Payback thrust is the Jumping thrust. First move you see in the trailer. That's from what I saw. The Shield attack seems weird. I see two versions of them. The Standing shield attack. Which I don't care for and the uppercut shield attack. Which I like a lot more. I feel like they should just remove the standing one and give up the uppercut shield attack. I like the idea of making the game more flexible and versatile but I like to see that in the button combos for the Lance. Like a Shield Bash Option when doing Dash attack would be cool. Other than that I feel like Lance is close and we will have fun. I love the instant counter shield Bash myself. Looking forward to the game. Hope to see more combos for us
Ahh that would make sense, I like that. I want to see how it works. That's true, there is two, it's abit strange some moves aren't on the sheet, not sure what's uo with that. I like you're ideas, hopefully they do us well!
@@gamecavalier3230 that’s what I’m thinking, but it looks like there are other moments where Lance also Shield Uppercuts as well. You are most likely right. The only problem is, I also like the Shield Uppercut to replace the current Shield Bash from guard or at least keep the moment Shield Bash to have a hop. As it stops your moments and that doesn't feel good.
@@czairkolmoslink5952 Well, the actual Thrust part of the Victory Thrust only happens if the shield bash connects with a Wound, did you see any times it connected with a wound but didn't use the finisher?
@@gamecavalier3230 I have seen it connect and do the thrust with out the shield charge. But you can do it with out the thrust. I kind of like to do it without having to be in focus mode. But we do need to see more info about Lance.
Some things to go over and/or clarify! = Payback Thrust is that powerful jumping upward stab attack, and is a powerful follow-up that can be combo'd into from wide variety of different attacks = Power Guard seems to be the new intended "counter stance" with the traditional input, letting players combo into a variety of different attacks depending on what the situation calls for while giving them a powerful held block on command = Being able to guard during almost any point between attacks is a major improvement, since it means we can consistently trigger a Perfect Guard between thrusts rather than needing to reset to a neutral stance = Perfect Guard's shield bash is an automatic thing that happens when you time a guard right, and you can combo into many different moves afterwards depending on what the situation calls for = The Focus Strike can't be spammed, since the initial shield uppercut needs to hit a Wound first to let you go into the rest of the Focus Strike
One thing I'm curious about is if we can rapidly tap R2 to perfect guard every hit of an attack that does multiple hits. Being able to stand in Kulve Taroth's magma breath while constantly perfect guard shield bashing her would be hilarious. As for focus strikes, the initial shield bash can... sort of be spammed, and as far as I know it does slightly more damage than the regular shield bash you get after a guard dash. The thing is if you're not hitting wounds there's no real follow-up, so yes you can keep doing that shield bash but you're not going to be doing the most damage you could be doing if you were using your actual combos.
Payback Thrust - Thanks for letting me know! Power Guard - it'll take some getting used to, we'll have to see how it goes The Focus Strike - I mean getting that initial shield uppercut won't be that hard haha, so in my mind it still is something that can be spammed, just there's a slight setup for it. Thanks for the comment.
@@Zulban48 I'm imagining that after perfect guarding you would automatically bash, then get hurt by a multihit. But for multihits you can go straight into power guard stance so we do have an option. Just not as fun as spamming perfect block
@@Sigma9870 I'm going on the assumption that the shield bash itself counts as guarding, otherwise perfectly timing a guard would result in you being punished during a multi hit and you're better off trying to guard normally. I'm also going to assume that we'd need to wait for the shield bash animation to finish before we can do another perfect block+shield bash, but it would be cool if it instantly reset into another shield bash for every perfect block you do. I wouldn't mind it if we're allowed to perfect block multi-hits by hitting the block button for each strike, but if a perfect guard is going to lead to you getting hit anyway that that just makes the counters for other weapons stronger than the 'counter weapon' since they at least get a ton of I-frames when they pull off a counter. I dunno, maybe I'm stubborn and just don't want to have to rely on power guard when that's a valid solution...
I'm pretty sure that the Perfect Guard shield bash isn't the main meat of the Perfect Guard follow up, just a automatic bonus Lance gets since every other Guard weapon also got Perfect Guard. According to the popups in the demo, the Follow Ups for Perfect Guard are Return Thrust, Payback Thrust, "Follow Up Rush", and Guard Dash.
@@NovaBushidoPayback Thrust seems like a new thing. It’s the uppercut where the hunter leaps up into the air. Could be this game’s cross slash alternative.
We do not know if its gone. Please remember not everything in on the control options and we havent got our hands on it yet. Greatsword, Hammer and Gunlance have all been shown to have way more than what the control screenshot shows
@fishnutz5196 I really hope it's still there. I was planning on going Gunlance and Lance but without Cross Sweep I'm considering the other big shield, Charge Blade
For me I don't miss that cross sweep, despite high MV it didn't feel as powerful since... It's just sweep, with a *thrust* lance, it's not really a cutting-tool, feel like scratching the monster
I'm just happy to spend time not wiffing, and more time re adjusting and changing on the move. I think it means we'll get more involved combat or to deal with monsters crowding.
9:04 The move on screen here is the Counter after Triple Poke, called "Charge Counter" from gameplay I've seen, you can charge it up like a GS (as the name implies) for stronger counters such as the one depicted in the trailer.
Always nice to see more lance discussion for wilds. I'm under the impression now that they wanted to make guard the default "counter stance", with power guard being another possibility and the 4th hit of the high thrust combo being the third option. With the later working very similarly to the old counter stance, as in you can hold and wait or release to cancel and hit. I already got the muscle memory of the old counter stance, but I'm welcoming the changes.
It's great to see you here, and you're interests, I'm always up for talking about Lance! Yea the muscle memory is with me too, suppose we'll have to adapt to it. the perfect guard will be the new counter outside of combos.
lance needs more charge hits…. its a GIANT stick its visually absurd it hits as fast as it does with pokes. I loved the triple thrust in GU glad its back.
