IRON FIST REVIEW
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- Опубликовано: 20 окт 2024
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Kevin shares his initial thoughts on the first few episodes of Netflix’s Iron Fist show with Marc. Marc discusses Kevin’s initial thoughts and offers a little bit of hope from his initial review episode
Three times a week, Marc Bernardin and Kevin Smith talk about all the daily news in movie make believe, terrific TV and anything that squeaks in Geek!
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The reason they didn't go with an Asian American Iron Fist is because Iron Fist and Luke Cage together were responsible for some of the most important comic book commentary on race relations between white and black people in America in the history of our country. I imagine with the state of things today they plan on using the Defenders as another opportunity to showcase the fact that a rich white kid and a black guy from Brooklyn are able to be friends and deal with some of the issues that come from the clash of cultures. Danny's martial arts background is a fairly minor subplot to his overall history, his wealthy white ancestry and how it relates to his best friend who was the first starring African-American character in comics is far more important and presents a great opportunity for social commentary in relation to those two characters.
There should absolutely be more representation of Asian Americans and Comics, but not at the cost of such an important character that has such a strong history of promoting social change and discussion.
*spoilers* Iron Fist is about duty and finding your place in the world. Danny had strived for the Iron Fist power because he thought the responsibility would make him feel whole, but it didn't, so he left Kun Lun because he saw that the path was open and he thought getting back to the family business was what he needed to do, then once he learned the Hand was there, he figured that it must've been destiny, so he falls back into his duty as "sworn enemy of the hand". Then Davos finds him and reminds him that he abandoned his post and should be guarding Kun Lun, but Danny becomes focused on getting closure for his parents' deaths instead. Getting that finally clears his conscience, but then at the end he finds out Kun Lun was attacked and blames himself since guarding Kun Lun was his responsibility. Pretty much everyone else throughout the series is motivated by a sense of duty as well. The Meachum siblings with their business, Harold Meachum's duty as a father, Colleen wanting to give troubled kids better lives, Davos trying to get Danny back to Kun Lun... That's how I saw it, at least.
Thats exactly the way I seen it as well.
lol that's a book?
good video but wouldn't it be better to watch the whole series before you do a review?
newjackswing21 no. Because that would mean having a informed opinion. Why would they want to have that, when they're doing a review for it?
Ethan Bradley sarcasm?
Rambo G totally...
You can't review it only 3 episodes in...especially in a series that you could literally skip the first 5 episodes...
This was not an easy, fast and engaging watch like Daredevil, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage. After episode 6 I took a 48 hour break and then finished the season. It felt a bit like completing an academic assignment. Hoping for a season 2 improvement in writing and plot development.
I don't understand some of Marc's complaints. Maybe he was bored from the show and not paying attention, but all of that stuff was explained and made pretty clear. Danny wanted to be the head of the company because his father instilled a love of the company in him from a young age and he wanted to continue his father's legacy. He wanted to take out Gao because she knows who killed his parents and because he believed she was the leader of the Hand. The comic Iron Fist costume was used in the show, just not worn by Danny. It was used in the old black and white video that showed the previous Iron Fist.
I wanted this to be so much better than it was. It feels like such a wasted opportunity.
(1) The Immortal Iron Fist should NOT be losing fights. He should not even come close to losing. Every fight for him should be like the end of the Hand trial, where he is literally having a conversation with his teacher while effortlessly defending against his enemy. The struggle for Danny should not be the fighting, it should be in his control of the Fist and his emotions. He should be saying "I don't want to fight you" in EVERY fight, because he knows it is not a fair fight. This would have the secondary benefit that Finn Jones would not have to know real martial arts. He could do basic forms that react to his opponent perfectly.
(2) The editing was SO overdone. Fight scenes are both dark and choppy/heavily edited. I get that they are trying to hide some of the action, but every punch does not need three cuts. It really takes the viewer out of the scene.
(3) There is no final fight! Colleen gets a final fight. But the main character's final confrontation is with an old guy with a gun?! If there was ever an indication that your kung fu show is missing the mark, this is it.
(4) I am fine that other people know more about the Iron Fist, but Danny should NOT be surprised that there is more to learn. There is no way that not one of his teachers ever alluded to greater powers or abilities.
(5) Either the writers don't know how to make a mature character, Finn Jones did a poor job, or the writers purposely wrote Danny with the maturity level of a 10 year old. If this is the case, they did a VERY good job, but needed to at least mention it. Like maybe once in the full episode with the psychologist? Just have the doctor dictating his notes and say "it appears that his emotional growth has been stunted following the accident..." it would give the character more depth (he's not whiny, he never really grew up) and it would make all the "stop acting like a child" comments a little closer to home.
MrGameAndMike he was fine in terms of challenge. And I think you forgot everything that happened before that. And and that Danny has beaten that guy before hadn't him
when the best Kung Fu in a series centering around Kung Fu is in the opening credits, there is most likely a problem with the show.
anthony cheesman id say his fight with the drunken guard was better than the intro but it was THE ONLY PART.
Ryan Seabury what about the Hand challenge first and third round
Even the drunken master scene wasn't great. People focus on that because of Lou Tan but it's not very good either. Showrunner really shit the bed.
Rome Janairo that shot was terrible it was super telegraph like they seriously would pause right before they would swing and don't get me started on the girl. that was the worst fight of the show
Good thing there is "Into the Badlands". Now that's kung fu in an american show!
