@@coltonkosto98I wouldnt take it personally. Im sure the guy must have done hundreds of other autographs or photos before you met him! Meet and greets especially with a big crowd can always drain your energy like crazy
It’s mostly from people on gear especially gear that puts your nervous system or whatever into overdrive overnight so your able to lift more weight but your body hasn’t adjusted to that
@@chickentoucher55 gear makes your muscles grow faster and thus your strength goes up too. The only thing that gear doesnt grow is your tendons, which are responsible for keeping your insertions attached to the bone. Those are the ones that tear if you go too heavy or overload it through volume
@@AK12255 search torn pecs bench press. That won’t put you in a wheelchair but you won’t be in the gym any more. Squats put him in a wheelchair. I’ve been lifting for 17 years. Play it safe kid. Longevity wins
Not a single pro bodybuilder can flaunt longevity. They’re all taking so many drugs that are poison for the body. This isn’t a low dose of TRT when you’re 55, these guys are actually killing themselves
He told me this same thing at the Cutler classic in Boston about 10 years ago. I was lucky to talk to him . He was super nice. Dumbbells and hammer strength he told me
Facts. You don't NEED the BIG 3 if you aren't powerlifting competing and have access to quality equipment. If I didn't lift at home I wouldn't back squat or barbell bench. I already only do RDL, no deadlift. Can still gain plenty of size and strength.
It´s bit fun, because I get the opposite fealing. When I flat bench with dumbbells I get a bit of pain in my shoulders, but never when I use a barbell. I guess people are different. But of course I don't lift as heavy as Cutler does.
@@mediaproof960I'm in the same boat. Massive improvements when I started doing incline barbell only. Start a lightweight and quickly worked up. I also got a multigroup bar so it helps a little bit on flat bench. Just don't push it. That's been my mistake. Every time i would feel no pain for a day or two I would try and rush and re aggravated it.
Been making steady gains for a year and a half, and for the last month both shoulders have been killing me. Removed flat bench from my splits and now I'm like new again!
Your rear rotator muscles are solid knots. Sending refered pain to your shoulders while you bench. Go get ART done on your rear rotators and your shoulders will be pain free. I've been there. Many times.
thats the way to go for bench. I intentionally stick to moderate weight. Bench really isn't a "1 rep max" exercise like the squat and DL. Weighted dips are superior anyways!
@@Roshea yes. Dip is the overall superior chest exercise which maximizes the abdominal (lower) and sternal heads of the pec major, as well as front delts. Less emphasis on upper chest so also do incline presses
not optimal for SOME people, but to say dumbbell is objectively better is just not true. Neither is objectively “better” you have to figure out what works best for you.
@@brennand933of course dumbbell ir objectively and scientifically better, since it stretches more the pecs and te contraction is better too, if you have better ROM than obviously the exercise is better
@@daellegendas2519 Really it’s objectively better? Show me a study where they directly measured hypertrophy results from one group progressively overloaded dumbbell bench and the other group progressing barbell bench. Be careful about making dogmatic and sweeping claims because you appear un-scientific and frankly you look foolish.
@@brennand933 I looked it up and found a study that show the opposite of what they are claiming even though it's not about harm prevention from what I've seen. Bench press shows more activation than the dumbbell. I don't know about the validity or if it's a definitive answer just found it interesting. Personally I have no bias toward one or the other www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7675616/
Most people don't bench press correctly. A lot of people in gyms bounce the bar off their chest to give themselves momentum to lift weights they cannot control. You should ALWAYS pause the bar on the chest briefly before pressing up, if you can't do that then the weight is too heavy for you.
I agree, with the right technique the risk is very low. I also switched from the normal bench press with legdrive to the Larsen press without the help of my legs and have made more progress in the chest as a result, I can only recommend it.
Hard disagree, saying “you don’t do it right” when statistically eventually almost everyone has the same issue with something means it’s most likely not the people but the common factor (this time being the bench)
And what Jays talking about has nothing to do with that. He’s talking about the entire movement of the bench press being unnatural to how your shoulder joints (cuffs) are suppose to rotate. And he’s right.
@@chancellor8715no absolutely not, the people are all stupid and definitely at fault. I see it literally every day, people not being able to do it correctyl. Not even Jay was doing it right, his way of benching looked like a suicide attempt
Another problem is not overhead pressing enough. This leads to a one-sided strenghtening of the rotator cuff and this is what causes most of the accidents.
Pec tears generally happen to steroid users and people who don't know how to retract their shoulders during the lift. Stay natural, be patient with your progressions and flat bench like a powerlifter and you'll be good to go
@@johntrains1317 Look at how Russel Orhii benches and other powerlifters. The PL stance prestretches the pecs lmfao it's literally better for hypertrophy and strength, you're probably think of those who arch their backs like crazy
I’ve been lifting for 4-5 years. I have ALOT of issues. My mistakes were, poor form, exercising the same muscle group more than 3 times a week. Not enough protein. Bench pressing hurt me 5 times, shoulders hurt me once, flys hurt me once, and squats have once. DONT go to heavy too early, especially with BAD form. Also, once you tweek or hurt something DONT keep lifting on the hurt muscle/joint, like I did alot. Now-a-days, I don’t violate any of those rules, and for 2 years no injury, and I can bench 275 lbs for reps and almost 315. It’s all about form, and not being dumb.
