need to be out into the room, well away from walls to sound their best. When given a good amplifier with ample headroom to allow them to get up and dance they are capable of holographic imaging with serious SPL.. and still sound very good. I guess I'm not a real picky hifi enthusiast. I'm easily pleased. These speakers, in my room, are good enough to me that I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything. Happy listening, whatever your taste. 👌
Nothing shown here would be improved by just placing the speakers away from the wall or giving them a « good amplifier ». Those measurements are horrible, pure and simple. You can like a speaker with a bit of an elevated high, or a small boost in the lows, or just a particular frequency response but this is not what is presented here. That’s a bit odd to say « oh yea I like those major deficiencies ».
Nice that they work for your needs and preferences. I tend to find Klipsch tweeters to be ice picks to my ears, so I generally avoid being around them for very long when they're playing at any real volume. Maybe I've just not heard their stock configuration playing on a suitable amp for them.
At the end if you are happy with the sound , that is all that maters, good for you. The rest of us keep chasing our tails trying to find what you already have...enjoy.
@@Carl-bd1rf I'll believe that. A colored amp, particularly one that slightly or even heavily rolls of the treble, could do wonders to improve the general listenability of Klipsch speakers. If you are a treble-head then it probably wouldn't be your thing, but if you're treble sensitive like I am, well then you're running a warm amp with a tube preamp before Klipsch speakers with their stereotypical tuning become listenable. But honestly, for a lot of people, that is part of the fun of the hobby: tinkering with your setup. With enough tinkering, I believe that there are very few speakers beyond redemption. Klipsch aren't even bad speakers, they just have a very specific tuning to their treble, so fixing that with your setup is entirely feasible. So once you resolve that minor problem with amp selection then you can certainly have a great listening experience. I also learned something recently which I find somewhat interesting: the more sensitive your speakers are, the more the coloration of your amp plays a role in how the speakers end up sounding. I learned this by demoing my KEF iQ90 with their claimed 91dB of sensitivity on the same amps I've heard powering the much less sensitive KEF R3. Their stock tuning is a bit different, but even so, the R3 didn't really change very much in sound signature while the iQ90 on a more V-shaped amp are essentially unlistenable. Put them on a much more neutral amp and they're amazing. The R3 still sound about the same. So, the more you know. And given that Klipsch are often even more sensitive than 91dB, you can bet that they're going to be revealing toward the tuning of your amp and source stack to an extreme degree.
Nice Pulling the loudspeakers way out into the room, well off the front wall... combined with a quality, robust, capable amplifier, is a platform for optimizing most any speaker's sound.
I did my RP600ms. There's a huge positive improvement in the top end. Far less smearing and attenuation of those mid to upper frequencies. Fun project. Very happy with the results.
@@Carl-bd1rf His tube connectors and truck load of no res he’s been trying to get rid of since his mullet was in style should fix all those print marks and tighten up the bass a little.
@@Carl-bd1rf . I built my speaker cabinets out of sand cast resistors just to piss this guy off . Try some tube connectors on your kitchen taps , musical spring fresh water , really brought them to life 👍
I've been installing this kit. It's the second GR Kit that I've done. The amount of parts in the high circuit was crazy. I think it was 4 inductors, 4 resistors, and 3 capacitors. The inductor for the lower woofer is bigger than the whole factory crossover. And the no-rez really deadens the cabinet. I've almost got one back together, and I'm going to listen to the modded one and stock one together for awhile to AB them. I think the hardest part is trying to find all the room in the cabinet for the parts needed to fix the speakers. I'm not sure people understand that these inductors are wound OFC Copper, thus the reason for the cost people complain about, and the reason the manufacturers cut corners here. That's just how it is. I also read a recent article that about 1/3 of dudes alive today don't own a drill, so I'm sure even fewer own a soldering iron. Probably hardly anyone owns both, thus, they won't be doing this type of install.
It is good to know that there are those who can and share the information, it turns out that companies do not always do a good job for the product and it is good to have professionals like you to give us the opportunity to see that it is worthwhile and can be corrected and improved
I met Paul Klipsch when he spoke at our IEEE meeting when I was in college. He was entertaining and enthusiastic about what he was doing in audio. I can’t imagine he would be happy with the direction his company has been taken. The speakers Danny modified here are not inexpensive speakers. While I understand Klipsch not putting $900 in high quality crossover components in a $4,000/pair speaker, the crossover Danny designed could be implemented for considerably less and still achieve close to what Danny did. This is a really sad example of corporate incompetence more than greed.
@@abboberg I really don’t know how Danny prices his kits but I recently purchased a CSS kit and went with their $400 crossover upgrade. I checked the price of the components and it was about $400. Of course they then made a profit by not having to supply the base crossover. Just a note, I’m not a flat earth’er. I choose the upgrade to get the improved tolerance and therefore insure the speakers crossed over at the designed frequency. If I would have had access to the crossover design, and access to a good capacitor value tester, and access to a lot of $7 capacitors instead of the $60 Jensen Zs to test, then I would have gone with a cheaper solution. Lots of if’s there so I paid my $400 and the speakers sound fantastic. Aided no doubt by the Danny designed No-Res that I packed the speakers with.
@@mabehall7667 The upgrade of my B&W CDM-1NTs was fantastic as well - I have two pair of them, so I was able to A-B compare, and the difference was remarkable. However, I spent over 60 hours building 4 large circuit boards from scratch, and had to layer them (just to squeeze them in there), using shouldered standoffs I made on my metal lathe - not your average DIY project. The whole project took me over 60 hours. I gave my non-upgraded pair to my son - if I ever needed to replace those speakers, I would just buy a pair of pro audio monitors where no games are played by cutting corners with crossovers. I just simply don't have any more time to throw at fixing other people's work. For some, tho, I can understand that it's a labor of love, and much less of a time commitment than building speakers from scratch (with an unknown outcome).
Disagree; I think Klipsch's newer offerings sound better than anything Paul Klipsch ever designed. The horns he used sounded like PA speakers---very nasal. I bought a pair of his floorstanders used at a thrift shop; they sounded so bad I gave them to a buddy
I'm glad you can put into words what I hear whenever I buy (and promptly return) Klipsch speakers, most recently the RP600m based on another youtubers positive review. Maybe I'll try these new 600m's...but I'm pretty pleased with my Polk R200's. I'd have to be really really convinced of something special to try a Klipsch again after all these years.
Just stop buying Klipsch... If you are bouncing between Klipsch and Polk you obviously need to spend more time finding out what you really like. You would be flat out finding two more diametrically opposed speakers. Ear bleeding shrill to fat and bloated midrange. Have a listen to more brands to see what is out there. Took me ages to find my sound. Ignore reviews, let your ears decide what you like, then narrow your search from there.
The 600M-IIs are an improvement, but are still bright up top. Imo, they only sound "good" when listening 20+30° off-axis. Makes for a decent soundstage, but imagining suffere in the process. On axis they get fatiguing after a short while.
@@hoth2112 there is no such thing as a good sounding Klipsch speaker, only a less worse one. Any time you get listening fatigue, that is you brain telling you it is in pain. Listening to it off axis is just masking a fundamental flaw in the speaker on the whole. There are so many good speakers on the market, there is no need to torture your ears listening to harsh Klipsch.
You’re hurting yourself buying these budget speakers full price. Get them used and get them dirt cheap. They’re built to a price and spending more than $150 feels like being ripped off.
Thanks Danny, I just placed an order for this kit. I have been hoping someone would send you this speaker to upgrade. I can speak for the fact that the vertical off axis has a huge audible hole. Every time I stand up, it sounds like something is covering the speakers. Also, I couldn't figure out why the tweeter fell off so much when I ran my sweeps now I know. I will inform you if I find a $1000 worth of improvement.
I hope they work for you, let us know. I think your going to get a LOT of Better imaging and Dynamic range! I think its going to be night and Day Different
@@KirkLazurus Well they do as described. The speakers now sound well either sitting or standing in the room and the speakers now crossover and aim correctly.
I listened to these in a store once, it was my first time hearing modern Klipsch, and boy howdy was I not impressed with these. Your measurements and explanation perfectly matches what I heard, as I was standing....
Klipsch Reference series is more attuned for surround sound and watching movies vs listening to music . Klipsch high end speakers are more catered to music but they are ridiculously expensive . Most people buy the Reference and RP speakers as surround sound setups vs a 2 channel stereo set up .
We've got several more to do ASAP, weve been swamped the last 3 months and are finally getting caught up and can start upgrades again. We got lots to come soon.
I just love Danny's "disappointed and pissed off look" at the beginning 😍😍😍 his face totally gives away how badly Klipsch have designed and implemented the crossover 😂😂😂
I love the thumbnail/teaser photo of this video! I'm glad there's someone else beside me that cannot stand how any Klipsch speaker I have heard over many, many years sounds.
LMAO. The gold standard in what? Ear bleeding crap. You couldn't pay me enough to own a set of Klipsch speakers. Heard some of their top of the range gear probably 30+ years ago and my opinion of them has not changed in the slightest over the years.
@Analog Looney KEF are a pretty decent all rounder, they aren't the greatest, but unlike Klipsch they don't make me want to do a van Gogh and lob an ear off.
@@Carl-bd1rf there is no getting away from the sound the metallic cones make. They are harsh. I am a treated paper cone person. Metallic cones will never sound nice to me regardless of what is driving them, unless we are talking subs, then that is a different kettle of fish. The Heritage don't appear to be using metallic drivers (still not fussed on horns).
@@Carl-bd1rf metal in the tweeter is not as critical. Some of the top end tweeters use beryllium, which is ultra light, expensive and poisonous, my own ribbon tweeters use an super thin aluminum foil as the cone material. Where metal cones sound harsh and unnatural is in the mid and mid woofer area. Through the vocal range they are just plain harsh. The difference is night and day in the sound. Tap on the side of a cardboard box, and tap on the side of a large tin, they don't sound remotely similar. Someone could tap on the side of a cardboard box all day and it not be annoying, the tin would get annoying real quick because of the sharper high pitched noise it creates. This material sound transfers into the waves coming off the cone. Metal can play cleaner than a paper cone because it is stiffer (cone distortion wise), but can equally be more fatiguing to listen to.
