The NEW best way to Level your Resin 3D Printer?!?!
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
- Is this really the new best way to level your resin 3D Printer? Testing out the new method of Dummy Print Leveling!
Dummy Print Leveling by Jan Mrázek
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I love your content you were the one that got me into resin printing you are amazing!!!!
Heck yeah! Thanks mate
@@UncleJessy ya!!! your awsome man!
This is exactly how the $90 Monoprice MP Mini SLA printer levels the bed. It loosens the knob holding the build plate in place, lowers the build plate into the vat, and tightens the knob - automatically! As long as you keep the vat clear of hardened resin, this method will never fail.
Just tried this, worked like a charm.
Glad it helped!
Every time you say "run off and print" I'm just picturing a guy sprinting down a hallway with a USB stick in his hand held up high xD
Hey thats me
So you dont hit Z=0 after turning printer back on?
From an outsider's view, who only has FDM, after watching the video it seems the "Dummy Print" method is just using the FEP sheet instead of a sheet of paper as the level. So is the FEP sheet thicker than paper which eliminates the elephant's foot because the plate is not pressing down as hard?
Hi, Jan here. Read the post - it explains why it is needed. TLDR: Stupid chitu firmware.
@@yaqwsx0cz Informative, thank you. Since I don't have a resin printer it seemed this was just using one leveling medium over the other. But I could extrapolate why to use this method if it is just Chitu causing issues with z height programming.
Idk about thicker, but I would say higher. The start point of any print is not the same as the level. I assume the start point is higher. The paper helps you to level against the screen with curing residual resin on your glass, and other messy stuff. 😂 I too have used printer paper, parchment and card stock. No difference in performance really.
@@yaqwsx0cz ☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️
I'm curious if you have to relevel though if you change layer height? The starting point for .025 would be different than .05 or .1
I use the faster "2 sheet resistance 1 sheet glide" method. I set the level to just have slight resistance on 2 sheets but one sheet can glide under the build plate without catching. It is faster and easier than Jans method because it is dead easy to test by running any program to check that the first layer still lets the 1 sheet glide under the build plate.
It also avoids squashed prints because it does not cause a pre load. If you squash the build plate when tightening it transfers a load up the z axis and rubber buffer causing screen squash during printing..
FEP or paper sheets?
This is brilliant. I've been having issues with lost Z height. In other words, the part is shorter than it's supposed to be. I can't wait to try this method!
Isn't the elephant foot mostly caused by the burn in layers curing for longer/more bleed time during the long burn in times?
Agreed. Nothing to do with leveling, just with the extended exposure time of the burn-in layers causing it to bleed. In my opinion, it seems like leveling against the FEP causes it to be way too close to the screen on that first layer, then curing for 20 seconds will bleed a lot into the adjacent resin since it is really thin, worsening the elephant's foot. Even if you were to compensate by removing pixels from the burn-in layers with the slicer (like with Lychee Slicer Pro version) you might still see it since the first layer is way too thin and thus over exposed.
An alternative; after leveling against the FEP, you could move the plate up 0.1mm and then set Z=0, this would make the first layer a total of 0.1 to 0.15mm which might reduce the elephant's foot on that first burin-in layer. That, and -0.2mm to -0.4mm from the Lychee Slicer Pro - Compensate feature, and the elephant's foot might not be visible anymore.
That said, I would avoid leveling against the FEP, any missing cured resin in the plate or in the Vat can perforate the FEP when applying pressure, and then what? Source: it happened to me.
the spring on build plate on the mars 3 pro seems like too much tension so i add 2 pieces of paper and i think it worked better, it atleast worked so i think its a win
Wait.. we should be able to use any print file correct? Since we're just cancelling the job at that first layer. What's so specific about that ring file?
Correct, was just making a simple file I could slice
This method seems like it would be dependent on having the correct z=0 position to begin with. To me it would seem like when you hit the home button the chitu firmware sends the build plate carriage down to engage the z-limit switch first, then goes up 0.5mm in order to ensure that the build plate is all the way at the limit. With the dummy print method, the carriage will begin the print wherever the z=0 is currently set, so if dummy operator accidently set their z=0 at 10mm up then the dummy print method will start the print at 10mm up.