Yes, I agree. Bad for shoulder joints and rotator cuffs. I met a physician who had rotator cuff surgeries on both shoulders at age 28 which I think could have been from bench pressing. He just said he looked at as services rendered. However, injuries can usually be prevented.
I think the main issue with flat bench - from personal experience, is that the bar is straight. That coupled with being new or novice at lifting technique, and not knowing how much weight to put. I fucked up my shoulders with only like 60lbs when I was like 22. But now I almost exclusively do dumbbell bench press because it allows your shoulders and hands to move more comfortably. I just maxed out at 70lbs for 4 reps a couple days ago. So I went from benching 60lbs and hurting my shoulders to benching 140lbs
Agreed brother Unless you are doing Smith machine incline with a spotter, the barbell chest press is just another tool in the arsenal I do think having that ability to progressively overload and confidently go higher is good, though - for me, it's more stable to do 120kg on an incline machine chest press for 8-10 reps And then I do 32kg dumbells, four sets of 8-10 This is after I've worked on some low, moderately and heavy seated pec flys on the machine, superset with assorted dips
Yeah. I started with dumbbells for 3-4 years and got up to 100’s for 4. But whenever I when and did 185 lbs on bench press for the first time, it’d hurt. Now I’ve been only practicing straight bench press for 2 years, improved my form much better, it feels way more comfortable. Been doing 275 lbs for 3 every chest day. It’s all about form, adjusting the bench to fit your body, and having the bar path correct. Also the bar even too.
@@cooluser23 dumbbells are free weights so is much higher risk than bench. Bench has a connecting bar so if one arm is weaker than the other, there is some stability and compensation available to get through the lift.
AKA he built a ton of muscle mass using archaic bodybuilding techniques instead of powerlifting techniques with proper shoulder mobility and retraction training. Flat bench is only nominally more dangerous when you are lifting upwards of 300 lbs, or in other words, more than 99% of lifters will achieve anyway. If you are not a mature lifter, don’t even consider removing flat bench from your training, it’s a great chest building compound movement.
Based on the new information ive seen about incline essentially training the whole pec. Ive only done incline. Since then i haven't had an issues with shoulder pain.
Amen took my 40 years to stop even though I was aware of all the shoulder problems (I would sprain my rotator cuff tendons every 3-4 years and couldn’t bench for 10-months to a year.Now at 63 I only do inclines no shoulder issues.
Someone once told me he never did flat bench/ whatever and all he ever did was incline machine flies incline bench etc…I’ll have to look into this more
@@TheBoon14 Cant agree more, when i remove bench press from my training and start doing with dumbbell i keep grove my chest mutch better, also fly machine, and streching with cabels its amazing.
Oh yeah, jay. I never thanked you for the tip about reverse grip barbell rows. You were right, I feel my lats a lot more on this rather than the pronated version. Thanks man.
I've been using bench press since I was 15 years old not once have I had any issues I think it's preference and choice never have I tried to ego lift on the bench press is why most people get hurt I'm 44 years old and I still bench press today no issues
happened to me at 42 years old. Wasn't using a lot more weight than usual. Just hadn't fully recovered I think from the past two weeks. Basically tore the muscle in half.
This advice literally got me injured. Everyone is different structurally, i got injured from the incine dumbell bench twice. Never had a problem with flat barbell bench.
Just pulled my muscle benching for the second time. Seeing this video today I’m done with flat bench never got 315 but I’ll be alright not getting this injury again is worth it
Man I just got into bench press and I get shoulder pain sometimes and when I rotate my shoulders they pop at times I hit 295 and I want to hit 3 plates so bad but now you got me wanting to slow down I wanted to attempt it Monday
It took me 5 years to get from 295 to 300. I hurt my shoulder twice and each time it took me a year to get back up to 295. I finally broke the 300lb barrier when I was asked to participate in a lift a thon charity event at my gym. I guess all I needed was someone next to me in a wheelchair cheering me on. Good luck I hope you get up 300lb today!
@@JohnWilliams-dy5dz thank you I attempted 315 twice got half way failed and I told the guy that spotted me that I just started he said your form was off I wasn’t distributing weight evenly and I would t plant my heals so we dropped it to 300 then 295 then 275 finally 225 and just practice my form pause three seconds and push to get over that barrier now ima just focus and pure form with only two plates for a month or two
Been doing flat barbell bench religiously for 33 years and currently doing 285 for reps. I could go heavier but don’t because of pec tear fears. However, you need to listen to your body and do what works for you.
I rarely do barbell flat bench press anymore as I got older. It started getting weirdly uncomfortable on my shoulders so everything he’s saying is pretty relatable. I prefer using dumbbells for bench press cause you can isolate movements where there is less tension on your pecs and shoulders
I've never torn my pec on bench press. Been lifting since 9th grade, now 51. Just did 10 sets of 3 reps with 300. 10th set I got 20 reps. I've worked my way up to that slowly. But consistency is key. I rest for a week in between. Rest is also key. Jay is saying to do it 3 times per week. When are you giving your muscles time to heal with that much work per week?! I like to work them hard just to the point of almost failure. Then rest. Rest is just as important. Just my humble opinion, but it's working for me. Find what works best for you. It's not the same for everyone. We all heal at different rates. I'm not trying to be a body builder though either, so there's the difference. Still like learning from these guys
I find that I like dumbbell pressing far more than bench press. I figure this is fairly common but what people don’t know that’s really good is bench pressing with a neutral grip. Try it if you can find a bar it’s amazing it squeezes your pecks together infinitely better than a standard bench press. It also takes most of the triceps and front delts out of it so you really feel like you are using your chest.
