Best of Jan Ove Waldner vs Ma Lin
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- Опубликовано: 25 дек 2016
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Win or lose, doesn't matter, both of those guys are incredibly quick and gifted.
Still matters.
Haha. Ma Lin eather looking 14 or 50, no matter his actual age. Fantastic players, both. Both with absolute feeling and touch in their respective styles. Both some of the finest hands ever existed in tt.
Interesting to see the clash of styles.
Ma LIn is hiperactive, lightning fast footwork, offensive. Something like the "Paganini" of table tennis.
Jan Ove Waldner was known as the Mozart of table tennis, due to his "less effort possible" style. Defensive, economic, precise, refined.
Typical "physical vs. technical" duel. Always exciting.
Dan Nobumi federer vs nadal?
Something like this.
I think Waldner is allrounder
Ma Lin is nothing like physical, and so this is nothing like a physical vs technical duel... really bad labeling
I personally wouldn't say that Ma Lin is a physical player, even when he was in his prime.
The action on some of those top-spin forehands is crazy. How they control that on the attack and track it down on defense is amazing.
Because Waldner keeps a level center-of-mass, and only moves it when he has to, and moves smoothly, his eyes have less dynamic-tracking overhead to deal with. The calculations are simpler. Coaches should keep that in mind.
Two words : simply legendary.
Nirbhay Pandya big cats
Big cats
The Legend Waldner he has an amazing touch. He counters the Chinese Speed and Power with His Amazing Control and Placements. He is gifted in the Sport of Table Tennis.
Yep
It's a shame that in the 40mm+ era, Waldner's playing style is no longer feasible.
And he is a very nice guy
Ma Lin is a legend as well
@@vikingkrigare5329
He is but Waldner poses an Amazing touch on the ball. He is the Best European Player in my opinion.
Waldner is the best of all time.
It's sooo hard to compare players in this area ?? When ball got bigger and had to move arm from serve . Maybe waldner not as good . But his touch was something amazing even with smaller ball . He's my fav player of all time
Not even close he’s just the best of his era
Best of all time is easily ma long
The best of all time has h2h losing records against many players.
To say Waldner was enduring and resourceful, yes, but the best of all time???????
@@benthekeeshond545 Waldner didn't make washed up veterans relevant again like Ma Long did with Boll/Samsonov.h2h records my ass...Lost only 1 match out of 8 against Klampar(a league match in 1984) and Klampar had a better run in his 30's at the Olympics/WTTC than either of them ever did.So much for the h2h records...Of course against minnows like Ovtcharov/Mizutani he has good records.
It's Ma Long but Waldner has a beautiful game.
Excellent video and play. The save the ma lin made when the ball hit the back edge was incredible.
I think the reason why Waldner is greatly admired in China is because the way he plays. |
He makes it look effortless like a master in contrast to the frantic play style of most chinese. And this effortless play style appeals to the chinese mindset of a master that does ping pong effortlessly since it shows mastery.
As a Chinese, I can tell you that your theory makes more sense on Vladimir Samsonov. We always saying that his style is just like playing Tachi, which is very fit to Chinese mindset.
But for Waldner, on the one hand, we admire his toughness for competing with 6 generations of Chinese player.
On the other hand, he got really good-looking moves which differ from all other Europeans, especially his forehand.
Indeed as you said, he always performed a lot of effortless and master-like moves as well, but for Chinese fans, he is classified with Ma Lin, Xu Xin and Koki Niwa as very an entertaining player rather than someone who fit Chinese mindset.
Jan Ove Waldner G.O.A.T !
fun fact: china had 1 million full time tabletennis players while sweden had 10 at that time..
Both are phenomenal players!
Amazing how HD TV changed table tennis completely.
ITTF 2019: hold my 20fps 240p camera
Jan is the coolest player
can't believe waldner beat ma lin in 2004 olympics. i think waldner was like 35 or something at the time.
