Thanks. I see several videos on yt saying Chinese Damascus is fake because its cheap and that's just a lie. I did a similar test here and revealed the pattern by polishing the sides after I thinned the knife. Xinzuo is an honest brand, the core they advise as 60 HRC matches description, good ergonomics, the edge lasts a long time and they have great quality control. The only downside from their knives is that some models are thicker than they should be so cutting performance is good but not amazing. They are already addressing this issue on new models.
all Damascus knife is fake :). Is difference between "Damascus" and "Pattern welding". In this knife's sharpness is from powder steel core, "Pattern welding" responsible for the surface (simulate Damascus surface). But it is better that laser engraved surface
@@mateczek The original damascus technique was lost so if you want to use that definition all damascus is fake. Nowadays what we call real damascus is pattern welding so this is as real as it gets. Core being mono steel for me is a bonus because damascus can be quite unpredictable. It may help a bit or be significantly worse than a mono steel core.
@@thiago.assumpcao "The original damascus technique was lost". Bulat steel, wotz steel etc. is possible to produce steel with the characteristics of original Damascus. it's crucible steel. not layered :). In the era of electron microscopes you can look into the structure of steel. so it's not a special secret!!!
@@mateczek Original Damascus was used in weapons so it's supposed to have decent impact resistance. Wotz steel pattern is made from bands of carbides. It sucks for impact resistance and most people don't think this is how they did it.
I actually have looked the back of the blade with a microscope and I was actually able to count the layers.... I'm serious... And can confirm it's a 67 layer Damascus 😅
Хотел бы поправить автора, судя по рисунку на клинке - этот нож изготовлен из ламината. В центре - моносталь, которая находится в обкладках из дамасской стали. БлагоДарю!🤝🏻 Очень полезный контент! 👍🏻
when looking here for hezhen damascus, i always find aliexpress nearby - so: sponsored by ali..? how come that "vg10-core" CAN NOT be seen on the back? as it can be seen on japanese knives of that kind with an inner core layer..?
I actually have looked the back of the blade of a shan zu 67 layers knife with a microscope and I was actually able to count the layers... And see the thicker middle layer clearly. I'm serious... And can confirm it's a 67 layer Damascus. You can't see that with bare eyes becouse it's been polished... Maybe your Japanese knife has more of a unpolished look or maybe just less layers which make it easier to see with bare eyes
Because there was a time when VG10 steel import-export from japan to china was restricted so the chinese had to make the copy of the VG10 steel. And so they did. The steel they're using is called 10Cr15CoMov and is basically the same quality as VG10, however chinese are not allowed to use the VG10 name on this composition. But you can see the difference in the composition below: VG10: Carbon (C) - 0,95-1,05%; Chromium (Cr) - 14,50-15,50; Molybdenum (Mo) - 0,90-1,20%; Vanadium (V) - 0,10-0,30%; Cobalt (Co) - 1,30-1,50% 10Cr15CoMov: Chromium 14.50%-15.50% Vanadium 0.25%-0.35% Molybdenum 0.80%-1.20% Cobalt 1.30%-1.80%
@@drmarianogarau i just bought a Hezhen like in video, same - and with good light i can see clearly the inner core , thick like 0,5mm - the sharpness of that layer is very good and seems to be on a level of vg10 - in german we say: " this is almost half the rent..", means: beautiful done, highly sharp, so for that prices over here a good deal - wether it is real damast or not - what still makes me pretty much suspicous looking on amazon with almost hundreds of chinese knives(often falsly offered as japanese knives..): obviosly some a laserprintet, a few in a real stupid look ... which are the real and which are the fakes..?? normal customer wont see that, right...