@@BenPlayford-jx1oyhe is mr Olympia who tf are u? If your goal is just building muscles effectively as possible while would u bench when it’s very risky which u can get same results with other safe excersise
@@tomjaap2933Listen to what the Goat is saying, smartass. EVERYONE he knows who flat benches has problems. He obviously knows people of his calibre and slightly slower.
I've never felt right on a flat bench and to finally hear a pro say it's bad is validating, I prefer dumbell presses and seated chest press, feels much better overall
It's only bad for your shoulder if you go wide grip/flat back. If you keep your elbows tucked at a 45° angle to the bar and get as much natural arch as possible you won't be using your front delts as much and the lift will be very safe.
For most folks, the barbell bench press is very safe, and a great exercise choice. Not essential, but a good choice. Let’s not forget that Jay is/was: a) enormous, with the limited mobility that comes from being the literal hulk b) outrageously strong, so had to use massive weights most of us will never touch just to get a stimulus c) on a lot of special supplements, which grow muscle at a much faster rate than tendons/connective tissues.
Lifting consistently for 35 years and can say without hesitation the flat barbell bench is the worst exercise in the gym for so many reasons but specifically the ones mentioned here by Jay
Lol be stubborn if you want to...HE TOLD NO LIE..20 yrs in and im the same..barbell incline for sure but not flat. Dumbbells or machines with all the new great machines they have, u don't need the barbell flat press
I try and keep the elbows more tucked than flared, imagine doing a barbell row. I don't arch my back more than is necessary to get my scapula retracted. Lower to my lower chest and I don't push straight up I press up and a bit toward my chin.
Grip way way way too wide. Move them in, play with lighter weights, the pain will stop immediately. I don't mean move in a finger. Move in one hand width each side.
JAY YOUR A SMART MAN 💯I HAVE SEEN MANY MYSELF THEY WOULD AWAYS ASK ME HOW MUCH YOU BENCH I WOULD WOULD ENOUGH 🏋💪I AM ALL ABOUT DUMBELLS TRAINING YOU USE SOO MUCH MORE IN MOVEMENT'S AND BENEFITS USING DUMBELLS MANY HAD LIFE TIME INJURYS I NEVER HAD 1 I LOOKED GOOD AND I WOULD STUDY ON HOW TO MAKE EACH MOVEMENTS COULD BE HARDED TO DO WITH SAME WEIGHT YOU THE MAN💪 HOPE TO MEET AND GET A WORK OUT IN THE FUTURE IAM STARTING FROM THE BOTTOM AGAIN LIFES STRESSES ALMOST TOOK ME OUT AND AWAY FROM MY LOVE IN LIF AND I MAJOR THING IS WEIGHT AND BODY BUILDING TRAIN NEVER COMPETED BUT ALWAYS HAD A DREAM TO 2O24 THE YEAR OF GREATNESS BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY SOO PROUD FOR YOU JAY🌟🏋🙏💯
The lesson here is to dont neglect stretching and working on your chest muscles between sessions. Dont make them tight. Flat bench is the best mass builder.
@@megantaylormichaels Thats a finisher not a mass builder. You dont just do flyes movements on chestday. No one has ever built a great big chest with only flyes.
I disagree, if you do flat bench press with light weight and high reps is key for adding size but to each their own. And yes maxing out on the bench press is playing with fire and can lead to a pec tear, especially if you are juicing
With dumbbells you can get a nice stretch and squeeze, which the barebell press does not have. That added ROM and fact your arr pushing both sides equally probably allows for less risk of injury. I don't think the flat position has much risk, although I do prefer a small incline either way for more upper chest emphasis.
Thank You for mentioning this. I have injured my shoulder joints by trying to increase my barbell bench pressing. I went to dumbbells and machines where the hands can travel on their own paths but always wondered if I was doing something wrong.
Спорт
Jay is one of the truly good dudes in bodybuilding. No ego or condescension.
Piss is stored in the balls
I met him, he was kinda cold tbh. And this was an autograph signing that he deff got paid for
@@coltonkosto98I wouldnt take it personally. Im sure the guy must have done hundreds of other autographs or photos before you met him! Meet and greets especially with a big crowd can always drain your energy like crazy
He says a lot of bs too. A lot
No ego? Lol fuck outta here
New fear unlocked:
Tearing pec on bench press 🏋🏻♂️💪😫
Just dont guillotine press and if you use gear dont make too big of a jumps when you’re getting stronger
It’s mostly from people on gear especially gear that puts your nervous system or whatever into overdrive overnight so your able to lift more weight but your body hasn’t adjusted to that
@@chickentoucher55 gear makes your muscles grow faster and thus your strength goes up too. The only thing that gear doesnt grow is your tendons, which are responsible for keeping your insertions attached to the bone. Those are the ones that tear if you go too heavy or overload it through volume
Don't worry, u won't ever reach the bench press level that allows u to tear the pecs.