As a lifelong Danny Rand/Fist fan (even named my kid after him), this was such a wasted opportunity. The entire season felt half assed. Boring. Uninspired. The lead actor was not convincing, in any way. He is almost exactly like his Game of Thrones character: spoiled, unimagined, naïve and worst of all uninteresting. It became comical to count how often the stunt doubles took over for the leads. If you had to get ONE thing right in this show it's the fucking martial arts! And how in the hell did they convince themselves that NOT showing K'un-Lun at all was the way to go? No costume either? Daredevil got an all black Iron Fist costume in his season 1 at least. Sigh. I'm normally a level headed guy who doesn't take this stuff too seriously, but how am I going to tell my kid he's named after THIS guy? For the record my son loved Yoga Hosers-laughed his ass off.
Better tell him he's named after Danny Ketch & you're a huge GR fan lol
Curious. Why review before watching the whole series?
Because it is physically painful to finish it (I did but I'm a 40+ year Marvel fanboy, and it was still torture).
arf410 I tapped out around 8 or 9.
I think the casting was imperfect. in terms of martial arts. the lead
actor's form was not impressive. I did not believe he was one of the
most talented martial artists in the Marvel Universe.
I wish I had a dad like Kevin, just a cool guy I could sit and talk about movies and comic books with.
Well I think they did a number of things that could have been done better including telling the wrong part of the story.
Spoilers Below.
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Episodes 1-6 should have been condensed down to 2 maybe 3 episode eliminating most of the office chatter and having the results of those meetings given to us in exposition.
The episode (I think it's 7 maybe 7 and 8) where Danny is "rescued" and taken to Coleen's sensei's compound should have been 3 or 4 episodes where Danny learns the things he doesn't know and gets mind bent by the leader of that group before finding out he is actually one of the leaders of a cell of the Hand.
In those episodes where he's learning from evil sensei, we should have been given flashbacks to Khun Lun and his sensei there teaching him different lessons and have it all culminate with his battle with the dragon in the cave which should give him some insight that let's him figure out the Hand's sensei is steering him in the wrong direction.
And he never wore the outfit from the comicbook. Daredevil, the Punisher and Luke Cage all wore their costumes at least once and even Jessica Jones held up her Jewel costume, but refuses to wear it so she would have to make her superhero name Cameltoe.
And giving him the outfit as part of his customary garb would allow a stunt fighter to do the fight scenes so we don't have 600 cuts in every fight.
Well, here's keeping my fingers crossed that they did the Defenders right.
Essero Eson some people like the meachums. most of that was fine
"I'm not a good writer..."
(*Responsible for one of the best Daredevil stories ever written the first time he wrote a comic.*)
I think this show gave Kevin PTSD.
"He's really thin, eat a sandwich!" - The guy with a man crush on Grant Gustin!
Barry has a very fast metabolism, he can't ever gain weight.
Ep 6-13 were better. I feel the expectations were high due to the success of the previous Marvel Netflix shows. It still fell short on it's main premise though, Mystical Kung Fu. We really needed to see K'un-Lun. Highlights for me were Davos, Hogarth, Temple and Colleen Wing. The real devil here is the writing, not the acting. Some of the dial lines were heinous. I'm sure in Defenders, we'll see a much stronger, more centered and authentic Danny Rand. I give the show a B-.
I disagree... 6-13 were no better than 1-5. They were all bad. The only thing I liked was Colleen, and even she was written terribly at the end. They forced a romantic plot where there should never have been one. They ruined Claire's character with shoddy dialog and motivations. She was clearly only there to connect the shows together. Hogarth was alright. There is no doubt that the writing was bad, but the acting was HORRIBLE. I give the show a D
I hear you. I respect your thoughts on the show as well. I agree about the dialog, even Rosario got some bad lines that felt forced. Hoping Defenders is a stronger show on all accounts.
I reckon it would of been much better if it was only 8 episodes and remove a lot of the "first" arc where Danny was trying to prove he was Danny. Seriously, that could of been done in the one episode which included the mental clinic scenes. That way, they could of at least given the main actor more time to train for the fight scenes.
Remove a lot of the pointless Ward is trying to kill me bullshit! Plus they could of added a few characters from the other series mainly Foggy (working with Hogarth) or Murdock near the end as DareDevil fighting the Hand.
Hell, I would of liked it if Danny released Madame Gao to help in fighting the "other" Hand faction. Causing more chaos.
Biggest Problem I have with the Netflix series is how disconnected it feels from the other series like, are we meant to believe that Murdock or the Punisher are no longer active during another series? I mean Luke Cage and Jessica Jones I can understand to a point for not getting involved but the other two should still be active. I was hoping for more of a lead into the "Defenders" now that Claire knows all the players etc. Plus Cage realistically shouldn't of been in prison for long with Murdock on his side.
I agree with Jake, they should've brought in JJ when Joy mentions the PI she hired who was great when sober. Claire should've called Matt when they went to Japan to get Gao. She learns it's the Hand and they are headed after Gao, first call should've been to Matt. This would've helped strengthen the episodes and add some different personalities. Also the start oh my god, it is slow I am Danny Rand, mental hospital for an episode was slow as a snail and boring. I FF through some of because it is so boring and provides very little.
I enjoyed it a lot. I thought it was better than the 2nd half of Luke Cage. They need to get him into a suit ASAP so that they can get stunt guys doing the fight scenes. He just is not believable right now. The budget was stretched so much and it was disappointing to see. They had a lot of fighting styles which was nice... but they really need a guy who has been doing martial arts all his life...... this show needs real stunt men.
COREY M I agree it's like people don't have any kind of patience
Yeah, I was fine with the actor, but, I was disappointed with the action. It felt like (same with Jessica Jones) That the fight scenes/action sequences were an after thought. They were in there because they had to be, but the writer/directors weren't interested in making any kind of convincing action.