His play style is very physically conservative, look how little he moves in every shot, plus he is defensive most of the time, seeking the rival mistakes. That is what made him able to play at top level for so long. I love to watch him play. And Ma Lin, extremely good player also.
38, Ma Lin was 23 I guess.
Ma Lin is still not the same age Waldner was 2004
Waldner played 3 generations of Chinese players. Respect!
@@TheVampB simply because China always have new talents while Sweden don't.
Love Danny’s explanations
Impressive to see how Waldner adapt to the quick play of Ma Lin. He transforms into an equal quick opponent.
΄cause the quick play of Ma Lin was nothing new for Waldner.Guys like Gatien and Saive were speed demons and Waldner countered their shots all the time.
2 of the best players ever, and in my top 5 favorites
Two best player..
Waldner had a long career, and is a little bit like Messi: a genius driven by motivation. In 1997 he was at the peak of his powers, 31 years old, ranked #1, and he destroyed everything. Won every set and crushed Samsonov in the final. This is the level of Jordan, Messi and Ali. Superior in the world in a world sport.
Waldner .... the greatest player to ever to play table tennis ... period ..... a legend even in China
As liu guoliang said, with the 38mm ball waldner was best, but with 40mm ball ma long is, and will be the best for a long time.
Only caucasians would say Waldner is goat because white people won't accept that Ma Long is even better. His major titles speak for himself. Heck some white people even say Timo Boll is the best in this era while obviously there are Ma Long and Zhang Jike in his era. The only argument white people have is "longetivity" which is absurd. ITTF always change the rules, rangking system, etc anything they can to suppress China. For example in last Olympic they changed the max number of players from the same country from 3 to 2 because top 3 players are chinese. Because of these number limitations China can only focus on their best 3 or 4 men singles and since they have too many talents they need the older players to step down to make room for the younger talents. In Sweden and Germany they only have Waldner, Persson, and Timo, they don't have anyone to replace them and they have to play as long as they could for new talents in their country to finally show up. Kong Linghui, Liu Guoliang, Ma Lin, Wang Liqin, Wang Hao, Zhang Jike, and now Ma Long, Xu Xin, FZD, LJK. They produced top players at faster rate than any other country that's why even the slightest decline in performances can force them out of national team. While Waldner and Timo Boll can play forever for their country because no one will replace them.
@@aaronaaron5861 couldn't agree more
@@aaronaaron5861 It is not the number of titles you win that makes you the best. You can just see it. One drastic example of this is Ronaldinho, who was, like Waldner, unmatched at its prime. It is how they almost become one with the ball. Pure class.
@@aaronaaron5861 Ma Long didn't face much competition from foreign players,he played mostly against veterans.Waldner faced much stronger competition both in number and quality.
Waldner also was an innovator developing the serve grip whereas Ma Long is a cookie cutter mass-produced Chinese player.Comparisons with Waldner are silly.
Of course Chinese officials always want to hype their players.Ma Long has always been suffering from knee injuries he wouldn΄t make it in Waldner's era.At least the previous generation of Ma Lin,Wang Hao,Wang Liqin was injury free.
Regarding the legacy of Waldner as one of the best players ever, it is very difficult to compare different eras. The oldtimers that played in the 30s and 40s without rubber mocked the modern game. Waldner played from the late 70s until the 2010s. He was a great talent but the swedes analysed the dominating chinese players and decided to adopt their style to beat them. The european style at that time was a lot of topspin some distance from the table, Grubba and Appelgren being prime examples, and this was undone by more offensive play near the table by the chinese. Waldner signifies the adoption by standing close to the table with backhand blocks. Waldner was better than most other players to adopt his style, this was perhaps his great talent. In the 80s the Swedes got closer and closer to the Chinese by Waldner first reaching the singles final in New Dehli in 1987 and then the team and singles win in 1989. This was really a team effort that Waldner was the main representative of. Waldner then had problems with his back from the late 1990s, probably due to his long career, that together with the switch to the bigger ball hampered him at the last part of his career. I think that he had had a similar career even if it had started 20 years later considering his talent and adaptability.