@@NovaBushido It's not about realism not really. Maybe simply down to immersion or preference? It's a big stick made for charging attacks. The poke is my only real issue with the weapon because it seems wimpy in animations. Plus what I do like about it like the leaping thrust is hampered by the elemental system in the games. Plus I love the games. Nothing wrong with thinking about what the weapons or games could be during or between hunts. Excited for the game but not sure if I'm feeling Lance, SnS or Gunlance more this time round.
Based on the fluidity they have added to all the weapon’s movesets I do believe that mid to endgame hunts are gonna have a way tougher difficulty than monster hunter world. They also did say that MHwilds took longer to make because with all the newcomer players they were trying to understand what everyone as a whole might want to play in the next installment. With the rise in people wanting more tough games as well as monster hunter players always welcoming challenges with not much pushback, I think that’s the fair conclusion they probably came to. I personally always viewed the monster hunter franchise as one of those challenging but very fun games to play and with the added quick mount system I can imagine things being Wild af later on in the game with the mounts becoming crucial in surviving. Lance and HH gonna go crazy 😁
Appreciate the compliment, I do hope the End game will be harder than World and Rise was. Base games normally doesn't have that much of a difficult end game but it would be nice to have one. I agree with you challenge but fun is important, that's why I love games like GU, arts and styles are fun but the endgame is pretty tough. Thanks for the comment.
Good overview of the moves! Just one thing i noticed that you missed, because the developer did it *once* in all 3 streams, and no one else seems to have caught those few seconds within hours of streams 🤣 It seems after a guard dash, he was able to do a different kind of shield bash animation than the usual one. He then followed it up with a second shield bash. I'm not sure how the hell you do this move, nor if it can lead into a third bash, but we wont know until a public demo now! I have a feeling it may have replaced the useless single poke from behind the shield, rather than it being related to a guard dash. It's hard to tell from the button prompts. Check it out at 44:13 on the Third developer dev stream!
Haha did it once huh, very nice of them :P. Thanks for that, just checked out the video again, very interesting... I'm not sure that use this will have apart from maybe good stun damage. Suppose we'll see how it is, in game!
@@NovaBushido I'll take every new opportunity to use the shield offensively! I loved the shield attacks in Rise, so more opportunities for KO damage is going to potentially make Lance even more versatile!
does blunt damage to certain areas apply some exaust damag? using the shield attack when you block is like free exaust when its something not tied to the head
Given the incredible buffs they've given to all other weapons so far, if they've truly removed counter stance or any raw counter input I sadly don't think I'll be playing the lance much in Wilds :( Perfect parrying just isn't the same. Unless they significantly buff the dmg on the lance because as of now one gunlance full burst does the dmg of 2 full 4 hit lance combos lol. Every other weapon will catch up to the lance in terms of offensive up time - with the quicker guard windows on half the weapons and adding perfect dodging on the others. On top of that we lose our easiest defensive tool/counter in the counter stance....doesn't seem very fair to the least played weapon in the series....what are these des thinking (game looks amazing im just so confused about this one weapon)
@@lewangg The old counter is now a 4th hit option after the 3 poke chain. Instead, you can now counter after every regular or perfect guard, it's not limited to perfect guards. It'll play functionally almost the same for countering, but we'll all have to get muscle memory for not using counter stance to counter, and instead just blocking. It'll be a weird change but Lance looks improved to me, the removal of counter stance from blocking doesn't really mean anything negative
It's true that are catching up to us with offensive/defensive gameplay, we need more still to make up for it. But I'm willing to wait and see, I've talked so much about Lance I want to do it again but I think i'll need to give it sometime on some of what you lance makes have as concerns.
@@TheRealCurrants youre right about everything you say but still disagree about "improved". having access to counter raw vs 3rd or 4th move of a combo or requiring a perfect block is definitely adding a bigger "skill" element to the weapon with none of the upside in terms of massive dmg or unique moves that weren't already in other MH games and in terms of weapon flow, i can understand why devs would hate that counter stance invalidates a lot of attacks and is a bonafide crutch but when CB, GL, GS and even bloody SnS have access to the same perfect parry mechanic....what have we really gained aside from a 4th move to our combo with a triple uppercut? I'm just being a little pessimistic but ill still give the weapon a shot and see how it feels in wilds.
when it comes to cancelling out of abilities, its obviously impossible to say for certain atm. but theoretically cancelling out of attacks opens up the possibility for capcom to greatly increase monster aggression, shifting the gameplay from a methodical prediction combat style, to a faster reactive combat style where you play as aggro as possible, cancelling into defensive moves where necessary
That's true, they'll have to be agressive, I dont' know if you played Sunbreak but monsters in that game were hyper aggressive near end game. Some people don't like that but I like aggression, keeps you on your toes!
@@NovaBushido I did indeed, which is why i am so confident in my assessment that cancelling out of abilities opens up the possibility for greater aggression, after all in that game you can cancel out of a lot of animations into some form of defence ability on most if not all ( i have not used every weapon ) weapons
personally am a hunting horn main but tbh i might pick lance as my secondary since hh only has offset melodies on some horns as its special performance so lance would be my go to power clash / counter weapon do lances sever ?
Lances can sever tails yes, I think that's what you're asking right? Glad to see you're interested in lance, will be great to have you in the lance army! I also play HH I've made videos on the weapon infact.