@@nyitrati japanese steel was just to expensive for china - and against their business-philo being since several years now the biggest steel producer of the world - yes, they copied and do a good job with that - but with carbon steel they are still middle class and pretty far from high class japanese carbon steel of first class - they could copy that too.. but looks they dont want it, cause the market worldwide for that is not big enough - but i saw small producers workinhg like japanese with hand-forged blades, maybe they are on premium carbon steel level
The knives are 2, 2.3 -2.5 mm thick if you remove 1mm then you reach the core which is not Damascus steel as the seller of theses blades clearly say in the product description (also what is trending is not Damascus steel but mechanical essence as we call it in the origin region of that steel which I would explain later) but anyway you would reach the hard steel core in less than a millimeter which is sandwiched between only 33 layers of very thin soft mechanical essence shaped stainless steel from each side for decoration and some support to the core. Nice kitchen knives for small budget. Don’t chop bones and frozen meat. Now, for clarity, from an Arab prospective who lived amongst sword makers and near Damascus area, The pattern on mixed types of steel blades are called mechanical essence, Damascus steel is indeed falling within these blade’s categories but with a uniqueness that it is not mechanically shaped as it is not heated and hammered layers which is mechanical but rather more molten and hammered metal recipe that only Syrian craftsmen know how to do with an inherited recipe that is now used for souvenirs only at antique shops. It is not lost as what the social media influencers promotes but the steel was only the best at a certain period of time within the mechanical steel making trend at that time, when the fighters needed the strongest lightweight blades. Nowadays, blades are in a higher quality, we have a higher technology and knowledge and we keep improving steel blades by time and the mechanical essence varieties are improving as well but unfortunately you still call them all Damascus. I forgot to mention that the Damascus steel is very flexible compared to mechanical essence that you can bend the tip of the sword with some strength to touch the handle and comes back straight when you release it. It has less appearing patterns and is more like a molten lava pattern. The mechanical essence steel comes in different styles by the shape of the pattern such as Turkish essence, Persian essence..etc and they are not as flexible as the Damascus steel. And the patterns are well shaped to create a controlled artistic designs for kings and was considered better blades than normal steel but not more functional in battle fields than the Damascus and indeed were more expensive for royal families. I translated the literal meaning from Arabic “Jawhar mechaneki” “Jawhar”means the reality of the material and literally translates into essence by the translator. And the adjective to nouns are reversed in Arabic compared to English. Mechaniky is a borrowed term from Greek language which had a great influence on the middle eastern terminology.
I have a question. Those two are full tang knives, means *ONE PIECE* of metal from the point, tip, blade to the butt. If this is of damascus steel the pattern should be shown even on the bolster which is at least 1" wide, but nothing there just a plain (no pattern at all) block of metal. These are NOT Damascus steel, not even cladded but laser etched
That's not necessarily true. The blade alone might have been the only part etched revealing the pattern, or more likely the whole thing was etched but then the bolster and handle was finished afterwards. It's also possible that the bolsters are seperate, non Damascus parts. The video proves this is real pattern welded steel, not a printed pattern
Hi, sorry for the uncle google translator. Damascus steel will show itself only after acid etching, which highlights the different types and hardness of steels. Therefore, only polished damask can look like a uniform type of steel.
I don't get it. For me it looks like it's fake? The pattern disappeared after brushing it off. I have a Kai shun Damascus knife which is made out of over 30 layers. And xinzuo says they use over 70 layers too. So with this video it's clear that they are not made out of multiple layers as the pattern is just made with acid.
Non avendo il coltello davanti a se non si vede bene . Ma se fermi il video si intravedono le tracce del damasco . Dopo la levigatura e il passaggio nell'acido fosse un falso il disegno sarebbe scomparso del tutto perché stampato superficialmente , invece qui le tracce restano . Si vedono poco perché adesso il coltello va di nuovo lucidato , è la lucidatura che fa risaltare le venature. Cmq il falso sta nel fatto che li vendono come coltelli giapponesi , ma sono cinesi (non nel senso dispregiativo ma che è fatto in Cina) .
Damascus pattern always appears after the acidic bath. If you polish your Kai pattern will disappear as well. That's the point of the video... If the pattern didn't show again after the bath it would have been a fake Damascus.
Thanks. I see several videos on yt saying Chinese Damascus is fake because its cheap and that's just a lie. I did a similar test here and revealed the pattern by polishing the sides after I thinned the knife.
Xinzuo is an honest brand, the core they advise as 60 HRC matches description, good ergonomics, the edge lasts a long time and they have great quality control.
The only downside from their knives is that some models are thicker than they should be so cutting performance is good but not amazing.
They are already addressing this issue on new models.
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
all Damascus knife is fake :). Is difference between "Damascus" and "Pattern welding". In this knife's sharpness is from powder steel core, "Pattern welding" responsible for the surface (simulate Damascus surface). But it is better that laser engraved surface
@@mateczek The original damascus technique was lost so if you want to use that definition all damascus is fake. Nowadays what we call real damascus is pattern welding so this is as real as it gets.
Core being mono steel for me is a bonus because damascus can be quite unpredictable. It may help a bit or be significantly worse than a mono steel core.