@@Carl-bd1rf I have heard some people say that they prefer soft dome over metallic tweeters, but you would have to have extremely high frequency sensitivity for it to be a concern. What is normally the cause of the listening fatigue (in the case of the tweeters) is a huge difference in the SPL curve between the highs and the lows. Just like Danny has demonstrated several times before with Klipsch speakers, they have some of the worst frequency response of speakers he has tested. If you have an overly bright top end and a big suck out in the vocal region, you can find yourself trying to turn it up trying to hear the voices, but are blasting your ears with highs, leading to listening fatigue (even if you can't hear them, your brain can sense it). Add on top of which Klipsch tend to favour horns on their tweeters, leading to an even louder distorted sound courtesy of the horn. Where the tweeter is crossed over will probably have more to do with listening fatigue than the tweeter cone material.
Question With the upgraded crossover now the acoustic center has been raised. This definitely helps when sitting in a normal chair but what about in a reclined theater chair. In that position now the acoustic center would be seem to be off axis to your ears. Question: When the original measurements were made I do not see the plinth riser. The plinth riser is to angle the original acoustic center more towards your ears. Maybe the design is geared exclusively to home theater. Thank You for all the time you spend helping enthusiasts.
This speaker would have been an EXCELLENT example of the difference a good network makes. I can imagine if you have a speaker like this again, setting it up in your room there and recording a song before and after the upgrade. Then A/B compare them by switching live in the video. You could even make it blind by not telling us which is which.
It would be easier if we had both speakers in house, plus we would have to build out one of the crossovers as when we're designing them we're using cheap caps and alligator clips. But even then we'd be stuck playing them in Mono. It's not an ideal means of comparison. The videos Danny did on the RP 600M a couple years ago had an AB with stock vs upgraded.
With that massive treble swell off of the 1kHz dip it's no wonder I find Klipsch speakers to be like ice picks to my ears. If you can make the larger Klipsch towers sound more neutral and tame in the trebles then you truly are a miracle worker. Their titanium or other metal alloy tweeters in their horn-loaded wave guide started me out loathing metal dome tweeters. It wasn't until I encountered my KEF iQ90 that I realized that metal dome tweeters could actually be pleasant to listen to. Maybe I'll see about getting those beauties upgraded at some point in the future when I can spare a couple hundred dollars to ship them 1000 miles away to have you guys look at them. They still sound plenty good as it is, so it's certainly not a rush for me to do anything.
This is exactly the kind of upgrade I want to do to my KLF-30s. I've had them for 25ish years and have wanted to upgrade them for a long time. One 12" bass, One 12" mid-base, and tying in and balancing out the horns with the crossover and internal wire upgrade in a DIY kit. I'm not opposed to swapping mid-horn out for another speaker and replacing the tweeter for a titanium upgrade. If you had the kit I'd buy it, I know they're old, but still capable speakers. I'm using way more power than needed for these speakers. Mark Levinson No 26 amp, with a tweeked Nakamichi Ca-7 preamp.
Wow, you talking about time alignment just turned the light bulb on, I always find myself lowering my ears to where it sounds better, it's something I have suspected, you confirmed it. My Monitor Audio speakers included.
Price point manufacturing, that’s the problem. You can’t afford to put the best parts in the crossover when you build it at a price point. It actually has a plus effect for the DIY group that addresses this. I am glad we have Danny to point out what the problems are and how he corrects them. Since there isn’t much chance of manufacturers changing their price point fixation, Danny will continue to do what he does and fix poor design and cabinet resonance issues. Glad he’s here to do so!
@@ToneCabinet Absolutely, at this price point I would expect high quality parts in the crossover. BUT! if not seen, why bother, the consumer doesn't know the diff!
@@cruise2023, I know it sounds crazy, but the way the money is divided is rather awkward. The actual cost is 3 to four times less than retail. If the manufacturer doesn’t make a profit, the company loses, it’s employees get sent home and lots of people who depend on them lose also. The bulk of the cost is materials, labor and logistics in the actual working units. The components wouldn’t cost the company as much bought in bulk. Lots of other companies are struggling with supply chain issues from the people who supply them. It’s much like a concentric ball with many layers. It isn’t simple or easy.
@@markphilpot8734 Yes we all know about the costs of manufacturing, labor etc but to see $1 parts in the crossover of a $4,000 speaker is unacceptable, I'm sure with the little amount of parts seen in the crossover that the parts could of been better quality, bought in bulk as they would do anyway, no excuse.
@@cruise2023, you have got it right Alain. Getting the manufacturers to clue up will be a neat trick. It isn’t like they can’t, it’s more like they won’t as the profit margin rules. It isn’t the right way. That’s why we have Danny. I wouldn’t want to deprive Danny his living. Greed is what drives the industry unfortunately. I don’t like it any more than you.
That is quite an improvement.... Good job! I would still never buy a pair of Klipsch anything, I don't like horn tweeters, period. But if a pair of these were given to me I'd strongly consider the upgrade now seeing what they could become. Cheers 🍻
All Klipsch have done is put the same drivers in a bigger cabinet having not doing any measurements at all they are not alone in doing this!It is amazing what Richie manages to do expensive but worth it if anybody has a pair
"Worth it" as in what money you've saved in not buying a better speaker versus how much time it takes to build and install custom circuit boards from scratch. I spent over 60 hours upgrading my B&W CDM-1NT speakers, and it made a very significant improvement in sound quality, but I could have saved that time by buying higher end speakers or studio monitors.
No. The airspace taken up by the damping layer is offset by the 1" layer of foam that covers it. Plus you can also reinstall the original foam sheets over the norez, or use fiberglass/rockwool insulation or polyfill to further control standing waves and internal reflections.
As Danny described it, yes technically it uses up some airspace, but the material used in the NoRez slows down and dampens the back waves inside the box so much that if anything it ‘acts’ like a larger enclosure in the end.
@@rehn1kri Technically speaking, it lowers the Q and somewhat f of panel resonances present, by increasing mass and dissipation due to friction. To do anything for Cab, fb and air column resonances, you go for fibreglass or similar fill and dissipate energy, especially at antinodes, where the velocity is at its maximum and sound pressure the opposite.
I’m Not going to lie I’m interested in trying this. When I heard how much it costed I almost pooped my pants. This is so simple if you don’t like the klipsch sound don’t get klipsch. It’s going to be so much cheaper to buy a speaker with a far cheaper crossover than this improved one and most other speakers and to not buy a speaker and then want to rebuild its crossover, if you’re looking for that flat response and one that measures well klipsch might not be the first choice. I would very much like to have a better crossover while retaining that klipsch sound and if it takes anything away from it which I really hope it wouldn’t with the price. I don’t think I will ever try this product simply because of the cost, also it scares me it would change the sound of the speaker into something that isn’t klipsch, but mostly the cost is ridiculous, you could Buy a whole new set of speakers for basically 2000$. With all due respect that seems insane to me. You talked so much about how well these speakers measure with the “fixed” crossover but I don’t remember you saying they sounded any better, maybe you did and I don’t remember. I feel like your emphasis is so much on they measure so much better but not on if they actually would be more enjoyable and pleasing to the ear for the people who are buying this speaker which are klipsch lovers. For short. would like to hear a trusted die hard klipsch fans reaction to this Improved crossover how it changes the sound of the speaker for the better and does it change that voicing of klipsch speakers that live voicing and if it’s simply worth it to throw another 2g at a speaker that already costs over 4. I feel like Danny is robbing us here with all due respect. Still intrigued but man that price is intense.
I am robbing you with this one huh? If Klipsch designed drivers that didn't need a lot of parts for correcting the response issues then it wouldn't cost so much. The parts are what they are and cost what they cost. You get the whole upgrade kit professionally designed with MUCH higher quality parts for exactly what the parts cost and zero fee (no cost) for all of the design work, and I am robbing you? Also, absolutely it changes the sound of the speaker. It allows you to hear the music cleanly and clearly as recorded rather than the mess it becomes when played though these speakers. Customer feedback on this one has been overwhelmingly good as well.
@@dannyrichie9743 good to hear. What you said sounded dangerously close to you’re not making any profit off this. Is that what you’re saying, that what it costs you is what your charge is therefor you would not be making any money off it.
@@dannyrichie9743 to me I hear the music very cleanly and clearly so you’re not really selling me there. I’d love to try it but I don’t think it’s worth it to me. do what you do man and I think I might of thought the price was more than it actually is, how much is it again? It’s cool you do what you do gives people more possibilities just some things like the way you say things annoy me I guess. Like you say it fixes it, to who’s standards. Your standards or John does standards might be completely different than someone else’s and what there ears like. Idk it’s just like you’re trying to focus on selling your product too much and not really being transparent with us and kinda one sided ig it seems to me. Maybe to people who aren’t as experienced in your field would watch you video and it would paint a much different picture to them then it should if you would stand on the fence than on one side or the other. Idk it’s hard to convey it into word but I tried my best. I don’t think you’re a bad guy you’re trying to run a business but you have to understand not everyone is a die hard experienced audiophile like you and that has your ears. To some people getting this crossover may degrade from the experience of the speaker as a whole in the form of them not liking the difference of sound rather or not you think it fixes it or not fixing the frequency response on paper, obviously that isn’t everything and how much of the picture it takes up is up for debate. everyone has different preferences and if you took more time to explain that maybe it would fix some things. Maybe it wouldn’t maybe to everyone that heard the rf7iiis with your new crossover they would like it who’s knows. Cheers. Do you do any of your products on a free trial, lol I would love to hear it.. I may be expecting a lil to much here feeling how I do but just my opinion like I said I do you but maybe my story did something..