I know I'm a little late to the table having started with World, but as a PC player I couldn't get in much sooner. As a lance main though, I'm feeling very pessimistic about this iteration of lance, with more and more weapons getting counter mechanics and reduced windows of uptime, it feels like some identity and what little utility lance had is being lost. Counterstance - poke poke poke is just as easy as iai slash - helmsplitter, when iai restores gauge. Removing counterstance means there's no way to combo back into defence after an attack, only wait for the attack animation's recovery to get back into blocking. Using powerguard, you could rotate 360 degrees anyway, and could float around with guard dash and leaping thrust for very flexable mobility, giving that to everybody with the new movement system feels a little like being an SnS main watching everybody be given the ability to use potions with their weapons drawn. I get that more freedom of mobility and turn radius is quality of life that other weapons previously haven't enjoyed and could be fun for the game, but it was a feature of the lance that is no longer a feature of the lance. They kept the dual blades wheel of death along the spine with the claw, but they didn't keep a version of the claw counter? Why? It didn't have to tender or anything, just do damage and look flashy. The absolute minimum they could do is bring the DPS in line with other top weapons like GS, dual blades and longsword, with motion values. If not in poke poke poke, then in the form of very high damage counters. Possibly by pinpointing these new weak spots, with the lance's accuracy. From a more personal standpoint I didn't really end up enjoying instaguard in Rise, I hope there's an alternative and it's not just simply forced in.
Hey all, hope you enjoy the video, how do you think the lance will play in MHWilds?! If you're interested in any other Lance videos Check out this playlist: ruclips.net/p/PLOzwv_YRhoLD4X49_u2ydoO-JR5IfgeB-
This looks interesting. It hope these changes don't disrupt the three-poke rhythm too much, but I can only hope until I get my hands on this game. Also, RIP counter, you will always be better than perfect guard in my book.
Lance looks fun as always, but man I'm afraid what they're doing to other weapons will rob it of its identity. There's more and more counters in the game now, and they're giving every weapon more versatility in terms of repositioning while attacking or even mid combo, which is the whole thing that makes Lance unique. If everyone can do it, what's the point of using the slow poking weapon?
I think it's just the popular design philosophy right now. Sekiro got everyone hooked on perfect parries and unlimited uptime, and now they're all on a quest for the most streamlined combat possible. Capcom seems to be pushing more and more of the MH weapons in that direction, which players seem to appreciate, at least for now. And for the record, I still think Wilds will be fun. But I definitely share your concern about certain weapons losing their identity, and I can only wonder if or when we'll ever return to the more ponderous and deliberate style of the older games.
Yea that's an issue I've had, and talked about a lot. They're adding what makes Lance special to other weapons, but we don't get what other weapons do, so in terms we're just losing out our uniqueness. It's sad.
Please tell me we don't have that awful clutch claw move from World... I love block counters, just not "that". Had it good on Fatalis until phase 3 before his shots can kill me while blocking.
Oh, a leaping thrust nerf. I suppose that's totally justifiable since the lance is clearly overused, how dare a whole 3% of players use it in Sunbreak. Unless they drastically increase Lance's damage elsewhere, then it's safe to say that Capcom's going for that 2% usage rate this time.
Lance is one of the weapons that they absolutely cannot change how it fundamentally works or else they will break it. Just making the third attack have a slightly longer animation in Generations made that style of lance less appealing than the traditional style. Making the wide swipe be a charge-up attack that does more damage than pokes like in Rise just feels wrong. ... That was what I thought before the Lance showcase. After seeing that and various gameplay I must say... the developers have SOMEHOW managed to fundamentally change the way Lance does counter attacks, AND how lance resets after a 3 strike combo, AND they made the third strike of the combo have a different animation than the other 2 pokes, yet SOMEHOW they made it even better than old school style of lance. Once upon a time you did R2+circle to initiate a counter stance. That is GONE. Now ANY TIME your shield gets hit while holding R2 (or I guess while power guarding) you can immediately do a counter attack by using one of the attack buttons, and on top of that you are rewarded for perfect blocks even before accounting for things like Offensive Guard. If they make perfect blocks effectively give you extra points in Guard skill then it may be possible for good Lancers to forego that skill entirely in favor of somewhat riskier play with perfect blocks and having more room for other skills in their build. Not only that, it seems they have added a really cool counter attack (Payback Thrust) by holding circle after a block instead of tapping it, putting you into a power stance of some sort with your hunter glowing orange. It looks like if you perfectly time the release of this attack with a monster's attack then you will block it and do a really cool two-hit counter thrust as seen in the weapon demonstration video (you even show it at 9:04 so you were correct in your assumption). The new infinite combo with the fourth attack input from a 3 hit combo is pretty nice. You used to have to hop to reset or use a counter-cancel thrust to reset the combo and it was kind've awkward but just part of the rhythm. Now with the fourth input you have the option of doing a higher damage upper thrust, or doing a quick 3-poke attack which can be animation cancelled into a block which is pretty huge since up until now the only 'animation cancelling' we had was cancelling the recovery animation from attacks by using hops or other attacks. Oh yes, and since there's no recovery animation this is now an infinite combo (unsure if the same is true for the circle attack but it is with the triangle attack). One of the only things I'm not so fond of is that triangle+circle from idle is a leaping thrust instead of a wide sweep. I would use wide sweeps to hit teammates out of stuns and for clearing groups of small monsters, but now you can only do that after another attack. I didn't use leaping thrusts much in World, generally preferring the shield bash because then I can do a full 3 poke combo (plus the shield bash) which I'm pretty sure did more damage than a leaping thrust's 3 hits plus two more pokes while not eating sharpness as much, but I guess that's just me. Leaping thrust does have Mind's Eye which is pretty neat, unless they've removed that in Wilds. As for Wide Sweep's more vertical animation, you'd be surprised how high the wide sweep hits near the end of the animation in older games, I've cut tails using it before. I mostly only used it when a monster blows past me and I still feel like getting one attack in before changing direction.