@@Robert-xk1cn you dont need to go heavy to tear a pec lol
That’s why he’s bodybuildings life time achiever.. longevity is the name of the game!
Exactly. Ronnie Coleman over did it and is now in a wheelchair.
U would know.
@@Jake-be9jibench pressing won’t do that I can guarantee that
@@AK12255 search torn pecs bench press. That won’t put you in a wheelchair but you won’t be in the gym any more. Squats put him in a wheelchair. I’ve been lifting for 17 years. Play it safe kid. Longevity wins
Not a single pro bodybuilder can flaunt longevity. They’re all taking so many drugs that are poison for the body. This isn’t a low dose of TRT when you’re 55, these guys are actually killing themselves
He told me this same thing at the Cutler classic in Boston about 10 years ago. I was lucky to talk to him . He was super nice. Dumbbells and hammer strength he told me
Hammer strength??
@@sheldonbelanger4318 Hammer strength is a brand of machine. So probably machine chest press he meant
Facts. You don't NEED the BIG 3 if you aren't powerlifting competing and have access to quality equipment. If I didn't lift at home I wouldn't back squat or barbell bench. I already only do RDL, no deadlift. Can still gain plenty of size and strength.
It´s bit fun, because I get the opposite fealing. When I flat bench with dumbbells I get a bit of pain in my shoulders, but never when I use a barbell. I guess people are different.
But of course I don't lift as heavy as Cutler does.
or decline like yates did.
So true messed up my shoulder bad and took forever to heal, but when I finally was able to return to the gym I stuck with dumbbell bench
Facts, took me 12 months to get my shoulders back to normal. DB the way forward
8mos into a shoulder injury and I really don't know what to do at this point. Any advice?
@@mikedwyer3108 see previous commnet
@@mediaproof960 I slightly injured mine in 2002, nothing sudden, a faint pain just appeared slowly during exercise and it remained to this day
@@mediaproof960I'm in the same boat. Massive improvements when I started doing incline barbell only. Start a lightweight and quickly worked up. I also got a multigroup bar so it helps a little bit on flat bench. Just don't push it. That's been my mistake. Every time i would feel no pain for a day or two I would try and rush and re aggravated it.
Been making steady gains for a year and a half, and for the last month both shoulders have been killing me. Removed flat bench from my splits and now I'm like new again!
You should watch out the videos on shoulder pain by Squat University, my bench got pain free when i started doing rotator cuff stuff
Deca will help your joints also😂
@@superpoacher6711really what you posted wasn't even funny
@@superpoacher6711is the joke that it's actually bad for your joints?
Your rear rotator muscles are solid knots. Sending refered pain to your shoulders while you bench. Go get ART done on your rear rotators and your shoulders will be pain free. I've been there. Many times.
Incline dumbell press has become my favorite and doesn't strain my shoulders like flat bench with bar use to.
Exactly, I’m all about the inclined bench w/ dumbbells
Im just pressing 60-80% of max and more reps 😅 Keeping it safe
thats the way to go for bench. I intentionally stick to moderate weight. Bench really isn't a "1 rep max" exercise like the squat and DL. Weighted dips are superior anyways!
Exactly, I used to try to hit 12-15 reps on bench, but havent benched in a whike my shoulder doesnt like it
@@aaronwylie6928 For more than just the bottom pecs?
Yea, I keep my rep goals from 7-12 and if I can't hit 6 I need to use less weight
@@Roshea yes. Dip is the overall superior chest exercise which maximizes the abdominal (lower) and sternal heads of the pec major, as well as front delts. Less emphasis on upper chest so also do incline presses
I saw a guy tore his pec on the flat bench press when I was in high school. Brutal to witness.
As a pro BB I 100% absolutely agree with Jay’s statement 💪🔥🔥🔥
So true, not optimal for chest compared to
dumbell press and it’s very tough on the shoulder joint once you start lifting heavy
Once you start lifting more than you should
not optimal for SOME people, but to say dumbbell is objectively better is just not true. Neither is objectively “better” you have to figure out what works best for you.
@@brennand933of course dumbbell ir objectively and scientifically better, since it stretches more the pecs and te contraction is better too, if you have better ROM than obviously the exercise is better
@@daellegendas2519 Really it’s objectively better? Show me a study where they directly measured hypertrophy results from one group progressively overloaded dumbbell bench and the other group progressing barbell bench. Be careful about making dogmatic and sweeping claims because you appear un-scientific and frankly you look foolish.
@@brennand933 I looked it up and found a study that show the opposite of what they are claiming even though it's not about harm prevention from what I've seen. Bench press shows more activation than the dumbbell. I don't know about the validity or if it's a definitive answer just found it interesting. Personally I have no bias toward one or the other www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7675616/
incline bench and chest dips work well for me
Yessir, and your good ol push-ups and its variations + incline bench and dips.. pretty much all u need for chest, maybe some cable flys or some
That's the one, dips always produce great results
Chest dips I do and it seems like my shoulder is healing but incline bench hmmmm ok I'll try that
True..these 2 is that u need
I do dips because I only have a dip/pull up thing at home and am too broke for a gym membership - glad this gets Jay's approval lol😂
Most people don't bench press correctly.
