Mass Battle: The Russian Air Force vs The Chinese Air Force (WarGames 144) | DCS
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- Опубликовано: 11 июл 2024
- We answer the viewer question whether or not the Russian Air Force could take on the Chinese Air Force. Our sim can not handle 2100 aircraft similtaneuously, so we run a 1/10th scale proportional battle.
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Mods: • Free DCS Mods
0:00 Overview
1:27 Research
5:45 Scenario Details
10:10 Predictions
12:08 Fight!
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#WarGames #GRWarGames #China #Russia #Su57 #J20 #DCSQuestioned #GR #DCSWorld #Aviation #AviationGaming #FlightSimulators #Military #DCS #DCSWorld 
Игры
Chinese Air Force vs Russian Air Force: ruclips.net/video/vHO94A7x6v8/видео.html
US Air Force vs Chinese Air Force ruclips.net/video/ngXvWALKi1w/видео.html
US Air Force vs US Navy & Marine Corps: ruclips.net/video/OfThwhYC-WQ/видео.html
Ridiculous scenario: Who would win a dogfight *B-1B or Tu-160?*
Brandon should try and difuse the situation by locking the door and leaving a note on it with a box of choccies for her.
this guy womens
Yes-- as a great man once said,"girlfriends are hardly ever compatible with DCS."
@@fredkruse9444 i don't know. It should not be impossible to live with each others hobbies, even if you share no interest in it. There is ususally not just one side to blame if it doesn't.
Unless it gets excessive.
Let's go Brandon.
I would say Brandon is at a crossroads. But, it doesn't have to be "her way or the highway." Just adjust your schedule a bit by increasing your "girlfriend appreciation time"! Truth is, relationships are always a balancing act. I should know, I'm older than Cap and have two daughters in their late thirties and two granddaughters!
Planes like the Su-34 can be set to freely attack air targets if you set it to AFAC and set rules of engagement to weapons free.
Yup did that.
bro wrote the question so professionally damn.
Brandon should drop some chocolate flares or Wine Chaff to evade GF problems.
You really need IADS and tactics to make this more realistic/interesting. So much of Soviet/Russian doctrine is based around working inside IADS. Having combined arms with some kind land acquisition would make it interesting as well. I would also like to see the human in steal (Fallon / J-20) as they use that advantage better than the AI does.
Felon
33:43 plenty of fish in the sea, on to the next one😆👍
Situation suggestion... Seeing a MASSIVE "GUNS ONLY" furball.
Basically take as many people as possible in MODERN jets, but GUNS ONLY so that you end up with a WW 1 style "massive furball". Would really love to see all the jinx, dives, banks, turns and chaos associated with a "furball", but cranked up to 11 due to the speeds involved.
31:41
"The entire Chinese Air Force is after Simba!"
Simba: "They better get some more guys!"
Brandon push the tactics - if no chaff left you'll have to let loose other shiny things, notch and use terrain, and try to draw her within range of your buddy Sam so she has a distraction
Good to know that when WW3 happens, all it takes to beat them is sending the people's champ and Brandon against 90+ Chinese fighters to eliminate them.. Tom Cruise can eat his hat, as Cap would say
This is about what I expected but actually running the simulation is nice confirmtion. Thanks Cap.
Great stuff! Would love to see some battles like this with SAMs like the naval battles have with all the defense ships
Yep, that went as expected
It would be interesting to see similar battles with smaller countries like Norway v Sweden / UK v France.
"10x Su-57"
**[X] Doubt**
They do have that many, at least that we publicly know of.
X fr
I've seen some latest estimates putting the current fleet at north of 20 Felons.
@@danielthuku8192 *F-22 salivating at the thought*
@@staz3014 why does everything has to be a contest?? The probability of them ever meeting in battle is 0
We should do the proposal from John Boyd to use “human wave tactics” of F-5s that was proposed in place of a 4th Gen fighter vs a smaller number of F15s and F16s. Maybe 30 F5s vs 3 F15s and 3 f16s
If the realism button is clicked to "on", there'll only be 2 flight-worthy SU-57s..........