Hmm I get you on your first point of Generations changes, but the Rise charge thing I don't really see an issue with that, it just mixes up the play but it's still overall similar in how the weapon plays. Instead what we used to have was a move that was never used, I prefer it being useful in some way than not useful at all. Allowing us to auto cancel is a huge thing for sure, gives us chance to do more damage, yet also freedom to move. You really put in a lot of thought on how lance will work in tandem with these new changes, compared to the past I love it.
A charged wide sweep does almost the same dps as 3 pokes, everything equal. It's great as a combo finisher, like following two pokes when you have the opening or for waking up the monster. The clear advantage of poking instead of wide sweeping is that you can quickly shift into blocking or dodging instead of being stuck in an animation like you are during a wide sweep. The most stupid thing they can do with the wide sweep is to bring it back to the world version. The move was virtually useless there, i am hoping that they atleast changed the motion value.
@@NovaBushidoMotion value doesn't have anything to do with speed, not inherently at least. Though it does make the original comment quite silly when you do know what motion value is, because they essentially said "it does more damage because it does more damage" lol
Haha I need to refresh myself on motion values, I haven't had to think about that since the days of 3U and looking up tips on Gamefaqs. Thanks for letting me know.
Brother, Monster Hunter isn’t dark souls and Capcom knows that, plus you still need the skill to know when to cancel attacks so I see cancelable moves as more skill expression
It isn't dark souls it's monster hunter, so I compare it to Monster Hunter which didn't have chancelling like this in 4th gen previous. But I do get what you mean.
I don't care. It's "hype train season" and until we have the MVs everything means nothing. Just comparing the weapon damage from the demo gameplay I think lance is pretty bad. we all know how it goes. We'll be set on slotting in to have our shit work while other weapons that already have more damage just slot damage. As we all know the moment anyone exposes any concerns they get whacked cause people are just like this. I'm not pessimistic. This is how lance has always been. Every Shield got the perfect Guard Mechanic so that's one more thing we share with other weapons. Until we know if we just never had a decent Lance gameplay recorded up to now or if the MVs are dog water like they have always been, I don't care if it is more comfortable to be weak. I see a lot of effort and long animations dealing low single digits. While I see other weapons doing multiple low single digits in the same time or less and bigger numbers too. What was the biggest damage number we saw for every weapon? We never get to 20 on doshaguma with the lance's normal moves and this is actual concern. Every weapon has achieved similar to lance's uptime while some even surpassed it far long ago with zero investment requirements. We need damage and only damage from here on. I don't want our entire gameplay be around a single good option.
I wasn't talking about Weapon Damage in the video apart from comparing mid and high thrust. I can't say anything about the damage or the balance of the weapon yet since as you said we can't know. But what I can talk about is the move set and it's looking good. Lance damage has always been lacking sadly, but in GU it actually was pretty damn strong. I hope they give us more damage in our kit thought. You're right the perfect guard mechanic means lance's guards and counters aren't special anymore. I've talked about this in many lance videos, and it's a shame, I'll leave it at that for now. When the demo comes out and we know more, if lance is truly shafted, I'll blast Capcom for basically pushing it's mechanic onto everything else and not giving us enough. I feel for now I've already beaten that horse enough. I hope this message at least gives you something to hold onto, hold me to my promises. Come back around the demo period, and we can roast Capcom together if they fail us once again.
@@NovaBushido I don't look at it that pessimistic. While other weapons might get perfect blocks the Lance shield remains the strongest shield in the game. Which means they can perfect block some attacks while Lance can block 95 % of attacks in the game with less push back. As for the counter after a block, it should remain the fastest for the Lance and i am fine with everything else.
They already removed leaping thrust and wide sweep, even cross sweep looks like it's gone. Not even sure that focus strike is any good, things aren't looking good. Doesn't help lance doesn't seem like it has any of the usual defensive skills baked in, still gonna need guard up and all the usually utility skills from the looks of it
Strongest weapon in GU, very good in 3U, middle of the pack in Sunbreak, what are you on about? Lance has only been bad, numerically speaking, in World/IB, and might be bad again in Wilds, but it's been great quite often and might easily get good again in future installments xd
Payback thrust is the Jumping thrust. First move you see in the trailer. That's from what I saw.
The Shield attack seems weird. I see two versions of them. The Standing shield attack. Which I don't care for and the uppercut shield attack. Which I like a lot more. I feel like they should just remove the standing one and give up the uppercut shield attack.
I like the idea of making the game more flexible and versatile but I like to see that in the button combos for the Lance. Like a Shield Bash Option when doing Dash attack would be cool. Other than that I feel like Lance is close and we will have fun. I love the instant counter shield Bash myself.
Looking forward to the game. Hope to see more combos for us
Ahh that would make sense, I like that. I want to see how it works.
That's true, there is two, it's abit strange some moves aren't on the sheet, not sure what's uo with that.
I like you're ideas, hopefully they do us well!
Isn't the uppercut shield bash the Focus Victory Thrust Starter?
@@gamecavalier3230 that’s what I’m thinking, but it looks like there are other moments where Lance also Shield Uppercuts as well. You are most likely right.
The only problem is, I also like the Shield Uppercut to replace the current Shield Bash from guard or at least keep the moment Shield Bash to have a hop. As it stops your moments and that doesn't feel good.
@@czairkolmoslink5952 Well, the actual Thrust part of the Victory Thrust only happens if the shield bash connects with a Wound, did you see any times it connected with a wound but didn't use the finisher?
@@gamecavalier3230 I have seen it connect and do the thrust with out the shield charge. But you can do it with out the thrust. I kind of like to do it without having to be in focus mode. But we do need to see more info about Lance.
Some things to go over and/or clarify!