@@daveycrockett5738 Let me take this one first. We don't make a lot of margin on crossover parts. We buy in bulk as much as we can so that we can make some margin. It is usually 20 to 30%. Considering all of the time I have invested in the design work, I have to sell a dozen of these or so to break even. I do it because it helps people. It gets them into the DIY hobby, and even as a loss leader it is good advertising. The customer feedback is really the best advertising I could buy. Our forum on the Audio Circle is full of it.
Secondly, let me dispel the notion that the improvement in performance is subjective or debatable. No one ever says they prefer the sound of having all of the detail smeared together rather then it being clear. No one ever decides they like the frequency response all jacked up and the tweeter level 4db louder then the woofers over a smooth and balanced sound. No one ever says they prefer when everything arrives out of phase and broken apart in the time domain over the sigal arriving in phase, coherent, and complete. No one ever says they like it when everything sounds flat and on the plane of the speakers or sound coming straight out of the speakers over a three dimensional and layered sound stage with separation and space around everything. Often (and to many of us) when we hear what speakers are capable of versus what we get from them when they are new then we do tend to think that they were broken from the factory. We realize they were built to a price point and not built to perform. For many people being able to fix them is a blessing.
Wouldn't it make sense to use an iron-core inductor for the lower woofer? I've seen an article showing that distortion of the iron-core inductors on frequences less than 500 Hz is still pretty low (as I recall, less than 0.1%).
We did try that option as well, but it didn't sound right with the iron core inductor compared to the air core when designing the new network. The RF7-II & 8000F upgrade kits both used iron cores for the lower woofer.
@@hoth2112Sorry, you mean it didn't sound right to include an iron core inductor for marketing reasons, or it didn't sound right, because somehow its core hysteresis/signal distortion is audible, while that of output transformers of valve amplifiers you favour is not ? Increased losses and lower damping make for a more pronounced bass, if less accurate. In any case, driver distortion will trump that of iron core coil by quite a margin at LF. To put things into perspective, what's the DCR of that air core, more than R7 ?
@@paulb4661 Tonally speaking, it didn't sound right. I dont have a better description The iron core we were using was also a much higher value than the air core. If we wanted to swap to an iron core of the same value, we would need to have had them custom made for us as it's not a value we normally carry in iron cores.
So is it essential that people use a measuring meter when they listen to music on the Klipsch loudspeakers or they won't pick up the dips in frequencies?
Would you consider reviewing something in the Polk Audio Reserve series? Perhaps the R500, or R600, or R700, which all the youtube reviewers seem to be raving about. It would be interesting to see how their measured performance compares with their perceived pleasant sound. Thanks for your consideration.
@@dannyrichie9743 someone would need to send him the speakers. Those R700 look like beasts! Im considering getting them and if I do I would definitely get Danny’s help with the crossover’s. I have the R200 in my garage and I like them👍🏻🔈
@@JR-ho5qm Why would you bother buying them expecting them to need a crossover change? Just buy what you enjoy. And the idea that they could be better with a crossover change doesn't fly as you have no idea what they sound like currently and for the money spent plus the new crossover you could have just purchased something you liked in the first place. Also, what if it's one of the speakers he doesn't think needs much done? Then you just wasted your money all around. Hell, just order one of his kits if you think he knows what's going to sound best for you.
@@davep2945 almost any speaker you buy under 10000$ can benefit from having higher quality crossover parts. Even if it’s just higher quality parts of equal value without a network change. It’s no different than souping up a car, kinda fun to have something a bit better than it was intended to be.
@@JR-ho5qm Hey, if you've got the scratch and that's your thing, go for it. But I am curious as to why more viewers don't just order his kits if they believe in his methods. I've found well designed kits to be a far better value both dollar wise and performance wise.
I knew mine were off. To compensate I rotated the plinths around 180 degrees and cranked the spikes in the rear as high as they will go and removed the front ones so they are pointing straight at me plus they are toed in about 20 degrees each. Looks funny but works for me. My 300Bs make em sing. Had RF5s prior and Response 2s prior to those.
For a 6000 dollar pair of speakers, you'd expect better parts. I would spend 6000 on these only to have to do an upgrade to them. I wonder what the upgraded 8000f doubt like in comparison to these upgraded? Are they close enough to not need to consider the rf7iii?
I went for the jbl 3800 instead of these. I rly wanted to like the rf7, they have a great 10" slam, but the sound overall is not worth it at ALL. The jbl's and the rf7 cost the same here (6700$) the rf7 mids is the worst part of the speaker.. most ppl who praises the rf7 or is typical americans , they get them very cheap on amazon for example, and most of them have never had some real speakers before, then ofc the rf7 gonna sound amazing.
@@hoth2112 basically forte drivers in a tower, very awesome, considering Bob Crites titanium tweeter diaphragm and cap update, any thoughts would be welcome
I have two pair of the 8060 fa first generation and those things pound concrete they sound absolutely phenomenal when it comes to listening to what I like to listen to which is 70s progressive rock from Alan Parsons all the way forward to yes.. I would truly enjoy Junior researches impression of the 8060 Fa for comparison please do so thank you
So how does it work with the very low end when the top woofer is crossed over differently compared to both working simultaneously. I feel like the bass impact would suffer tremendously with one woofer doing the low end instead of two and for me that's a deal breaker for a strictly two chanel system with no sub. I feel like it makes more sense to just bi-amp with monoblocks and then control timing and crossover that way. A more pure method without extra parts for the signal to flow through.
I've never done anything like this before. I would really need a full walk through video before I considered spending that kind of money and potentially damaging these speakers. Would you be willing to make one? Or do you have one already with any other speakers that would give me a better idea if this is something I could take on myself?
I don't care for the reference line much, but the Klipsch heritage line is great, the heresy and forte are very good. I'd like to see you do some vintage speaker upgrades and see what you think, original klh model 5? Hpm 100? Just a thought.
@@JukeboxAlley Amazing how thousands of satisfied buyers don't think it needs any help at all. But because one dude sends a pair in and they don't meet Dan's preferred specs suddenly all those folks are wrong. Nope, they just like what they like. No one is the all powerful arbiter of how a speaker should sound or measure. If you enjoy them then F what anyone else thinks. We're not talking about people receiving a counterfeit version of a life saving medicine that doesn't follow the definitive formula needed to make it work. We're talking about personal enjoyment and taste which is entirely subjective.
I want to see you make kits for Arendal speakers or Atlantic technology or other direct to consumer/specialist brands. I can’t stand getting bad quality for a lot of money
Another successful x-over makeover and some lucky guy’s ears saved from mediocre sound quality. I bet that dip at 1000-1500Hz must have been pretty audible, plus a roughly 10dB variance in output across the entire frequency range.
I just finished the upgrade on one speaker, and have been doing A B comparisons. Really, there is no comparison... This is with Outlaw 200w mono blocks and a parasound pre amp. My anecdotal experience is consistent with what his measurements show in my room. For me, when the GR version is in the same room as the stock one, the performance is obvious. The GR modded one has so much more presence, bass, and the sound is so forward. It's still the Klipsch sound, but the drivers actually start and stop like they're supposed to. It's like the upper driver actually works now. It's a faster speaker, more articulate, and without all the distortion and fizzy sound. Everything Danny said about cabinet resonance is true. Once you hear a damped cabinet, you're spoiled forever. So much more sound energy is being directed AT you as opposed to being lost in the cabinet resonance. It makes me want to put no rez even in my garage speakers. Now, the speakers actually sound like all the review boys say they did. You could spend more money than Danny's kit on your audio system elsewhere and get less improvement. If you have these speakers, you really owe it to yourself to upgrade them.
hi joblo, does the A/B comparison took after you burn in upgrade crossover? what is the result after 200hr burn in so far. I would like to know because I'm planning to do it so. thx for sharing.
I was seriously considering buying this model until now. I have zero skills or experience working on speakers so a video on how to do this would be very helpful to see if it is even something that I would feel comfortable trying. It seems that every speaker I am considering I then see it on here and move on.
Remember that this guy is selling a product, not exactly unbiased..Odds are youd buy these speakers and be blown away, they are popular for a reason.. its been 3 months, what you get?
I have the RF-7 I's and they desperately need to be a 2.5 way. I am shocked the III's still have crappy radioshack plastic binding posts. 2K a piece tower speaker and plastic binding post nuts should not be in the same sentence.
Their biggest center channels are also still 2-way speakers. The RC 64-III we have up next is an absolute mess, especially off axis. It desperately needs to be a 2.5 way speaker as well..
There are some RUclips channels dedicated to A-B comparisons, which in theory should tell you something, but even with my high end monitors, I can't really tell enough difference to make a buying decision. I did upgrade my B&W speakers with Danny's kit, but I doubt a mic'd comparison could reveal the richness of the sound in the upgraded speakers.
Most cases, we only get one speaker and all of the crossover designs are done externally using clips, which aren't ideal for sound quality. Danny has done A-B clips with the smaller RP600M, as that was a pair we built out and compared the stock to upgraded.
He has said multiple times that he doesn't listen to the speakers at all. Just runs tests and adjusts to his preferred graph. Sometimes I would say the measurements are better and sometimes they aren't worth the effort but no matter the sound will only be changed. To you it may be better or it may not be. Plenty of people love the speakers Danny denigrates. And plenty of people think he's some sort of guru with this singular knowledge no one else possesses. Well, except for Andrew Jones because that's the only other speaker designer these folks know of. So they'll ignore the fact the Elac's budget to upper tier speakers use budget crossovers because, well, Andrew.