You mean 11?
F35s are very problematic as well unfortunately
@@dexlab7539 Yes because an aircraft with almost probably the second best stealth available after the B-2 with 950 airframes in service and a 54% readiness rate is just as bad as something with 5 deployed airframes which is also very unlikely to have all its planned systems working.
Girl Friend not compatible with DCS.. Great quote CAP...
To correct you on something here, both sides operate their SAM’s with friendly aircraft in the area. Russian aircraft are specifically designed to operate within their SAM net and use IFF systems to correctly identify their aircraft.
Supposed to being the key word. It was confirmed that multiple Russian aircraft were shot down by their own SAMs in Ukraine. My guess is that is likely a training issue if we assume it wasnt them overstating capability.
From the Ukraine war, it's very dubious their IFF system/procedures are reliable. Their ground and air coordination overall has been quite horrible. Maybe things would be better if they were facing western jets and the jets are very different from their own, but in this scenario China, like Ukraine, operates many Russian/Soviet or copies of such jets, so that doesn't really come into play.
There were multiple reports that they tend to not operate sams when own aircraft are in the ao.
@@javiermoya2801 No one confirmed this. These are all allegations. Don’t believe everything you’re told, I learned that a long time ago.
@@jakej1837 That’s not how IFF systems work. Do your research before hand. Just because either side uses the same/similar aircraft, does not mean that they can be mistaken for the enemy, unless if you’re talking about visual confirmation, but that’s a different story. Also, IFF systems have been around and used since the 40’s, so they’re not anything fancy or new. If you look up what an IFF is, it’s not a very complex system.
So amazing simulation, thanks for it
Its good to see you use other Russian air assets, like Su-27 and Su-30
'Numbers and stealth will win out' mmmmm interesting comment. As China now has both, the US should be questioning their actions towards China as well
Forgot to count the 1000+ f-35s nato has??
I only want to point out J10A and J10C are pretty different plane...
Don’t know anything about the SW but I’m guessing it overestimates the ability of the air air missiles and SAMs. How does it account for tactics and training differences?
Let them fight.
Wonder who's going to supply Russia's AA missile stocks once they deplete. As well as all other stocks - ground action would be on as well. Russia has already been begging Iran, China, and NK for ammo recently.
Artillery heavy war chews through ammo fast and the war has been going on for more than a year. Entire Nato and other countries supplied Ukraine and they are still screaming for more ammo. Also the strikes on ammo depots also burns supplies faster on both sides
Love your content! Just recently started watching your older videos and catching up.
Thanks
I'm surprised they have only a few thousand I expected tens of thousands. I wonder would a combined operation at 1/10 scale would look like.
It's important to remember that basically all the jets that could be mass produced at those numbers have become obsolete to the point they're barely worth maintaining. Even if one side did try to mass produce thousands of mig 15s or similar craft, they're going to be vulnerable to EVERYTHING in the opponents air defense arsenal. Sure you could try updating the easily produced designs, but the cost of making them somewhat viable for what you need them for quickly brings you close to the cost and production time of a newer air frame. Basically, the thousands of older model craft, even if they were still functioning, are largely obsolete and not worth considering in a hypothetical situation like this. You want all your best pilots in aircraft that are capable, well maintained, and well integrated. Throwing in a ton of less capable fighters in your usual attacks will, at best, be unnecessary but somewhat useful. At worst you're going to lose dozens of pilots because despite how much you train them, the older aircraft will be nearly unsurvivable regardless of skill. If you don't have enough viable aircraft for all your pilots at once, sending them up in something obsolete is a good way to waste the millions of dollars it takes to train EVERY SINGLE FIGHTER PILOT.