= Payback Thrust is that powerful jumping upward stab attack, and is a powerful follow-up that can be combo'd into from wide variety of different attacks
= Power Guard seems to be the new intended "counter stance" with the traditional input, letting players combo into a variety of different attacks depending on what the situation calls for while giving them a powerful held block on command
= Being able to guard during almost any point between attacks is a major improvement, since it means we can consistently trigger a Perfect Guard between thrusts rather than needing to reset to a neutral stance
= Perfect Guard's shield bash is an automatic thing that happens when you time a guard right, and you can combo into many different moves afterwards depending on what the situation calls for
= The Focus Strike can't be spammed, since the initial shield uppercut needs to hit a Wound first to let you go into the rest of the Focus Strike
Re: payback thrust, it's available after a perfect guard so you can think of the shield bash + payback thrust as the replacement for cross sweep
One thing I'm curious about is if we can rapidly tap R2 to perfect guard every hit of an attack that does multiple hits. Being able to stand in Kulve Taroth's magma breath while constantly perfect guard shield bashing her would be hilarious.
As for focus strikes, the initial shield bash can... sort of be spammed, and as far as I know it does slightly more damage than the regular shield bash you get after a guard dash. The thing is if you're not hitting wounds there's no real follow-up, so yes you can keep doing that shield bash but you're not going to be doing the most damage you could be doing if you were using your actual combos.
Payback Thrust - Thanks for letting me know!
Power Guard - it'll take some getting used to, we'll have to see how it goes
The Focus Strike - I mean getting that initial shield uppercut won't be that hard haha, so in my mind it still is something that can be spammed, just there's a slight setup for it.
Thanks for the comment.
@@Zulban48 I'm imagining that after perfect guarding you would automatically bash, then get hurt by a multihit. But for multihits you can go straight into power guard stance so we do have an option. Just not as fun as spamming perfect block
@@Sigma9870 I'm going on the assumption that the shield bash itself counts as guarding, otherwise perfectly timing a guard would result in you being punished during a multi hit and you're better off trying to guard normally. I'm also going to assume that we'd need to wait for the shield bash animation to finish before we can do another perfect block+shield bash, but it would be cool if it instantly reset into another shield bash for every perfect block you do.
I wouldn't mind it if we're allowed to perfect block multi-hits by hitting the block button for each strike, but if a perfect guard is going to lead to you getting hit anyway that that just makes the counters for other weapons stronger than the 'counter weapon' since they at least get a ton of I-frames when they pull off a counter.
I dunno, maybe I'm stubborn and just don't want to have to rely on power guard when that's a valid solution...
I'm pretty sure that the Perfect Guard shield bash isn't the main meat of the Perfect Guard follow up, just a automatic bonus Lance gets since every other Guard weapon also got Perfect Guard. According to the popups in the demo, the Follow Ups for Perfect Guard are Return Thrust, Payback Thrust, "Follow Up Rush", and Guard Dash.
Yea seems that way, so you can follow into almost any move the lance has.
@@NovaBushidoPayback Thrust seems like a new thing. It’s the uppercut where the hunter leaps up into the air. Could be this game’s cross slash alternative.
I'm honestly really sad Cross Sweep is gone after the perfect Guard...it gave us a powerful option after a guard...
We do not know if its gone. Please remember not everything in on the control options and we havent got our hands on it yet. Greatsword, Hammer and Gunlance have all been shown to have way more than what the control screenshot shows
@fishnutz5196 I really hope it's still there. I was planning on going Gunlance and Lance but without Cross Sweep I'm considering the other big shield, Charge Blade
It would be a shame if it was gone, but as @fishnutz5196 (great name btw) said, let's wait and see on that one.
For me I don't miss that cross sweep, despite high MV it didn't feel as powerful since... It's just sweep, with a *thrust* lance, it's not really a cutting-tool, feel like scratching the monster
I enjoyed world more than rise , yes love all mh games , but I really really loved risebreak lance it was so fun
I'm just happy to spend time not wiffing, and more time re adjusting and changing on the move. I think it means we'll get more involved combat or to deal with monsters crowding.
That excites me as well.
Brothers I will be your shield, and you my blade, for I am the wall that collided with the beasts
Thank you my brother in arms, may the holy lance guide your way.
9:04 The move on screen here is the Counter after Triple Poke, called "Charge Counter" from gameplay I've seen, you can charge it up like a GS (as the name implies) for stronger counters such as the one depicted in the trailer.
Yea that's true actually, I wonder how much stronger it'll actually be.
Always nice to see more lance discussion for wilds. I'm under the impression now that they wanted to make guard the default "counter stance", with power guard being another possibility and the 4th hit of the high thrust combo being the third option. With the later working very similarly to the old counter stance, as in you can hold and wait or release to cancel and hit. I already got the muscle memory of the old counter stance, but I'm welcoming the changes.
It's great to see you here, and you're interests, I'm always up for talking about Lance! Yea the muscle memory is with me too, suppose we'll have to adapt to it. the perfect guard will be the new counter outside of combos.
lance needs more charge hits…. its a GIANT stick its visually absurd it hits as fast as it does with pokes.
I loved the triple thrust in GU glad its back.
Good point, although MH isn't built to be realistic haha, so I wouldn't take it so deeply.
@@NovaBushido It's not about realism not really. Maybe simply down to immersion or preference?
It's a big stick made for charging attacks. The poke is my only real issue with the weapon because it seems wimpy in animations. Plus what I do like about it like the leaping thrust is hampered by the elemental system in the games.
Plus I love the games. Nothing wrong with thinking about what the weapons or games could be during or between hunts.
Excited for the game but not sure if I'm feeling Lance, SnS or Gunlance more this time round.