Aggreed
You can already compensate for elephant foot in the Chitubox settings (Advanced/Bottom Tolerance Compensation). I don't think elephant foot in resin printing can be fixed by adjusting the homing, it's due to the bottom layers printing 10x longer than the rest. This causes more resin to cure, which only has one way to go, outward. And to be honest, I have yet to experience much elephant foot on the Saturn. Don't know if it may be the Sirayatech Blu Nylon resin I'm using.
as you could have read in the comment that the blog's author posted 2 hours before you asked the question, the goal of this method is NOT to eliminate the elephant's foot 🤔
@@pgabrieli It is nonsensical to suggest it affects the appearance of the whole model which is what he concluded as well as the slight reduction of the elephant's foot.
Well, I tried this on my Elegoo Jupiter, but it doesn't seem to work. It might be because I have the flexi-plate installed though. After leveling it this way, my printer couldn't get to home when trying to print. The plate just kept trying to lower, would hit the bottom, make a noise, then try again like 3-6 times before I stopped it. Luckily no damage to my FEP or the screen. I'll just stick with the paper method for now.
Two quick questions: 1. Is the vat empty/no resin in the vat? (I appears that way). 2. At what point do you set the Z-Axis, if you do at all?
I have the exact same questions!
The vat is empty, everything is cleaned. He doesn't have to use any "Set Z-Axis" buttons after tightening down the build plate because he's adjusting the build plate to be perfectly level at the currently stored Z-Axis setting. As opposed to manually adjusting the build plate position and THEN setting the "Zero Axis" to match the new build plate position.
Ah I like this! Very interesting way to handle the bed leveling and it makes COMPLETE sense! Thanks for sharing! Glad to see Jan in the comments as well!
Yeah it’s a pretty dang smart way to do it actually
@@UncleJessy I have always leveled to the FEP, but never during a dummy print. I love the thought process!
Not sure what the purpose the dummy print is versus just lowering the build plate manually on an empty vat and then tightening (and then setting z=0), which is what the old "Flint Read" approach is. Never heard of anyone actually filling the vat with resin during the leveling process.
Read the blog post - it discusses the reasons why. TLDR: There seems to be a dummy constant in the firmware that moves the build plate below the zero print for the initial layers.
@@yaqwsx0cz Thanks for clearing that up. It sounded to me like the light magically pushed the build plate or something :D
If we had something like manual Z-offset like on an FDM printer all this could be avoided.
Very interesting! I would be thinking about changing my paper method...
Elephant's foot is not from 'squishing', that's an FDM thing. Resin printing elephant's foot comes from light bleed and over exposure on the 'burn in' layers to ensure adhesion to the build plate.
Place item outside of the build plate and it will ''print'' darkness and you don't have to worry about the UV going through as well for the level file.
I just level with the vat in place with however much resin is in there from my last print. It works, and it's easy.
Has anyone tried this on the Jupiter?
this is very impressive... it sounds so ridiculous that most would think of laughing at the thought of this trick... but after seeing the two prints... we may want to see some more testing with this method to see if the first one was just a lucky fluke or not but if this continues to be the case then i'm sure many of us will follow suit of using this method of leveling... definitely a learning curve to relearn on how we think of leveling but this maybe in the right direction
Anxiety is watching a time lapse clip of Jesse leveling his build plate..
"What are you doing? Hurry up and get the paper down!"😮 😂😂😅😅
Hey Jessy, are you still leveling your build plate this way with the dummy file? Any new thoughts on this?
I've always just leveled on an empty vat. Never messed around with pieces of paper, and I've literally never pressed the "Z=0" button. Worked perfectly on my original mars, we'll see if it continues to do so on my new Saturn 2
I think im missing a part of how the second method works, from my understanding when the arm moves up for that first layer the plate is still loose so it is still 0 away from the FEP. Is this method taking into consideration the positioning of the arm? Also how does the printer read when this is set up? Ive tried using the manual lift to raise the arm by .01mm before to try and deal with compression but when i tried to print 0 was still in the same place because without a bed home first i cant set the 0 position..... pressing the home button or starting a print just makes the arm try to push the screen further down into the screen
..and my Saturn2 forces me to home the build plate before setting z=0 so as far as my first attempt with no digging.. this won't work (that I can tell) on the saturn 2.. but I've missed more than one thing in my life so..