@@thiago.assumpcao "The original damascus technique was lost". Bulat steel, wotz steel etc. is possible to produce steel with the characteristics of original Damascus. it's crucible steel. not layered :).
In the era of electron microscopes you can look into the structure of steel. so it's not a special secret!!!
@@mateczek Original Damascus was used in weapons so it's supposed to have decent impact resistance. Wotz steel pattern is made from bands of carbides. It sucks for impact resistance and most people don't think this is how they did it.
Fantastic test, easy en clear
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
cladding with damascus billets and core powder steel...better than classical damascus. the future is here
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
I actually have looked the back of the blade with a microscope and I was actually able to count the layers.... I'm serious... And can confirm it's a 67 layer Damascus
😅
Thank you very much for your support and your feedback. Peace, kindness and love.
I love the black edge. What acid mix did you etch it with?
ruclips.net/video/47QM7555G-g/видео.html - DIY | Etching Damascus Steel at Home | Knife Making How To / Tip
what about the 2nd knife
I have Xinzuo Damascus and had same result as he did.
There is absolutely the same steel, the difference is only in the geometry of the blade and the handle.
What Mixtur did He use in the Video?
Etching Damascus Steel at Home - ruclips.net/video/47QM7555G-g/видео.html
Polishing a knife looks like damascus
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
It says it’s 10Cr15CoMoV wIth 67 layers Damascus… Shun does it too…
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
Хотел бы поправить автора, судя по рисунку на клинке - этот нож изготовлен из ламината.
В центре - моносталь, которая находится в обкладках из дамасской стали.
БлагоДарю!🤝🏻 Очень полезный контент! 👍🏻
Большое спасибо за поддержку и ваш отзыв. Мира, добра и любви.
when looking here for hezhen damascus, i always find aliexpress nearby - so: sponsored by ali..? how come that "vg10-core" CAN NOT be seen on the back? as it can be seen on japanese knives of that kind with an inner core layer..?
I didn't understand your question.
I actually have looked the back of the blade of a shan zu 67 layers knife with a microscope and I was actually able to count the layers... And see the thicker middle layer clearly. I'm serious... And can confirm it's a 67 layer Damascus. You can't see that with bare eyes becouse it's been polished... Maybe your Japanese knife has more of a unpolished look or maybe just less layers which make it easier to see with bare eyes
Because there was a time when VG10 steel import-export from japan to china was restricted so the chinese had to make the copy of the VG10 steel. And so they did. The steel they're using is called 10Cr15CoMov and is basically the same quality as VG10, however chinese are not allowed to use the VG10 name on this composition. But you can see the difference in the composition below:
VG10:
Carbon (C) - 0,95-1,05%; Chromium (Cr) - 14,50-15,50; Molybdenum (Mo) - 0,90-1,20%; Vanadium (V) - 0,10-0,30%; Cobalt (Co) - 1,30-1,50%
10Cr15CoMov:
Chromium 14.50%-15.50% Vanadium 0.25%-0.35% Molybdenum 0.80%-1.20% Cobalt 1.30%-1.80%
@@drmarianogarau i just bought a Hezhen like in video, same - and with good light i can see clearly the inner core , thick like 0,5mm - the sharpness of that layer is very good and seems to be on a level of vg10 - in german we say: " this is almost half the rent..", means: beautiful done, highly sharp, so for that prices over here a good deal - wether it is real damast or not - what still makes me pretty much suspicous looking on amazon with almost hundreds of chinese knives(often falsly offered as japanese knives..): obviosly some a laserprintet, a few in a real stupid look ... which are the real and which are the fakes..?? normal customer wont see that, right...
@@nyitrati japanese steel was just to expensive for china - and against their business-philo being since several years now the biggest steel producer of the world - yes, they copied and do a good job with that - but with carbon steel they are still middle class and pretty far from high class japanese carbon steel of first class - they could copy that too.. but looks they dont want it, cause the market worldwide for that is not big enough - but i saw small producers workinhg like japanese with hand-forged blades, maybe they are on premium carbon steel level
Has anyone checked the damascus knives from Pintinox company? I believe it’s also Chinese
I didn't check knives from Pintinox company.