Based on the fluidity they have added to all the weapon’s movesets I do believe that mid to endgame hunts are gonna have a way tougher difficulty than monster hunter world. They also did say that MHwilds took longer to make because with all the newcomer players they were trying to understand what everyone as a whole might want to play in the next installment. With the rise in people wanting more tough games as well as monster hunter players always welcoming challenges with not much pushback, I think that’s the fair conclusion they probably came to. I personally always viewed the monster hunter franchise as one of those challenging but very fun games to play and with the added quick mount system I can imagine things being Wild af later on in the game with the mounts becoming crucial in surviving. Lance and HH gonna go crazy 😁
Appreciate the compliment, I do hope the End game will be harder than World and Rise was. Base games normally doesn't have that much of a difficult end game but it would be nice to have one.
I agree with you challenge but fun is important, that's why I love games like GU, arts and styles are fun but the endgame is pretty tough. Thanks for the comment.
Good overview of the moves! Just one thing i noticed that you missed, because the developer did it *once* in all 3 streams, and no one else seems to have caught those few seconds within hours of streams 🤣
It seems after a guard dash, he was able to do a different kind of shield bash animation than the usual one. He then followed it up with a second shield bash. I'm not sure how the hell you do this move, nor if it can lead into a third bash, but we wont know until a public demo now!
I have a feeling it may have replaced the useless single poke from behind the shield, rather than it being related to a guard dash. It's hard to tell from the button prompts.
Check it out at 44:13 on the Third developer dev stream!
Haha did it once huh, very nice of them :P. Thanks for that, just checked out the video again, very interesting... I'm not sure that use this will have apart from maybe good stun damage. Suppose we'll see how it is, in game!
@@NovaBushido I'll take every new opportunity to use the shield offensively! I loved the shield attacks in Rise, so more opportunities for KO damage is going to potentially make Lance even more versatile!
does blunt damage to certain areas apply some exaust damag? using the shield attack when you block is like free exaust when its something not tied to the head
Using a shield attack on the body also build up exhaust yea! all blunt attacks (as far as I know) work the same in all use cases.
Given the incredible buffs they've given to all other weapons so far, if they've truly removed counter stance or any raw counter input I sadly don't think I'll be playing the lance much in Wilds :( Perfect parrying just isn't the same. Unless they significantly buff the dmg on the lance because as of now one gunlance full burst does the dmg of 2 full 4 hit lance combos lol.
Every other weapon will catch up to the lance in terms of offensive up time - with the quicker guard windows on half the weapons and adding perfect dodging on the others. On top of that we lose our easiest defensive tool/counter in the counter stance....doesn't seem very fair to the least played weapon in the series....what are these des thinking (game looks amazing im just so confused about this one weapon)
@@lewangg The old counter is now a 4th hit option after the 3 poke chain.
Instead, you can now counter after every regular or perfect guard, it's not limited to perfect guards.
It'll play functionally almost the same for countering, but we'll all have to get muscle memory for not using counter stance to counter, and instead just blocking.
It'll be a weird change but Lance looks improved to me, the removal of counter stance from blocking doesn't really mean anything negative
It's true that are catching up to us with offensive/defensive gameplay, we need more still to make up for it. But I'm willing to wait and see, I've talked so much about Lance I want to do it again but I think i'll need to give it sometime on some of what you lance makes have as concerns.
@@TheRealCurrants youre right about everything you say but still disagree about "improved". having access to counter raw vs 3rd or 4th move of a combo or requiring a perfect block is definitely adding a bigger "skill" element to the weapon with none of the upside in terms of massive dmg or unique moves that weren't already in other MH games
and in terms of weapon flow, i can understand why devs would hate that counter stance invalidates a lot of attacks and is a bonafide crutch but when CB, GL, GS and even bloody SnS have access to the same perfect parry mechanic....what have we really gained aside from a 4th move to our combo with a triple uppercut? I'm just being a little pessimistic but ill still give the weapon a shot and see how it feels in wilds.
when it comes to cancelling out of abilities, its obviously impossible to say for certain atm. but theoretically cancelling out of attacks opens up the possibility for capcom to greatly increase monster aggression, shifting the gameplay from a methodical prediction combat style, to a faster reactive combat style where you play as aggro as possible, cancelling into defensive moves where necessary
That's true, they'll have to be agressive, I dont' know if you played Sunbreak but monsters in that game were hyper aggressive near end game. Some people don't like that but I like aggression, keeps you on your toes!
@@NovaBushido I did indeed, which is why i am so confident in my assessment that cancelling out of abilities opens up the possibility for greater aggression, after all in that game you can cancel out of a lot of animations into some form of defence ability on most if not all ( i have not used every weapon ) weapons
lance makes my lance unsheath
😉 damn right it does.
personally am a hunting horn main but tbh i might pick lance as my secondary since hh only has offset melodies on some horns as its special performance
so lance would be my go to power clash / counter weapon
do lances sever ?
Lances can sever tails yes, I think that's what you're asking right?
Glad to see you're interested in lance, will be great to have you in the lance army! I also play HH I've made videos on the weapon infact.
I know I'm a little late to the table having started with World, but as a PC player I couldn't get in much sooner. As a lance main though, I'm feeling very pessimistic about this iteration of lance, with more and more weapons getting counter mechanics and reduced windows of uptime, it feels like some identity and what little utility lance had is being lost.
Counterstance - poke poke poke is just as easy as iai slash - helmsplitter, when iai restores gauge.
Removing counterstance means there's no way to combo back into defence after an attack, only wait for the attack animation's recovery to get back into blocking.
Using powerguard, you could rotate 360 degrees anyway, and could float around with guard dash and leaping thrust for very flexable mobility, giving that to everybody with the new movement system feels a little like being an SnS main watching everybody be given the ability to use potions with their weapons drawn.
I get that more freedom of mobility and turn radius is quality of life that other weapons previously haven't enjoyed and could be fun for the game, but it was a feature of the lance that is no longer a feature of the lance.