Watch u every other day I have a ? I havevthe elegoo mar3 been printing with strictly default as its been great .I was wondering where i could find one of your videos showing how to up detail a bit .Does resin make a difference Thank you for your time Also enjoyed your flsun S1 review
Thank you for this video. I always print the bases for my minis flat on the bed and am always annoyed about the elephants foot. I will definetly try this method and see how my next bases come out.
How did they come out?
@@xlavleenx works fine, almost no elephants foot. But I'm not sure if this is because of the new leveling methode or because of the new "Bottom tolerance compensation" in chitubox which I also use. :D
Neitherless is so much easier to level your plate this way, no extra step.
Interesting content as usual.
Totally different question. Did you get resin in your left eye?
Your left eye lashes seems Grey and I don't see that in any of your older videos... Just age showing all the sudden?
I have had the peopoly phenom for 2 years and have never used paper, card stock or film of any kind to level the build plate . I just level on the screen and move on. I rarely ever have to level the build plate this resin printer is a walk in the park to use and I keep it running 24 hours a day 7 days a week. And now I guess you could say I use film because I keep the screen protector on when leveling. Thanks uncle Jessy for all the information you give on these printers. It was because of your review on the phenom is why I bought mine . Happy creating................
I actually just printed some things for a client that are basically like popsicle sticks so I printed them flat and sure enough I saw a little elephant's foot. I don't normal print flat but this client might want some more so maybe I should do this.
Im a bit confused. ( a little late to the party I know) but if it started printing, wouldnt the spring be decompressed by the height of the first layer as it already started exposing? Or that little bit of compression isnt a deal breaker?
Agreed. Plus any cured resin from previous prints could cause the FEP to be punctured or perforated. I personally do not level against the FEP. If I would do it, I would certainly add some buffer to Z=0, like 0.1mm for that first layer.
Do you leave the layer height at 0.01 afterwards or can you change it back afterwards? Sorry totally new to printing.
I'll just use lychee slicer and use the elephants foot compensation setting at -0.1mn. Been working great for the last 9 months!
Should the black plastic looking tape around the LCD screen on the new Mars 4 ultra be bent in as the LCD screen is pushed down on the back side.
Nope. This is squish from the plate crash
This was great for me too, but for different reason, when I puased it during the start of the print and made the adjustments to the build plate screws and tried to run another print it started making a shutterring noise telling me that my Z-Home was off this whole time, I have been making pancakes lol but now my base layers are crispy and easy to remove, Thanks Uncle Jesse!!!💛🚫🐘
I've never understood the paper method being called the easiest. Just level it with the vat in place. The FEP sheet is the width of a piece of paper.
Is it just me thinking that when printing the first layer the build plate should NOT be at zero, but at one layer hight? So when using this method it should (theoretically, untested yet) work if you switch of when the machine starts the SECOND layer?
Wow, this improved my prints on the original Elegoo mars a ton. Thanks!
I am just thinking, when you do the new method, you risk in putting pressure on that cercle directly on the screen, as that screen does not need much force to damage it
There's no resin in the vat (he says to make sure there's not even resin residue left behind), thus nothing is actually printed so only the flat build plate is being pressed down onto the screen
I print everything with a raft underneath. So is this method unnecessary?
and how will the machine "remember" this position if you don't save it?
This method seems to me extremely wrong. Is impossible to check the planarity of the build plate.
I use a piece of paper that’s the same thickness of the FEP I use, 120, then raise the plate by 0.01 until the paper ban barely move. If it pivot around a corner means that corner is too low and the plate is not parallel to the screen. If it slides correctly I save the new Z=0.
This way homing do not compress the FEP and the base layer is accurate.
Hi, Jan here. The main reason for the method is to counteract the 0.5mm constant present in the firmware. If you want to check the tightness of the build plate, nothing prevents you from using a thin piece of paper. But it is not necessary in my experience to check if the built plate lies flat against the display - a sufficient pressure down from your hand when tightening the build plate should ensure that the build plate is parallel enough with the LCD.