COREY M AGREE
COREY M and yet that's why it failed cause they tried to hard to ground it in realism. .I think they should have just gone there in the fantasy part and people might have enjoyed it more...I had to make myself watch the first 6 episodes...I also agree with Kevin about him being too skinny and eat a few sandwiches. .
Wing Chun? Definitely not. He was using tiger, leopard and snake styles...
I think the problem with Iron Fist is that it didn't really do what it set out to do.
Daredevil is a crime drama with a superhero, and it did that very well. Jessica Jones is about someone surviving horrific abuse, living with PTSD, and trying to find some kind of closure to this terrible thing that happened to her, and it did that very well. Luke Cage is about someone trying to find his place in the community of Harlem and an exploration of black culture and experience, and it did that very well.
Even though those shows had problems with pacing or plot or the villains, they follow through on their premise and developed the themes they set out to explore.
Iron Fist is about a mystical warrior trained in a legendary city returning to a home that is now alien to him. But the show doesn't do the martial arts very well. It doesn't really explore any spirituality or mysticism beyond very basic qigong. And the whole fish out of water story falls flat since there's rarely any consequences to Danny's ignorance.
KingOfMadCows iron fist is also about finding his place. honestly.sometimes it felt like Luke cage was just dragging doing the right thing or being a hero ect
I feel crazy for loving it. Not as much as daredevil but I love it.
redskinfan I don't love it but I still enjoy it enough.
Qc4073 I also loved it. Don't worry, i think a fair amount of people did. I actually find that most things that come out (especially comic book related) *always* have people who love and hate it. Even something critically and fan (general public) acclaimed like Logan, or even most Marvel films, have people saying that they're awful all over comment sections etc. So it doesn't really surprise me anymore. I just watch the things i like and make up my own mind.
Sarie Natt, no way! The Flash is fast paced and I really enjoyed season one and two. It's still entertaining, although they have some filler episodes. I wouldn't compare Iron Fist to The Flash at all.
The show rocks man, don't feel crazy.
I dig it. Just finished the series.
When I let go of some of my DD, JJ, and Luke Cage expectations, that's when I really started to enjoy Iron Fist. Danny Rand is a man-child. He's still the kid from the plane crash, 15 years ago.
Naive. Impulsive. A poor judge of character. He can't control his anger. (Or in this case, his chi) He acts more like a kid with nerd rage than the Iron Fist. For me, it was like watching an Amish kid's first trip to NYC. Think, Will Ferrell, in "Elf" & you'll be rolling off the couch! I LOVED IT!
Why was this made if neither of you have finished the series? Strike while the iron is hot? I think that's how the saying goes.
I truly appreciate that you will be dedicating a third video for review of this show. Thanks very much for taking some time to work through this show.
A Buck Rogers reference ? Wow. Someone else remembers one of the shows I grew up with.
Iria Sky is it stuck In your head now too?
I had to pause this and go watch the intro
It was either buck rogers or battlestar galactica (original)
Just wait til you get to the ice cream scene. That was the turning point for me. It was kind of slow up to that point but then that ice cream scene happens (if you've seen it YOU KNOW) and I was in. Then there are twists and turns and it gets better.
David Wenham was pretty great in that show.
Loman He was my favorite part.
*Spoiler*
I knew he wasn't dead after Ward killed him because he actual was the most fun charchter. His finally death was pathetic.
agreed. in fact the way the show used him in the last episode was kind of pathetic. "just mope around the office David, doing particularly nothing but looking a little mad until you get shot off the roof"
he was a greatly acted villain with poor writing to finish off the season.
Your reviews bring me in, your impromptu acapella theme music is what keeps me coming back.
I liked it but it felt extremely slow.
Like Luke Cage flies by compared to this.
Brian Hunt It's no where near slow. Try watching The OA you will notice a huge difference in pace, it's painfully slow. I honestly don't have a problem with the pace of the 4 shows, it's like people don't like the fact that they're drama's.
It's not you... The show is HORRIBLY paced with shoddy editing and direction. Compared to all the other shows, this was just subpar. Justifiably panned by critics.
Connor McCartney or the fact that instead of focusing on the iron fist we had half a season of danny rand trying to take rand back and the next half of boring bs that was irrelevant and made the series shittier. lets just face it the whole arc of this season was bad and predictable from the first episode. not to mention they cut a much better origin out for this horrible and pretty pointless origin.
II D3ADB1RD II he didn't want rand he wanted a place to belong
I binged it all in one day and I enjoyed it a lot. I felt that Danny Rand's lack of goals and direction was actually the entire point, because I felt the story was basically a coming-of-age journey, an outsider having to learn his place in the world. The theme was about Danny finding out who he was and what he actually wanted himself, not just what others told him that he should want.
Danny starts out emotionally as the 10 year old kid that lost his parents. In fact this is even mentioned by Davos, who says how the monks forced the young students to suppress their emotions. It is also this childish innocence that makes him vulnerable to Harold's manipulations. He starts maturing over the show and we even see him in the later half struggle with typical teenage issues, such as uncontrollable anger and his love/lust for Colleen Wing. As season 1 wraps up he seems to have found himself, knowing who he is.
Colleen Wing also has her own personal developments, as she also liberate herself and start making her own decisions in life, culminating in her big scene in the rain, where she takes the final step.
Of course the show also have flaws. I did feel that there were times where it became a bit sluggish and drawn out. This is also something that we have seen in the other shows, so not too surprising.
Overall I liked it better than Luke Cage and about the same as Jessica Jones. The only one clearly above it is Daredevil.