They kept the dual blades wheel of death along the spine with the claw, but they didn't keep a version of the claw counter? Why? It didn't have to tender or anything, just do damage and look flashy.
The absolute minimum they could do is bring the DPS in line with other top weapons like GS, dual blades and longsword, with motion values. If not in poke poke poke, then in the form of very high damage counters. Possibly by pinpointing these new weak spots, with the lance's accuracy.
From a more personal standpoint I didn't really end up enjoying instaguard in Rise, I hope there's an alternative and it's not just simply forced in.
How did you find the movesets for the weapons?
(also great video!!)
I got sent it to me in my discord, but it's also online on reddit. I'll put the link in the description of the video
@@NovaBushido tysm!!!! 🙏
I do what I can for my bros.
As a gunlance player, I’m going to miss flying on my gunlance like I could in MHGU and Rise. I was hopeful like crazy it would be in Wilds 😢
I'll miss it to, was a lot of fun in GU and Rise :/, but I suppose we'll get used to it.
Hey all, hope you enjoy the video, how do you think the lance will play in MHWilds?!
If you're interested in any other Lance videos Check out this playlist: ruclips.net/p/PLOzwv_YRhoLD4X49_u2ydoO-JR5IfgeB-
It will play like ass as always
@@anthonymorales7487 Still better than IG
Its looking great
Thanks HFS!
I always assumed the High Thrusts did more damage to incentivise attack a monster's underbelly.
That would be interesting, but that's more linked to hitzones rather than the fought of an underbelly, if you get what I mean.
This looks interesting. It hope these changes don't disrupt the three-poke rhythm too much, but I can only hope until I get my hands on this game. Also, RIP counter, you will always be better than perfect guard in my book.
Indeed, we'll truly know when we play around in the demo, can't wait for that.
Lance looks fun as always, but man I'm afraid what they're doing to other weapons will rob it of its identity. There's more and more counters in the game now, and they're giving every weapon more versatility in terms of repositioning while attacking or even mid combo, which is the whole thing that makes Lance unique. If everyone can do it, what's the point of using the slow poking weapon?
I think it's just the popular design philosophy right now. Sekiro got everyone hooked on perfect parries and unlimited uptime, and now they're all on a quest for the most streamlined combat possible. Capcom seems to be pushing more and more of the MH weapons in that direction, which players seem to appreciate, at least for now. And for the record, I still think Wilds will be fun. But I definitely share your concern about certain weapons losing their identity, and I can only wonder if or when we'll ever return to the more ponderous and deliberate style of the older games.
Yea that's an issue I've had, and talked about a lot. They're adding what makes Lance special to other weapons, but we don't get what other weapons do, so in terms we're just losing out our uniqueness. It's sad.
if it made you feel better, at least you're not an IG main in this generation
Please tell me we don't have that awful clutch claw move from World... I love block counters, just not "that". Had it good on Fatalis until phase 3 before his shots can kill me while blocking.
I don't think we have any clutch claw related moves in Wilds for lance which is good, so don't have to worry :).
Oh, a leaping thrust nerf. I suppose that's totally justifiable since the lance is clearly overused, how dare a whole 3% of players use it in Sunbreak. Unless they drastically increase Lance's damage elsewhere, then it's safe to say that Capcom's going for that 2% usage rate this time.
Looool true, i mean tbh I can't be mad it was nerfed but we finally got something super strong, felt nice.
Vince McMahon memes never get old 😂😂
I'll use them till I die 😂
THE WALL💪💪💪
BRICK WALL
Lance is one of the weapons that they absolutely cannot change how it fundamentally works or else they will break it. Just making the third attack have a slightly longer animation in Generations made that style of lance less appealing than the traditional style. Making the wide swipe be a charge-up attack that does more damage than pokes like in Rise just feels wrong.
... That was what I thought before the Lance showcase. After seeing that and various gameplay I must say... the developers have SOMEHOW managed to fundamentally change the way Lance does counter attacks, AND how lance resets after a 3 strike combo, AND they made the third strike of the combo have a different animation than the other 2 pokes, yet SOMEHOW they made it even better than old school style of lance.
Once upon a time you did R2+circle to initiate a counter stance. That is GONE. Now ANY TIME your shield gets hit while holding R2 (or I guess while power guarding) you can immediately do a counter attack by using one of the attack buttons, and on top of that you are rewarded for perfect blocks even before accounting for things like Offensive Guard. If they make perfect blocks effectively give you extra points in Guard skill then it may be possible for good Lancers to forego that skill entirely in favor of somewhat riskier play with perfect blocks and having more room for other skills in their build.
Not only that, it seems they have added a really cool counter attack (Payback Thrust) by holding circle after a block instead of tapping it, putting you into a power stance of some sort with your hunter glowing orange. It looks like if you perfectly time the release of this attack with a monster's attack then you will block it and do a really cool two-hit counter thrust as seen in the weapon demonstration video (you even show it at 9:04 so you were correct in your assumption).
The new infinite combo with the fourth attack input from a 3 hit combo is pretty nice. You used to have to hop to reset or use a counter-cancel thrust to reset the combo and it was kind've awkward but just part of the rhythm. Now with the fourth input you have the option of doing a higher damage upper thrust, or doing a quick 3-poke attack which can be animation cancelled into a block which is pretty huge since up until now the only 'animation cancelling' we had was cancelling the recovery animation from attacks by using hops or other attacks. Oh yes, and since there's no recovery animation this is now an infinite combo (unsure if the same is true for the circle attack but it is with the triangle attack).