I cannot fathom why everyone seems to get so hung up on complicated methods to level a resin printer plate. I always just leave the vat and film in place, loosen the screws, home it, then tighten the screws - This has never once failed to work perfect for me. Now more difficult to get right is leveling my top-down resin printer....
What kind of top down resin printer do you have
@@InitiallyJB Hitry Rocket 1 Pro
@@tommydouglas3911 yea I seen the process and setup. It scares me to think of how much I’d I have to invest in it only in material
@@tommydouglas3911 hey bro can you do a video of your process it seems so simple but I tried it and it didn’t work but I did try it the way elegoo does it on there page and it work successfully
I finally got my flexplate and did the home without the vat... And after a few prints going wrong i just re did the calibatration and raised it a little bit. And so far my prints are doing well without elephant foot.
But if you do it this way, you will have to take out the build plate right after leveling ant take off the first layer you printed before printing something, right?
no clean off required beacuse there is no resin in the vat when he levels it
I am having a problem with my print is building on the plastic of the tray instead of build plate. Do you know how I fix this problem? Please help. I print resin for jewelry
So this is NOT a foolproof way to level, if your Z height isn't properly set up. It could even lead to cracking your screen.
THANKS UNCLE JESSE! My Mars2 had a motor failure. Got it installed, now it won't recognize files AND it the motor goes too high and hits the top of the hood! HELP-I'm at the end of my rope as the Elegoo Firmware won't download as well as the motor goes too high. Thanks!
I use a POWER BALL Lottery Ticket.
So I tried this early in the morning. It works. It works very well. Tip to the hat to you Jan. I just followed the instructions and did this on my Saturn 2. And works well.
I dont get it, what am i missing??? .... this new leveling way effectively stops the print before layer 1 is cured... that is 0.05mm high in most cases... then you loosen & push the build plate back down to 0.0mm and tighten it.... effectively offsetting your zero point with -0.05mm so now every first layer is printed with a thickness of "0"... and your homing point is now -0.05... where is the first layer???? Why would this work? I believe you need to do this at level at 0, not at layer 1 and not while printing but just while homing with the vat and some resin in it.
sooooooo the start of two prints on my Elegoo Saturn just sounded like the plate wanted to crush through the top of the LCD, making a cracking noise... I swear I followed the instructions! 😭
Well if I try that with my saturn 2 nowadays.. it doesn't works. If I want to adjust the z offset and change the defaults the printer requires me to press home first. So the only way to do it.. you remove build plate... press home.. adjust z axis than save. The order of operations is then.. press home.. level plate.. print 5 level calibration elements on the 4 corners plus middle.. say 2mm. If it prints all of them and all have the same height, measuring with caliper.. nice its calibrated.
If they all are 2mm nice it's also on the correct z index offset. If it isn't.. remove build plate.. press home.. and after that adjust to the correct heighs of the difference between the average of the elements.. then save.
How often are all you leveling ur resin printers? Every vat change out? Every print? Maybe I've been extremely lucky with my Saturn S.
Ironically using paper on my Voxlab always failed. Their customer support suggested not using paper at all which seemed to work fine
hm so we don't have to set Z to 0 right? Cause when i try this on my saturn 2, i can't set z=0 with this method, it asks me to use Home first
I leveled mine by letting the loosened platform rest all the way to the FEP plate and then tighten. No paper/business card shenanigans. In fact all that paper business caused more problems for me. This was on a cheap halot one resin printer, so I guess take it with a grain of salt.
This is so many extra steps for a simple method. Just level with the vat attached. No need for that test print. I always level with the vat.
Its odd, you wnat to level to the width of the FEP, but then you use a piece of paper, instead of the actual FEP,... I always just level with the vat attached.
No way I´m gonna change my leveling process. I do it in the fep tank, thats it. So easy, no problems. Never change a running system. I never print something straight on the build plate.
so just to confirm, the 'dummy' print can literally be anything, just needing to trigger the printer to put the z axis in first slice position?
I am looking into getting a very large resin printer - what one is your favorite ?
Right now I have an anycubic photon mono x - I like it - it’s easy to use - but I need a larger printer -
why don't all printers come without this crap and follow the vertical axis ???
This feature is plain stupidity
3:07 Unless you're using flexible resin. Haha
Thanks Jessy! I'm still a novice with 3d printing, and your vids have helped tremendously. Leveling is always a thing I forget to do. Gonna give this method a try.