How can you review a show that 1 of you has seen 11 of, and the other has seen 3, watch them all, THEN review it...period
Some of the points seem odd, people saying they don't know what Danny Rand wanted.. It was made pretty clear almost from the drop that Danny's goals were to refind a place in New York and wanted to find out what really happened to the plane and his parents. So when people say "I don't know what Danny wanted", it seems that most people just watched the series with a blind eye and didn't pay attention to the story at all or the characters. >_
This show didn't have any memorable action scenes, and that is it's major problem
Definitely proportionately weaker to Daredevil's fight scenes. However, Episode 6 "Immortal Emerges from Cave" is one of my favourite episodes of the Marvel Netflix shows. RZA's direction and vision gave me throwback feels to watching Enter the Dragon for the first time.
Zombie Killer elevator comes to mind. best romance too. most likeable coupling.
It's all about the family, the meecham's and dad, he was resurrected by the Hand. That's exactly what happened. So it was what was portrayed in the show. Basically bleed over stuff from Daredevil. The Hand 'stuff'
so it looks like your friend missed some parts in his eleven episodes. yes the father of the brother and sister did die and got resurrected. the show is about being an outcast and an idealist. i liked the show but i'm an idealist and an outcast. plus the middle eastern philosphy and trying to figure out where to go.
There were 2 main issues with `Iron Fist` for me - the first was that it was another `poor little rich boy` character BUT the main problem I had was that with the inclusion of `Clare` who has all these various people on speed dial who could *potentially* have been useful to call upon, were conveniently ignored for the sake of ....reasons (aside from it being cheaper to film) - when they could have helped build up the mythos of `The Defenders` by joining in at various points (be it all of them or individually).
You can't review it only 3 episodes in...especially in a series that you could literally skip the first 5 episodes...
The actress who played Colleen was stellar, I just never felt as invested with much else apart from her.
My bar is very low too and I want to like things too! That's how I enjoyed suicide squad and batman vs superman haha.
My bar was low for iron fist based off the trailer and the fact that they casted Loras Tyrell. But, I LOVED IT. Even if my expectations were higher, I still would of loved it. I loved Danny Rand, Colleen Wing and as always, Claire Temple. Ward was GREAT too.
"“I was learning those fight scenes just 15 minutes before we shot them" ~ Finn Jones
'Nuff said. :-(
I enjoyed the show. I don't understand the hate and outrage of the show. I thought Danny Rand was a white man in the comics, so I don't understand why people were complaining about race, It doesn't matter.
MrMathew12 The character was always racist since the 70's. That's the problem.
"This character's white and only Asians can do martial arts!" - People complaining about racism.
Saying an American using martial arts that he learned in a magical fictional city to save people in America is racist is moronic. You have to do some serious mental gymnastics to come to that conclusion.
Wannabe_Baby Stop with the false equivalency. You know stealing asian culture is racist. The soul purpose of Iron Fist in the 70's was to white wash asian culture for white America comicbook fans. Stop making excuses for them in 2017. Marvel had plenty of heros that practice martial arts.
I don't really care about that either, I just think Finn Jones is TERRIBLE. He has one facial expression for the whole show. Iron Fist is supposed to be the funny guy that bounces off Luke Cage's straight man and he literally pouts and throws temper tantrums for 13 episodes. I wanted to love it...but hopefully they fix it for The Defenders..ugh
Brandon Matthews it's not racist
I agreed, but I also happen to like the business and corporate side of the stories in general so to me that too worked for me. There were few things that put me off every now and then, but overall yes I enjoyed the series. I went through each episode one after another, non-stop and this is coming from a guy who sometimes spent an entire day watching one episode of a show.
Yes things should be, could be better especially the fights. Now that you described how things went down behind the scenes so I can see why it happened the way it happened. Artists were good no doubt so I hope to see them make it all up in Defenders.
Why review a season if you have not watched it all and apparently did not pay attention to what you were watching anyway.
I loved it just as much as Daredevil. I was hooked from the first episode. I don't understand all the hate. I loved Danny and all the characters. It was great.
Here we go again. Why in the hell would they cast an Asian actor to play Iron Fist when you have Shang Chi?
Shang Chi's not in this.
I didn't say that he was. I was referring to the people that were complaining about the fact that Iron Fist isn't being played by an Asian actor. Clearly they're not all that familiar with the Marvel Universe (and they come off as a little racist). If they want an Asian character, Shang Chi is available. If they actually read or research Marvel Comics, they'd know that.
WarriorSmurf the people who complain about this stuff don’t actually read or watch this stuff. This is problem with activism these days.
The show is about Danny coming into and staying true to his father's legacy. Not changing his name because his name means something. His ideals come from his name and what his family stood for, which is why he fights so hard to get back in the position where his name means something. I thought while that might be an unconventional theme it's sort of obvious when you think about it. He says his name constantly like it's going out of style because his identity and his connection to his family and what they stood for represented. This is also why they spend so much time on the Meechums because it shows the contrast of their family and his and the blurry line separating them. His identity is also brought up in relation to the 15 years he was gone. Going through that abusive situation from the monks, and walking away from the destiny they had for him vs the destiny that is more true to who he is. There's a little bit of conflict between his Iron Fist self and the self he feels he is. Some of it is in agreement some of it is not.
come on, fellas. watch the whole thing before you review it.
I found that the series got progressively stronger after the first few episodes. The final episodes were pretty good.
Can you do a review when you have seen all of it? I loved it tbh
Glad to see I was not the only one who had to 'struggle" through Iron Fist. I was.good to go with Colien Wing and if she had been Iron Fist I would have been onboard. It took me a while to get my review up as well and I'm fully on the Marc train! :)
Kevin, if you just watch session 2 episode 1 of Into The Bad Lands - you will see more capable action than the entire 13 episodes of Iron Fist! Plus some nice temple training scenes that were missing from Iron Fiat as well! :D
Bet you loved season two since they passed the power of the Iron Fist to Colien Wing who is obviously the better fighter.