# 2 from me: i am not convinced - take a machine and polish 0,5 - 1,0mm off, then we will see....
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
The knives are 2, 2.3 -2.5 mm thick if you remove 1mm then you reach the core which is not Damascus steel as the seller of theses blades clearly say in the product description (also what is trending is not Damascus steel but mechanical essence as we call it in the origin region of that steel which I would explain later) but anyway you would reach the hard steel core in less than a millimeter which is sandwiched between only 33 layers of very thin soft mechanical essence shaped stainless steel from each side for decoration and some support to the core. Nice kitchen knives for small budget. Don’t chop bones and frozen meat.
Now, for clarity, from an Arab prospective who lived amongst sword makers and near Damascus area, The pattern on mixed types of steel blades are called mechanical essence, Damascus steel is indeed falling within these blade’s categories but with a uniqueness that it is not mechanically shaped as it is not heated and hammered layers which is mechanical but rather more molten and hammered metal recipe that only Syrian craftsmen know how to do with an inherited recipe that is now used for souvenirs only at antique shops. It is not lost as what the social media influencers promotes but the steel was only the best at a certain period of time within the mechanical steel making trend at that time, when the fighters needed the strongest lightweight blades.
Nowadays, blades are in a higher quality, we have a higher technology and knowledge and we keep improving steel blades by time and the mechanical essence varieties are improving as well but unfortunately you still call them all Damascus. I forgot to mention that the Damascus steel is very flexible compared to mechanical essence that you can bend the tip of the sword with some strength to touch the handle and comes back straight when you release it. It has less appearing patterns and is more like a molten lava pattern.
The mechanical essence steel comes in different styles by the shape of the pattern such as Turkish essence, Persian essence..etc and they are not as flexible as the Damascus steel. And the patterns are well shaped to create a controlled artistic designs for kings and was considered better blades than normal steel but not more functional in battle fields than the Damascus and indeed were more expensive for royal families.
I translated the literal meaning from Arabic “Jawhar mechaneki” “Jawhar”means the reality of the material and literally translates into essence by the translator. And the adjective to nouns are reversed in Arabic compared to English. Mechaniky is a borrowed term from Greek language which had a great influence on the middle eastern terminology.
uyyyyy siii es original, pense que era una estafa
Muchas gracias por su apoyo y comentarios. Paz, bondad y amor.
I have a question. Those two are full tang knives, means *ONE PIECE* of metal from the point, tip, blade to the butt. If this is of damascus steel the pattern should be shown even on the bolster which is at least 1" wide, but nothing there just a plain (no pattern at all) block of metal. These are NOT Damascus steel, not even cladded but laser etched
The core is made of Chinese VG10, and the pads are made of layers of steel.
That's not necessarily true. The blade alone might have been the only part etched revealing the pattern, or more likely the whole thing was etched but then the bolster and handle was finished afterwards. It's also possible that the bolsters are seperate, non Damascus parts.
The video proves this is real pattern welded steel, not a printed pattern
Hi, sorry for the uncle google translator. Damascus steel will show itself only after acid etching, which highlights the different types and hardness of steels. Therefore, only polished damask can look like a uniform type of steel.
What is he doing ?
I am checking whether the layers of steel are real or if this is a drawing.
Oh thanks for the reply now we know, so is this real ?
@@Sam_Huang87 yep
clad steel is ok today
Thank you very much for your support and feedback. Peace, goodness and love.
I don't get it. For me it looks like it's fake? The pattern disappeared after brushing it off. I have a Kai shun Damascus knife which is made out of over 30 layers. And xinzuo says they use over 70 layers too. So with this video it's clear that they are not made out of multiple layers as the pattern is just made with acid.
To get it, watch videos on how Damascus knives are made. These are real Damascus steel knives. That's what the video clearly demonstrated.
Non avendo il coltello davanti a se non si vede bene .
Ma se fermi il video si intravedono le tracce del damasco .
Dopo la levigatura e il passaggio nell'acido fosse un falso il disegno sarebbe scomparso del tutto perché stampato superficialmente , invece qui le tracce restano . Si vedono poco perché adesso il coltello va di nuovo lucidato , è la lucidatura che fa risaltare le venature. Cmq il falso sta nel fatto che li vendono come coltelli giapponesi , ma sono cinesi (non nel senso dispregiativo ma che è fatto in Cina) .
The core here is made of Chinese VG 10, and the pads are made of layers of steel
the pattern is probably made with laser
Damascus pattern always appears after the acidic bath. If you polish your Kai pattern will disappear as well. That's the point of the video... If the pattern didn't show again after the bath it would have been a fake Damascus.