The initial measurement put up is not what one would hear seated, listening to these Klipsch speakers. The tweeter height is way above ear level when sitting in your listening chair on these speakers which is where the measured response got a lot smoother. Danny would know this & you can tell that his computer chair still doesn’t get him to tweeter height which is a lot higher than normal listening chairs. Although the speakers still need a lot of work :) just would like a fair review. Not a big Klipsch fan but do have these as surrounds. Nice result in the end Danny.
The speaker is setting on a lift table behind me. It is about 10" off of the floor. Even if you do get your ear to near the mid woofer level, the overall room response is still all over the place.
@@dannyrichie9743 you are right, results were still not great. Albeit better than your first measurement. These speakers for unknown reasons were never meant to be listened to with tweeter at ear level. If I was using these as stereo speakers & really enjoyed them, I would ant this upgrade myself :) Happy listening.
I ve had my RF7 iii for a few years and like how they sound in Movies and don't think they are harsh. In music though it's a totally different story. I can't listen to more than 2-3 songs at once, I get fatigue and have to turn it down or off. Would this be related to the stock crossover design? Can I expect improvement in that area with this upgrade? Or is this just how Klipsch speakers are naturally? Thanks
how would you compare the stock rp8000f ii to the stock rf7 iii? Noticed you talked about how Klipsch has cleaned up the response on their version 2's of their RP line. Does that better response make it better than the RF7 iii when talking about accuracy/overall sound quality?
@@dannyrichie9743 The RP tweeter are better, so the top high end would be better and less parts But the lower end would need work just like all the RP-
Is this why I feel that my RF7 IIIs have no low end bass? I mean I am feeding them power from a Monolith 7X amp. Thankfully I have a subwoofer for movies but my music seems to be missing bass.
@@yournightmare9999 I have a separate set up for full range 2 Ch and 2.1 crossed over as suggested already. I just assumed 4 10in woofers would move more air. Maybe I have to really crank the volume to move the woofers.
@D1Calderon klipsch need 150-200 hours to make them sound way better. I have rp280f since when they released 2015 at beginning they sounded good but nothing special but today they way better. After few years they released RF7III and when I switched them RF7III sound like crap compared to my rp280f but today they sounds better. But overall I think I need way better amplifier like 450wpc to play them in full potential
I have to wonder if crossovers like these are simply calculated with some type of software without any listening or testing to doublecheck the actual response. Seeing measured response charts makes me wonder how could a $4k speaker be released into the marketplace with glaring issues that are somewhat obvious. 🤷🏻♂️
If Danny is selling his xover at 900, it probably would cost Klipsh 500 in cost of goods sold. That would double their sale price. Best to buy the speakers used and add Danny's xover and have great speakers at less than retail.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thanks for your reply. Do you have a ballpark figure of how much it might cost. I'm on SS. Thanks again. PS a I will be using this with a Fisher 400 and a Marantz 2275.
@@eazystreet5507 Oh man, I just realized which speaker that is. There is no fixing those. Those things have drivers all spread out all over a big baffle. There are comb filtering issues in every direction. That can't be fixed.
I am from Toronto Canada i would like to order the up grade kit for the Klipssch RF7 lll. I am a plumber but i never did any thing like this before. Do you have any suggestions.Thanks Patrick
Watch the older videos I did on the Klipsch RP600M. I shot five videos on that one and showed the upgrade from beginning to end. The process for this one is exactly the same.
I looked at these rf7 for a long time. Listened to them at my local dealer and I was not spec impressed. Yes they have alot of bass but the mids are lacking, and they are known for it. If u have a dealer who has the new jbl hdi line, like the jbl hdi 3800, they are worth checking out, tripple 8's instead of 2x10 lkke the rf7, but they sound so much better overall and they got a great slam to
@@dannyrichie9743 i hope someone else does. I do not live in america, so that shipping would cost more than the speakers itself😅 but in general, are jbl using cheap crossover parts from what you have seen?
I purchased a new pair of RF-7III and felt like all the negative elements Danny addressed were correct but after around 3-400 hrs. the speakers began to open up. The biggest improvement first noticed was the integration of the drivers was much better and the highs opened up. I use the speaker plinths that come with speakers many do not. Bass response is very powerful and has evened out alot. The GR upgrades would clearly be a large improvement but even without upgrades the speakers have good detail, uncompressed dynamic range with a good high power amplifier. I am using a Emotiva XPR-5. The speakers have very good dynamic range and I hear no edgy or compressed highs. As I stated earlier the highs have opened up. ( No not like my Magnapans but adequate and on bad recordings you can enjoy music) In terms of speakers I have magnapan 1.7i, Room 11.7x16.0x10.0. Placement : Spks. 6.1 apart Side wall. 18" BackWall 4'x7" Seat distance 9'.0 Heavy wall treatment side walls 4"x48" thick. Behind spks. 21" back 4"x48" panel.
At last, we are Back in Business again with Speaker upgrades. And so long as there are Klipsch and B&W speakers around, Danny will be busy with the upgrades. Another silk purse from a Sow's ear... Thanks, Danny
@@hoth2112 awesome. I cant wait. I bought better quality parts to revamp my wifes old Warfedale Laser60's and will do the same with 3 pairs of Linn Tukan's I'm using as Dolby Atmos wall mounted speakers. I learned a lot from Danny. And eagerly await more
if they would have used cheap parts and your design it would not cost that much more in the first place!!!! its crap, they knew it and they dont care. nice work ntl
I just did this upgrade and this is my first impression. The speaker sounds amazing. I can feel the mid bass more and the vocals sounds fuller. Which I feel makes the imagine have a lot more presence. Next is just doing some measurements for technical curiosity purposes.
I’ve always been a klipsch fan starting with the rf7 gen1. After experiencing what this crossover can do, I think klipsch can do better. Especially at the price of these rf7 iii.
Any pics on your crossovers, how is the sound now, there is another break-in period from what I've been reading
i’ve purchased Danny’s cross over for the RF7III and would love to see pics of the cross over layout.
@@brentshock3787 are you doing these yourself?, I would have loved to but I haven't the time
@@johnadams3116 I am, kit arrived today but it will be a few weeks before i can do the work. I solder very often with another hobby so no big deal there.
I can take pics along the way. This is my 2nd set of RF7 IIIs, first set was replaced under warranty. SPL from a horn took a crap. Knowing what I do now, likely a cross over component. Shame of it is, the first pair sounded amazing, 2nd set sound like completely different speakers and sound like garbage and that god awful klipsch ear fatigue came with this 2nd pair.
@@johnadams3116 meant to also say I’ve just upgraded my amp from a Parasound A23 to a Parasound JC5, the upgrade really highlights the speakers weakness.
I actually really love the sound of these speakers the way they are. God forbid I go against the grain but I have a dedicated room for these in a 2ch system and they are quite spectacular. They need to be out into the room, well away from walls to sound their best. When given a good amplifier with ample headroom to allow them to get up and dance they are capable of holographic imaging with serious SPL.. and still sound very good.
I guess I'm not a real picky hifi enthusiast. I'm easily pleased.
These speakers, in my room, are good enough to me that I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything.
Happy listening, whatever your taste. 👌
Nothing shown here would be improved by just placing the speakers away from the wall or giving them a « good amplifier ». Those measurements are horrible, pure and simple. You can like a speaker with a bit of an elevated high, or a small boost in the lows, or just a particular frequency response but this is not what is presented here. That’s a bit odd to say « oh yea I like those major deficiencies ».
Nice that they work for your needs and preferences. I tend to find Klipsch tweeters to be ice picks to my ears, so I generally avoid being around them for very long when they're playing at any real volume. Maybe I've just not heard their stock configuration playing on a suitable amp for them.
At the end if you are happy with the sound , that is all that maters, good for you. The rest of us keep chasing our tails trying to find what you already have...enjoy.
@@Carl-bd1rf I'll believe that. A colored amp, particularly one that slightly or even heavily rolls of the treble, could do wonders to improve the general listenability of Klipsch speakers. If you are a treble-head then it probably wouldn't be your thing, but if you're treble sensitive like I am, well then you're running a warm amp with a tube preamp before Klipsch speakers with their stereotypical tuning become listenable. But honestly, for a lot of people, that is part of the fun of the hobby: tinkering with your setup. With enough tinkering, I believe that there are very few speakers beyond redemption. Klipsch aren't even bad speakers, they just have a very specific tuning to their treble, so fixing that with your setup is entirely feasible. So once you resolve that minor problem with amp selection then you can certainly have a great listening experience. I also learned something recently which I find somewhat interesting: the more sensitive your speakers are, the more the coloration of your amp plays a role in how the speakers end up sounding. I learned this by demoing my KEF iQ90 with their claimed 91dB of sensitivity on the same amps I've heard powering the much less sensitive KEF R3. Their stock tuning is a bit different, but even so, the R3 didn't really change very much in sound signature while the iQ90 on a more V-shaped amp are essentially unlistenable. Put them on a much more neutral amp and they're amazing. The R3 still sound about the same. So, the more you know. And given that Klipsch are often even more sensitive than 91dB, you can bet that they're going to be revealing toward the tuning of your amp and source stack to an extreme degree.
Nice
Pulling the loudspeakers way out into the room, well off the front wall... combined with a quality, robust, capable amplifier, is a platform for optimizing most any speaker's sound.
I did my RP600ms. There's a huge positive improvement in the top end. Far less smearing and attenuation of those mid to upper frequencies. Fun project. Very happy with the results.
Those are expensive speakers u already spent a lot and now u spent more. Just buy a GR kit speaker one time
I already owned the speakers. I wasn't happy with the sound and I enjoyed the project. Sure there's cheaper ways to get better value. And?
@ Trey Dempsey . Haha less smearing 🤣🤣 . What measurement can I see this in ? Haha
@@Carl-bd1rf His tube connectors and truck load of no res he’s been trying to get rid of since his mullet was in style should fix all those print marks and tighten up the bass a little.