He can't be an Asian American cause Danny not looking like everyone else in Kun'Lun is how EVERYONE in Kun'Lun knew he was an outsider. You could have made Danny hispanic, black, or native american and it still would have worked. But the one race that would not work for his back story would be Asian. Personally I think Native American would have been super cool. But I agree with you guys on most of this. I really wanted this to be amazing. I mean, just stick with Immortal Iron Fist 2007 comic line and it would have been amazing. But alas, c'est la vie.
There is more than one type of Asian, he coulda been any other type than whatever the monks were? But, cinematically it works better if he is non-Asian, I agree there.. But yeah, stick with whatever he was in the comics, make more diverse characters going forward if you want, but we don't really gain anything black/yellow/redwashing.
I don't care. I enjoyed it...
Then again, when it comes to superheroes, I love almost everything.
It's definitely a flawed-ass show, but I think you guys need to finish a show before you review it.
arkainjalex12 ikr! They really should.
arkainjalex12 i agree but I think it speaks to just how bad it is lmao
arkainjalex12 ya you got a point but 2 episodes in we all knew we were in for a very very very rough season. the guy just didnt fit his role. which is very sad to say because the guy you see before they capture gao that has the "drunken master" fighting style was amazing and seemed like he could have been a much better match.
but those flaws won't go away in the 12th and final episode. or any episode fro that matter.
Most of them won't, no. It's easily the weakest Netflix Marvel show.
However, there are some positive qualities to it such as Colleen Wing and the redemption of Ward Meachum. By the end of the series, Ward actually ends up the strongest, most well-rounded character. It's pretty cool considering what a douche he was early on.
I liked it as much as Luke Cage. Cage's best moments were better than Iron Fist's but Iron Fist's worst moments weren't as bad as Cage's. I think both shows had flaws, but I enjoyed them at the end of the day.
Listen. This show has it's problems, it's true. But to say Danny's motivations are unclear is utter bullshit. What Danny wants is simple: he wants the 2 people he grew up with that are owners of his fathers company to know that he is Danny Rand. When Joy FINALLY believes him, she offers him a deal for 100 million dollars, no stake in the company, his deceased father's legacy, only if he changes his name. The honorable Danny can not take this deal. Not because of the money. Not because he wont own the company. But because he has to go around as Danny Rand, but under another name, the only thing his parents left him besides the company. It's THIS reason he decides to fight to take his place in the company when Jeri offers to help him do so. To say he did it for no reason is erroneous and shows you werent paying attention to the show, Marc. Probably because you already made up your mind you wouldnt like it before you even watched the first episode.
thank you for the message Jarrell Jones that was very nice ... and yes i agree about judging things before they are even out for silly reasons!
Isla Mazuca thank YOU
They rushed the Kung Fu, but the lead actor is really skilled. He did this badass front flip, and it was... badass. They just need to edit it better. It's an editing and take problem, but the lead guy has tons of potential.
Just some helpful critiscism. Please watch the whole series before doing a 23 MINUTE REVIEW. pls
If you ate a piece of poo, you wouldn't need to swallow it before you decided its bad.
Kevin, I'm glad you're going to watch more of this series, as I feel it has received a lot of unwarranted criticism. Yes, Finn Jones is no Muscle-Mary, but as you pointed out quite correctly, he doesn't need to be as he can channel the power of his chi into his fist. And whilst I too would have preferred more action in the series, I do feel there are too many comments below stating that Mr Jones is no Jackie Chan, Bruce Lee or Jet Li... What moronic comparisons! Of course he isn't - he has made acting his LIFE, not martial arts!
And Mr Bernardin, if you haven't worked out the story by episode 11, you must either be watching a different show, stoned, drunk, or just not paying attention when you are watching... I don't mean to be rude, but really it all seems quite obvious to me, and I'm only on episode six!. That said, I would have liked more of the mysticism attached to Iron Fist appearing in the show... I have thoroughly enjoyed watching the series so far - it takes me back the days of the Marshall Macao novels like The Opium Wars and The Rape of Sun Lee Fong, and the Richard Dragon novel Dragon's Fists by Jim Dennis... And also my older brother in the seventies making some nunchaku from a couple of pieces of broom handle and a short length of chain from a lavatory pull... More Kung Fu on TV please! x :)
Is this now the second upload of an Iron Fist review where neither of you have finished watching it?
The actress who plays "Joy Meachum" is wonderful. She's visually stunning, and a brilliant actress. She played Kevin Bacon's niece on THE FOLLOWING (another highly underrated show).
Sorry, Kevin. I'm a fan of your films, but strongly disagree with you on Marvel's track record. JESSICA JONES and LUKE CAGE are incredibly boring. Those two shows are almost as dull as AGENTS OF SHIELD. I put them on when I have trouble falling asleep.
IRON FIST, however, is amazing! I binged watched the first season in one weekend. It reminds me of Nicholas Hammond's 1977 SPIDER-MAN television series, which to this day, is the best on-screen, live-action incarnation we have seen of Spidey. IRON FIST has better stories, better actors, and better chemistry between the characters, than LUKE CAGE or JESSICA JONES. IRON FIST does not deserve the criticism it's getting.
Ive only seen the trailers and havent got a full on look at it yet. I do know the fight scenes are not on the same level, that justs jumps right out at me. The fight choreography is way, way, way below par, but I dont care. I still want to see it. The fights in Daredevil got better as the first season progressed, then they ramped it up to awesome. Im totally willing to give the show a shot.