A lot of people in gyms bounce the bar off their chest to give themselves momentum to lift weights they cannot control.
You should ALWAYS pause the bar on the chest briefly before pressing up, if you can't do that then the weight is too heavy for you.
I agree, with the right technique the risk is very low. I also switched from the normal bench press with legdrive to the Larsen press without the help of my legs and have made more progress in the chest as a result, I can only recommend it.
Hard disagree, saying “you don’t do it right” when statistically eventually almost everyone has the same issue with something means it’s most likely not the people but the common factor (this time being the bench)
@@chancellor8715 Now apply this to firearms
And what Jays talking about has nothing to do with that. He’s talking about the entire movement of the bench press being unnatural to how your shoulder joints (cuffs) are suppose to rotate. And he’s right.
@@chancellor8715no absolutely not, the people are all stupid and definitely at fault. I see it literally every day, people not being able to do it correctyl. Not even Jay was doing it right, his way of benching looked like a suicide attempt
Another problem is not overhead pressing enough. This leads to a one-sided strenghtening of the rotator cuff and this is what causes most of the accidents.
Never hurted myself on a bench in 15 years 🤷
Good technique, warmup and choose wisely your exercises
Are you on a shit load of gear which weakens the tendons?
Well, Jay is pressing more than 135, so..
@@voke4553 the gears doesnt weakens them you gain muscles too Quickly and that's the issue with the bigger weights ans I dont take anything yet
@@idealsAREisomorphic I bench 150 kg for 8
@thouveninvijayan3073 Ha! Gottem. I just put up 315 lbs for 8 on Monday fairly comfortably. I'm hoping to get 405 lbs this year.
My old man shoulders endorse this message 👍🏽
This 67 year old man up to 205 at bench in a year. See about 225 by end of the year.
***If you bench incorrectly***
And if you inject a ton of drugs*****
Pec tears generally happen to steroid users and people who don't know how to retract their shoulders during the lift. Stay natural, be patient with your progressions and flat bench like a powerlifter and you'll be good to go
I tore it on the flat bench without any steroid use, full warmup, and 90% of my max weight.
@@hugoruzicka6035 hence the "generally" sorry about what happened
@@johntrains1317 Look at how Russel Orhii benches and other powerlifters. The PL stance prestretches the pecs lmfao it's literally better for hypertrophy and strength, you're probably think of those who arch their backs like crazy
Because powerlifters never tear a pec, right?
@@mach5jeep Doing 1RMs isn't really being patient with your progressions is it? Use your brain
Good man. Thanks for spreading that good info. I like the incline and decline to open it up.
Yup. Going for dumbell press , way better
Unstable. Bar gives you a lot more control.
Ive been lifting for 3 years i fixed my form and stretch regularly everyday. No issues
Bad weightlifting form will cause an injury.
Stretching on heavy lifts is also bad for you.
I’ve been lifting for 4-5 years. I have ALOT of issues. My mistakes were, poor form, exercising the same muscle group more than 3 times a week. Not enough protein. Bench pressing hurt me 5 times, shoulders hurt me once, flys hurt me once, and squats have once. DONT go to heavy too early, especially with BAD form. Also, once you tweek or hurt something DONT keep lifting on the hurt muscle/joint, like I did alot. Now-a-days, I don’t violate any of those rules, and for 2 years no injury, and I can bench 275 lbs for reps and almost 315. It’s all about form, and not being dumb.
Yes, I agree. Bad for shoulder joints and rotator cuffs. I met a physician who had rotator cuff surgeries on both shoulders at age 28 which I think could have been from bench pressing. He just said he looked at as services rendered. However, injuries can usually be prevented.
Dumbbell flies are even harder on your shoulders.
Try slightly inclined.
I think the main issue with flat bench - from personal experience, is that the bar is straight. That coupled with being new or novice at lifting technique, and not knowing how much weight to put. I fucked up my shoulders with only like 60lbs when I was like 22.
But now I almost exclusively do dumbbell bench press because it allows your shoulders and hands to move more comfortably. I just maxed out at 70lbs for 4 reps a couple days ago.
So I went from benching 60lbs and hurting my shoulders to benching 140lbs
Agreed brother
Unless you are doing Smith machine incline with a spotter, the barbell chest press is just another tool in the arsenal
I do think having that ability to progressively overload and confidently go higher is good, though - for me, it's more stable to do 120kg on an incline machine chest press for 8-10 reps
And then I do 32kg dumbells, four sets of 8-10
This is after I've worked on some low, moderately and heavy seated pec flys on the machine, superset with assorted dips
U can def do more than 140 too now I bet. But keep it safe brother
Yeah. I started with dumbbells for 3-4 years and got up to 100’s for 4. But whenever I when and did 185 lbs on bench press for the first time, it’d hurt. Now I’ve been only practicing straight bench press for 2 years, improved my form much better, it feels way more comfortable. Been doing 275 lbs for 3 every chest day. It’s all about form, adjusting the bench to fit your body, and having the bar path correct. Also the bar even too.
Well, while you're right we can't really say that jay cutler does not know his stuff...
Dumbbell to bb bench conversion isn't really a 1:1 conversion. You can def bench more barbell, dumbbell is harder
I'm 37 and training just to look good and be healthy,flat bench isn't worth it anymore.