@@Carl-bd1rf . I built my speaker cabinets out of sand cast resistors just to piss this guy off . Try some tube connectors on your kitchen taps , musical spring fresh water , really brought them to life 👍
I've been installing this kit. It's the second GR Kit that I've done. The amount of parts in the high circuit was crazy. I think it was 4 inductors, 4 resistors, and 3 capacitors. The inductor for the lower woofer is bigger than the whole factory crossover. And the no-rez really deadens the cabinet. I've almost got one back together, and I'm going to listen to the modded one and stock one together for awhile to AB them.
I think the hardest part is trying to find all the room in the cabinet for the parts needed to fix the speakers.
I'm not sure people understand that these inductors are wound OFC Copper, thus the reason for the cost people complain about, and the reason the manufacturers cut corners here. That's just how it is.
I also read a recent article that about 1/3 of dudes alive today don't own a drill, so I'm sure even fewer own a soldering iron. Probably hardly anyone owns both, thus, they won't be doing this type of install.
Remember this guy is also a business man and salesman
It is good to know that there are those who can and share the information, it turns out that companies do not always do a good job for the product and it is good to have professionals like you to give us the opportunity to see that it is worthwhile and can be corrected and improved
I met Paul Klipsch when he spoke at our IEEE meeting when I was in college. He was entertaining and enthusiastic about what he was doing in audio. I can’t imagine he would be happy with the direction his company has been taken.
The speakers Danny modified here are not inexpensive speakers. While I understand Klipsch not putting $900 in high quality crossover components in a $4,000/pair speaker, the crossover Danny designed could be implemented for considerably less and still achieve close to what Danny did. This is a really sad example of corporate incompetence more than greed.
Of course, you are paying for Danny's excellent engineering. I couldn't do it for that price.
@@abboberg I really don’t know how Danny prices his kits but I recently purchased a CSS kit and went with their $400 crossover upgrade. I checked the price of the components and it was about $400. Of course they then made a profit by not having to supply the base crossover. Just a note, I’m not a flat earth’er. I choose the upgrade to get the improved tolerance and therefore insure the speakers crossed over at the designed frequency. If I would have had access to the crossover design, and access to a good capacitor value tester, and access to a lot of $7 capacitors instead of the $60 Jensen Zs to test, then I would have gone with a cheaper solution. Lots of if’s there so I paid my $400 and the speakers sound fantastic. Aided no doubt by the Danny designed No-Res that I packed the speakers with.
@@mabehall7667 The upgrade of my B&W CDM-1NTs was fantastic as well - I have two pair of them, so I was able to A-B compare, and the difference was remarkable. However, I spent over 60 hours building 4 large circuit boards from scratch, and had to layer them (just to squeeze them in there), using shouldered standoffs I made on my metal lathe - not your average DIY project. The whole project took me over 60 hours. I gave my non-upgraded pair to my son - if I ever needed to replace those speakers, I would just buy a pair of pro audio monitors where no games are played by cutting corners with crossovers. I just simply don't have any more time to throw at fixing other people's work. For some, tho, I can understand that it's a labor of love, and much less of a time commitment than building speakers from scratch (with an unknown outcome).
@@abboberg Hey, I’m with you. Spent more time than I expected.
Disagree; I think Klipsch's newer offerings sound better than anything Paul Klipsch ever designed. The horns he used sounded like PA speakers---very nasal. I bought a pair of his floorstanders used at a thrift shop; they sounded so bad I gave them to a buddy
I'm glad you can put into words what I hear whenever I buy (and promptly return) Klipsch speakers, most recently the RP600m based on another youtubers positive review. Maybe I'll try these new 600m's...but I'm pretty pleased with my Polk R200's. I'd have to be really really convinced of something special to try a Klipsch again after all these years.
Just stop buying Klipsch... If you are bouncing between Klipsch and Polk you obviously need to spend more time finding out what you really like. You would be flat out finding two more diametrically opposed speakers. Ear bleeding shrill to fat and bloated midrange. Have a listen to more brands to see what is out there. Took me ages to find my sound. Ignore reviews, let your ears decide what you like, then narrow your search from there.
The 600M-IIs are an improvement, but are still bright up top. Imo, they only sound "good" when listening 20+30° off-axis. Makes for a decent soundstage, but imagining suffere in the process. On axis they get fatiguing after a short while.
@@hoth2112 there is no such thing as a good sounding Klipsch speaker, only a less worse one. Any time you get listening fatigue, that is you brain telling you it is in pain. Listening to it off axis is just masking a fundamental flaw in the speaker on the whole. There are so many good speakers on the market, there is no need to torture your ears listening to harsh Klipsch.
You’re hurting yourself buying these budget speakers full price. Get them used and get them dirt cheap. They’re built to a price and spending more than $150 feels like being ripped off.
Thanks Danny, I just placed an order for this kit. I have been hoping someone would send you this speaker to upgrade. I can speak for the fact that the vertical off axis has a huge audible hole. Every time I stand up, it sounds like something is covering the speakers. Also, I couldn't figure out why the tweeter fell off so much when I ran my sweeps now I know. I will inform you if I find a $1000 worth of improvement.
I hope they work for you, let us know. I think your going to get a LOT of Better imaging and Dynamic range! I think its going to be night and Day Different
What is your feedback for this kit?
@@KirkLazurus Well they do as described. The speakers now sound well either sitting or standing in the room and the speakers now crossover and aim correctly.
@@schantzc thats it? Imagining ad a whole didnt improved?
@@brentshock3787 I didn’t notice any changes. The RF7 iii images great in my system.
very impressed with your results and how you included a 2nd distance in your study.. it definately proves their serious mistakes.
I listened to these in a store once, it was my first time hearing modern Klipsch, and boy howdy was I not impressed with these. Your measurements and explanation perfectly matches what I heard, as I was standing....
Me to
Same here. They kind of hurt my ears. After listening to them in several shops, I avoided the brand completely.
Klipsch Reference series is more attuned for surround sound and watching movies vs listening to music . Klipsch high end speakers are more catered to music but they are ridiculously expensive . Most people buy the Reference and RP speakers as surround sound setups vs a 2 channel stereo set up .
Thats still no excuse to use cheap components
I'm glad you're back at making videos working with speakers
We've got several more to do ASAP, weve been swamped the last 3 months and are finally getting caught up and can start upgrades again. We got lots to come soon.
I just love Danny's "disappointed and pissed off look" at the beginning 😍😍😍 his face totally gives away how badly Klipsch have designed and implemented the crossover 😂😂😂
I love the thumbnail/teaser photo of this video! I'm glad there's someone else beside me that cannot stand how any Klipsch speaker I have heard over many, many years sounds.
You are shattering my illusion of Klipsch speakers being the gold standard. Thank you.
LMAO. The gold standard in what? Ear bleeding crap. You couldn't pay me enough to own a set of Klipsch speakers. Heard some of their top of the range gear probably 30+ years ago and my opinion of them has not changed in the slightest over the years.
@Analog Looney KEF are a pretty decent all rounder, they aren't the greatest, but unlike Klipsch they don't make me want to do a van Gogh and lob an ear off.
@@Carl-bd1rf there is no getting away from the sound the metallic cones make. They are harsh. I am a treated paper cone person. Metallic cones will never sound nice to me regardless of what is driving them, unless we are talking subs, then that is a different kettle of fish. The Heritage don't appear to be using metallic drivers (still not fussed on horns).
@@Carl-bd1rf metal in the tweeter is not as critical. Some of the top end tweeters use beryllium, which is ultra light, expensive and poisonous, my own ribbon tweeters use an super thin aluminum foil as the cone material. Where metal cones sound harsh and unnatural is in the mid and mid woofer area. Through the vocal range they are just plain harsh. The difference is night and day in the sound. Tap on the side of a cardboard box, and tap on the side of a large tin, they don't sound remotely similar. Someone could tap on the side of a cardboard box all day and it not be annoying, the tin would get annoying real quick because of the sharper high pitched noise it creates. This material sound transfers into the waves coming off the cone. Metal can play cleaner than a paper cone because it is stiffer (cone distortion wise), but can equally be more fatiguing to listen to.
@@Carl-bd1rf I have heard some people say that they prefer soft dome over metallic tweeters, but you would have to have extremely high frequency sensitivity for it to be a concern. What is normally the cause of the listening fatigue (in the case of the tweeters) is a huge difference in the SPL curve between the highs and the lows. Just like Danny has demonstrated several times before with Klipsch speakers, they have some of the worst frequency response of speakers he has tested. If you have an overly bright top end and a big suck out in the vocal region, you can find yourself trying to turn it up trying to hear the voices, but are blasting your ears with highs, leading to listening fatigue (even if you can't hear them, your brain can sense it). Add on top of which Klipsch tend to favour horns on their tweeters, leading to an even louder distorted sound courtesy of the horn. Where the tweeter is crossed over will probably have more to do with listening fatigue than the tweeter cone material.
Funny thing is, they sound great as they are.
Question
With the upgraded crossover now the acoustic center has been raised. This definitely helps when sitting in a normal chair but what about in a reclined theater chair. In that position now the acoustic center would be seem to be off axis to your ears.
Question: When the original measurements were made I do not see the plinth riser. The plinth riser is to angle the original acoustic center more towards your ears.
Maybe the design is geared exclusively to home theater.
Thank You for all the time you spend helping enthusiasts.
This speaker would have been an EXCELLENT example of the difference a good network makes. I can imagine if you have a speaker like this again, setting it up in your room there and recording a song before and after the upgrade. Then A/B compare them by switching live in the video. You could even make it blind by not telling us which is which.
It would be easier if we had both speakers in house, plus we would have to build out one of the crossovers as when we're designing them we're using cheap caps and alligator clips. But even then we'd be stuck playing them in Mono. It's not an ideal means of comparison. The videos Danny did on the RP 600M a couple years ago had an AB with stock vs upgraded.