Personally I never thought that Kevin was being paid by Marvel to hype their stuff. I just think it is painfully obvious that it is in his interest to "like" these things. Not that I get annoyed by his 'opinions' when it comes to things that he gets work and gigs from 'liking', but I also not to take everything he says about them as a serious opinion. Doesn't stop me from watching either way ;)
Why would he hype marvel? He has done a lot more stuff for DC/WB.
He hypes DC, Marvel, Star Wars, etc. Basically anything in which is gets extra work by doing so ;)
When was the last time he worked for Marvel? I have only ever heard of him working on DC Tv shows and comic books.
Th last Marvel thing his IMDB says is The Marvel Experience.
The Marvel Experience is a Hyper-Reality Tour. noting to do with making anything for marvel. He probably just had a speaking gig or something.
I LOVED it. Smoothly paced character development mixed with the action sequences... all unfolding enticingly as a grand, layered mystery .. I was pleasantly surprised at how all the subplots were interesting... I didn't think I would care about the Meachum siblings but I really did... Also, Finn Jones speaks great Mandarin! He and Jessica Henwick (Colleen Wing) both put their heart, blood (literally) and soul into this.
The only reason critics disliked this series stemmed from the controversy of Danny not being Asian, which I just can't even. Batman also trained in martial arts in the East after his parents died and took his new skills back to the West... Shouldn't HE be Asian, too? Seriously, ppl.
Your reviewing it and havent even finished it? :P Kevin, you've barley started it! that being said it really isn't all that bad, not great like i was hoping but alright.
I think the problem was in the overall structure of the show:
- it tried too hard to give us twists regarding Danny's parents and the crash, and then left it very ambiguous
- it gave us barely any information regarding his years in K'un-Lun. We saw a scene where they found him in the mountains, then beating him with bamboo sticks, then waking up outside of the cave of Shou-Loa. This was an introduction to not simply a Defender, but to a Marvel character many have never even heard of - some kind of origin story would have been nice.
- it was very awkward in regards to what Danny was after overall. We do not know why he decided to abandon his post, why he decides he needs to fight the Hand, why he wants to join his family company. It is all very muddy in regards to character desires and goals.
- For a guy who has the Iron Fist, and is suppose to be the world's greatest martial artist, he gets kicked in the face an awful lot. Not saying he should have been unstoppable, but jesus he was getting his ass kicked by people who should have been nothing to him.
I love the show. I binged the hell out of it. Haters gonna hate.
I did see a few issues with it but I certainly didn't come down on the side of Mark who literally pick it apart like it was some kind of ill-fated Roadkill. my only real issue was that they didn't at least have some cameos in Daredevil period you would have just stopped with her being so close to all the other active Defenders that you would have seen at least some of that and that was one of my real only disappointment. I'm fan of the Iron Fist comic books. so of course I had as far as this plot was concerned to begin with and I thought they did it justice. Yes the choreography could have been better and yes the tography could have been better but I thought the writing was very reminiscent of Iron Fists.
Tired of these god damn reviews without watching the entire series
Finish it then review
I'm so old. I actually broke out into the Buck Rodges theme along with them. I love this channel.
I LOVED it and gives room for growth and improvement for season 2!
mrrpm01 I doubt there's gonna be a S2.
hope springs eternal lol
mrrpm01 They'll probably pair him with Luke Cage for S2 and it'll be Heroes For Hire.
THAT I WOULD LOVE
Brian Hunt There easily will be
Trust me, you really gotta push yourself through that show. Honestly, I didn't believe critics shitting on it, giving low reviews, I gotta judge myself. Well, I fell asleep for 6 times on episode 2, I tried to watch next day, made it through till episode 5, fell asleep again, like 3 times. Then I started watching in the morning, caught myself checking my phone, Insta, Pinterest etc. Damn, major let down(( All I was thinking, HOW COME A DRAWN DUDE IN THE OPENING CREDITS,DOING HIS KUNG FU IS BETTER THAN THE CHARACTER IN THE SHOW??!!
Let me clear it up for Marc. "Iron Fist" is a show about identity. Danny Rand is conflicted about who it is he wants to be - the Iron Fist or the son his Father always wanted him to be. The keeper of the gates to Kunn Lun or just a decent guy. Ward is conflicted about being the perfect son for his Father or living his own life. Anger is another continuos theme. I just really love the show, I want other people to see how cool it is. Trust me, it's really good!
Zach Mohl I get the theme of identity for Ward (as he probably had the best character arc in the show), but Danny's story is a tad too cluttered. His "struggle" is between being Danny Rand and Iron Fist but we never really see this struggle. At no point does he give up being Iron Fist (maybe we can assume he did when he left kunlun but he explains it by wanting to find the truth of his parents death + he literally tells anyone who will listen HE IS THE IRON FIST) but at the same time we never really see him fully accept being Danny Rand. Granted, maybe this indecisiveness was on purpose but it could've been handled better.
As for anger, I'll agree that is a theme I see more prominently in the show. All the Meachams, Danny, Colleen, and Davos deal with pent up aggression due to their emotions that they can only release through fighting. My only issue with this is that the best characters who exemplify this theme either can't really fight (Harold Meacham), barely fights (Davos) or rarely goes all out (Danny). Plus the fighting was subpar so the thematic elements suffered.
BULLCRAP-O!!!!!
I think I liked it so much because I viewed the show as about trust and truth. Just like DD was about justice, JJ was about guilt and addiction, LC was about power and responsibility, I view Iron Fist as all about learning to trust others, yourself, allies and what is really true.