I realize this strayed very far from your comment, but basically, even if all those old soviet early migs were still operational, there's almost no situation desperate enough to justify flying out in one because it is so vulnerable, and as a modern military pilot, your life and training are EXTREMELY valuable. Cutting edge fighters are worth 10s to hundreds of millions, but EVERY HOUR in the air is going to be 15 thousand to 30 or so for fuel and regular repairs, and as a pilot in training you will already have hundreds of those hours already spent on training you, and as you gain years of experience, every hour in the air is another 30k and another hour of experience you get. An experienced modern pilot is not only worth orders of magnitude more than any potential action they could accomplish I'm some ancient Korean War era jet, but after enough hundreds of flight hours you might even be worth more that 70 million dollars jet you fly. It would be borderline sabotage to order pilots to fly something that has a near 0 chance of surviving anything beyond an initial Sam shot
Do you know what the difference is between your AESA radar and the new f15e radar? Can you do a bvr fight with it vs j20 and su57, or yf23 and f22. Would probably just be a regular video but if you could give detection ranges I would be ok with that.
Detectability with GR AESA radar:
F-22 14 miles
YF-23 11 miles
Su-57 45 miles
Su-57(RAM) 25 miles
J-20 22 miles
Ranges vary a bit depending on alt, aspect etc.
@@grimreapers is it different than the f15e strike eagle radar? how much so?
Loved it
Not gonna lie, the J-20 is one sexy bird.
agree
next bout should be US navy/marine aircraft vs US air force aircraft maybe Brits thrown in if theres a big enough difference between the two
I think it would be fun if you had the entirety of China and Russia vs the United States scaled down of course
Girlfriend issue is a self-resolving issue. You ignore it, girlfriend goes away, no more girlfriend issues.
nice
One thing China might have to consider, why should Russia hesitate to use nuclear weapons in Siberia? I mean, where else in the world could you worry less about collateral damage?
Luton?
Ohio.
As Kissinger once said,‘ Pity they can’t both lose.’
Happy Independence D...
Oh, wait...
Never mind 😏
Great video,
you've done Russia vs China and USA vs China,
what I'd really love to see next is China vs. the Western European Union i.e. just the European members of NATO (now with added Sweden!)
- Meteors everywhere!
- How many different types of IR-guided short ranged missiles??
- ideally, set up so that at least some of the F-35's can make it to the battle?
- To be fair, the range of the J-20 is part of its capability, and likewise the short runway requirements of the F-35B is part of its capability, allowing it to start on more runways, including ones closer to the front line. Perhaps spread out the starting bases of the stealth aircraft, to showcase the benefits of range & STOVL?
All the jets had valued viewers sitting in them XD
agreed
Could you maybe next do the entire NATO airforce, vs China + Russia + maybe something like Iran?
That's just lingo for US vs China.
Could see why Russia would use pre-emptive nukes
This. But add in bombers on both sides spewing air to air missiles into the fray.
Any idea when the type 003 fujian model will be done? Also would be interested to see it with a squadron of J35 carrier stealth to help counter the American lightings
I think there actually is a mod with the J-31/35
Yeah j31 is less known though
Don't mention J-35 or Type 003.....Fat Amy fanboys get depressed as does NATO 🤭😁😁😁😁🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@Spooky_918
The J-31 and J-35 are the same project
Its just not publicy known wich the real designation the Aircraft actually have
@@jonathantoymakernot sure why, the J-31 is just a direct copy of the F-35.
What a scenario.......far from implausible.
It’s really implausible, in all honesty. Russia and China are best buddies politically rn.
Haha, nope. Most likely Russia+China vs NATO
200+ J-20s is very scary for NATO irl 😮
Great video, can you do it with the Russian set up defensively where the Chinese are attacking. That might help balance out the power a little.
now that the air war is over can we send in the same 1/10th scale ground force battle?
China does not have a dedicated bomber fleet due to a defense doctrine for the better half of century. However, that is changing.
H6s are bombers, china just doesn't have any advanced bombers. at least until the H20 enters service
@@hughmungus2760 good catch.
This is going to be a treat for us flanker enjoyers
F-22 man myself, but I have much respect for the Flanker. Scary bastard.