J-O Waldner el más grande de todos los tiempos!!!
Both players are so good with using their wrists.
These guys seem to be so evenly matched. Does anyone know what their overall record is against each other?
I don't know the exact head to head results but in an interview JOW said ML won way more of their encounters.
www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/showthread.php?1796-Waldner-stats-vs-Chinese
Ma Lin vs Waldner 7-2 in Ma Lin favour.
In my opinion Waldner has the ability to become one of the greatest table tennis players ever, but only if he goes on with this quality of play and good and intelligent training sessions.
😂😂😂
All this experience, waldnerr , the best
JOW - Великий!
In the past "Ma Lin", now "Ma Long", future "Ma Lung"...
goat vs goat clash
Ok you can play
Ma Lin was Waldner's nemesis with a a negative head to head score of 2-7
Waldner beat him at least three times 1998 Italy Open, Yugoslav Open and the 2004 Olympics.
@@dickn.ormous1064 Waldner has a superior record over Ma Lin. In fact, Waldner has a superior record over all the Chinese. That is why Waldner is the best
@@alberthuang4868 He doesn't have superior record over Ma Lin but he beat him in the Olympics at the age of 38.Ma Lin retired at the age of 33 after losing to Japanese blocker Matsudaira.Ma Lin doesn't hold a candle to Waldner and that's a fact.
Mozart is like Boss
Waldner does not posses the speed and footwork in Table Tennis. His master the technique of precise control and placement of the ball. His ability to chance the pace of the game gives the Best Chinese Players a Hard Time.
@@CoolCoyote
Show me a Chinese Player that can still beat top players at age 40. Waldner played against Ma Long at age 40 he lost 3-1.
Waldner is fast but not chinese top players fast
If all the wars were to be fought in a table with balls and paddles.
Not a good idea, the asians would rule the world. It is a very under appreciated sport though.
Poor Ma Lin, small guy, have to work twice as fast to beat the big guy.
Ma Lin was so fast, but he lacked power
JOW said in an interview that Ma Lin was always his toughest opponent. And Ma Lin has more wins over JOW
Of course Ma Lin has more wins over Waldner...he is 15 years younger! ^^
@@matalbasse excuses
@@TheRafaelBond Jo Waldner is a legend, he comes from sweden which had about 8-9 million people during his playing, while China had 1 billion plus people. It's laughable China couldn't produce a better player than that with the amount of people living there, so.
olle12 not every one in China play table tennis okay? They not even have time to workout.
olle12 that’s not how it works. Football has been England’s national sport for almost 2 centuries. That doesn’t mean you should expect them to produce world class players
Waldner beats all the top chinese players with ease, and that means the best players in the world. But he usually have a hard time against any other countries players. It's a little weird
And as a footnote, China have more active table tennis players than Swedens entire population
top players of 199x, 200x play so simply and not so much aggressions and power in comparison with nowadays younger players.
The ball was smaller
5:38,6:03,6:15
Ma Lin hadn't used RPB by then
No body blocked the ball better.
人間の動きじゃねぇ、、、
人間だ
Permaenan eropa sebenarnya lebih cantik.
Валднер в свои годы творил не реальные вещи.
Waldner doesn't have backhand. I know he is legendary player, but you have to admin that modern tt would dismantle this style easily. any top player has strong backhand or doomed.
No, he has. He just uses backhand for blocking more often than for attack.
Ma's backhand is no better
So what have you go to say about Chinese pen-hold players who have been dominating the sport forever? They generally use it to block and guide and will occasionaly attack with a top-spin. Waldner had the best block in history and one of his trademark was the smash backhand!
his backhand loop was fine but at that time chiquita wasn't invented, most people tried to use forehand.
lol easily dismantle ? you really don't even know how to play table tennis.
remember he destroyed Malin and Timo Boll at 2004 when he was 39.