I describe IF as "Forgettable"
Matt Hall watched it all the way through a few days ago and the only really memorable people were one offs like the "drunken master" fighter and fucking gao. sad when your lead and supporting characters fall behind a villain and a random henchman.
Ryan Seabury truth. I mean I liked Harold, but he went out on a pathetic fashion.
Same but I still enjoyed watching it at the time. Same with all Marvel shows, I've watched them all and couldn't tell you the name of the nurse-lady... What does that tell you lol. Forgettable -_-
Buck Rogers. That theme tune rendition with optional air-guitar made my day ♥
Its actually not bad at all. People hold it to daredevil but its not daredevil. The iron fist is less well known for a reason. He isn't as good of a character. Ps. Stop saying it's white washed! he is supposed to be a white dude.
Danny wants his name back.
Anybody in the role would have fucking sucked because the writing was shit. SO boring. Nothing ever happens. So what anyone in it looks like isn't even a factor. It was just shit out quickly to get to Defenders.
Still better than anything on the CW... you love content. I bet you watched the entire season.
I'm on the 8th episode and I gotta be honest, I'm loving it so far. Probably not quite as good as Jessica Jones and definitely not as good as Daredevil but I'm enjoying it way more than Luke Cage which was good but kinda slow imo.
I still think most of the hate comes from the sjw side of the left, and even here I heir sjw spewing forth.
The story to me is about a guy that for some reason is running away from his destiny. what else do you expect a milinial to do when he is shown an exit from servitude. now if you were to complain about that i wouldn't mind the hate.
Marvel done right on Netflix. Loved it. Legion is good to but. Nothing compares to Netflix marvel series.
I said this when the announced the actor and the show only confirmed it, Finn Jones was the wrong person for this job. None of his actingwas special enough, that your average martial arts actor couldn't have pulled this off better. That's what this role needed was a martial artist, to fucking play THE Martial Artist of the Marvel Universe. Mark mention the 15 minute thing. The Might Morphin Power Rangers would be given 15 minutes to choreograph their own fight scenes every episode. Now the Pink and Blue rangers didn't have MA experience but were gymnasts, and that's why all their fights sucked and they would randomly do flips. The Red ranger just said, "Fuck it. I'll just kick each stunt man a few times and never have to block. they're paying me shit." But the Black, Yellow and Green rangers would often have some very cool fights that utilized their surroundings and cool moves. Now i'm not saying they're great actors, but pointing out that if your actor already knows how to do fight, it's not hard to make the fights look good, even with only 15 minutes of prep.
Iron Fist had better pacing and was just generally less boring than Luke Cage, I also preferred the fight scenes in Iron Fist (they weren't necessarily good, but the Luke Cage action scenes were just boring as hell).
Story and characters weren't as good in Iron Fist, though, but I actually preferred Iron Fist.
Neither are as good as Daredevil and Jessica Jones.
I think Jessica Jones just made it thanks to an awesome villain. Other characters (even herself) in itself aren't very likeable.
that's funny i thought daredevil lost steam half way through and was a slog to get through whereas the others seemed consistent on all fronts. i think luke cage was the easiest to binge in a few days next to jessica jones and iron fist. i had to force myself to sit down and get through some episodes with daredevil
That is funny, because Luke Cage has been my hardest to binge out of all 5 Marvel Netflix seasons so far, I watched the others in about two days, whereas it took me four to watch all of Luke Cage.
I knew nothing about the Iron Fist story before watching so it may have been easier for me like this one than an older fan. Anyway, I liked it. Kevin and Marc, much respect, but this season gets better as it progresses and is really good in the last few episodes. Just my opinion. Of course Rosario Dawson shows up finally and...yeah, I get weak in the knees. So thats a factor. I will give you this, it is not on the same level as Daredevil..but I will watch all of these that Netflix puts out for us.
anyone else think it's shit ?
worst marvel tv series by a mile
King_George95 I wouldn't even give it a 5 it's not just bad as a marvel series..it's bad as a series in general...poor acting nothing intriguing worst villian
andrey daniel honestly LC was worse in comparison
I preferred it to Luke Cage, I finished Iron Fist really quickly. I struggled through LC
yeah.
As far as "What's the show about," I would guess that Iron Fist is about DESIRE vs DUTY in life.
Danny Rand has a duty to defend Kun Lun, but he desires to return to reclaim his family's legacy.
The male Micham kid has a duty to perform his father's bidding, but he desires to run Rand his own way or leave and establish his own life.
The female Micham kid has a desire to support her brother and her friend, but she has a duty to keep Rand profitable.
Coleen Wing's character desired to be a force of good in the world, but she had to betray her duty to The Hand in order to accomplish that.
Desire vs Duty.
i liked it
You guys singing the Buck Rogers theme seriously gave me a flashback to my youth.
It's complete trash!
Romeo315 LOL I was wondering if it was a good show
By episode 11-12, Finn has gotten a bit more in shape, and it seems like, he has continued his training throughout shooting. I think, if he commits, season two will be night and day... my wife helped me to understand, that this guy is NOT the Iron Fist. He just has the power of the IF. He is unsure, he left without learning all of his possibilities. This I finally got, and it helped me to understand it way better. Do I like all the board room stuff, but even that makes more sense if viewed through the lens my wife sees the show- a person who never knew about the comic character..
I actually watched the whole thing and it honestly wasn't that bad, meaning I've seen allot worse...If you compare it to the DD series or the Disney/Marvel Flix than yeah, it's quite sub par but, it's still somewhat entertaining. My only real complaint would be that it's going nowhere, asides putting him in the story Arc, even Danny says something like: I don't know my purpose in the last few episodes.Side note: you do actually kinda see the costume in the WW2 video but, it's grainy and in black and white so, hard to make out.