Always worth it. Working out bench has lowered my cholesterol way down. Added deadlift more recently. Cholesterol just straight downward trend.
Once I switched to dumbbells my chest improved. Bench really isn't worth the risk.
@@cooluser23 dumbbells are free weights so is much higher risk than bench. Bench has a connecting bar so if one arm is weaker than the other, there is some stability and compensation available to get through the lift.
@@khaki_man Incline grip width has to be much narrow than flat bench, which is likely why it hurts your shoulders.
Bench lowering cholesterol?? Is this you liver king?
Caveat is *if you abuse a shit ton of gear and bench* it increases pec tear risk
AKA he built a ton of muscle mass using archaic bodybuilding techniques instead of powerlifting techniques with proper shoulder mobility and retraction training. Flat bench is only nominally more dangerous when you are lifting upwards of 300 lbs, or in other words, more than 99% of lifters will achieve anyway. If you are not a mature lifter, don’t even consider removing flat bench from your training, it’s a great chest building compound movement.
I get this. Tore m y rotator on the bench while training for a show. Now I only do dumbbell presses. Solid advice as usual Jay. #MrO ##Fit50 💪🏼
Ditto! Took me months to recover from a shoulder injury doing flat Bench barbell press. Now, I only do this for finishing moves w very little weight.
Jay knows what he's talking about. Decades in the industry and managed to mostly avoid injury, unlike The King Ronnie
One of the smartest bodybuilders of all time.
He is correct. EVERYONE I know has torn their pec using heavy weight with the barbell flat bench.
Based on the new information ive seen about incline essentially training the whole pec. Ive only done incline. Since then i haven't had an issues with shoulder pain.
Watching with a sore shoulder
lol me too. Taking Jay’s advice now.
I just wanna be able to bench 315 and I’ll be satisfied
😁
Agree 315 is a good goal, then stop.
I hear you brotha, 3 plates and my goal is accomplished
Me too brother!
@@jimmyjohnson6232
You're lucky you don't have shoulder issues its rare at your age.
Yup. I’m a rookie next to this guy but I cut out barbell flat bench few years ago. Shoulders have never been happier.
Amen took my 40 years to stop even though I was aware of all the shoulder problems (I would sprain my rotator cuff tendons every 3-4 years and couldn’t bench for 10-months to a year.Now at 63 I only do inclines no shoulder issues.
That explains a lot actually
Someone once told me he never did flat bench/ whatever and all he ever did was incline machine flies incline bench etc…I’ll have to look into this more
@@tank1110 very interesting. my elbows hurt on both flat and incline
You find the incline only is sufficient for lower peck growth?
@rw8990 DITTO! Your story reads about identical to mine. I'm 67... injured my shoulder...more than once doing flat bench...took MONTHS to stop hurting
dumbbell bench press is king
Specifically incline!
@@TheBoon14 yes!
agree, feel the squeeze so much better than barbell bench.
@@TheBoon14 Cant agree more, when i remove bench press from my training and start doing with dumbbell i keep grove my chest mutch better, also fly machine, and streching with cabels its amazing.
@@BeLLicus19 yes sir!!
True. BP always felt weird to begin with so ditched it years ago.
Glad I came across this. My shoulder joints do hurt when doing flat bench. No more. I’ll stick to flys, incline, and hsmmer strength
When you have Quagmire as a training partner, anything is possible
Oh yeah, jay. I never thanked you for the tip about reverse grip barbell rows. You were right, I feel my lats a lot more on this rather than the pronated version. Thanks man.
I've been using bench press since I was 15 years old not once have I had any issues I think it's preference and choice never have I tried to ego lift on the bench press is why most people get hurt I'm 44 years old and I still bench press today no issues
He is spot on bench pressing will eventually damage the rotator cuff
happened to me at 42 years old. Wasn't using a lot more weight than usual. Just hadn't fully recovered I think from the past two weeks. Basically tore the muscle in half.
"tore in half" is a CAT scan diagnosis, or just hysteria? 67 years old, bench is at 205.
guys remember this only applies to enhanced lifters since you are never tearing anything as a natural only your hamstring maybe
Regardless take caution.
How about biceps? I've seen some horrible videos
Plenty of normal people have hurt their shoulders bench pressing.
@@BigJavWJ yeah bicep tears can occur but they are very rare
@@loonneye rotator cuff pain is pretty common but it is not a tear so it’s not a major problem
This advice literally got me injured. Everyone is different structurally, i got injured from the incine dumbell bench twice. Never had a problem with flat barbell bench.
Love this guy. Says how it is and can back it up.
Legends never die
Watching this In Between The rest of Bench Press Sets 😮
Switch to dumbell.
He’s so right. Short of tricep presses flat barbell is useless
Just pulled my muscle benching for the second time. Seeing this video today I’m done with flat bench never got 315 but I’ll be alright not getting this injury again is worth it
Man I just got into bench press and I get shoulder pain sometimes and when I rotate my shoulders they pop at times I hit 295 and I want to hit 3 plates so bad but now you got me wanting to slow down I wanted to attempt it Monday
It took me 5 years to get from 295 to 300. I hurt my shoulder twice and each time it took me a year to get back up to 295. I finally broke the 300lb barrier when I was asked to participate in a lift a thon charity event at my gym. I guess all I needed was someone next to me in a wheelchair cheering me on.