With that massive treble swell off of the 1kHz dip it's no wonder I find Klipsch speakers to be like ice picks to my ears. If you can make the larger Klipsch towers sound more neutral and tame in the trebles then you truly are a miracle worker. Their titanium or other metal alloy tweeters in their horn-loaded wave guide started me out loathing metal dome tweeters. It wasn't until I encountered my KEF iQ90 that I realized that metal dome tweeters could actually be pleasant to listen to. Maybe I'll see about getting those beauties upgraded at some point in the future when I can spare a couple hundred dollars to ship them 1000 miles away to have you guys look at them. They still sound plenty good as it is, so it's certainly not a rush for me to do anything.
This is exactly the kind of upgrade I want to do to my KLF-30s. I've had them for 25ish years and have wanted to upgrade them for a long time. One 12" bass, One 12" mid-base, and tying in and balancing out the horns with the crossover and internal wire upgrade in a DIY kit. I'm not opposed to swapping mid-horn out for another speaker and replacing the tweeter for a titanium upgrade. If you had the kit I'd buy it, I know they're old, but still capable speakers.
I'm using way more power than needed for these speakers. Mark Levinson No 26 amp, with a tweeked Nakamichi Ca-7 preamp.
Someone from Klipsch probably bought one of your upgrade kits and was impressed.
Wow, you talking about time alignment just turned the light bulb on, I always find myself lowering my ears to where it sounds better, it's something I have suspected, you confirmed it. My Monitor Audio speakers included.
Price point manufacturing, that’s the problem. You can’t afford to put the best parts in the crossover when you build it at a price point. It actually has a plus effect for the DIY group that addresses this. I am glad we have Danny to point out what the problems are and how he corrects them. Since there isn’t much chance of manufacturers changing their price point fixation, Danny will continue to do what he does and fix poor design and cabinet resonance issues. Glad he’s here to do so!
I can understand that on the RP-600's, but these beasts are over $4K/pair!! Surely they can afford a quality crossover at that price point. 🤔
@@ToneCabinet Absolutely, at this price point I would expect high quality parts in the crossover. BUT! if not seen, why bother, the consumer doesn't know the diff!
@@cruise2023, I know it sounds crazy, but the way the money is divided is rather awkward. The actual cost is 3 to four times less than retail. If the manufacturer doesn’t make a profit, the company loses, it’s employees get sent home and lots of people who depend on them lose also. The bulk of the cost is materials, labor and logistics in the actual working units. The components wouldn’t cost the company as much bought in bulk. Lots of other companies are struggling with supply chain issues from the people who supply them. It’s much like a concentric ball with many layers. It isn’t simple or easy.
@@markphilpot8734 Yes we all know about the costs of manufacturing, labor etc but to see $1 parts in the crossover of a $4,000 speaker is unacceptable, I'm sure with the little amount of parts seen in the crossover that the parts could of been better quality, bought in bulk as they would do anyway, no excuse.
@@cruise2023, you have got it right Alain. Getting the manufacturers to clue up will be a neat trick. It isn’t like they can’t, it’s more like they won’t as the profit margin rules. It isn’t the right way. That’s why we have Danny. I wouldn’t want to deprive Danny his living. Greed is what drives the industry unfortunately. I don’t like it any more than you.
Thanks for the video. I was looking to get some Klipsch floorstanding speakers. Really don't feel like pay that much for speakers I have "fix".
I’ll bet those speakers will sound damn good with the improved crossovers.
What program are you using to measure? Will Klipsch repair these under warranty? I have both the 600m ii and the RP-8000 ii
That is quite an improvement.... Good job!
I would still never buy a pair of Klipsch anything, I don't like horn tweeters, period. But if a pair of these were given to me I'd strongly consider the upgrade now seeing what they could become. Cheers 🍻
I would never buy a pair of Klipsch anything either! It blows my mind that people actually buy those ear bleeders.
The RP line tweeter are way Softer and a lot better than the RF line
All Klipsch have done is put the same drivers in a bigger cabinet having not doing any measurements at all they are not alone in doing this!It is amazing what Richie manages to do expensive but worth it if anybody has a pair
"Worth it" as in what money you've saved in not buying a better speaker versus how much time it takes to build and install custom circuit boards from scratch. I spent over 60 hours upgrading my B&W CDM-1NT speakers, and it made a very significant improvement in sound quality, but I could have saved that time by buying higher end speakers or studio monitors.
Hey Danny, can you measure at the distance that Klipsch recommends for this speaker? Curious to see if the Tweeter and Woofer sums better.
Do you have upgrade kits for the klipsch RF-5 towers?
Eagerly awaiting a Heresy 4 segment.
Will adding No-Res change the internal volume of the box?
No. The airspace taken up by the damping layer is offset by the 1" layer of foam that covers it. Plus you can also reinstall the original foam sheets over the norez, or use fiberglass/rockwool insulation or polyfill to further control standing waves and internal reflections.
As Danny described it, yes technically it uses up some airspace, but the material used in the NoRez slows down and dampens the back waves inside the box so much that if anything it ‘acts’ like a larger enclosure in the end.
@@rehn1kri Technically speaking, it lowers the Q and somewhat f of panel resonances present, by increasing mass and dissipation due to friction. To do anything for Cab, fb and air column resonances, you go for fibreglass or similar fill and dissipate energy, especially at antinodes, where the velocity is at its maximum and sound pressure the opposite.
A little bit, not enough to mean anything. But you will get a punching bass and drums w less bouncing of the woofer , A huge different.
Have you worked on the RF7 and RF7-II? If yes, what were the differences to the problems in this version? Or are they more or less the same?
Have you ever worked on any of the Klipsch Heritage models?
Only the Forte III so far.
I’m
Not going to lie I’m interested in trying this. When I heard how much it costed I almost pooped my pants. This is so simple if you don’t like the klipsch sound don’t get klipsch. It’s going to be so much cheaper to buy a speaker with a far cheaper crossover than this improved one and most other speakers and to not buy a speaker and then want to rebuild its crossover, if you’re looking for that flat response and one that measures well klipsch might not be the first choice. I would very much like to have a better crossover while retaining that klipsch sound and if it takes anything away from it which I really hope it wouldn’t with the price. I don’t think I will ever try this product simply because of the cost, also it scares me it would change the sound of the speaker into something that isn’t klipsch, but mostly the cost is ridiculous, you could
Buy a whole new set of speakers for basically 2000$. With all due respect that seems insane to me. You talked so much about how well these speakers measure with the “fixed” crossover but I don’t remember you saying they sounded any better, maybe you did and I don’t remember. I feel like your emphasis is so much on they measure so much better but not on if they actually would be more enjoyable and pleasing to the ear for the people who are buying this speaker which are klipsch lovers. For short. would like to hear a trusted die hard klipsch fans reaction to this Improved crossover how it changes the sound of the speaker for the better and does it change that voicing of klipsch speakers that live voicing and if it’s simply worth it to throw another 2g at a speaker that already costs over 4. I feel like Danny is robbing us here with all due respect. Still intrigued but man that price is intense.
I am robbing you with this one huh? If Klipsch designed drivers that didn't need a lot of parts for correcting the response issues then it wouldn't cost so much. The parts are what they are and cost what they cost. You get the whole upgrade kit professionally designed with MUCH higher quality parts for exactly what the parts cost and zero fee (no cost) for all of the design work, and I am robbing you? Also, absolutely it changes the sound of the speaker. It allows you to hear the music cleanly and clearly as recorded rather than the mess it becomes when played though these speakers. Customer feedback on this one has been overwhelmingly good as well.
@@dannyrichie9743 good to hear. What you said sounded dangerously close to you’re not making any profit off this. Is that what you’re saying, that what it costs you is what your charge is therefor you would not be making any money off it.
@@dannyrichie9743 to me I hear the music very cleanly and clearly so you’re not really selling me there. I’d love to try it but I don’t think it’s worth it to me. do what you do man and I think I might of thought the price was more than it actually is, how much is it again? It’s cool you do what you do gives people more possibilities just some things like the way you say things annoy me I guess. Like you say it fixes it, to who’s standards. Your standards or John does standards might be completely different than someone else’s and what there ears like. Idk it’s just like you’re trying to focus on selling your product too much and not really being transparent with us and kinda one sided ig it seems to me. Maybe to people who aren’t as experienced in your field would watch you video and it would paint a much different picture to them then it should if you would stand on the fence than on one side or the other. Idk it’s hard to convey it into word but I tried my best. I don’t think you’re a bad guy you’re trying to run a business but you have to understand not everyone is a die hard experienced audiophile like you and that has your ears. To some people getting this crossover may degrade from the experience of the speaker as a whole in the form of them not liking the difference of sound rather or not you think it fixes it or not fixing the frequency response on paper, obviously that isn’t everything and how much of the picture it takes up is up for debate. everyone has different preferences and if you took more time to explain that maybe it would fix some things. Maybe it wouldn’t maybe to everyone that heard the rf7iiis with your new crossover they would like it who’s knows. Cheers. Do you do any of your products on a free trial, lol I would love to hear it.. I may be expecting a lil to much here feeling how I do but just my opinion like I said I do you but maybe my story did something..
@@daveycrockett5738 Let me take this one first. We don't make a lot of margin on crossover parts. We buy in bulk as much as we can so that we can make some margin. It is usually 20 to 30%. Considering all of the time I have invested in the design work, I have to sell a dozen of these or so to break even. I do it because it helps people. It gets them into the DIY hobby, and even as a loss leader it is good advertising. The customer feedback is really the best advertising I could buy. Our forum on the Audio Circle is full of it.