Aw, Kevin is so sweet. Okay, if Kevin will keep watching, and even Marc will keep watching, I will keep watching. But I'm not looking forward to the hospital/mental ward episode.
Was gonna watch this. Noticed that it's not a review of all episodes. ...didn't.
...
I'll wait for a real review.
Really glad you are going to finish the show and talk more on another episode.
I have an idea on what the problem is. All the characters are complex with no simple foils. So they kinda fall flat.
Also the issue with the PTSD of Dany Rand and him not dealing with is the center of the story. He clings to the various identities (CEO/Dany Rand/Ironfist/Hand smasher) to give himself an anchor of self. However; it does not fix the main problem with the PTSD and anger issues. That is why his goal post keeps changing through out the series. It is very unfortunate that the other stuff gets in the way of that.
Now i will say the fights are not as crisp and not as pretty as Daredevil. I kinda liked it a bit more as for me it seems more like a real fight with real martial artists that are at a similar level. Also, there is the thing with the lack of juxtaposition with the enemies being tooted as the same level/near same level of combat skill. In Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and Luke Cage there is a distinct skill or ability gap with the hero and the enemy. In Iron fist it's not as drastic.
So overall I liked it for what it was and enjoyed the characters. I think they tried to do too much though.
I have only been able to get to episode 8...and it's been tough. I didn't want to be negative about the show because I want them to keep making more shows of this variety! ...and I don't like people being so negative...KEVIN thank you so much for making me laugh and bringing out my feelings in the perfect comedic way. 😂
For the most part, I subscribe to Kevin's way of thinking; I'm just super happy we're getting these things. Iron Fist definitely wasn't their best show, but goddamn, we get the Fist. I enjoy all of it, even if it's not the greatest cinematically. I love Avengers, BvS, Suicide Squad.. all of it. Praise Odin we get these.
We're not disappointed by Iron Fist because we're haters, we're disappointed because we're FANS. We WANT the show to be good and it's just not. The opening sequence of the second season of Into the Badlands is both more epic and more fun than the entirety of Iron Fist. The fight scene is amazingly creative, and the main character, Sunny, is shackled in a freaking *yoke* for most of it. Into the Badlands does a great job of staging fight scenes with stuff that's at hand. In the second episode the woman who fights marauders is clearly not a great martial artist, but through creative editing you don't even notice. She uses hot soup as a weapon. Hot. Soup. There's none of that in Iron Fist, more's the pity.
+Kevin Smith , keep those early 1980's references coning man. Buck Rodgers! But, yeah. Thank you and Marc Bernardin for bringing us your thoughts.
I loved this show. Beginning to end. I think this is a show that benefits if you know about the character before watching, his company helps all kinds of people heroes included. It sucks that this show is getting reamed
It's all about protecting his father's legacy. The company has his name on it. The Hand and Madame Gao in Danny's eyes had corrupted it. That was Danny's motivation beyond just reconnecting with the people he knew. I didn't think that was hard to figure out. I think the thing you gotta remember about Danny in this series is that he was robbed of his childhood, and the show leans into that. He does appear to be a stunted individual.
The fight scenes should be better for this show. I agree. That said I did enjoy pretty much every Colleen fight in the series. It was a mistake not to give Danny some sort of suit or at least his mask because they would have helped them hide the stunt work better.
I really liked the show, but I really think better and more frequent action scenes spread out throughout the series would have kept people engaged and the show probably would be getting less hate.
Also I liked Ward. I think they gave him a good plot, but it's a real slow burn. Joy didn't really get enough to do in my opinion.
Season 1 was about Danny trying to find a place in the world he had been removed from. It's not that difficult to understand. Personally, the only thing that has me seeing this as lower than Jessica Jones or Daredevil is the use of music by people so polarizing as Killah Priest and the Tribe Called Quest.
Storywise, I really liked it, and the studio scene with Colleen in the penultimate episode of the season was wonderfully sensual.
Marc stated my opinions on this show a LOT better than I was able to. Suffice to say I am now re-watching Daredevil Season 1 for like the 5th time.
What they could have done is addressed the fact that he's a white guy utilizing martial arts in a "Kill Bill" fashion (similar to how Lucy Liu taunted Uma Thruman's character for being white) and gone from there. I'm sure their are many people who flock to other cultures despite not originating from them that could have understood the story more. Iron Fist could have been a really cool way to explain that narrative, but instead its a "meh" show without a foundation.
I've seen multiple rankings of Marvel netflix shows where Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and Luke Cage have been ranked #1 in various forms. The first three Marvel shows did a better job of establishing that "our show is about ______ for _______ audience". The most polarizing IMO is Luke Cage as I've seen it ranked last almost as much as Iron Fist, however in the blerd (black nerd) community that's first or second each time. If you've never dealt with issues Luke Cage faces within the show you're not going to understand it. And I think that's the issue Iron Fist suffers from. The other 3 characters were "victims" in a sense whether from sexual assault, being black in America, or having a disability. Iron Fist is a rich white guy who inherits a billion dollar company and sleeps with the first asian girl he meets. Not sure what his struggle is tbh
If I told you, only one Marvel show is getting a Season 2 you'd have support for all 3 in some capacity minus Iron Fist. It's not that its terrible, it's just that there's no point where you're invested in Danny Rand or his story to the extent of a Jessica Jones or Matt Murdock or Luke Cage.
Oh come on, The Meachum bros. were the best part of the show, specially on the second half.
edit: the old school suit is worn by Orson Randall in that flashback and that was totally the classic Iron Fist suit.