One of the only things I'm not so fond of is that triangle+circle from idle is a leaping thrust instead of a wide sweep. I would use wide sweeps to hit teammates out of stuns and for clearing groups of small monsters, but now you can only do that after another attack. I didn't use leaping thrusts much in World, generally preferring the shield bash because then I can do a full 3 poke combo (plus the shield bash) which I'm pretty sure did more damage than a leaping thrust's 3 hits plus two more pokes while not eating sharpness as much, but I guess that's just me. Leaping thrust does have Mind's Eye which is pretty neat, unless they've removed that in Wilds. As for Wide Sweep's more vertical animation, you'd be surprised how high the wide sweep hits near the end of the animation in older games, I've cut tails using it before. I mostly only used it when a monster blows past me and I still feel like getting one attack in before changing direction.
Hmm I get you on your first point of Generations changes, but the Rise charge thing I don't really see an issue with that, it just mixes up the play but it's still overall similar in how the weapon plays. Instead what we used to have was a move that was never used, I prefer it being useful in some way than not useful at all.
Allowing us to auto cancel is a huge thing for sure, gives us chance to do more damage, yet also freedom to move.
You really put in a lot of thought on how lance will work in tandem with these new changes, compared to the past I love it.
A charged wide sweep does almost the same dps as 3 pokes, everything equal. It's great as a combo finisher, like following two pokes when you have the opening or for waking up the monster. The clear advantage of poking instead of wide sweeping is that you can quickly shift into blocking or dodging instead of being stuck in an animation like you are during a wide sweep. The most stupid thing they can do with the wide sweep is to bring it back to the world version. The move was virtually useless there, i am hoping that they atleast changed the motion value.
where shield dash? as much as i want the normal dash i think shield dash is more superior
Shield dashing is still there, maybe i'm mis-understanding you.
@@NovaBushido Is it in wilds? never saw it in any gameplay... (what i meant of shield dash is the one that they add in generation and rise.)
Nice leaping thurst and widesweep nerf
Leaping thrust does need a nerf haha, widesweep... not so much, I liked it being somewhat useful.
ive seen a video where someone said high thrust does more damage because it has more motion value
Hmm I'm not sure if it is slower. I think they have the same speed. Also the mid thrust final attack has the same speed, but it does more damage.
@@NovaBushidoMotion value doesn't have anything to do with speed, not inherently at least.
Though it does make the original comment quite silly when you do know what motion value is, because they essentially said "it does more damage because it does more damage" lol
Haha I need to refresh myself on motion values, I haven't had to think about that since the days of 3U and looking up tips on Gamefaqs. Thanks for letting me know.
Brother, Monster Hunter isn’t dark souls and Capcom knows that, plus you still need the skill to know when to cancel attacks so I see cancelable moves as more skill expression
It isn't dark souls it's monster hunter, so I compare it to Monster Hunter which didn't have chancelling like this in 4th gen previous. But I do get what you mean.
Please never use the phrase “simultaneously erected” again,,,, pleas,,,,,,
@@Arc-ug7dc I'll use it in every video from now on
I don't care. It's "hype train season" and until we have the MVs everything means nothing. Just comparing the weapon damage from the demo gameplay I think lance is pretty bad. we all know how it goes. We'll be set on slotting in to have our shit work while other weapons that already have more damage just slot damage. As we all know the moment anyone exposes any concerns they get whacked cause people are just like this. I'm not pessimistic. This is how lance has always been. Every Shield got the perfect Guard Mechanic so that's one more thing we share with other weapons. Until we know if we just never had a decent Lance gameplay recorded up to now or if the MVs are dog water like they have always been, I don't care if it is more comfortable to be weak.
I see a lot of effort and long animations dealing low single digits.
While I see other weapons doing multiple low single digits in the same time or less and bigger numbers too.
What was the biggest damage number we saw for every weapon? We never get to 20 on doshaguma with the lance's normal moves and this is actual concern.
Every weapon has achieved similar to lance's uptime while some even surpassed it far long ago with zero investment requirements. We need damage and only damage from here on. I don't want our entire gameplay be around a single good option.
I wasn't talking about Weapon Damage in the video apart from comparing mid and high thrust. I can't say anything about the damage or the balance of the weapon yet since as you said we can't know. But what I can talk about is the move set and it's looking good. Lance damage has always been lacking sadly, but in GU it actually was pretty damn strong. I hope they give us more damage in our kit thought.
You're right the perfect guard mechanic means lance's guards and counters aren't special anymore. I've talked about this in many lance videos, and it's a shame, I'll leave it at that for now. When the demo comes out and we know more, if lance is truly shafted, I'll blast Capcom for basically pushing it's mechanic onto everything else and not giving us enough. I feel for now I've already beaten that horse enough.
I hope this message at least gives you something to hold onto, hold me to my promises. Come back around the demo period, and we can roast Capcom together if they fail us once again.
@@NovaBushido I don't look at it that pessimistic. While other weapons might get perfect blocks the Lance shield remains the strongest shield in the game. Which means they can perfect block some attacks while Lance can block 95 % of attacks in the game with less push back. As for the counter after a block, it should remain the fastest for the Lance and i am fine with everything else.
They already removed leaping thrust and wide sweep, even cross sweep looks like it's gone. Not even sure that focus strike is any good, things aren't looking good.
Doesn't help lance doesn't seem like it has any of the usual defensive skills baked in, still gonna need guard up and all the usually utility skills from the looks of it
Sorry, I meant to say they already nerfed leaping thrust and wide sweep
Literally the only thing damage does is finish the hunt faster.
Do you want to spend less time hunting monsters in your monster hunting game?
lance is trash and will be trash for ever EVER
@@1234numbers yo, we fighting, meet me world 244, north edgeville.
Strongest weapon in GU, very good in 3U, middle of the pack in Sunbreak, what are you on about? Lance has only been bad, numerically speaking, in World/IB, and might be bad again in Wilds, but it's been great quite often and might easily get good again in future installments xd
@@Raisera for ever trash