Secondly, let me dispel the notion that the improvement in performance is subjective or debatable. No one ever says they prefer the sound of having all of the detail smeared together rather then it being clear. No one ever decides they like the frequency response all jacked up and the tweeter level 4db louder then the woofers over a smooth and balanced sound. No one ever says they prefer when everything arrives out of phase and broken apart in the time domain over the sigal arriving in phase, coherent, and complete. No one ever says they like it when everything sounds flat and on the plane of the speakers or sound coming straight out of the speakers over a three dimensional and layered sound stage with separation and space around everything. Often (and to many of us) when we hear what speakers are capable of versus what we get from them when they are new then we do tend to think that they were broken from the factory. We realize they were built to a price point and not built to perform. For many people being able to fix them is a blessing.
03:36 -- Danny's version of an Uncle Roger "Hai-yoo!" 🤣
Wouldn't it make sense to use an iron-core inductor for the lower woofer? I've seen an article showing that distortion of the iron-core inductors on frequences less than 500 Hz is still pretty low (as I recall, less than 0.1%).
Makes sense, you are likely to obtain much lower DCR at a reasonable cost with a cored inductor and that's what really matters down low.
We did try that option as well, but it didn't sound right with the iron core inductor compared to the air core when designing the new network. The RF7-II & 8000F upgrade kits both used iron cores for the lower woofer.
@@hoth2112Sorry, you mean it didn't sound right to include an iron core inductor for marketing reasons, or it didn't sound right, because somehow its core hysteresis/signal distortion is audible, while that of output transformers of valve amplifiers you favour is not ? Increased losses and lower damping make for a more pronounced bass, if less accurate. In any case, driver distortion will trump that of iron core coil by quite a margin at LF. To put things into perspective, what's the DCR of that air core, more than R7 ?
@@paulb4661 Tonally speaking, it didn't sound right. I dont have a better description
The iron core we were using was also a much higher value than the air core.
If we wanted to swap to an iron core of the same value, we would need to have had them custom made for us as it's not a value we normally carry in iron cores.
Any chance you might offer an upgrade for the Klipsch Cornwall IV?
Someone has to send or bring one to him.
Very nice work on this one. 2.5 way for the win!
So is it essential that people use a measuring meter when they listen to music on the Klipsch loudspeakers or they won't pick up the dips in frequencies?
Would you consider reviewing something in the Polk Audio Reserve series? Perhaps the R500, or R600, or R700, which all the youtube reviewers seem to be raving about. It would be interesting to see how their measured performance compares with their perceived pleasant sound. Thanks for your consideration.
I am really not a reviewer. I just work on whatever customers send us for upgrades.
@@dannyrichie9743 someone would need to send him the speakers. Those R700 look like beasts! Im considering getting them and if I do I would definitely get Danny’s help with the crossover’s. I have the R200 in my garage and I like them👍🏻🔈
@@JR-ho5qm Why would you bother buying them expecting them to need a crossover change? Just buy what you enjoy. And the idea that they could be better with a crossover change doesn't fly as you have no idea what they sound like currently and for the money spent plus the new crossover you could have just purchased something you liked in the first place. Also, what if it's one of the speakers he doesn't think needs much done? Then you just wasted your money all around. Hell, just order one of his kits if you think he knows what's going to sound best for you.
@@davep2945 almost any speaker you buy under 10000$ can benefit from having higher quality crossover parts. Even if it’s just higher quality parts of equal value without a network change. It’s no different than souping up a car, kinda fun to have something a bit better than it was intended to be.
@@JR-ho5qm Hey, if you've got the scratch and that's your thing, go for it. But I am curious as to why more viewers don't just order his kits if they believe in his methods. I've found well designed kits to be a far better value both dollar wise and performance wise.
I knew mine were off. To compensate I rotated the plinths around 180 degrees and cranked the spikes in the rear as high as they will go and removed the front ones so they are pointing straight at me plus they are toed in about 20 degrees each. Looks funny but works for me. My 300Bs make em sing. Had RF5s prior and Response 2s prior to those.
So this new crossover will transform these 2 way speakers into a 2.5 or 3 way speakers ?
For a 6000 dollar pair of speakers, you'd expect better parts. I would spend 6000 on these only to have to do an upgrade to them. I wonder what the upgraded 8000f doubt like in comparison to these upgraded? Are they close enough to not need to consider the rf7iii?
I have the same question
I went for the jbl 3800 instead of these. I rly wanted to like the rf7, they have a great 10" slam, but the sound overall is not worth it at ALL. The jbl's and the rf7 cost the same here (6700$) the rf7 mids is the worst part of the speaker.. most ppl who praises the rf7 or is typical americans , they get them very cheap on amazon for example, and most of them have never had some real speakers before, then ofc the rf7 gonna sound amazing.
Have you ever got your hands on the old Klipch legend series from the late 90s particularly the KLF20s?
We haven't.
@@hoth2112 basically forte drivers in a tower, very awesome, considering Bob Crites titanium tweeter diaphragm and cap update, any thoughts would be welcome
I have two pair of the 8060 fa first generation and those things pound concrete they sound absolutely phenomenal when it comes to listening to what I like to listen to which is 70s progressive rock from Alan Parsons all the way forward to yes.. I would truly enjoy Junior researches impression of the 8060 Fa for comparison please do so thank you
how far away do you take these measurements?
Klipsch are known for horn tweeters and BASS, are they still BASS Heavy
So how does it work with the very low end when the top woofer is crossed over differently compared to both working simultaneously.
I feel like the bass impact would suffer tremendously with one woofer doing the low end instead of two and for me that's a deal breaker for a strictly two chanel system with no sub.
I feel like it makes more sense to just bi-amp with monoblocks and then control timing and crossover that way. A more pure method without extra parts for the signal to flow through.
I have 15 yo Klipsch floor standing speakers and the woofer sounds blown with explosions in movies. Is that fixable? Do they sell replacement woofers?
Is that dip related to the mid band compensation on auddessey? If so, then is that not a bad idea to keep turned on?
I've never done anything like this before. I would really need a full walk through video before I considered spending that kind of money and potentially damaging these speakers. Would you be willing to make one? Or do you have one already with any other speakers that would give me a better idea if this is something I could take on myself?
Just wondering if you've had your hands on the Klipsch Forte IV and what kind of upgrade was needed with them? thanks so much. Keep up the great work.
Not yet.
I don't care for the reference line much, but the Klipsch heritage line is great, the heresy and forte are very good. I'd like to see you do some vintage speaker upgrades and see what you think, original klh model 5? Hpm 100? Just a thought.
I designed an upgrade for the Forte 3. We even did before and after listening comparisons. That speaker needed a lot of help.
@@dannyrichie9743 interesting
@@JukeboxAlley Amazing how thousands of satisfied buyers don't think it needs any help at all. But because one dude sends a pair in and they don't meet Dan's preferred specs suddenly all those folks are wrong. Nope, they just like what they like. No one is the all powerful arbiter of how a speaker should sound or measure. If you enjoy them then F what anyone else thinks. We're not talking about people receiving a counterfeit version of a life saving medicine that doesn't follow the definitive formula needed to make it work. We're talking about personal enjoyment and taste which is entirely subjective.
For the RF7 II should we use the same setup?
I want to see you make kits for Arendal speakers or Atlantic technology or other direct to consumer/specialist brands. I can’t stand getting bad quality for a lot of money
Wow! Great work!
I wonder how good the crossovers are in the Klipshorns and their other high end speakers?
Another successful x-over makeover and some lucky guy’s ears saved from mediocre sound quality. I bet that dip at 1000-1500Hz must have been pretty audible, plus a roughly 10dB variance in output across the entire frequency range.
I have a set of Paradigms Monitors 9’s…can do an upgrade?
I just finished the upgrade on one speaker, and have been doing A B comparisons. Really, there is no comparison...
This is with Outlaw 200w mono blocks and a parasound pre amp.
My anecdotal experience is consistent with what his measurements show in my room.
For me, when the GR version is in the same room as the stock one, the performance is obvious. The GR modded one has so much more presence, bass, and the sound is so forward.
It's still the Klipsch sound, but the drivers actually start and stop like they're supposed to. It's like the upper driver actually works now. It's a faster speaker, more articulate, and without all the distortion and fizzy sound. Everything Danny said about cabinet resonance is true. Once you hear a damped cabinet, you're spoiled forever.
So much more sound energy is being directed AT you as opposed to being lost in the cabinet resonance. It makes me want to put no rez even in my garage speakers.
Now, the speakers actually sound like all the review boys say they did. You could spend more money than Danny's kit on your audio system elsewhere and get less improvement.
If you have these speakers, you really owe it to yourself to upgrade them.
hi joblo, does the A/B comparison took after you burn in upgrade crossover?
what is the result after 200hr burn in so far. I would like to know because I'm planning to do it so. thx for sharing.
Pretty awesome. I never liked the RF7iii. This would probably make them nice.
So basically with the stock cross over, these speakers should sound better if you turn them upside down.
In some ways. But being on the axis of the upper woofer is probably the closest to a "sweet spot" that exists.
I have taking to tilting mine back about 7 degrees, sounds better bit I'd have preferred to spend more and have them right.
did you have better luck with the 3,s as oppised to the 7ll?
Is there a how to video to these? I’ve had these for about a year and would like to take a stab and trying to do this myself
3:43 - Maybe that is what their design intended. People sitting on the floor watching movies or on a bed sleeping watching tv/movies 🤷🏽♂️
Are this towers on a 3 way crossover design 🤔
@Brian Mallia yeah maybe design from today's rp8000f II similar horn from edge to edge and finally maybe 3 way speakers with slightly better crossover
Did you ever do an upgrade on the elac uni-fi UF5 towers speakers
We had the smaller model in last year, but it wasn't worth working on. There was no room left in the box for any quality parts.
I was seriously considering buying this model until now. I have zero skills or experience working on speakers so a video on how to do this would be very helpful to see if it is even something that I would feel comfortable trying. It seems that every speaker I am considering I then see it on here and move on.
We do offer many of our models fully assembled as well.
Remember that this guy is selling a product, not exactly unbiased..Odds are youd buy these speakers and be blown away, they are popular for a reason.. its been 3 months, what you get?