Always fun trying out new ways of doing things!
Like your videos! I'm new to 3d printing. Do I need to level the build plate every time when removing it or only time to time?
Homing and Z=0 are always misunderstood. Homing will lower the z axis until the optical/proximity switch is reached. Z=0 is where the first layer will begin printing.... HOWEVER, the z axis will always lower all the way to the optical/proximity switch BEFORE a print starts, then it lifts to wherever Z=0 was set. Regardless of leveling preference, it is important to understand this so you don't damage your screen accidentally. Keep up the great videos!
then is it necessary to do the typical leveling with the paper before trying this method or am I wrong?
Don't waste your time i have tried explaining that to Jan plenty of times. He still thinks the optical sensor is the z=0 which would be crazy because every program would crash into the screen looking for the optical sensor.
@@Anton_Vader_3D Level is level by whatever means you get there. Everyone will have their preference for accuracy and ease, and I am not disputing which is best. I simply want to point out that Z=0 is seperate from leveling. It is just information on how your machine works that may be helpful to know. I stumbled across it on my own and realized my original presumption of Z=0 was incorrect. Once I properly understood it, it help me resolve some issues I had when using very viscous resin. You can easily test the feature yourself for clarification. Level your build plate by whatever method you choose. Then raise the build plate by some visually obvious amount (10mm or more) and set the Z=0 at that point. Finally, WITHOUT A VAT INSTALLED, begin any print file. You will see that the z axis will lower to the sensor (as a sanity check / reference). This is the same spot it goes to when homing to level. Then it will raise to the Z=0 you previously set (10mm or more), and then the LCD will display the first layer and "begin" the print. Seeing it operate first hand will give you the best understanding. Setting Z=0 at your leveled position ensures that printing begins at the machines absolute zero position as defined by the sensor. Also it would be good to check this on your particular printer as I cannot guarantee it true of all brands and models. I do know it is accurate for all Elegoo printer from the original Mars through the Saturn. Hope this clarifies things, happy printing!
@@karlh6692 There is no need to convince anyone, my point can easily be tested...this is the method I replied to another comment "You can easily test the feature yourself for clarification. Level your build plate by whatever method you choose. Then raise the build plate by some visually obvious amount (10mm or more) and set the Z=0 at that point. Finally, WITHOUT A VAT INSTALLED, begin any print file. You will see that the z axis will lower to the sensor (as a sanity check / reference). This is the same spot it goes to when homing to level. Then it will raise to the Z=0 you previously set (10mm or more), and then the LCD will display the first layer and "begin" the print. Seeing it operate first hand will give you the best understanding. Setting Z=0 at your leveled position ensures that printing begins at the machines absolute zero position as defined by the sensor."
All CNC machines need an absolute mechanical zero point to reference their coordinates from. FDM printer and CNC routers must also home all of their axis before beginning to run their g-code. This Z=0 offset is akin to starting an FDM print in the middle of the build plate versus at X=0, Y=0 in the corner of the build plate. However, the difference for the Z offset determines the quality of the first layer/adhesion and the success of the print for both FDM and resin.
@@PerformanceTechEngineering No need to explain to me I have designed and built my own cnc machines. I understand how the limit switch homing works and how it applies a work co ordinate after sensing the limit switch.
Hi I subscribed to your patreon to get the settings for the mars 3 printer and there’s no files can you help me out plz 🙏🏻
i think elephant foot is why elegoo says go up 0.01mm after tightening screws
Hey, im quite new so Im trying to firgure out, is it normal for it after its leveled and you press the home button for it to try to go too far? Or is something wrong with mine?
Gonna give this a try, I’ve leveled using paper and index cards in the past. I have an odd issue I haven’t been able to find help for where my fep is getting damaged every time I print, it sticks and puts dimples in the fep. I’ve tried nearly half a dozen different methods to installing the fep, including using a tuning app, and gave up after burning through several brand new sheets and wasting resin to boot. It probably is still to do with the tightness of the fep but I need to try something new or a may just give up on the machine altogether. It’s killing my fun in the hobby to keep having this issue.
what printer do you have?
dumb question im a noob be gentle. so if i use this method am i not hitting home and setting to zero after i turn the printer back on i am using anycubic mono 2
wow! that's so incredible! print a file 2 level the resin printer!! I don't know if I'm smart enough to do this! I think I'm already confused!!