Relationship problems have been figured out for hundreds of years. Sit down and say everything with the option of getting on with it.
我觉得整个战斗大概率又和海战一样，比弹道能力，比弹道数量。还有预警机的性能，也可能会在必要时，会调配军事高清卫星追踪高价值目标，配合预警机的数据整合分配作战任务。最后就剩下驾驶员的意志力了。谁更像太阳俯瞰大地，谁更容易获胜。当然也只是更容易，而不是一定。
Would be interesting to see with real world factors we can’t account for easily. For example Russian vs Chinese tactics, some of which is known. But then important and classified variables such as: radar/sensor effectiveness and fusion in various aircraft, actual missile effectiveness, how effective jamming and electronic warfare would be etc. I’m sure real world EW would make a big impact in lowering those high kill probabilities. Then of course there are things like pilot training and skill which are really impossible to simulate.
For a video you guys should do if just the entire US Carrier Strike Forces can win air superiority over the UK/ entire European Union.
That would be interesting to see.
I was about to propose the other side of the world. NATO vs USA.
Are submarines allowed to take part?
@@trolleriffic I would say yes the US gets a cruise missile sub and EU gets 2 attack subs to try and take out carrier's
Why would China attack Russian Serbia for resources while they could JUST ASK?
I hate to quote Stalin, especially when the context of the quote is against the Russians this time, but it's just to fitting. He said, "Quantity has a quality all its own." Grim Reapers have proved this time and again in soooo many different scenarios!!! Super Cap says it best, if you throw enough S at anything, you'll get leakage. In this case the Russians were doomed to be overwhelmed by the numerical disadvantage. Pile that on with the fact that a good portion of the Russian forces were running older missiles, they never really had a chance!! This was an excellent proof of concept though on that note, so even though you guys all called it in the pre-flight, I think this was still valuable information gleaned!! Great flying as always Grim Reapers!! Hats off to Simba in this one!! On one of those last few lives, he pulled straight up and smacked a J-10 probably before his freaking wheels were up!!! The peoples champ for a reason!!!
Still don't get why you keep put the 57's and 20's RCS so high with US jets at 0.00000000000 etc? Yes, we know they have larger RCS than US but I highly doubt the differences are as big as you think
Bro is mad
Cap is there a way to increase the size of the scoreboard little hard to read especially on mobile RUclips
Wow, damn
Honestly, myself and the rest of the world would probably just be sitting back eating popcorn if this were to happen.
Its an unfair fight for Russia without the SAM defences.
Russian air defenses tend to shut down when their own planes are in the air. Guess their iff is iffy.
China has similar (reportedly better) IADS so its pretty fair.
@@BoraHorzaGobuchul Fratricide when you've got highly capable IADS in operation is a very serious risk for any airforce. I'd imagine most if not all of them would limit SAM use with their own aircraft overhead.
@@trolleriffic maybe, maybe not. I would imagine USAF will fare much better in this regard.
It would be cool to see if the US airforce vs the chinese airforce or us airforce vs the Russian airforce
Those numbers for Russian A/C, are they current or pre SMO calculations?
Current. Those numbers were much higher at the beginning of the conflict.
@@92HazelMocha Clearly, as the RF have lost much aviation during the conflict but I wonder how current Wiki 'facts' are.
Any time one side has both _MORE_ aircraft *AND* more _STEALTHY_ aircraft, that side will win.
Unless one side gets brokenass missiles that can't be stopped like the LRASM
Viewington wooington reporting!
Hi
Slightly off topic, while it's clear that western aircraft have capability advantages over Chinese and Russian aircraft, I think the Russian planes are more aesthetic. The Flanker is simply a good looking aircraft, it looks the way you'd expect a fighter jet to look.
很明显？你被洗脑的很严重啊。
Would love to see y’all model F18 block 3
Shoulda put in the su-30 Mod from project flanker
Cool! Can you do US VS RUSSIA air war over Canada air space? Have you already done that?