Good luck I hope you get up 300lb today!
@@JohnWilliams-dy5dz thank you I attempted 315 twice got half way failed and I told the guy that spotted me that I just started he said your form was off I wasn’t distributing weight evenly and I would t plant my heals so we dropped it to 300 then 295 then 275 finally 225 and just practice my form pause three seconds and push to get over that barrier now ima just focus and pure form with only two plates for a month or two
Grip way too wide if shoulders are hurting you. Move way in, start with one full hand width in each side. Give that a few days. Pain should stop.
@@donaldkasper8346 thank you
I will definitely believe and listen Mr. Olympia if he says it's bad.
Are you for real lmao
@@miso5968 so what are you gonna do
Make him beleive otherwise?
@@umarhossain2701 no, I'll just make fun of him
its not bad, its just a balance of risk to reward. its much easier and safe to fail on dumbbells, plus u can get a bigger rom
Drop Flat bench. I did and without any regret and no pec tears and shoulders are just fine. 23 yrs lifting
I love it when you tell me what not to do but offer no alternative
Watching this with a pec Strain 🫠
Same, How's your recovery?
Been doing flat barbell bench religiously for 33 years and currently doing 285 for reps. I could go heavier but don’t because of pec tear fears. However, you need to listen to your body and do what works for you.
He is right. Its one of the works exercises for the shoulder joint.
I rarely do barbell flat bench press anymore as I got older. It started getting weirdly uncomfortable on my shoulders so everything he’s saying is pretty relatable. I prefer using dumbbells for bench press cause you can isolate movements where there is less tension on your pecs and shoulders
Have you tried the swiss bar bench press?. It doesn't give me shoulder issues like the barbell bench press.
Can’t get rid of incline barbell bench love it to much 😅
He does incline still, its specifically the flat that is the worst offender. Not that incline is without it's own risk ofc.
Shoulder surgery and you will trust me.
@@hotwheel6663 so everyone to ever touch a barbell has shoulder surgery
Me hitting a pr of 125kg on flat 😢
I've never torn my pec on bench press. Been lifting since 9th grade, now 51. Just did 10 sets of 3 reps with 300. 10th set I got 20 reps. I've worked my way up to that slowly. But consistency is key. I rest for a week in between. Rest is also key. Jay is saying to do it 3 times per week. When are you giving your muscles time to heal with that much work per week?! I like to work them hard just to the point of almost failure. Then rest. Rest is just as important. Just my humble opinion, but it's working for me. Find what works best for you. It's not the same for everyone. We all heal at different rates. I'm not trying to be a body builder though either, so there's the difference. Still like learning from these guys
I find that I like dumbbell pressing far more than bench press. I figure this is fairly common but what people don’t know that’s really good is bench pressing with a neutral grip. Try it if you can find a bar it’s amazing it squeezes your pecks together infinitely better than a standard bench press. It also takes most of the triceps and front delts out of it so you really feel like you are using your chest.
Same bro. Angled cables is the way.
Yeah cos your like him 😂😂😂
Lmao you must be a female
@@BenPlayford-jx1oy We lift. Do you?
@@BenPlayford-jx1oyhe is mr Olympia who tf are u?
If your goal is just building muscles effectively as possible while would u bench when it’s very risky which u can get same results with other safe excersise
Anytime I touch the barbells I end up with shoulder or pectoral injuries :/ so I been sticking to dumbbells or machines only
Maybe it is you and not the barbell???
@@tomjaap2933Listen to what the Goat is saying, smartass. EVERYONE he knows who flat benches has problems. He obviously knows people of his calibre and slightly slower.
I've always preferred a slight incline to the flat barbell bench. Dumbells are a good alternative either way.
We only have 45 incline at my gym. My weight I use that is half of my flat bench.
I've never felt right on a flat bench and to finally hear a pro say it's bad is validating, I prefer dumbell presses and seated chest press, feels much better overall
My buddy literally tore his pec doing the flat bench press
Me: Is my chest gonna look like yours?
Jay cutler: INNN DEEED!
Broooooo plz tell me where you got that line from no way it from where I think it is
@@barakatchashenyi7093 EURO TRAINING 😜
It's only bad for your shoulder if you go wide grip/flat back. If you keep your elbows tucked at a 45° angle to the bar and get as much natural arch as possible you won't be using your front delts as much and the lift will be very safe.
He's right!. The bench press is so uncomfortable to me! I do inclines instead....💪🏾
For most folks, the barbell bench press is very safe, and a great exercise choice. Not essential, but a good choice.
Let’s not forget that Jay is/was:
a) enormous, with the limited mobility that comes from being the literal hulk
b) outrageously strong, so had to use massive weights most of us will never touch just to get a stimulus
c) on a lot of special supplements, which grow muscle at a much faster rate than tendons/connective tissues.