@@drewpknutz1410 blown away? They cost 6700$ here, maybe half the price i would be happy to pay for them.
@chriss881000 I pay 4500 with delivery for both tower and RC64 III a 1.1/2 year ago
I have the RF-7 I's and they desperately need to be a 2.5 way. I am shocked the III's still have crappy radioshack plastic binding posts. 2K a piece tower speaker and plastic binding post nuts should not be in the same sentence.
Their biggest center channels are also still 2-way speakers. The RC 64-III we have up next is an absolute mess, especially off axis. It desperately needs to be a 2.5 way speaker as well..
@@hoth2112 The center channel that went with the RF-7 I was a 2.5 way, which adds much insult to injury.
@@raidendigital1003 now that's a real shame...
Lol. U paid that much for these?
@@Starch1b2c3d4a Yes. I was young and stupid. I did not have a room big enough to use them properly, and still don't.
Does this tech ever play a before and after audio sample so we can hear what the difference is?
There are some RUclips channels dedicated to A-B comparisons, which in theory should tell you something, but even with my high end monitors, I can't really tell enough difference to make a buying decision. I did upgrade my B&W speakers with Danny's kit, but I doubt a mic'd comparison could reveal the richness of the sound in the upgraded speakers.
Most cases, we only get one speaker and all of the crossover designs are done externally using clips, which aren't ideal for sound quality.
Danny has done A-B clips with the smaller RP600M, as that was a pair we built out and compared the stock to upgraded.
He has said multiple times that he doesn't listen to the speakers at all. Just runs tests and adjusts to his preferred graph. Sometimes I would say the measurements are better and sometimes they aren't worth the effort but no matter the sound will only be changed. To you it may be better or it may not be. Plenty of people love the speakers Danny denigrates. And plenty of people think he's some sort of guru with this singular knowledge no one else possesses. Well, except for Andrew Jones because that's the only other speaker designer these folks know of. So they'll ignore the fact the Elac's budget to upper tier speakers use budget crossovers because, well, Andrew.
The initial measurement put up is not what one would hear seated, listening to these Klipsch speakers.
The tweeter height is way above ear level when sitting in your listening chair on these speakers which is where the measured response got a lot smoother.
Danny would know this & you can tell that his computer chair still doesn’t get him to tweeter height which is a lot higher than normal listening chairs.
Although the speakers still need a lot of work :) just would like a fair review.
Not a big Klipsch fan but do have these as surrounds.
Nice result in the end Danny.
The speaker is setting on a lift table behind me. It is about 10" off of the floor.
Even if you do get your ear to near the mid woofer level, the overall room response is still all over the place.
@@dannyrichie9743 you are right, results were still not great. Albeit better than your first measurement.
These speakers for unknown reasons were never meant to be listened to with tweeter at ear level.
If I was using these as stereo speakers & really enjoyed them, I would ant this upgrade myself :)
Happy listening.
Will the sensitivity of the speakers get affected by this upgrade?
No
Is this for all RF7's?
Have you done any of the Klipsch Heritage speakers?
Only the Forte IIIs so far. And they needed a lot of help as well.
@Not My Fault, You Asked For It some people love the vintage look, but want them to sound better/ more balanced.
@Not My Fault, You Asked For It exactly, which is why they keep getting sent to us.
Great thumbnail!
funny thing is i like the klipsch sound
Would these crossovers work on my R 820 F ?The cabinets are identical in size. Same size drivers and horn. Thanks
They will if the drivers are exactly the same.
I ve had my RF7 iii for a few years and like how they sound in Movies and don't think they are harsh. In music though it's a totally different story. I can't listen to more than 2-3 songs at once, I get fatigue and have to turn it down or off. Would this be related to the stock crossover design? Can I expect improvement in that area with this upgrade? Or is this just how Klipsch speakers are naturally? Thanks
I love mine for music, and have the opposite reaction. I can't turn the things off.
how would you compare the stock rp8000f ii to the stock rf7 iii? Noticed you talked about how Klipsch has cleaned up the response on their version 2's of their RP line. Does that better response make it better than the RF7 iii when talking about accuracy/overall sound quality?
I don't know. I have not had the RP8000F ii in house yet.
@@dannyrichie9743 The RP tweeter are better, so the top high end would be better and less parts But the lower end would need work just like all the RP-
I find the RP 8000Fs sound muffled when compared with RF7s. Again, that’s my feeling I could be wrong
Is this why I feel that my RF7 IIIs have no low end bass? I mean I am feeding them power from a Monolith 7X amp. Thankfully I have a subwoofer for movies but my music seems to be missing bass.
Set rf7 to 80hz and subwoofer to 120hz
@@yournightmare9999 I have a separate set up for full range 2 Ch and 2.1 crossed over as suggested already. I just assumed 4 10in woofers would move more air. Maybe I have to really crank the volume to move the woofers.
@D1Calderon klipsch need 150-200 hours to make them sound way better. I have rp280f since when they released 2015 at beginning they sounded good but nothing special but today they way better. After few years they released RF7III and when I switched them RF7III sound like crap compared to my rp280f but today they sounds better. But overall I think I need way better amplifier like 450wpc to play them in full potential
can you make a video for b&w 801 matrix s3?
I only work on whatever is sent in.
I have to wonder if crossovers like these are simply calculated with some type of software without any listening or testing to doublecheck the actual response. Seeing measured response charts makes me wonder how could a $4k speaker be released into the marketplace with glaring issues that are somewhat obvious. 🤷🏻♂️
If Danny is selling his xover at 900, it probably would cost Klipsh 500 in cost of goods sold. That would double their sale price. Best to buy the speakers used and add Danny's xover and have great speakers at less than retail.
PLEASE PLEASE look at making a kit to upgrade/rebuild Dahlquist dq-10 speakers.
Send one in.
@@dannyrichie9743 Thanks for your reply. Do you have a ballpark figure of how much it might cost. I'm on SS. Thanks again. PS a I will be using this with a Fisher 400 and a Marantz 2275.
@@eazystreet5507 Oh man, I just realized which speaker that is. There is no fixing those. Those things have drivers all spread out all over a big baffle. There are comb filtering issues in every direction. That can't be fixed.
@@dannyrichie9743 Ok Thanks.
I am from Toronto Canada i would like to order the up grade kit for the Klipssch RF7 lll. I am a plumber but i never did any thing like this before. Do you have any suggestions.Thanks Patrick
Watch the older videos I did on the Klipsch RP600M. I shot five videos on that one and showed the upgrade from beginning to end. The process for this one is exactly the same.
Short cuts?
That's what turned me off on the RP line so wanted them but had no warmth to the vocals. if they made it a 3 way would really help.
So I was looking at getting these but not if I got to get it all changed. What speaker do you recommend that is great right from the dealer?
I looked at these rf7 for a long time. Listened to them at my local dealer and I was not spec impressed. Yes they have alot of bass but the mids are lacking, and they are known for it. If u have a dealer who has the new jbl hdi line, like the jbl hdi 3800, they are worth checking out, tripple 8's instead of 2x10 lkke the rf7, but they sound so much better overall and they got a great slam to
@Crysis looking at martin logan xt f200 or paradigm founder 100f are my other 2 choices
Zu Dirty Weekend 6 Supremes or their Union 6 or Union 6 Supreme.
And they cost how much!!?
The speakers are roughly $2200 each
@@hoth2112 And they're worth?
The UK price on them is just over £4000
they are the top of the line speakers, how can klipsch cheap out like that?
Plz take a look at the jbl hdi 3800 or 3600 if u ever get a chance to 🙂
Send one in.
@@dannyrichie9743 i hope someone else does. I do not live in america, so that shipping would cost more than the speakers itself😅 but in general, are jbl using cheap crossover parts from what you have seen?
I purchased a new pair of RF-7III and felt like all the negative elements Danny addressed were correct but after around 3-400 hrs. the speakers began to open up. The biggest improvement first noticed was the integration of the drivers was much better and the highs opened up. I use the speaker plinths that come with speakers many do not.
Bass response is very powerful and has evened out alot.
The GR upgrades would clearly be a large improvement but even without upgrades the speakers have good detail, uncompressed dynamic range with a good high power amplifier. I am using a Emotiva XPR-5. The speakers have very good dynamic range and I hear no edgy or compressed highs. As I stated earlier the highs have opened up.
( No not like my Magnapans but adequate and on bad recordings you can enjoy music)
In terms of speakers I have magnapan 1.7i,
Room 11.7x16.0x10.0.
Placement :
Spks. 6.1 apart
Side wall. 18"
BackWall 4'x7"
Seat distance 9'.0
Heavy wall treatment side walls 4"x48" thick.
Behind spks. 21" back 4"x48" panel.
Don't worry. This guy is trying hard.. guess he makes a lot of money with his kits..
At last, we are Back in Business again with Speaker upgrades. And so long as there are Klipsch and B&W speakers around, Danny will be busy with the upgrades. Another silk purse from a Sow's ear... Thanks, Danny
We've still got 2 more Klipsch speakers in house, a B&W center channel Alon with some Magnepan 3.7i & .7s
@@hoth2112 awesome. I cant wait. I bought better quality parts to revamp my wifes old Warfedale Laser60's and will do the same with 3 pairs of Linn Tukan's I'm using as Dolby Atmos wall mounted speakers. I learned a lot from Danny. And eagerly await more
I can understand building to price point with cheap components , but a to design a speaker that is so flawed blows my mind.🤯
if they would have used cheap parts and your design it would not cost that much more in the first place!!!! its crap, they knew it and they dont care. nice work ntl
So basically if you own a pair of these and can't afford to fix the crossovers, go to the bookshelf and put some books under the speakers.
Is the cost $950.00 each or for a pair.
pair
Please review JBL HDI 3800
If someone wants to sends us one we'd be happy to.
Excellent