Brandon needs to drop tanks and RTB
There isn't that many Tu-160, there's about 16. There will be double that once russia acquires the new ones they ordered. So maybe that figure includes that
he should get her a DCS computer of her own and they can fight each other in game
Brandon sounds like Lance Stroll .. lmao
j 10 looks like the eurofighter
Russia v. China at scale is horrendous to contemplate. The distances are enormous. China would first want to take Vladivostok, which is relatively a backyard fight, but beyond that, they're extending over Mongolia and Kazakhstan. Hell, even western China is a long way for Chinese to reach logistically. When Xi met with Putin, he said something like, "We're going to see change like we haven't seen in a hundred years." I couldn't help but wonder if he was really thinking that a quarter of Russia would be a way better prize than tiny Taiwan.
Brandon, you can get rid of your girlfriend problems by getting married, then it becomes wife problems.
Still hate the J-10 because it was OP af in BF2.
and the irony was the F35 was utterly dogshit in BF2 as well.
@@hughmungus2760 imo the real irony is that they didnt even need to make the fighter jets different at all. They couldve just all had the same flightmodel and noone wouldve noticed.
Indeed, had good memories with BF2
the main reason russia has so many planes is because majority of their stuff is old tech; easy to mass produce and maintain
As usual all these battles are pointless - so-called AI charges in - spafs all their long range missiles off and then go in for dogfights until they run out of fuel or are shot down - nobody would use their air force like that. The skirmishes would be multiple battles at range with aircraft returning to base to rearm and refuel - actually these aircraft taking off with full weapons loads would refuel again after taking off (if that’s available to the type) or they’d be sent in with lighter weapons loads as escorts to the longer-legged aircraft.
I think the difference would be china would okay with the losses.
I thought the su57 Felon would of done better
Shouldn't the J-20s takeoff first?
WOW!!! thiz took some time to make!!?? Nice CAP ;)
The J10, the "Wish Eurofighter"
Don't the J-11s carry PL-12s?
R.I.P Brandon
Brandon should tell her to calm down and listen to reason.
Cap maybe try to put MIG 31s further back, because they don't need to be that close to the front and please remove fullbacks from the fight since they are clearly useless
TBH they way I have them set up, even if they are at the back, they still going to charge into close combat.
The readiness rate of Russian forces is always a question
Considering they are popping tanks with their Ka-52’s from 10km, they don’t seem to be doing terrible.
@@rebelliousfewConsidering that Wagner got to just march straight through Russia towards Moscow I am not sure about that...
@@grabok555 Why do you think that is, I wonder, in your tiny brain? The army let them, they didn't want to shoot at each other. They literally communicated with the army all along the way. Of course the western propaganda turned it all around and made people like you believe something that isn't true.
@@rebelliousfew theyre over a year in against a military that doesnt have air superiority. this isnt the dub you think it is slim lmao
@@rebelliousfew Not at all I would say. Their defence is extremely good right now
Who the hell marked the J-15 as a "stealth multirole" on that Wiki? lol
Lets Go Brandon!!!! Id say let her play with the joy stick too!!!!
Where'd they get the RCS of the J-20?
These things are based on educated guesses or official press releases where available. Nobody making these mods or any others has access to the classified specifications they'd need to make them properly accurate.
It can only be inferred, but some research institutions in the United States have conducted computer simulations, and the RCS is not too bad.
I kinda disagree with the assessment of the older fighters. And as you said they can carry the missile and I think with they serve as a threatening fodder especially since using those would save money. Plus it's china they human wave alot anyway.
SIMBA FTW!
Tom Clancy - The Bear and The Dragon
is it me or the j20 is not even firing
They fired plenty. The air base had to clear J15s first so J20s were taking off when the fight was pretty much over. In reality these stealth multirole fighters will probably take off first but only to deal with the sam sites and some act as their own escort.
Hi, longtime lurker first time commenting; why does Cap say "break" at seemingly random moments?
Radio etiquitte when you take a pause speaking.
It means I am thinking what to say next, but please keep the line quiet.
Let's go Brandon!