''Club foot''!! with music!!rip!! good luck! Jessy!
I am definitely going to try this. I have a problem with the paper method often zeroing too low. Then when I put the vat back on and start the print, it bottoms out and makes a grinding sound. I’m afraid it’s going to damage my screen. So far, I’ve been trying to finesse just how loose the paper is so it won’t grind but it is imperfect.
Level on the FEP
Use a thicker grade of paper.
why do you even need to make a print file can you use any print file you already have on your USB drive and do the same thing?
I kind of wish I saw this when I started a couple months ago
Why do you need a dummy file? Surely any file would work using this method?
i didnt do this, I held it down against the FEP with my finger and got some killer elephant foot issue. lol
Heya Uncle Jessy. It's the Flint Read method
what is your layer time for saturn s
This dosent make sense. You have just homed the build plate below 0. The printer will home then raise 0.05mm to start printing the first layer. Then you proceed to push the build plate back down to 0.00 and lock the build plate in place. that's not set to the "perfect height for you first layer" that's set one layer below home position
What are the settings that you use for the Saturn to make snails and “flexi” stuff because mine tends to stick together?
I don’t recall where I learned this, but I have been trying out the method of leveling with four strips of paper, one at each corner. This method helps with ensuring that there is consistent pressure and nothing shifted after torquing the set screws.
Mine doesn’t still go the build plate it stick to the fep instead
This should work with any file and not just your dummy print file right? Maybe better to level with the file you want to print
what if my plate is slightly higher on the left side than it is on the right?
I just level directly on the FEP and have never had an issue
Yes I’m changing over.
Hi, I've got the FlashForge 9.25 6K. I'm getting an error code when the print starts. The z axis can't seem to pull the print off the fep film. Could this be caused by incorrect leveling or incorrect resin settings ( using default settings for that resin) or a faulty motor. Your advice would be really appreciated.
Would the dummy print method stop all elephant's foot if you did this method with a small amount of resin in the vat?
not sure why it would do that. anyway the elephant's foot is mostly caused by the higher exposure time of the bottom layers, which "cooks" the resin more than the normal layers, making the cured voxel wider. it really has little to do with the levelling, although apparently with this method there's a slight gain against elephant's foot because it prevents the build plate squishing too hard, but that's almost a side effect, not the goal
for me and my mars 3 - 3 pages of the manual gives me the best results... and its not a nitemare to remove from the plate. 1 sheet was just too close.
How’s that Elegoo filter? Does it reduce the smell alot?
Yes, it's incredible, you should however always make sure to still wear protective gear (gloves, glasses and mouthmaks/respirator). Because after several usages nearly every part will be contaminated by resin and over time the smallest amounts will eventually cause health issues. This will however take months/years to develop.
I love his content, but unfortunately a lot of contaminated surface are touched without protection.
it works for me, yes.
Simple question here ! I have an elegoo mars pro 2, I already did the bed leveling calibration by the menu on the printer. Is it ok to do the "dummy print" version right after or should I undo in any form the bed leveling calibration on the machin first ? And if so how to do so ? thanks a lot !!
Not a tip for leveling but removing stuff with out a flex plate, put IPA in spray bottle, spray it on your scraper, when the IPA gets in between the bed and resin, the resin item pops off the plate.
Holy smoke! 3:02 my elephant Footbfan print made and Uncle Jessie video as it was used in the article! Day made! 😂
im thinking about getting one... cant really decide between the mars 3 pro or the photon m3... also would a used device is recomennded? u can actually get them pretty cheap used too...
Hello to all that see this comment have an amazing day/night. I was wondering if any one had a torture test you could recommend for resin 3D printer that doesn’t take long and fits in small area?
had a bad leveling after leveling it using the vat method. on large resin prints the bed adhesion is more critical than on a small resin print and I can say that the paper method produce significantly stronger bed adhesion. you might be getting better quality prints but you are sacrificing higher probability of failure doing it this way.
Second to none my friend! Thanks again for this tip. Gonna try on my Saturn 2!