Lifting consistently for 35 years and can say without hesitation the flat barbell bench is the worst exercise in the gym for so many reasons but specifically the ones mentioned here by Jay
I’ve used a flat bench press for years now and don’t have any problems especially since I’m natty
His pressing form is not safe bench is one of the better shoulder exercises and safer than a overhead press
Lol be stubborn if you want to...HE TOLD NO LIE..20 yrs in and im the same..barbell incline for sure but not flat. Dumbbells or machines with all the new great machines they have, u don't need the barbell flat press
@@jaygib105 sorry bro but science moves forward and that’s not the consensus anymore
I never feel the chest muscles get engaged or feel soreness after benching, just wrecks my shoulders
I try and keep the elbows more tucked than flared, imagine doing a barbell row. I don't arch my back more than is necessary to get my scapula retracted. Lower to my lower chest and I don't push straight up I press up and a bit toward my chin.
Grip way way way too wide. Move them in, play with lighter weights, the pain will stop immediately. I don't mean move in a finger. Move in one hand width each side.
Then you're definitely doing it wrong. The bench presses one of the best chest exercises
I do dumbbell press. You have to work harder (consciously or not) to maintain stability through the movement.
Pectoralis tear with a bone evulsion fracture here after heavy bench pressing for 20 years it finally got me bad good advice Jay
Incline bench best chest movement?
I tore a peck a few years ago. After I healed, I made the most progress in benching in my life. Don't give up, get back on the horse!
As a young lifter who wants to lift hardcore for life, injuring my shoulder is what i fear the most.
Jay is not a muscle head he actually speaks common sense I really like that!
Maturing in the gym is what we like to call it. Once you can check your ego, the real gains begin.
Can we alternate it with DB press?
Way more free range of motion
I love these experience tips
JAY YOUR A SMART MAN 💯I HAVE SEEN MANY MYSELF THEY WOULD AWAYS ASK ME HOW MUCH YOU BENCH I WOULD WOULD ENOUGH 🏋💪I AM ALL ABOUT DUMBELLS TRAINING YOU USE SOO MUCH MORE IN MOVEMENT'S AND BENEFITS USING DUMBELLS MANY HAD LIFE TIME INJURYS I NEVER HAD 1 I LOOKED GOOD AND I WOULD STUDY ON HOW TO MAKE EACH MOVEMENTS COULD BE HARDED TO DO WITH SAME WEIGHT YOU THE MAN💪 HOPE TO MEET AND GET A WORK OUT IN THE FUTURE IAM STARTING FROM THE BOTTOM AGAIN LIFES STRESSES ALMOST TOOK ME OUT AND AWAY FROM MY LOVE IN LIF AND I MAJOR THING IS WEIGHT AND BODY BUILDING TRAIN NEVER COMPETED BUT ALWAYS HAD A DREAM TO 2O24 THE YEAR OF GREATNESS BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY SOO PROUD FOR YOU JAY🌟🏋🙏💯
The lesson here is to dont neglect stretching and working on your chest muscles between sessions. Dont make them tight.
Flat bench is the best mass builder.
Dumbbell flies is the ultimate mass builder. Work up to 120s for 20, Arnold's fave.
@@megantaylormichaels Thats a finisher not a mass builder. You dont just do flyes movements on chestday. No one has ever built a great big chest with only flyes.
I disagree, if you do flat bench press with light weight and high reps is key for adding size but to each their own. And yes maxing out on the bench press is playing with fire and can lead to a pec tear, especially if you are juicing
Really? Im doing 10 reps currently and still feel a bit awkward on my shoulders sometimes..
@@law2340 10 reps is heavy, try 50 reps
Good call. I'm no body builder but I prefer to do dips and incline in lieu of flat bench
This only applies to dudes that size and dudes with poor form. 99% of you Don’t take this as advice.
@@3AcesCapital He's right. You're bot gonna tear your chest with proper form as a natty. Hurting your wrists is way way more likely.
I don’t think Thor has a bad form on his bench … he still tore his pec though
@@_JC_Denton_ Thor wasn’t average dude at the gym
@@marken816 even then, proper form won’t hurt your wrists
Pec tear is not a problem if you're natty and recover.
It definitely alters your physique tho, even after surgery and full recovery you’ll see the muscle insertion changes quite a bit and looks uneven
With dumbbells you can get a nice stretch and squeeze, which the barebell press does not have. That added ROM and fact your arr pushing both sides equally probably allows for less risk of injury.
I don't think the flat position has much risk, although I do prefer a small incline either way for more upper chest emphasis.
Thank You for mentioning this. I have injured my shoulder joints by trying to increase my barbell bench pressing. I went to dumbbells and machines where the hands can travel on their own paths but always wondered if I was doing something wrong.
dumbells all the way stay kinda light 120s/130s for reps is the sweet spot
That’s light to you? Try 150s
@@TheMilo246 I usually do those for my lateral raises. Keep the reps high 😂
Those are light weight. Thats warmup for my standing kickbacks. Work my way up to the 200s
Couldn’t agree more … I replaced flat with incline only will do flat after I’m fried and can’t lift anywhere near my regular strength
Truth. Incline DB is much kinder on the shoulders.
That’s how my grandfather ruined his shoulder. He never went heavy on an upper body press movement again.
Excellent advice Jay.
Amen on barbell bemch press being horrible for your shoulders. All my workout buddies in the 80's thought I was stupid for using dumbells imstead.
Well said, scary exercise!
Reverse your grip on the BP and 'presto' no more shoulder issues and 30% more upper pec activation!
good form + no ped= 0 problems with bench press
I replaced the flat bench with incline dumbbells years ago. Much easier on the shoulders and you get that deep stretch at the bottom.